JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Australia still hangs in the carbon trading twilight zone

The Australian situation tonight: Today the Emissions Trading Scheme (ETS) decision was successfully delayed by questions until Monday. That’s good news, but there’s no Champers popping yet. The longer we wait, the longer the real story of the fraud has to filter through to our representatives, but this is a race to overcome two decades of propaganda in one weekend.

This week will be written up in history books. Late yesterday a parliamentary mutiny occurred as opposition cabinet members abandoned their leader. Three on Monday: Mitch Fifield, Brett Mason and Mathias Cormann. Then Thursday: six more, and on Friday Concetta Fierravanti-Wells all quit their appointed shadow positions. Senate offices are apparently being swamped with emails. The message it seems, is getting through. (Thanks to all of you who have sent emails, I been copied in on many, please keep them coming :-) ).

Senator Fierravanti-Wells had been expected to back the ETS laws but has now indicated she will vote against the bill.

‘I acknowledge the avalanche of correspondence and feedback conveyed to me from a wide cross-section of the community, most especially after the decision of the joint party room to amend and support the legislation,’ she said.

Senator Fierravanti-Wells, who is facing a Senate preselection ballot on December 12, indicated she was heeding the view of the NSW Liberal base of the party, which was strongly against the ETS decision.

‘In all my years of involvement in the party, I have never seen such an extraordinary reaction,’ she said. [link]

The left leaning Labor Government needs just 7 votes to get the Legislation through the Senate.

The left leaning Labor Government needs just 7 votes to get the Legislation through the Senate. The Leader of the Opposition – Malcolm Turnbull, appears determined to deliver those votes, no matter what his party say or what scandalous information  is exposed.  On Tuesday, he survived a leadership spill, then listened as more than half the members of his own party spoke against the ETS. Through accounting tricks that the East Anglia CRU would be proud of, he announced the opposition supported the ETS. Despite the arrogant bullying, on that day, it looked to Reuters like the Australian ETS was a done-deal, but the anger and fury within the conservatives was ignited. Turnbull staked his leadership on the line in October, and it’s now almost guaranteed that he will lose that role.

Meanwhile, Reuters is oblivious as to why there is a mass uprising and grassroots protest against the deal, indeed, these two journalists refer to the fate of the legislation as a delay, as if it has never occurred to them that it might not pass. Instead of asking the skeptical parliamentarians the obvious question “Why?”, they talk to anonymous carbon traders and a consultant who not a skeptic. They report that “The delay worried carbon traders”. In this “analysis” they don’t mention the  ClimateGate scandal at all — a bit like not noticing the black hole that gatecrashed the party.

The word I have heard is that the Liberal opposition will meet Monday at 9am to solve the leadership question, and then the ETS meeting will start at 10am. But it might be Tuesday, and all of it is subject to change without notice.

In this “analysis” they don’t mention the  ClimateGate scandal at all — a bit like not noticing the black hole that gatecrashed the party.

The question now is who will lead the Liberal Party, and which way will they call the party room to move? Will the party vote as one block, or for the first time, will a noteable section “cross the floor”. In Australian politics, “crossing the floor” is a major move. It has simply never happened on a mass scale, but it would have happened any day this week, if the vote had been held. Tony Abbot has written to the Party Whip asking for a leadership spill. A few months ago he thought the party should go with the ETS, because they couldn’t win an election right now. But he has changed his mind.

The other most widely suggested leader is Joe Hockey, who is well liked, but has backed Turnbull all the way with the ETS. Tonight he is apparently face-booking for feedback about views on the climate. No doubt he realizes that there’s no point in the party dumping Turnbull because of the ETS and then adopting another ETS fan. Could be a weekend “conversion” coming. There’s nothing like flexibility.

In Australian politics the “front benchers” means those in the Cabinet, i.e. the top dogs in the party who all have special assigned roles in certain areas. The “back benchers” are the other elected members, (i.e. everyone else who is not part of the select group called the “Cabinet”). This upset has been driven by back benchers, but now gained enough momentum to be picked up by those at the front. The first vote on the opposition leadership on Tuesday this week was like the test run, and even though Turnbull survived, the numbers shocked the party (48 : 35). Someone from out of the blue (Kevin Andrews) amassed 35 votes against the leader. It was a message that his leadership was close to failing. Now today we know that the top dogs, so to speak, are negotiating for the top role.

