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Natural immunity may last three times as long as vaccine immunity (and Omicron infections give about 75% protection against Omicron).

Natural immunity against Omicron from a previous Omicron infection is better than advertised (75%+) so far

Two new interesting studies out of Qatar in the last month show that natural immunity against Covid is better than recent headlines suggest, and also that (as expected) immunity created from a real infection lasts about three years whereas vaccine immunity may “last only one” (at best, and if that).* 

Although people who caught early variants (up to Delta) are only 28% protected against catching the latest Omicron BA5, people who have caught some form of Omicron itself already may have 75 – 80% protection. And what really matters is that everyone who has caught any form of Covid has “robust” protection against severe disease.

Qatar is an interesting population to study — it has a youngish demographic and they can literally include everyone which removes a lot of selection biases. It’s a very diverse conglomerate: Nearly 90% of Qatar’s population are expatriates from over 150 countries, coming …because of employment.

The first study is one of the longest term research projects on Covid to date. Chemaitelly et al followed people who got Covid in Qatar from nearly the beginning of the whole pandemic. They estimate protection against reinfection starts off at 90% and gradually declines over the next couple of years, until it reaches nothing, they figure (with Gompertz curves), by about 32 months.  The good news is that protection against severe infection appears to be robust, even when people do get infected again.

Now that doesn’t mean there isn’t some cumulative damage from reinfection (and other studies suggest there might be, which I’ll discuss soon), but at least the second infection itself probably won’t put people in hospital or a morgue. As far as decisions for boosters go, will doctors tell their patients about this data?

There was never any justification for forcing people to take vaccines if they already had natural immunity.

Only Omicron really protects against Omicron reinfection

The second study (Altarawneh et al) from a similar group of researchers, looked at the most recent data when the superinfectious BA5 variant was spreading rapidly in May and June this year. They estimate that immunity against old Covid infections (Delta and earlier) are not that useful in stopping these later two Omicron variants. People who caught Covid in 2020 and 2021 appear to have about a 28% protection against reinfection. But people who caught an early variant of Omicron are much better protected — with 75% – 80% protection against reinfection. Part of the weaker protection from catching an early variant of Covid is because the virus has changed shape so dramatically, and part of it is due to the waning of immunity. Obviously people who caught the original Wu-Flu are a long way past the infection.

This graph below is the past year of Covid variants globally. Obviously Omicron BA.5 is taking over. It was virtually unknown at the start of May but now is about 63% of global infections. Depending on which country you live in, you can check the Nextstrain database to see which strain was dominant at various times (like say, when you may have caught Covid, so you can figure out what the variant may have been). (Mouseover their graphs).

Covid July 2021 -July2022, Nextstrain, Omicron.

The past year of Covid variants. | Nextstrain (scroll down)

One coronavirus infection wards off another— but only if it’s a similar variant

McKenzie Prillaman, Nature

Natural immunity induced by infection with SARS-CoV-2 provides a strong shield against reinfection by a pre-Omicron variant for 16 months or longer, according to a study (Chemaitelly). This protection against catching the virus dwindles over time, but immunity triggered by previous infection also thwarts the development of severe COVID-19 symptoms — and this safeguard shows no signs of waning.

The study, which analyses cases in the entire population of Qatar, suggests that although the world will continue to be hit by waves of SARS-CoV-2 infection, future surges will not leave hospitals overcrowded with people with COVID-19.

Immunity against Omicron with a pre omicron infection.

Chemaitelly: The top line shows protection of early variants against other early variants. The lower line shows what happened when Omicron arrived. Presumably natural protection from Omicron against Omicron is similar to the top line.

Now they tell us…

Regardless of the extrapolations, the data indicate that naturally acquired immunity is hardy — something that is not always championed.

“In the US, we were underselling the immune protection provided by previous infection,” says Jeffrey Morris, a biomedical data scientist at the University of Pennsylvania in Philadelphia. He adds that the Qatar team’s study affirms the substantial evidence for natural immunity’s capabilities.

The second paper looked specifically at Omicron protection against Omicron:

Prior Omicron infection protects against BA.4 and BA.5 variants

McKenzie Prillaman, Nature

To see how much protection previous infection offers against the two Omicron subvariants, Abu-Raddad and colleagues analysed COVID-19 cases recorded in Qatar between 7 May this year — when BA.4 and BA.5 first entered the country — and 4 July. They looked at the number of people known to have been infected previously who tested positive or negative for COVID-19, and identified which infections were caused by BA.4 or BA.5 by examining positive test samples to see whether they contained a protein that these subvariants lack.

The researchers found that infection with a pre-Omicron variant prevented reinfection with BA.4 or BA.5 with an effectiveness of 28.3%, and prevented symptomatic reinfection with either subvariant with an effectiveness of 15.1%. Prior infection with Omicron granted stronger protection: it was 79.7% effective at preventing BA.4 and BA.5 reinfection and 76.1% effective at preventing symptomatic reinfection.

Effectiveness of a previous pre-Omicron infection against symptomatic BA.4/BA.5 reinfection was 15.1% (95% CI: -47.1-50.9%), and against any BA.4/BA.5 reinfection irrespective of symptoms was 28.3% (95% CI: 11.4-41.9%). Effectiveness of a previous Omicron infection against symptomatic BA.4/BA.5 reinfection was 76.1% (95% CI: 54.9-87.3%), and against any BA.4/BA.5 reinfection was 79.7% (95% CI: 74.3-83.9%).

