JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


Handbooks

The Skeptics Handbook

Think it has been debunked? See here.

The Skeptics Handbook II

Climate Money Paper


Advertising

micropace


GoldNerds

The nerds have the numbers on precious metals investments on the ASX



Archives

Could Green BioGas ferment botulism?

Clostridium Botulinum is one of the toughest bugs around. And its toxin (a neurotoxin) is also one of the most deadly, yet strangely popular at the same time. Yes botulinum toxin is also known as BoTox and tiny quantities paralyze nerves. Small quantities can be fatal as nerve damage progresses to respiratory failure.

In it’s spore stage you can boil the bug to no avail — it’s one of the reasons boiling isn’t enough for tins, or sterilization of lab equipment. To kill these spores you need 121C in an autoclave (or pressure cooker). The toxin itself can be destroyed at 100C.

A million acres of land are producing corn for biogas plants in Germany.

German “Green” Biogas Plants Producing Deadly Botulism – “Could Be Catastrophic To Wildlife”

By P Gosselin on 19. Mai 2011 No tricks Zone

German sporting and dog magazine Wild und Hund reports that thousands of domestic and wild animals are falling ill from tainted waste from green “climate-friendly” biogas plants, which is then used as an agricultural fertilizer in fields.

Hat tip:Dirk Maxeiner here (in a commentary titled: “Gross negligence in green”).

DEATH FROM THE BIOGAS PLANT – CHRONIC BOTULISM

In the German region of Vogtland in Saxony, 600 cows and the farmer himself fell seriously ill. Diagnosis: chronic botulism. And that was no isolated incident …

The unnatural ferment

In early spring when harvesting biomass plants, foremost green rye, young wildlife end up getting minced by harvesters and end up as an ingredient in the biogas plant brew. In a addition slaughterhouse waste and other meat, such as old hens, along with manure slurry, get thrown in as raw material. At a brewing temperature of 40°C, bacteria multiply with abandon…

The brewing pot with such a gruesome mix is then heated to 70C to make it hygienic, which of course doesn’t bother the botulinum spores at all. The waste material is used as fertilizer and the spores are spread across farmland for wildlife and cattle to ingest.

The end result is more often a chronic form of poisoning rather than the acute very deadly variety.

Read it all at No tricks Zone (there are interesting comments too).

See the story in German on and watch affected cows struggle: Youtube.

My hat tip to Lawrie Ayres.

VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 0.0/10 (0 votes cast)

Tiny Url for this post: http://tinyurl.com/3br833v

51 comments to Could Green BioGas ferment botulism?

  • #
    Bulldust

    Sorry to go O/T … heck you are used to it by now :p Our mate Will Steffen is about to publish the Australian alarmist report of the year, as outlined at The West:

    http://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/a/-/national/9493811/sea-levels-could-rise-a-metre-by-2100/

    Here are some snippets of the article:

    “A plausible estimate of the amount of sea-level rise by 2100 compared to 2000 is 0.5 to one metre,” it says.

    That’s higher than the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s top range of 0.18m to 0.76m.

    But that’s OK, because our mate Will did an exacting analysis of the science… he surveyed reports and talked to experts. Therefore, apparently, we should just take his word for it:

    “Some people may take issue with that – but that’s my judgment,” Professor Steffen told AAP ahead of the report’s release at Parliament House.

    What about the costs of doing something about climate change? Well Will has run his expert economics brain over that one as well and come to this brilliant conclusion:

    “The costs of not doing something about climate change will almost surely be far, far greater than the costs of doing something about it,” he said.

    So “almost surely” … which IPCC level of certainty was that again?

    Anyone?

    Bueller?

    Bueller??

    00

  • #
  • #
    Paul

    Fleisch kranker Tiere – Was landet auf unseren Tellern?

