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The largest poll in Australia on Climate Change was the 2013 Abbott landslide election

Left-right morphing sides of politics.The flipping of Wentworth just marks a the morphing of the two major parties which started long ago.

The Labor Party now represents the rich and the welfare dependent. The Liberals represent the Deplorable worker and what’s left of the Middle Class and there aren’t many of those in the seat of Wentworth. Turnbull was the perfect fit for the seat as it transited from being a safe Conservative Seat to a safe Collectivist-Virtue-Signalling Seat. He was the Labor-guy badged as a Liberal. Kerryn Phelps is the “ideal” replacement — the Labor-Green candidate badged as an Independent. This made it easier for doctors-wives, lawyers and journalists to vote for an option which was essentially Labor-Green, but had the appearance of being “smarter” and above all the riff raff.

Kerryn Phelps essentially stands for a Get UP approved Labor Green Christmas Wish List: More renewable parasites, death to coal, pandering to collectivist UN committees, a ban on fossil fuel donations (but no ban for government cronies who take big-government funds and donate it to big-government parties.). She wants to restore funding to The ABC because $3m a day is not enough. Heck, they lost 5% a while back.

The vote in the wealthiest electorate in Australia is still underway, but whatever happens, it tells us nothing much about most other electorates. Should the national policy on energy change because of 1,500 voters in the wealthiest seat?

Labor calls for National Energy policy to be set by 1,500 voters in richest seat in Australia

Labor is calling on the government to embrace the National Energy Guarantee [NEG] following the Wentworth by-election result.

Thus proving that the NEG was really a Labor Policy all along.

Polls show climate and energy policy was a key factor in voters turning their backs on the government in the blue-ribbon Sydney seat on Saturday and electing independent Kerryn Phelps.

The largest poll ever done in Australia was the 2013 election where the only party ever to run in Australia on a blood oath of “no carbon tax” won 90 seats and blitzed the opposition. What’s changed since then? Electricity prices have hit bleeding point, we have more unreliable energy than ever, and watching Australian black-outs has become an international sport.

Liberals could still win the next Federal Election but almost certainly won’t

The hottest two topics in the electorate are electricity prices and immigration. If the ScoMo team grew a spine they could simply copy the Abbott tested formula. It’d be even more popular now than it was then — see Brexit, Trump and Dean.

The Jellyfish-Liberals are trying to satisfy the centre of the climate debate but polls show there is no “centre” anymore. This is the graveyard where losing teams hunt for votes. The centre used to be the place where most people were, but in the artificially polarized climate debate it’s a vacant lot now. The undecideds split long ago into the skeptic camp or the gullible feedlot.

As long as Liberals pretend wind and solar are useful, they can’t defeat the fake claims that wind and solar are cheap. So they get consigned to be the crew that “cause” expensive electricity with policy uncertainty and because they don’t support more renewables. Jellyfish Liberals are called almost the same names they would be called if they were out-and-out “deniers” of the climate religion.  Pandering to the namecallers is a losing game.

Nick Cater:Weird, wealthy Wentworth is not the real Australia

A by-election in Sydney’s eastern suburbs is no place to test the national temperature, any more than dipping your toe into a glass of chardonnay at the Bondi Trattoria can tell you if it’s warm enough for a swim.

Wentworth is a land removed from the daily struggles faced by other Australians, a place where rising electricity prices barely touch the hip-pocket nerve, where God’s own airconditioner blows gently off summer waters, and “action” on climate change, by which they mean “subsidies”, boosts the share portfolio.

Few Wentworth residents could tell you the price of petrol, just as few know the full horror of the word “commute”…

It is home to 210 surgeons but not a single animal slaughterer. If you live in Wentworth, your meat is boned elsewhere.

Wentworth is home to 731 of them [journalists], the third highest concentration in the country, beaten only by the neighbouring seats of Sydney (962) and Grayndler (837).

The Wentworth result shows people are sick of both big parties. But it tells us nothing about solving the energy crisis or changing the climate.

*Headline changed. It was “Labor calls for National Energy policy to be set by 1,500 voters in richest seat in Australia” but after watching the ABC repeat how “polls show” voters care about climate change, the more important message was the line about the 2013 election.

VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 9.9/10 (83 votes cast)
The largest poll in Australia on Climate Change was the 2013 Abbott landslide election, 9.9 out of 10 based on 83 ratings

Tiny Url for this post: http://tinyurl.com/yct9x86r

272 comments to The largest poll in Australia on Climate Change was the 2013 Abbott landslide election

  • #
    Dave

    And 653 ABC Journalists & Staff!
    And 885 Goldman Sachs Investors in renewable energy!

    Yup!

    This is typical Australia!

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    • #
      Dave

      OH! And ONE Alex Turnbull!

      170

      • #
        Dennis

        The Keshik Capital Pte Singapore guy, the investment business that acquired shares in failing Infrigen Energy Australia, the unreliable energy company that shareholders benefited from a substantial increase in share value following Australian Government additional support for “the transition to renewable energy”.

        That guy.

        260

        • #
          Originalsteve

          Fiddling around the edges….

          While its good to have competition, its not addressing the core problem.

          https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/government-s-default-energy-price-to-save-consumers-up-to-832-a-year-20181022-p50b9s.html

          “Australians will be promised new laws to slash up to $832 from their annual electricity bills in another federal government move to toughen rules for big energy companies and demonstrate action on household costs.

          Energy Minister Angus Taylor will outline new laws to set a default offer price for millions of consumers, in a long-awaited response to calls from regulators for the new mechanism to put pressure on suppliers.

          Mr Taylor will promise the default offer will ensure customers are not being “exploited” because they stay on the standing offer from their suppliers rather than shopping around for a better deal.

          The Australian Energy Regulator will begin work “immediately” to set the default offer price in each state, according to the draft statement to be issued on Tuesday.

          The government will also act on a recommendation from the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission to set a “reference bill” for each state or distribution region, making it easier for customers to compare offers from different suppliers.”

          30

  • #
    William

    Just sitting here, shining my baseball bat.
    And counting the days until I get to use it.
    The “Liberals” are done, dusted and buried. Just Zombies that haven’t fallen over yet.
    Australia will have two or three terms of Labor; a total collapse of the economy, and then our grandchildren will have the long climb back to sanity.
    That is assuming the indoctrination they are now getting will have worn off by then.

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    • #
      wal1957

      Agreed William.
      I posted on STT that we indeed did want to get rid of Malcolm, BUT we also wanted a change in policy direction. That has not occurred. The Libs are still having 2 bob each way. They need to grow some cojones and stand up for what they believe in. If they want to grow renewables, then so be it, but make the decision.

      The Libs have definitely lost my vote for the next election no matter who is the leader.

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      • #
        wal1957

        BTW I am not saying that they should endorse the renewable gravy train, I’m suggesting that they should revert to Abbott style policy.

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      • #
        Robdel

        Agreed too. Make your vote count by concentrating on the Senate. That is the only way to block the worst of GreenLabor depradations.

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        • #
          PeterPetrum

          Yes go for Barnardi’s Australian Conservatives in the Senate – it is our only hope in the very dire set of circumstances we are in now and it will only get worse. Morrison will not “do an Abbott”.

          100

          • #
            Environment Skeptic

            A “Collective Qualification”. “The Russians did it.” Implies that every Russian in the geographical location called Russia dropped what they were doing collectively to do what was allegedly done.
            A “Collective Qualification”. “Japan leads the world in whale research”…Exactly who in Japan is leading the entire world which is also struggling every day to further the exacting knowledge, but alas, the entire country of Japan leads the world in whale research.
            A “Collective Qualification.” “Girls just want to have fun.” This implies that ‘all’ girls want to have fun.
            A “Collective Qualification”. China is building coal fired power stations. This implies that all of china is building power stations.
            A “Collective Qualification”. Labour wants to submit to the greens

            What i describe as the ‘collective qualification’ is just one of the many reason our chief means of communication is of such poor quality, and deteriorating by the day.
            From: https://www.gurdjieff.org/excerpts3.htm
            “For an exact study, an exact language is needed. For an exact study, an exact … An inexact speech cannot serve an exact knowledge.”

            An inexact political language cannot serve any exact political study.

            00

            • #
              Environment Skeptic

              I continue to remain a skeptic with respect to the way in which our political system, and the language that is now fully ‘bon-ton’ as it were, seeks to find an exact political direction of any kind in the current highly inexact environment.. :)

              00

    • #
      Albert

      When Labor takes over they will have to roll back NDIS and the new fund for sexual abuse victims as they wreck the economy and start up the boats. Labor followers don’t know how good we got it now and the next experiment will fail again as they all do then LNP will be elected to save us again and to stop the boats. People smugglers would be laughing in the streets as they collect about $1 million per boat and many of the victims are children calling out to their parents under the night sky as they drown

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      • #
        Dennis

        It angers me when refugee advocates and like minded politicians, and maybe soon to be Member for Wentworth, demand that detainees be brought to Australia.

        The US has just rejected about 150 from Nauru considered on a swap basis in cooperation with the Australian Government. Why were they rejected, and why would we accept them if the US wont?

        Offshore detention was one of the Pacific Solution deterrents used to stop the boats, to process people smuggler clients who arrived in Australian waters on Suspected Illegal Entry Vessels as the RAN described them. Labor changed that designation to Suspected Irregular Entry Vessels – gullible voters might feel better about that. Illegal immigrants are asylum seekers if they apply for asylum, but they remain illegal immigrants who arrived with no passport and required visa.

        When processed on Australian territory the illegal immigrants once processed and claim for asylum rejected, and appeal against that decision unsuccessful, then had access to the legal system leading to a number of courts at taxpayer’s expense, legal aid. And delays between hearings on appeals enabled detainees to stay in detention for years, also at taxpayer’s expense. By processing offshore with no access to Australian courts a deterrent was created as the rule is that illegal immigrants will never be resettled in Australia.

        On the other hand, which refugee advocates never acknowledge, detainees are free to seek deportation to return to their homeland at any time during the processing, appeal and then as permanent detainees if they refuse to leave. They would be issued a travel document one-way travel home.

        Detainees are not prisoners and despite the claims of mistreatment detention centres have often superior amenities to what detainees had in their homeland.

        Note too that the UN Charter requires people who are genuine refugees to seek asylum in the nearest safe haven country. An example is Pakistan for people from Afghanistan, There are UNHCR Refugee Camps in Pakistan and since the major troubles ended large numbers of refugees have been repatriated by the UNHCR. A minority paid people smugglers in Pakistan to take them to far off Australia where they planned to seek asylum and become effectively economic refugees seeking a better life by illegal means.

        Why should they be rewarded?

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        • #
          Albert

          I remember some years ago a retired female officer with 20 years service had to wait 13 years to get placement in a home as most homes were going to those of illegal entry

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        • #
          yarpos

          If they are not prisoners, why does Australia have any say in the NZ offer to accomodate some of them?

          Bit puzzling. I am not a supporter of country shoppers, but their status once stopped seems a bit opaque.

          00

    • #
      Dennis

      Too many Liberal MPs continue to ignore what voters are angry about and they continue to ignore how their now former leader got to that position in politics: pushed aside Peter King Liberal MP for Wentworth, tried to push aside PM Howard and Treasurer Costello, pushed aside Opposition Leader Brendan Nelson and to cap the lack of loyalty displayed pushed aside PM Abbott who led the Coalition to a landslide defeat of Rudd Labor in September 2013.

      They also pretend that the Timeline of history available on line reveals an ambition to get rid of the conservative Liberal and National parties to create one single major governing party, an amalgamation of Liberal and National Lights with Labor Greens, a socialist globalist republic and new world order focused party with only minor parties in opposition forever.

      However, presenting as two major party political opponents for the purpose of electioneering and covering up the real objectives the Australian Constitution has been ignored, many UN Treaties implemented without referendum. Many bad consequences, too many to list here. I was reminded of one by Bob Katter MP on Sky last night, he spoke about Torres Strait Islanders who are no longer permitted to fish, Marine National Parks prohibit them from doing what they had been doing for thousands of years. I then remembered how many fishing coop businesses have closed and related commercial fishing trawlers sold and the owner’s licences cancelled in return for a not very generous compensation using taxpayer’s monies. And now a lot of our seafood is imported. Sustainability?

      A western NSW sheep and wheat property owner, a friend of mine, told me that due to the “green madness” fire hazard fallen timber cannot be cleared more than 35% per year, dotted around the countryside are former farms now set aside to return to nature creating havens for feral animals and wicks for bushfires. And productive farmland locked up.

      Too many Australians turn their back on politics, they vote in a tribal fashion, traditionally about 80 per cent voted Labor or LNP including swinging voters. Apparently that has decreased to 60 per cent in more recent elections, according to former PM Howard in 2017. The last (five?) by elections indicate that it could now be about 50% supporting the major parties. Very clearly Australians are fed up with the way our nation and economy is being damaged by politicians.

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      • #
        OriginalSteve

        We have enetered a weird phase ( from a secular viewpoint ) globally.

        However, from my Chritian point of view, I can clearly see the Satanic influence.

        God clearly said in the Last Days, a mass delusion would be sent, so the wicked people would believe a lie :

        “10 and all the ways that wickedness deceives those who are perishing.
        They perish because they refused to love the truth and so be saved.
        11 For this reason God sends them a powerful delusion so that they will believe the lie
        12 and so that all will be condemned who have not believed the truth but have delighted in wickedness.”
        ( 2 Thess 2:10-12 )

        The reaosn people are like zombies is that they are walking off literally into destruction. They have rejected God, and will continue to do so. Australia recently with the SSM vote turned its collective back on God.

        Why should God now save our country, or any country that rejects Him? Maybe like when he rescued Lot from Sodom, He may postpone destruction for the sake of the few rightous people left to get them out of harms way…..

        Here is a sobering reality – Russia, has turned back to Christinaity. The military openly build Christian chapels. The USA military openly allow satanic worship and suppress chritian worship. Russia is rising rapidly.
        America & Australia have turned their backs on on God and embraced paganism.

        Which nation will likely prosper?

        Food for thought…..

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        • #
          Dennis

          Interesting, are you aware that Mr Turnbull refers to himself as “Satan”?

          One of the History Timeline items.

          30

          • #

            All the global elites are satanists driving agenda 21/2030. Sexualisation of our children, climate change cult, cultual marxism,etc. Leading the human race to destruction.

            51

        • #

          Spot on O’Steve. Only “ONE” law that applies, everything else is inferior.
          God’s Word is law. Right here and right now. It is the unbreakable, binding, life-defining reality under which all of His creation and property – including what we now call the ‘Civilised West’ – is held together.
          Wherever any document – including any Constitution, Statute or Treaty – deviates from the Word of God, that document is in error. Wherever and whenever any so-called “law” of man purports to allow that which God has forbidden or inhibits any behavior that God has commanded, that perversion of law is no real law at all and it is to be rejected.
          Christians are commanded and equipped by the one true God to stand for Christ’s complete authority over all things right here and now, including law, politics, economics, education, and everything else. Read your Bible, Christian…and obey your King’s commands with joy.
          Nations and Empires come go. The length of time they are allowed to persist on God’s earth is entirely contingent upon His grace and their submission to His Son as her King in practice.
          Let us live and legislate accordingly.

          31

        • #
          yarpos

          Like climate alarmists, we also can often find what we look for.

          Walking into destruction isnt the sole province of non believers, unless you really think you have a talisman against evil.

          10

          • #
            Annie

            No, would agree there Yarpos. I hope that my beliefs would strengthen me when times are difficult but just claiming to be a Christian isn’t enough, as we see from some of the appalling behaviour some get up to.

            10

    • #
      theRealUniverse

      “That is assuming the indoctrination they are now getting will have worn off by then.” When they are freezing their butts of in the next LIA they may say “oh wonder if we just got scammed?”…To late mate!

      51

    • #
      Hanrahan

      The electorate is more fickle than you think. Remember Tony’s big win just 5 years ago – what a debacle since. When Campbell Newman won in Qld, labor bought a Tarago for transport. Lasted just one term.