The study was implemented on Qatar’s total population, perhaps thus minimizing the likelihood of bias.

*Natural immunity may last three times (or even five times) as long as vaccine induced immunity

“Three times longer” is probably an underestimate. Other studies suggest vaccine immunity doesn’t last for “a year”. One Swedish study of 840,000 people showed vaccine efficacy at 7 months was zero. But I’ll just quote the Chaimatelly paper, which buried this comparison in the text:

Protection of natural infection waned with time after primary infection, prior to Omicron emergence, and reached ∼70% by the 16th month. This waning likely reflects genuine waning in biological immunity rather than viral immune evasion, as pre-Omicron variants demonstrated much less immune evasion than Omicron.1416 This waning in natural immunity mirrors that of vaccine immunity,4, 6, 30 but at a slower rate. Vaccine immunity may last for only a year,4, 6, 30 but natural immunity, assuming Gompertz decay, may last for 3 years, as also suggested by long- term follow-up of SARS-CoV-1-associated antibodies,36 and incidentally not dissimilar to pandemic-influenza-associated antibodies.37

Immune evasion of Omicron subvariants reduced overall protection of pre-Omicron natural immunity and accelerated its waning (Figure 3), mirroring the effect of Omicron on vaccine immunity, but at a slower rate. Vaccine immunity against Omicron subvariants lasts for <6 months,5, 7, 8 but pre-Omicron natural immunity, assuming Gompertz decay, may last for just over a year.

Despite waning protection against reinfection, strikingly, there was no evidence for waning of protection against severe COVID-19 at reinfection. This remained ∼100%, even 14 months after the primary infection, with no appreciable effect for Omicron immune evasion in reducing it. —  Chaimaitelly et al

Informed consent means knowing more about natural immunity as well as vaccines and the risks associated with them. Given the risks of vaccination, once people have had any variant of Covid, are there any benefits for “boosting”? These are questions doctors or bosses need to answer.

REFERENCES

Altarawneh et al (2022) Protection of SARS-CoV-2 natural infection against reinfection with the Omicron BA.4 or BA.5 subvariants,

Chemaitelly et al (2022) Duration of immune protection of SARS-CoV-2 natural infection against reinfection in Qatar,  medRxiv 2022.07.06.22277306, DOI: https://doi.org/10.1101/2022.07.06.22277306https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2022.07.06.22277306v1

Michlmayr et al (2022) Observed protection against SARS-CoV-2 reinfection following a primary infection: A Danish cohort study among unvaccinated using two years of nationwide PCR-test data, DOI:https://doi.org/10.1016/j.lanepe.2022.100452

10 out of 10 based on 58 ratings

127 comments to Natural immunity may last three times as long as vaccine immunity (and Omicron infections give about 75% protection against Omicron).

  • #
    Joao Martins

    Rediscovering basic Biology.

    Putting it another way: reinventing the wheel.

    180

    • #
      Ronin

      Maybe not so much as reinventing basic Biology but shining a light on information suppressed by Big Pharma and their useful idiots for monetary gain.

      250

      • #
        Joao Martins

        Ronin, I “half-agree”; you may be right. BUT: a research paper is a research paper (and that is what Jo is showing us) and a police file is a police file — a different kind of “investigation”. Discovering knowledge is one thing, uncovering fraud is another, different thing.

        00

  • #
    Annie

    Having had Omicron over Easter, I very much hope that this extended natural immunity is what we now have. That should give us an extension to our current status.

    70

  • #
    Penguinite

    As far as I can read No references regarding natural v chemical (aka vaccination)? Does that infer the vax may weaken both natural and chemical protection and permit reinfection?

    110

    • #
      Adellad

      No it “infers” nothing. It might “imply” but inference is the subjective action you perform if you accept the various components of an argument, whether implied or not.

      82

  • #
    Graham Richards

    What we now need to know is, do other similar viruses behave in a similar way when it comes to immunity??

    If Covid-19 is unique in this behaviour it would appear that this is definitely a malicious attempt by the creators of the virus to cause as much death & economic destruction as possible. Fauci & his compatriots in Wuhan & the CCP have much explaining to do. It’s creation as a bio weapon is becoming more & more obvious. Complicity of the WHO because of their misinformation is very likely. Which also turns the spotlight on the UN and their partner in globalisation on The WEF.

    One may then assume that the vaccines are also suspect. How much of the detail on immunity we’re big Pharma aware of & did they simply take advantage of the complexity of the situation for financial gain??

    We all know that none of those involved in this can be trusted.

    220

    • #
      Adellad

      It’s means it is. We’re means we are.

      49

      • #
        Forrest Gardener

        Pedantry means you can never afford to make a mistake.

        100

        • #
          David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

          G’day F G,
          I consider the relationship of pedantry to language to be the same as precision to science.

          And further, if we’d had regularity of pedantry in the climate “debate” that mess wouldn’t have advanced beyond AGW.

          Cheers
          Dave B

          30

      • #
        RoHa

        Thank you, Adellad. Keep up the good work.

