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Climate change causes more tsunamis — The ABC will believe anything

Too much panic is never enough. Fran Kelly asks Stephen O’Brien, lawyer and UN official, about that the effects of climate change which are “already being felt”. She does not blink when his answer includes more frequent and more severe tsunamis. His qualifier…  It’s not a question of “if”, but “when”.

Yes, yes, this is “best and brightest” ideas from around the world, apparently.

 ABC Radio National

Fran Kelly: “Give us a sense of the effects [of climate change] which are already being felt in our region and discussed at this conference.” (at 1 minute)

Stephen O’Brien: “The Pacific Region, and particularly the Pacific Island countries whose land, as you rightly say, are the ones just above sea-level, are the ones that really do have the greatest challenge when it comes to climate change effects on humanitarian need, with the regularity of cyclones, tropical storms, and tsunamis coming through [at 1.30 minutes]. It’s not a question of if, it’s a question of when. And we see that [these] effects of climate change seem to be exacerbated so that they are more frequent and even at times more severe…”

ABC gives free advertising for “the cause”

ABC staff are happy to ask loaded and leading Dorothy-dixer-type* science questions to people who have no scientific background, while pretending they are real journalists, then accept everything the interviewee says with dutiful nods. So O’Brien gets time to do his advertising, but if he gets “caught” mixing up his science, he’ll just say he’s not a scientist. No loss. Free marketing for “the cause”.

It’s not just poor journalism, it’s pravda-downunder. Lawyers-of-a-left-leaning get free gushing space, but when does the ABC ask any questions of actual prize winning NASA scientists, Nobel prize winners, geologists or meteorologists who hold differing views?  The problem is not that O’Brien is not a scientist, it’s the one-sided blind tilt — the ABiasC.  Fran Kelly is her own climate expert, she “knows” what the climate will do, and she won’t ask people who disagree with her views who are far more qualified than her or O’Brien. It’s easy questions for “friends”, and the Cloak of Invisibility for enemies.

If there is a trend in South Pacific Cyclones, it’s down.

All across the South Pacific, the trends for cyclones are flat.

Looks like CO2 helps prevent cyclones. Burn more oil, eh? ;-)

Cyclone Pam, South Pacific Cyclones, Intensity, Frequency, Graph

Number and intensity of Cyclones in the South Pacific | Source: Met Service Blog 

It doesn’t matter what his qualifications are, anyone who pretends solar panels can stop tsunamis ought to be grilled.

h/t to Michael K

*Dorothy Dixer questions means an obviously friendly, planted question.

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128 comments to Climate change causes more tsunamis — The ABC will believe anything

  • #

    Another thing about cyclones that the consensus denies is that they show the combined influence of latent heat, clouds and weather is effectively negative feedback. A cyclone is a maximally efficient version of the global heat engine that drives the weather. The Second Law tells us that a heat engine can not warm its source of heat, which for a cyclone (and weather) is the surface. The evidence is the trail of cold water left in their wake. If the warmists were right, the massive positive feedback from latent heat and clouds would leave a trail of warmer water in the wake of cyclones and hurricanes.
    George

    401

    • #
      tom0mason

      co2isnotevil,

      Well said.
      Weather systems are nature’s fast method of managing energy, oceanic cyclic movements are the slower method of management. With both energizing by the sun.

      180

      • #

        Both also direct the path from one equilibrium state to another whose chaotic nature is often conflated with the simplicity of establishing what the new equilibrium state will be.

        130

    • #
      Whoppers

      BOM are at it again. A July “cyclone” over Solomons has been named “Raquel”. Have a good look at it. At the central pressure, the spillage, the isobars surrounding it, and the pressure over Australia. You’d grind your teeth if it wasn’t such nonsense.

      81

    • #
      Just Thinkin'

      I’m waiting for the person who gave
      you “the red thumb” to make a comment.
      Waiting…..waiting….waiting…

      Oops… fell asleep.

      41

      • #

        Me too. But like most who only accept science that conforms to the green narrative, they are afraid of the political consequences of being so wrong for so long.

        20

  • #
    Andrew

    Can we prove CO2s WONT cause more tsunamis? They have the power to produce any other imaginable outcome such as making it simultaneously rain less and more.

    251

    • #

      It can only be proven that the effect from incremental CO2 is at least 4x smaller than claimed by the IPCC (the consensus) and that any effect incremental CO2 may have on cyclones is somewhere between nothing and negligible.

      251

    • #
      tom0mason

      Andrew

      Argument from Ignorance

      Ad Ignorantium

      (also known as: appeal to ignorance, absence of evidence, argument from personal astonishment, argument from Incredulity)

      Description: The assumption of a conclusion or fact based primarily on lack of evidence to the contrary. Usually best described by, “absence of evidence is not evidence of absence.”

