JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Monday Open Thread

9.1 out of 10 based on 15 ratings

291 comments to Monday Open Thread

  • #

    Much fun here:
    https://www.cfact.org/2021/10/22/laughing-at-climate-hysteria/

    340 comments so far and counting! Touched a nerve.

    I spend most of my time debating the intricate specifics of science, technology and policy. But some cases are so extreme that debate is impossible. This is when pure ridicule is called for.

    A recent example (from Morano’s great Climate Depot):

    JEFF GOODELL of Rolling Stone: “West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchinjust cooked the planet. I don’t mean that in a metaphorical sense. I mean that literally. Unless Manchin changes his negotiating position dramatically in the near future, he will be remembered as the man who, when the moment of decision came, chose to condemn virtually every living creature on Earth to a hellish future of suffering, hardship, and death.”

    The last 18 words are irrational beyond debate. One can only laugh in their face.

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    • #
      Klem

      It may seem irrational to you but there are plenty of good people out there to whom it makes complete sense. I recently met one, I’ve been working with her for the past three years and had no idea she was an irrational climate loon. She is a kind and gentle soul who would believe every one on those last 18 words.

      …They walk among us…

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      • #
        Ross

        There’s a person I have been working off and on for about 35 years in a highly technical scientific based industry. He named his dog Greta because he believes she is a hero.

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        • #

          Greta is indeed a spiritual leader of the movement. Her demands are impossible which actually helps us.
          See my https://www.cfact.org/2019/09/28/is-climate-alarmism-tearing-itself-apart/

          Her followers may well wreck COP 26 as they did COP 25. Fine by me.

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        • #
          OriginalSteve

          The only time I have had a near punch-up in an office, was with a climate warming loon who was just totally un-open to any form of civilized debate.

          I can hold my own ( thankfully I havent had to for a long time ), and its unusual for the adrenelin to start flowing, but when you start start getting the adrenalin “shakes” in a reaction to an aggressive affront, you have to think pretty quickly.

          I managed to diffuse the situation, but it reminded me of how those who scream at the sky at a Trump win are also a lot unhinged….

          Its a form of stupidity and nhilism and ignorance, that you have to see to believe.

          I have actually chastized a fellow engineer once for lacking logic and believing in CAGW. Not preferred, but engineering is based on logic and whats provable. I think I’m off his xmas card list….

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          • #
            Deano

            I know the sort of person you’re describing. They usually justify their aggression and threats with “Look, I’m all in favour of open debate, but you’re endangering the lives of MY CHILDREN with your climate change denial!” And they’re always hypocrites too – as they usually produce more CO2 than the people they lecture.

            20

      • #

        Indeed Klem, not only do they walk among us, they are a powerful political force. Rolling Stone would not be saying it if their followers did not believe it. Ours it a titanic struggle but all things considered we are doing pretty well and the irrationality of many of our opponents is an advantage to us. In fact I feel like Robert E. lee at the battle of Fredicksburg when the Union forces attacked his impenetrable position.
        https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Fredericksburg

        Demanding the impossible is a losing position. So I laugh at them.

        72

      • #
        Mark Allinson

        Talking with an elderly chap – well, a bit more elderly than myself – and he is 100% convinced that we are destroying the planet.

        He has, he told me, made many temperature readings of the sea where he lives and they confirm that ocean temps are rising rapidly.

        40

        • #

          Maybe they are where he lives, since they vary constantly. Some people argue that rising ocean temps are causing the CO2 increase. We are, after all, emerging from the little ice age.

          But the ocean stats just give ocean warming of a few hundredths of a degree, if he is getting a lot more he is a local outlier, far out in fact. Clean heat capacity is enormous compared to air.

          00

    • #
      Mark Kaiser

      “JEFF GOODELL of Rolling Stone: “West Virginia Sen. Joe Manchin just cooked the planet.”

      I brought the marshmallows. Who has the wieners?

      I know what you’re saying David. I’ve decided that these guys aren’t the true threat. It’s the people that blindly believe (AKA the mob).

      In fact, if more Democrats acted like Manchin, I’d even consider voting for one.

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      • #
        OrignalSteve

        Pass the logic, along with a couple of full clips…..

        Once the mob is off the leash, it will get ugly fast.

        30

        • #
          Bruce

          Their sanctimony knows no limits and justifies anything.

          I’m reminded of the words of Sir Arnaud Amalric, “holy man”:

          “Caedite eos. Novit enim Dominus qui sunt eius”

          “Kill everyone; God shall know his own”.

          More recently seen on T-shirts as:

          “Kill them all. Let God sort them out”.

          The eco-loons are running an Apocalypso-style eschatology.

          They may eventually find that they should NOT have poked the bear that is “The Man (and woman) who just wants to be left alone”.

          As an old acquaintance once describe his general life philosophy:

          “Threaten or harm me and I might get annoyed.

          Threaten or harm my wife and I will kill you.

          Threaten or harm my children and I will kill you slowly and horribly; then start on your family.”

          Leave me alone and we’ll get on fine”.

          We appear to be getting dangerously close to that stage. The relentless provocations are specifically designed to draw out the more hot-headed, so they can be dealt with tn the time-honoured way, plus full media coverage.

          Thus, the rest are expected to “acquiesce” or simply cower in fear. Modern Democracy in action.

          However…..

          20

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Cool.

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    • #
      MichaelinBrisbane

      David,
      Perhaps you can help me as you “debate the intricacies of science”.
      People, like me, who are sceptical of the “consensus” that anthropogenic carbon dioxide is causing global warming and climate change look at the trivial amounts of CO2 involved. With rising levels over the past century we have only just cracked .04% of the atmosphere. And when you search for an answer to the question “How much are humans contributing to the natural CO2 cycle” one gets the answer “5%” (though I thought I’ve heard this should just be 3%).
      However, the argument from the “consensus” seems to be that every bit of anthropogenic CO2 is cumulative so we are to be blamed for every bit of the recent increase from .025% as if we have thrown a heavy blanket over the world. There seems to be no recognition that the yearly anthropogenic contribution just simply adds to the natural CO2 cycle and produces the astounding benefits we are seeing today with, for instance, increased crop yield and general greening of the planet.
      What is the answer we can give to this argument?
      Regards, Michael

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      • #
        Kalm Keith

        Good question.

        Human origin CO2 is not cumulative but it does take a while to be recycled.

        The worming worriers claimed that it just built up, and this is a totally science free opinion.

        Recent studies have shown that the half life of human origin CO2 is seven years and another says that it is all reabsorbed in four years.

        CO2 in the atmosphere is a valuable resource and every living thing from microbes, plants and moving animals “process” it in some way and wants to contribute.

        The oceans need our CO2; where would fish and shellfish be without that bone building gas.

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        • #
          MichaelinBrisbane

          Thank you, Keith — Quite a good answer! I’ll add that to my arsenal of responses.

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          • #
            Vlad the Impaler

            Greetings, M.I.B.:

            And, no, it does not mean “Men in Black”, but Michael:

            Here’s one I’ve tried, and even if it doesn’t work outright, it does throw a monkey wrench … … … er, sorry, spanner, into the works.

            Once we’re on the topic, I’ll ask a true believer if they know Einstein’s famous quote, regarding his newly published Theories on Relativity. He is reputed to have stated, “No amount of experimentation can prove me right. A single experiment can prove me wrong.”

            I have yet to have anyone dispute that.

            Once we reach a point of agreement that a single experiment or instance can and should cast doubt upon an idea, we establish (if the person does not already know) the approximate concentration of carbon dioxide in the present Earth atmosphere. We usually settle on the range of 400 – 450 ppm, the value being on an upward trend, we’re allowing for future changes. I’m usually the one supplying the figure, but again, we reach an agreement.

            In the following, “Me” is me, and “OP” is the ‘other person’:

            Me: So we have established that the Earth is warming under a concentration of 400 to 450 ppm, and the concentration is increasing.

            OP: Correct. More carbon [dioxide] causes more warming. [paraphrasing the ‘usual’ statement/belief of the OP’s I’ve talked to]

            Me: We’ll assume that to be a true statement. Given that it is true, what would the average Earth temperature be like if the concentration was, say, for example, maybe ten times what it is today, viz. around 4,400 ppm, or perhaps more?

            OP: Well, at the very least, a whole lot warmer, but very likely hellishly so. Maybe not as hot as Venus, but hot enough to have exterminated most of the life on the planet.

            Me: Well, interesting. Have you ever heard of the Hirnantian?

            OP: No, what it is?

            Me: The Hirnantian is the terminal Stage of the Ordovician Period. (pause)

            When the Earth was in a major ice age. (pause)

            The ice age ended in the early Rhuddenian Stage, in the basal Llandovery Epoch of the Silurian Period. (pause)

            When the concentration of carbon dixoide dropped to 3,000 ppm.

            At this point, I’ve had a few just walk away, unable to contain the cognitive dissonance. Some make a recovery, and usually try this tack:

            OP: Well, you can’t compare that long ago to today. Things were different, back then.

            Me: What was different? Was carbon dioxide not a ‘greenhouse gas’ 445 million years ago?

            (sidebar: I might press at this point, at the risk of making the OP really angry, asking something along the lines of ‘so only human-caused carbon dioxide is a ‘greenhouse gas’, and “natural” carbon dioxide is not a ‘greenhouse gas’?)

            If the OP recovers enough, I’ve had a few who have tried this tack:

            OP: No, it’s just that there’s other things affecting climate.

            Hope you caught that; drive it home:

            Me: Precisely. That’s what us ‘non-believers’ have been saying. Carbon dioxide, what ever it does or might do, there’s hundreds, or even thousands of other climate factors that have far greater influence on climate than some trace gas. Carbon dioxide is nothing more than a ‘bit player’ in global climate, and it might not even be that.

            Usually things will come to an end there, but if they do not, I continue along the lines of not just one of Einstein’s instances, but multiple, including the Cryogenian, the evidence from EPICA/Vostok, and the post-WW II period from about 1950 to 1977, when carbon dioxide was increasing, but the scientific community was warning of a “new” ice age beginning, due to consistent temperature decreases.

            And, full disclosure, it is a fact that I am mixing geochronologic terminology (Period, Epoch, Age) with chronostratigraphic terminology (System, Series, Stage); through bitter experience, I’ve found that as soon as the words “age” and “ice” get mixed into a sentence, in the mind of the OP, it becomes ‘ice age’, as in Pleistocene Epoch, and trying to correct the error is well nigh impossible.

            I apologize for the overly-long post; what is here is likely to go into Moderation (no problem there), but I’m always ready to assist anyone in gaining another arrow for their quiver.

            My Regards, and my best, to you and yours,

            Vlad

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          • #
            Vlad the Impaler

            Mods:

            Upon re-reading, I see my post responding to Michael in Brisbane is not on the topic of his post; it should be removed. (1.4.1.1.1)

            My bad — — too much skimming.

            V. t. I.

            11

        • #

          Keith is correct. However our annual emissions are now something like double the annual increase in the atmospheric concentration so there is a prima facile case that we are causing that increase, which AGW simply accepts. The reality is much more complex, as usual. My view is we have no idea what is causing the increase.

          Moreover the increase seems to be causing no warming, gutting AGW. But that is another story.

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        • #
          Chris

          It has been shown that 80% of the CO2 from the Australian bushfires have been taken up by phytoplankton in the Pacific Ocean and the Southern Ocean. Phytoplankton is at the very bottom of the food chain, it is the keystone species for all food chains that feed the ocean fauna and also it releases O2 back into the atmosphere.

          CO2 is so essential that volcanos pump mega tons ( tonnes) out annually. As we only monitor five volcanos ( because they are easy to access) we really have no idea how much is released under the oceans or by other terrestrial volcanic activity.

          We live on a self sustaining and self correcting planet .

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          • #
            Ian

            “CO2 is so essential that volcanos pump mega tons ( tonnes) out annually. ”

            I don’t think volcanoes are sentient entities that “pump out” CO2 because it is so essential. They “pump out” CO2 as a result of magma rising to the surface. Magma is rock that is formed when the Earth’s mantle melts due to differences in temperature, pressure, and structural formations in the mantle and crust. These are not processes designed to enable volcanoes to “pump out essential” CO2

            37

            • #
              Chris

              Well that was a little pedantic ; don’t you think Ian? I was speaking metaphorically.

              As someone who gets up each day and is amazed how the physics, chemistry and biology all fit together. I believe it’s all been intelligently designed.
              Not everyone’s cup of tea of course , but it beats believing in billions of mathematical improbabilities.

              40

        • #
          TedM

          “The oceans need our CO2; where would fish and shellfish be without that bone building gas.” Excellent reply Keith, but may I emphasise particularly the exoskeleton.

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          • #
            Kalm Keith

            Thanks.
            We need to highlight the fact that crabs and lobsters need our CO2 for their armour.
            As Chris says above, it starts with the phytoplankton, and for me it ends with the lobsters.

            60

        • #
          dadgervais

          Actually, since the accumulation in the atmosphere is one half our yearly increase, this is evidence that the half life of human source CO2 (indistinguishable from “natural” source CO2) is just six (6) months. This assumes other sources do not change much year to year, and sinks take up what ever is delivered to them by the atmosphere, which acts as a random distribution channel.

          20

          • #
            Kalm Keith

            Hi dad, there are two main factors in the “complete atmospheric CO2 turnover in four years”;

            The first is the living churn created by all forms of surface life which take in “sequestered” CO2 as our food.
            We eat this in many forms; meat, fruit, vegetables etc after those life forms have absorbed it.

            The second is the massive “push – pull” of CO2 partial pressure of CO2 in the oceans. When oceanic CO2 varies slightly we feel it in the atmosphere. Ocean CO2 is 98% of available CO2 and must dominate that in the atmosphere.