      There is a large sea of discontent out there and while the pollies take their bases for granted they will not be reliable supporters of either party.

      50

  • #
    robert rosicka

    Posted last thread but listening to ABC radio drive in the arvo and as much as the presenter pushed the idea of “climate change” as the no one factor in the result the man she was interviewing said it had zero impact from the conservative side as far as he could tell .

    152

  • #
    Graeme No.3

    The Liberals could take Labor and the Greens at their word that “renewables are the cheapest electricity” and eliminate the RET subsidies for them. Then by pointing out that Snowy 2 “Australia’s biggest battery” will be ready in 6 years so no point in adding more renewables until there was storage to use the excess.
    Then they could demand that State Governments which own the distribution (and milk it for as much as they can get) should only charge the least expensive rate.
    It would be the only way they could reduce electricity charges before the next election. Otherwise when Labor stuffs the economy so badly it will be a case of who will take government and start fixing the mess, it won’t be the Liberals.

    260

  • #
    King Geo

    Yes William the “Liberals are done” and so is Oz.

    The ALP will win the 2019 Federal Election – likely by a big margin.

    The 50% RET by 2030 Policy will take hold – the death warrant for the Oz Economy.

    The ALP will spend ten of millions of our hard earned tax dollars educating 3 year olds, encouraging all kids to go to university and get a degree.

    It seems like a great plan.

    The only problem being there will be too few “real jobs” as huge numbers of university graduates enter the job market. You see true to form, the ALP will fail to create an environment where there will be jobs for our “over educated youth”.

    With escalating electricity prices, unions pushing for big increases in wages, increasing red tape wrt Industries adhering to “over the top environmental obligations” etc etc, manufacturing companies will leave Oz in their droves – best to head to Asia.

    Oz’s Economy will implode accordingly because who would want to run their operation in Oz under the ALP’s “EU-like” Socialist Regime?

    Believe me 3 years of ALP Rule (2019-2022) will send this fine nation down the gurglar with youth un-employment numbers rising dramatically with numbers likely to match those now in Italy (> 30%), Spain (> 30%) and even one of the EU powerhouse economies, France (>20%).

    Under ALP Rule the Oz Economy will become like the “EU Mark 2″.

    Of course in 2022 there will be an uproar.

    Hopefully a “reformed Coalition” will save the day.

    As they say “NO PAIN NO GAIN”.

    231

  • #
    pat

    we’re stuffed. 4 writers needed for this?

    22 Oct: SMH: Coal’s days are numbered, top government adviser says
    By Adam Carey, Cole Latimer & Nick Toscano; with Nicole Hasham
    The federal government’s top energy adviser Kerry Schott says the plunging cost of renewables will force Australia’s remaining coal plants to close even earlier than planned, as mining giant BHP renewed calls for a price on carbon to urgently slash national emissions.

    The Morrison government’s failure to produce an emissions reduction plan for the electricity sector and general inaction on climate change have been credited with helping to drive a massive negative swing in the Wentworth byelection, which is expected to cost it the seat and force it into minority government.

    The nation’s energy ministers are due to meet in Sydney on Friday to discuss the Morrison government’s bid to lower prices and improve reliability. Efforts to cut greenhouse gas emitted by electricity generators are not on the agenda…

    Energy Security Board chair Dr Schott on Monday predicted that renewables would force many of Australia’s remaining coal-fired power plants to make an early exit from the energy market, by beating them on price.
    “Commercial reasons will be made about retiring coal plants and they’re likely to get dropped out the door faster than their technical lives would suggest,” she said at a Committee for Economic Development of Australia event in Melbourne.
    But she said the transition must be well managed to avoid a hasty rush to renewables pushing up energy prices…

    Speaking at a conference in Melbourne, BHP head of sustainability and climate change Fiona Wild said the company accepted the latest findings of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change that the “warming of the climate is unequivocal, the human influence is clear and physical impacts are unavoidable”….

    Speaking at a conference in Sydney on Monday, Alinta Energy chief Jeff Dimery said the national electricity market had “shortcomings … it isn’t sustainable forever”.
    Frontier Economics chief executive Danny Price told Fairfax Media that without a national policy to guide investment, including emissions reduction targets, electricity prices will continue to rise.

    “The National Electricity Market can’t last more than a few years in its current form, it just can’t cope any more,” he said.
    A new report by consultants Wood Mackenzie forecasts that renewables will become the main global source of energy by 2035.
    “This is the point of no return, and represents a new era for the energy industry,” it says…

    “There is serious change going on and you can’t stop the evolution of energy just because [former prime minister] Tony Abbott and his mates don’t want it to,” (Frontier Economics chief executive Danny ) Price said.
    https://www.smh.com.au/business/the-economy/coal-s-days-are-numbered-top-government-adviser-says-20181022-p50b50.html

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      • #
        Dennis

        One crucial but overlooked point is that Turnbull was aided and abetted in this policy by a group of ultra-ideological, “expert” global warming bureaucrats who run the electricity grid, especially the Energy Security Board Chair, Dr Kerry Schott.

        These people allowed Turnbull to place all the responsibility for the promises about the policy on their back, to help him politically. Why are these anti-carbon dioxide fanatics helping Turnbull defeat Labor when Labor policy pushes greater emissions cuts? The obvious answer is that they want to protect Turnbull’s leadership in order to destroy, for the longer term, their only effective opposition, which is conservatives within the Liberal Party.

        Dr Kerry Schott, considered the primary architect of Turnbull’s policy, is an eclectic bureaucrat and veteran oligarch who has previously had close connections with Turnbull and the Labor Party. She worked for the investment bank Turnbull started with former NSW Labor Premier Neville Wran and former Labor Prime Minister Gough Whitlam’s son, Nicholas Whitlam in the late 1980s. She has also been a board member of the Whitlam Institute, which maintains Gough Whitlam’s archives.

        During Turnbull’s time in the Howard Government’s ministry, first as Parliamentary Secretary for Water and then as Environment Minister, Schott was CEO of Sydney Water. They both agreed that Australians must pay higher prices for water to fund global warming-friendly infrastructure (like desalination plants that turned out to be white elephants).

        Ref: Heywood, L. (2006, Nov 23). Price rise to slow the flow. The Courier–Mail.

        20

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      You cant reason with fools….

      90

      • #
        William

        Tell me something new Steve, I often post comments at the Fairfax Collective and regularly run the risk of being dragged down to their level. It is the same each time. I make a comment, they challenge it, I post a link supporting my comment and they ignore the link because they refuse to even consider that there are scientists who strongly disagree that CO2 is driving the climate. And so it goes each time.

        The collective does not seem to understand that the science cannot possibly be settled when there are so many highly (and relevantly) qualified and renowned scientists in open disagreement with their belief system.

        100

        • #
          Hanrahan

          I often post comments at the Fairfax Collective and regularly run the risk of being dragged down to their level.

          One William to another: Life is too short for such grief. My health has been steadily improving since being fortunate enough to be banned from hotcopper. I am sleeping better with a subsequent improvement in my blood pressure.

          “We’ll all be rooned” said Hanrahan
          “before the year is out”.

          50

          • #
            OriginalSteve

            I think that there is better milage to be had in talking to people one on one in pubs and dinner parties, as the marxists have taken control of the media.

            I also note that in one regional Fairfax paper, you cant post comments on stories unless you are a paid subscriber! I guess one way of forcing a consensus – I guess if you want to pay for the paper, you will probably agree with its content. I couldnt stomach paying to comment….

            10

    • #
      RickWill

      This person has a masters degree in Arts. Sounds the right person to be talking about energy security in Australia!

      Thinking that intermittent generators are lower cost than coal shows limited ability to analyse and understand the power supply system.

      100

    • #
      Dean

      Only in the zany world of the converted does a new technology which beasts the old one on price, lead to higher prices.

      10

  • #
    PeterS

    The rich people of Wentworth couldn’t care less if power and petrol prices went up 500%. How any party, be it ALP or LNP even bother to appease them by following the CAGW story is beyond any common sense or logic when the rest of the nation is taken into account. In fact it’s electoral suicide. If both parties remain soft on the renewables crap they will be hit hard at the election and neither will have majority rule. What a mess.

    201

    • #
      Dennis

      They might be looking forward to driving EVs in the near future, the government has recently announced $6 million to provide fast recharging stations.

      70

      • #
        PeterS

        I thought Morrison was a great supporter of a level playing field. If he’s happy to do that then he also should announce say $6 billion for new HELE coal fired pwoer plants and much more for nuclear power plants (after scrapping their restriction). Or is he just another fake PM?

        121

        • #
          Dennis

          Wasn’t the Liberal way free market capitalism, supporting businesses small and large, working for the people?

          111

          • #
            ando

            The modern Liberal Party is more interested in token apologies, homosexual ‘marriage’ and ‘green’ schemes than improving the standard of living for all Australians.

            40

      • #
        Greebo

        Between Capitol cities, wasn’t it? Nobody from Point Piper would drive further than the airport.

        50

  • #
    pat

    22 Oct: Reuters: German steel sector warns against abrupt halt to coal-fired power
    Reporting by Tom Kaeckenhoff; Writing by Caroline Copley
    DUESSELDORF, Germany – An abrupt end to coal-fired power generation in Germany would damage the steel industry’s competitiveness by pushing up electricity prices, the head of the country’s steel association warned on Monday.
    Hans Juergen Kerkhoff said he expects rising power prices from a hasty withdrawal from coal to lead to additional electricity costs of between 140 million euros and 220 million euros ($161 million to $253 million) a year for the steel industry…

    Energy-hungry steel companies in Germany are already grappling with overcapacity, cheap imports from Asia and increasingly strict climate requirements…
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-germany-steel/german-steel-sector-warns-against-abrupt-halt-to-coal-fired-power-idUSKCN1MW0SJ

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  • #
    LittleOil

    26,000 Votes Missing in Wentworth?

    There is a hidden story in Wentworth. Dr Phelps received just over 37,000 votes after preferences and won by about 1,600 votes.

    There are 104,000 registered voters in the electorate. 78,000 voted of which 4,000 were informal.

    What is the story behind the 26,000 registered voters who did not vote and also the 4,000 informal votes? They could be liberal voters reluctant to vote for another candidate and lodging a protest for more renewable energy or possibly seeking to stop subsidies to renewables and leave the Paris accord. (Figures rounded up from AEC Tally Room).

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    • #
      philthegeek

      Or it could be as simple as the turnout was about 74%. World is run by those who turn up. :)

      21

      • #
        el gordo

        Brexit!

        30

        • #
          philthegeek

          Lol! Greatest act of political self harm this century. Interesting thing is that promises were made in the lead up as to how it would go and be done…which have turned out to be bollocks. :) Much pain for Brits to come

          24

          • #
            el gordo

            The Millennials couldn’t be bothered to vote because it was a fait accompli (why would anyone want to get out) and they have been bitter ever since.

            I see the old Empire getting back together again, a powerful non aligned movement ditching the US Alliance.

            A united Europe was good for its time, a bulwark against communism, but the world has moved on.

            10

      • #
        Hanrahan

        World is run by those who turn up.

        The “progressives” have made a big mistake getting the GOP angry. The attempted lynching of Kavanagh, the party authorised violence towards republicans and the wholesale attack on the southern border have ensured the best republican turn out ever.

        And the NPC meme is perfectly timed. Luv it! :D

        60

    • #

      littleoil… this is not an unusual turnout at a by election. As pointed out in this article

      https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-07-29/participation-rate-at-wa-by-elections-extremely-low/10048928

      recent by elections have been considerably less than this. The long term average is 86% but the average in the last 20 years is close to 75%.

      so

      What is the story behind the 26,000 registered voters who did not vote

      is that they didn’t turn up

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    Cameron

    I think many commenting here (including Jo) are ignoring the drop in support for the Labour AND Green parties as well (>6% each). None of the people in Wentworth care about the RET, they are just chucking a hissy fit.
    The next election is far from lost for the coalition but there is a lot of work to do.

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      robert rosicka

      No one is ignoring the swings against the Greens , Labor and Liberal it’s a sign that neither party can ignore .

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      • #
        Cameron

        Comments like “Liberals are done” don’t take into account the swing against Labour and Greens at all. There is no alternative government at this point, therefore the “Liberals” are not done and there is still life in this government. But they have a lot of work to do.

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          William

          Labour didn’t want to do well in Wentworth – the knew that they wouldn’t get enough preferences if they were ahead of Phelps so their strategy was for Phelps to come second and then fall over the line with Labour and Green preferences. It worked and I doubt the ALP will be losing sleep over the result. The Greens might be though.

          10

      • #
        Dennis

        Five by elections in a row!!!

        50

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      Cameron

      Sorry, didn’t read the last sentence, Jo does (slightly) note the lack of support for Labour.

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        wal1957

        I think it just proves how highly regarded our politicians are by the electorate in general!
        (sarc)

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        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Whoever is pulling the globalist strings behind the scene is ensuring regardless of what the commnuity wants, the Elite get, namely “close” so called “elections”.

          “He who votes, counts for nothing, he who counts the votes counts for everything”
          - Josef Stalin

          Its quietly acknowledged the vote in the last US presidential election may have been rigged ( in fact going back to 2004 ), but what messed it up was that Trumps vote was way way higher than what they set things up for. This is another reason why the current Communist in the USA is currently frothing at the mouth, as it cant win easily, which is why its turning to violence and voter intimidation. The Americans though, are starting to get sick of the violent and unstable Left….

          71

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      Yonniestone

      Another idea/theory was that leading up to the next election the real Liberal conservative faction will quit and join Bernardi’s Australian Conservatives creating what the Liberals now should be, it would be a first step in the reformation of conservatism that will be sorely needed to stop the far left progression in Australia, win or lose imagine a political party here openly discrediting Climate Change, the UN, unsustainable immigration, renewables, attacks on Christianity, safe schools, gender insanity etc..

      The shrieks of indignity from the left would be worth the price of LNP dismantlement alone and at last give some representation for the majority of Australians, no one likes a bully and the left in this country are long overdue for a David to take an eye or two out.

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      philthegeek

      think many commenting here (including Jo) are ignoring the drop in support for the Labour AND Green parties as well (>6% each).

      As they should if they are not complete and utter…not very bright people. :) The Wentworth byelection has a few messages for the body politic, but has to be seen in the context of of the strategic voting encouraged by the the ALP and Greens.

      ALP and Greens primary vote in this one is actually pretty irrelevant to any rational analysis……but vital to the Libs trying to spin this as something other than a complete disaster. :)

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    Zigmaster

    The other factor not appreciated is that the Wentworth constituency would have a disproportionate number of ABC listeners whether that be radio or TV. I don’t often hear callers contacting 2gb from this electorate. The bias of the ABC over the period of the Wentworth campaign was out of control giving inordinate Amount of airtime to Turnbulls son.

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    Joanne mentions this in her text: (my bolding here)

    Kerryn Phelps essentially stands for a Get UP approved Labor Green Christmas Wish List: More renewable parasites, death to coal, pandering to collectivist UN committees, a ban on fossil fuel…..

    Hmm! Death to coal!

    Ha ha ha! I’d like to see that!

    It’ll never happen.

    Tony.

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    • #
      Albert

      She wants the people on Nauru replaced by new boatloads that will arrive shortly as the smugglers can guarantee delivery to Australian soil

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    • #
      Roy Hogue

      Tony,

      I used to say “never” with some confidence when I thought I was right. But now I don’t say “never” nearly so easily. When a government cares so little for the governed they can and will throw everyone to the dogs to please their real masters.

      I wish it was a different world but it’s not what it used to be anymore.

      190

    • #
      Peter C

      It is happening already, Tony

      51

  • #
    Dave in the States

    Why do the well to do pander to and support lefties and lefty policies? I can think of a few reasons:

    Virtue signalling. They are really ambivalent about things but if it makes them look virtuous and they can feel better about themselves among themselves and with in the media bubble, then it’s a win.

    If they can get Gov to pay for social programs using other peoples money and debt, then they are not pressured to make any meaningful sacrifices themselves in either time or money.

    They know they are little affected and they may benefit through their crony connections anyway.