        11

    • #

      Good question Graham, and perhaps I should have explained in the post.

      Natural immunity varies from a few months to viruses like RSV right up to lifetime for am exact strain of influenza and I think measles/mumps/chicken pox/smallpox/ etc.

      But there are many viruses that we develop only temporary immunity too naturally — like Norovirus (Cruise ship gastro) and coronavirus common colds. We can catch the exact same virus a year later (or even five months later). We retain immunity against a severe infection but we don’t fill our blood with antibodies against every single infection. We retain the T-Cell immunity that stops us dying, but not the antibody shield against getting sick for a week.

      Severe infections are more likely to generate long term immunity for obvious reasons.

      90

      • #
        David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

        Evening Jo,
        Do you know if any work has been trying zinc and an ionophore against the common cold et al? With and/or without vitamin D?
        Cheers
        Dave B

        50

        • #
          Joao Martins

          Very good question, David.
          Perhaps this can help, as a start:
          Singh M, Das RR. (2011) Zinc for the common cold (Review). The Cochrane Collaboration.

          20

          • #
            David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

            Thanks Joao,
            But: ” This review has been withdrawn. ”
            Too good perhaps? Or just more from the censors?
            Cheers
            Dave B

            20

          • #
            David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

            But I found this:
            https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/21328251/
            Quite positive, but no mention of the need for an ionophore. An apple a day is worth trying. (Contains quercetin.)
            Cheers
            Dave B

            30

            • #
              Joao Martins

              Yes, that one is good. When I read it, I wondered if in the “refereeing” procedure there was any “suggestion” to abstain from recommending the use of zinc.

              I have tried to follow the “retraction” of the Cochrane report but I could not find any reasonable explanation for it. Anyhow, after 40+ years reading and using scientific literature in my research work, I did not see significant flaws in it, so I ignore the “retraction”.

              30

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Basic awareness and intuition suggest to me that true vaccines may provide valuable defence against some diseases when applied judiciously.

    The other side of the coin is that quite possibly overvaxxination with every latest Big Pharma thoughtie VaXX will damage and ruin the Natural Immune system.

    The summary:

    only use vaccines in extreme threats and then only after proper development with initial testing done publicly, on the families of big Pharma executives.

    360

  • #
    David Maddison

    that natural immunity against Covid is better than recent headlines suggest, 

    It is important for the Government and their partners, Big Pharma, to maintain the misinformation and the fear

    200

  • #
    David Maddison

    Meanwhile Pfizer’s Paxlovid (nirmatrelvir + ritonavir) at over A$1000 per dose is in short supply in Australia.

    Apparently there is also a shortage of Molnupiravir sold as Lagevrio. Cost $1101.39 https://m.pbs.gov.au/medicine/item/12910L.html

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/williamhaseltine/2021/11/01/supercharging-new-viral-variants-the-dangers-of-molnupiravir-part-1/?sh=37c684a36b15

    Supercharging New Viral Variants: The Dangers Of Molnupiravir (Part 1) – Forbes

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/williamhaseltine/2021/11/02/harming-those-who-receive-it-the-dangers-of-molnupiravir-part-2/?sh=7ce5a95614907

    Harming Those Who Receive It: The Dangers Of Molnupiravir (Part 2)

    It’s tragic because the proven safe and effective and VERY INEXPENSIVE Ivermectin would be readily available had it not been banned for covid treatment and prophylaxis in Australia.

    240

    • #
      Lost Hope

      David, It’s way beyond “tragic” it’s outright “criminal” that Ivermectin is banned by our misgovernments, the guilty should be hanging from lamp posts.

      70

  • #
    rodgerwithoutD

    This study, that study all well and good but then you have a case like my lovely partner who has now had a cough, cold, runny nose for some 5 to 6 weeks. A previously very healthy person who shrugged off all and any illness in a mater of days seems to have lost all natural defences.
    Twice jabbed last year (so as could travel) and a five day positive to a RAP test in early April, now has no idea what is happening.

    It’s not the weather – we are in FNQ

    150

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Yes. My son in London has a similar experience. Any hopes that the omicron variant would spread rapidly and harmlessly through the world are gone along with the idea that the virus would then disappear.

      70

  • #
    Harves

    Australia had the 8th highest number of Covid deaths in the world yesterday (89) even though the majority is triple jabbed and the current variants are milder. Yet our media is silent.

    I remember not that long ago when 3 deaths a day had the Premiers holding press conferences and offering their bland, scripted condolences to families. But I suppose there aren’t any elections coming up.

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    • #
      Adellad

      “But I suppose there aren’t any elections coming up.” You suppose wrong. Vic in less than 4 months and NSW 4 months after that.

      61

      • #
        Gary S

        That’s why they are quiet.

        60

        • #

          On deaths, use Worldometer, sort by Deaths per million (arrows in top. Because Australia and NZ shut borders and kept out the deadliest variants our total death rates per capita are a sixth of the UK and a seventh of the US.