            50

            • #
              Kalm Keith

              Forgot to mention that after we have eaten the food containing the sequestered CO2 we then recycle that CO2 back to the atmosphere.

              We breathe in 400 ppm and exhale 40,000 ppm of CO2 for use by our next year’s food.

              The 100:1 ratio between intake and output means that we have little to worry about from increasing atmospheric CO2 levels.

              The most dangerous gas for humans is paradoxically Oxygen.

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              • #
                MP

                And the waste from one is called the “breath of life” to another.

                30

              • #
                Ian

                “The most dangerous gas for humans is paradoxically Oxygen.”

                Then why was it not used instead of Chlorine in WW1? The answer is, of course, that oxygen is not dangerous until its concentration reaches about 75% whereas Chlorine gas is lethal at concentrations as low as 0.04%.

                You may not know that drinking too much water can be lethal but it happens only rarely as does death from too much oxygen

                20

              • #
                another ian

                Ian

                “You may not know that drinking too much water can be lethal but it happens only rarely as does death from too much oxygen”

                Or too much ivermectin

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              • #
                robert rosicka

                Ian death from too much oxygen is a little more common than you realise , look up CO2 retainer.

                00

      • #
        clarence.t

        “They” say that the Earth is warming…

        This means that the natural Earth would be emitting more CO2 from the oceans and the land.

        If they then turn around and say that humans are responsible for 100% of the rise in atmospheric CO2…

        … it means they are saying the Earth has not warmed. QED.

        As for the “blanket analogy… when the Earth’s surface gets warmed by the Sun, convection acts to cool the surface.

        No “blanket” acts like that. The whole “blanket” meme is totally anti-science.

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        • #

          One of the questions in the Quiz that I was doing yesterday was “Is the Earth moving away from the Sun or moving closer?”. The answer was, “The Earth is gradually moving away from the Sun”. Now, that should help with “Climate Change”……..Whoops. another Ice Age coming I guess……………Better keep burning that Coal and Oil…………

          30

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Michael;
        the annual rise in the atmosphere only accounts for about 50% of human emissions; the rest must be absorbed naturally.
        With an 80-100 year ‘lifetime in the atmosphere’ as postulated by climate “science” that must mean The Grinch is stealing a lot of carbon dioxide every year or that the climate “scientists” have no idea what they are talking about. Your choice.

        The question is that if this absorption into the carbon cycle is happening (as shown by the reduction in the increase) why wasn’t it happening before the industrial Revolution. If it was, then the level of CO2 in the ice cores should show a steep decline over the last 10,000 years before we started burning coal etc. It doesn’t. So “It doesn’t matter how beautiful your theory is, it doesn’t matter how smart you are. If it doesn’t agree with experiment, it’s wrong.”

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        • #

          As KK points out, our CO2 molecules stay in the air for just a few years because about 25% of all the CO2 molecules are replaced every year in the natural flux. This stuff about half being absorbed is part of the deliberate misdescription of the system. They are hiding the huge annual natural carbon flux in order to make the CO2 increase look like accumulating pollution.

          See my https://www.cfact.org/2021/08/21/the-ipccs-deliberate-co2-deception/.

          Whether our emissions are causing some or all of the increase is an open question, but in no case do our emissions compose the increase. Our emissions do not stay in the air long enough to do that.

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          • #
            MichaelinBrisbane

            David,
            I’ve now read your cfact article and saved it for future reference as excellent fodder for my cannon when I get into battle with woke followers of the “consensus”.
            Thank you very much, and thank you all — Kalm Keith, Vlad, Ian, Ted M, Dad Gervais, Graeme #3, Rick — for all your contributions today. They are very convincing that CO2 is not a climate changing problem, but rather a very essential compound for the biosphere which can use as much as is available and does a lot better with all the more it can get. No need to sequester CO2 in abandoned salt mines or old wells, Nature will lap it up quickly enough and turn it into cellulose or coral reef.

            30

          • #
            Richard+C+(NZ)

            David >”Whether our emissions are causing some or all of the increase is an open question”

            Given the GFC and recent global C-19 lockdowns (vehicles off the road, airlines parked up) had no effect on the increase, I’m going with none – not some or all.

            Or at most negligible.

            30

            • #
              Richard+C+(NZ)

              >”…recent global C-19 lockdowns (vehicles off the road, airlines parked up) had no effect on the increase”

              ‘U.N. Says Global Coronavirus Lockdowns Had No ‘Discernible Impact’ on Emissions’

              The U.N.’s World Meteorological Organization (WMO) said Monday atmospheric greenhouse gases reached a “new record” in 2020 despite markedly decreased human activity due to the coronavirus pandemic.

              In its report, timed for publication just prior to the COP26 U.N. Climate Change Conference, the WMO said that concentration of carbon dioxide (CO2) in the atmosphere “reached 413.2 parts per million in 2020 and is 149% of the pre-industrial level.”

              “As long as emissions continue, global temperature will continue to rise,” the WMO warned.

              https://www.breitbart.com/politics/2021/10/25/u-n-says-global-coronavirus-lockdowns-had-no-discernible-impact-on-emissions/

              # # #

              Or, as is obviously evident, human emissions have no discernable effect on atmospheric CO2 either.

              00

          • #
            clarence.t

            Sea critters..

            They absorb a lot of CO2 to make their shells and skeletons (in fish) etc, plus all the plankton they eat.

            When they die, they sink to the depths, taking all that CO2 with them.

            Oceans are 70% of the world’s surface, that’s an awful lot of CO2 to lose every year.

            Thank goodness the likes of China and India are replacing some of it. !

            10

            • #
              Graeme No.3

              clarence.t

              There are also corals which sequester large amounts of CO2. One example is the Great Barrier Reef off Queensland. It has only formed after the end of the last ice age (about 21,000 y.a.) and later than that, as the melting ice caused the sea level to rise around 110-120 metres. The small coral animals couldn’t have started building the GBR until the sea level started rising. (In fact there are old reefs further offshore in deeper water (now) which would have been in shallow water then).

              20

      • #
        RickWill

        There are some fundamentals about Erath’s energy balance that few people understand or even appreciate.

        December 2019 was no different to any other December in recent history. That month, the ice free oceans absorbed 43.9E21J. Of that, 25.7E21 joules was released over land as the evaporated water condensed. That resulted in 10.7E12 tonne of water being dumped on land; equivalent to 63mm deep over the entire land surface including sea ice. Most dumped in the Amazon forest, northern Australia, PNG, Malaysia, Indonesia and the Congo. Some locations get more than 200mm in the month and very little due to land evaporation.

        Humans produce 580E18 joules of energy for all their needs each year. That seemingly massive figure corresponds to just 18 hours, less than a day, of the work done by the sun evaporating and transporting water from oceans to land in December 2019.

        The total volume of the atmospheric water was cycled more than once in December just in dumping water over land. The amount of water actually cycled through the atmosphere in that month is more than order of magnitude higher than what ended up on land.

        Now tell me that there is a “greenhouse effect” and I will confidently inform you it is a fairy tale.

        In fact in January, when the oceans are taking in the most heat of any month, the ocean surface is at its coolest.

        Oceans are slowly warming because the water cycle is slowing down due to the sunlight over oceans being in decline since 1585. When evaporation is lower, the rate of cool deep water being drawn to the surface slows down so average temperature increases. The observed river run-off is in slow decline, completely at odds with every climate model.

        To think that oceans can be heated from the surface to 2000m depth within a century is absurd.

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        • #
          Richard+C+(NZ)

          Rick >”…completely at odds with every climate model”

          With UN COP hysteria upon us, again, worth keeping this inconvenience (for them) in mind:

          New confirmation that climate models overstate atmospheric warming
          Two new peer-reviewed papers from independent teams confirm that climate models overstate atmospheric warming and the problem has gotten worse over time, not better. The papers are Mitchell et al. (2020) “The vertical profile of recent tropical temperature trends: Persistent model biases in the context of internal variability” Environmental Research Letters, and McKitrick and Christy (2020) “Pervasive warming bias in CMIP6 tropospheric layers” Earth and Space Science. John and I didn’t know about the Mitchell team’s work until after their paper came out, and they likewise didn’t know about ours.
          https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/climate-ecology/new-confirmation-that-climate-models-overstate-atmospheric-warming/

          The vertical profile of recent tropical temperature trends: Persistent model biases in the context of internal variability
          Dann M Mitchell1, Y T Eunice Lo1, William J M Seviour1,2, Leopold Haimberger3 and Lorenzo M Polvani4
          Published 13 October 2020
          https://iopscience.iop.org/article/10.1088/1748-9326/ab9af7

          Pervasive Warming Bias in CMIP6 Tropospheric Layers
          R. McKitrick,J. Christy,
          First published: 15 July 2020
          https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2020EA001281

          IPCC AR6: Tropical Troposphere warm bias, unspun edition
          22 Sep 2021 | Science Notes
          In honour of our video on Big Trouble in the Tropical Troposphere, which is closing in on 30,000 views in its first month online, we turn to the AR6 discussion of the discrepancy between models and observations in that part of the atmosphere. To understand why it matters a great deal, have a look at our video. To see if the problem has gone away or gotten worse, we turn to the latest IPCC report. As always, except for replacing some author lists with (—) and spelling out some short forms to improve readability, what follows is the IPCC report verbatim, this time from Chapter 3 Section 3.3.1.2.
          https://climatediscussionnexus.com/2021/09/22/ipcc-ar6-tropical-troposphere-warm-bias-unspun-edition/

          # # #

          So basically, apart from the scientific literature above, one of the best rebuttals to UN hysterics is to quote verbatim their latest IPCC report Chapter 3 Section 3.3.1.2.

          I don’t think that is what they intended.

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    • #
    • #
      Ross

      On recent episode of Q&A on Australia’s ABC network the panel were discussing Climate Change etc. One speaker claimed that last year 1/2 of Australia was on fire. No one challenged or contradicted her. These claims just get keep getting more hyperbolic.

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      • #
        Geoff Sherrington

        Ross,
        “Hyperbolic” has particular meaning in mathematics and science. Might be best to avoid using the word as a general adjective unless you can show valid hyperbolic numbers.
        There is no shortage of alternatives if you are seeking to describe a rapid change of a parameter. BTW, a line on paper depicting a hyperbole has both downwards and upwards trend parts. Geoff S

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        • #

          Hyperbole also has a particular meaning and it is appropriate in this case. The rhetoric is truly hyperbolic.

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        • #
          Strop

          Geoff, Ross can show valid hyperbolic numbers.
          1/2 or 50%.

          As for parameters. There are at least three by which the Q&A speaker arrived at those numbers. Stupidity, error, or lying.

          The real figures are 1/40 or 2.5%

          00

      • #

        Right Ross, but the reason the hyperbole is increasing is because very little of what they are calling for is happening. Their complaint is a measure of our achievement.

        61

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        At this rate the climate kooks will think a small car can be put in its own boot…

        20

    • #
      Deano

      Aussie Greens leader Adam Bandt also said today that our 2030 target will “cook our kids”.
      The energy policies supported by the Greens would mean our kids won’t be doing any cooking. A handful of raw insects if they’re well connected maybe.

      00

  • #
    John Hultquist

    The west coast of North America is having a weather event.
    Cliff Mass and others have made posts there upon.

    110

  • #
    skeptikal

    I don’t normally promote any political party because they’re all crap… but I am going to mention the United Australia Party as they have a policy of allowing alternate treatments for the coronavirus, including the use of anti-virals.

    From their website…

    The United Australia Party believes in the sanctity of the doctor-patient relationship and the privacy of your medical or health information.

    Alternative treatments to COVID-19 (including anti-virals) that have shown extraordinary success where administered in many overseas countries, must be included in the treatment options and available for all Australians.

    Medical treatments should not be mandated from on high by government chief health officers who have not seen or examined the patients for whom they are mandating particular or a narrow range of treatments.

    https://www.unitedaustraliaparty.org.au/national_policy/

    Even if you believe in the vaccine, you should feel disgusted that the Federal Government is deliberately limiting your treatment options. Cheap and safe anti-virals should be allowed for anyone who wants them.

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  • #
    Erasmus

    Are state and the federal governments about to cross another line by insisting that vaccination certificates depend on additional booster shots? This is getting very silly.

    360

    • #
      Klem

      Gotta keep the scam alive somehow.

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    • #
      David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

      G’day E,
      ” This is getting very silly. ”
      Far too soft. i’d suggest words along the line of: “This is already criminally stupid”.
      Politeness prevents me from mentioning some of the possible alternatives to my “criminally”.
      Cheers
      Dave B

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    • #
      beowulf

      Not silly, just cunning: it’s the next step in The Plan. Did you really expect anything different?

      Most humans are not much harder to boil than frogs as long as the authorities pretend to justify each increment in the heat. Some I know will still be fighting to get their Nth shot as their fellow suckers drop dead around them from the effects of previous shots, so long as the government tells them the vax is safe and necessary.

      Observation, inquisitiveness and independent thought are not ranked amongst their talents.

      It’s like watching a class of blind-folded children leading each other over a cliff as their teachers urge them on for the greater good.

      171

    • #
      Ross

      The pressure for the 3rd booster shot is coming from both ends of the vaccine marketing pipeline. I genuinely believe there a significant number of people still scared silly enough to be demanding the 3rd jab. At the other end you have the major companies eg. Pfizer who are probably not achieving some of their initial volume predictions for their product. I think countries like India and Indonesia with their big populations were pencilled in early by these companies and the vaccination uptake in both have been less than forecasted. Hence, there is excess product to be used already and Australia is a soft target. We have compliant politicians and health bureaucrats and because of our low population they are afraid to reject any of the vaccine push due to FOMO.