    BSE, Schweinepest, Maul- und Klauenseuche oder Vogelgrippe – wenn sie von diesen Erkrankungen lesen, vergeht den Meisten die Lust am Essen. Aber: Ist die Seuche erst einmal erkannt, tut der Staat viel dafür, dass das belastete Fleisch nicht in den Handel gelangt. Anders verhält es sich mit Botulismus. Die Nervenerkrankung zählt in Deutschland nicht als Seuche und Tiere aus befallenen Herden dürfen geschlachtet und das Fleisch verkauft werden.

    Ein vogtländischer Landwirt hat sich mittlerweile selbst mit dem Erreger infiziert.

    In diesem Sinne: Guten Appetit!

    Unfortunately my German is inadequate to understand the video or most of the reports. However the ‘No Tricks Zone’ link is in English.

    DEATH FROM THE BIOGAS PLANT – CHRONIC BOTULISM

    There’s been a terrible suspicion for years. The residue from biogas plants that produce “clean” green electricity is causing a deadly disease among domestic and wild animals, and humans – chronic botulism.
    Wild und Hund not only examines the disease, but also looks into the background as to why such a hazard has not been publicly discussed for 10 years. In the aftermath of Fukushima, the public wishes to shift to renewable energy sources. Today in Germany already over a million acres of land are producing corn for biogas plants. German Agriculture Minister Ms Ilse Aigner announced on 27 April 2011 that land used for growing plants for producing energy will be significantly expanded to an area anywhere between 4 to 6 million acres. Today biogas plants are sprouting everywhere in the countryside.

    I see two sinister ‘unintended consequences’ flowing from this misguided policy of alternative energy from bio-fuel – the one highlighted in this thread, and the other already mentioned elsewhere, the effect on the poor of this world on food prices.

    The ‘Green’ movement is not what they would have you believe they are!

    The big green killing machine: What is VAD?

    Paul

    00

  • #
    WB

    Jo this is OT like commenter B above. In the SMH there’s a graphic that is superalarming. I haven’t seen it before (not that that counts for much).

    http://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/sealevel-rise-to-hit-sydney-worst-warns-climate-report-20110522-1ez0x.html

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    The Australian has an excellent piece absolutely trashing the ludicrous policy that was the NSW home solarPV subsidy system:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/solar-panels-burn-taxpayer-dollars/story-fn59niix-1226060667283

    Well worth the read … it shows how damaging poorly concocted policies can be. Rest assured that Joolya can stuff up any carbon (sic) price (sic) policy just as badly.

    00

  • #
    Roy Hogue

    Why, just once can’t the results of stupidity fall back on the perpetrators? Just once — that’s all I ask. Just one time…

    BioGas or political flatulence?

    00

  • #

    Will Steffen is a bloke missing a sandwich board that says” The end is nigh!”

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    I am not sure where to start on this one. At least when judges start losing the plot they get stood down, as do surgeons who starting mucking up in operations etc… Somehow when a Professor Wil Steffen makes no economic or scientific sense whatsoever and start spouting the D-word left and right to silence critics he is considered somehow competent? WTF????

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/make-carbon-tax-hurt-julia-gillard-advised/story-fn59niix-1226060946662

    My thoughts which are unlikely to get published:

    At what point did the Holocaust-associating word “denialism” become acceptable use? If Prof Steffen wants to talk science and economics then lets get busy… but outrageous statements like this make it quite clear that he left the realm of rational, scientific thought a long time ago. Nice paycheck being aFederal Government stooge, but…

    00

  • #
    Damian Allen

    “Will Steffen” and his ilk should be waterboarded !

    00

  • #
    pat

    apart from this article in jamaica’s top newspaper, i cannot find a single reference online to this taxpayer-funded Caribbean romp:

    22 May: Jamaica Gleaner: Climate experts, policymakers deliberate at T&T meeting
    The Conference is being co-hosted by Australia and the South Pacific Regional Environment Program, and is being funded by the Australian Government, through the Department of Climate Change and Energy Efficiency and the Australian Agency for International Development.
    http://go-jamaica.com/news/read_article.php?id=28842

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    PS> Wow my comment at The Australian made it up :) I thought it was a touch inflammatory, but there you go.