Malcolm Turnbull has said he won’t go quietly, and people will need to demand that he go. Obviously, they are.

Not coincidentally the New Zealand government unfortunately negotiated their own ETS this week. No doubt they were hoping that Australia would too. It may still happen.  The NZ bill was passed 63-58.

Meanwhile Andrew Bolt has been accused of all things, of being a “player”. The ABC may be feeling threatened.

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38 comments to Australia still hangs in the carbon trading twilight zone

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    [...] populace and the huge backlash over the ETS policy – listen here Joanne Nova talks about the changing climate of the liberal party and how senators are dumping support for the ETS. Senator Fierravanti-Wells – a previous [...]

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  • #

    Seven votes needed to pass is close. However, we in the US are needing to move about the same number of votes to the anti-AGW side to prevent passage of even worse legislation. I am not holding my breath. The breadth and depth of self destructiveness in our political class is beyond comprehension.

    I do sincerely hope you can avoid a Mann made catastrophe. I want to have someplace on earth I can move to if the US falls into the dark abyss of terminal stupidity. I am glad I have been able to make a small contribution to your efforts. If you win, maybe we can too.

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    Steve

    “Never was so much owed by so many to so few”.

    I hope they stand strong and don’t give into to fear and intimidation. Perhaps if Australia doesn’t pass an ETS then maybe NZ can repeal ours.

    Here’s hoping

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    Plasmablast

    What is it about Liberal leaders and their women?

    First we saw John Howard, ready to withdraw gracefully from leadership the moment his Party asked him to, only to be denied that grace by Janet insisting he refuse to go.

    Malcolm Turnbull was pictured across the Nation’s news papers yesterday morning, giving and receiving a most gracious kiss from Mrs Turnbull – as if Mrs Turnbull was to say “go knife your Party but remember I am the woman you never had as a Mother”. – It reeked of insecurity by Malcolm at a time his testosterone should have been flowing.

    A twisted concept I know, but Turnbull’s final speech last night confirmed he was speaking from his feminine side.

    Defiant to his Liberal core values espoused by an outraged Liberal mob from which he and his colleagues had heard plenty during the day, he rose to betray them and followed the Mother he never had. “Be good my son and do as mummy says!”

    It would be a fair guess from this distance that many of his old school colleagues would recognise the demeanour he portrayed. Petulant, insecure, self effacing and contemptible toward those that had given him so much trust.

    I now know what Kerry Packer must have felt when Malcolm turned against him.

    It is a trait he has shown often over the years. Get very close to someone or something and at the point of the supreme test of loyalty – turn against them.

    The man has no grace and certainly no leadership skills. He should immediately resign from the Liberal Party and join Labour. He is Rudd’s true “inside man” in a manner which Gordon Gretch could never hope to epitomise.

    A moles MOLE.

    I am depressed. Rudd (whom I loathe) now controls the Lib’s as well as Labour and the bastions of democracy have been brought into question given that “OPPOSITION” in this context results in subserviency.

    Last night when Turnbull wickedly mentioned that as a man of his word he had “done a deal with Rudd” and “shaken hands on it” and his honour prevented him from going back, he had forgotten his “oath” with his Liberal constituency – to honour their faith in him as leader of their Party and to take them where THEY WANTED TO GO.

    So much for the mother lode.

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    picarl

    The Member for Goldman Sachs has to go.

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    Louis Hissink

    Jo,

    The News Polls are not helping – most of the mob want the ETS passed. Do they really want this? The Fabians do seem to have run an excellent propaganda campaign on this, but if the polls remain pro ETS, and that seems to be driving the Australian Newspaper commentary this morning (Saturday), then we still have a long way to go.

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    Denny

    And here’s the latest from the U.K..

    Breaking: Pressure Mounts From Inside: Scientist From U. of East Anglia: UN IPCC has Run it’s Course

    http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/e107_plugins/forum/forum_viewtopic.php?1303.last

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    Hi Jo, thank you so much for your efforts and this blog.