    It keeps the deplorable classes, whom they despise, in their places over the long term.

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      James Poulos

      I think I can answer that Dave.

      The well-to-do have all they want and are bored – it seems to be a western Culture thing – now they want to make a ‘difference’ to leave a legacy, in order to be remembered for something other than being lucky enough to be wealthy enough.

      Rosa Parks made a difference.

      Eddie Mabo made a difference.

      Martin Luther King made a difference.

      Just to name a few.

      The problem is that after these – and many other – truly brave and selfless people made differences, the world changed.

      People became more equal and with equality comes less difference.

      Social Justice succeeded extremely well in Western culture.

      Now in order to make a difference the Modern Western Social Justice Warriors (who do not come from oppressed, destitute or down trodden sections of a community) take up an imagined cudgel on behalf of people they do not know to make themselves feel good about their own good fortune.

      They resort to anarchy and fake news to try to make other like minded social warriors believe that they still matter.

      They partition off sections of the community and label those sections according to their need for redemption and social media friend requests, they tribalise and rant and rave about intolerable injustices and attack innocent law abiding citizens having meals in public places for attention to their cause.

      Heaven only knows why our spineless, weak and servile politicians cow-tow to these lunatics.

      Thank God for Donald Trump.

      He shines the light.

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        Dennis

        Noting the cold shoulder President Trump was given, and returned by him by Prime Minister Turnbull and Minister for DFAT Bishop.

        The following diplomatic signal of strained relations, withdrawal of the just appointed new Ambassador to Australia and no appointment announced since.

        It was somewhat amusing when Minister Bishop waffled about the strength of the relationship between our two countries, sometime after the Ambassador was withdrawn.

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        • #
          James Poulos

          Dennis,

          I suspect the strained relationship between Little Lord Wentworth and Mr Trump began shortly after Mr Trump was elected but before he took over.

          That is when Little Lord Wentworth approached Obama with a great joke they could both enjoy at Mr Trump’s expense – the ‘Manus Island and Nauru Refugees Deal’.

          I present as evidence his subsequent actions in retiring from politics and leaving the seat of Wentworth vacant allowing his son to advocate for opposing candidates.

          How they must have laughed over that one – Lucy, Mal and whatever the kid’s name is…

          “When will we three meet again, in thuinder, lightning, or in rain.”

          70

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        robert rosicka

        Remember that the goal of socialists is wealth distribution so if the wealthy of Wentworth want to divide their hard earned up with the state and country they deserve what they voted for .

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          ando

          In addition, every second house should be forcibly acquired by the government to house all the ‘refugees’ that the people of Wentworth are welcoming with open arms. Lets see how many Wentwothians hang around after that happens shall we?

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  • #

    *Headline changed. It was “Labor calls for National Energy policy to be set by 1,500 voters in richest seat in Australia”

    After watching the ABC repeat how “polls show” voters care about climate change, the more important message was the line about the 2013 election.

    Polls show Australians — like Americans won’t vote for climate taxes, and don’t want to pay more to change the climate either.

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    • #
      Roy Hogue

      Do I detect a fixed fight?

      Our upcoming election looks like the same kind of thing. When I, a registered Republican, have a choice for U.S. Senator from California between 2 Democrats with no possibility of a write in vote. The fix is in. I’ve been disenfranchised.

      I’m forced to vote for Diane Feinstein because her competitor is far far worse than Feinstein who is more than bad enough already.

      If I thought it would do any good I would take my ballot outside and set fire to it in the parking lot. The news wouldn’t even report the arrest of a Republican for whatever the charges would be.

      I can only hope the final downfall of California is far enough away that both I and my wife are gone to our graves first. My son and his family just moved to Arizona so that removes a lot of my fear for them.

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        sophocles

        Umm, let’s see:

        -disorderly behaviour
        -creating a public nuisance
        -attempted arson (of a tar-sealed car-park)
        -endangering public property (tar-seal)
        -endangering private property (parked cars)
        -creating a public danger/menace
        -destruction of public property (a voting paper)
        -attempted electoral fraud (submission of a burnt voting paper)
        -disrespecting the Guv-nah

        … that’ll do for now. I’m sure the AGs will be able to find/invent more …

        40

        • #
          sophocles

          14.1.1 is awaiting moderation.
          It’s been a couple of weeks since I last saw that missive.
          Darn and other Expletives Deleted :-)
          I forgot: and used the f***d word. Bother. As in Electoral …ph-raw…d.
          These censorship scripts have no sense of humour … mutter mutter …let’s see if this sneaks in …

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            Yonniestone

            I agree that currently Australian politics are F****d and like many I’m F****d if I know what to do about it.

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              PeterS

              There is nothing you on your own can do but collectively the Australian voters can do something about it very simply. Of course they won’t because most are still asleep, clueless and/or don’t give a damn, such as a lot of those in Wentworth. Then there is the other problem about having two major parties who are trying their best to destroy our nation in only slightly different approaches thus not giving us much of a choice for those who are a awake, sharp and do give a damn. So yes we are f**** but in more ways than one.

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                el gordo

                The voters in Wentworth care about their grandchildren’s future, they are mindless women and millennials, but that is not the rest of Australia.

                If big nose doesn’t say something useful on climate change then I won’t be voting for the ACP.

                There were 4000 Informal votes in Wentworth and at the general election that number should increase.

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          • #
            Dennis

            I have fallen foul of the moderation system today.

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          Roy Hogue

          Sophocles,

          You didn’t need to list them all individually you could summarize it easily as being a Republican in possession of a ballot. They don’t want Republicans. See, California makes it all nice and easy — instant guilt with two words, Republican and voting.

          00

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        Roy, it might be time to let CA just rot on the vine, and just leave…..

        30

    • #
      Dave in the States

      I think this goes with Lindzen’s observation that elites can afford to support climate action policies because it hardly affects them, but the middle classes are greatly affected.

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      PeterS

      I hope you are right Jo. Yes Wentworth is not typical of much of the nation but don’t forget even many in “poor” electorates believe we should do more about climate change due to their gullibility in believing much of what the MSM is preaching on the subject, in particular the ABC. That’s the main reason why Morrison was so soft on the climate issue prior to the by-election, which IMHO was a mistake and as it turns out was pointless anyway. What we need to see from Morrison now is a full on attack on the CAGW scam to break away from the left in a clear and unambiguous way. Then the voters will have a clear choice instead of the current confusion and doublespeak Morrison et al are still carrying on about. That’s assuming he is serious about it and a sceptic off CAGW as most of us here are.

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      • #

        Poor electorates do not rank climate change as a high priority. They might believe it, but they want jobs and struggle to pay the bills.

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        • #
          philthegeek

          data to support that assertion is where??

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            C. Paul Barreira

            One might be declining enrolments in Catholic schools, especially parish (typically primary) schools. True, it tells little about attitudes towards climate change, but about quickly increasing costs of living, a good deal—and they take precedence. Much of that was evident well over twelve months ago, since when petrol prices have increased alarmingly.

            It would be a distraction in many ways, but perhaps the Liberals and their coalition partners could offer voluntary voting as an attraction. Others have noticed the informal vote, which seems to rise even in advance of the cost of living.

            20

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        • #
          PeterS

          Yes the poor are struggling but many like the climate change ideology because they are afraid of their children’s future, which of course is a falsehood.

          30

        • #
          yarpos

          Hierarchy of needs stuff really. They arent comfortable enough to start focussing on touchy feely stuff, too busy just surviving.

          10

  • #

    Beginning with Hawke, which Labor PMs have not been plutocrats? (You can include Malcolm in the list of Labor PMs.) Nope. Can’t think of any non-plutocrats, can we?

    Their best buds and mentors: Hawke and Abeles. Keating and Suharto. Rudd and his missus. Julia and the Clintons. Malcolm and…does Malcolm have any friends? Malcolm can just hold hands with Malcolm.

    Now, what do you reckon Shorten could do, with one hand on the migrant tap and the other hand on the debt tap? I reckon we could re-christen Australia Cronyland. No more dusty, smelly mine disasters for Bill. He’s done the hard yards, straining to keep his diphthongs broad as he addresses crowds in his fluoro jacket and hard hat. Phew, do those Labor foot-sloggers stink in the heat! As for all the golly-gee GetUp volunteers…how many times do they have to be told to use the tradesmen’s entrance!

    Bill’s now ready for the Big End. And he’ll stay there.

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      sophocles

      Malcolm X … where X is the unknown and unknowable quantity, allegiance, loyalty (*cough), policy, integrity (*cough*) … &c, &c, &c, Everything!, a veritable wind vane.

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    TdeF

    Perhaps the most frustrating part is the story being run that Malcolm was saving the Liberal party when he was unfairly tossed out? What an ego with no sense of hypocrisy. The only thing he is really good at was wrecking. When did Malcolm ever do anything good for the country or anyone else? A narcissistic opportunist who inherited his wealth and his politics, he is everything he says about Tony Abbott with no awareness of total hypocrisy. Ran away to New York in a giant dummy spit, he has come back to taste his calculated vengeance on the Liberals and Nationals.

    So we read that Malcolm was about to win the election? Is this the same man who turned a landslide victory for Tony Abbott into a one seat parliament? A double dissolution election for no reason at all? Even bitterly disappointed that he won it and refused to speak and then to thank anyone.

    Still Christopher Pyne is in the press saying we should not go to the hard right. The hard right appears to be all the sensible stuff everyone wants, like getting out of Paris, repealing the RET, small government, lower taxation, less interference in our lives and stopping the flood of immigrants who want our country, not our culture of hard work.

    Alt Right, Hard Right, fascist, deluded conservatives. These are all labels from the extremists press funded by our unwilling taxes. Pyne and Bishop are ready to retire. Like Turnbull, their job is done. Who is left to pick up the pieces? Only Tony Abbott. Again. Morrison has all the appeal, charisma and policies of a brick and his political genius sent Tony Abbott to talk to Ab*rigines and now hired Malcolm Turnbull to represent our Climate in Bali. Words fail.

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    • #
      TdeF

      We have even been told by our wonderful press that “Advance Australia Fair” is now a racist anthem because fair now means fair haired, fair skinned, not fair and equal as in fair go? You could not make this nonsense up, but someone is.

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      Dennis

      Long before he joined the Liberal Party many or most of his close friends and business associates were from the Labor and Green side.

      His stated mission in political life was to get rid of the Liberal and National parties and merge the remaining left leaning MPs to form one giant unassailable governing party with only minor parties in opposition. He was out to wreck the Australian Liberal Party and National Party, and interestingly one Julia Gillard who formed the Socialist Forum long before she became a Labor MP had the same objective to wreck the Labor Party. There must be more to the story.

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    Michael Reed

    I said eight weeks ago that Scott Morrison would not change course on Turnbull’s legacy on climate policy and guess what he really hasn’t.I’ve always said things in
    this country will remain the same politically until such time as the electorate wake up and start ignoring the word emissions and the phrases Climate Change and Paris Agreement.I now understand why the “deplorables” haven’t woken up-its to do with time and money of which they don’t have enough of either.Basically crony capitalists with vested interests in renewable energy lobby politicians to maintain the obscene amounts of money that flow their way .One perfect example would be the son of Mal T
    ie Alex and his Infagen interests.Yep this whole sordid story is guaranteed to continue because as Scomo told us “the Australian Government sticks to its Agreements (namely the Paris one)”-certainly looks like Malcom is still running the puppet show which is this Government.
    I also said way back(maybe 18 months ago on this site) that politicians who earn three times the average income of ordinary Australians and a guaranteed massive super
    annuation payout for the rest of their retired life -DON”T really care much much about -Electricity or gas bills ,the price of fuel.Maybe there was a time when these elected representatives did consider these issues but it is NOT NOW!! I’m afraid “now” is a time when virtue signalling about Climate Change is way more important
    than the pedestrian issue of cost of living. All of this is new ideology of course is bolstered by the MSM and of course our ABC.It has taken me quite a while to come
    to the realisation that this whole charade is plainly and purely about “self interest” and of course “following the money”
    Cheers Mike Reed

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    David Maddison

    Sorry if a little OT… (but related).

    Morrison sent Turnbull to “represent” Australia at the climate conference in Bali. Remember what happened at the last climate conference in Bali? They ran out of parking places at the airport for all the private jets climate change activists flew in on. Is Turnbull going by private jet or government VIP jet?
    https://www.ign.com/boards/threads/airport-warns-not-enough-private-jet-parking-spaces-for-un-global-warming-conference.250453845/
    Of course, this is a common problem at climate conferences, the same thing happened recently in San Francisco.
    https://climatechangedispatch.com/how-to-fly-to-a-climate-change-summit-in-a-co2-spewing-private-jet/

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      GD

      Morrison sent Turnbull to “represent” Australia at the climate conference in Bali.

      What is wrong with these politicians? Why the hell can’t they just read Jo Nova’s blog and save Australia a shed-load of money and subsequently keep the lights and power on.

      We are being misgoverned by imbeciles

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      • #
        PeterS

        We are fighting a losing battle against the CAGW scam thanks to the likes of Morrison.

        60

        • #
          Robdel

          We need a full scale crisis before the people come to their senses. Such as NO electricity. Until that happens expect the people to pay up, reluctantly or not, for higher power prices.

          30

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      PeterS

      It’s getting worse and worse by the day. Morrison must then be a believer in the CAGW crap just as strongly as Turnbull. This is backed up by the fact Morrison refuses to dump Paris. May the LNP crash and burn at the next election and never be elected again to make room for a new party.

      60

      • #
        David Maddison

        I believe that Morrison is nothing more than a Turnbull puppet.

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        • #
          PeterS

          It’s starting to look that way. Look at his contradictory messages on emissions and power prices. Still I will give him some more time but it’s not looking good. It probably won’t matter anyway because they will lose the next election by a landslide going by recent studies.

          30

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    robert rosicka

    The Libs just can’t help themselves -

    Father Riley’s kids of the street foundation have had their Govt support withdrawn and ordered to repay over $600,000 .

    Reports of a dozen or so juveniles moved from Nauru to Oz .

    Moderate Libs (whatever that means) want a $Billion injected into the climate fund .

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      OriginalSteve

      Well, you have to fund your master, the UN, somehow……

      Why not strip money from doing good, and pour it into a Satanic organization to further world domination?

      Bonus….

      /sarc

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    TdeF

    Yesterday’s Australian was interesting. The NT penalizing gas producers who have found gas amounting to 200 years of Australian needs with carbon ‘offsets’ which will amount to over $4.5Billion a year. At least it’s not a ‘tax. As the RET has taught the elites, you cannot call it a tax. Fossil fuel is simply ‘not eligible’ for power generation and must buy ‘certificates’ with your money.

    At the same time a major fertilizer manufacturer in Queensland is going to close because they cannot get supplies of affordable gas. Firstly that means a massive shortage. Secondly, you can always get gas, if you pay enough for something which starts life as free, the property of the people of Australia.

    So we now have carbon ‘offsets’, in the billions. A massive gas shortage.

    However the report does say there will be jobs found for aboriginal ‘rangers’. Wow. That’s a relief. I though we were just being robbed and shut down. Again.

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    • #
      TdeF

      Yesterday’s Australian was interesting. The NT penalizing gas producers who have found gas amounting to 200 years of Australian needs with carbon ‘offsets’ which will amount to over $4.5Billion a year. At least it’s not a ‘tax. As the RET has taught the elites, you cannot call it a tax. Fossil fuel is simply ‘not eligible’ for power generation and must buy ‘certificates’ with your money.

      At the same time a major fertilizer manufacturer in Queensland is going to close because they cannot get supplies of affordable gas. Firstly that means a massive shortage. Secondly, you can always get gas, if you pay enough for something which starts life as free, the property of the people of Australia.

      So we now have carbon ‘offsets’, in the billions. A massive gas shortage.

      However the report does say there will be jobs found for ab*riginal ‘rangers’. Wow. That’s a relief. I though we were just being robbed and shut down. Again.

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        PeterS

        In other words the nation is run by lunatics who keep on getting re-elected by other lunatics, which we already knew. Australia is starting to look a lot like one large lunatic asylum.