      Logical Form:

      X is true because you cannot prove that X is false.

      X is false because you cannot prove that X is true.

      Example:

      Although we have proven that the moon is not made of spare ribs, we have not proven that its core cannot be filled with them; therefore, the moon’s core is filled with spare ribs.

      Explanation: There is an infinity of things we cannot prove — the moon being filled with spare ribs is one of them. Now you might expect that any “reasonable” person would know that the moon can’t be filled with spare ribs, but you would be expecting too much. People make wild claims, and get away with them, simply on the fact that the converse cannot otherwise be proven.

      You ask “Can we prove CO2s WONT cause more tsunamis?” IMO why waste yet more public money on futile arguments when observation say the probability is so remote.
      As far as can be seen and measured CO2 at current or even higher levels are not problem in nature. Atmospheric CO2 gas which has NO measured negative impact even at many times the current atmospheric levels.
      This observation has not prevented the wild imaginings of some commentators saying it will bring shrinking fish stocks, coral die-out, increased drought, more storms, increased number of floods, reduced crops, meat-eating to become unsustainable, etc.
      However these things are not happening, even as the the human population continues to rise, our ability to grow and farm more food has increased faster, and all this on less land than ever before.
      The argument that 400 parts per million (i.e. same ratio as 4¢ in $100) of CO2 in the atmosphere would change the number of earthquake, volcanoes or Tsunamis is just scaremongering propaganda.

      222

    • #

      Andrew, although I sympathize with your dilemma you cannot prove a negative.

      Trying to prove a negative is a fallacy known as proving non-existence. The burden of proof rests upon the proponent of the theory or claim. In a debate, the resolution is never framed as a negative. In this case, the resolution would be, “RESOLVED, Increased atmospheric CO2 will cause [an increase in] tsunamis. The fallacy is sometimes mistaken for an argument from ignorance, argumentum ignorantiam.
      An argument from ignorance, often espoused by rent-seeking scientists, “We don’t know of any other forcings that can explain the warming of a measly three-quarters of a degree since the end of the little ice age, the coldest period of the current Holocene interglacial, so it must be the increase of atmospheric CO2 that is responsible” was actually on a web page on the NASA website! It is different from proving non-existence in that the fallacy claims that if you cannot prove that it doesn’t exist or it isn’t true then it must exist or be true. It makes one think of black swans. It was believed that they didn’t exist. That changed when they were discovered.

      From http://www.logicallyfallacious.com/index.php/logical-fallacies/146-proving-non-existence.

      Although it may be possible to prove non-existence in special situations, such as showing that a container does not contain certain items, one cannot prove universal or absolute non-existence. The proof of existence must come from those who make the claims.

      110

      • #
        Richard of NZ

        Dear Eddy

        Regarding black swans. In my experience all swans are black, as I have never seen a swan that is not black. All claims to the contrary are figments of someone’s imagination.

        I hope that my experience is useful in explaining “climate change” the political/religious movement to take over the lives of individuals.

        p.s. religion can be described as failed/pseudoscience anyway. It was originally a means of explaining the natural world but it did so by inventing unexplainable entities a.k.a. god/s

        81

        • #

          Regarding black swans. In my experience all swans are black, as I have never seen a swan that is not black

          http://blackswanevents.org/?page_id=26

          The term Black Swan originates from the (Western) belief that all swans are white because these were the only ones accounted for. However, in 1697 the Dutch explorer Willem de Vlamingh discovered black swans in Australia.

          Maybe they call it a white swan even in the land down under? ;-)

          40

          • #
            Sceptical Sam

            Only in the Psychology Department at the University of Western Australia, Eddy.

            They specialise in Cognitive Dissonance.

            40

          • #
            Len

            There are actually a colony of white swans in Northam, Western Australia. They were brought from England and live on the Avon River.

            10

            • #
              Bill Johnston

              That is bs. I’ve never, ever seen swans on the Avon; never seen the Avon either except in England.

              If there are any swans, its because either is dark or because of global warming.

              mutter …. mutter

              20

              • #
                Owen Morgan

                The name “Avon” comes from the Welsh “afon“, which just means “river”; there are at least three rivers called “Avon” in England. In Chile, they couldn’t decide between white swans and black swans, so went for a Black-necked Swan (there is also the all-white Coscoroba Swan, but it’s not a real swan).

                00

  • #
    Peter Miller

    This is how It works:

    ‘Climate change’ causes the Eart’h's crust to warm up, which means it expands, leaving a gap between it and the super hot nickel/iron core of our planet.

    The pressure release allows the core to expand abruptly, causing the reactivation of major subsea faults, which in turn create tsunamis.