          Australia 426
          New Zealand 382
          UK 2663
          US 3200

          *I don’t know why Worldometer doesn’t calculate the USA rate? (1.05m/330m)

          60

          • #
            RossP

            I do not know what is or has happened in Australia but in NZ they changed the way a death was classified a few months ago. Death numbers went up a lot as a result. Cynical me says it was done to keep the fear factor up. Now probably because of the unwanted attention NZ has been getting with it’s rapid increase in numbers, they have in the last couple of weeks said they are “refining” the classification methods again. This, in my view, will show a reduction in Covid deaths being reported.

            00

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Suspicious minds might think that even the Australian media has a clue that perhaps the injections, lock downs and masks made things worse. And we can’t have that sort of notion in the nightly news can we?

      160

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      With?
      Median age?

      00

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Immoderata, that old Dean Martin song.

      10

    • #
      Philip

      That is human nature. I do it myself. When something is new you are hyper aware of it. Then with time it slackens off. Simple as that.

      00

    • #
      Lawrie

      I don’t know if you listen to or read about Wayne Alan Root who is a conservative radio jock in the US. He was reported in the Gateway Pundit today to have had 33 of his wedding guests eight months ago suddenly dying or suddenly becoming ill. He notes that they were all vaccinated. His unvaccinated guests have not become ill. He could be telling porkies although he is usually pretty sound. But it does gel with the increase in unexplained sudden deaths reported by insurance companies and the deaths of high profile athletes, some in their prime and others recently retired. I also note that the UK government is paying compensation to the relatives of those that can be shown to have died as a result of the jab. I do not recall back in 1957 when all us youngsters at a Sydney boarding school lined up for our polio shots that there were any reports of sudden death or illness as a result. If there were it would have been in the Daily Mirror for sure. I also do not recall any kid having had the vaccine subsequently getting polio. There were kids who had polio at school so we all knew the symptoms and results.

      80

  • #

    From the Above Article/Post –

    “There was never any justification for forcing people to take vaccines if they already had natural immunity.”

    Now, that comment says it all which is why I never got jabbed. My Human Trial is ongoing and I still have not contracted the virus. Not that I am aware of anyway. Maybe a Cold or two but that’s all.

    There must be Billions of people with Natural Immunity.

    241

    • #
      Adellad

      If you haven’t had Covid, you cannot have “natural immunity.” You achieve the latter via antibodies created by your immune system upon contact with some kind of pathogen, in this case the WuFlu.

      411

      • #

        That to me is my “natural immunity” as provided by my immune system.

        102

        • #

          We need a common language and definitions. In microbiology, natural immunity means specifically a past infection. Innate immunity is immunity you were born with — generic molecules and paths to reduce infections. Totally different mechanisms.

          Please use the common microbiology definitions or it will waste time in threads and create confusion.

          Adellad is correct.

          91

          • #
            Honk R Smith

            But Jo, we are a bit behind on definitions.
            Like ‘vaccine’.
            And ‘case’.
            And ‘herd immunity’… which is now defined as only the result of the most recent approved number, (update your card), of vaccines that don’t vaccinate.

            The common definitions of ‘woman’ and ‘free speech’ are a bit up in the air nowadays too
            When it’s “my body, my choice” unclear as well.
            I also find myself a bit confused about the definition of science.
            I’m told if I don’t ‘believe’ in the Consensus of Science, I am a heretic.
            I do understand that anthropogenic means unnatural.

            90

            • #
              Honk R Smith

              Forgot to mention …
              where are we with the definitions of ‘with’ and ‘of’?

              70

              • #

                Honk, I’m absolutely going to fight to the end on strict definitions. The left alter meanings to suit themselves and stop us having a sensible conversation. If we start doing it, we are just helping the Left. Do you want to understand microbiology or add to the fog?

                There is no “to me it means this” or “if they destroy our language so can we”.

                How would Geologists or Engineers feel if I just started making up my own definitions?

                10

      • #
        Tel

        How do you know that?

        https://geneticliteracyproject.org/2021/11/09/a-lucky-segment-of-the-population-is-genetically-immune-from-the-covid-virus-what-can-we-learn-from-them/

        There are many recorded cases of people with innate immunity, proven by extensive direct exposure to the virus, usually from family members. There’s also plenty of cases where symptoms were incredibly mild and people test positive but don’t even feel sick … if it wasn’t for the test they wouldn’t even know there was a problem.

        140

        • #
          Scissor

          Really good article. Thank you.

          There are numerous corona viruses. Previous infections with some containing genetically similar viruses would confer some immunity. This helps explain geographic susceptibilities, among other factors.

          00

          • #

            Tel, (are you replying to me?) I’m not denying innate immunity, I’m saying it is a totally different thing to “natural immunity”. They have different mechanisms of action. Natural immunity is learned. Innate immunity is not. Our immune system is a form of AI. These differences matter. Though both innate and natural immunity can lead to asymptomatic infections.

            00

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Yes; I also believe that natural immunity may develop the capacity to deal with threats that are “new”.

      I’m doubtful of the concept that only a previous exposure will protect the host and see immunity as being a strength effect rather than being totally reliant on specificity.

      50

      • #

        Keith — there are other mechanism that give some innate immunity. EG some genetic variations of ACE2 are different, some people have molecules in saliva that bind to ACE2 covering up the binding sites and making infection less likely. Vit D3 contributes to innate immunity. Children have a stronger innate immunity because they have less stored memory of infections. As we get older we rely on the library of past infections more.