      160

    • #
      Gary S

      ‘All tyrannies rule through fraud and force, but once the fraud is exposed they must rely exclusively on force.’
      -George Orwell.

      130

    • #
      Gary S

      ‘This work was voluntary, but any animal who absented himself from it would have his rations reduced by half.’

      George Orwell – Animal Farm.

      Are we now farmed animals?

      160

      • #
        GD

        ‘This work was voluntary, but any animal who absented himself from it would have his rations reduced by half.’

        Getting the jab was voluntary, but anyone who refused would have their freedom reduced by half.

        00

    • #
      yarpos

      Just another step of incrementalism.

      Just 14 days to flatten the curve
      Just a mask
      Just a few days/weeks/months
      Just another lockdown
      Just a few more restrictions
      Just a State border closure
      Just a curfew
      Just a vaccine (never mind it has no long term testing)
      Just a form that only lets you say its voluntary
      Just a booster
      Just apartheid for the unvaccinated

      And most of us have swallowed it all. I far better understand the Americans strong defence of 2A now and the extent to which normal life can be eroded by meglomaniac State officials.

      180

    • #
      Hanrahan

      John Campbell’s Sunday missive tells of massive drop in efficacy in months. Don’t know the details, he bores me so I do sudoku at the same time.

      70

      • #
        yarpos

        A juror in the Theranos/Elizabeth Holmes case in the US got the flick the other day for doing Sodoku during evidence.

        20

  • #
    • #
      David Maddison

      I absolutely don’t trust the government, the Left or Big Pharma or the safety or efficacy of the particular covid vaccines on offer (and am very much pro-vax in general) but I very much doubt that “microparasites” as they call them are present in the vaccines or are responsible for various non-parasitic diseases.

      190

  • #
    Broadie

    This appears to be a rational discussion by Naomi Wolf & Peter Navaro.

    Wolf looks at Australia and considers rethinking her long held opposition to the 2nd Amendment.

    Navarro worked with Fauci and ‘The Father of The Vaccine ‘ Trump to bring us the ‘Clot Shots’. Peter discusses the effect of these ‘Jabs’ and the withholding of safe therapies.

    50

  • #
    clarence.t

    A fun little video.. two Lib-Dems in the UK who happen to be realists….

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B_J4fInzUBY

    50

  • #
    David Maddison

    Here is Mark Dice’s latest video on the viral cultural meme “let’s go Brandon”.

    It’s even been recorded into the Congressional Record.

    Mark Dice: https://youtu.be/qBwcfxB5J7A

    Frankly, I can’t see how Biden’s going to make it to the next “election”, his dementia is progressing so rapidly he’ll be lucky to be trusted in public by the end of the year.

    Sky News compilation of some of Biden’s recent gaffs: https://youtu.be/g9h2ZB_8oLA

    100

    • #
      Dave in the States

      It probably doesn’t matter how far Biden’s dementia progresses, since he just a figure head for the untouchables beyond the curtain. He’s been nothing but an empty suit for so long now than a little more MT doesn’t matter.

      200

    • #
      Geoff Sherrington

      David M,
      All of us make mistakes, some earning the label “gaffe’. A “gaff” is a lever with a hook, for lifting fish.
      Bit tricky to use a mistake to illustrate a mistake.
      Geoff S

      30

  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    Tomorrow is the day el gordo and I resolve our bet (and honestly it is the only reason I have for being on this site)

    Just to be sure, my understanding is that it was going to be cooler now because of El Niño.

    According to BOM “ The national mean temperature for September was 1.01 °C warmer than the 1961–1990 average for Australia as a whole. The mean maximum temperature for September was 1.31 °C warmer than average and the mean minimum temperature was 0.70 °C warmer than average.” This is after July which saw “ The national mean temperature for July was 1.77 °C warmer than the 1961–1990 average for Australia as a whole, making it the fourth-warmest July on record. It was amongst the three warmest Julys on record for South Australia, Western Australia, and the Northern Territory, and the seventh-warmest on record for Queensland.”

    To round out the year BOM is forecasting “ Maximum temperatures for November to January are likely to be above median for much of the northern half of Australia and Tasmania. Below median daytime temperatures are likely for eastern NSW.
    Above median minimum temperatures for November to January are very likely for almost all of Australia, with roughly equal chances of warmer or cooler than median nights for south-east WA and south-west SA”

    Over to el gordo

    119

    • #
      David Maddison

      I’d be concerned that the BoM temperature data has been altered or “homogenised” to “prove” the BoM’s political agenda of anthropogenic global warming.

      You might have to find an uncorrupted data set.

      350

    • #
      David

      So it’s warmer! If you analysed the 1960s and 1970s it would show cooling trends. The reality is the temperature moves in cycles – seasonally and in decade like terms, let alone in geological time terms.

      I recall a paper analysing the aggregate European temperature data back to the 1700s. It showed mathematically various cycles some decade like lengths and others century like. Interestingly the continuation of the cycles showed unambiguously that the future was going to colder. We can see this already in weather reports from Antarctica and the Northern Hemisphere.

      150

      • #
        clarence.t

        So true.

        The Australian temperature data is a sort of smile shape.

        1880-1920 was the highest period, cooling to the bottom of the curve in the late 1950’s then a warming to a nice “mama-bear” temperature, but still below the 1880-1920 warm period.

        Absolutely none of this was anything to do with atmospheric CO2.

        Meanwhile, the Antarctic continues to cool.

        101

        • #
          Geoff Sherrington

          clarence.t,
          There is accumulating evidence that BOM did something odd with their temperatures, some time in the last 10 years.
          BOM data show an increased warming (one end of your ‘smile”) that is out of step with other data products for surface temperatures, like Hadley and Giss and UAH.
          Ken Steward has a 3-part examination of this postulate, starting here:
          https://kenskingdom.wordpress.com/2021/01/07/how-accurate-is-australias-temperature-record-part-1/

          One should be wary about taking bets on temperature data when there is so much uncertainty, much of it arising from the convenient use of existing weather station data from equipment that is not fit for purpose, when that purpose involves verifiable accuracy. The BOM are reluctant to state an accuracy estimate, here is their reply to one of several requests:

          .
          You have asked “If a person seeks to know the separation of two daily temperatures in degrees C that allows a confident claim that the two temperatures are different statistically, by how much would the two values be separated?”
          The internationally accepted standard for determining if two measurements are statistically different is ISO/IEC17043. The latter covers the calculation of a normalized score (known as the EN score), which is a standard method for this type of question.
          As previously communicated, the most relevant figure that we can supply to meet your request for a “T +/- X degrees C” is our specified inspection threshold (conservatively within +/- 0.3 ⁰C), but this is not an estimate of the uncertainty of the ACORN-SAT network’s temperature measurements in the field.
          .
          .
          Material for another episode of “Utopia”? Geoff S

          80

      • #
        OldOzzie

        If you analysed the 1960s and 1970s it would show cooling trends.

        Melbourne 1968 Station 086071 – no longer appears in BOM Climate Data Online as Station shut down 2015 – Ran from 1855 to 2015

        http://www.bom.gov.au/jsp/ncc/cdio/weatherData/av?p_nccObsCode=122&p_display_type=dailyDataFile&p_startYear=1968&p_c=-1481795582&p_stn_num=086071

        Select Days above 30C

        100

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      I am sure he will pay you off in brass monkeys.

      70

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Not really a fair bet when Bom keep adjusting the historical temperature data .

      200

    • #
      clarence.t

      According to UAH, a much more accurate measure of temperature because it doesn’t contain urban heat smeared over large areas, and isn’t fabricated/homogenised from many surface stations of which a large percentage are “unfit for purpose”

      .. for Australia, September 2021 was cooler than September 1980, 1981 and 1983 (12th out of 43)

      and October 2021, was cooler than October 1980, 1982 and a lot of other years, (20th out of 43)

      161

    • #
      clarence.t

      Further more, in Australia, the period from 1880-1920 was much warmer than current temperatures.

      171

    • #
      Rowjay

      Isn’t climate in this new world order the average of the last 30 years of weather?
      Why is the BOM using 1961 – 1990 instead of 1991 – 2020 for their comparison?

      130

      • #
        Rowjay

        According to BOM “ The national mean temperature for September was 1.01 °C warmer than the 1961–1990 average for Australia as a whole.

        According to data downloaded from the BOM, the average of the last 30 years of the national mean temperature anomaly (1991 – 2020) for September (using the BOM baseline) was 1.005 °C.

        So yes Peter – you win by .005 °C!

        51

    • #
      el+gordo

      It was a five year bet, not one month, climate changes slowly. We live on a small continent in the Southern Hemisphere and need to focus on world temperatures, nevertheless…

      ‘Below median daytime temperatures are likely for eastern NSW.’

      There is a pattern and its not in the AGW narrative, the meandering jet stream will continue to bring cold air from the south as we go into summer.

      81

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        5 years! i thought is was 5 months. OK I will reset my calendar.

        now what data will be used. I prefer one which uses SAT, as UAH does not cover mountains (where warming is the fastest)

        Since we are now talking Global, could I suggest that we use the World Meteorological Organisation

        or would have have an alternative?

        19

        • #
          clarence.t

          “as UAH does not cover mountains”

          Rubbish.

          UAH covers most of the globe.. This cannot be said for urban based surface thermometers that cover a tiny tiny proportion of the globe’s surface.

          Warming is not fastest on mountains.. that one of your many made up fantasies.

          WMO uses sparsely located and massively in-filled and homogenised and adjusted erratic data.

          Its surface temperature fabrications are meaningless.

          The only pristine surface data in the world trend-matches UAH over the same region

          UAH is proven accurate by sampling, as well as by similarity to balloon data.

          https://i.postimg.cc/76vq3kFf/Christy-JR-20210121-v2-CMIP6-models-UAH.jpg

          00

        • #
          el+gordo

          Use whatever tools you have at your disposal and we’ll continue to argue the toss over whether they are fit for purpose.

          Watching temperatures is not a good indication of climate change, it would be better to look at extreme weather as a guide to where climate is heading. You have a linear perspective, this is wrong headed, CO2 doesn’t have the ability to override earth’s natural cyclic system.

          60

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            possibly if you had looked at the link, it was about climate – and as I said UAH is not fit for purpose

            as stated here “Data are available as global, hemispheric, zonal, and gridded averages. The global average covers 97-98% of the earth’s surface, excluding only latitudes above +85 degrees, below -85 degrees and, in the cases of TLT and TMT, some areas with land above 1500 m altitude. The hemispheric averages are over the northern and southern hemispheres 0 to +/-85 degrees. The gridded data provide an almost global temperature map”

            (my bold) – this is a very bad dataset to use for global climate as it misses large bits.

            Still, 5 years it will be

            17

            • #
              clarence.t

              Funny that mountains are no longer located in the lower troposphere.

              97-98% of the worlds’s surface

              wow.. that’s a pretty darn good representation.

              A far greater amount than covered by the sparse, irregular urban tainted surface temperatures.

              Magnitudes better, if fact.

              Thanks for confirming that UAH is a far better measure of global temperature than the surface fabrications

              50

            • #
              clarence.t

              Fascinating that you think a coverage of 97-98% of the world’s surface,

              Missing only a tiny circle of ultra cold at either pole,

              .. doesn’t give an extremely good measure of the global temperature.

              Bizarre, even !!

              20

            • #
              clarence.t

              Each surface station, in reality only represents an urban area of say and average 3-4km in radius at the very best. Even then, highly tainted by urban and other erratic heating effects…

              Without data smearing over areas that a particular surface point does not represent, the surface data actually covers well less than a single digit percentage of the even the land surface, probably far less.

              Compared to 97-98% of the global surface…. which would any sane, rational, science-minded person choose.

              10

            • #
              Kalm Keith

              I have it on good authority that essentially 99.9% of the Earth’s land mass is above sea level.

              20

          • #
            Richard+C+(NZ)

            el gordo >”Watching temperatures is not a good indication of climate change, it would be better to look at extreme weather as a guide to where climate is heading.”

            Surface temperature is a secondary metric and extreme weather is way too loose.

            The primary metric is the Earth’s energy balance which. the IPCC says, “controls” surface temperature:

            FAQ 2.1, Box 1: What is Radiative Forcing?

            “What is radiative forcing? The influence of a factor that can cause climate change, such as a greenhouse gas, is often evaluated in terms of its radiative forcing. Radiative forcing is a measure of how the energy balance of the Earth- atmosphere system is influenced when factors that affect climate are altered. The word radiative arises because these factors change the balance between incoming solar radiation and outgoing infrared radiation within the Earth’s atmosphere. This radiative balance controls the Earth’s surface temperature.

            The term forcing is used to indicate that Earth’s radiative balance is being pushed away from its normal state. Radiative forcing is usually quantified as the ‘rate of energy change per unit area of the globe as measured at the top of the atmosphere’, and is expressed in units of ‘Watts per square metre’ (see Figure 2). When radiative forcing from a factor or group of factors is evaluated as positive, the energy of the Earth-atmosphere system will ultimately increase, leading to a warming of the system. In contrast, for a negative radiative forcing, the energy will ultimately decrease, leading to a cooling of the system. Important challenges for climate scientists are to identify all the factors that affect climate and the mechanisms by which they exert a forcing, to quantify the radiative forcing of each factor and to evaluate the total radiative forcing from the group of factors.”

            https://www.ipcc.ch/site/assets/uploads/2018/02/ar4-wg1-faqs-1.pdf

            # # #

            That is effectively the definition of “climate change”.