    Anyone can use Mannian logic to prove just about anything, the problem is the ‘science reporters’ at the ABC and the BBC are either unable to discern obvious BS from the factual truth, or have been instructed to report all obvious BS on climate as being the gospel truth.

    331

    • #

      The real problem is that consensus climate science has added so much excess complexity to provide the wiggle room required to support extraordinary claims that understanding climate science has become too complex for mere mortals to comprehend, thus they have no choice but to defer to authority. The recognized authority is the IPCC and the consensus it crafted with the express purpose of supporting its chartered agenda.

      221

      • #
        Originalsteve

        I think about th emass of the crust and how much heat you’d need inthe atmosphere just to heat the air, let alone the crust so it could expand…seems ludicrous to me just looking at it logically…..

        60

  • #
    Colin Henderson

    We have the same problem here in Canada with the CBC. It seems like every interview eventually comes around to global warming and climate change which, according to the CBC impacts everything known to man. And the evidence is everywhere, finding dirt under a rock is proof enough for them.

    220

  • #
    DHF

    What happened to watchdog journalism? Are there none critical journalists left in mainstream media?

    190

    • #
      Hugh

      Watchdogs are watching ‘the consensus’, not criticizing it.

      Any criticism is considered ‘skepticism’, or ‘false balance’, which is a ‘bias’. The ‘consensus’ has green-progressive journalists in its iron fist. The consensus will be revealed to be alarmist in the end, but the progressive-green-good-doers will have something else on their mind at that point.

      It will take at least 10 years for climate alarmism to shut down, maybe 20, provided that the temperatures keep rising slow or turn down.

      161

    • #

      There’s another depressing thing happening as well. All of the conservative media is slowly moving behind paywalls, so anything that they may provide as an alternative view, will be hidden from general readership. Meanwhile, the Leftist media is fully free for all readers (taxpayer funded in many cases) and that’s what the general populace will be seeing and believing, as there is (or will be) no alternative viewpoints. Yes, alternative viewpoints are being presented in blogs and the like, but the majority of people read/watch the MSM. The Left is let free to promote their propaganda and that then becomes the truth.

      200

      • #
        King Geo

        100% correct bemused and like all fellow “AGW Skeptics” we are not amused. Andrew Bolt is out there telling the truth of the matter, ie that the “Theory of AGW” is a farce – he regularly says this on his blog – being from WA I don’t read the Sun Herald, Daily Telegraph or Advertiser but surely his views on the “Theory of AGW” appear in those daily newspapers. Then you have the Bolt Report on the Ten Network. By leftist media you mean the ABC, which being totally govt funded, is a disgrace given that it is 100% biased wrt the “AGW Religion”, and never gives the other side of the story, ie the truth. At least the other leftie MSM outlets, ie the Fairfax Group MSM outlets are independent.

        31

        • #

          Even Andrew Bolt’s blog is often pay walled nowadays.

          I don’t agree with everything that he posts, but his climate posts are spot on; unfortunately, his style turns me off and he has become very irritating, to the extent that I’ve turned off reading his blog or watching his program.

          The conservative side needs somewhat more pleasant characters to put forward the alternative case, rather than abrasive personalities that even turn away supporters.

          21

        • #
          David-of-Cooyal in Oz

          G’day K G,
          The SMH is a Fairfax publication and has an editorial policy of not publishing any letter supporting the sceptics view. I’ve received an email from them saying that. So you can’t even rely on that mob to be even handed. I found that out when I sent a letter to their editor in support of Maurice Newman.
          Cheers,
          Dave B

          30

    • #
      Dennis

      When there are schools of journalism employing militant leftist student activists of decades past what hope is there for students?

      I recently read that Wendy Bacon, one of the noisiest student unionists of the 1960s, a laws graduate, is now lecturing in journalism. I understand that she is no longer permitted to practise law.

      81

    • #
      Robber

      Watchdog journalists are there to knock down anyone who strays from the consensus. Searching for the truth? Forget it.

      50

  • #
    DHF

    Look at what Wikipedia has to say about roles of a journalist:
    “Matthew C. Nisbet, who has written on science communication,[2] has defined a “knowledge journalist” as a public intellectual who, like Walter Lippmann, David Brooks, Fareed Zakaria, Naomi Klein, Michael Pollan, Thomas Friedman, and Andrew Revkin, sees their role as researching complicated issues of fact or science which most laymen would not have the time or access to information to research themselves, then communicating an accurate and understandable version to the public as a teacher and policy advisor.”

    Knowledge journalists or maybe activists?

    150

    • #
      manalive

      Matthew C. Nisbet, who has written on science communication,[2] has defined a “knowledge journalist” as a public intellectual …

      What’s a ‘public intellectual’? Maybe it’s someone you can call anytime after hours or at weekends or stop on the street and ask questions such as ‘what’s the meaning of life?’.