    00

  • #
    Bruce of Newcastle

    Prof Steffen just said on ABC News that temperature will rise by 7 C by 2100. That is 0.8 C a decade! I don’t know what he’s smoking, but it certainly isn’t real world data. UAH has been flat to falling since 1998! Quite consistent with the solar cycle and PDO decline.

    His claim is so ludicrous I have got to think he is deluded.

    00

  • #

    Bruce, He’s further up the insanity scale than that. Somewhere between Bugf**k Nuts and BatSh*t Insane.

    00

  • #
    Paul

    I love some of the comments following the article posted above : –

    Time to end climate denialism …

    LIARS of Melbourne Posted at 10:36 AM Today

    Phony debate? Pot-kettle-black, this from people caught out distorting and fudging data to fool the general population.

    Comment 10 of 104

    and

    Liz Rose of Perth WA Posted at 10:44 AM Today

    Nothing we do in Australia will change the rate of global warming, our emissions are minimal in a global sense. Until the large emitters, USA, China, India take carbon reduction on board we may as well spit into the wind.

    Comment 17 of 104

    and

    Ninderthana of North West NSW Posted at 10:57 AM Today

    The so-called “science” of climate change is an absolute disgrace. Future generations are going to be flabbergasted that so many (normally intelligent) people were sucked-in by these self-appointed “experts”. How much cooling will have to take place before these charlatans and pseudo-scientists are discredited.

    Comment 32 of 104

    and

    Nigel Posted at 11:02 AM Today

    If it’s so dangerous we should immediately stop all coal exports … o, hang on how will swanniwe get the budget to balance without a super profits tax on the coal miners? Hypocrites.

    Comment 42 of 104

    Just a small sample. People ain’t stupid, once suspicions are aroused most can spot an attempt to defraud them a mile off. That is one of the realities on which democracy is founded.

    What the article should be entitled, instead, should be something like “Time to stop this climate-scam”

    Paul

    00

  • #
    Paul

    Somehow the Professor Steffen gives the game away with what he is quoted as saying : –

    Professor Steffen said there was no debate in scientific literature over the fundamentals of science underpinning climate change “and there hasn’t been for decades”.

    “I think we want to make clear in this report where the credible science actually stands, what the credible scientists are actually saying,” he said.

    Credible? This is derived from the Latin ‘credo’, from which we get the English word ‘creed’ or statement of belief.

    QED. This is not science, it is a belief system.

    Once one has fallen for the sales pitch one loses the ability to think for oneself. Now all one has is a belief based on what ‘credible’ scientists say. And who are these credible scientists? Why they are the ones who warn against the immanent threat of catastrophic global warming. Any scientist who says otherwise is a paid mouthpiece for those infinitely bad industries which give us our cheap energy.

    Ouch!

    Paul

    00

  • #
    Damian Allen

    OT but funny……….

    Julia Gillard (accidentally) rails against her carbon dioxide tax !!!
    I’m sure irony is lost on this woman, but just on Saturday (21/05/2011), she said this:-
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/05/21/3223197.htm?site=melbourne&section=news

    “We don’t have time for made-up figures and shameless fear mongering.
    “We don’t have time to waste on a debate that lacks fact and reason.
    (Gillard’s address to the Victorian ALP State Conference 21.5.11)
    Also against the way the carbon dioxide tax is being sold is Penny Wong, who told the ABC 7.30 Report on 2nd December 2009….
    PENNY WONG: I don’t think confronting a scare campaign in politics is ever easy.
    It is always easier to frighten people and to tell untruths than it is to inspire change.
    They accuse Abbott of a scare campaign – while mounting the mother of all scare campaigns themselves!
    Unbelievable. Literally!

