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Two Australian families end up in hospital trying to heat homes with coal burners

Do Australian Lives Matter?

Two families this week, one in Adelaide and one in Sydney, tried to heat their homes with charcoal barbecues. Thankfully no one died.

Four more people are rushed to hospital after burning COALS inside their home as the price of electricity soars

Sam McPhee, DailyMail Australia

A second Australian household have been rushed to hospital with carbon monoxide poisoning after attempting to warm their house with a charcoal burner – laying bare the reality of the country’s ongoing energy crisis.

Emergency services attended a home in Adelaide‘s Bedford Park on Friday morning after four people woke up feeling faint and suffering from nosebleeds. They had been attempting to warm their home overnight using a cooker. All four showed signs of carbon monoxide poisoning.

It comes after a family of six from Sydney’s west were also hospitalised this week after using a burner to warm their granny flat.

His father said it was a response to rising gas prices in Australia.

Energy poverty can be deadly.

Four people “lucky to be alive” after indoor fire leaches carbon monoxide

Twenty South Australians have been admitted to hospital with carbon monoxide poisoning caused by unventilated heating in the past year.

The MFS has revealed that as well as the latest case, two people were taken to hospital last week.

“We are seeing a spate of people bringing outdoor heaters into the home, and burning heat beads, charcoal, and wood in unventilated rooms,” he said. “It is a combination of a very cold winter and the higher cost of electricity and gas (causing people to do this).

How can this be? South Australia has all that clean renewable energy …

h/t OldOzzie

9.8 out of 10 based on 88 ratings

135 comments to Two Australian families end up in hospital trying to heat homes with coal burners

  • #
    Curious George

    That happens when you price a “cheap clean energy” out of people’s reach.

    380

    • #
      Dennis

      I shudder to think what might happen over the next few years as electricity prices climb higher and higher and gas as well, desperate people.

      70

  • #
    CoRev

    Adding every renewable to the grid adds new costs. Adding every solution to solve renewables intermittency adds new costs to the grid. Subsidizing renewables adds new taxes to be paid.

    There seems to be a pattern here that doesn’t correlate with renewables are cheaper than…

    How long before the average voter rebels? I think that will happen this November in the US of A.

    380

    • #
      Robber

      Most calculations of the “levelised costs of electricity” (LCOE) ignore the added costs of full back up to deliver power 24×7, (eg solar panel costings sometimes add just 2 hours of battery storage), windmills do not add the costs of the backup gas or diesel generator or the battery required when the wind doesn’t blow, and neither adds the complex additions required to the grid to cope the wide fluctuations on output.

      330

  • #
    John Hultquist

    Many cities will make an effort to warn people about inside burning.
    Locally the problem seems to be limited time of the “public service announcements” and poorly conceived (not diverse; language) programs. Whether these efforts are cost constrained or thought constrained, I don’t know.

    Search up: Cast Iron Genghis Khan Grill

    These generally come with a warning about the use indoors, even with ventilation. Although, with precautions, it is done. A patio or deck is a better choice.

    130

    • #
      Ronin

      “Search up: Cast Iron Genghis Khan Grill”

      Genghis khan strikes again.

      30

    • #
      Lawrie

      It would be easier if new arrivals learnt to speak English and it was compulsory to become a citizen. Multiculti has limitations and serious downsides.

      140

  • #
    Alexander

    Natural selection at play. Thinning the herd. What other clichés…? I reckon we’ll see a lot more of this…

    211

  • #
    Andrew Wilkins

    Totally off topic, but I need to put it out there:
    The county council for Leicestershire in the UK have decided to embrace Nut Zero and have put together a survey for feedback. Please feel free to go over there and give them the sceptical point of view. I had quite a lot of fun:
    https://surveys.leics.gov.uk/snapwebhost/s.asp?k=165114339249

    [This ought to be posted to the Weekend Unthreaded, otherwise it will divert the intent of the current topic. Please consider doing that. Any responses to this post will be redirected to the Open Thread. – LVA]

    90

    • #
      Amos E. Stone

      Ooh, thank you. I live in Leicestershire, so that really was an enjoyable twenty minutes giving them both barrels and reloading several times! But in the end identifying as a 65+ straight white male probably gives me an immediate ride to the round file. Ah well….

      220

  • #
    UK-Weather Lass

    Electricity, perhaps one of the greatest gifts to humanity, denied to the many because of the folly of the few. Some may say the Chinese have been clever but narcissism has hit them just as hard in their past.

    The weaknesses of narcissism are well recorded:

    An inability to listen (especially listening to themselves)
    An inability to accept criticism
    Impatience and aggression(especially with and towards others)
    Lack of focus (or quick jumping to conclusions)
    Lack of real empathy (because feigned empathy is easier to do and takes less energy)
    Disingenuousness and lack of candor (follows from lack of empathy)
    Stubbornness (because giving ground is seen as a weakness)
    Dishonesty (Just look at POTUS and family)

    QED

    Greed (no additional comment needed)

    322

    • #
      Geoffrey Williams

      Uk-Weather Lass ;
      Your comment ‘The weaknesses of narcissism are well recorded’
      The eight points you mention should be aimed at you own country/goverment – perfectly applicable.
      Just look at their current policies on climate change and the impacts these will have on ordinary working people. Why are people like you so intent on Chinese bashing ?!

      211

  • #
    James Murphy

    I worked with someone who lost a sibling because, while drunk, they brought a brazier into their house to stay warm, and they never woke up again. Tragic to say the least, but fatal mistakes like this should be extremely rare, not increasing in frequency thanks in no small part to state and federal government policy.

    270

    • #
      MP

      thanks in no small part to state and federal government policy.