      100

  • #
    King Geo

    It is all very simple. God created the universe – the pope says so. Man causes Global Warming – the pope says so. Us humans cause more Tsunamis and you might as well throw in more tornados and hurricanes/cyclones/typhoons as well – no doubt the pope will confirm this. What the pope is really saying is, borrowing a line from Monty Python, “We have been very naughty boys and girls”.

    120

  • #
    Andrew McRae

    To my eye (okay not just my eye, I checked it with an image editor) there is no significant difference between the left side of that chart and the right side in terms of total category 3,4,5 cyclones. Erasing the gales and storms, blurring the chart horizontally, boosting contrast, then doing a histogram on left and right halves gives two average colours which differ by less than 1.5 out of 255. The area under the curve is probably almost the same left and right, just that the big cyclones are clumped together on the right but more evenly distributed on the left.

    It’s different when you look at smaller regions of actual impact.
    When we checked eastern Australian cyclones three years ago on this forum we found a definite Elvis/Kenobi difference.

    Possibly the cyclone tracks were closer to the equator during the high PDO phase than they were (and will be) during the low PDO phase. If warming by itself caused cyclones to hit our East coast we should have seen them for the whole of the last 15 years. If the PDO is the main factor then we wouldn’t see them south of Rockhampton until after 2010, and though Yasi was just barely north of Rockhampton it did arrive pretty much on schedule in 2011. Cyclones should arrive more frequently in the next 10 years and it need not have anything to do with global warming.

    (Armchair critic caveats apply. Please do not use this comment for assessing TonyFromOz’s insurance premiums, thanks.)

    80

  • #
    Manfred

    The Pre-Paris Push (PPP) is in full drive. From the histrionics over the heat wave affecting London & Paris to the stifled nod toward the record low temperatures recently seen in Scotland, the MSM Apparatchiks are very, very hard at it, fulfilling the demands of their UN Green Masters. The camera shot on Centre Court yesterday in the Murray match showed a digital thermometer sitting in the 6PM evening sunshine on a radiating green metal surface at 40.1C, the announcer positively crowing. The curious thing was that the crowd looked relaxed and not at all heat stressed, many sitting with ties still on enjoying the occasion.

    The attribution of tsunamis to UN defined climate change (eg. due to anthropogenic effects) is extraordinarily ignorant. Still, we have seen this before, where the whole array of a country’s economic, industrial and social malaise were blamed on a single segment of the population.

    The fixated anthropogenic forcing ideation will be eclipsed soon. The makings of a change are underway, possibly with Grexit. If the Euro State (The ECB) fails all bets are off. Cohesion, as presented by the multinational acceptance of the absurd notion of decarbonisation for a non-problem will evaporate. No one in their right mind will be paying hard earned wonga into a mythical orifice of infinite Black Hole proportions. As I have already mentioned, there is no stipulated, theoretical end to it. The demand will be multigenerational. They weren’t kidding when they said your children, grand children, great grand children etc. ad nauseam would be paying.

    120

  • #
    Lawrie

    If it is OK for some twit to drag Alan Jones before the board because he left out a zero in some climate related comment We should be able to haul Frans derriere before it as well. I realise the ABC have complaint mechanism that never finds themselves in error but it is time for change and to have a truly independent arbiter. Me for example.

    191

  • #
    Yonniestone

    The ABC can produce all the trash journalism they want, but I strongly object to Australians giving one cent to support this leftoid sputum.

    Cut them loose from the taxpayers coffers and see how they last in the real world, going by the climate porn spat out in recent years they would give Zoo and Picture magazines a run for their money.

    Second thoughts those magazines are self aware of the inanity they produce, it’s a standard they aim for, so what’s the ABC’s standards?, could it be they are a rogue outfit operating with whatever the current leadership decides is the best left trending idea for the day?

    160

    • #
      Dennis

      When the Abbott Coalition Government was elected one in every eight Australians was living in poverty, on this basis alone why should taxpayer’s monies be granted to public broadcasters that operate as empires of like minded left leaning people who push political propaganda that at least half of the ovulation rejects?

      40

    • #
      clive

      If anyone thinks that the LNP are going to do anything about their ABC,I can inform you that we will be disappointed.I have Emailed Warren Truss,who is my local MP and he says that the board of the ABC is going to conduct the “Investigation”into itself.We all know how that is going to end,don’t we?