        61

    • #
      ghl

      I have been asking my doctor for years for an antibody test.Not available apparently.

      80

      • #

        The lack of testing for antibodies is another scandal — it appears they didn’t want people to be able to say they had natural immunity and use that as an excuse not to get vaccinated.

        Note that we don’t know what level of antibodies stops people from getting reinfected. It appears to vary a lot. But having specific past N-capsid antibodies means people had an infection at some point, and likely means they have T-Cell immunity. They may still get infected and pass on the virus, but they are probably protected from severe infection. We should have been doing these tests. Especially once we learnt that the vaccines didn’t stop transmission anyhow. Where are the benefits from being vaccinated against a disease someone has natural immunity too if it isn’t going to make much difference to their risk of catching and spreading it? There is big debate still in the medical literature saying that boosters will help reduce infection but the cost-benefits are not being explained at all in a way that gives the public the ability to decide if the risks are worth the benefits.

        151

    • #
      Hasbeen

      82 years old, never been jabbed, never had Covid. Do the supermarket shopping weekly, buy bread a couple of times a week & car club activities a couple of times a month, so plenty of chances to have contact.

      Did have a dose of this years rather nasty flu for a week a couple of weeks ago, but seam to have survived it again.

      160

      • #
        Ando

        I couldnt catch the coof despite sleeping next to my infected wife. She was forced to get the experimental serum to keep her job.

        10

    • #
      Vicki

      It does make you wonder. Husband got a mild dose ( a couple of days) a few months ago. We were both tested by RaTS & hospital PCRs. I remained negative.

      Mind you, both of us have been on revised health regime & diet for 2 years & daily vitamins & supplements. Husband also took Quercetin, anti histamines , steroid inhaler straight away.

      BTW I used a nasal spray recently introduced in Oz by German Vicks facility. Also Betadine gargle.

      30

  • #
    Honk R Smith

    I keep getting the impression that SARS/COV19 is the only public health threat.
    I notice this most mornings watching obese people walking out of my local coffee/donut establishment with their virtue signaling surgical mask and bag of donuts.
    Fortunately many are inserting themselves into EVs.
    So progress.

    160

    • #
      Adellad

      I stare quizzically at the nappy-faced as though there is something wrong with them – which there is of course.

      70

      • #

        Adellad, maybe some respect for personal choice. Those people may be undergoing cancer treatment or live with an anorexic child, or a high risk parent. Or they may be avoiding the security cams…

        81

      • #
        Philip

        Thats me. I wear a mask when going to a crowded place like Bunnings. Why not ? Whats the problem ? If it doesn’t work, oh well. It wouldn’t work without it I know that.

        I do what you do to people in cars by themselves wearing a mask or walking along the road wearing a mask, puzzles me that one.

        00

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Obesity or Diabetes 2 or pancreatic cancer are far more dangerous than CV19 and progeny.

      But it’s not acceptable to say that people need a more balanced lifestyle. Gluttony and laziness must not be criticised. Let them die in peace.

      90

    • #

      I notice this most mornings watching obese people walking out of my local coffee/donut establishment with their virtue signaling surgical mask and bag of donuts.

      One of the most maddening features of the medical response to the Covid pandemic has been the failure of the medical professionals to use the opportunity to improve the health of the community in respect to a healthy diet and exercise – the best defence to disease.

      Not a single word in the media by these so called health experts.

      130

      • #
        Honk R Smith

        Difficult to dispute, IMHO, observation of the Great P.
        Medical ‘professionals’ appear to operate in support of an agenda of which the “health of the community” is not the paramount concern.
        Whatever could the real agenda be?
        Oh, wait.
        Community?
        Their community consist of politicians, Academia, and Pharma.
        And of course their Media harem.
        No Prom for us.

        50

  • #
    Harves

    “Professor Paul Hunter, an infectious disease expert based at the University of East Anglia, told MailOnline that New Zealand has ‘done better than most countries that initially followed zero-Covid strategies’ because this approach meant many people had good protection against severe illness and death when restrictions were lifted.

    But he noted that hybrid immunity — being both vaccinated and having a previous infection — seems to provide the best protection against severe disease and death.”

    So is he admitting that the ‘vaccine’ isn’t really a vaccine? Or is he suggesting that people shouldn’t get the ‘vaccine’ until after you’ve already had the virus?

    40

  • #
    Ross

    It’s great we get these scientific studies, because mostly they just validate what we already know as common sense. We KNEW that COVID lockdowns were more damaging from an overall public health perspective. We know that continual vaccinations against an RNA respiratory virus with leaky vaccines is also bad policy. Now, all we need to do is convince the experts, who should have known these things in the first place.

    160

  • #
    OldOzzie

    Quick question to Jo’s Bloggers

    I am unvaxxed, happy to stay with my 2+ years of antivirals – in my live in 3 generation family, back 5 have had covid in last 3 weeks and wife has had fever, cough etc but RAT negative.

    I was aiming to have my second flu vaccine beginning August and was going to ask my GP for a Serology Test for Covid Antibodies, as about 4 weeks had had techy throat for a week and was interested to see if it might have been Covid

    Question is if Serology Test indicates Covid antibodies, does Test show Covid Variant?