            Note the IPCC discarded the idea of ‘surface forcing’ in AR4 in favour of TOA forcing above. Even so they still write screeds on surface forcing in Observations: Atmosphere.

            00

        • #
          Maptram

          But then the BOM is comparing apples with oranges. The BOM has closed quite a few sites and opened others from the early 1990s onwards. One example is Noona. As far as I can tell Noona is a roadside stop about 80 km wet of Cobar airport on the barrier highway. It’s an AWS that records temperature and not much else. First temperatures recorded were on 20 Aug 2017 and the maximum temperature recorded was 47.5°C on 10 Jan 2020. How many other places like Noona has the BOM opened since 1990?

          And then you mention BOM forecasts. Cobar is a good place to look at the BOM’s record with forecasts. The BOM has two weather stations at Cobar, Cobar Meteorological Office (Cobar MO) and Cobar Airport AWS. The MO started recording in 1962 and the airport started recording in 1993. The airport is about 7km south west of the MO. The forecasts that the BOM provides for Cobar seem to be an average, so often with actual temperatures, one location is above the forecast and the other is below.

          Then there is Deniliquin. Deniliquin Visitors centre site operated from the 1850s until 2003. Deniliquin Airport AWS opened in 1997, with first records in June 1997. so there is some overlap in the records for the years 1998 to 2003. For January in four of the five years, Airport average temperatures were higher than Visitors Centre temperatures. For Cobar the January average maximum from 1994 to 2021 is higher at the airport than the MO.

          The Cobar records also show that, for January 1994 to 2021, average Cobar airport temperatures are higher than average MO temperatures.

          From 1990 onwards the BOM has opened a number of sites often at airports, and closed a number of other sites. So how do the mean temperature increases you refer to incorporate the possibility that they could be due to change of sites and inclusion of hotter sites, rather than caused the increasing CO2 or some other weather factors

          90

          • #
            Geoff Sherrington

            Maptram
            If not done already, go to Chris Gillham’s web host site of waclimate.org.
            You will find emotion-free analyses of your line of questioning.
            You will see in clear terms how the ACORN-SAT data adjustment processes have cooled the past. You will find several aspects of new, warm locations being added. Bonus, you can find detailed analyses of number of hot days each year at 100+ locations.
            Geoff S

            60

        • #
          el+gordo

          From 2000 to 2010 temperatures were flat because of a negative PDO, then went neutral in the following decade, now we are returning to a plateau in world temperatures as it goes negative.

          https://www.drroyspencer.com/wp-content/uploads/UAH_LT_1979_thru_September_2021_v6.jpg

          20

        • #
          clarence.t

          5 years.. Ok.

          Here is Australia UAH since 2015-16 El Nino event.

          ***best data available by far, according to PF… covers 97-98% of the globe !
          Also shown to trend match pristine surface data and balloon data.. ie Great data !

          https://i.postimg.cc/C5F37dYP/Australia-UAH-since-2015-16-El-nino.png

          Anyone with eyes open enough, will see the trend. 😉

          20

        • #
          KP

          Hang on! I live in the mountains and Weatherzone tells me October has been colder than average! Minimums 1.5deg below average, maximums 0.6deg below average, and I think Sept was also cold.

          I’ve yet to feel any of this global warming…

          10

      • #
        clarence.t

        ‘Below median daytime temperatures are likely for eastern NSW.’

        See comment below.

        30

      • #
        Forrest Gardener

        El Gordo. Please just tell him he is right and to eff off.

        40

    • #
      clarence.t

      Also, on a year-to-date basis, 2021 in UAH Australia is below the median, being in 23rd position out of 43.

      40

    • #

      Even if, who cares and why ? Who is feeling a difference ?

      90

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Hi PF. I am taking it on myself to speak for El Gordo. You win our bet. Now eff off.

      80

    • #
      Travis T. Jones

      2013: Australia to face stronger El Niño weather patterns from global warming

      https://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/australia-to-face-stronger-el-nino-weather-patterns-from-global-warming-20131118-2xrbl.html

      Global warming causes stronger El Niño unless it is not a normal El Niño season, then that’s caused by global warming as well.

      Got it.

      Is there nothing carbon (sic) can’t do?

      70

      • #
        el+gordo

        Hannam got that wrong, didn’t consider the possibility that the oceanic oscillations determine temperature, a cluster of La Nina like conditions has returned and should falsify AGW.

        40

    • #
      Annie

      If it’s warmer, I wonder why we still need to light our woodstove now it’s late October? We had a couple of days when it warmed up pleasantly but yesterday I had multiple layers on to work outside. There was a perishing cold wind!

      80

    • #
      Richard+C+(NZ)

      Peter >”my understanding [of the bet] is that it was going to be cooler now because of El Niño”

      I’m assuming your bet is confined to Australia given your comment. In that respect, and given current double-dip La Niña conditions I wouldn’t expect eastern Australia to be cooler – just the opposite. But I haven’t looked at what effect La Niña has on Australia so I don’t know. el gordo mentions the jetstream and Antarctic air so that may be a greater factor than La Niña for a year or so.

      However, indisputable that the globe and hemispheres have cooled since the February 2016 El Niño peak.

      Geoff Sherrington warns:

      “One should be wary about taking bets on temperature data when there is so much uncertainty”

      I would add that betting on anomalies is a fools errand. Anomalies remove the recurring oscillations at the annual frequency (warm-cool-warm-cool), create distorted trends, and false long-term temperature differences. See scientific literature here and thread above it.

      There is however a ‘control’ to compare anomalies to – absolute datasets.

      I presented the NOAA’s WRIT Monthly Timeseries Tool in a previous thread here.

      Using the NCEP/NCAR R1 dataset in absolute (K), the Southern Hemisphere trend for the last decade, even including the 2015/16 El Niño, is -0.24K/decade.

      But NOAA’s anomaly dataset at Climate at a Glance returns +0.18K/decade for the same timeframe.

      SH 2010 – 2021 trend
      -0.24K/decade Absolute
      +0.18K/decade Anomaly

      And the long-term differences:

      1950 Dec 0.74K cooler than 2020 Dec Anomaly.
      1950 Dec 0.15K cooler than 2020 Dec Absolute
      .

      Anomaly is 0.6K too warm hence “Code Red for Humanity”.

      CO2-centric climate scientists really favour anomalies because they provide them with Stephen Schneider’s “scary scenarios” but absolute paints an entirely different picture.

      20

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        What exactly is your point. el g is saying we are at the start of a cooling period, I say the opposite. 4 years and 7 months from now we will see who had the winning prediction. And the whole point of the 5 years is to remove short term weather events. None of the commentators pilling on here seem to have the nouse to understand this, preferring instead to repeat anything published by the heartland institute (which is now mostly funded by oil, previously by cigarettes)

        13

        • #
          clarence.t

          “I say the opposite. “

          And the data proves you wrong…. here it is, 5 years + a bit.

          https://i.postimg.cc/C5F37dYP/Australia-UAH-since-2015-16-El-nino.png

          10

        • #
          el+gordo

          Yep, there seems to be a lack of interest in climate science, but we’ll struggle on without them.

          00

        • #
          clarence.t

          “anything published by the heartland institute”

          ?????

          What a weird comment !…

          Not one link cited by Richard C had anything to do with Heartland, nor is there one comment I can find in response to your first comment at #9, that has anything to do with Heartland.

          20

        • #
          Richard+C+(NZ)

          Peter >”What exactly is your point. el g is saying we are at the start of a cooling period”

          My point is that by using absolute datasets, rather than el gordo’s “start” of a cooling period, the Southern Hemisphere has in fact been cooling for the last 10 years (-0.24K/decade).

          Note this period includes the 2015/16 El Nino.

          Also, 0K is the ultimate anomaly baseline – no molecular activity and no temperature. Kelvin is the base unit of temperature in the International System of Units (SI) and the measure used in physics/thermodynamics calcs.

          00

  • #
    David Maddison

    Interesting video of digging water wells by hand in an unspecified Third World country, possibly Pakistan (a nuclear and space power, unlike Australia, but still classified as Third World).

    It would never happen in Australia. You’d never get government approval.

    https://youtu.be/DejfIkNJGEo

    Someone made the comment that as slow as it was to dig the wells by hand it would still be faster than the permitting, inspection and approval process in a Western Country.

    180

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Yes it would be quicker , I know a few who have dug bore holes using auger bits and extensions they then put a fake dog house on top to fool any sat or drone footage . This is where the water table isn’t that far down though.

      80

      • #
        yarpos

        Mines at 5 metres, but dont ask me how I know

        40

      • #
        Hanrahan

        In ’59, working on Fairymead Sugar plantation, we sank shallow bore holes by hand using a sand pump.

        We cadets just provided the cheap labour to work the sand pump so the 10 or 12 inch steel casing was in the hole when we got there. I assume they just drilled through the topsoil with a tractor mounted auger and erected a tripod and pulley over it. We stood on a wooden platform clamped to the case and jiggled the sand pump, a heavy bucket with a flapper valve in the bottom. Lifting and dropping filled the bucket with sand which we then emptied. The casing sank into the the sand under its own weight and a little from my 44 kilos.

        I didn’t see the hole finished but they could pump a LOT of water out of them.

        20

  • #
    el+gordo

    ‘…. it was going to be cooler now because of El Niño.’

    That is not quite right, the absence of El Nino makes it cooler. The other point is that south east Australia appeared to be cooler, is this correct?

    I think BoM is wrong in their forecast for summer, cooler days and warmer nights seem more likely.

    110

    • #
      Harves

      Bom has rarely been able to predict two weeks into the future. If Bom says red, you’d be best to put your chips on black.
      There’s a reason they go to great lengths to hide their past forecasts. Whereas you’d think this should be the primary KPI for this taxpayer funded embarrassment. If they are not well above 50% accuracy, then what is the point?

      100

    • #
      KP

      “cooler days and warmer nights seem more likely.”

      You’d need to study the moon for that decision, and BOM vehemently deny they need to.

      Has anyone read “The Lunar Code” by Ken Ring?

      20

  • #
    John+R+Smith

    Reverse Zombieism.
    My personal experience from the get go of this whole thing, is that the real contagion was fear.
    Purposely promulgated by an over the top government/media propaganda campaign.
    (For purpose and outcome we can’t yet fully see, and those that do see it may find themselves in trouble.)
    To me, it was obvious and I never experienced a moment of fear, even though I am in the alleged high risk demographic.
    It is likely I developed natural immunity to government propaganda from climate fear exposure.
    And natural immunity is the best. 🙂

    Folk I interact with daily behave as zombies.
    Wearing masks walking alone down the street and in cars.
    Plus face shields and surgical gloves.
    A friend recently went off because my mask had slipped under my nose.
    Trump Derangement Syndrome evolved into Covid Derangement Syndrome.
    Mostly the same victims.
    Instead of gurgling “brains”, they gurgle “vaxine”.
    Although they need brains since their brains appear to have been eaten.
    The world is dividing between the Vaxxed and the Pure Bloods.
    Low budget Sci Fi made real.

    230

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Our glorious leader the most blessed and holy divine one in Victoriastan has ruled I must stay hidden from public places lest I infect his disciples. Well until the opinion polls say let it rip .

      160

      • #
        Travis T. Jones

        Dan scares the people by saying he doesn’t want the unjabbed to infect the jabbed.

        Dan implies that unjabbed people are infected, which is unscientific, scaremongering garbage.

        If Dan thinks the unjabbed are ‘infected’, let them be tested for immunity.

        Dan also confirms that double jabbed people are not protected from catching the virus, as Dan doesn’t want a “fully protected” taxpayer to catch the lurgy from a supposedly infected taxpayer.

        Evil Dan.

        140

      • #
        yarpos

        The unvaxxed wont be allowed to vote next year

        90

        • #
          Annie

          The ‘unvaxxed’ will have to apply for postal votes!

          60

          • #
            yarpos

            No, no , no Annie you wont be able to mail in your Covid cooties. Lord think of the expense with AEC officials in full hazmat and votes having to be stored as bio hazards. Much easier to ban.

            10

    • #
      Steve of Cornubia

      I wonder how many people would comply with mask mandates if there wasn’t the very real prospect of being fined? That’s all I am doing. I wear a mask when going to the supermarket etc only because I don’t want a fine. It’s not because I believe my health is at risk and a mask will save me.

      Just visit pretty much anywhere away from busy malls etc, where the Kovid Kops aren’t likely to get you, and hardly anybody wears a mask.

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        Forrest Gardener

        Just another data point but there has been a marked change on the route of my daily walk. There have been very few masks in the last week where previously they were close to universal.

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      John+R+Smith

      Oh and I almost forgot …
      I am pleased to announce my new venture.
      The SUPPLY CHAIN DIET.
      Significant weight loss without effort.
      Simply go to your local grocery or restaurant and find nothing there.
      We plan to offer the complete easy to follow step by step program at an introductory price of only one Bitcoin.
      Link to follow soon.
      Thanks! 🙂

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      Kalm Keith

      “The world is dividing between the Vaxxed and the Pure Bloods”.

      Like it.

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  • #
    TdeF

    For those who question how many people will go to Glasgow, the numbers are back up to 30,000. But they always link to spruikers. The more common figure is 25,000 and I have read under 20,000. Whatever happens, it is front page news because so many journlists want it to happen and are in the ecological apocolpytic camp. (Delingpole’s Four Horsemen of the Ecopalypse)

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      TdeF

      And who really believes any 50-60 year old politician really intends to do something about ‘carbon emissions’ when they are 80-90? People like Barnaby Joyce as just holding onto their jobs in the face of Press badgering to do something ridiculous which none of them understand. Adolph promised free cars and free holidays for all. He lied.