    Malcolm Turnbull has to go immediately rather than march lock step with Kevin 747.

    Here is the speech I’d give if I were Liberal leader today.

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    Bruce

    Hi Gibbo,

    Great speech. Perhaps we should email it to all the Australian Federal Senators.

    If you don’t think these emails have an effect see link below:

    http://www.theaustralian.com.au/politics/how-to-test-the-faith-of-the-party-faithful/story-e6frgczf-1225804380924

    Have faith, Louis Hissink at post no 6. Don’t believe those polls.

    I’ve been sending multiple emails to Liberal members of parliament and senators over the past couple of days.

    Does anyone have access to email lists of politicians, in a format such that it can be pasted into an email.

    There is a Liberal National Party Convention in Qld this weekend, so the more the show of public support the better.

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    Matty

    Well I’m upbeat, because I think the Libs just tore themself to bits because they don’t intend to pass anything and that is why Rudd/Combet/Wong and most of the press in Australia have now got a problem.

    Our journo’s who have been subtlely moving this one along are seeing a window close. Post Copenhagen, they will have diminished grounds to exert their pressure without looking a lot more reckless, and if Rudd is serious about a quick election he now has to do it with a negative campaign on ets costs. Costello before he left, claimed that Rudd mainly wanted as many Lib finger prints on his scheme as possible so he could blame the amendments when it went splat, and say they voted for it too. Now he will own the whole thing as attitudes are shifting.

    If there was serious electoral risk for Libs in not passing it now(losing extra seats), would Combet be warning be warning them about it, or daring them not to pass it?

    Rudd is a coward, and he is s!#t scared of Abbott getting up and saying, in an effective way, start putting aside an extra few grand for every Christmas, because that’s what it will cost.

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    Allen Ford

    “The other most widely suggested leader is Joe Hockey”

    Not a wise choice, in my opinion. His wife is head of foreign exchange and global finance at Deutsche Bank, one of the leading financial houses pushing carbon trading. Can Hockey distance himself from the suggestion of undue influence? The same cloud hangs over Turnbull, formerly head of Goldman Sachs in Oz.

    We could be back to square one if Hockey is the new leader.

    [ Oooo. Interesting. Thanks Allen. That is a conflict worth noting. — JN]

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    Allen Ford

    “Does anyone have access to email lists of politicians, in a format such that it can be pasted into an email.”

    How’s this for Lib members & Senators? Let me know if you want the Nats, Independents and Labor.

    Malcolm.Turnbull.MP@aph.gov.au;

    Alex.Somlyay.MP@aph.gov.au; Andrew.Laming.MP@aph.gov.au; Andrew.Robb.MP@aph.gov.au; Andrew.Southcott.MP@aph.gov.au; B.Billson.MP@aph.gov.au; Bob.Baldwin.MP@aph.gov.au; Bronwyn.Bishop.MP@aph.gov.au; C.Pyne.MP@aph.gov.au; Chris.Pearce.MP@aph.gov.au; Danna.Vale.MP@aph.gov.au; Dennis.Jensen.MP@aph.gov.au; Don.Randall.MP@aph.gov.au; Fran.Bailey.MP@aph.gov.au; Ian.Macfarlane.MP@aph.gov.au; J.Moylan.MP@aph.gov.au; Jamie.Briggs.MP@aph.gov.au; Jason.Wood.MP@aph.gov.au; Joanna.Gash.MP@aph.gov.au; Julie.Bishop.MP@aph.gov.au; Kevin.Andrews.MP@aph.gov.au; Louise.Markus.MP@aph.gov.au; Luke.Simpkins.MP@aph.gov.au; Mal.Washer.MP@aph.gov.au; Margaret.May.MP@aph.gov.au; Michael.Johnson.MP@aph.gov.au; Michael.Keenan.MP@aph.gov.au; Nola.Marino.MP@aph.gov.au; P.Georgiou.MP@aph.gov.au; P.Secker@aph.gov.au; Pat.Farmer.MP@aph.gov.au; Peter.Dutton.MP@aph.gov.au; Peter.Lindsay.MP@aph.gov.au; Peter.Slipper.MP@aph.gov.au; philip.ruddock.MP@aph.gov.au; Rowan.Ramsey.MP@aph.gov.au; Russell.Broadbent.MP@aph.gov.au; S.Stone.MP@aph.gov.au; Scott.Morrison.MP@aph.gov.au; Sophie.Mirabella.MP@aph.gov.au; Steven.Ciobo.MP@aph.gov.au; Stuart.Robert.MP@aph.gov.au; Sussan.Ley.MP@aph.gov.au; Tony.Abbott.MP@aph.gov.au; Tony.Smith.MP@aph.gov.au; W.Tuckey.MP@aph.gov.au; senator.abetz@aph.gov.au; Alex.Hawke.MP@aph.gov.au; Barry.Haase.MP@aph.gov.au; David.Hawker.MP@aph.gov.au; Greg.Hunt.MP@aph.gov.au; J.Hockey.MP@aph.gov.au; Steve.Irons.MP@aph.gov.au