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          PeterS

          Listening to 2GB today according to a recent analysis using data acquired before Morrison replaced Turnbull only a small swing against the government was necessary to see the LNP lose some 20 seats. That’s how bad things were under his reign. Let’s hope Morrison can claw back as many as possible to avoid a catastrophic election loss and at worst only have a small loss.

          40

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            PeterS

            Given it’s that bad Morrison has nothing more to lose by dumping Paris, RETs and renewable subsidies. Although he doesn’t appear to believe it such moves should enhance his chances of winning the next election. Come on Morrison pull your finger out.

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            • #
              Hanrahan

              PeterS
              October 23, 2018 at 10:37 am · Reply
              Given it’s that bad Morrison has nothing more to lose by dumping Paris, RETs and renewable subsidies. Although he doesn’t appear to believe it such moves should enhance his chances of winning the next election. Come on Morrison pull your finger out.

              The fact that we have changed PMs like smoke alarm batteries is not a failure of politics, we don’t need to make it harder to do so in future, it is a failure of energy policy.

              Go back to Pres. Malcolm the First, he was dumped as leader because of his energy policy. Rudd/Ranga/Rudd were dumped because of their energy policy. Abbott was dumped because their ABC didn’t like his energy policy and Lord Malcolm II was dumped because the timid libs realised they were about to lose their jobs because of his energy policy.

              If ScoMo can tap the mood of the electorate re electricity and petrol prices [and defy the ABC] he will survive. If not the Lodge will continue being refurbished as each new lodger gets the keys.

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            Dennis

            It is important to know the background, the landslide victory gain for new seats by the Abbott led Coalition in 2013 and the near loss of government and loss of those seats by the Turnbull led Coalition resulting in a government with a single seat majority provided by the National Party at the 2016 election.

            November 2007 Rudd led Labor to defeat the Howard Government decisively but polling results indicated that many new seats were marginal and vulnerable. A too long story, but the excuse of the northern hemisphere financial crisis called Global Financial Crisis by Rudd Labor was used to excuse squandering of the $22 billion 2007/08 budget surplus handed over by the Howard Government, and then borrowing to squander more on “economic stimulus” most of which was pork barrel spending to impress voters. Because in 2007 the Australian economy was in a strong position, there had been years of budgets in surplus (all but one of twelve), the Labor debt was repaid with interest by 2006 and there were funds invested including the then $60 billion Future Fund.

            In 2010 the Gillard Labor Government was forced by the Abbott led Opposition to form a minority alliance government.

            From 2009 when Tony Abbott was drafted to become Opposition Leader he faced “relentless negativity” from inside the Coalition, anonymous leaking and background briefing, and assisted by Labor’s GetUp activist group called upon to help by the opponents within the Coalition of Tony Abbott, the Turnbull Black Hand Faction. Disunity is death in politics it has been observed. The rebels attacking their leader had apparently unforeseen consequences, the Coalition’s image was also damaged.

            No doubt about it, Turnbull was on a mission to destroy the LNP and coupled to his lack of leadership ability and poor political instincts, former Coalition Opposition Leader Medical Doctor Brendan Nelson, narcissism, things were very bad indeed under his reign. And becoming worse as he pushed socialist globalist UN based agendas.

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            Tom R Hammer

            Morrison and his minders can take the Liberal party and stuff it where the sun doesn’t shine. Bunch of do-nothing, what’s-in-it-for-me, latte sipping suburbanites. Same applies to the Labor party. There in it for the inside scoop on share trading. At this stage, the Australian Conservative Party is looking good. At least there seems to be some morals, good intentions and intelligence there.

            20

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              PeterS

              Same sentiment my friend. I think we are taken for fools by both major parties. I hope both lose half their seats and end up with a hung parliament. Betters till let’s have a new government headed by just all the minor parties forming an alliance. At least it will be fun to watch. Can’t be any worse than say Italy, right?

              30

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        theRealUniverse

        According to the paper in the link I posted above human CO2 is about 18ppm overall out of nearly 400 (if that is even correct).
        So taxing the 18ppm thats .0000018. hmm.

        40

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          TdeF

          Thanks. I put the same stuff in my personal blog many years ago, but it is all so simple. Still the fake science community demand ‘papers’ as only ‘peer reviewed papers’ tell the truth. Apparently. You do not have to go beyond school boy physics and chemistry to show the IPCC are just making it up.

          Plus I had never heard the theory that man released CO2 was special and ‘clogging’ the system somehow. That is amazing fantasy physics.

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    A Crooks

    The Liberal Party is made up of about 50% small “l” liberals and 50% conservatives. These two groups are as ideologically as far apart as you can get – with the “small l” liberals happier to side with the “small s” socialists than with the conservatives. Its the same all over the world. Think of the Republicans who were happier to support a Clinton Presidency than support Trump. Think of the centre-right Sarcozy who was happier to join with the socialists in France than see Le Pen get seats.
    Stalin didn’t call the liberals “useful idiots” for nothing. He knew he could count on them to deliver. Think of the fight between May and Johnson

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      ando

      I would say 80% small l liberals and 20% conservatives. The once sensible party is now a total and utter joke.

      30

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        TdeF

        I would suggest the other way around. Your numbers are right for allegedly Conservative commentators. When ever you go near a journalist, you have to push the meter far to the left, even for conservative journalists. Except Bolt, Credlin, Jones. They are apparently extreme far mad right, even fascists, when in fact they are just what we used to call conservatives and when fascists like Hitler and Mussolini were in fact socialists.

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    Lionell Griffith

    For those for whom facts, evidence, truth, and demonstration matters, the predicted man caused climate catastrophe IS a settled issue: there is no such thing. Extreme climate can be catastrophic but we didn’t cause it.

    For the true believers in such a thing facts, evidence, truth, and demonstration is irrelevant. Their significant others have said it, they believe it, and that settles is. Again, extreme climate can be catastrophic but it is not caused by fear and predictions of disaster.

    The real difference is embedded in believing because you know as opposed to knowing because you believe.

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    Robber

    Seems ScoMo’s “Minister for getting electricity prices down” Angus Taylor’s only plan is to put a cap on list prices, one of over 40 recommendations from the ACCC. While it makes sense to stop the ridiculous “40% off” advertising from retailers, and it will help those who simply pay their electricity bill as though it was non-negotiable like rates and taxes, it does nothing to stop the major rorts. Those rorts include:
    – The RET. If wind/solar are so cheap, why mandate their use?
    – Solar rooftop subsidies of 50% on capital cost.
    – High solar rooftop feed in tariffs.
    – The cash rich overseas owned monopolies that run the networks with a guaranteed ROI of over 7%, so the more they invest the more they make.
    – More than 20 retailers competing for business when all they do is advertise, and issue direct debit invoices.
    Given the current political climate, unless ScoMo does a 180 degree about turn, we are doomed to the next Labor/Green government adopting a 50% renewables target.
    Just imagine that scenario. To meet a 50% target with an average 25% capacity factor, (20% for solar, 30% for wind), installed capacity for wind/solar must be 200% of average demand.
    So what do we do with all that surplus capacity in the middle of the day? Add more investment for batteries, pumped hydro of about 80,000 MWhr?
    And what do we do to meet peak evening demand when the sun isn’t shining and the wind isn’t blowing? Why, keep reliable coal and gas stations on standby with a capacity of at least 120% of demand.
    So all up, we will have total installed capacity equal to 320% of demand. At what cost? Do we have to reach that nightmare scenario before our pollies and voters wake up? Or will they keep on dreaming that whatever the cost it’s worth it because Australia is saving the planet?

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    • #
      James in Melbourne

      Why 120%, Robber? Would like to know how that is arrived at.

      10

      • #
        Robber

        That 120% allows for 20% contingency for unplanned/planned shutdowns. I think AEMO planning works on the basis that you must always have a reserve greater than the largest plant in that supply area.

        30

        • #
          Hanrahan

          You are right in principle but adequate spinning reserve was considered to be equal to the largest gen-set on line. In a large grid that is less than 20%. That may have changed.

          Before governments intervened the only people who were concerned about this were the network control room operators. Consumers were only vaguely aware of “peak demand” and how it was met. For decades electricity price rises were less than inflation. Anyone else feeling a bit nostalgic?

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  • #

    This is a low point in this blog history. Oh the confected misery. Speaking of history, that is the thing being rewritten along with the made up demographics and amazing insight into how people think.

    As an aside, most of the doctors that I know have husbands, not wives.

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  • #
    PeterS

    Listening to 2GB today according to a recent analysis using data acquired before Morrison replaced Turnbull only a small swing against the government was necessary to see the LNP lose some 20 seats. That’s how bad things were under his reign. Let’s hope Morrison can claw back as many as possible to avoid a catastrophic election loss and at worst only have a small loss.

    40

    • #
      Len

      Many in the press are writing that the “coup”, (falling on his own sword by Turnbull) was responsible for the expected loss of 20 seats. Not true.

      21

      • #
        PeterS

        As discussed on SkyNews it’s not one single issue for the massive swing against the Libs in Wentworth. The main one I believe is that more and more people have come to the conclusion the Libs have lost direction and are drifting in a sea of chaos and confusion with a strong wind of doublespeak blowing from so many ministers. If the same kind of sentiment is prevalent elsewhere, which is likely I think we will see a massive number of LNP seats lost at the next election but not necessarily all to ALP/Greens. In fact I expect some ALP/Greens seats to be lost to a minor party. What a mess but we can thank both major parties for it.

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    • #
      el gordo

      In the wake of the failed coup.

      ‘Polling analysis shows a collapse for the Coalition in every mainland state and the loss of 25 seats.’ Oz

      I’m calling it a failed coup because the Morrison ascendancy was not in the script.

      41

      • #
        PeterS

        That is true. Even Morrison was surprised. Most people expected Dutton to win. Although we can never be sure I think he would have been the best choice out of the three contenders at the time.

        50

        • #
          el gordo

          Dutton as PM would have done the bidding of the ginger group, with the banner of Niccolo Machiavelli flapping in the breeze, we are against mass delusion.

          We are not interested in preserving the status quo on climate change; we want to overthrow it.

          42

          • #
            PeterS

            Morrison is doing exactly that – preserving the status quo on climate change. His reluctance at dumping Paris is one example. Now the Turnbull visit to Bali. Morrison’s true colours are now showing. He is a believer in climate change just as Turnbull is but the difference is Morrison is sneaky and doing whatever it takes to reduce power prices, which is a good thing but for the wrong reasons. He should be doing it because they are too hight due to the renewables subsidies and RETs, not just because it’s a vote winner. He should be scrapping Paris, renewables subsidies and the RETs immediately if he really believed CAGW is a scam.

            40

            • #
              Hanrahan

              If you are right PeterS [I haven't conceded yet] then the liberals will not only be thrashed at the next election but thrashed to within an inch of their collective life. They will be like that polar bear standing on that little bit of ice, they will have nothing solid to stand on.

              40

              • #
                PeterS

                That’s what I’v been hoping for when Turnbull was PM. Now that Morrison is all over the place I might start hoping for that outcome yet again except this time I want to see the LNP lose so bad they fail to meet the minimum requirements to be registered as a political party. We need a new one so desperately. There is so much dead wood and white anting in the LNP.

                20

            • #
              el gordo

              If Morrison is a clone of his former boss then we’ll need a Plan B.

              Only the Liberals might get decimated, with the Nats holding their own against the Independents. A landslide defeat of the government could see the Coalition become unstuck and dissolved, but its too early to see with any clarity.

              20

    • #
      Hanrahan

      Listening to 2GB today according to a recent analysis using data acquired before Morrison replaced Turnbull only a small swing against the government was necessary to see the LNP lose some 20 seats.

      That can be said of any government: “They would have lost if only 200 voters in X,Y and X seats had not voted for the government”. That ignores the fact there there are a similar number of seats that could have swung the other way just as easily.

      How long would it be since labor could win government, state or federal, without green preferences?

      20

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    The 2013 national elction was about one issue : Boat people. Labor had an open borders policy from 2008 – June 2013. Folks were pissed off with them for that.

    A few folks were worreid about the carbon tax but compared to the Boat people stuff up by Labor, it was insignificant.

    It’s always good to know our history. Spreading misinformation just confuses things.

    27

    • #
      philthegeek

      The 2013 national elction was about one issue : Boat people.

      Not really. That result had more to do with ALP internal dysfunction than anything else.

      40

    • #

      Sure Bill, and Juliar was a nickname used in mass protests that had nothing to do with the Carbon Tax she said she wouldn’t introduce.

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      • #

        She wasn’t a candidate in that election.

        03

      • #
        Bill In Oz

        Julia was removed from office by her own party and replaced with Rudd.Gillard retired from politics 3 months later…Ummmm .

        What was the first big new policy that Rudd instituted ? Stopping the boat people.What was Rudd’s big new policy : send them to Manus Island & Nauru..and pass legislation banning them from ever coming to Oz…

        Then Rudd dissolves parliament and asks the people to say what a Good Boy” he’s been..

        The public disagreed. No one believed him.

        Labor was decimated and Abbot was PM.

        Did the carbon tax matter in all of this ? No.

        21

        • #
          • #
            Bill In Oz

            But El Gordo who here cares what the biased ABC reports ?

            Or indeed what Abbott said to them ?

            I just saying what most ordinary folks thought then. The issue which caused a huge number of ordinary Australians to rethink their overwhelming support for Rudd’s Labor in 2007 – which by the way saw Howard lose his own seat as PM ! And move back to the Coalition is 2010 in huge numbers ( Gillard only hung onto power with a minority vote but with supportfrom 2 independents) And then finally another huge sing against Labor in 2013..

            What did all this ? Boat people; 50 odd thousands of them…

            The only issue which got Turnbull over the line in July 2016 was the simple fact that the Coalition stopped the boats in 2013-2016 – again just like Howard did 2001-2007.

            And if labor stuffs up (again post next May ) and opens the borders again, it will be dumped yet again..

            20

            • #
              el gordo

              Yeah, looking back the Coalition was only lukewarm on climate change (milking it for what they could get out of it) and the electorate, preoccupied with their own petty foibles, went along with the soft option.

              Nothing much has changed, politicians are a great disappointment.

              20

  • #
    robert rosicka

    Totally OT but just to prove how delusional the ABC really is just read the quote about the media .

    “Sensationalist media coverage can also damage Australia’s reputation as a reliable food producer. Images of barren landscapes, stressed livestock and desperate farmers send the wrong signals to customers and trading partners.”

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-23/helping-farmers-in-distress-does-not-help-them-be-the-best/10417972

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  • #
    DaveR

    You would think Morrison/Frydenberg would get this, and realise their convoluted efforts to save the Turnbull 1 seat majority are hopeless.

    Perhaps Morrison has to go after all, especially if he cant see the Lib/Nat coalition has no electoral future with the current Labor lite policies.

    30

  • #
    pat

    22 Oct: NoFrakkingConcensus: IPCC: Redefining ‘Global Warming’ at the 11th Hour
    On what planet is it OK for politically-determined definitions to supersede those written by actual scientists?
    by Donna Laframboise
    https://nofrakkingconsensus.com/2018/10/22/ipcc-redefining-global-warming-at-the-11th-hour/

    20

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    pat

    as comments are posting all over the place today as well, will try to draw attention to a MUST-WATCH video I posted on the previous thread:

    full show:

    Youtube: 39min57sec: Life Liberty & Levin FOX NEWS | Mark Levin Oct 21 2018
    Guest: Dr. Patrick Michaels
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmqqRF9lkfw

    shortened video:

    21 Oct: Fox News: The truth about global warming
    Dr. Patrick Michaels, director of the Center for the Study of Science at the Cato Institute, provides insight into the debate over climate change and the political games played to create policy.
    https://www.foxnews.com/shows/life-liberty-levin

    20

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    pat

    Angus Taylor at work:

    “Electric vehicles have the potential to ***lower transport costs, enhance fuel security, and increasingly create more sustainable cities with less pollution and better health outcomes for our communities,” ***Minister for Energy Angus Taylor said on Monday.

    good news for Wentworth, who probably have more people who can afford an EV than any other constituency in Australia!