      I remember Bob Monkhouse’s line when asked for a joke in public. His answer was, if I was a politician would you say, you’re a politician, tell us a lie?

      Climate and pandemics are the UN’s opportunity to be a world government and do what all such communist dominated institutions of 40,000 privileged unelected people do, grab power. And with the power, get billions in cash for nothing to redistribute at their leisure.

      At least Robert Mugabe and friends are not turning up this time. Climate victims need cash, lots of cash.

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        robert rosicka

        Listening to Joyce try and explain the Nats reason for selling out the bush on net zero and the only thing I really got from it was it was a better deal than what we were going to get ! Not the point you’ve sold the herd not just one cow for a few magic beans .
        Can’t wait to see exactly what is in the sell out terms of this agreement and the details of what has to go to appease the god of green menace .

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        • #
          Steve of Cornubia

          We will never get to see the real terms. I have no doubt that what was really at stake for Joyce – a pollie I used to have time for – is his own future, in the short term as leader of the Nats and Deputy PM, but also the longer term after politics. Like others, he will probably now be assured of many lucrative positions on NGOs or the like, and maybe non-exec directorships in the corporate world, all of which will mean he retains all the perks he and others in government are hooked on.

          Frankly, I despair. I never had a high opinion of career politicians and their ilk but, one by one, even the few I had hopes for or some admiration are revealed to be sell-outs and self-serving skunks.

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        • #
          MP

          Zero is zero, it does not matter what deal is cut, you end up at the same number 0.

          20

          • #
            Yonniestone.

            Unless its Biden’s $3.5 trillion build back better plan that’s going to cost $0, from a White House press release no joke.

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  • #
    OldOzzie

    Newspoll: Support slumps as Scott Morrison leaves for Glasgow

    Simon Benson Political Editor

    The Coalition has slumped to its lowest level of support in three years as Scott Morrison prepares to attend the Glasgow climate change summit armed with a commitment to meet a 2050 net-zero emissions reduction target.

    It comes amid growing community support for action on climate change, with most voters saying the goal of reducing emissions should be a greater priority for government than keeping energy prices down.

    An exclusive Newspoll conducted for The Australian shows popular support for the Liberal-Nationals falling two points to 35 per cent, the lowest level of support recorded this term.

    The poll shows 47 per cent of voters believed the government should prioritise meeting emissions reduction targets compared to 40 per cent believing lower energy bills should be the main consideration.

    It marks a four-point increase in support since February 2020 in the wake of the bushfire crisis, but confirms a dramatic reversal of sentiment since 2018 when 64 per cent of voters said energy prices should be the priority and only 24 per cent believed reducing greenhouse gas emissions was more important.

    Coalition voters were still more inclined to favour cost of living concerns – 50 per cent to 34 per cent – while 59 per cent of Labor voters said emissions targets should be given greater weight than power prices which were supported by 33 per cent.

    An average of 10 per cent of voters said energy security – avoiding blackouts – should be the key priority.

    Voters also believed Labor rather than the Coalition – 35 per cent to 28 per cent – would be better at leading Australia’s response to the climate change challenge.

    The latest Newspoll result marks the worst result for the ­Coalition since December 2018, four months after Malcolm Turnbull lost the Liberal Party leadership amid a rebellion over climate change policy.

    Support for Pauline Hanson’s One Nation rose a point to 3 per cent while Labor also gained a point to 38 per cent.

    There was no movement for the Greens which remained on 11 per cent.

    The strong support recorded in the previous poll for other minor parties, which includes Clive Palmer’s United Australia Party, has been maintained at a post-election high of 13 per cent.

    The poll also covers a period that has seen the nation pass the 70 per cent full-vaccination rate, the reopening of both ­Victoria and NSW following months of lockdown, and a commitment by Queensland to lift its border restrictions before Christmas.

    However, the end of lockdowns has delivered no net electoral benefit for Mr Morrison or the ­Coalition.

    On a two-party-preferred basis, the Coalition has drifted a point and now trails Labor 46-54 ­compared to 47-53 per cent in the last survey conducted three weeks ago.

    This is the equal worst result for the government this term with the same result posted in August.

    Mr Morrison’s approval ratings have also fallen further into net-negative territory and are now level with those recorded in September.

    Approval of the Prime Minister’s performance fell two points to 46 per cent while those dissatisfied with Mr Morrison rose a point to 50 per cent, resulting in a net satisfaction rating of minus four.

    They are still well above the lowest recorded during the 2019-2020 summer bushfire crisis when Mr Morrison’s net approval ratings dipped to minus 21.

    But voters remain disenchanted with Labor leader Anthony ­Albanese, whose approval rating remained unchanged at 37 per cent.

    Those dissatisfied with his performance fell a point to 46 per cent, producing a net approval rating of minus 9.

    A significant percentage of voters have yet to make up their mind about Mr Albanese, with 17 per cent unable to say one way or the other about his performance as Opposition Leader.

    In the head-to-head contest over who would make the better prime minister, Mr Morrison has maintained a strong leader over his rival. Mr Morrison lifted a point to 48 per cent with Mr Albanese remaining unchanged on 34 per cent.

    Worrying is the Bold Highlighted text – Are Australians that Dumb or just Brainwashed?

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    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      An exclusive Newspoll conducted for The Australian shows … that they are still making up the numbers as they always have.

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    Life in the 21st Century

    I could give a sort of reasoned scientific patho-physiological medical response to that, but if I go Eu-ugh! that will probably suffice for now.

    Dr. John Campbell.

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    OldOzzie

    Irish Quandary: Who to Blame When Everyone’s Vaxxed?

    No one seems curious about the prevalence of the disease in an almost fully vaccinated population.

    by JACK CASHILL
    October 23, 2021, 10:02 PM

    During his Thursday town hall meeting with CNN’s Anderson Cooper, President Joe Biden blithely dismissed the most basic assertion of those who have chosen to resist a COVID-19 vaccination. “Freedom? I have the freedom to kill you with my COVID,” scoffed Biden. “No, I mean come on — freedom.”

    In his literally mindless way, Biden said out loud what health officials everywhere have been implying since the vaccines became widely available. Those who are not vaccinated are killing their more responsible peers.

    In the Republic of Ireland, however, health officials are running out of people to blame. This has becoming embarrassingly obvious in County Waterford. As reported in the Irish Times, the nation’s establishment newspaper, two of the three most COVID-infected electoral areas in Ireland are located in the county “with the highest rate of vaccination in the country.” In Waterford, a remarkable 99.7 percent of adults over the age of 18 is fully vaccinated.

    The arbitrary evolution of Irish COVID policy over the past 18 months has made it clear that public health officials and government policy makers have no idea what they are doing. If proof were needed, County Waterford provides it. According to data published on October 21, Waterford City South has the nation’s highest 14-day incidence rate at 1,486 cases per 100,000 and Tramore-Waterford City West has the third highest at 1,122 cases per 100,000. This is despite internal travel bans and the county’s more than 90 percent vaccination rate.

    Although Waterford is running three times the rate of the nation writ large, Ireland as a whole is not faring particularly well, especially given its draconian restrictions. In the seven days preceding October 21, Ireland reported 2,026 new cases. To put that number in perspective, wide-open Florida had 2,262 cases during that same period with a population more than four times greater than the Irish Republic’s.

    Most major newspapers have reported on the Waterford quandary, but they do so without any serious reflection. No one seems particularly curious as to how an almost fully vaccinated people can be spreading the disease among its members.

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      OldOzzie

      From weekend open thread

      Thanks ozfred – as epoch wants you to subscribe, here is an alternate

      https://alethonews.com/2021/10/15/two-new-studies-test-quercetin-and-covid-outcomes/

      Saved and printed 8 Pages including List of 48 Sources and References – excellent reference

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      TdeF

      When everyone’s vaxxed, deaths will be attributed to what?

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      Forrest Gardener

      As a counterpoint Israel’s third wave looks like it has passed and India’s second wave has diminished but with a long fat tail.

      In addition to asking what has gone wrong in Ireland I’d be very interested in the measures Israel and India have taken.

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      RickWill

      To put that number in perspective, wide-open Florida had 2,262 cases during that same period with a population more than four times greater than the Irish Republic’s.

      Lets put it in proper perspective. Ireland has 77% vaccinated. Their death rate is 0.18/100k per day – 9 people per day. Florida has 61% fully vaccinated and death rate is 0.6/100k per day or 135 deaths per day.

      Ireland does not have enough people vaccinated to get an infection rate solidly under one. County data is only relevant if no one is actually moving between counties.

      On the other hand Ireland is losing people at 1/3rd the rate of Florida. About what would be expected given the different level of vaccinations.

      Mobility in Ireland is 17% down on pre-Covid while Florida is 13% down. Not what most would regard as significantly different.

      NSW is a good example of high level of vaccination – First dose now over 90% and fully vexed above 80%. Daily cases have tumbled from 1600 to under 300 in 6 weeks while mobility has increased dramatically.

      Russia is a really good example of vaccine hesitancy. Just 30% fully vaccinated and deaths now hitting daily records. Europe is relying on Russia to keep them warm this winter – not something I would be relying on!

      As much as loonies look for data to condemn vaccinations the data inevitably supports the effectiveness of vaccinations.

      Countries that open up with fewer than 80% of the population fully vaccinated have experienced a tough road with the few exceptions of those that had high death rate prior to opening up. Countries that have embraced vaccinations have experienced an easy road out of Covid. UAE is testament to the value of vaccinations – now just 100 daily cases and some days with no deaths:
      https://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/?chart=countries&highlight=United%20Arab%20Emirates&show=highlight-only&y=both&scale=linear&data=cases-daily-7&data-source=merged&xaxis=right#countries

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      • #
        Gabriel Pentelie

        “Lets put it in proper perspective. Ireland has 77% vaccinated. Their death rate is 0.18/100k per day – 9 people per day. Florida has 61% fully vaccinated and death rate is 0.6/100k per day or 135 deaths per day.”

        Your numbers for Florida are waaaaaaaay off. Which, of course, means that your statement that ” Ireland is losing people at 1/3rd the rate of Florida” is the opposite of reality.

        As of Oct 24 on Worldometer, daily COVID deaths 7-day average:

        Ireland: 9, i.e. 0.18 per 100K.
        Florida: 5, i.e. … 0.02 per 100K.

        IOW, contrary to your aforementioned statement, it’s Florida that is currently losing people at a slower rate than Ireland. By a factor of 9. Despite the lower vaccination rate.

        You were saying?

        Links:
        https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/usa/florida/
        https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/ireland/

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        • #
          Peter C

          Florida has really had a huge improvement in Covid recently. What are they doing right?

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          • #
            Gabriel Pentelie

            Much of the ebb and flow of this virus clearly has to do with seasonality, which directly affects the amount of time people spend indoors. In the South, cases (and thus deaths) tend to rise noticeably during the sweltering summer months. In the North, they tend to do so during the frigid winter months.

            The rest is due to a variety of factors that interact in ways that no person or organization can fully understand yet (and if they claim they do, they’re lying). Some measures, such as aggressively prioritizing the vaccination of and monoclonal antibody treatment delivery to the most vulnerable people (i.e. older and more prone to comorbidities), clearly help. Florida has been very good at that, pretty much throughout. Other measures, such as mask mandates, have no clearly measurable benefit. Florida has avoided that. Yet other measures, such as school closings, actually are harmful. Florida has avoided that, too.

            That’s about all I got at the moment.

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            • #

              Much of the ebb and flow of this virus clearly has to do with seasonality, which directly affects the amount of time people spend indoors. In the South, cases (and thus deaths) tend to rise noticeably during the sweltering summer months. In the North, they tend to do so during the frigid winter months.

              Dan Bongino (a Florida resident) made exactly this point recently. During the summer in Florida everyone is indoors in air-conditioned spaces, now it is the fall everyone is back outside again. This demonstrates beautifully that transmission risks are highest indoors.

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      John+R+Smith

      “No one seems particularly curious as to how an almost fully vaccinated people can be spreading the disease among its members.”

      They notice it.
      But to be curious, is to admit to being fooled.
      They just can’t handle it.
      It one of the main symptoms of mass hysteria.
      The ‘unvaxxed’ will be blamed.
      Retribution must dealt to the non-believers for the integrity of the psyche of the ‘good people’ to survive.
      (The plans have been proudly announced.)

      I’m not that well educated, but I’m pretty sure there are books about this very thing.
      That might get burned soon.

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    David Maddison

    It’s interesting that the Australian Government has only provided limited or no funding for two Australian developed non-mRNA covid vaccines now undergoing clinical trials but gave a huge support and subsidy for the mRNA offerings from Big Pharma e.g. by making purchase of their product mandatory if you want to trade, travel or socialise (despite Orwellian claims that the vaxxes are not mandatory); by exempting them from liability for damages; by giving them authorisation without the usual testing; banning competition from competing anti-virals (HCQ and IVM) plus only providing limited access to antibody treatments.

    The two Australian products are:

    EnGeneIC Dream Vector (EDV) (no government funding that I can see):

    https://www.pharmaceutical-technology.com/news/engeneic-trial-nanocellular-vaccine/

    COVAX-19 (a $1 million grant):

    https://www.news-medical.net/news/20210812/South-Australian-developed-SARS-CoV-2-vaccine-shows-promise-to-prevent-COVID-19-lung-infection.aspx

    The government is funding an mRNA vaccine at Monash University:

    https://theconversation.com/whats-australias-first-local-pfizer-style-covid-vaccine-and-when-might-it-be-in-our-arms-an-mrna-expert-explains-163161

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    Harves

    How about a poll asking: “Did you know Australia has met or exceeded all emissions targets under the Coalition Govt?” Or “Did you know Australia is one of a small handful of countries to actually meet its emissions targets?”