      80

      • #
        Dennis

        Clive in politics it often doesn’t pay to display your game plan before you are able to implement it, not only applies to politics. Over the next couple of years the government will accept the retirement of the Chairman and Directors and be able to replace them with their own choice of people. The new Board will have the power to force management to adhere to the Charter they are required to follow. And be able to retrench the Managing Director if they believe he is in breach of his responsibilities. On The Bolt Report last Sunday journalist and former ABC Director, Janet Albrechsten, said that if she was still on the Board and the others were behaving as they are now she would resign. Last year another former ABC Director, Michael Kroger, said that the present Board had been in breach of the Act ever since they were appointed.

        As for the ABC inquiry by ABC selected people, I agree, it is ridiculous and an exercise in futility.

        20

  • #
    ScotsmaninUtah

    “Tsunamis, El Ninos, La Ninas, los Burritos .. it’s all the same ..”

    Tsunamis ? of course CAGW is to blame, and this was on my preparedness list…..
    but I honestly forgot ! :o
    Damn it, I hate it when that happens.. :(

    Anyway here in Utah we do not get many Tsunamis…. although I will be keeping an eye on our Great Salt Lake, it has definitely being looking very “tidal” lately …

    … and for those at SkepticalScience who are fanfaring the coming of the “Super El Nino” also the result of blatant C02ers emitters …. the warnings are there for all to heed!

    However it is interesting to note that since 2012 the TAO/TRITON array has been in a “compromised state” where less than 40% of the sensors are now in operation. uhm ? :(

    http://www.pmel.noaa.gov/tao/jsdisplay/

    This means that those alarmists who are now predicting the “Super” must have gotten hold of the Gene Roddenberry version of the “no maintenance required” sensor array.
    OR
    they are falling back on the tried and tested statistical CFR method for replacing data that isn’t there … and there are lots of algorithms to choose from;
    RegEM
    RegEM-Ridge
    RegEM-TTLS (current favorite for when you have absolutely NO data)
    BoM (this is not an algorithm more of a secret burrito recipe )

    So be warned Tsunami, El Nino, placid lake (with tidal tendencies) or your fav burrito …
    Global Warming is to blame… :o

    111

  • #
  • #
    Ruairi

    The media we once would extol,
    Has surrendered to warmist control,
    Now two of a kind,
    As the blind lead the blind,
    To some fantasy climate-change goal.

    171

  • #
    TdeF

    About 10% of people used to go to university. Now it is probably closer to 20% with every post school course, from farming to cooking to waiting on tables now a degree. You can even get a PhD in the Lyrics of the Beatles. However formerly only 1 in 10, now perhaps 1 in 20 do hard science, physics, chemistry, mathematics. So only 1% of people do hard science beyond school. Certainly not self described ‘climate scientist’ Tim Flannery, chief Climate Commissioner and now bleating head of the ‘Climate Council’ funded presumably by Big Carbon and appropriately, Big Wind and the odd merchant banker.

    Everyone believes what they read. Why would someone lie about something so important? So tsunamis make sense. They are caused by the trace gas and industrial pollutant, CO2. Killer weather, most weather is really caused by the other terrible industrial pollutant produced by combustion, H2O. Parody is wasted though on true believers who believe what they read, especially if they do not understand it.

    An odd group are medical doctors like the current leader of the Australian Greens, Richard di Natalie people are were really good at hard science but often compassionate believers in CO2 driven climate change and especially ocean acidification. They believe what they are told. It is their training. However the fact is that seas are alkali and always will be. Convert a doctor today.

    131

    • #
      Dennis

      Too many believe what they want to believe, and quickly reject any truth that does not suit them.

      70

    • #
      Robert O

      Your estimates are probably close to the mark, but science students used to be drowned out by people studying law, arts and economics. Looking at the lower house, its full of the latter with only a handful with any understanding of science. To get a degree in science one used to have passed two first year subjects out of Chemistry, Physics or Mathematics, and these weren’t easy subjects with 60-70% pass rates.

      How else would you get most people to believe in the AGW hypothesis, apart from their ignorance, that climate is not controlled by solar input and its distribution from the tropics to the poles by the ocean currents and weather systems, rather by a gas with an atmospheric concentration of 0.04% and its elemental form essential to life itself.

      60

    • #
      Len

      Most of these Medical “doctors’ don’t actually have doctorates. They are double pass bachelor degrees. They are correctly described as medical practitioners. The registry is for Medical Practitioners, not medical doctors. Most of academia are not aware of this. I asked a university about this and they could not explain why this is so. There are a few around who have the MD degree. Doctor of medicine. Ken Fitch has an MD. He was the Australian Olympic Medical Officer and was the West Coast Eagles Medical Coordinator in the early days. Most people called him Ken. I have met an South African medical practitioner who has a M. Med. A Masters degree in Medicine. He told me it took him four years to do the course.
      Off course, the Americans call their first basic medical degree, MD to add to the confusion. With the Americans their Army sergeant is equivalent to the British Lance Corporal. So there you go.