    120

    • #
      David Maddison

      I believe GP’s are discouraged from ordering covid antibody tests. It would harm the narrative.

      170

      • #
        Zane

        They are banned from doing so. Any Australian doc who does will lose his licence to practice medicine.

        50

    • #

      My understanding is that it does not identify a variant, Old Ozzie. And yes, David is right – most GPs won’t order a Covid Serology Test for antibodies. Many don’t think that it is conclusive, in any case.

      There has been a virus circulating in Sydney for months (one of many!) which has a characteristic itchy throat that just can’t be shifted. Some people have had it for months. It is like an allergy, but doesn’t respond to anti-histamines. Those that have tested for Covid have returned negative results.

      50

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        RATs have a high failure rate. It’s likely your wife had what everyone around her had. You too possibly. It does seem GPs are not encouraged to get serology tests. Damn shame. Calculate odds of variant from Nextstrain by date of first infection and assume everyone in the house got the same variant.

        In Australia — after June 21 more than half of infections were the new Omicron BA4 (22A) or BA5 (22B). BA2 is also known as 21L. Most people who caught Covid in March April or May here got that one.

        For people overseas, filter by country in last six months on this page (Scroll to the bottom to select)
        Or filter by country for the last two years here.

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    Zane

    Daniel Andrews is again trying to ramp up the Covid fear in Victoria this winter. Even though winter is half over. Dictator Dan worships this virus.

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      Forrest Gardener

      Yes, but wasn’t one of the features of covid supposed to be that it was not seasonal? And that it spread strongly during the Australian summer?

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        Forrest Gardener

        And again I ask the question whether the automation is working as intended.

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          ian+hilliar

          Have you ever heard of delaying gratification? Or is instant just not quick enough for you?

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        Tel

        There wasn’t much of an Australian Summer on the East coast in 2022 … it rained, and people stayed indoors, probably with the A/C on to dry the place out.

        Essentially, from the virus point of view it was Winter … everyone packed together with cold dry air and same air recirculating. Perfect conditions really.

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          Zane

          Cold dehumidified air dries out the protective mucosal layer in the nose, sinuses, and throat which stop a respiratory virus from gaining a foothold there in the first place.

          Mucus may sound icky but it should be celebrated.

          Biology 101 but it seems to be news to most medicos.

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      David Maddison

      In preparation for the election in november he wants to be seen as The Saviour. Like most pyschopaths he wants to be worshipped and many people do worship him, a voting majority in fact.

      I have no doubt that Comrade Dictator Dan will be re-elected.

      The Liberal “opposition” are beyond hopless and want to set even more stringent “climate change” goals than Dan.

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    Lawrie

    I took my two when offered last year and I caught the Wuflu on June 20 from my wife who is in a nursing home. She recovered in less than a week but it took me until about the 12 July to fully recover. My seven year old grandson who lives with me , and has since he was 8 months old, did not even get a sniffle. WHY are they so keen to give kids vaccines and us oldies boosters? There is something really wrong here and there are elites up to their eyeballs in a huge crime. I note a quarter of the US Army will be sacked for refusing the jab and that recruitment is down 60%. Just who will benefit from that? CHINA. These mongrels are crippling us and our government is helping them at every turn.

    Off subject but the obvious evil intent of government. FMD is next door and the ALP are not doing anything to stop it. WHY? Well what a way to wipe out large herds and flocks without even passing a law. Bowen would get 10% reduction in emissions without doing a thing. Remember it is the same crowd that ruined the live cattle trade with Indonesia based on an ABC Four Corners show found to have relied on activist footage, some from elsewhere. Socialists hate farmers because they are free thinkers and very independent. They are not sheeple.

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      David Maddison

      You are right about FMD (foot and mouth disease). I bet the way it comes here will be an Australian Government “expert” working for AQUIS or similar agency goes on a “fact finding trip to Indonesia” (taxpayer funded holiday) and then brings it back here by “accident”.

      The Left hate the consumption of meat by the non-Elites, that’s why they hate farmers and are now in an active war against meat. E.g. look at NZ, Netherlands, the subtle promotion of insect protein, etc..

      The Labor Government would delight in killing every single commercial meat animal in Australia, after making sure they have plenty of frozen meat supplies for the Elites.

      Incidentally, foot and mouth disease does not affect humans. There is no threat to human health. Theoretically it is OK to eat an animal with FMD, not that you’d want to.

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        David Maddison

        Humans get “foot in mouth” disease, not “foot and mouth disease”.

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        Lawrie, like you I am baffled by the lack of response to stop FMD. Is our tourism to Bali more important than billions of losses to our farmers and then pain for consumers as meat prices rise even further? It’s almost like a part of the plan… Australian quarantine has always been excellent. You could bring in cut flowers for decades yet now FMD is “OK”?

        Australians can always holiday in Phuket. Seriously.

        If the CCP wanted to hit Au with FMD — hypothetically — we are making it easy for them, giving plausible deniability. And if we lose $billions I guess we won’t be able to afford as many subs.

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      Kalm Keith

      Yes.

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      Yes and compare the ‘Alarmism’ over the virus along with the draconian dictates to the lethargy being exhibited over FMD. Something smells very fishy here.