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    • #
      David Maddison

      If Morrison or anyone in the Government actuslly cared about Australia they would be shouting it from the rooftops.

      Since they aren’t, they obviously support the “decarbonisation” (sic) agenda.

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    • #
      RickWill

      A better question:
      Did you know the “greenhouse effect” is contrived nonsense, make believe if you like – a fairy tale?

      Anyone answering yes is on the right path to understanding how Earth’s energy balance is achieved. Those who answer I did not know that are at least in the starting blocks . Those who give an alternate view have been lost to the religion and are beyond reason. No amount of scientific facts will alter their belief. They will spout consensus “science” and it soon degrades to fact-free hand waving and name calling.

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    David

    So it’s warmer! If you analysed the 1960s and 1970s it would show cooling trends. The reality is the temperature moves in cycles – seasonally and in decade like terms, let alone in geological time terms.

    I recall a paper analysing the aggregate European temperature data back to the 1700s. It showed mathematically various cycles some decade like lengths and others century like. Interestingly the continuation of the cycles showed unambiguously that the future was going to colder. We can see this already in weather reports from Antarctica and the Northern Hemisphere.

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    robert rosicka

    Heart attacks anyone ? Seems the incidence of heart attacks has risen by 25% in Scotland , wonder what’s changed over the last year to possibly cause that ?

    https://nworeport.me/2021/10/02/health-experts-baffled-by-mystery-rise-in-heart-attacks-from-blocked-arteries/

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    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Bargain prices for deep fried Mars bars?

      60

      • #
        OldOzzie

        Deep-fried culture is ‘no joke’

        Mars bars are battered and deep-fried in some chip shops

        I read the quaint fact about Scotland and nearly fell out of my seat.

        “Scotland has the worst diet of any developed country in the western world, and the highest incidence of heart disease,” it said.

        “One delicacy is the deep-fried chocolate bar, covered in a protective layer of batter, and favoured by the nation’s school children.”

        “Who writes this garbage?” I groaned.

        My wife grabbed the volume, eager to read the text which had so upset me.

        Favourite snack

        “Yes I remember that on television,” she said.

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  • #
    Richard+Jenkins

    The mayor of Wagga Wagga was going to drive an EV to Sydney and back to prove his point.
    I would love to know what happned.
    The proposal was MSM NEWS. WHAT HAPPENED???

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    • #
      yarpos

      I wonder what his point was? If I was being paid by the ratepayers and had time to waste I would take that on as well. Wow! Wagga to Sydney what an epic adventure! they have such low expectations.

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      • #
        Richard+Jenkins

        His point was to justify changing council’s fleet to EV as a wortwhile expenditure.
        In metropolitan suburbs there may be some hope of charging outdoors overnight as distances are short.
        In rural shires the concept is absurd.
        Note I said charging outside as in your garage the possible fire could be more tragic.
        Note the Geelong battery fire that burned for four days. The fumes seriously toxic!

        50

    • #
      robert rosicka

      No potholes to fix around Wagga no rubbish to pickup and no bridges or parks and playgrounds to maintain an Australian first you would think .

      50

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Off for a third round of blood tests in as many weeks tomorrow and was trying to decipher the abbreviations of all the tests , looks like one of them is for COVID antibodies. A friend who had the second jab last week went home after the jab fell asleep and when they woke up couldn’t move and was paralysed for about half an hour . No booster for this one .

      50

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      Richard+Jenkins

      It seems that nothing happened.
      I suspect the car dealer and EV support industries did not want an example of what they claim being exposed.
      I doubt he would have made Sydney without a detour for a fuel stop of a few hours wait while the battery charged.
      A longer wait if another customer was ahead of him. Charge in Sydney and again on the way back to Wagga.
      I base that on the motoring journalist who could not make Canberra from Sydney.
      What they claim does not match live experiences.
      They suggest using a rug and gloves if its cold or open the windows if its hot.
      The climate control is excellent but slashes the distance range. The charging meters read in kms.???

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    David Maddison

    Apparently the mRNA COVID vaxes are useless after about 4 months so I guess everyone will need endless rounds of injections.

    And I guess every single injection of these inadequately tested vaxes carry a higher risk than the properly tested vaccines.

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    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      I take the rapid uselessness of the injections to be a positive thing. That is as long as they are not doing permanent damage before they wear off.

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    OldOzzie

    New Zealand Prime Minister Admits She Wants to Create Two Classes of Citizens Based on Vaccination Status

    New Zealand Prime Minister Jacinda Ardern admitted she wants to create two classes of citizens based on Chinese coronavirus vaccination status.

    During an interview with the NZ Herald on Friday, a reporter asked Ardern if her goal is to create two classes of citizens with New Zealand’s “traffic light” system, which Ardern unveiled Friday morning.

    “So you’ve basically said, you probably don’t see it like this, but two different classes of people — if you’re vaccinated or unvaccinated. You have all these rights if you are vaccinated —” NZ Herald‘s deputy political editor Derek Cheng asked Ardern.

    “That is what it is, yep,” Ardern replied.

    Ardern told the Herald the use of vaccine certificates is designed to make vaccinated people feel safe, even though vaccinated people are reportedly protected against severe illness.

    “Actually, what has become clear to me, is that [vaccine certificates] are not just a tool to drive up vaccines. They’re a tool for confidence,” Ardern said, without mentioning that vaccinated people can also carry and spread the virus. “People who have been vaccinated will want to know that they are around other vaccinated people. They’ll want to know that they are in a safe environment.”

    New Zealand, which has only reported 28 Chinese coronavirus deaths since the pandemic began, has enforced some of the “tightest pandemic restrictions among OECD nations,” Reuters reported. Despite that fact, the country has been experiencing an outbreak, with nearly 2,500 cases reported out of a population of 5 million.

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      OldOzzie

      ‘Your six months is up’: Daniel Andrews hints boosters will be needed to keep fully vaccinated freedoms

      Victorians may soon be required to get a third booster shot or lose their fully vaccinated freedoms, with a message warning them before their “six months is up”.

      Daniel Andrews suggested on Sunday that going forward, life for the vaccinated would “be about the maintenance of your vaccination status”.

      The Victorian Premier made the comments ahead of a meeting of the medical regulator on Monday that could see third doses of Pfizer’s Covid-19 vaccine offered to the general public as early as the end of next week.

      The Therapeutic Goods Administration (TGA) and the federal government’s vaccine advisory body, the Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisation (ATAGI), are considering booster shots for everyone six months after their second dose.

      “I hope, and we’ll play our part in this, like a month before your six months is up, then you will get a message and your vaccination certificate, the thing that gets you the green tick, you’ll be prompted to go and book a time to go and have your booster shot,” Mr Andrews said.

      “There may be state clinics in that or it might be all done through GPs and pharmacies, that hasn’t been worked through yet. We’re happy to play our part, though. So it’ll be about the maintenance of your vaccination status.”

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        Forrest Gardener

        It’s just polly speak. He’s just telling the world how benevolent he is as a dictator by saving the people from themselves.

        They haven’t even managed to convince shop keepers to be injection police yet. Judging by the civil disobedience being displayed on mask wearing I think it will fail.

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    David Maddison

    In my relatively limited circle of friends I know of the following covid vaccine issues:

    1) A very fit and healthy, daily swimmer medical doctor in early sixties died in swimming pool and paramedics and hospital could not revive after two hours resuscitation effort.

    2) Female mother, early thirties, healthy, in hospital for two weeks with heart issues after taking the vax. Cardiac ward was already full with other cases so they placed her in a dementia ward.

    3) Double vaxxed male, early sixties, healthy, has contracted covid.

    I wish the media, the government, the medical establishment and the Left were being open and honest about these issues.

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      David Maddison

      I should have stated for (1) the issue was heart failure several days after taking the second vaxx shot.

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      Ross

      My 91 year old father passed away in June. His aged care facility went through the whole of 2020 without “losing” a resident. Thanks to better COVID infection controls, less unscheduled visitors etc etc. Within probably 1 month of receiving their first COVID vaccine back in January this year there were 4 deaths in quick succession at the facility. My father also developed a mysterious “cold”. Congestion etc which persisted for months which led to loss of appetite, lethargy etc etc. Because of COVID lockdowns etc we were not able to visit. He then suffered a massive heart attack and died. His death certificate doesn’t state any complications following the COVID vaccine – which was AZ. But we had prior knowledge because 2 years ago he had the annual flu shot which also put him in hospital with fluid management problems. However, he thought best to take the COVID vaccine. I’m sure that pattern was duplicated at a lot of AC facilities Australia wide but due to lower deaths in 2020 any adverse trend is probably hidden in the mortality stats.

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        Analitik

        I’m sorry for your loss.

        And the health authorities and MSM will continue to deny that there are serious problems with the CoViD vaccines. Excess mortalities in 2021 is going to be quite significant and well in excess of CoViD deaths yet Rick Will put it all on to CoViD and Gee, I think someone else will back him up.

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      Broadie

      Maybe there is another way to achieve natural immunity without these dreadful outcomes for some of those receiving the experimental treatment.

      Apparently you can recover quickly from what may have been one of the worst cases of Covid ever!!! This chap was clearly recovering and showing the common symptoms of those with a positive covid test. He was attempting to escape to possibly go to Bunnings, the Gym and have coffee. Common symptoms of an infected individual in Australia.

      Remember only last week?

      He was Soooooo!!!! Siiiiiick!!!! and now the un-vaxxed man (modern day un-dead equivalent) attempts to escape hospital and is placed under Police Guard.

      The Mystery deepens! How sick was he? Did he escape on a gurney with an accomplice to a waiting ambulance? to be medi-vacced to Bunnings?

      from MYGC.com.au

      Gold Coast COVID-19 patient allegedly tries to flee hospital
      October 25, 2021 8:07 am in Gold Coast by Shanee Dobeson

      A Gold Coast man who sparked the city’s latest COVID-19 scare has reportedly tried to escape the virus ward at the Gold Coast University Hospital.

      Duran Raman is allegedly under police guard in hospital after sparking the security scare overnight, but police are yet to confirm any details.

      It comes as authorities reveal the 36-year-old’s condition is improving after testing positive last week.

      He’s now understood to be in a stable condition but is still displaying symptoms of the virus.

      The vocal anti-vaxxer, who remains under investigation for allegedly breaching border rules, has been so unwell officials have been unable to gather any information from him.

      He is believed to have acquired the virus while on a recent trip to Sydney and Melbourne, with mystery surrounding how he managed to cross the border back into Queensland without going into quarantine.

      Investigations are continuing, but no charges or fines have been laid.

      No further cases have been linked to the man.

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      Philip

      Everyone I know is vaccinated, I’m the only one not. No issues with any of them. Except, my mothers blood pressure skyrocketed and they monitored her for two hours before sending her home, not too well for another day, back to doctor for check and she was fine after that. Second shot no issue. AZ.

      So I like to hear of other experiences because my experience makes me think its all fine some times and diminishes my skepticism.

      95% vaccinated in my LGA NSW.

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        MP

        And nobody I know has got sick let alone die from the virus, 100%.

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        RickWill

        So I like to hear of other experiences because my experience makes me think its all fine some times and diminishes my skepticism.

        I know the vaccination status of between 50 and 100 people. The vaccines are not risk free. And there appears to be little difference in the risk with the different types. I am in the older group and suffered some dizziness the morning after the first shot. It was like standing up quickly after resting from heavy exercise. Five days after the second jab I felt queasy for two days. Both were AZ.

        I know a 42yo male who visited a doctor after suffering shingles immediately following both Moderna jabs – it is recognised reaction. I know a 41yo, obese woman who spent a night in hospital under observation after first jab. Have not heard anything about the second jab for her.

        About half of the people I know have not experienced much. Most are aware of some body response but a few nothing at all. As a general trend older people, say 70+, seem to suffer more but the most severe response was in the two 40+yo olds. I know of a 90+yo old woman who had no effect.

        My middle son is a physician who worked in two of the large Melbourne hospitals during the first wave. He was the first to alert me to the dominance of a certain religious faith in the first Melbourne wave – and more from Central African origin than Middle East. He simply said that no one wants to get this virus after that experience. He was meticulous with his PPE to the point of not changing out of it for any breaks up to 14 hour shifts. He has taken Vitamin D supplements since he has worked in hospitals because he has limited ability to get into sunlight due to the job and ongoing study. He got AZ jabs as soon as they were available.

        His view on alternative treatments is – why bother. The vaccines are clearly effective, free, simple to administer and relatively safe.

        Russians and Eastern Europeans have the greatest vaccine hesitancy – far worse than USA – and they are now reaching record death rate as they try to open up with 30% vaccinated.

        In Melbourne, still more than 90% of those in ICU are unvaccinated and that is from only 20% of the population not yet fully vaccinated.

        My son is doing a 3 month period in rural Victoria where there are currently very few Covid cases. He is not looking forward to coming back into a Melbourne hospital if cases are in the high hundreds. He has to take leave in any case and might make the most of that to avoid the worst in Melbourne.

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    • #
      MichaelinBrisbane

      A “female mother”?

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    • #
      KP

      Friend of mine runs a BICOM machine, very good for diagnostics of past illnesses that still have subtle effects. She says most of her clients who felt a change after the vax had old diseases re-occur, but some who were suffering from conditions like Lupus said they suddenly felt better for a few days, no pain, lots of energy…

      Its a shame we can’t correlate all the effects people have had without propaganda from both sides muddying the water.

      She has had both shots, as has her family, but her university-student son was the only one with a bad effect- collapsed that night and had to go to hospital for observation.