    00

  • #
    Damian Allen

    Here is the email address for this “will steffen” traitor:-

    will.steffen@anu.edu.au

    Send him a message and let him know what you think of his Propaganda and Lies !

    00

  • #
    pattoh

    “ the evidence for global warming has never been stronger”(* Steffen et al 2011)

    *that is if you measure it by the new science of Climate Phrenology.

    The accepted method is to lock a bunch of climate scientists in a room & run tests with a special vernier which measures skull dimensions , wallet thickness & frequent flyer points.

    00

  • #
    manalive

    Re: The Climate Commission Report ‘The Critical Decade’
    I took their advice, read the ‘Important Message – please read’ which states inter alia:

    “…the Commonwealth of Australia and all persons acting for the Commonwealth preparing this report accept no liability for the accuracy of or inferences from the material contained in this publication, or for any action as a result of any person’s or group’s interpretations, deductions, conclusions or actions in relying on this material…”

    There was no need to read any further.

    00

  • #
    mc

    Damian Allen @ 9.

    Damian Allen:
    May 23rd, 2011 at 11:35 am

    “Will Steffen” and his ilk should be waterboarded

    Wrong. Will Steffen and his ilk should not be waterboarded, nor should anyone else!

    Your statement above represents precisely the kind of barbarism that rational justice loving people stand against, and I would suggest that the great majority of people who frequent this site are of that type. Justice loving and rational.

    I could be mistaken of course and if I am the good people who contribute here will no doubt let me know and I will bugger off to a site that does advocate reason and justice.

    You ought to know by now that inflammatory statements of the kind you have used above are exactly what warmists want to see coming from our side of the debate so they can point and declare, “See what they are saying !” “They are cranks and lunatics.”! It matters not one iota to the other side that you may have been merely joking.

    PS, your links are useful, I use them often and I thank you for that.

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    The report is now available in all it “glory”:

    http://resources.news.com.au/files/2011/05/22/1226060/682675-aus-news-file-climate-change-11-05-22.pdf

    I note from a quick glance that some highly discredited sources have been used. I notice there is cherry-picking: for instance they show Arctic decline in ice extent but ignore Antarctic gain. Graphs are clipped short in cases where reversal of trends doesn’t fit the storyline, despite years of more recent data being available. They show the decreasing flow into Perth dams, despite that having more to do with changing landuse than rainfall decreases.

    I could go on… and that is from a 2 minute perusal of this alarmist claptrap. No doubt Jo will have another field day :)

    00

  • #
    janama

    WB @4 Steffen’s chart is out of date – it was recently revised showing cooling

    http://i48.tinypic.com/14e6wjn.gif

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    The Comedy Central of Australian politics is at it again:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/make-carbon-tax-hurt-julia-gillard-advised/story-fn59niix-1226061256624

    Christine Milne is now calling for a ban on all new coal mines. Here’s a snippet or two to whet your appetite:

    “This is a negotiation and it’s going to be a compromise,” she said.

    “This will not be as the Greens would have it. We would like to go to 100 per cent renewable energy immediately, if we could.

    and

    “In terms of coal mines, the Greens have said very clearly no new coal mines, no extension of existing coal mines. Let’s invest in renewables.”

    Yes that worked so very well in NSW and Spain and Denmark and… I could go on.

    At least she is good comedy value … by ranting as she does she focuses fire on the Greens and hence the Labor-Greens love in which can only serve to drive the voting public further over to the Libs.

    Thank you Christine for your contribution to the Liberal cause.

    00

  • #
    Llew Jones

    Is Will Steffen a genuine climate scientist? My Cursory reading of his CV in Europe and in Australia indicated that his specialty is society and human induced climate change. Which has him straddling science and sociology. Has he done any serious climate science research?