      So government policy can prevent stupid people doing stupid things. Yay Government.

      Would you mind letting me know what “policy” stops you from poisoning yourself.

      23

      • #

        MP, obviously James means that government policies that make electricity expensive put pressure on poor families to try “non-standard” cheap heating. If electricity were cheaper more people just hit the “On” switch on their legally installed/approved heating.

        We have a system built up over generations, but then someone decided to use it to change the weather.

        132

        • #
          MP

          Maybe, but I did not read anything in your article indicating any trend either way and both your links are to the same article, different rag. Yes I saw the couple of lines of 6 others.
          Those “Australians” don’t appear to be on the bones of their ar$es, so I am very doubtfull of their claim for warmth, indoor kababs or sashlik more likely, cooking inside because its warmer, not to give warmth.
          Stupid people doimg stupid things.

          Obviously not obvious

          05

          • #

            So the householders were dishonest, and the MFS were liars?

            Whatever is bugging you at the moment MP, I hope it gets better.

            91

            • #
              MP

              Yes people lie and its generally to cover up stupid things. The MFS know that can was inside, they know what they are told.
              I spent many years in former soviet countries and many BBQ’s with Shashlik and that is what that can is, a Shashlik pit, it’s that width for the skewers. (Little steel swords)
              I am saying it was more likely to be used as intended, as those beads are $4 a kg, so the economics do not support the claim, “to save money”.

              I went into town, and it was door to door masks, no mandate required. I have been standing in a park for a year and a half at least, rain, snow, sleet and hail, heart breaking, no more alert now then two and a half years ago. I’m done out of sympathy, I’m done out of patience, I’m done standing in a park.

              02

      • #
        James Murphy

        MP, don’t be ridiculous. I know people will do stupid things and government policy can’t ever change that.

        40

  • #
    Graham Richards

    Welcome to 3rd world Australia!! The Labor party hack, Chris Bowen will have us competing with the likes of South Africa or Venezuela for a place on the list of top Socialist paradise failures.
    Less coal & gas and increasing unreliable wind/solar generation. Or how about the other fairytale, hydrogen!!

    South Africa is winning at present. Blackouts of 6 hours per day, twice a day. Really good for winter cold, even better for business they say. They’re striving for 8 hours a day.
    Give them time!!

    All for the sake of a pie in the sky Socialist ideology. All for the sake of the global warming hoax. The big Socialist powers aren’t dumb enough to follow this strategy of achieving economic disaster but they’re clever enough to manufacture the tools to achieve that disaster & our governments are dumb enough to swallow the hoax, hook, line & sinker.

    The 30% of the electorate that voted for this mob of miscreants have a lot to answer for.

    Haven’t seen or heard from our wonderful minister for energy & environment for a while now.
    Is he being hidden from view until the population forget the recent crisis & panicked power price increases?? (Just like the USA President Joe Fraud). Now we have a fraud of our own
    We can join the race to the bottom.

    One wonders if the victims of carbon monoxide poisoning voted for them

    390

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Got them right on target.

      100

    • #
      MP

      South Australia was liberal prior to the last election, that did not seem to change their course as a matter of fact they dove in deeper. 21 years of liberal Fed government never deviated Australia’s course.
      I have not added up the numbers, but I would bet the Lib/Nat trash have thrown more money into the junk science than any other government ever.

      90

      • #
        Graham Richards

        Half the Liberal government are WEF trainees and are just as enthusiastic about destroying our economy as the Labor mob, the WEF & the UN!

        100

        • #
          MP

          They all are, they would not be in the party if they weren’t, same with Lab, Greens. Clive Palmer is director (or was) of the world economic council, with Bill Clinton.
          They are all in this together and we will not vote our way out of this crime family.
          The WEF and the UN signed a memorandum of understanding in 2020 and it appears the WEF now run the UN.

          Dying peacefully in your sleep from CO will look like the easy way out in a couple of years.

          70

          • #
            Bruce

            Some years back, some observant person noted:

            “You can vote your way into socialism, but you will probably have to shoot your way out of it”.

            So, look at the “balance” of firepower in the “afflicted” places.

            Does it raise any questions?

            30

        • #
          Dennis

          Have a long hard look at the other side and maybe find another explanation for “left leaning”.

          11

  • #
    David Maddison

    There is something very wrong when people freeze in their own homes in Australia because they can’t afford heat.

    This is inexcusable.

    And the answer from the Left/anti-energy lobby is just to wear more clothes at home. That’s not acceptable!

    This article was about a survey about how South Australiastanis stay warm at home.

    https://glamadelaide.com.au/top-10-quirky-ways-south-australians-try-to-stay-warm-at-home-this-winter/

    [..]

    Alarmingly, some of the choices are guzzling energy. Nearly 20% have left the oven door open to warm the house and 10% have heated up clothes in the tumble dryer. Conversely, nearly two thirds have avoided using a portable electric or gas heater as they are concerned their energy bills will be too high.

    The situation is so extreme that one in ten Australians have had to move their families into a warmer part of the house to sleep – even into one room – to beat the chill during frosty nights.

    [..]

    190

    • #
      MP

      There link for the Research goes to an error, but the date of the article is Posted on June 4, 2015, not realy relivant to the current and done by the sellers of the solution

      “The research, conducted by Think Insulation,”

      “Commenting, Claire Cunliffe, Marketing Manager at Knauf Insulation Australia”

      The take from the Idiots that wrote that is, Aussies can’t afford a couple of hundred bucks on their energy cost but “When it all gets too much at home, over a third escape winter in Australia all together and jump on a plane to warmer climates.”