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  • #
    Maptram

    But then the BOM is comparing apples with oranges. The BOM has closed quite a few sites and opened others from the early 1990s onwards. One example is Noona. As far as I can tell Noona is a roadside stop about 80 km wet of Cobar airport on the barrier highway. It’s an AWS that records temperature and not much else. First temperatures recorded were on 20 Aug 2017 and the maximum temperature recorded was 47.5°C on 10 Jan 2020. How many other places like Noona has the BOM opened since 1990?

    And then you mention BOM forecasts. Cobar is a good place to look at the BOM’s record with forecasts. The BOM has two weather stations at Cobar, Cobar Meteorological Office (Cobar MO) and Cobar Airport AWS. The MO started recording in 1962 and the airport started recording in 1993. The airport is about 7km south west of the MO. The forecasts that the BOM provides for Cobar seem to be an average, so often with actual temperatures, one location is above the forecast and the other is below.

    Then there is Deniliquin. Deniliquin Visitors centre site operated from the 1850s until 2003. Deniliquin Airport AWS opened in 1997, with first records in June 1997. so there is some overlap in the records for the years 1998 to 2003. For January in four of the five years, Airport average temperatures were higher than Visitors Centre temperatures. For Cobar the January average maximum from 1994 to 2021 is higher at the airport than the MO.

    The Cobar records also show that, for January 1994 to 2021, average Cobar airport temperatures are higher than average MO temperatures.

    From 1990 onwards the BOM has opened a number of sites often at airports, and closed a number of other sites. So how do the mean temperature increases you refer to incorporate the possibility that they could be due to change of sites and inclusion of hotter sites, rather than caused the increasing CO2 or some other weather factors

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    Travis T. Jones

    Pretty sure any trust you had was thrown under the bus when you did the no-spine triple-pike-out from your previous position …

    25 October, 2021, ScoMo: “Only the Coalition can be trusted to deliver a plan to achieve net zero emissions by 2050 that will protect and promote rural and regional Australia.”

    Nationals agree to net zero target by 2050 despite Barnaby Joyce’s opposition

    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2021/oct/24/nationals-agree-to-net-zero-target-by-2050-despite-barnaby-joyces-opposition

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  • #
    Furiously+Curious

    I get the feeling that the change in public perceptions on climate doom, is due to the pummelling the public psyche has been given over covid, and it has spilled over into climate? When we have bent to the tidal wave of fear, and ‘safe and effective’, I think we are very well prepared to take in the narrative of, ‘rising seas, bushfires, heat waves, cyclones, catastrophe, and doom, ‘. We have been well prepared.

    People were asking earlier in the thread for answers they could give to the climate change stand point. There aren’t any; arguments are so set, facts have no purchase! At best you can ask awkward questions, get them into detail, where at least they have to step out of their general fact’s fortress. And still you cant supply alternative facts. It just becomes,’ if it’s not what I heard on the ABC, it is evil’. Good luck.

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    • #
      Ross

      I think you have to separate the hype leading up to COP 26 from the normal debate regarding Climate Change we have been having for years. I’m not sure it has hit its zenith yet either. I expect during the actual proceedings is when all the social media bots and MSM will go into top gear. It’s when Labor and the Greens will probably utter the most ridiculous claims about our weather and climate and I’m sure there will be a few LNP pollies as well. Its like federal election time in Australia- that’s when I used to turn the idiot box off for 2 weeks preceding the election day. Listen to podcasts as I drove around. Avoid the ABC at all costs. Do you think average Joe in the street in Namibia or Peru or Siberia are concerned about COP 26? I expect they have never heard of it. For some reason in Australia we publicise these events.

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        Graeme No.3

        Ross,
        Australia is one of a few countries to carryout its agreements and make substational reductions in CO2 emissions (at least in electricity generation). We cp a battering because it is the hope that more blood can be squeezed from the stone.

        As I’ve just posted on The Australian “It’s a Crusade! Never mind the facts, just have faith and resolve and Heaven on Earth will come, or possibly not. The Dark One (coal) will vanish, along with the unbelievers, and all the world will bask in endless sunlight and gentle zephyrs, and if electric cars run out of power there will always be unicorns to draw the coach.” Any bets on that comment being accepted?

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  • #
    David Maddison

    COVID is allowing a lot of Leftists release their “inner fascist” such as by extreme lockdown measures, extreme penalties for the most trivial violations, extreme travel restrictions, a police commander in Vicdanistan instructed police to “break some skulls”, the destruction of small business and many social relationships, suicides, enforced experimental medical treatments (covid “vaccines”), unprecedented and un-Australian violence by police against peaceful protestors and numerous other issues.

    In general the creation of a two or mukti-tier society with the Leftist Elites at the top of course.

    It’s been a dream run for everything the Left believe in.

    Beyond that, many Leftists are now advocating that the untermenschen (the unvaxxed) should not be eligible for medical treatment for covid or any other unrelated issue.

    This raises an interesting ethical question. Traditionally medicine has never discriminated against people who abuse their bodies or engage in risky behaviour such as illegal drug taking, extreme sports, motorcycle riding, doing stupid things etc. Everyone had equal and non-judgemental access to the medical system.

    Besides all that, the Left banned possibly effective alternative covid treatments such as anti-virals and monoclonal antibody treatment in Australia is highly restricted (only something like 7000 doses were ordered).

    Whether people decide to get the covid vax or not, people ought not be responsible for the protection of others. People are responsible for their own health which means you get vaxed if you think that protects you, or not if you have safety concerns. Your neighbour is not responsible for you. If you don’t want to get infected, with or without the vax, then just stay at home.

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      OldOzzie

      But Gordon. If you are vaccinated, why would you be afraid of the unvaccinated? After all, that’s why we get vaccinated in the first place, isn’t it? I get the influenza vaccination every year, but I’m not afraid of or have anything against people who aren’t vaccinated. And influenza can be just as fatal as covid. So what’s the problem?

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        Forrest Gardener

        Eventually the populace will come to the realization that the “vaccines” are not worthy of the name.

        Before that happens the powers that be have another round of propaganda to go in the form of booster injections.

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          David Maddison

          I wonder how long boosters every 4 months will be considered acceptable, and what damage they may do to the body?

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            Forrest Gardener

            Agreed. The long term damage is the potential horror scenario. There are anecdotes about people suddenly succumbing to cancer and other serious illness.

            Hopefully these anecdotes will turn out to be coincidences but three or four months will provide enough anecdotes for the authorities to perform either a genuine analysis or a cover up.

            Imagine the repercussions if after all the happy clapping and not so veiled threats it turns out that these injections are doing permanent damage.

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    • #
      MP

      Left?
      The government is right, but they are all in this together.

      It is not the “wing” it is the bird.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    Unvaccinated tennis players will be welcome at the Australian Open but unvaccinated Australians will not be able to attend.

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    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Sooner or later the question will turn to infected and non-infected. Just don’t hold your breath waiting. Especially when governments are slow walking rapid flow self testing and antivirals.

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    • #
      Philip

      Very telling policy that one.

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      Hanrahan

      Last weekend’s US GP [that’s Formula 1 for the non-rev-heads] had unrestricted entry. I think they had 400,000 attendance. The rest of the world wonders why the Australian Open is still one of the four Grand Slam tennis events, why Melbourne should host an F1 event if the circus isn’t welcome.

      We have a lot to lose.

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      • #
        Hanrahan

        We have a lot to lose.

        Vic has a lot to lose on our behalf.

        Forgot to mention that was in The Lone Star State.

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    Robber

    So Australia is now going to sign up to net zero by 2050, but without a costed roadmap to get there.

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  • #
    John Connor II

    Beyond Covid – the global agenda

    The death by starvation of Etwariya Devi, a 67-year-old widow from the rural Indian state of Jharkhand, might have passed without notice had it not been part of a more widespread trend.

    Like 1.3 billion of her fellow Indians, Devi had been pushed to enroll in a biometric digital ID system called Aadhaar in order to access public services, including her monthly allotment of 25kg of rice. When her fingerprint failed to register with the shoddy system, Devi was denied her food ration. Throughout the course of the following three months in 2017, she was repeatedly refused food until she succumbed to hunger, alone in her home.

    For those yearning for an end to pandemic-related restrictions, credential programs certifying their vaccination against Covid-19 have been marketed as the key to reopening the economy and restoring their personal freedom. But the implementation of immunity passports is also accelerating the establishment of a global digital identity infrastructure.

    As the military surveillance firm and NATO contractor Thales recently put it, vaccine passports “are a precursor to digital ID wallets.”

    https://www.blacklistednews.com/article/81052/public-health-or-private-wealth-how-digital-vaccine-passports-pave-way-for-unprecedented.html

    By now most informed people know of the ever shrinking supply chain, vaccine induced labour shortages and collapsing agricultural production, both orchestrated and natural. Full blown global communism, total surveillance and food production control & rationing is the objective at least in most western countries.
    It will fail as it has done every time in history such control was attempted but not without the human suffering that always accompanies such delusional power grabs.

    [Spelling corrected. – Jo]

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    John Connor II

    How trick syringes work.

    https://va.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_r1bwg1Xf1v1qeow88.mp4

    Of course Biden never got a real shot!
    Let’s get our Aussie political “leaders” out in a public event and injected by the same baaxines given to the public.
    I’ll pay for both the shots and an independent doctor to administer them.
    Hands up any interested pollies.
    Crickets…

    10

  • #
    David Maddison

    Most present politicians will be retired in 20 years so they don’t care.

    Plus, Australia will likely not be a viable or governable country by then. It will be like Venezuela. Nothing will matter.

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    • #
      David Maddison

      That was a reply to Robber.

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    • #
      Dennis

      Until our elected representatives find the intestinal fortitude to tell us the truth about global politics, climate hoax and related emissions reductions including now net zero emissions, and the wealth creation activities based on emissions deception and unnatural climate change claims, we can only suspect that most of them are players, fellow travellers representing the leftists and their agendas.

      We are never really consulted, are we.

      UN treaties, agreements, protocols and other meant to impress us titles are signed overseas, legislated here and regulations introduced to implement these impositions and intrusion into sovereignty of the nation and have been, hundreds of them, not all necessarily bad but many hidden in the pile are definitely not what the average centre of the political spectrum Australian would agree to support. In fact migrants on the whole are even more conservative and many arrive with the experiences of totalitarian regimes and fear a repeat here in Australia.

      What about constitutional laws, referendums?

      It appears that the present Federal Government does not intend to release an economic statement so that we can assess net zero emissions by 2050 impacts on national prosperity.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    Does anyone have insight into why housing prices are among the highest ever in Australia and the US?

    It doesn’t make sense.

    In both places the economies are in a disastrous state although we haven’t experienced the full extent of the disaster because both economies are being propped up with unprecedented government borrowing.

    The interest rates are currently low but are people not aware they will eventually go up again?

    Something strange is going on.

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      Dennis

      The history relating to the Sydney Basin (ocean one side, Blue Mountains behind and National Parks South and North including the Hawkesbury River and housing prices rising is typical lack of supply and demand exceeding available stock. This began soon after the Carr Labor State Government of NSW took office in 1990 and a decision to restrict release of public lands for development, the rationale (ridiculous in my view) was to limit the settlement of migrants and encourage them to settle elsewhere.

      When the Liberal-National Coalition took over after sixteen years of Labor they quickly released public lands and fast tracked development applications through Local Government Councils that were encouraged to cooperate. Since that time building and construction projects have been many and to the point where qualified trades people are in short supply, and accordingly paid high hourly rates.

      The rundown by Labor State Government TAFE system in NSW was another factor impacting adversely on the building and construction industry labour shortages. Some might remember the threats from the Federal Liber-National Howard Government to open Federal TAFE centres? Apprentices at that time were mucked around by the TAFE system in decline, qualified builders I know were sent to different TAFE centres every year or even for terms within a year.

      Add to this the not well publicised immigration policy including resettling refugees sent from UNHCR refugee camps overseas, from memory reaching over 200,000 migrants some years and up to 20,000 refugee migrants. That’s a lot of people requiring housing. But add their demands for government services and infrastructure expansion, and the costs involved, and then the cost to society as Australian born people suffered problems gaining access to government services such as hospitals due to overcrowding. Education has been hit hard, Labor when in NSW Government sold many public schools and land. Schools populations rise and fall as young families grow older, and then young families begin the cycle again so schools should not be sold but recycled.

      But the services problems add to the housing pressures as people seek to live where services including transport are available and efficient.

      Then consider the foreign investment particularly in the inner suburbs where universities and colleges are located, wealthy Hong Kong Chinese families were buying inner city home units and even houses for their student children to live in, and as a safe low risk investment for their money.

      There are many Sydney suburbs that have large wealthy migrant Asian populations and the real estate pricing has risen with demand from them which forces not so well off people to move to outer suburbs. And the inflation of dwelling prices then occurs where cheaper housing used to be.

      Another reason that comes to mind is the very low interest rates on term deposits and other cash security investments, real estate offers capital gain and security more often than not, the old “bricks & mortar” theory.

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      • #
        Dennis

        More recently from my observations and family looking to purchase property along the Mid North Coast of NSW people escaping COVID-19 city life have pushed prices higher than I can remember them being, people who might have a “modest” $2-3 million Sydney suburban home will unfortunately pay a premium price apparently because the money is on paper and in their mind something like Monopoly game money.

        They apparently do little research and buy on impulse, nice views, nice location, etc.

        It has not been unusual for a house on a small acreage that was first on the market for under $900,000 to sell for $1,100,000 or higher, $400,000 becomes $500,000 plus for small blocks of land and a house.