      11

  • #
    el gordo

    Fran thinks she is on safe ground because the tsunami theory has history. Here is Richard Meares (Reuter 2009)

    ‘Quakes, volcanic eruptions, giant landslides and tsunamis may become more frequent as global warming changes the earth’s crust, scientists said on Wednesday.

    ‘Climate-linked geological changes may also trigger “methane burps,” the release of a potent greenhouse gas, currently stored in solid form under melting permafrost and the seabed, in quantities greater than all the carbon dioxide (CO2) in our air today.

    “Climate change doesn’t just affect the atmosphere and the oceans but the earth’s crust as well. The whole earth is an interactive system,” Professor Bill McGuire of University College London told Reuters, at the first major conference of scientists researching the changing climate’s effects on geological hazards.

    “In the political community people are almost completely unaware of any geological aspects to climate change.”

    100

  • #
    Dennis

    Did Frantic Kelly attend high school?

    61

    • #

      When one has belief, knowledge is a distraction and understanding a dangerous path paved with self-deceit that one could understand what the belief is all about.

      30

  • #
    Neville

    Indur Goklany has prepared a response to the latest garbage from the Pope and his left wing advisers.

    http://www.thegwpf.com/on-climate-change-energy-vatican-advisors-have-lost-their-moral-compass/

    Here is his summary from the PDF.

    Summary
    This paper is a commentary on the opening four sentences of the pontifical academies
    joint declaration, Climate Change and the Common Good: A Statement of The Problem
    and the Demand for Transformative Solutions, echoes of which resonate in the recent
    papal encyclical. The paper finds that the premise behind the academies’ call for deep
    decarbonization and a rapid reduction in fossil-fuel use is fundamentally flawed.
    The academies claim that fossil-fuel use has reduced the world’s sustainability and
    resilience. But despite record human numbers and carbon dioxide emissions, human
    well being has never been higher, by virtually any measure whether climate-sensitive
    or not. The average person has never lived longer or been healthier or wealthier. Living
    standards are at their highest ever; poverty, hunger, malnutrition, and mortality
    from vector-borne diseases and extreme events are at record lows. There is no indication
    that these trends are being reversed.
    Prior to the Industrial Revolution virtually all of humanity’s basic needs – food,
    fibre, fuel, energy, materials – were met by the rest of nature. Fossil fuel technologies
    and associated economic development increased the terrestrial biosphere’s natural
    productivity to provide these basic needs, shifted humanity’s demand for energy
    away from biomass and animal power, and increased its reliance on man-made fibres
    and materials. Consequently, the share of humanity’s demand for life’s basic necessities
    filled by the rest of nature has never been smaller despite exploding demand.
    Also, because of carbon dioxide fertilization, nitrogen deposition, and possibly a more
    equable climate, all caused by fossil-fuel use, the terrestrial biosphere’s productivity
    now exceeds pre-industrial levels. This allows the biosphere to sustain larger biomass.
    Thus greater fossil-fuel use has been accompanied by advances in both human
    wellbeing and terrestrial biosphere’s ability to sustain biomass. That is, our reliance on
    fossil fuels has increased the world’s sustainability and resilience. Another result has
    been that conversion of wild land to farmland has almost peaked worldwide, allowing
    some societies to reserve land for conservation.
    Also contrary to the academies’ claims, inequality, which is secondary to poverty,
    hunger, and malnutrition as indicators of well being, has shrunk among the world’s
    population in recent decades. Moreover, there is no empirical evidence for their claim
    that agriculture is ‘doubtless causing’ hundreds of thousands if not millions of extinctions.
    The academies’ assertion that fossil-fuel use poses existential risks for the poor
    and future generations must necessarily rest on models of future impacts of climate
    change. But impact models use climate models that overestimate global warming
    two- to four-fold. Moreover, neither climate nor impact models have been validated
    using external data, climate models often contradict each other regarding the direction
    of precipitation change at regional and local scales, and the impact models do
    not fully account for the increased adaptive capacity of future generations, who will
    be wealthier and technologically-more sophisticated than we are.
    The academies’ ‘transformative solutions’ are based on a delusion that economic
    alternatives to cheap fossil fuels are widely available, a notion belied by the government
    mandates and subsidies that prop up these alternative energy sources. These
    purported solutions would therefore be counterproductive for both humanity and
    the rest of nature. They would slow the ongoing broad advance in human well being,
    retard poverty reduction, and reduce the ability to adapt and cope with adversity in
    general and climate change in particular, especially harming the poor. They would
    also reduce the future productivity of the terrestrial biosphere, increasing pressure
    on species and ecosystems.
    In exchange for reducing both humanity and the rest of nature’s sustainability and
    resilience, the academies would solve future problems that may not even exist or, if
    they do, might be more easily solved by future generations who should be richer, both
    economically and technologically. Essentially, these policies would give up real gains
    in human and environmental well being to solve hypothetical problems forecast by
    models which, if they have a track record, is for inaccuracy.
    The academies are right that climate change is a moral and ethical issue. Unfortunately,
    they are on its wrong side. Apparently their moral compass is broken