      50

      • #
        yarpos

        Not sure what your point is. So if you are right 2/3rds stay home , they arent the travellers who dont care about the power bills. Haves and have nots.

        70

        • #
          MP

          Not my point not my link, from the article. So by your logic, 2/3’s are have nots, more likely, did not.
          Why stop there, The research, conducted by Think Insulation, revealed nearly 75% of South Australians have worn outside layers such as hats , gloves and scarfs whilst watching TV and even to bed (25% did not) . Almost 35% opt to wear thermal underwear (65% did not) and over 15% choose to go home and jump into a onesie (85% did not). Once bundled up with blankets and clothing, almost 40% choose not to suffer alone and grab the nearest family pet (or loved one) to cuddle up with and keep them cosy (60% did not).
          Alarmingly, some of the choices are guzzling energy. The situation is so extreme that one in ten Australians have had to move their families into a warmer part of the house to sleep – even into one room – to beat the chill during frosty nights (9 out of 10 Did not).Nearly 20% have left the oven door open to warm the house (80% did not) and 10% have heated up clothes in the tumble dryer (90% did not). Conversely, nearly two thirds have avoided using a portable electric or gas heater as they are concerned their energy bills will be too high (1/3 did not, they were jet setting to warmer climes). So if you’re not a jet setter you’re freezing to death, am I understanding you correctly?

          Trash survey, salesman’s pitch.

          So what is your point, besides not reading the article you comment on?

          [Grumpy today MP? – Jo]

          16

          • #
            yarpos

            ” So by your logic, 2/3’s are have nots, more likely, did not.” no MP , my world isnt as black and white as yours. It would be nice if it was that simple. Carry on, you appear happiest arguing with yourself.

            50

            • #
              MP

              You were the one whom said “Haves and have nots” or black and white.
              I was just pointing out it was a worthless article from 7 years ago, when energy prices were not the issue they are now.

              Its called Glama Adelaide for a start.

              02

    • #
      Ian Hill

      Putting on extra clothes is all very well but in my experience if my face is cold then I cannot function in a normal daytime situation, such as working at my desktop.

      10

  • #
    David Maddison

    In Vicdanistan the Liberals, pretend conservative party, want even more extreme “climate” policies than Comrade Dictator Dan. Things will get even worse under a Liberal regime, as hard as that is to believe. However there is almost no chance they will be elected.

    151

    • #
      Robber

      Disaster Dan is handing out $250 to every Vic household that submits an electricity bill – as though it’s his money.
      But no doubt in some cases that money will be boozed/betted away.

      161

      • #
        Dennis

        No accounting available for the compensation paid and being paid to businesses forced to suspend operations when instructed to reduce the load on grid baseload capacity when demand is higher than the available supply.

        10

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      And Dominic Perrottet is abroad spruiking NSW as the example of the future with hydrogen and supplier to the World. Just a few billion to start with.
      Some example!

      140

      • #
        Dennis

        But with Japanese government and private sector finance being provided to secure hydrogen from NSW.

        00

    • #
      Ian

      “In Vicdanistan the Liberals, pretend conservative party, want even more extreme “climate” policies than Comrade Dictator Dan. ”

      Seems as if the “Rightists” are even more Left than the “Leftists” So now what are you going to do?

      47

      • #
        MP

        Chuckle, beat me to it.

        They have gone that far right they have almost come full circle and are now more left then the left.

        40

        • #
          el+gordo

          Climate change has the power to do this because it has crossed all political boundaries.

          101

          • #
            Ian

            “Climate change has the power to do this because it has crossed all political boundaries.”

            That’s interesting as in general it is considered that Federally the Greens and the ALP are pushing the boundaries while the LNP are digging in to keep the boundaries where they are.

            13

  • #
    David Maddison

    Neil Oliver (the Scotsman) has an execellent little 10 min rant about what’s happening in the Bigger Picture.

    https://youtu.be/_konpE3pcMw

    131

  • #

    “Energy poverty can be deadly.”

    So true and so can the abject poverty of basic Science being taught at Schools.

    This is just like the Nigerians drilling into oil pipelines to get free oil and the South Africans trying to wire up an electricity sub station to get free electricity.

    There is nothing wrong with an open coal fire in a house with a chimney though.

    180

  • #
    Yonniestone

    Australians using charcoal BBQ’s for heat is the 1st world alternative to 3rd world dung fires, but at least the “developing” countries know about drawing smoke and ventilation from a structure, it seems the intellect of worlds is shifting a well as the numbers.

    -Dung Fires- 3 to 2.
    -Charcoal BBQ’s- 2 to 3.

    110

    • #
      David Maddison

      I guess in Australia’s dumbed-down “education” system, they no longer teach about combustion processes.

      One of my earliest childhood memories was from when I was about three and my farther warning me against standing next to the exhaust pipe of the idling family car to warm my hands as carbon monoxide was poisonous.

      150

      • #
        Ronin

        David, I think most Australian educated folk know of the dangers of CO, I say ‘most’ because every now and then there is a news item of someone using a pump or generator in an enclosed area, but I noticed these latest incidents seemed to involve people with foreign sounding names, not to say they weren’t born here but I wonder what their command of English was like.

        101

    • #
      Sambar

      Hey Yonnie any ideas where these bags of charcoal come from? I have never bought charcoal but notice them for sale in the big green hardware store where 90% of their products are of Chinese origin. ( noticed the bags of river pebbles are from China) Wouldn’t surprise me if bags of charcoal had a truely huge “carbon footprint”

      120

      • #
        David Maddison

        Fancy that Australia has to import river pebbles from China.

        How messed up is that?