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      Ronin

      “Socialists hate farmers because they are free thinkers and very independent. They are not sheeple.”

      They also don’t vote for socialists, bless ’em.

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      Philip

      Apparently they are relying on stockpiles of a FnM vaccine. They have tightened a few things up, a few links into the country, which is good, but consider people coming in as low risk, given the meat product in their luggage has to find its way to a farm animal. They consider the risk low. With given what is at stake, I think is a miss calculation.

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    David Maddison

    Everyone I know who has had a severe presentation of covid has been double or triple vaxxed. Most people I know are unvaxxed intellectuals and only one had covid but in extremely mild form and not enough to stay in bed. Most of them also take Vit D, zinc and quercetin (or Ivermectin under a prophylaxis protocol if they have a supply) as well as other appropriate supplements.

    (I mentioned “intellectual” because the usual response from Leftists is that only fools, idiots and “tin foil hat wearing conspiracy theorists” would be so foolish as to not get vaxxed.)

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      jpm

      Hi David
      My wife, sister and brother in law & my son and his wife, all double vaxed, have had the dreaded lurgy (covid) and I, unvaxed, have not! I lived in the same house with my wife, no masks, without catching it. It is only one case but there are many more out there in the same boat. The vaccines are worse than useless!
      John

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      Most of them also take Vit D, zinc and quercetin (or Ivermectin under a prophylaxis protocol if they have a supply) as well as other appropriate supplements.

      A word of caution. Quercetin is fantastic and is high in order of efficacy in charts for early treatment. However, I was warned by a pharmaceutical PhD (& yes – he is OPPOSED to the vaccines) that Quercetin should NOT be used as a daily prophylactic. Similarly, I know of one case – Heather Heyering, wife of evolutionary biologist Bret Weinstein, who experienced visual problems when on prolonged Ivermectin. Both of these treatments appear to be for early treatment of Covid only, not as preventatives. Having said that, I also understand that many in Equatorial Africa, take Ivermectin daily as a prophylactic for River Blindness and other diseases.

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        Annie

        Did he explain WHY Quercetin should not be taken as a daily prophylactic?

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        OldOzzie

        Vicki,

        let me reiterate re my own situation – Since the start of Covid, I have been taking NOW Quercetin 800 mg with Bromelain 165 mg capsules twice a day over the last 2 plus years (Greg – 90 Kgs) as well as Vit D, Zinc, NAC, Vit C etc and as blood tests every 3 weeks over that period, no problems showed up

        Greg as on 2 year Cancer Immunotherapy Trial, Thyroid level checks were part of the blood test regime, and TSH levels were normal.

        Additionally, after pre-op hospital meeting early Dec last year, added additional NOW Bromelain 500 Mg Capsules twice per day as studies showed assisted wound recovery

        After Major head Op mid February this year intensive home wound care for the 1st month (looked like a Mummy), was scheduled for a Post Op second Op to tidy up, but Emergency on the day deferred

        Following, to the surprise of the Plastics, the head wounds cleared up and no need for second op

        Head Plastic was amazed when head wounds completely healed in 3 months

        Notwithstanding 22 Year CLL still showing in bloods, post 2 year Cancer Immunotherapy full PET Body scan early June showed no Lymph Nodes and no cancer in body, specifically in Head, neural pathways to the brain.

        With 5 out of 7 in Household confirmed Covid and wife suspect – myself, with slightly scratchy throat for a week, as unvaxxed still the
        Healthiest person in the house and happy to continue with antivirals

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    Zane

    I can recommend thecovidblog dot com.

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    Macha

    If totally unvaccinated, is it necessary to get all past jabs to “catch up”?. Why would it be so given a the latest variant is about 10 versions down the line abd older variants have killed themselves off?.

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    STJOHNOFGRAFTON

    I’m sceptical about Covid variants and sub-variants so I did a search to enlighten my knowledge base. Wading through a tank of cold molasses would have been easier. I consider myself scientifically literate but all that recondite knowledge about this and that variant and how the next one will be the real nasty mother of all variants annoyed my brain. I’m going out into the cold and damp now to do some veterinary on the horses in order to clear my brain and get in touch with real life.

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    David Maddison

    As evil and incompetent as Australia’s Federal and State Labor Governments are, don’t forget that much of Australia’s response to covid was formulated under the Liberal (pretend conservative party) “health” minister, Herr Klaus Schwab student, Greg Hunt.

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    Katzenjammer

    Where do we stand with degrees of natural immunity before any infection? It swept through me like a mild fever, over within 6 or 8 hours with a couple of hours of slight hot and cold flushes. Only ever so slightly worse than flus or colds I’ve rarely had in the last umpteen decades, with never having any flu shots.

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    Philip

    Covid came as close to me as it has been 3 weeks ago. The boss had a filthy cold and he was wandering around work saying he’s tested negative. How lopng you had this I asked. Couple of days he replied. I told him to stay back from me, which he constantly would breach and I’d warn again, and again and again. To operate the tractor and truck in common use which he had been in for those days, I Glen 20’d them, used them both all day, and never caught it. The other 2 young blokes at work are clowns with non analytical minds and took no evasive action and got it. They’re all triple vaccinated, Im not.