    senator.adams@aph.gov.au; senator.back@aph.gov.au; senator.barnett@aph.gov.au; senator.bernardi@aph.gov.au; senator.birmingham@aph.gov.au; senator.brandis@aph.gov.au; senator.bushby@aph.gov.au; senator.cash@aph.gov.au; senator.colbeck@aph.gov.au; senator.coonan@aph.gov.au; senator.cormann@aph.gov.au; senator.eggleston@aph.gov.au; senator.ferguson@aph.gov.au; senator.fierravanti-wells@aph.gov.au; senator.fifield@aph.gov.au; senator.fisher@aph.gov.au; senator.heffernan@aph.gov.au; senator.humphries@aph.gov.au; senator.ian.macdonald@aph.gov.au; senator.johnston@aph.gov.au; senator.kroger@aph.gov.au; senator.mason@aph.gov.au; senator.mcgauran@aph.gov.au; senator.minchin@aph.gov.au; senator.parry@aph.gov.au; senator.payne@aph.gov.au; senator.ronaldson@aph.gov.au; senator.ryan@aph.gov.au; senator.sue.boyce@aph.gov.au; senator.troeth@aph.gov.au; senator.trood@aph.gov.au;

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    Matty

    70% of respondents at Yahoo7 don’t support amended ets – for various reasons I guess. Kevin will gulp.

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    How can current polls be realistic? Our major newspapers are not going after the fraud as they would if it were a politican who was caught, or a… skeptic?

    If you polled Australians and said “Would you vote for a party that passed legislation based on fraud” would the number be statistically different from zero?

    As the story of fraud spreads the polls will crash. Liberals need to have the faith that the public will hear about the fraud. So send emails, twitter, sms, phone the offices and leave messages. The message will get through. The good members of the Liberals are working hard for us, they need all the support they can get.

    Thanks for your help. Email your Australian friends. They could save $1100 in 2011 and more in the years to follow, if they just email this weekend!

    Jo

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    Gibbo – Good speech. The finish is excellent.

    …the tide is turning against the “scientific consensus” that never was and that people are waking op to the fact they have been deceived for political and personal gain. Should an ETS be introduced in Australia it will have a devastating effect on our economy, industry and our people. When it hits the fan, and it will, I do not want to be held accountable for marching lock step with the labor party into Australia’s ruin. I cannot standby and watch our people devastated to suit Kevin Rudds global ambitions.

    I want this time to mark the point where we decided it was better to die on our feet than to live on our knees.

    http://gibbosplace.blogspot.com/2009/11/speech-id-make-if-i-were-liberal-leader.html

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    Mattb

    Jo: “If you polled Australians and said “Would you vote for a party that knocked back legislation based on quackery” would the number be statistically different from zero? It is all in the wording of the question I guess.

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    Mattb

    Oh oh – this has to hurt Aussie Liberal sceptics… even the Queen has abandoned them! Could at least bring on a republic at least.
    “Queen Elizabeth II has urged Australia and other Commonwealth nations to lead the world in responding to climate change”

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    Grant

    What is “responding to climate change”? I’d say putting up an umbrella when it starts raining or putting on a hat when it is sunny.