        120

      • #
        Yonniestone

        Well I suspected China but the popular Bunnings & trade ones are heat beads by Australian Char pty ltd I’ve got a bag and searched it they are made in Victoria, I’ve also got large briquettes made in Germany from a farm supply store, there is a difference between lump charcoal and briquettes a good link here https://www.smokedbbqsource.com/lump-charcoal-vs-briquettes/

        Note on all the products is a warning in bold letters DO NOT USE INDOORS, perhaps reading is an issue?

        100

      • #
        Hadsbeen

        Where would you get fuel for a fire today, if not China.
        My folks built a new house in a NSW country town in the late 50s. As well as an electric stove they installed a “Rayburn” slow combustion stove, cooking & hot water system. It heated the whole house in winter.

        No gas in town so no coke, & coal was expensive to buy by the bag, so we burnt wood. White box specifically from a friends who was clearing a 500 acre paddock to graze sheep. Tough stuff that white box, I know as I chopped every bit of what we burnt from 200mm by 3m logs brought in once every couple of months.

        Interestingly all 3 front row forwards in the high school football team had fuel stoves at home, chopping does make you strong. Couldn’t happen today as no one is allowed to clear bush blocks to do something useful like graze sheep or cattle.

        God help us.

        110

  • #
    Harves

    The media will make this story about the evils of coal.

    140

  • #
    David Maddison

    The disconnect from reality is amazing.

    The Left keep saying how unreliables are the “cheapest form of energy”.

    And yet the REALITY is that more unreliables correlates with higher consumer electricity prices. And more human misery and death.

    Every.

    Single.

    Time.

    190

    • #
      MP

      “In Vicdanistan the Liberals, pretend conservative party, want even more extreme “climate” policies than Comrade Dictator Dan. Things will get even worse under a Liberal regime, as hard as that is to believe. However there is almost no chance they will be elected.”

      Some bloke up thread a tad!

      20

  • #
    David Maddison

    Are the Left going to fund more fire brigade and paramedic emergency services to deal with more house fires and asphyxiations under “green” Energy Starvation policies.

    130

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Modern journalism works by using headlines that grab your attention by using contradictory word grabs.

    In this case the use of the term “leaches” is, however, completely inappropriate.

    Possibly the writer intends to create the image of leeches crawling all over the victims.

    Whatever, CO is not “leached”, and this little example emphasises the primary purpose of modern journalism, the creation of the printed equivalent of click-bait.

    KK

    140

    • #
      Ronin

      I can understand the junior journos can’t spell or use grammar, but I would have thought editors were a little older and had some education, but it seems not.
      Just pick the paper up and read a few news items , mistakes everywhere.

      Just recently, that Qantas plane that had to call a Mayday, news report had it running out of petrol, why so uninformed and ignorant, just pick up the mobile and call someone who knows a bit about planes and they could tell them that 737s and Airbus use kerosene not petrol.
      If you don’t read the news you might be uninformed but if you do, you are misinformed.

      141

      • #
        David Maddison

        Back in the day, it was quite unusual to find a mistake in a newspaper.

        Now it’s unusual to find something that is correct.

        It is remarkable that “journalists” think jet aircraft run on petrol (gasoline).

        (Strictly speaking, theoretically they will run, but burn hot leading to premature engine failure.)

        110

      • #
        William

        Newspapers used to have a large group of sub-editors whose job it was to proof read all of the articles prior to the paper going to air – as did other media, also to ensure names were correctly pronounced. These subbies were educated in grammar and word usage – avoiding platitudes etc.

        But no longer – spill chuck is good enough these days.

        80

      • #
        MP

        The writer does not pick the headlines, the Op Ed does that. As a nation of headline readers we don’t notice the contradictory story below the headlines.

        50

      • #
        Annie

        The Guardian led the way for years (hence ‘Grauniad’) but the UK Daily Telegraph is pretty bad now too. They all are; it’s quite cringe-worthy.

        20

  • #
    David Maddison

    The way things are going, by design, soon Australians won’t be able to afford any charcoal or other fuels to burn indoors to keep warm.

    Problem solved!

    130

  • #
    Petros

    They should have been vaccinated against carbon monoxide. You know it makes sense.

    160

  • #
    David Maddison

    Remember, the Left can’t say “oxide” as in “carbon dioxide” which they call “carbon”. So is this a case of “carbon” asphyxia?

    100

  • #
    Michael

    Hmmm, you think that is bad, wait for end of the year (ie: winter) in England and Europe. 30%+ of people in England will be in fuel poverty. Germany is planning to open public halls as warm refuges for those who cant afford to heat their homes. England has now said they plan to do the same. This is akin to war time desperation provisions. Imagine people flocking to town halls to sleep in masse on the floor with no privacy simply because the alternative is to freeze to death! How can a society function in anything like a normal way under such conditions? The 3rd world and the 1st world are swapping places. Sri Lanka has found out the hard way. England and Germany are about to. In Holland at least some people are waking up, France had its moment some time ago (yellow vests) and probably will again. Canada descended into overt totalitarianism to stop their protest. It will be interesting to see how that plays out long term. USA who knows?

    A desperate possible silver lining and that is that people might at last wake up to the monumental scam the watermelons are using to destroy our society from the inside (not to mention the 4th estate that has turned into a vicious 5th column).

    Just to drive the message home, you will find Russia wins the war with Ukraine because of their stranglehold over Europe energy. Already their financial status is improving by leaps and bounds not withstanding sanctions. The sanctions are not crippling them, they are thriving and I suspect they will do better and better as time goes on. Of course, when China sees how well Russia can play the west they will jump on board! India, China, Russia, Iran, Italy and others have woken up. Who’s side will they be on when WW111 is declared and will the west win or lose?