    22 Oct: NoFrakkingConcensus: IPCC: Redefining ‘Global Warming’ at the 11th Hour
    On what planet is it OK for politically-determined definitions to supersede those written by actual scientists?
    by Donna Laframboise
    https://nofrakkingconsensus.com/2018/10/22/ipcc-redefining-global-warming-at-the-11th-hour/

    22 Oct: ZDNet: Australian government invests AU$6m in EV charging network
    A AU$15 million ‘ultra-rapid’ electric vehicle charging network being built by Chargefox has received a AU$6 million boost from the Australian government.
    By Corinne Reichert
    The Australian government has announced a AU$6 million investment in an “ultra-rapid” electric vehicle (EV) charging network powered by renewable energy across the nation under the Australian Renewable Energy Agency (ARENA).

    According to the federal government, the EV charging network will be deployed around Sydney and Melbourne; between Sydney, Melbourne, Canberra, Brisbane, and Adelaide; and across Western Australia.
    Euroa, in Victoria, and Barnawartha North, outside Albury Wodonga on the New South Wales-Victorian border, will be the first sites to gain charging areas thanks to a grant from the Victorian government.

    The AU$15 million EV charging network is being built by Chargefox, with plans to develop 21 charging stations across the nation, each around 200km apart.
    The charging stations are designed to provide a range of 400km or up to 80 percent capacity within 15 minutes of charging, with the network to be worth AU$15 million.

    “Electric vehicles have the potential to ***lower transport costs, enhance fuel security, and increasingly create more sustainable cities with less pollution and better health outcomes for our communities,” ***Minister for Energy Angus Taylor said on Monday.

    Chargefox had launched business on Monday, after being co-founded by Jet Charge using investment from Australian Motoring Services (AMS) — which is jointly owned by motoring clubs NRMA, RACV, RACQ, RAC, RAA, and RACT — as well as from Wilson Transformer Company and Carsales.com.au founder Greg Roebuck, who will serve as Chargefox chair…

    The charging network will be deployed on interstate freeways as well as in cities, with each site to have at least two charging stations with 350kW of power.
    The first two sites will feature four charging stations each, with Euroa’s to be powered by 150kW of solar and 450kWh of station storage while Barnawartha North relies on 200kW of ground-mount solar. The latter site will also “feature landscaping [and] picnic facilities”, Chargefox said.

    “Each 350kW capable charging station will feature both CCS2 and CHAdeMO plug standards. CCS2 can output up to 350kW, and the CHAdeMO can output up to 200kW under the new high-powered CHAdeMO standard,” the company said.
    Australia will join Europe and the United States as the only region with a 350kW network, Jet Charge CEO Tim Washington said…

    A report produced by the Association of Mining and Exploration Companies (AMEC) estimated that the lithium value chain, including raw materials and cells and battery packs, could increase from $165 billion to $2 trillion by 2025 if there were more EVs in Australia…

    Doctors for the Environment Australia then told the Senate committee that poor air quality causes 3,000 deaths a year, with half of these attributed to vehicle emissions.

    Tesla senior manager Sam McLean additionally told the committee that there would be advantages to producing its EVs in Australia, including easier access to lithium and nickel, as well as a skilled workforce to tap into.
    According to McLean, Australia should invest in EV infrastructure and set sales targets…
    The report also revealed that Australia has 15 to 16 EVs per charging point.

    The Senate had established a motion to form a select committee in June this year to look into the economical, environmental, and societal benefits of EV uptake, as well as the opportunities for EV manufacturing, supply, and value chain and how the federal government could work with state governments to support EV targets.
    https://www.zdnet.com/article/australian-government-invests-au6m-in-ev-charging-network/

    Trump in Texas boasting about withdrawing from Paris. massive crowd goes wild.

    PICS: 21 Oct: Washington Examiner: Supporters lining up for blocks one day before big Trump-Cruz rally in Houston
    by Daniel Chaitin
    With Trump’s 2020 campaign boasting “100,000+” people being interested in attending, lines of people outside the venue Sunday evening, shown spanning multiple blocks in photos tweeted by CNN’s Betsy Klein, further indicate high enthusiasm for the event…

    On Sunday, the Trump re-election campaign offered more positive news, claiming that because there was more than 100,00 requests online for tickets to the event, there would be a “Big Texas Tailgater” outside the venue, which would include food, music, and, of course, big screens for viewing the main event, which starts at 6:30 p.m. local time…
    https://www.washingtonexaminer.com/news/supporters-lining-up-for-blocks-one-day-before-big-trump-cruz-rally-in-houston

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    • #
      pat

      accidentally included nofrakkingconcensus again.

      20

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      I’m imagining the car chases of cops and robbers in the future…..chase….stop…recharge…chase…

      50

      • #
        Dennis

        Must be why the leftists think dispatchable energy is the answer, a zap zap here and a zap zap there, here a zap there a zap everywhere a zap zap?

        40

    • #
      Dennis

      Has Angus obtained a briefing from AEMO regarding what extra generating capacity would be required if the ICEV fleet was replaced by EV?

      I understand that the UK has a much larger ICEV fleet than Australia and that an engineer society report to the government there estimated that the whole area of Scotland would need to be covered with wind turbines, assuming they were reliable and therefore capable, just to service the EV demand.

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    • #
    • #
      Hanrahan

      On Sunday, the Trump re-election campaign offered more positive news, claiming that because there was more than 100,00 requests online for tickets to the event, there would be a “Big Texas Tailgater” outside the venue, which would include food, music, and, of course, big screens for viewing the main event, which starts at 6:30 p.m. local time…

      How can there be a blue wave?

      00

  • #
    theRealUniverse

    New good paper on the real truth about C14 and ‘human CO2′
    https://www.iceagenow.info/new-study-exposes-a-fatal-flaw-in-global-warming-science/

    global warming science = global scamming science.

    40

  • #
    philthegeek

    The title of this post says it all really. :)

    I fully endorse that the definitive word on Climate Change should be defined by the 2013 election result, and that IS the lesson from that election that should be taken as the absolute received wisdom on the politics of this. Really hope that that attitude informs the strategy of conservatives in Australia. Just ignore any other polling and other data since 2013 or anything else that may…..possibly….. have been play at the 2013 election …….

    As a “Leftie” its always fun to watch the other side going all take themselves far to seriously delusional. Equivalent of seeing people walk around with their fingers in their ears going…la…la..la with the occasional break to thump themselves in the face with their Dogma. :)

    Have heard a bit about the outcome of the recent “meeting” of the Abbottish crew in Sydney. Apparently Corgi Bernardi involved as well?? :) Morrisons offering to the conservative equivalent of the volcano doGs for now is agreeing to no changes in policy (they have some apparently), and to have Malcolm tossed out of the Liberal Party. More fun, games, and internal Liberal pointless nastiness to come it seems. :)

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    • #
      el gordo

      A few months before the coup the Turnbull was advised to talk with Abbott and Bernardi, but he couldn’t bring himself to do it.

      Its worth remembering Cory only left the Libs because of Malcolm, but he won’t be wooed back so easily. Tony might suggest he join the ginger group and cause a ruckus.

      00

  • #
    Andrew S

    There seems to be very little commentary on how a Shorten Government will operate with its 50% renewable target – the reality is they won’t get to the that figure but the attempt to do so will see power bills increase more than they already are and the Government-by-Newspoll will see Labor’s vote fall quickly to be consistently behind just as the Coalition has been in recent years. At this time Labor’s rules keeping the leader in will be severely put to the test with Albo hunting for the leadership – himself not of much help as he will be busy out-greening the Greens in Grayndler. Looks like the Prime Ministerial merry-go-round will continue!

    20

  • #
    Steve Spencer

    When I visited the polling station at the last election, I was approached by one of the candidates who I had already checked out online. It was clear to me that, though he claimed too be an independent, he was nothing more or less than an ALP representative who either wanted to deceive voters, or had an ego too large to be accommodated within the ALP itself – you know the type.

    Having done my research, and having been cornered by the guy on my way in, I simply asked him to explain how his platform differed from the ALP’s, because I couldn’t see it.

    He then proceeded to demonstrate why he wanted to be a politician by talking at me for a solid five minutes, without taking a breath but also without answering my question.

    Perhaps somebody should ask Phelps where she differs substantially from the ALP/Greens and why, there being so little difference, she decided to run as an independent.

    60

    • #
      Dennis

      And her campaign manager was a former PM Gillard office staffer, and GetUp was in Wentworth campaigning in a manner fit for their princess but the Labor leader was never seen.

      20

      • #
        philthegeek

        the Labor leader was never seen.

        Because he was too smart to give the Libs anything to aim at and distract people from their many and varied fwark ups during their campaign.

        You don’t interrupt you enemy while they are working sooooo hard on gouging their own eyes out. :)

        10

        • #
          el gordo

          It was amateur hour, there is no denying it.

          The Party is divided between the ‘moderate progressives’ and the ‘conservatives’, and this is probably true of the Nationals too. The green slime has infiltrated both parties.

          From your perspective do you think climate change will be an issue in 2019?

          00

        • #
          el gordo

          Oh wait, look over there, Morrison is channeling me.

          ‘Scott Morrison will seek advice on whether public money should provide discounted loans for new baseload power generation.’ Oz

          Climate change will be front and centre.

          00

  • #

    When visiting Sydney I hang out in Wentworth with family. Know some of the local Libs. They were never optimistic about Sharma, knew that Turnbull’s (or somebody’s) millions had been the main factor in holding the seat in recent years.

    Considering the massive resources flowing to Phelps (and why not, for another empty, canting opportunist?) it’s amazing she did not achieve a landslide against an unknown and that the result was in doubt for a while. Why? Maybe because she’s such an urger and kind of repellent?

    I’m calling this a defeat for the luvvies and Posh Left, as well as for a torn Liberal Party.

    ScoMo, Hastie and that Belgian bloke are reasonably likeable characters who, unlike Shorten and Turnbull, do not make the blood run cold as if one’s grave had been stepped upon by a pair of parliamentary RM Williams.

    What if some non-nauseating characters like the above made a straight pitch to squelch Green Blob and the globalism which is already on the nose outside the Bubble. It’s a long shot that they’d dare to try it against the Common Enemy of Mankind (the media, right?) and the Bubble people…but I reckon winning would not be a long shot, if only they dared.

    Remember, there hasn’t been a vote in the miserable carcasses of recent globalist appointees like Gillard and Turnbull. Shorten is loathed, needed Turnbull to be loathed even more, which he was. The current fave of the Bubble people is Bishop…who is justly loathed outside the Bubble.

    ScMo, Hastie and Belgian bloke! Why not take a shot now? Just take a shot. A real one. You might win. You might lose. But going with the Blob and the Bubble you will certainly lose.

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    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Unless the Libs start building coal power stations and start actively killing off PC and actually stop trying tpo be touchy feely “Me Too” spineless wannabe Leftoids, they will be decimated by the Left.

      People will rally around a clear unapologetic cause, like they did Trump, because they were sick of being shafted by the Elite.

      I susepct the current crop of Libs are fairly spineless, which is why they are generally a joke.

      And someone in Libs needs to pull tight on the reins of the Young Libs and slap some sense into them – if the libs keep pandering to the SSM nonsense and trying to out-PC the Left, this country will go full blown Communist coz the young libs were shown to be clueless and think socialism is “cool” – no its not, its highly destructive. And this this the problem these days – we have clueless inept fools as lawmakers, who despite a complimentary LLB with their latest Maccas drive through order know nothng about real life. The Left are street brawlers, the Right are clowns. Time to sharpen up and read history before its too late.

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      • #
        Hanrahan

        Speaking of Trump, he might carry the GOP over the line next month, all his own doing. But things have gone well since the death [execution?] of McCain. Graham has blossomed since. What did McCain have on him?

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      • #
        Hanrahan

        I susepct the current crop of Libs are fairly spineless, which is why they are generally a joke.

        Any move by liberals to get more women into parliament will be suicidal, few are natural conservatives, fewer still are good at their jobs.

        21

        • #
          robert rosicka

          Ouch , think you might need to mansplain your way out of this one , although I must agree with you on female pollies the list of hopeless female politicians is long .

          Keneally
          Mirabella
          MacGowan
          Both Bishops
          Gillard
          Ley
          Payne
          Hansen Young
          To name but a few

          20

          • #
            Hanrahan

            Then there was Roz Kelly who kept track of millions in grants to communities on a white board………

            The “sports rorts” affair was the name by which Australian media and political commentators came to refer to events during the second Keating ministry in late 1993 and early 1994, where the then Sports Minister, Ros Kelly, was unable to appropriately explain the distribution of federal sporting grants to marginal electorates held by the governing Australian Labor Party. It led to a textbook demonstration of individual ministerial responsibility where, on 28 February 1994, Kelly resigned from her position under consistent pressure from the Australian Democrats and the Liberal opposition about the matter. Ultimately, the controversy also led to her resignation from Parliament and, at the resulting by-election on 25 March 1995, the government lost the normally safe Labor seat of Canberra.

            20

          • #
            Annie

            Aren’t these hopeless women outclassed in their hopelessness by Rudd, Turnbull, and an almost endless list of them from the UK and Europe?

            00

            • #
              Environment Skeptic

              Politics is an art. Not about gender at all. Take Shirley Temple for example. If she were alive today, i am certain she would put todays politicians to shame.
              Only an Oscar for amazing acting abilities or a Nobel prize, or both, count in todays political arena unfortunately.

              00

              • #
                Environment Skeptic

                Or even Skippy, The Bush Kangaroo.

                00

              • #
                Environment Skeptic

                I Imagine Wall the wombat or Gwenice the Goanna could do a pretty good political impersonation and fool us all too.

                There is still a lot of political talent out there lol.

                00

        • #

          Any move by liberals to get more women into parliament will be suicidal, few are natural conservatives,

          must be competitive finding a like minded woman for a life partner for conservative men then. Tim Wilson has the right idea.

          14

          • #
            Hanrahan

            must be competitive finding a like minded woman for a life partner for conservative men then.

            Easily solved, just grab them before they get infected with lefty ideology. Married Mrs H when ehe was 19. Now, 55 years later, she still votes the way I tell her. /sarc

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          • #
            el gordo

            The women are ‘progressive moderates’ not conservatives, more Labor lite.

            10

  • #
    Global Cooling

    What if welfare dependent voters become the majority? Isn’t there a moral hazard of voting yourself more money? Then government prints more money. There is no incentive to earn because of confiscation by taxes and tariffs.

    60

    • #
      el gordo

      In a world where humans are replaced by robots, it will be a win win situation, a socialist paradise.

      10

  • #
    Another Ian

    Somewhat O/T

    According to Ray Hadley this morning Indonesia invited Turnbull while he was PM. So Morrison is between a rock and a hard place.

    40

    • #
      Hanrahan

      Morrison could have said “You can go if you meet your own expenses”.

      40

    • #
      Dennis

      …… and, ScoMo was responsible for the $444 million GBRF donation, so he said.

      sarc.

      30

    • #
      Kinky Keith

      Is he still P.M.?

      20

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Scomo just confirmed that Turnbull will be representing the govt at that conference .

      20

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      pat

      Another Ian -

      sorry. that doesn’t make any sense whatsoever. he is being sent as the Australian Govt representative, so we are told.
      he is not in the Australian Govt.

      50

    • #

      When the facts change, Sir…?

      40

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      Serp

      I had been wondering about the timing of the Fabulous Windbag’s return from the US and now I see what’s in it for him.

      30

      • #
        Serp

        I read that the ex-PM will be leading the Prime Minister’s delegation to Our Ocean 2018 by agreement between Morrison and Widodo.

        They can’t be serious! This is some bizarre psychotherapy for the Windbag Ego at public expense. Lord knows I never thought I’d seen it all but this’ll take some beating.