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  • #
    Dennis

    Taxpayer’s monies and ABC/SBS amounts to close to $2 billion a year cost to federal budget, approximately enough to construct two public teaching hospitals a year. And much of our money is being used for leftists propaganda promotion free of charge, no responsibility for management to secure revenue and manage to provide shareholders with an acceptable Return On Investment. Managing Director Mark Scott claims ABC is independent. Really? I understand that children who live at home with their parents are dependents.

    Climate change is only one example of relentless brain washing by the public broadcasters that compete directly with private sector broadcasters but without having any need to operate a profitable business. No responsibility and now no adherence to Act of Parliament or Charter requirements. A Board and Chairman appointed by Union Labor.

    With so many choices for consumers within the private sector why do we need the cost of ABC/SBS?

    111

  • #
    Glen Michel

    I notice Fran Kelly is interviewing Cory Bernardi today on Radio National.Talk about getting some balance back into their ABC.Subject is gay marriage!! Hoot!

    80

  • #
    Glen Michel

    Fran- bless the lady- was an “activist ” before entering into journalism and went through Wendy Bacons school of advanced indoctrination.She is,like all leftists-on a mission to save us from ourselves.Sauve qui peut!!

    51

  • #
    sophocles

    Well. I’ll have to take my microscope down to the beach and see if I can spot some of these tsunamis. It’s going to be a long and difficult hunt given the low signal-to-noise ratio. There are all those other waves, caused by the wind, smothering the evidence.

    The Hockey Schtick has just published the transcript of a lecture given in 2000 by atmospheric scientist Dr. Joseph Fletcher. According to the hockey-schtick’s introduction, Dr Fletcher was the:

    … former NOAA Deputy Assistant Administrator for Labs and Cooperative Institutes, provides multiple lines of evidence that climate is primarily forced by changes in solar irradiance which are amplified by various solar amplification mechanisms. Changes in solar irradiance in turn control the variable size of the Pacific Ocean Warm Pool at the equator (from which the El Nino Southern Oscillation (ENSO) originates). The size of the Warm Pool in turn controls deep convection, the Hadley Circulation, wind strength, evaporation, precipitation, cloudiness, sea surface temperatures, and air temperatures …

    It’s a tour de force about the main forcings of global climate. I’ve only read half of it, so far, and if anything was attributed to the anthropogenic emissions of CO2, I missed it:

    After all, the sun runs the whole system …

    All reporters, even those of the ABC, need to read it. I haven’t reached his conclusions yet, that will have to wait until I have time to finish reading. In the meantime: enjoy.

    40

  • #
    TdeF

    Fran forgot. As Professor Tim Flannery made very clear, bushfires are also caused by climate change, even when the Army admitted they started the fire.

    As in Father Patrick Hartigan’s famous poem, Said Hanrahan, after the rains came and the drought finally broke and prosperity returned to the bush devastated by drought

    “There’ll be bush-fires for sure, me man,
    There will, without a doubt;
    We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan,
    “Before the year is out.

    Tsunamis too.

    70

  • #
    STJOHNOFGRAFTON

    SEX CHANGE ALERT! Climate change turning male lizards into females? As reported in the SMH, today, by columnist Scott Hannaford “Climate change is threatening to turn the world’s male reptiles into females”. This artical based on ‘research’ by ‘scientists’ Dr Claire Holleley and Professor Arthur Georges at the University of Canberra was first published in Nature. Then from ABC Online: “Male bearded dragons that change sex make better mothers, study finds”.

    I’m worried. Are my days as a lounge lizard comming to an end? Climate change has ruined beer and barbies and now, is my ZZ in danger of becoming a ZW?

    90

  • #
    Geoffrey Williams

    For God’s sake! Get a grip on reality Fran!
    The Islands of the Pacific are only metres above the ocean/sea level.
    What do people expect the sea to do in a storm?! It is a risky place to live.
    Of course people who live in the Pacific see this whole debate as an opportunity to get something free.
    Who can blame them. In general they are poor and can do with some genuine economic assistance.
    The reality is that their ancestors migrated to these Islands centuries ago.
    Existence on these Islands is marginal and life into the future may not sustainable for their societies.
    However man made global warming is not the cause of their problem.
    Regards
    Geoffrey Williams

    60

    • #
      TdeF

      Most of the Pacific islands were uninhabited until the last few hundred years unless people could walk to them in the last ice age, 10,000 years ago.