    I suspect the greens have given us WW111 and just maybe that’s what they wanted all along.

    [Bold claims require substantial proof. – LVA]

    61

  • #
    R.B.

    It’s not just the cost. At a huge expense, the gas meters in SA were changed. One big difference is you can’t adjust the pressure. I haven’t used my gas heater since then as there is not enough pressure to keep the pilot light on. It’s not a simple fix of adjusting the pilot light, either, so I need to get in a plumber. That will cost a mint at the moment, although regular maintenance needs to be done anyway. I’m not home long in the evenings before going to sleep so not an issue for me this winter.

    So the government spends a lot of money so that the poor need to spend a lot more money on keeping warm. It’s a sad joke.

    220

  • #
    TdeF

    Since 1988 we have had rapid Global Warming, as predicted. Or so we are told every day. Except people are freezing even in Australia. How?

    It is perverse that “Global Warming” is only seen on the very hottest day of the year. In fact real Global Warming should be most obvious on the very coldest day of the year, the clear nights when the heat radiates away and the frost comes and the ice forms. But there is no sign of this warming CO2 blanket. I may have to tell Climate Scientists that blankets are most obvious on cold nights. And it isn’t there.

    So every day I read about Global Warming. In summer. But never in winter. Why?

    190

    • #
      TdeF

      And after an alleged 150 years of rapid end of days runaway Global Warming since the end of the Little Ice age in 1870 when temperatures started to go up not down, where is the problem? Who really believes 1C in an average over a planet is even noticeable let alone devastating? A temperature change which humans could not even notice. Could any human, animal, device notice a change of 1C except a thermometer or right on 0C?

      Sir Isaac Newton came up with a temperature scale likely as Master of the Mint in 1699, 300 years ago, it was an idea on the boundaries of science. The freezing of water was obvious to everyone for this new scale but one reference point was water so hot you could not keep your elbow in it. In later tables Newton had one point, a hand swirling in hot water. Clearly mankind was not too concerned about temperatures, unless it was freezing and certainly not in England.

      How did it come to this that the world is spending $1,500,000,000,000 a year to change the temperature by 1 degree? There is not any evidence that a few degrees has any significance at all. So why is it dominating our public discourse? Who is making it up and why? The UN?

      150

      • #
        TdeF

        And why are people still dressing up as polar bears? There isn’t a problem. King Canute tried to explain this before the Roman Invasion. And we are warned about ratbags claiming the sky is falling in the childrens’ tale of Chicken Little. It is unbelievable to me that we are in the age of Chiken Little, all spread by the United Nations and their friends in the EU and the extreme left. It’s all about money and power. The sky is not falling. Try telling that to the Green and now Teal voters.

        140

        • #
          TdeF

          Yes, it’s a fight for survival.

          “The United Nations, with offices in 193 countries and 37,000 employees, is the world’s largest universal multilateral international organization”

          And needs hundreds of billions urgently to save the planet.

          Plus there are 40,000 people seconded to this organization. And they need to be paid too. Henny Penny needs money.

          160

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          TdeF:
          Not Roman invasion, Norman. Canute/Knut/Cnut was King of England from 1018-1035. Born 993 or 995. He was also King of Denmark, Norway and part of Sweden (the warmer bit down south where he founded his northern Capital Lund (named after guess where?).

          20

      • #
        David Maddison

        the world is spending $1,500,000,000,000 a year

        Imagine the wondrous things that could be done with that money if it was spent on something useful and not lining the pockets of the Left Elites.

        130

        • #
          TdeF

          My dream has been nuclear fusion. With this sort of money, it would have happened. Then the gas and coal and oil could have been used for organic applications like fertilizer, plastics and more. We are burning through our gas because of the Greens. As Dr Patrick Moore, one of the founders of Greenpeafe in the 1970s when it made sense says the Greens are the enemies of humanity.

          Despots and anarchists in my opinion, the same who used to adopt communism as a path to unearned power.

          The Rev Jim Jones of Guyana fame tried communism, gave up and started his own religion which ended for hundreds in the jungle taking poison. L. Ron Hubbard though it was a path to power, until he invented his incredible science fiction religion. Now we are assailed on all sides by Climate Scientology. There is no way Adam Bandt gives a damn about the planet. It’s all about political power.

          Unfortunately they are supported in the Senate and local politics by the same incredulous masses who automatically believe whatever they are told. Science is based on skepticism. It is not a religion. That for many is its weakness.

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      Graeme No.3

      In 1987 we were told (by Dr. James Hansen of NASA) that the world would be 3℃ warmer by 2020.
      In 1990 “Under the IPCC ‘Business as Usual’ emissions of greenhouse gases the average rate of increase of global mean temperature during the next century is estimated to be 0.3°C per decade. As CO2 emissions have increased faster (as we hear constantly) than predicted that means we have missed out on at least 1°C
      Can we sue for loss of heat?

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    Neville

    No doubt the idiot MSM, pollies, etc will equate dioxide with monoxide and proceed to tell every lie in the book.
    But we should inform them that crews on submarines easily cope with 8,000 ppm levels of co2 and ditto people who work in greenhouses.
    Now off to Ousiders on Sky News.

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  • #
    Ronin

    “We are seeing a spate of people bringing outdoor heaters into the home, and burning heat beads, charcoal, and wood in unventilated rooms,” he said. “It is a combination of a very cold winter and the higher cost of electricity and gas (causing people to do this).

    How can this be? South Australia has all that clean renewable energy.”

    SA power might be clean…. sometimes, except whenever they are importing that Brown Coal generated power from Vicdanistan, but it is the dearest in all of Australia.