        40

        • #
          robert rosicka

          Just watching Paul Murray and although this deal with Turdball was made possibly a long time ago it makes no difference to the fact its outraged a lot of Liberal voters to the point that I think estimates of a Liberal wipeout next election are understated especially if Turdball does end up going to Bali .
          Morrison is being Mr nice guy to Turdball and also to the left of the party and also to the right and also to the renewable industry and also to the ABC and other MSM maggots FFS grow a pair and stop trying to please everyone of which most hate your guts .
          You know what you have to do ,get out of Paris , tell the UN to shove it where the sun don’t shine ,stop the payment to save the Reef ,put money in to help any state build a coal fired power station or two .
          Build more dams to try and mitigate flooding and provide future drought proofing , charity begins at home so stop all payments to the UN , Ministers and special envoys you have elevated that are only there to make some faction happy need to go back bench .

          20

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    meanwhile, in the real world of global cooling….

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-23/severe-hailstrom-in-rome-brings-city-to-a-halt/10418182?section=world

    “Dozens of people were trapped in their vehicles when roads in Rome were turned white by a severe hailstorm that hit the Italian capital.

    Images on social media showed ice drifts from the storm trapping commuters and bringing the busy European city to a standstill.

    Footage showed floodwater loaded with ice and garbage flowing through the city streets and into the metro system.

    People could be seen in the footage trying to escape their vehicles.

    Local media said police received multiple reports of people trapped in their vehicles due to flooding.”

    20

  • #
    pat

    in the run-up to Wentworth & since, the media repeatedly claimed/claims “THE POLLS” said climate change was the big issue. they rarely, if ever, name the polls or who commissioned them.

    jo’s own link to The Australian is a perfect example of this:

    Australian: AAP: POLLS show climate and energy policy was a key factor in voters turning their backs on the government in the blue-ribbon Sydney seat on Saturday and electing independent Kerryn Phelps.

    THE ONLY POLLS I KNOW OF PRE-ELECTION (AND I’VE SEARCHED FOR MORE)

    6 Oct: Guardian: Katharine Murphy: Exclusive: Poll shows climate change tops list of issues for people in the electorate, ahead of the economy and hospital funding
    A poll ***commissioned by the Refugee Council of Australia says 65.4% of a sample of 870 Wentworth residents want children on Nauru brought to Australia…
    The poll also suggests climate change is a significant issue in the byelection, which could cost the Morrison government its one-seat majority in the House of Representatives.
    Climate change topped a list of issues influencing the votes of local residents on 20 October, ranking ahead of the economy and hospital funding, and 62.3% of the sample said they would be more likely to vote for a candidate with a credible plan to tackle climate change…
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/oct/06/most-wentworth-voters-want-nauru-children-brought-to-australia

    17 Oct: Guardian: Wentworth byelection: Liberals in danger as vote slumps to 32.7% – poll
    by Anne Davies
    The poll ***commissioned by Greenpeace, did not attempt to calculate the two-party preferred result, but did ask about preferences…
    The Greenpeace ReachTel poll asked people how they voted at the last federal election, which is a way of verifying the sample…
    Greenpeace Australia Pacific also asked how much climate change policy would impact on a person’s vote – particularly in light of the recent IPCC global emissions report.
    It found that more than 40% of Wentworth voters list climate change as being the biggest issue for them in this election..

    A total of 64.8% of voters surveyed agreed or strongly agreed with the recent statement of John Hewson that: “A major party without a credible climate action plan should forfeit the right to govern.”
    Greenpeace Australia Pacific campaigner Neneh Darwin said: “This polling shows clearly that the voters of Wentworth are planning on sending the climate wreckers in Canberra a message that there is huge electoral penalty to pay for abandoning action on climate change.”
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/oct/17/wentworth-byelection-liberals-in-danger-as-vote-slumps-to-327-poll

    MORE TO COME.

    20

    • #
      pat

      followup to comment #40:

      note final excerpt:

      ***It is disappointing there have been no properly conducted polls of Wentworth since early October, and no media-commmissioned polls at all

      15 Oct: The Conversation: Poll wrap: Labor slips in Newspoll, but gains in Ipsos, in Wentworth and in Victoria
      by Adrian Beaumont, Honorary Associate, School of Mathematics and Statistics, University of Melbourne
      (GENERAL ELECTION)
      As usual, the Greens vote in Ipsos is too high, but Newspoll also indicates that the Greens have gained; this is their highest Newspoll vote since August 2017. The Coalition’s dismissal of the IPCC report is a plausible reason for Green gains…
      Essential: 53-47 to Labor
      57-62% had at least some trust in ABC and SBS TV and radio news and current affairs. Other news sources had between 35% and 48% trust, with Internet blogs at the bottom with just 17% trust. There was little change in trust since October 2017.
      36% thought the government had too much influence over the ABC, 16% too little and 17% about the right amount. By 40-34, voters thought news reporting and comment on the ABC was unbiased, with Labor and Greens voters more likely to say the ABC was unbiased…

      WENTWORTH
      Wentworth ReachTEL poll tied 50-50 Liberal vs Labor
      A ReachTEL poll for the ***Refugee Council of Australia, conducted in the first week of October from a sample of 870…
      This poll also gave a Sharma vs Phelps two candidate estimate, which had Phelps beating Sharma 53-47. However, on the primary vote figures, it is likely Phelps will be eliminated and her preferences distributed between Sharma and Murray…

      ***It is disappointing there have been no properly conducted polls of Wentworth since early October, and no media-commmissioned polls at all.
      http://theconversation.com/poll-wrap-labor-slips-in-newspoll-but-gains-in-ipsos-in-wentworth-and-in-victoria-104562

      FINALLY, THE ONLY EXIT POLL I KNOW OF, THANKS TO MURPHAROO!

      21 Oct: Guardian: Katharine Murphy: Wentworth won’t prompt climate rethink, says Frydenberg
      While the level of community concern would vary in communities across the country, an exit poll funded by progressive thinktank ***the Australia Institute*** after people in Wentworth cast their votes on Saturday suggests climate change was a significant factor in the poor result for the Liberals.
      The exit poll of 1,049 respondents indicated 78% of the sample nominated climate change as having some influence on their vote in the contest, with 47% saying it had a lot of influence on their vote, and 33% nominating climate change as the most important issue.
      https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2018/oct/21/wentworth-wont-prompt-climate-rethink-says-frydenberg

      FakeNewsMSM love FakePolls.

      30

      • #
        pat

        I highlighted ReachTEL poll sentence in The Conversation piece, merely to show that was who carried out the poll for the Refugee Council, because Murpharoo didn’t bother to mention that, or link to the poll, in her 6 Oct Guardian article.

        30

  • #
    Serp

    What can you say but we’ve come a long way since Abbot’s government was elected and there’s an even longer haul ahead and anybody who claims to see light at the end of this tunnel is dreaming.

    It was a beaut country Australia until the Hawke government gave us the accord and we ended up being progressively dudded on “our” superannuation; contemporaneously Dawkins trashed our educational institutions leaving the way open for Gillard to swamp the country with bogus educational bodies preying principally on overseas students (the pool of locals being insufficient for the needs of these scoundrels).

    Along the way Howard had been stooged into legislating the RET and now we’re aghast at the acceleration of our power bill increases.

    Jacob Zuma and the Guptas eat your heart out, Australia’s corruption shall outdo yours. Iniquity abounds…

    40

    • #
      Hanrahan

      I thought I saw the light at the end of the tunnel when Tony was elected. Turned out to be an express train.

      30

  • #
    Hanrahan

    Life, Liberty & Levin October 21, 2018

    I think most here will enjoy this:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frviKqDWRl4

    10

    • #
      pat

      Hanrahan -

      yes, it is great. hope everyone watches it & spreads it around. the following fits with Michaels’ theory on how the CAGW scam began, which is something I’ve tried to point out from time to time. James Hansen, George Monbiot, Shellenberger & a whole lot more keep pushing for nuclear. I don’t mind, so long as we keep coal in the mix, big-time:

      22 Oct: EastAnglianDailyTimes: Suffolk Greenest County claims questioned as council agrees new nuclear energy deal
      Opposition councillors at Suffolk County Council have raised fresh questions over the council’s ‘Greenest County’ claim, after it has emerged its new energy deal relies 100% on nuclear power…

      Mr Stringer said the council’s new energy deal starting from April next year was a “step backwards” as it will rely on 0% renewable energy while its existing contract includes 18% green energy.
      Councillor Richard Rout, cabinet member for environment, said: “From April 2019 Suffolk County Council will have its electricity supplied by EDF Energy, on a three year contract and a tariff which is 100% nuclear.

      “Most importantly, it is rated zero carbon per kWh. This is an environmentally sound decision for our low-carbon future and affirms our commitment for Suffolk to be the Greenest County.
      “It is also a financially sound decision, being one of the best value tariffs available at the time of negotiation.
      “If we looked to renegotiate this agreed deal now, it is estimated to cost the council an extra £456,000 each year.”…
      http://www.eadt.co.uk/news/suffolk-greenest-county-claims-questioned-as-council-agrees-100-nuclear-deal-1-5746034

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    • #
      theRealUniverse

      Hes still in the ‘luke warm’ camp, even so.

      10

  • #
    pat

    “exclusive”? same old same old…

    22 Oct: Herald Scotland: 85% of big firms say climate change poses risk to business – WWF Scotland
    Exclusive by Brian Donnelly
    It is claimed the survey, commissioned by ***WWF Scotland, shows current and future impacts of climate change are on the agenda in boardrooms across the country, with 85 per cent of businesses in Scotland with 250-plus employees saying they believe climate change poses a business risk.
    The survey further found that 85% of large businesses and SMEs in Scotland say they want the Scottish Government to take the lead in tackling climate change…

    The findings come a week after the Bank of England declared banks and insurance companies will be required to appoint a senior manager to take responsibility for protection from climate change risk.
    Responding to the findings, Dr Sam Gardner, acting director at WWF Scotland, said: “These findings make it clear climate change is no longer a concern of a few ‘green’ businesses…
    “Climate change poses many chronic and severe risks to our planet’s natural and financial systems.”
    He said: “But the actions we need to tackle climate change, like building warmer homes, developing new modes of transport and modernising how we grow our food, will also present huge innovation and economic opportunities for forward-thinking businesses in Scotland…

    The survey of 300 Scottish businesses was conducted by Censuswide on behalf of WWF Scotland in October 2018. The sample included 150 businesses with over 250 employees and 150 SME businesses.
    https://www.heraldscotland.com/business_hq/16994938.85-of-big-firms-say-climate-change-poses-risk-to-business-wwf-scotland/

    22 Oct: Reuters: Australia backs hydrogen project to store renewable energy
    by Sonali Paul
    The Australian government said on Monday it would provide half the funding for the country’s biggest trial to produce hydrogen using solar and wind energy, which could then be used as a back-up for gas supplies.
    The A$15 million ($11 million) project is being run by gas pipeline company Jemena, which plans to build a 500 kilowatt electrolyser in western Sydney that will use solar and wind power to split water into hydrogen and oxygen.

    Most of the hydrogen will then be injected into the local gas network, aiming to show that renewable hydrogen could be used for energy storage in Australia’s gas networks, the Australian Renewable Energy Agency said.
    “As Australia transitions to renewable energy, hydrogen could play an important role as energy storage and also has the effect of decarbonizing the gas network with ‘green’ gas,” the agency’s chief executive, Darren Miller, said in a statement…

    Jemena is owned by State Grid Corp of China and Singapore Power…
    Australia is also the site of a trial being led by Japan’s Kawasaki Heavy Industries to produce liquid hydrogen using brown coal.
    https://uk.reuters.com/article/us-australia-hydrogen/australia-backs-hydrogen-project-to-store-renewable-energy-idUKKCN1MW01M?rpc=401&

    10

  • #
    Robber

    Electricity prices in Germany for 2017 were 30 Euro cents/kWhr, that’s 48 Aus cents/kWhr. The German price includes a renewable energy levy of 6.9 Ecents/kWhr and 15% GST.
    Australian prices are around AUs 30 cents/kWhr after adding in the daily charge of around $1.20/day.
    In the UK prices were 17 Ecents/kWhr or about 27 Aus cents.

    20

  • #
    Albert

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fA5sGtj7QKQ
    A good insight into warming and only model that works, the Russian model

    20

  • #
    pat

    open borders Guardian!

    22 Oct: Guardian: Migrants building £2.6bn windfarm paid fraction of minimum wage
    Workers on Beatrice project in Scotland have included ***irregular migrants on under £5 an hour
    by Felicity Lawrence and Ella McSweeney
    Workers hired to build the flagship £2.6bn Beatrice offshore windfarm in Scotland have included migrants ***without proper immigration documents paid a fraction of the UK minimum wage, the Guardian can reveal…
    A group of Russian workers recruited as relief crew on the giant crane ship contracted to carry out the initial construction on the Beatrice windfarm were detained by immigration officials at Aberdeen airport in April 2017.
    They were being brought in to the country on seafarer identity documents, intended for foreign crew leaving UK waters immediately, instead of the official permits required of people from outside the European Economic Area (EEA) entering the UK to work.

    Permits have not historically been available for lower skilled people from non-EEA countries work on vessels that operate in the UK’s territorial waters.
    But in an extraordinary relaxation of immigration rules, the Home Office granted a six-month, time-limited waiver to the windfarm industry to use non-EEA workers on 21 April 2017. The ITF said it was needed to give the Russians stuck at Aberdeen airport leave to enter

    An ITF inspection on board the crane ship in the Moray Firth the following month found more than 140 migrant workers, the majority from Russia and some from Indonesia.
    Contracts for some of them, seen by the Guardian, set rates of pay that were a fraction of the UK minimum wage…
    Amber Rudd, who was home secretary at the time of the concession, had been energy secretary when the Beatrice project was launched, and promised it would “provide home-grown clean energy boosting skills and create jobs and financial security for working people and their families in Scotland and across the UK”…

    The government has provided generous subsidises to Beatrice and other windfarms, and jobs in the sector are seen as particularly important to Scotland and the north-east…
    The Guardian has identified several other low-paid migrant workers being used on guard vessels for other windfarm construction and offshore cable-laying sites.
    Local fishing trawlers often take on contracts for guard duty as a lucrative way to supplement their income when they have run out of fishing quota, and many depend on it for survival. Several workers brought in from Ghana are doing these jobs, at a reported rate of £1,050 per month, with hourly pay well below the UK national minimum wage.
    The ITF maritime coordinator, Jacqueline Smith, said it had become aware of a sharp increase in the number of Filipino and Ghanaians on board trawlers in recent months, which it suspects relates to the increase in offshore wind farm activity…
    https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/oct/21/migrants-building-beatrice-windfarm-paid-fraction-of-minimum-wage

    ***nothing irregular or without proper documentation here (extremely short on other facts as well):

    17 Oct: Guardian: Hondurans fleeing violence join migrant caravan – in pictures
    President Trump has threatened to cut aid to Honduras if it did not stop the migrants
    by Arnel Hecimovic
    PICS INCLUDE:
    A large group of Hondurans fleeing poverty and violence move in a caravan toward the United States from San Pedro Sula, Honduras

    The group climbs a staircase

    Hondurans sleep in a public gym in Santa Rosa de Copan, Honduras

    A man carries a baby as he walks with other Hondurans

    Children help each other get dressed ETC
    https://www.theguardian.com/world/gallery/2018/oct/16/hondurans-fleeing-violence-join-migrant-caravan-in-pictures

    10

  • #
    pat

    behind paywall:

    22 Oct: BusinessGreen: Winds of change: Shell joins Global Wind Energy Council
    Oil giant delivers latest green move with board-level membership of leading renewables body
    Oil giant Shell has moved to expand its influence in the green energy space by joining the Global Wind Energy Council (GWEC) as a board level member. The move, announced late last week, will bring Shell closer to an industry it is investing heavily in around the world…

    22 Oct: EnergyLiveNews: Shell joins Global Wind Energy Council
    The organisation expects the wind industry to grow to 841GW in 2022
    By Priyanka Shrestha
    It is taking part in GWEC’s Offshore Taskforce, which aims to accelerate the growth of offshore wind in new global markets.
    The organisation expects the wind industry to grow from 539GW at the end of 2017 to 841GW in 2022.
    https://www.energylivenews.com/2018/10/22/shell-joins-global-wind-energy-council/

    10

  • #
    pat

    22 Oct: BusinessGreen: Winds of change: Shell joins Global Wind Energy Council
    Oil giant delivers latest green move with board-level membership of leading renewables body
    Oil giant Shell has moved to expand its influence in the green energy space by joining the Global Wind Energy Council (GWEC) as a board level member. The move, announced late last week, will bring Shell closer to an industry it is investing heavily in around the world…
    https://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/3064867/shell-joins-global-wind-energy-council

    20 Oct: Dave Toke’s green energy blog: Renewables lobbies fight to stave off Treasury massacre
    UK Renewable trade associations are fighting for the survival of the renewable industry against an onslaught led by the Treasury. If the Treasury gets its way almost all future development for renewable energy in the UK will be stopped. Continued incentives and tax breaks for nuclear power, shale gas and conventional power stations will, however, remain in place.