    Passing an ETS is not a response to climate change. Its the enactment of a new form of currency and/or tradable commodity and it condemns many people to poverty.

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    J.Hansford

    It is absolutely essential that the Liberal coalition oppose Rudd’s ETS/CPRS…. Two main reasons come to my mind.

    1; Ideologically. The conservatives should be against any big taxing government initiatives, and considering that Rudd’s CPRS is completely anti productivity, bordering on Anti Australian, it and Rudd, needs to be completely rejected. No deals.

    2; The Coalition must be a rallying point politically for the sceptical viewpoint, especially now that Labor is a tyranny of Rudd’s ambition, rather than a party of individual politicians who stand by their basic values. These CRU Emails prove that there are real problems with the science and the politics behind the hypothesis of AGW. The Sceptical scientists and Australians need that political representation, now that “climate science” has been shown to be hijacked by interest groups.

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    J.Hansford

    I meant to commend Senator Fierravanti-Wells for her change of heart also….

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    Jo: “If you polled Australians and said “Would you vote for a party that knocked back legislation based on quackery” would the number be statistically different from zero? It is all in the wording of the question I guess.

    Mattb: The difference is, word “fraud” fits.

    1. Climate science assertions of catastrophe are based on fraud.
    2. The ETS is based on climate “science”.
    3. Some politicians are pushing the ETS as hard as they can.

    Fill in the gaps ……. supports fraud.

    In time, Australians will cane any politician who supported the ETS.

    Some in the ALP are quietly hoping the liberals will save them from this train wreck by delaying or axing the legislation. I would like the ALP to rise above it themselves. It would be the honest thing to do. And if they did, it would leave the others for dead. The hacked CRU emails have given people an opportunity to get out of this without shame. But “it’s only available this week”…

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    Matty

    Go Jo #21

    A bit of people power right now would be glorious. Says a bit about the ALP doesn’t it. To vote with the conscience at this juncture would be brave but maybe it would be a useful tactic for Abbott etc to keep reminding the media that scepticism is pretty well represented on the other side too? Only difference is freedom of expression.

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    allen mcmahon

    Oh oh – this has to hurt Aussie Liberal sceptics… even the Queen has abandoned them! Could at least bring on a republic at least.
    “Queen Elizabeth II has urged Australia and other Commonwealth nations to lead the world in responding to climate change”

    Matt quoting soundbites, naughty, naughty
    Perhaps the Queen feels that opposing ETS schemes, holding the ‘team’ accountable for their actions, openness and transparency in climate science , increasing funding for skeptical scientists is an appropriate response. It’s possible you know as she is often at odds with Charles The Tree Hugger.

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    Can someone ask the Queen to name one scientific paper…

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    Matty

    How about: Effect of global warming on leg humping behaviour in adolescent corgi’s (2009)

    We are not amused.

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    Anne-Kit Littler

    I haven’t heard/seen any sceptical comments on …

    The Copenhagen Diagnosis

    Surely, we can’t let this uber-alarmist nonsense go by unchallenged! 6 meters sea level rise by 2100 etc etc.

    Matthew England is implicated, as well as Mann … it was embargoed till 24th November – why? … I smell something fishy …

    Anyone want to comment?

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    Matty

    RE #26

    I guess they were always going to ramp it up around now, but India and China standing by with buckets of cold water.

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    P Gosselin

    New to this site. I like it.
    I trust you lads down under will get it right on Monday.

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    Plasmablast

    “I work for a Government I despise for ends I think criminal”

    I sent this to all members of Parliament who supposedly are meant to be on my side. – Those who read it will determine if it applies to them.