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    • #
      Yonniestone

      Yes its expensive, this from Craig Kelly,

      THE GENIUS OF DANIEL ANDREWS

      Dan Andrews was 1st elected in late 2014

      In his first winter in office, with coal providing 95.8% of Victoria’s electricity supply, w/sale electricity prices averaged $49.41 mw/h throughout winter.

      Then Andrews went to work – aided & abetted by the hopeless Federal Liberals in Canberra – blowing up Hazlewood.

      And even after spending tens of billions in subsidies for ‘renewables’ (paid for by consumers in higher retail prices) so far this winter w/sale electricity prices are averaging $399.80.

      Great work Dan

      And that $399.80 is actually much worse, because it doesn’t include the billions that will need to be paid (by taxpayers & electricity users) to the generators to compensate them for AMEO putting artificial caps on the price.

      No energy using Australian business that competes internationally can afford a w/sale electricity at $400 mw/h.

      The Communist Chinese are laughing at us. They must be so proud of Dan – one of their star useful idiots.

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    • #
      Robber

      SA swings.
      Last night, zero solar, 3% wind, battery 2%, Vic imports 20%, diesel 2%, balance gas.
      This morning, wind 97%, battery (3)%, exports 16% (gas is needed to balance the grid).

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  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    Every year there are reports of these types of tragedies. In Australia, there are numerous reports every year, and many investigations, the earliest I could find was ‘Death sequence in multiple carbon monoxide asphyxiations’ which was in 1978.

    Accepting the premise of this post, that “ Energy poverty can be deadly”. Then it has been a problem for decades.

    To have this continue year on year, without any countermeasures from any government of any stripe, just shows how callous our society has become.

    Of course, if you are poor, that is your fault, work harder and one day you will rich.

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      No Peter, the government’s deliberate policy of making people poorer.

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    • #
      Ronin

      “Accepting the premise of this post, that “ Energy poverty can be deadly”. Then it has been a problem for decades.”

      More likely it is ignorance and foolishness that has been with us since time immemorial.

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      • #
        Ronin

        I should clarify that comment, it was aimed at the UN and its cohort of loonies that are setting us up for a disaster if they keep pushing this BS, ignorant fools.

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    • #
      el+gordo

      ‘ … just shows how callous our society has become.’

      Agree, before every winter they should be warning people (in every language) of the danger of carbon monoxide poising. Basically its just ignorance.

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    • #
      yarpos

      “Of course, if you are poor, that is your fault, work harder and one day you will rich.”

      or just sloth in the public service all your life, that seems a popular alternative

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  • #

    After 40 years of the Global Warming/Climate Change Nonsense, we are lucky that most people have survived that insane onslaught on their standard of living. Losing lives to Energy Poverty will continue and accelerate.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    In Third World countries they burn dung from ruminants to keep warm and cook.

    That won’t work in Australia because we have no large native ruminants and when the meat industry is shut down there will be no large animal dung pats to collect.

    In any case, ever since the introduction of dung beetles into Australia, they get rid of cow pats quickly.

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      And if the CSIRO weren’t so WOKE they would be breeding large mutant dung beetles capable of burying that other pollution i.e. believers in The Science.

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    • #
      Sambar

      There is a marketing opportunity to be had in the dung to fuel scenario here David M. I read somewhere that in Arabia, back in the day, camel droppings would immediately be scooped up and thrown into a wooden mould to dry, a bit like making mud bricks. These “camel bricks” were all uniform in size, dried very quickly in the sun and fitted straight into little portable stoves the nomads used. If we act quickly we could probably patent this in Oz.

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  • #
    cadger

    Who knew?

    CDC Report Finds Carbon Monoxide Poisoning Highest During Cold Weather

    https://www.cdc.gov/nceh/publications/spotlights/cospotlight.htm

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    • #
      Ronin

      I fully expect our CSIRO to come out with a parallel study, with similar conclusions, wasting our hardearned.

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  • #

    […] points.First, a number of people attempting to heat their residence with a charcoal burner were ‘rushed to […]

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    Ross

    I haven’t read the comments, but this article is a little alarmist. People have been doing stupid things with improvised indoor heating for decades. I have a brother in law who was a fireman for 30 years and he has many of these type of stories. At least these incidents have been reported. What’s more important and cant be reported are the pensioners and older cohort who have turned down the thermostat on their heating. Or worse still, turned off their heating or are huddled into 1 room with the rest of the house closed off. We probably wont actually detect those changes until years after- they might be revealed in excess deaths during winter, but again difficult to detect. To me, that will be real crime of increasing energy prices for no good reason.

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    Zane

    As a European architect who visited Sydney once said, most Australian houses are simply tents in winter.

    The one I’m in certainly is!

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    • #
      Dennis

      I understand that modern house regulations demand insulation and other measures.

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      • #

        Dennis, the insulation regs are there to reduce cooling costs — sort of the same but not. I have lived in houses in Canberra which were monocrete single layer walls. I could breathe out in the morning and generate fog indoors.

        A Swedish PhD student at ANU I knew said he was going back to Sweden to get warm. I joked that they probably have double brick and double-glazed windows. He laughed and said “what’s that”. We use three layers.

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      • #
        Daffy

        The level of insulation regulated is tokanistic at best. Insulation needs to be part of a whole thermal design of the envelope, roof (part of the envelope, of course), ventilation and floors/slabs. All external walls and roof should be R2.5 at least. Floors enclosed to prevent cross drafts and also R2.5. Internal walls also need to have insulation in some cases, e.g. an internal wall shared with an uninsulated garage, for example.