        I also wonder about the inevitable interest rate rises but according to the RBA they have no plan to raise the official rate before 2023.

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      yarpos

      Is the real economy as bad as you think? Many have worked all through this period, our 3 kids have just by virtue of what they do. Son bought a house 4 months ago in a regional centre and got out of Melb. I think its very patchy.

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    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Several factors.
      From what little I’ve heard there haven’t been many properties built recently.
      This means strong competition for short supply considering there are always those homes that need to be retired due to age.
      Also, would you rather put your money in a bank or in a solid asset like a liveable home.

      Homes are less exposed to pilfering from the Wall Street crowd; shares- super are more vulnerable.

      A major factor could also be the normal housing pricing anomaly.
      In the past property has often not kept place with inflation and when everything finally has to get to where it should be there’s a sudden jump. The jump seems big but it’s just a catchup that’s been delayed.

      10

      • #
        Dennis

        Don’t listen to Labor spin, my son is a builder and at present on a house project in Sydney and has commented about how difficult it is to locate qualified trades people because the demand is very high because of the continuing building boom.

        On the Mid North Coast new housing estates and retirement villages are going up everywhere, take a drive around Newcastle and areas surrounding areas too.

        20

        • #
          Kalm Keith

          Just the last month in NovoCastria there’s been a sudden rash of demolitions of old houses and new starts coming soon.
          On the other side I hear that commercial building is slow.

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    Philip

    One reason Im reluctant to get vaccinated is I have slightly high blood pressure at the moment and I know when my mother got vaccinated with AZ, her blood pressure went through the roof. Should something go wrong with that, if I died or even survived a heart attack, no one would care less and you’d be written off as a minor statistic. That somehow doesn’t sit well with me.

    They have an argument to win, and you’re not getting in the way, in fact you’ll be specifically made irrelevant. Ever heard the PM give tribute to those who sacrificed their lives for the greater good ? Ever heard them say they’re insignificant ? Yes.

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  • #
    TedM

    Florida’s surgeon general speaking about the vaccines. From a surgeon general this is compelling.

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1452309002021388296

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    Dennis

    Here are statistics published in The Australian today: M”A sobering perspective on ‘net zero by 2050’ written by Ticky Fullerton …

    “The world gets 83 per cent of its energy from fossils. For the Middle East that number is 99 per cent, Australia 91 per cent, China 87 per cent, the US 83 per cent. Germany spent 20 years turning itself green but it is still 78 per cent fossil fuels.”

    “Since the first global climate meting in 1992, the world has only achieved a drop from 87 per cent to 83 per cent fossil fuels.”

    In other words COP 26 in Glasgow will be another exercise in futility.

    That’s if the organisers really were concerned about unnatural climate and weather variations. But we know they are not, UN Officials like Christiana Figureres have admitted that the real objective is to wreck ‘capitalism’ as the world has known it, free enterprise free markets private sectors.

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    David Maddison

    Excellent. Only 2 min 20 sec for those interested.

    In the Red States, America has some excellent politicians and other leadership such as that Surgeon General.

    His name is Joseph Ladapo.

    The Left hate him and not just because he’s a black conservative.

    He has a medical degree plus Phd from Harvard.

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    David Maddison

    https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/frances-le-pen-says-she-will-take-down-wind-turbines-if-she-is-elected-2021-10-14/

    October 15, 202112:02 AM AEDT
    Last Updated 11 days ago

    France’s Le Pen says she will take down wind turbines if elected

    By Geert De Clercq

    PARIS, Oct 14 (Reuters) – French far-right presidential candidate Marine Le Pen said on Thursday she would end all subsidies for renewable energy and take down France’s wind turbines if she is elected next year.

    Le Pen, who will be the candidate of the Rassemblement National party in the April vote, made it to the second round of the 2017 election, and is expected to do so again, although some recent polls have shown that right-wing talk-show star Eric Zemmour could best her if he decides to run.

    “Wind and solar, these energies are not renewable, they are intermittent. If I am elected, I will put a stop to all construction of new wind parks and I will launch a big project to dismantle them,” she said on RTL radio.

    She added that she would scrap the subsidies for wind and solar, which she said added up to six or seven billion euros per year.

    See link for rest.

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    David Maddison

    All those Lefties and their private jets at COP 26…

    https://www.glasgowtimes.co.uk/news/19631775.park-private-jet-according-glasgow-cop26-guide/

    7 October 21More News >

    Where to park your private jet, according to Glasgow COP26 guide

    By Lauren Brownlie 

    TWO airports that cater to private jets are listed on a COP26 guide for participants arriving in the UK. 

    The United Nations Climate Change Conference will be held in Glasgow between October 31 and November 12.

    And in a guide for participants, which will include more than 100 world leaders, a list of airports in which they should fly into has been set out. 

    This includes Farnborough Airport and Biggin Hill Airport, both in England, which cater exclusively to private jets.

    Last week, Extinction Rebellion activists claim to have blocked all major entrances to Farnborough Airport in Hampshire, with a stretched limousine parked at the gates as part of the protest.

    The protesters, including a former airline pilot, are raising awareness of the emissions caused by private flights.

    Footage posted by the group appears to show activists using wire cutters to break into the grounds through a perimeter fence. 

    An Extinction Rebellion spokesman said: “As world leaders gather for the COP26 climate summit in Glasgow this month, protesters are calling on the world’s super-rich elite of celebrities, oligarchs and business leaders to ditch private flights.

    “These private flyers, just 1% of the world’s population, cause half of aviation’s global emissions. Extinction Rebellion is also demanding the Government stops private flights now.”

    The other airports listed include Heathrow Airport, Gatwick Airport, London City Airport, Birmingham Airport, Bristol Airport, Aberdeen Airport, Edinburgh Airport, and Glasgow Airport.

    A COP26 spokesperson said: “If we are to deliver for our planet, we need all countries and civil society to bring their ideas and ambition to Glasgow.

    “Sustainability is at the core of COP26. The UK will be offsetting all carbon emissions associated with running the event and working closely with sustainability experts to do so.”

    SEE LINK FOR REST

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    Dennis

    So batteries are the future solution to natural climate change?

    What about the environment?

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-10-25/electric-car-solar-battery-storage-waste-recycling/100564234

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    • #
      robert rosicka

      Sorry Dennis I missed your comment and added another about this at the end of the thread , Surely the ABC aren’t having a go at batteries now ? There is something up at the ABC .

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    Brenda Spence

    Petition to reverse the ban on ivermectin

    https://www.aph.gov.au/e-petitions/petition/EN3364/

    Closes 27th

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    David Maddison

    The woke Age sacked Leunig for an anti Dan Andrews cartoon.

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    David Maddison

    The BS just never ends….

    https://www.skynews.com.au/opinion/climate-conference-leaders-now-engineering-the-way-we-eat/video/0cd888351925cd46244a9338fcfc5f38

    Climate conference leaders now ‘engineering the way we eat’

    18 hours ago

    Sky News host Chris Smith says climate conference leaders are now “engineering the way we eat” after reports in the United Kingdom there is a push at Glasgow to cut global beef production.

    Senior members of the Nationals Party “are understandably alarmed” at the potential for a push to “cut global beef production and encourage plant-based diets, to further reduce carbon emissions”.

    “There are also passages in the COP 26 text, describing beef, as a ‘high carbon’ food, and they’re even rallying support for an international ‘Meatless Monday’,” Mr Smith said.

    Mr Smith said the move would be “ridiculous and invasive” and instead of a change in diet, agricultural technology should be championed by climate change advocates.

    “It’s technology which can help nations reach these targets, not dumb and divisive orders about what we can eat and not eat.”

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      Serp

      Zealotry without limit, there really is no way for this to end of its own accord.

      Today we live in a world where all our leaders are acting ultra vires through the artifice of emergency powers which has proved itself the tool of choice for dictatorship and will have the unvaccinated obliged to proceed outdoors on all fours, well I’m guessing that, but great indignity will be imposed.

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    David Maddison

    This is an interview with the last Nuremberg Trials prosecutor still living. He is 101 years old.

    https://youtu.be/_FLMRa9WOh4

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  • #
    David Maddison

    This video (link below) is a very good rebuttal to Leftists who say we should stop eating meat and start eating plants and insects in order to “save the planet”.

    To date there have not been very many comprehensive rebuttals about the supposed inappropriate land, water and energy use and “carbon” (sic) pollution supposedly created by raising tasty animals to BBQ for human consumption.

    https://youtu.be/sGG-A80Tl5g

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  • #
    Peter C

    Some Good News for Yonnie, I hope!

    “Australia Post Victoria drops mandate. Workers no longer have to get Jabs!”

    I saw this on Cafe Locked Out. I am not sure how to look it up myself.

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    • #
      Yonniestone.

      Yes its true for now we got the news the day before his so called mandate deadline as we’re Commonwealth employees but the contractors had to but maybe that’s changed also, IMO the big driver to override the state decision was the legal liability for any damages from the vaccine that is essentially forced upon the employees.

      From a rough survey at work I’d say well over 80% got the vaccine against their wishes just to keep their jobs, I’m just disgusted with the country I once loved.

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    Serp

    Found this in comments on MichaelSmith https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2021/10/anti-dan-vax-cartoon-from-a-murdoch-newspaper-which-still-allows-them.html

    “John Smith said…
    “Your not ever ‘fully vaccinated’ … You never will be!!!

    “Re read and let that it sink in???

    “How many ‘SHOTS’ before you succumb?”

    and thought it worth sharing here.

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  • #
    el+gordo

    North Eastern America enjoys summer conditions well into Autumn and its being caused by a mysterious block.

    ‘Typically, blocked or stuck patterns that are not coupled to the stratosphere (and this one, as far as I can tell is not) last up to three weeks or so. This blocked or stuck pattern looks to be at least double that in duration. I can’t explain the tenacity of this pattern and not sure if it is being prolonged by coupling to the surface (water temperatures are well above normal in Hudson Bay, Baffin Bay and the Labrador Sea, but I do wonder if it can possibly persist long enough to ensure a mild start to winter in the Eastern US but especially Eastern Canada. .’ (Judah Cohen AER)

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    Anton

    Great satire by a man called Gary North:

    What is the longest-running socialist experiment? What has its success been?

    If someone asked you to defend the idea that socialism has failed, what would you offer as your example?

    Where did modern socialism begin?

    In America.

    That’s right: in the land of the free and the home of the braves. On Indian reservations.

    It was invented to control adult warriors. It had as a goal to keep the native population in poverty and impotent.

    Did the system work? You bet it did.

    Has the experiment been a failure? On the contrary, it has been a success.

    When was the last time you heard of a successful Indian uprising?

    Are the people poor? The poorest in America.

    Are they on the dole? Of course.

    Last year, the U.S. Department of Agriculture allocated $21 million to provide subsidized electricity to residents on the reservations whose homes are the most distant from jobs and opportunities. This will keep them poor. Tribal power means tribal impotence.

    The tribes are dependent. They will stay dependent. That was what the program was designed to achieve.

    For some reason, textbooks do not offer a page or two on the corruption, the bureaucratization, and the multi-generation poverty created by tribal-run socialism.

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      Len

      The same with our Aboriginals on their lands. No personal ownership of their houses. All based on Joseph Stalin’s book ” on the National Question”

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        Hanrahan

        The flip side of personal ownership is personal responsibility.

        So you own a boat! The gubmint man won’t fix the leaks.

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    Anton

    In fairness to Gates, Schwab etc, they probably do genuinely believe the climate scare, and what we are seeing is how influential they are. They are informed by climate scientists… US funding for climate science went up x15 in 6 years after an alarmist briefing to Congress in 1988 (on a hot day on which speaker Jim Hansen of NASA had disabled the air conditioning). Other nations boosted funding too. Applicants and science faculties doing the hiring knew the recruitment was a response to the alarm.

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    Anton

    I don’t know if this item of minutiae has reached Australia, but the rubbish collectors and train drivers in Glasgow are going on strike for COP26. Boris is furious and Nicola Sturgeon, the malevolent little ruler of devolved Scotland, is backing the strikers. Both are believers in the carbon scare. As a Brit I find it highly amusing.

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    As Reports of Deaths After COVID Vaccines Near 16,000, CDC Urges Pregnant Women to Get the Vaccine
    VAERS data released Friday by the CDC included a total of 752,803 reports of adverse events from all age groups following COVID vaccines, including 15,937 deaths and 105,758 serious injuries between Dec. 14, 2020 and Sept. 24, 2021.
    https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/vaers-cdc-deaths-injuries-covid-vaccines/

    Russell Brand: Why Are Drugmakers Who Caused Opioid Crisis in Charge of Solving the Pandemic?
    It makes sense, Brand says, that some people have doubts about allowing corporations with a history of prioritizing profits over people to be in charge of solving the pandemic.
    https://childrenshealthdefense.org/defender/russel-brand-opiod-crisis-pandemic/

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    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10131491/Covid-Australia-Victorians-fined-90-000-jailed-two-years-new-laws.

    Dan Andrews power grab: Victorians could be fined up to $90,000 and jailed for TWO YEARS just for not wearing a mask or protesting lockdown under law that allows him to invoke pandemic restrictions at will
    Premier will be able to call state of emergency at will without doctors signing off
    Pandemic restrictions can be imposed even if there are no cases in Victoria
    Anyone protesting against lockdowns or breaching mask rules faces huge fines
    Individuals can be jailed for two years or fined $90,500 for breaking new law

    All kids under 18 are exempt from vaccine requirements
    50 countries with low vax rates also qualify for exemptions, but residents need a ‘compelling’ reason to come
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10129345/Kids-18-wont-vaccinated-enter-Bidens-new-travel-restrictions.html

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