    Dear Sir/Madam,
    RE: – AWG and empowerment – 29th November 2009
    “I work for a Government I despise for ends I think criminal”
    – Letter to Duncan Grant (15 December 1917 – John Maynard Keynes)”
    Those of you who are a bit slow on the uptake.
    Please stop insulting me and family by suggesting that only you are concerned about the future of my children. I will look after them thank you.
    Your support of Labour to impose an egregious tax on my family’s future is fraudulent against me and the people of Australia for the following reasons.
    1. You do not have the moral support of the people you represent to introduce this tax as indicated by the thousands of emails you have received. Some of you (Member for Kooyong and others) do not even have web sites that work properly and so have remained blissfully ignorant of the storm of protest.
    2. You have failed to acknowledge or give any consideration to the fact that your global warming faith has been shaken across the world by breaking news this week of “manipulated data” used to support your faith. This is the second time the data on which you choose to rely has been discredited. The first being the “hockey stick lie”. “When the facts change, I change my mind, what do you do Sir?” – John Maynard Keynes
    3. If you are so concerned about the future of our children, consider this. I get the underlying impression from you that your global warming exponents are beyond reproach and beyond questioning because of their white coats and their title “scientists”. What? Like scientist Sir Alexander Fleming in 1928 discovering that penicillin killed bacteria? If the GW answer lay in every child in the world taking a pill from these fraudsters, would you demand that each and every child in Australia take the pill instead of paying tax? Fleming of course had to prove his discovery, make sure it was safe to use and with the help of Australian Howard Walter Florey, commenced using it on humans twelve years later in the Second World War. This was real science, from the old school, we could trust them, rely on them to act honestly, and give them our children to cure. Do you really consider the current batch of global warming alarmists to be in this class? Have this level on integrity? Deserving of our respect? If you do then, “Step Back and Think” (a saying that come from our treasured youth of today).
    4. The truth hurts so I suggest you sit down for this. You are selfish and conceited. You are concerned with your upcoming electoral position (next week, next year, next two years – who cares). You are not concerned with the next one hundred years as you so blithely put forward for if you were, you would call for a full independent enquiry on AGW and spare no expense at getting to the truth. You have not done so and shame on you. You are lazy and have relied on others research to build up your “opinions” rather than do the hard yards and research it fully for your constituency as they deserve to expect from you.
    5. Had you done your research you would have discovered the following:
    a. The tax you wish to impose on Australians will have no measurable effect on CO2 levels in the atmosphere – ever. Your fraud is to support a tax which is meaningless in terms of reducing the Gas that you are so afraid of. A dishonest ponzi tax scheme!
    b. If you are truly a believer in AGW then you should have put forward a tax bill that would have addressed the issue of significantly reducing CO2 emissions by Australia. I know you have looked at this but you have fraudulently kept it in the back ground and hidden it from your peoples. NOT because it was going to accomplish your declared objective of reducing AGW – but because it would bankrupt the country and you would be voted out of office!
    c. The “new idea” magazine style science upon which you rely is now so clearly under question, your “group think” mentality brings your own mentality and objective reason into question.
    6. The halls of academia have also taken a brutal hiding. In the good old days, Professors used to have something called “tenure” – a job for life. Tenure was important so that any Professor could speak out without fear or favour. A fundamental tenant to maintain the integrity of our scholars. In addition, in times gone past, no one is business was allowed to give Universities “tagged” donations. (for exclusive data access or ownership or for having any influence on research paper outcomes). I completed my MBA at the Melbourne Business School. Each “Chair” at the school was set up (at that time) by a donation of $5 or $6 million dollars. This cash was then put into investments to provide the “Chair income” sufficient to pay the Professor and his or her staff. This provided eternal financial independence to the school, no matter what its research or findings, no matter who was in Government, no matter what the world opinion was. – Without fear or favour.
    7. The bastion of academic independence is now smashed. Not by Private Enterprise (the original mea culpa for which tenure protection was designed) but by Government and the billions of funding it provides to Universities for its own “preferred” projects. As you know, we have recently lost the integrity of the CSIRO over this, (employee’s AWG Research Paper dished because it was not helpful to the Government cause) previously the most trusted scientific institution in the Country. Money corrupts.
    8. Finally, let me tell you something further that you clearly don’t know. Australians are a proud and independent people both in thought and deed. We don’t need you to tell us how to look after our children and indeed we resent your contempt that you assume you have our authority to do so. It is fatuous of you to argue you are leading the people on this. We the people lead and tell you what we want done. Not the other way round!
    9. Climate sceptics’ are thinking Australians and our country is united. Your attempts’ to divide the peoples of our Nation between “the global warming faithful” and the “skeptics” shows you to be cowardly. If you are honest and straightforward in the truest of Australian tradition then get on with business of explaining yourself, your points of reference, your research, and your conclusions.
    10. Trust me. If you are right, Australians will see it. If you are wrong, have the good grace to withdraw and leave us alone to protect our own children.
    Yours sincerely,
    David Armstrong
    Kew Victoria.