        Slightly different strategy in humid tropical areas and dry tropical areas, but can still be done to, in all cases, reduce need of energy input to maintain comfortable interior to almost zero. This is not about the climatistas’ fantasies, it is about good, sensible thermal design to minimise running costs.

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  • #
    John Watt

    Australia’s electricity problems started with the privatization of the 1990’s version of the industry. It should be noted that at that time we had some of the cheapest reliable distributed electricity in the developed world . Now we have some of the dearest and it is now of suspect reliability. This has an impact on living costs and on the viability of industry.
    Back in the 1990’s a single , government owned entity had control of electricity from the coal heap to the dishwasher. It was relatively straightforward to match supply and demand and manage a built-in stand-by process to cope with unexpected spikes in demand and plant outages.
    Since then the system has been sold off in a piece meal fashion and effective control has faltered. Instead of continually monitoring demand and matching it with supply we have an artificial pricing mechanism which attempts to use a spot-pricing process to achieve a similar result. That allows privately owned generators to choose whether or not they will feed into the grid. Supply uncertainties are the result. When the whole system was government owned the task was simply to supply the power. No need for complicated pricing. We simply kept the costs down to the point where we had cheap ,reliable electricity.
    Unfortunately both sides of politics participated in the selling-off process. Puzzling because it is an essential service and what responsible leaders of the nation would sell off an essential service to big business profit chasers including non-Australian organisations?
    Since then both sides of politics have joined the “green dream ” and have deluded themselves into thinking that we can base a cheap, reliable electricity supply on unreliable renewable sources. The other major problem with renewables is that they will be supplying from multiple locations (e.g. 200) as opposed to about 40 in the previous coal based system. This requires major extra expenditure on transmission assets. While the raw energy (wind/solar) may be free ,getting it to customers is not.
    Politicians seeking to blame each other for the current mess are simply displaying their ignorance of what it takes to supply cheap reliable electricity. They have a good model of a good system. How hard is it to re-build the 1990’s system?
    While climate change is undoubtedly occurring, the role of atmospheric CO2 has been blown out of all proportion. (See Dr John Nicol’s analysis of the greenhouse effect). Bottom line is that our politicians are taking us down an IPCC/Gore/Thunberg path that blames CO2. Hence we are being encouraged to destroy fossil-fuelled electricity supply and hence manufacturing viability. This misguided approach is based on populist “feel good” thinking as opposed to the factual physics-based analysis presented by Nicol.

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      Ronin

      “When the whole system was government owned the task was simply to supply the power. No need for complicated pricing. We simply kept the costs down to the point where we had cheap ,reliable electricity.”

      Right you are, even allowing for govt inefficiency, they did a much better job of supplying an essential service at an affordable cost.

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      John Watt:
      Any indication or links to Dr John Nicol’s analysis of the greenhouse effect?
      I have to deal with a Dr. John who has publically berated me as a “denier of Climate Change & non-believer in THE SCIENCE”. Obviously a gullible fool but any ammunition for returning fire would be welcome.

      (My sin was to list 40 prognostications from scientist about the coming effects of climate change, dating back to 1922). I have more in reserve.

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      • #
        John Watt

        Hi Graeme,
        Try climatelab.com.au website. Dr Nicol is science advisor to Climate Lab.
        John

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    • #
      Dennis

      Electricity supply (and water etc) are primarily State Government area of responsibility, they based on the Federal Labor RET and subsidies privatised State owned publicly owned power stations and then transmission lines, or in some examples leased them to private sector operators and in QLD a private company owned by the State Government.

      The AEMO is a cooperative of governments and other members.

      Federal Government cannot build power stations (exception being on Commonwealth land) without State planning approvals and other requirements. The Morrison Government had proposed four gas fired generators, two for NSW and one each VIC and SEQ, but so far only one for the NSW Hunter Valley has been granted approval. Also proposed was one coal fired power station for NQ offered with Federal underwriting of funding for a private sector investor but that proposal was not approved by the QLD State Government. And I read recently that funds set aside for projects like them have been cancelled by the Albanese Federal Government.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    As of 17th July there was a spike in winter house fire deaths in NSW, just part way through winter.

    I wonder how many cases are due to people using unconventional and dangerous methods to keep warm because of Government imposed Energy Starvation?

    Ten people had died during winter until 17th July compared to 4 over the whole of last winter.

    And just today, there were multiple fatalities in a single house fire in NSW, including children.

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2022-07-18/nsw-house-fire-related-deaths-preventable-/101245290

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  • #
    John Connor II

    There have been cases like this worldwide for decades. They typically get reported on the tv nightly news along with warnings not to do it.
    Every outdoor bbq comes with warnings about indoor use.
    It should be common knowledge by now.
    So why did they do it?
    The cost of electricity and gas.

    Interestingly though in Sydney the temp was 9C, no info on SA.

    As the fireman said in SA.

    “All of these external barbecue devices — they all indicate ‘do not use the barbecue indoors’ — it’s a killer.
    “We can’t stress anymore; you must not do this. This is very, very foolish behaviour.
    “I feel for everyone who is suffering, but multiple layers of clothing will keep you warm.”

    Seriously – 9C is not cold unless you’re an immigrant from a hotter country.
    Perhaps still more warnings about the bbq risk focussing on immigrants so they know the risks?

    My heat pump went into a de-icing cycle 10 times the other night and it was WAY colder than 9C, at -3C.
    Even so my last power bill a few weeks ago was $270. Heatpumps don’t cost much to run at all.

    The cheapest way to stay warm at no cost is a bottle of hot Chilli sauce. One drop lasts 20 minutes. 😉

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    • #
      Hasbeen

      9C was not all that cold to me either, 50 years ago, but let me assure you, it is damn cold to me now at 82. You do not have the same internal heating capacity as you age.