    The Treasury is pushing for…READ ON FOR DETAILS
    http://realfeed-intariffs.blogspot.com/2018/10/renewables-lobbies-fight-to-stave-off.html

    20

  • #
    William

    O/T but the Sydney Telegraph has run an article pushing a book by US journalist Michael Specter about science denial and the danger of irrational thinking. Much of what Specter says is common sense but he goes on to include scepticism about (man made) climate change as being the same as anti-vacs and the rest of those conspiracies.

    He says “Climate change denialism is a particularly active frontier where wars are waged with all the usual weapons — accusations of conspiracy theories; cherry picking facts; using false experts; using logical fallacies such as false analogies; and pointing to consequences.”

    I would be interested to know what Richard Lindzen, Judith Curry, David Evans, and so many other distinguished scientists feel about this fellow with no apparent scientific qualifications calling them false experts.

    But again, it is the usual thing that these “experts” do, lump climate change sceptics in with those who question vaccines, GM etc in an attempt to portray them as lacking in science.

    40

    • #
      pat

      William -

      Specter has been pushing his 2009 book for nearly a decade. a total MSM swamp creature:

      Wikipedia: Michael Specter is an American journalist who has been a staff writer, focusing on science and technology, and global public health at The New Yorker since September 1998. He has also written for The Washington Post and The New York Times…
      His 2009 book, Denialism: How Irrational Thinking Hinders Scientific Progress, Harms the Planet, and Threatens Our Lives, explores the ways in which people in the United States and Europe have increasingly rejected scientific truths, backed by impressive data…

      nice!

      3 Feb 2017: New Yorker: The Deep Denialism of Donald Trump
      By Michael Specter
      Eventually, the President’s daily policy outrages, his caustic insults, and his childish Twitter rants will fade into history. But it will take years to gauge the impact of having a habitual liar as President. When words like “science” and “progress” become unmoored from their meaning, the effects are incalculable. And let’s not kid ourselves: those words today are under assault with a ferocity we have not seen for hundreds of years…

      But we are now led, in an age of unimaginable scientific achievement, by the most narcissistic and thoughtless denialist ever to have entered public life. His denialism is not based in fear, it’s based in arrogance. And it must not be forgotten that denialism kills. Climate change, which Trump has denied and dismissed, has already had a grave impact on the world’s poorest people…

      “Scientists have battled the political and ideological forces against concepts such as evolution and climate change for years,’’ Elizabeth Hadly, a professor of biology, geological, and environmental sciences at Stanford University, told the Guardian this week. “We have patiently articulated the physical and biological laws governing the universe, assembled the data, and presented it in the pages of journals, at public seminars, to the halls of Congress. What is occurring now against science and scientists in the U.S. goes beyond ideology and political party. Now we find our discourse under attack.”…

      How many of our country’s schoolteachers must consider, every day, whether to explain to their students that the President is a liar? The alternative—simply accepting those lies—would be devastating. It would change our language and change us, if we let it…
      Facts deserve our support. And lies do not.
      https://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/the-deep-denialism-of-donald-trump

      20

      • #
        pat

        Grist wasn’t happy with his book, at first:

        November 2009: Grist: Michael Specter’s new book ‘Denialism’ misses its targets
        By Tom Philpott
        But what about the successful deniers–the ones who have managed to block any meaningful response to climate change from the federal government, and are even now fouling up the effort to pass an effective climate bill? These folks, part of a loosely concerted movement funded largely by the oil and coal industries, get barely a mention in Denialism; they certainly don’t rate a chapter.
        The book’s index has no entry for “climate change.” The entry for “Global warming” cites just one page–a reference to genetically modified foods as a “solution” to global warming.

        Does this mean that Specter thinks Monsanto’s critics–of whom I am one–pose more of threat to humanity than the likes of Sen. James Inhofe, who airs his views not in a blog but on the floor of the U.S. Senate? Monsanto has certainly shaken off its deniers; it now dominates the U.S. corn, soy, and cotton seed markets. The movement to mitigate climate change hasn’t been so lucky.

        Specter’s failure to consider this most successful foray into denialism just astounds me. Did an author really just publish a book about “denialism”–and forget to address climate-change deniers? It’s like writing a book about the British invasion of the 1960s, and neglecting to mention the Beatles and the Rolling Stones…

        (I’m still marveling at this statement, from the introduction: “I wonder, as the ice sheet in Greenland disappears, the seas rise, and our sense of planetary foreboding grows, will denialists consider the genetically engineered organisms that propel our cars and sustain our factories as a continuation of what [organic champion] Lord Melchett described as a war against nature?”)
        GMOs are hardly a product of the kind of pure and objective science that Specter celebrates…

        This great defender of science appears to be cursed with something that a love of science should have cured: naiveté. To be sure, the kind of know-nothing, reflexive anti-scienticism that Specter deplores certainly exists; and its adherents need a kick in the pants. Specter’s boot misses the target. Moreover, he sees deniers everywhere, except where they are actually powerful and effective: denying climate change.
        https://grist.org/article/2009-10-31-michael-specter-denialism-organic-gmo/

        but he’s no doubt more to their liking in recent years:

        June 2016: NPR: Michael Specter: What Happens When We Ignore Scientific Consensus?
        Heard on TED Radio Hour
        Part 2 of the TED Radio Hour episode Truth And Lies
        Michael Specter explores why some deny scientific evidence — such as the safety of vaccines and GMOs, or climate change. He says denying can provide a sense of control in an unsure world…
        https://www.npr.org/2017/06/23/533786284/michael-specter-what-happens-when-we-ignore-scientific-consensus

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    • #
      TdeF

      It’s interesting to compare vaccines with climate change. Pandemics like Smallpox have ravaged the planet, but they have been stopped. Currently it is Ebola. Anyone who thinks this is not an immense danger is quite mad.

      However Climate Change, invented with eponymous IPCC in 1988 has done nothing. Killed no one. Cost nothing. Seas have not risen. The polar bears are fine. Crops are up 50% with the extra CO2. The world is going well, too well as population pressures push people around, not climate change. The border crossings are by well fed people, often with brand name clothes.

      As for a man on the moon, the only falsehood is that the people of Earth put them there. No, the Americans did. Six actual landings. The score for every other country is exactly zero. Including Russia. You would think if faking it was so easy, a lot of countries would have landed by now. Set up franchises and sold hamburgers.

      The clear criterion which distinguishes Climate Change from plagues, is that plagues are real, vaccines work and Climate Change is not and CO2 reduction is rubbish. Could someone tell me, over the 30 years, where (man made) Climate Change has occurred. The IPCC would dearly love tov know.

      Also if someone could show me how much CO2 has dropped with 350,000 giant votive Easter Island windmills how much CO2 has dropped, I would dearly love to see that too.

      51

  • #
    TdeF

    Andrew Bolt and the IPA. Sell the ABC/SBS

    20

    • #
      Hanrahan

      My son is an NPC. I generally keep my mouth shut re politics but if I do say something like “No PM can survive without the backing of the ABC” [thinking Abbott] I get the println answer “Murdoch” or in other cases “Both parties do it”.

      think.exe disabled
      run
      resist.exe.

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  • #
    pat

    Peta Credlin read out messages left on her FB, all really angry about Turnbull going to Bali.
    Ben Fordham is sitting in for Bolt (who has to attend a family event) and says the phones went wild when he talked about Turnbull/Bali today and people are angry.

    AUDIO: 23 Oct: 2GB: Ben Fordham: ‘It makes no sense’: Barnaby Joyce savages Turnbull’s Bali trip
    https://www.2gb.com/it-makes-no-sense-barnaby-joyce-savages-turnbulls-bali-trip/

    News.com.au/AAP write about the 2GB Barnaby interview, but virtually endorse the idea of Turnbull going:

    23 Oct: news.com.au: AAP: Turnbull shouldn’t go to Bali: Barnaby
    by Angus Livingston
    Mr Turnbull sent a tweet supporting Mr Sharma and also sent private messages to him, but did not actively campaign while he was overseas…
    Mr Morrison said President Widodo appreciated Mr Turnbull’s decision to go.
    Mr Turnbull famously had a good relationship with the Indonesian president, and Mr Morrison said sending the former prime minister was a signal of how seriously Australia is taking the conference
    https://www.news.com.au/national/breaking-news/turnbull-represents-australia-in-bali/news-story/00b53b3cc633ebebb3dbb9086e2d540a

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    • #
      Hanrahan

      Is this “plausible deniability”? Whatever resolution or final communique is published ScoMo had nothing to do with it and can ignore it. “Didn’t you know Turnbull was just a citizen at the time with no authority to write cheques? LOL” If so he has a devious edge he hasn’t shown before. :)

      20

  • #
    pat

    AUDIO: 7min29sec: 23 Oct: 2GB: Ben Fordham Show: Mark Latham: ‘Scott Morrison’s made some mistakes lately’
    A controversial decision will see former prime minister Malcolm Turnbull lead Australia’s delegation at a climate change conference in Bali next week…
    “This decision is just totally ridiculous,” he tells Ben Fordham.
    “All the callers who’ve rung in are spot on in condemning it.
    “The bloke wouldn’t lift a finger to try and save or retain their seat of Wentworth is now rewarded with an overseas trip.”
    The Outsider also says sending Mr Turnbull to a climate change conference “is a recipe for higher electric prices”.

    “He is a full-on, 100 per cent supporter of renewables. He signed up to climate change and this on a day where the government in Canberra is trying to announce a policy supposedly to bring down electricity prices.
    “Scott Morrison’s made some mistakes lately.
    “The lead up to the Wentworth by-election was all over the shop and he just makes some fundamental errors.”
    https://www.2gb.com/mark-latham-scott-morrisons-made-some-mistakes-lately/

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  • #
    pat

    AUDIO: 4min26sec: 23 Oct: 2GB: Ben Fordham Show: ‘I wouldn’t trust him’: Pauline Hanson ‘furious’ over Turnbull’s trip to Bali
    One Nation Leader Pauline Hanson is “absolutely furious” over the Prime Minister’s decision to send Malcolm Turnbull to Bali for a climate conference…
    “Truly everyone is up in arms about this decision,” Ben Fordham says.
    It’s not just our listeners who are angry about Prime Minister Scott Morrison’s call…

    “He [Mr Turnbull] actually kicked the Liberal Party in the guts, by clearing out of the country. Never gave his support to Sharma in the seat of Wentworth, wants nothing to do with it.
    “I wouldn’t trust him at all to go over there and represent us. What’s he going to say or do?”

    The One Nation Senator says “the whole lot stinks”.
    “Does Morrison feel that he owes Turnbull something? Because it’s not his fault that he’s in the prime ministership and not Turnbull because the party threw Turnbull out.
    “I’ve got to ask the question: is there any dirty laundry hidden in the closet that he’s frightened what Turnbull might come out and say prior to the election?”
    https://www.2gb.com/i-wouldnt-trust-him-pauline-hanson-furious-over-turnbulls-trip-to-bali/

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    pat

    ends with plenty of paragraphs meant to debunk the savings:

    23 Oct: ABC: Want cheaper power bills? The Government says it can save you up to $800 a year
    By national consumer affairs reporter Amy Bainbridge
    Some households will save more than $800 a year on their power bills, the Federal Government says, as part of measures to protect consumers and businesses from rising energy costs.
    Prime Minister Scott Morrison said the Coalition was prepared to use “a big stick” to stop energy companies gouging Australians…

    What is the Government proposing?
    •A default power price for all customers
    Mr Morrison said: “The first one is to empower customers with a price safety net and to end the loyalty tax put on customers all around the country simply because they’ve stayed with their electricity company, they pay more. That has to end.”

    •Increase regulator’s power to crack down on anti-competitive practices
    “Secondly, to give ourselves, as a government and through the Parliament, a big stick to keep these big energy companies in line, to stop the gouging, to ensure they pass on the savings that are being achieved in wholesale prices.”

    • Ensure power companies invest to meet energy demands
    “Thirdly, forcing energy companies to buy ahead and contract reliable energy supply into the market — fair dinkum power, as you’ve heard me call it — from the generators, so we can keep the lights on and we don’t see a repeat of the fiasco we saw in South Australia.”

    •Backing investment in new power generators
    “There needs to be more reliable power generation going into the system to ensure that that can get prices down,” Mr Morrison said.

    ***The Prime Minister said there would be big savings once the plan was in place by July next year, which is after the next election…READ ON
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-10-23/federal-govt-energy-policy-save-households-hundreds-of-dollars/10418994

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    TdeF

    Pat, how do you drop six comments in place while I can only type one? Appreciated, amazing and a little frustrating but thanks.

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    ghl

    I just heard that Malcolm ( HHHK-PTOOOIE ) will represent Australia at an ocean conference. Extreme stupidity to go along with that. Organise a sweepstake on how much he will commit Australia to. He’s not even in Parliament.
    I see a future where MT announces a $B commitment and says ” But I WAS representing Australia, you agreed.”
    He’ll do it just to make this government look bad.
    Dumbo ScoMo… How many times does MT have to spit in our face before you wake up.
    If you renege on his actions, the greens will hate you, if you back him, everyone else will hate you.
    And you will look so silly.

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    pat

    I can’t think of anything that has provoked more outrage than Turnbull going to Bali, yet theirABC has not a word on it so far!

    can’t find Morrison’s full statement, but this is close enough. Farr clearly isn’t outraged (no surprise):

    23 Oct: news.com.au: Scott Morrison hands Malcolm Turnbull surprising new gig
    EVEN though he’s in the government’s bad books, Malcolm Turnbull has been handed a surprising new role that comes with some very handy perks.
    by Malcolm Farr; with AAP
    DESPITE being reviled by some Liberals for “losing” Wentworth, Malcolm Turnbull soon will be an international statesman for Australia.
    And his special status will come with an unprecedented entitlement to tap taxpayers’ funds for flights anywhere, perhaps a hint he will be given a global role.

    Prime Minister Scott Morrison today confirmed his predecessor would be representing the government at a summit in Bali late this month.
    And it has been revealed Mr Turnbull has been granted a unique international airfare pass which will allow him to fly when he wants, where he wants…

    Mr Morrison today told parliament he had discussed Mr Turnbull subbing in for him with Indonesian President Joko Widodo
    “I was unable to follow through on that invitation and so, to ensure that we had very senior-level representation – which was well-received by the President of Indonesia – I did request the former prime minister to represent us at that conference, and he’ll be there representing the policies of our government,” said the Prime Minister.