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    Tony

    It’s pretty simple really. The same thing happens here in the UK. If you want to get a piece of legislation through – don’t explain(to the public) 70% of the UK don’t want to be in the EU. So the governement doesn’t explain nor do the Tories. It’s the same with Global warming. Don’t explain just do it. It’s called lack of moral fibre. Your Kevin Rudd and Malcolm Turnbull have it in loads

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    kuhnkat

    Here is another gem from the CRU Files. Thank Steve Milloy over at Junkscience for it:

    On Oct 14, 2009, at 10:17 AM, Kevin Trenberth wrote:

    Hi Tom
    How come you do not agree with a statement that says we are no where close to knowing where energy is going or whether clouds are changing to make the planet brighter. We are not close to balancing the energy budget. The fact that we can not account for what is happening in the climate system makes any consideration of geoengineering quite hopeless as we will never be able to tell if it is successful or not! It is a travesty!
    Kevin [My emphasis]

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    Steve

    Haha Tony,

    Your post about joining the EU made me laugh. I work next to a POM and he’s says exactly the same thing. They’ll never ask the public because they know what the public will say.

    They’ll just go ahead and do it “for the good of the country” :) .

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    Plasmablast

    Well done Gibbo,
    Great speach!

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    Plasmablast

    speech!

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    Mark

    If the parliamentary Libs think Hockey will assuage their base they are in for a shock. Hockey is also Rudd-lite. Whatever I think about him, Abbott showed guts in his actions, Hockey did not – even with the gut that he has! He’s now riding Abbott’s coat-tail and did not resign his Shadow Treasurer position in protest. Even now, he’s saying he won’t actually challenge Turnbull.

    There’s not the slightest doubt in my mind that he would betray the grass-root Libs at the earliest possible moment. We would be left gagging with him then spouting mealy-mouthed weasel words about “healing the party” and “moving on”

    Like many others I emailed AND faxed all Coalition Senators.
    All Nationals offices responded. The tone of these were much more personal than those of the ONE Lib who did respond (Heffernan) whose office stated that it would be passed on.

    NEITHER HELEN COONAN NOR MARISE PAYNE EVEN BOTHERED WITH AN AUTOMATED RESPONSE!!!

    That lack of basic courtesy won’t be forgotten by anyone in my family. Never liked either of them anyway. Coonan strikes me as an ignoramus and Payne as a Labor person who thinks she’s too good to be a Labor member.

    Keep up the pressure folks and also remember to thank any Senators who respond appropriately.
    Just heard the news on radio. Turnbull is now directing his vitriol to any Lib member who differs from him. What a bully, what hubris! How could any Lib support such behaviour? To boot, his political judgement is abysmal. Hasn’t landed a single blow on Rudd’s glass jaw.

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    Matty

    As the weekend unfolds Turnbull looks more and more lke a Labor politician. Gillard on insiders described him as in “lockstep”. We will never again see a government and an opposition leader gang up on the opposition. AT least it seals his fate a little further. After this weekend even his supporters would know it’s not salvagable.

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    Allen Ford

    “Oh oh – this has to hurt Aussie Liberal sceptics… even the Queen has abandoned them! Could at least bring on a republic at least.
    ‘Queen Elizabeth II has urged Australia and other Commonwealth nations to lead the world in responding to climate change’”

    My bet is that Her Maj’s speech was written by Gordo, so no surprises there.

    Perhaps, if it really is her opinion, it might change somewhat when the miscreants are hauled into court to answer criminal charges. The wheels have already been set in motion by Lord Christopher Monckton.

    Ponder the train wreck!

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