    00

  • #
  • #
    Another Ian

    Also O/T

    From http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2011/05/23/life-in-the-climate-science-nut-house/#comments

    Deadman says:
    May 23, 2011 at 5:30 am
    Haven’t you received the memo? The debate we never had is over, according to Climate Commissioner, Will Steffen, in The Critical Decade: Climate science, risks and responses (p. 3):

    Over the past two or three years, the science of climate change has become a more widely contested issue in the public and political spheres. Climate science is now being debated outside of the normal discussion and debate that occurs within the peer-reviewed scientific literature in the normal course of research. It is being attacked in the media by many with no credentials in the field. The questioning of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC), the “climategate” incident based on hacked emails in the UK, and attempts to intimidate climate scientists have added to the confusion in the public about the veracity of climate science.
    By contrast to the noisy, confusing “debate” in the media, within the climate research community our understanding of the climate system continues to advance strongly. Some uncertainties remain and will continue to do so, given the complexity of the climate system, and the impossibility of knowing the future pathways of human political, social and technological changes. Meanwhile there is much climate change science that is now well and confidently understood, and for which there is strong and clear evidence.

    See also “Four Lies in Four Sentences”.

    http://impactofcc.blogspot.com/2011/05/four-lies-in-four-sentences.html

    “Four Lies in Four Sentences
    From the conclusion of The Critical Decade: Climate science, risks and responses, by the Climate Commission:

    As you’ve read in this report, we know beyond reasonable doubt that the world is warming and that human emissions of greenhouse gases are the primary cause.* The impacts of climate change are already being felt in Australia and around the world with less than 1 degree of warming globally.† The risks of future climate change – to our economy, society and environment – are serious, and grow rapidly with each degree of further temperature rise.‡ Minimising these risks requires rapid, deep and ongoing reductions to global greenhouse gas emissions.§ [p. 60]

    The rear and front covers of the report.” (Copy of front and back covers shown here at site)

    First comment
    Deadman said…
    I have a theory to explain the cover: it looks as if someone wrote a memo, “Should we use some nice cover art to polish this turd?”, and the reply was, “¡=@§#!”

    23 May, 2011 16:53″

    00

  • #
    Rereke Whakaaro

    Well guys,

    I started reading this post, and thought, “Oh goodie, it is about botulism from bio-gas, which is one of the things that we have been concerned about for some time”.

    And then I discovered that practically all of the comments are about Will Steffen. WTF?

    They both may be equally toxic (actually Steffen is probably worse) but the gentleman (sic) hardly warrants a thread of his own. Can we get back on topic please?

    The slurry from the brewing of bio-gas, when used as a fertilizer, has the ability to poison sheep and pigs, because the spores can attach to growing grass. Depending on time between ingestion and slaughter, and the tests conducted, the meat can pass inspection and end up in the human food chain. We are told that cattle are not affected because the heat generated in a cow’s stomach is sufficient to kill the spores.

    Now there are probabilities at each stage of that process, so it only occurs under certain conditions. But we know it can happen, so I believe that we should adopt the precautionary principle and demand a total shut down all bio-fuel plants, world-wide. Our children’s health may depend on it.

    There, I feel better now … carry on chaps …

    00

  • #
    rpeo

    Will all that extra botox make the German dogs look younger?

    00

  • #
    Joe Lalonde

    Jo,

    Understanding this planet is to also understand the chemical changes that occur in our bodies due to the DNA changes to diversify the many different life forms.
    The “What you eat or drink” can change the DNA structure and also what you are exposed too. Sun exposure, different forms of radiation, other forms of energy can also contribute to these changes.

    Hey, that is just some more research I have looked at.

    00

  • #
    Mark D.

    Rereke @ 27 I have been waiting for the thread to get on topic too. Thanks for trying and lets hope it stays that way.

    Jo or anyone else: do we know how many of these kind of botulism refineries exist? Here in the US I know only of ethanol plants (from corn) which is probably not the right process to create the botulism problem.

    00

  • #

    mc @ 20

    You ought to know by now that inflammatory statements of the kind you have used above are exactly what warmists want to see coming from our side of the debate so they can point and declare, “See what they are saying !” “They are cranks and lunatics.”! It matters not one iota to the other side that you may have been merely joking.