    “In that capacity, I think he presents a very serious, a very senior, and a very duly recognised status of our relationship with Indonesia.
    “And I know that his attendance at that summit will be well-recognised and appreciated by President Widodo, and I thank him for representing Australia on that occasion.”…

    ***Mr Turnbull sent a tweet supporting Mr Sharma and also sent private messages to him, but did not actively campaign while he was overseas…
    https://www.news.com.au/national/politics/scott-morrison-hands-malcolm-turnbull-surprising-new-gig/news-story/d88d6f4e6dd4d271b1a248f2f022214c

    ***the “tweet” is AAP, and it’s mentioned all over the MSM.
    here it is:

    13 Sept: TWEET: Turnbull
    Congratulations from Lucy and me to @DaveSharma – new Liberal candidate for Wentworth. As a diplomat Dave has represented Australia magnificently overseas, and now if elected will make a great contribution in our national parliament.
    https://twitter.com/TurnbullMalcolm/status/1040285066759430144

    Phelps hadn’t even confirmed she was running when that tweet was sent:

    16 Sept: Guardian: AAP: Kerryn Phelps to run as independent in Wentworth and urges voters to put Liberals last

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    pat

    22 Oct: ClimateChangeNews: US-China trade war spills into Green Climate Fund
    Global green fund gets back on track with $1bn splurge, but US vetoed a project that would have loaned $100m to China
    By Megan Darby
    The first Chinese bid for finance from the Green Climate Fund (GCF) was deferred on Saturday, after the US board member blocked it.
    In a sign of US-China tensions spilling into the climate finance arena, Mathew Haarsager, a US treasury official, vetoed a $100 million loan for green development in Shandong province.

    He and Japan’s Hiroshi Matsuura raised concerns about the accountability of sub-projects and potential use of funds for research and development of commercial products.

    The $1.5 billion programme also already had enough sources of cash, Haarsager argued: “We don’t see a compelling case for GCF financing being additional here.” The Asian Development Bank, French and German development banks, Shandong local governments and the private sector are named as co-financers…

    After consultations, Matsuura said he would not stand against the proposal, leaving the US in sole opposition…

    Earlier in the meeting, the board considered a proposal that would have removed the ability of an individual member to veto decisions, but could not agree on a voting system that everyone considered fair. This apparently innocuous procedural issue has proved the “toughest nut to crack”, said co-chair Paul Oquist, defying resolution for five years.

    These were hitches in a generally productive meeting that went some way to reassure climate watchers, following a complete breakdown in boardroom relations in July.
    The board approved 19 projects worth $1 billion, including a slimmed-down version of a controversial water security project from oil-rich hosts Bahrain.

    It agreed to trigger a fresh round of fundraising, with rich countries expected to deliver pledges at an event in autumn 2019…
    The decision to officially launch replenishment was “encouraging”, agreed Karma Tshering of Bhutan. He added: “We now need developed countries to step up and make significant pledges, so replenishment becomes a reality.”
    http://www.climatechangenews.com/2018/10/22/us-china-trade-war-spills-green-climate-fund/

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    pat

    from CarbonBrief: North Sea new investments reach three-year high
    Investments in new North Sea oil and gas projects have hit £3bn in 2018, reports the Financial Times, saying this is the highest level since 2015. The marker was passed after two projects – led by BP and Shell and due to begin production in 2020 – received regulatory approval on Monday, it adds. The two projects represent £430m of investment, says the Scotsman. They will seek to tap reserves of 20m barrels of oil, say the Times and City AM.

    Meanwhile an opinion piece in the Financial Times argues that growth in US gas output, exported as liquified natural gas (LNG), will “meet Europe’s urgent need for gas”.
    The article follows reports in the Wall Street Journal that the German government will co-finance a $576m LNG import terminal on the country’s northern coast.

    The paper describes the move as a “win for Trump” that will “open Germany up to US LNG”. The paper says that the project had been stalled for years and calls the move a “key concession to President Trump as he tries to loosen Russia’s grip on Europe’s largest energy market”. The paper also quotes a German government spokesperson saying the decision was down to national economic interests rather than US pressure.

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    pat

    only the wealthy should fly:

    22 Oct: UK Independent: ‘Electrofuels’ that increase plane ticket price by 60% only way to clean up air travel, report finds
    ‘There is a cost to this, but in light of how cheap subsidised air travel has become, and the incalculable cost of runaway climate change, it’s a price worth paying’
    by Josh Gabbatiss
    New fuels and accompanying hikes in ticket prices will be essential to clean up air travel and avoid the worst effects of climate change, according to a new report…

    In its analysis, European green transport group Transport and Environment (T&E) found that replacing fossil fuels in planes with “electrofuels” is the “only technically viable solution that would allow aviation to exist in a world that avoids catastrophic climate change”…

    This will present a challenge to consumers as well as the industry, as the expense of these fuels means the cost of a plane ticket is projected to rise 58 per cent if they replace kerosene in all aircraft.
    “The good news is that radically cleaner aviation is possible even with today’s technology,” said Andrew Murphy, aviation manager at T&E…

    Electrofuels are produced by combining hydrogen with carbon extracted from CO2. Ideally, the hydrogen would be produced using renewable electricity to obtain it from water, and this would be combined with CO2 sucked from the atmosphere.
    If such a process was implemented on a large scale, it would be effectively carbon neutral – but it would also cost up to six times more than jet fuel…
    https://www.independent.co.uk/environment/air-travel-aeroplane-fuel-climate-change-carbon-emissions-electrofuels-kerosene-a8595946.html

    above is full of links, but none to the actual report! following links to page where you can then download the 34-page report:

    22 Oct: Transport&Environment: Radically cleaner air travel possible but governments need to act now – NGO
    By driving out the use of fossil kerosene fuel through carbon pricing and requiring aircraft to switch to synthetic fuels, the climate impact of flying can be reduced dramatically, according to a new report (LINK) by Transport & Environment (T&E)…

    While high profile promises such as short-haul electric aircraft or more efficient aircraft designs every 20 years won’t be sufficient to solve aviation’s climate problem, new near-zero-carbon electrofuels can be produced today and deployed immediately using existing engines and infrastructure…
    https://www.transportenvironment.org/press/radically-cleaner-air-travel-possible-governments-need-act-now-%E2%80%93-ngo

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      Chad

      “Electrofuels” ( yet to be proven ?) will be incredibly expensive, most likely more costly than fossil fuels with a high carbon tax added.
      Either way, it would be another step towards the dismantling of civilisation as we currently enjoy it. Transportation is one of the cornerstones of civilisation.
      Aviation (mass air transport) is only viable if large volumes of paying passengers can be attracted.
      Very high fuel costd will destroy the economics and force unaffordable ticket pricing and demolish the current business model…forcing costs ever higher.
      Sure , a few wealthy travelers (and politicians !) would still be able to afford it , but mass air travel would be finished.

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    pat

    22 Oct: CNS News: UN’s Plan on Climate Change: End Capitalism
    By Nicolas Loris
    (Nicolas Loris, an economist, focuses on energy, environmental and regulatory issues as the Herbert and Joyce Morgan fellow at The Heritage Foundation)
    What will it take to keep the planet habitable?
    According to some eco-warriors, all that’s necessary is to end capitalism—the one economic system that has lifted billions from poverty and suffering.
    The latest United Nations Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change report led Eric Holthaus, a Grist writer, to tweet enthusiastically, “The world’s top scientists just gave rigorous backing to systematically dismantle capitalism as a key requirement to maintaining civilization and a habitable planet.”
    The sentiment is not new. Three years ago, while pushing for the Paris Climate Accord, U.N. climate official Christiana Figueres described the strategy this way: ETC

    To accomplish such a feat, the new report proposes an energy tax of epic proportions. It claims that, to keep warming in check, by 2030 we’ll need to impose a tax of between $135 and $5,500 on every ton of carbon emitted.
    And that’s just for starters. By the end of the century, the authors say, we’ll have to jack the tax up to as much as $27,000 per ton.

    How would that play out in the real world, where conventional carbon-emitting fuels currently generate about 80 percent of all energy consumed? Carbon taxes of the magnitude suggested in the report would bankrupt families and businesses and trigger a global economic disaster.
    Using the same model as the federal government’s Energy Information Administration, Heritage Foundation analysts estimated the economic impacts of a $37 per ton carbon tax—less than a third of the panel’s lowest recommendation.
    The model indicates that, at $37 per ton, the tax would reduce U.S. aggregate gross domestic product by more than $2.5 trillion over the next 17 years. That translates to more than $21,000 in lost income, per family. It would also destroy more than a million jobs, half of them in energy-intensive manufacturing sectors.
    The higher the tax goes, the greater the economic damage. At $135 per ton, the model crashes…

    According to a poll from the Energy Policy Institute at the University of Chicago and the AP-NORC Center for Public Research Affairs, only a little more than half of us would shell out as much as a buck a month to reduce carbon emissions. At $20 a month, the poll found, only 27 percent of the public is willing to pay to combat climate change. Even among households earning more than $100,000, only 46 percent were willing to pay as much as $20 a month…

    In the developing world, more than 1.4 billion people still suffer from energy poverty. The U.N. report means nothing to them. Their priority is gaining access to energy and the economic growth it allows…
    Offering solutions to climate change that would require a complete makeover of the global economy and plunge developed nations into deprivation are unrealistic and counterproductive.
    https://www.cnsnews.com/commentary/nicolas-loris/uns-plan-climate-change-end-capitalism

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      Bill In Oz

      Socialists and greenies have always believed in the ‘One World’ government Coolaide. And will never stop trying to persuade us to drink it.

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    Hanrahan

    OK, let’s talk Jamal Khashoggi. Nothing I have heard makes sense, what obviously happened is too obvious to be believed in the world of professional spooks. My gut feeling has been that “they” are goading Trump into unwise, precipitous action but that wouldn’t be the Saudis, Trump is their best friend.

    I’m an innocent bystander who listens a lot and draws few hard conclusions, and Dave Janda didn’t “convince” me of anything. But worth listening to anyway. He is at least logical.

    Hint: It was the Russians.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbKbGZ4K0CQ skip the first 1:30

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      Bill In Oz

      The Saudi regime leadership is stupid enough to think that no one would notice him missing..Just one of those things that characterises brutal dictatorships…

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    observa

    All I know is anyone who tries to marry renewables with affordable, reliable power is ultimately committing political suicide but there’s no shortage of hopefuls trying to disprove a fundamental axiom of engineering that you can’t produce a reliable system from unreliable componentry. True you can firm the unfirm as they like to describe their unreliables nowadays but it costs big bucks.

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    Ian

    This topic is an attempt to re-write history. The Abbott 2013 landslide had far far more to to with the Rudd-Gillard-Rudd debacle than with climate change. If Abbott believed his “Climate Change is Crap” mantra why did he sign Australia up to the Paris Agreement in 2015? Why did he set an emissions target of between a 26-28% reduction of CO2 emissions from 2005 levels by 2030? Why dd he set a RET of 33,000 gigawatt hours to be sourced from renewables by 2020? There is criticism of Turnbull as being a climate change afficionado but he did nothing more than continue with Abbott’s policies.

    Abbott was a very poor PM who alienated the majority of voters by breaking his 2013 pre-election promises in the 2014 budget. He was deposed by his colleagues after being warned in February 2015 that if he didn’t change he was out. At the time he said “This is a wake-up call. Good government starts today”. It didn’t of course so he was rolled. He then promised “no sniping, no undermining” more promises that he then broke.

    And as for the angst about Turnbull going to the Bali meeting, commenters here seem to know northing of the way politics works.

    In his desire to stem the landslide in Wentworth, Morrison proposed moving Australia’s embassy in Israel from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem. This infuriated Indonesia, a country with which Australia is hoping to seal a trade agreement to be signed by Christmas. Turnbull and the Indonesian president are on good terms and had a good working relationship. Sending Turnbull to Bali where he can talk to the Indonesians, provides a way to defuse Indonesia’s anger and thus assist with the sealing of the trade agreement. It is incredible that commenters here cannot understand Morrison’s motives.

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      el gordo

      All good points Ian, Paris was meant as a sop which Abbott thought he could alter later, but the Turnbull coup brought an end to that.

      Morrison’s motives are dodgy, lots of bad calls, he appears to be a political minnow but I’ll wait until Xmas for my final judgement. Turnbull should not have been sent to Bali because he has a large ego and no brain.

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      Gee Aye

      I think I wrote the same about 8 screens above and in fewer words. The rose coloured Abbott glasses are fading to reality

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    WXcycles

    So what’s this all about? What’s the point of the gripes?

    Here’s my view. Basically I don’t think climate change is a ‘problem’, it’s natural, it’s normal, it happens on scales much larger than any human life period, longer than virtually all civilizations or empires. In a lifetime we see a fragment of one part, of one side, of one cycle, of a climate fluctuation. A ‘change’, if we must.

    And for goodness sake! We have been in just one small fragment, of one side, of one cycle, of one climate variability wobble, for the ENTIRE history of modern science! And without any doubt, that wobble/perturbation began as a secular natural variation, operating over a thousand years, or more—probably much longer.

    So what do I want? What do you want? What the hell is this all about?

    What I want, is for the politicians of our country to stop being all OCD about this one fraction, of one side, of one cycle of one perturbation and constantly turning it into a F***ING political pogo-stick! I want politicians to get back to their proper damned job! I don’t want to hear their opinion about ‘climate-change’.

    I want a see a politician who when gets asked for their opinion on political ‘climate-change’, decks the reporter who asked them so that they won’t dare ask it again.

    That person I’d vote for!

    I want everyone to stop playing politics with this idiocy called ‘climate-change’.

    Stop interfering in science! Stop interfering in energy supply and technology. Stop using it as an excuse to interfere in economy! Get it completely OFF THE AGENDA! I don’t want to know about this ‘climate-change’ topic anymore. The more I hear about it outside of its actual context of science, the more I detest all politicians and all media. They make me never want to vote again.

    Not just not for the Lib/Nats, I’ll not vote for again for any politician who keeps using this “climate-change” agenda as a stupid warped political circus. I’m done with it. I’m not prepared to put up with it any longer. I won’t vote for ANY politician, And all the political ‘sales people’ in here, to hell with all of you! You’re just as bad as the politicians and the media!

    This is a topic about science and that fact is lost, it’s gone, now its just silly politics, and that’s all. I don’t have to listen to people make a political circus out of everything. I will stop listening, I will stop reading, I will stop voting—The End! No more having an opinion to be played with, no more listening to fools tell me why it all matters, and why I should vote, or who I should vote for. To hell with all that junk, I’m done with the lot of it.

    I can choose! And my choice is to not listen any more, to not vote ever again, to not support any candidate, to not have or maintain any political opinion, to not give a damn about any policy ‘argument’, ever again.

    I see nothing in this muck that I want to even think about again. It is the lowest level of political garbage, and it’s all the system ever throws up at me.

    That’s my democratic choice, I’m consciously making it. I don’t care what other’s do, but that’s what I’m doing, and all this cr*p about slomo and all the rest of them, it’s just DRIVEL. To hell with Democracy if this is all it is.

    All this political ‘climate-change’ drivel does is to make it very easy for me to decide to choose to pay no further attention to any politicians, or to any media, or to any Govt BS., or to political ‘opinion-makers’–ever again. To just not care, to not have any opinions, knowledge or interest in any part of this political climate-change garbage. I have no intention whatsoever of voting ever again. It’s the one choice I do have that’s crystal clear, that makes more sense than anything else, and that’s my democratic choice. That’s what I think of this circus passed off as the democratic process.

    I think everyone in here should take a holiday from the Internet, and especially from the habitual political idiocy, and all media (I repeat myself), and have a think about what you want. What do you do this for? What will satisfy you? What’s your objective? Do you even know?

    My objective is this: I want this ridiculous political ‘climate-change’ topic infesting our world DEAD! Gone! Never revisited! And anyone who brings it up again gets crucified, stoned, tarred-and-feathered, milestone around the neck with disposal in deep water. I’m done with the whole political ‘climate-change’ charade. I’m done with reasoning with idiots. I’m done with ‘watermelons’, ‘unionists’ and ‘conservatives’, they’re all the same. They’re all playing the same stupid game. If this is just politics for you, then you’re neurotic.

    We’ve been hijacked by politics! Our minds have been hijacked by it. And all these gushy jabbering political clowns are pushing it along, like a never-ending drug-dispensary of petty intrigues and loud hysterical imagined nothings. If you want the politics to continue like that, it’s not about scientific learning or understanding that’s for sure. Political entertainment is all it is. Something to endlessly gripe at. Are you not entertained?

    But I’m done with your all political climate-change nonsense and all your upbraiding to vote some favored way.

    /TILT

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