    The boss was sick as a dog, flu like, but couldn’t resist travelling 3 hours to the cattle sales and sat in the stands bidding and buying. He tested positive the next day. You have to laugh I guess.

    But be aware, this is what people are like. That weekend we went to a restaurant and the Japanese owner was there coughing and blowing her nose as she served you, as was her 6 year old child sitting in the eating area. When I leave such areas I sterilize the hands, shoot anti cold stuff up my nose, gargle betadine and take some prohibited substances I keep in the sheep shed. But most of all I try and avoid such places altogether. Working so far.

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      When I leave such areas I sterilize the hands, shoot anti cold stuff up my nose, gargle betadine and take some prohibited substances I keep in the sheep shed. But most of all I try and avoid such places altogether. Working so far.

      Way to go! Nasal spray & Betadine worked for me when husband got a mild case of Covid.

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    Philip

    I’ve known of a few instances now where households have come down with it but the the one who smokes the funny stuff a lot hasn’t. Anecdotal of course but still, interesting.

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    Robert Malone has told The Highwire that the Qatar studies indicate increasing immune deficiency in those who have been vaccinated multiple times with the Covid vaccines. It is the vaccinated who are driving chronic infections as a result of these leaky vaccines.

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    UK-Weather Lass

    And so a certain global health organisation which once publicly stated in written response to epidemics – No Lockdowns, No School Closures, No Masks, No Social Distancing, No Mass Vaccination, No Travel Bans, and No Panic – were right all along. And so has the leader of that certain global health organisation been questionned under oath as to why he decided to advocate otherwise? Couldn’t possibly have anything to do with ‘corruption in high places’ could it.

    I think we all really do understand the truth already. And I think we all really do understand what needs resetting too. It’ll take a long time to get trust back but a little honesty, integrity and humble apology wouldn’t go amiss. And then before anything else, of course, we want our free and fair democracies back.

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    RoHa

    C’mon people. Many of you are missing the main point.

    Natural immunity doesn’t make any money for Big Pharma, which means a reduction in bribes for the politicians.

    You don’t want that, do you?

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    Zane

    Coming soon, Super Natural Immunity, even better!

    Well, have you ever seen a ghost catch Covid?

    😃

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    […] Natural Immunity Gives Three Years Protection, Compared to Months for Vaccines. By Joanne Nova. […]

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    Alex

    I am just concluding an experiment:

    About two months ago, my wife and I received a note in the post for the second booster. My wife accepted to be jabbed but I refused. Now we are both Omicron positive, ‘suffering’ exactly the same symptoms highly indicative that boosters are useless.

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    Deano

    Some ‘experts’ initially claimed natural immunity against COVID-19 didn’t exist. This made me wonder how anyone with it ever recovered.

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      In microbiology “Natural Immunity” means people who have caught it and have thus got immunity. So the experts were correct. Almost no one had natural immunity to SARS in Jan 2020. Some people had some crossover immunity from H1N1 influenza, we later found out.

      A few had immunity from SARS1 or MERS (I even know someone who was in South Korea when MERS hit and thinks he survived it).

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    OldOzzie

    In the meantime – The Biden administration and Big Pharma are using Covid-19 as an excuse to circumvent your doctor and make decisions about your health.

    Consider the Food and Drug Administration’s recent decision allowing pharmacists to play doctor and prescribe Pfizer’s anti-viral treatment Paxlovid

    But the drug’s fact sheet is a tangled web of restrictions that will make it impractical for most pharmacies to take the risk. Why is the FDA encouraging this?

    The answer is plain to anyone who has been following the plight of independent doctors during the pandemic. Our public health agencies — heavily influenced by the pharmaceutical industry and beholden to Biden’s “vaccine first” approach — are committed to diminishing the medical profession and centralizing authority with bureaucrats in Washington, D.C. They have prosecuted a relentless campaign to reduce physicians to cogs in a health care system that is aggressively transforming all medical professionals from providers to prescribers.

    The problems with Paxlovid are no secret. FDA granted Pfizer emergency use authorization for the drug after a single trial with questionable results. The medicine has many contraindications, meaning it can’t be taken by someone who simultaneously would be taking certain anti-depressants, anti-seizure, anti-psychotic, cholesterol, or blood pressure medications. Furthermore, many Americans cannot take Paxlovid, given that nearly half of adults have cardiovascular disease.

    The risks are plain to see in FDA’s guidance, which recommends referring the patient to a doctor if “sufficient information is not available to assess renal and hepatic function” or “potential drug interactions.” Numerous contraindications are listed, and caution is advised throughout. The burden is on the patient to furnish medical records to prove that he or she doesn’t have any significant kidney or liver disease, drug sensitivities, or other medications that could cause serious adverse events.

    Nevertheless, pharmacies have spent months and millions of dollars lobbying for the right to play doctor and prescribe Paxlovid. The economic motives of such a move are clearly in their favor, as, unlike doctors, they profit directly from dispensing drugs.

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    OldOzzie

    Facts are vicious to the feckless.

    One of the Greatest Videos Ever Made – 1 Min

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    Jim Jordan Urges CDC To Do A Natural Immunity Study And Compare It To The Vaccine
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lJE7Tc8YGsc

    NO natural immunity study has been done?

    Previous infection is 27 times more protective than the gene therapy shot

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