    Please ignore our resident mobying troll. Damian(current alias), has been trolling this site for years. I don’t know if it’s questionable mental health or extreme dedication to the warmist cause but, his shenanigans have a uni-dimensional strategy which is easy to spot(he usually only links to extreme right wing blogs like Andrew Bolt). Just thumbs down and ignore, rinse and repeat.

    00

  • #
    Beth Cooper

    I read Bulldust’s strong :-) response to Will Stepen’s pseudo science and noted that only 6 comments of the 130 were favorable, the rest almost as damning as Bulldusts’.

    00

  • #

    Rereke Whakaaro @ 27:

    But we know it can happen, so I believe that we should adopt the precautionary principle and demand a total shut down all bio-fuel plants, world-wide. Our children’s health may depend on it.

    You forgot to say, “The science is settled. It’s worse than we thought!” :D

    00

  • #
    John F

    http://factsanddetails.com/china.php?itemid=392&catid=10&subcatid=66#02

    Then you need to read this to confirm that even if we did our bit, China have not intention of ever doing anything anytime soon, my concern is not co2 its all the other stuff the freely pollute with, Stefan continues to spruke what a great job China are doing what a joke

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    Mea Culpa on the thread derail Rereke … but it is the main news of the week on the subject of climate policy. You can exact your revenge by talking about botulism in the next thread (which my tea leaves indicate is going to be about Will Steffen).

    00

  • #
  • #
    Neville

    Terry McCrann further pulls apart the BS of this idiot report and the mess Juliar could find herself in.

    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/business/terry-mccranns-column/carbon-debate-a-no-win-situation-for-pm/story-e6frfig6-1226061435866

    00

  • #
    Neville

    The Mt Isa story is indeed a tragedy but before these green and labor morons are finished with us it will get much worse.

    The Greens will hold the balance of power in the senate in a little over a month, so what are their secret dreams of a carbon price?

    A Victorian Green’s MP won’t even rule out a level of $500 a tonne.

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/no_price_too_high_for_the_greens/

    00

  • #
    janama

    Alan Jones will interview David Karoly tomorrow after 7am. This will be interesting.

    http://www.2gb.com/listenlive/wmp_stream.php

    00

  • #
    crakar24

    Rereke in 27,

    I dont know much about this subject but am interested maybe you can be more detailed in this process.

    On a lighter note my son told me a joke “how does a Kiwi say ten tons of tin”?

    Cheers

    Crakar

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    Janama:

    There is a barrage, a concerted effort ATM, to pound the media with CAGW articles on a number of fronts. The MSM does no analysis and they merely report the press releases given to them.

    The Australian has a couple pieces, one of which has a pretty giant blue wrasse, in case there was any doubt that the carbon (sic) price (sic) was justified:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/national-affairs/no-one-country-can-save-the-reef-says-tim-flannery/story-fn59niix-1226061500198

    How can you argue with a piece featuriong Nemo’s great grand dad?

    00

  • #
    Rereke Whakaaro

    Waffle: #33

    You forgot to say, “The science is settled. It’s worse than we thought!”

    OMG! I am so ASHAMED – how could I have forgotten? Of course you are right. The science is settled – somewhere in the bottom of the nearest cesspit. ;-)

    Bulldust: #35

    You can exact your revenge by talking about botulism in the next thread …

    Nah, I feel better now … and I have taken my little yellow pills.

    crakar24: #40

    On a lighter note my son told me a joke “how does a Kiwi say ten tons of tin”?

    Er, I don’t get it. Are you sure that is not a joke about Tasmanians? Some Aussies get confused about those island thingies.

    00

  • #
    MadJak

    Bulldust@41:

    The MSM does no analysis and they merely report the press releases given to them

    And that dear friends is the root cause of most of this crapola. “Journalists” too lazy and incompetant to do uhmmm, journalism. What a pack of oxygen thieves. And Murdoch whines we don’t want to pay for their “news”!