      Wish I had tour heat pump, the reverse cycle on my air conditioner must be more expensive than yours. My latest power bill was $683, & that is after prompt payment & pensioner discounts. Could the heater in my old water bed be costing the difference?

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      • #
        Ronin

        “Could the heater in my old water bed be costing the difference?”

        Absolutely it is, I binned my old king size water bed years ago and you could see the difference on the graph on the next bill, also, your reverse cycle aircon may not be the newer inverter type, big difference there too.

        30

      • #
        John Connor II

        Poor old JC2 ain’t no spring chicken any more either. No more world records for me. 😮

        I assume you’re joking about the waterbed and heater. 😉

        On a sidenote – I wonder if those camping “instant” water heaters would be a viable cost saving alternative to the standard HWC. Theoretically they should.

        00

  • #
    Zane

    I expect the globalists to soon prepare us for a mostly raw food diet to save on cooking fuel emissions. Every little helps! Fried grasshoppers? Ha! You will eat your bugs raw and enjoy them!

    Think I’m joking? I wish I was. I can read these globalists like a book.

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    • #
      David Maddison

      I will be posting something on that in unthreaded.

      10

      • #
        John Connor II

        I already have but look forward to your new info.😊
        Actually we’ve all been eating insects for years unknowingly but more on that later.

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  • #
    Ronin

    As more families hit peak energy poverty and get disconnected, look for these incidents to increase markedly.

    30

  • #

    […] JoNova; President Obama called it right when he said renewable energy would cause electricity bills to […]

    00

  • #
    Bruce

    Sometime in the near future, some wide-eyed innocent is going to ask:

    “What did people use before candles?”

    To which the answer will be:

    “Electricity”.

    50

    • #
      Dennis

      And the little children will ask: what’s electricity?

      30

    • #
      Sambar

      Hey, hey, hey don’t think you will be using candles into the future, you will just sit in the dark and enjoy it. Remember the first rule of candle making WAX. Aren’t enough bees in the world to keep everyone in WAX. So where does the wax come from. Well we could use that by product of the petro chemical industry. Oh wait. Damn, the simplier life gets the more complicated it becomes.

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  • #
    Dennis

    A public information campaign is obviously needed to warn people about using heat bead fires and similar dangerous to burn inside “heaters” targeting the migrant communities resettled here via UN HCR refugee camps in poorer countries where open fires are all the people have to cook with and keep warm.

    10

  • #
    Philip

    Id like to do a cost comparison. Is it cheaper to use bbq coals then put a heater on ? Id be surprised if it was actually.

    20

    • #
      Dennis

      Reverse cycle air-conditioning is definitely a more expensive for heating purposes than firewood being burnt in a wood heater which unlike a room wall mounted aircon heats the whole house.

      Of course the source and cost of firewood varies area to area, I am in the country.

      20

      • #
        David Maddison

        Very few people in the city have access to free firewood, plus it is labour intensive to use.

        And then if everyone in the city starts burning wood they will put restrictions on it or ban it as already happens in some places.

        In the struggle to keep warm, there are going to be no easy ways.

        The Elites want us to suffer. This is a war against everything good the Enlightenment and the Industrial Revolution brought to us.

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        • #
          John Connor II

          Another reason to not live in the city…

          That’s one good thing about being rural – you can have a good fire!
          Power goes off. No problem. You have heating, hot water and cooking and minimal lighting.
          There’s nothing like a wood fired BBQ.
          Crispy jacket potatoes cooked in the coals.
          Yum.

          I suspect the last major burnoff I had could be seen from space. Man did that go up! Couldn’t get within 10m of it.

          You can have your city living. Been there done that. No thanks.

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  • #
    Ronin

    There have been 13 house fire related deaths so far this winter.

    10

  • #
    William x

    It is tragic that this has occurred.

    the article states:

    “Thankfully no one died.”

    That is a good result,
    Though understand that there can be lifelong issues due to damage to your major organs from CO poisoning.

    As a first responder, I would like to explain what happens on the fireground.

    CO binds to your red blood cells and inhibits your uptake of oxygen.
    It takes a very, very long time to expel that CO from your bloodstream.

    The patient will look grey in colour. shallow breathing.

    If we have a severe case, giving oxygen will not make you well in a few minutes. You will need urgent hospital care.
    If a patient shows signs of recovery and we remove the oxygen, that patient will relapse.

    Your vascular system is compromised.
    All we are trying to do is to force an increase in the oxygen level of your CO free, red blood cells.

    Why? So as to limit further damage to your major organs.
    If you go into cardiac arrest, we have buckley’s chance of saving you.

    Please, please. Maintain your smoke detectors and DO not used an unflued heater in your home.

    I have seen this occurrence too many times. Sadly with numerous loss of life.

    I have tried to keep this post simple and free of terminology, so all can understand.

    Please take care all.

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  • #

    Local street libraries have been cleared out by people (allegedly) wanting to burn them for heat.

    00

  • #
    Daffy

    The rich/elites not only hate the poor, they hate people other than themselves with a vengeance. It is the modern parody of aristocracy minus the concept of noblesse oblige.

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  • #
    LG

    Even if it weren’t toxic, would burning charcoal (presumably purchased at a retail store) even be cheaper than using gas or electricity? A bag of charcoal might cost $10 or $15, and wouldn’t last more than a day or night if burned constantly. If done every day that would be at least $300. There’s no way heating a home would cost $300 per month in gas or electricity at current retail prices. I have gas central heating and don’t shy away from using it when cold, and my last gas bill was equiv $140 per month. And that’s not just heating, but also stove + hot water. And the supply charge.

    00