    Does anyone really beleive that a climate commission, set up and reporting to a government which is desperate to impose a new tax would have come up with any other finding?

    The next pitch from the anointed ones will be that Guillard will make out how she knocked the price down – won’t it be great how she stood up to the greens!

    Of course, they want to get any price in just to get it in the system. Then the greens and “In-dependants” can crank up the rate at will.

    Yes folks, once this one is in, it’s going to be the ultimate tax grab. All the pigs will be in the trough.

    00

  • #
    pattoh

    MadJak:

    Yeah & if you feed the buggers it only encourages them to breed.

    00

  • #
    Bulldust

    One last attempt to post at JtI’s blog:

    Here’s a fact for you to mull on Jack. If everyone and every manmade thing in Australia disappeared tomorrow, then using the IPCC models the resulting decrease in global temperatures by 2050 would be 0.0154C. Any, repeat ANY, policy to “decarbonise” (sic) the Australian economy is a completely futile exercise. The impact on the global climate would not be noticed.

    Cross posted as I am sure you’ll “moderate” this comment as well… clearly no breach of The Australian’s blogging guidelines, just simple bias.

    At: http://blogs.theaustralian.news.com.au/jacktheinsider/index.php/theaustralian/comments/turnbull_blows_the_whistle_on_direct_action/

    Just so we are clear that he is doggedly biased on the issue of climate change… I am sure that comment will be moderated or met with a pointless, off-topic and snide remark from JtI himself.

    00

  • #
  • #
    Bruce of Newcastle

    Bulldust at #45

    I get a feeling that the Oz’s moderators get flooded every time another climate story is posted. So many lately that the stories are scrolling off the website in hours to make room for the next ones. A day later and you can’t even find ‘em anymore.

    ‘Bout the last half a dozen posts I put in haven’t gone up. On topic polite & sciency too. That may change as fury quotient is rising in the Bruce household the more we get CAGW spoutings from the usual suspects.

    00

  • #
    pat

    there’s a poll here which has about 26% wanting a tax on carbon, not carbon dioxide, of course, and 10% wanting higher carbon reduction targets.

    24 May: Canberra Times: Markets to punish a nation in climate denial
    BY ROSSLYN BEEBY
    But Mr Abbott said the report supported his plan for tackling climate change through storing carbon in the landscape..
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/news/national/national/general/markets-to-punish-a-nation-in-climate-denial/2172473.aspx?page=2

    it’s time for the Coalition to admit CAGW is a scam, to draw attention to the use of “carbon” instead of “carbon dioxide” etc.

    00

  • #
    Damian Allen

    Thanks “Pat” (48),
    I just voted for the obvious choice in the poll – “No Action”.

    Global warming is a Fraud, a Scam and a Con !

    00

  • #
    Neville

    Here’s a new study that finds zero SL rise over the last 80 years, in fact a small deceleration.

    I hope Bulldust etc has a look at this, very interesting stuff.

    If true it just about wrecks any theory of unusual or unprecedented temp increase for 80 years.

    I mean if there is an increase in SL to be found why can’t they find it?

    http://www.jcronline.org/doi/abs/10.2112/JCOASTRES-D-10-00157.1

    00

  • #
    Lawrie

    I still think the botulism item is important. It’s another case of unintended consequences of Green policies.

    Pat @ 48. I voted in the poll and by my reckoning 65% want to a. make it easier to reduce household and business carbon (sic) footprint, b. wait and see what the rest of the world is doing and c. do nothing. So even in the socialist stronghold of Canberra only about a third want a carbon tax. That doesn’t seem like an overwhelming call for us to do something about climate change.

    Julia and her motley crew are on a hiding to nothing if they persist with this fraud. Couldn’t happen to a nicer bunch of losers.

    00