      This was true even of very big islands like Taiwan, which was largely uninhabited when the Dutch arrived. The fleeing Nationalist government of China changed all that. Small islands also suffer from another serious problem, no water. Without natural water sources from mountains, they are uninhabitable. Many of the ships along the Dalmatian coast are carrying fresh water to islands. This was true of Hayman Island in Australia. No natural water.

      Volcanic islands also go up and down, appearing and vanishing in only decades. Charles Darwin had a theory that the coral which only grows close to the surface kept growing as the mountains sank, creating coral atolls. The French drilled Bikini island during the atom bomb tests and found the coral was kilometers thick. So much for weak, fragile coral.

      So as population pressures force people to live in dangerous places, surely the approach is not to subsidize this with taxes on everyone else. This is a dangerous lifestyle choice and ultimately, utterly unsustainable, like extraordinary cities Dubai and Qatar, perverse site of the 2012 UN Climate Change conference.

      So Global Warming Climate Change is not about concern for humanity or science or even sustainability, it is about money and power and politics.

      50

      • #
        ROM

        Small correction there TdeF

        The French drilled Moruroa Atoll and Fangataufa Atoll to conduct their atomic bomb tests after Algeria where the French had first tested their nuclear weapons in the Sahara Desert, became unavailable to them.

        Moruroa Atoll and Fangataufa Atoll both about 1250 kms SE of Tahiti are about 60 degrees of longitude and 30 degrees of latitude distance from the Marshall Island’s Bikini and Eniwetok Atolls where the Americans conducted their atmospheric Atomic and H Bomb tests.
        A distance apart that amounts to close to 8000 kms.

        The Marshall Island’s Bikini Atoll and Eniwetok Atoll are located a couple of thousand kilometres north of the Solomon Islands chain.

        The French had a near disaster when they had a nuclear device jammed half way down an 800 metre shaft and as they couldn’t move it they decided to detonate it which nearly blew a chunk of the atoll off which would have had some serious repercussions from the probable large tsunami amongst the extensive Tuamotu Island group from the huge mass of island coral sliding into the depths.
        They had a tsunami in any case which affected the local area.

        Moruroa

        A major accident occurred on 25 July 1979 when a test was conducted at half the usual depth because the nuclear device got stuck halfway down the 800 metre shaft.[4] It was detonated and caused a large submarine landslide on the southwest rim of the atoll, causing a significant chunk of the outer slope of the atoll to break loose and causing a tsunami affecting Mururoa and injuring workers.[4] The blast caused a 2 kilometre long and 40 cm wide crack to appear on the atoll.[4]

        20

        • #
          TdeF

          Sorry, I meant to write Atoll. What is so obvious about Coral Atolls is that they are all the same doughnut shape. That was clearly the clue for Darwin who was an observational genius. Many people see things but see nothing. He undeerstood immediately that there was no way a tall round coral cylinder would or could grow from the deep ocean. The other odd thing is that it is always just as tall as the ocean, another incredible coincidence. He was proven right of course and yes the French had to drill a kilometer in solid coral just to place their bomb. What sort of mass is that? NO dirt, rock or sand, just coral.

          10

          • #
            TdeF

            My point about the height is that, of course people who live on coral atolls are living close to the water level! That is not Climate Change. It is why the atoll exists at all (joke). If you choose to live there or under a waterfall or on a dry river bed, you have to expect to get wet occasionally.

            10

            • #
              TdeF

              Darwin also the the examples of most of the Pacific islands which are surrounded almost completely by coral reefs offshore. While unknown in most oceans, it is standard in the Pacific and a real problem for people like Darwin or Cook, trying to find a way to land. So it is not unrealistic that he started to guess how coral atolls were formed. This is the wisdom of hindsignt, but coral is a force across the Pacific. The Australian Great Barrier Reef is simple the longest linear example of the same coral behaviour in the warm NE tropical currents of the Southern East Pacific.

              10

  • #
    Peter C

    BOM has now made TC RAQUEL into a proper cyclone with a pressure in the eye of 990HPa. at 1800UTC 1 Jul 2015).
    http://www.bom.gov.au/australia/charts/synoptic_col.shtml

    Nadi Cyclone warning centre has issued an alert!
    http://www.met.gov.fj/aifs_prods/20004.txt

    20

    • #
      el gordo

      The warmists will say its a sign of AGW, but I think it more likely a sign of global cooling.

      The ordinary person in the street may see it as only a weather anomaly, but what do they know. Its a sign I tells ya.

      41

    • #
      Peter C

      Strangely the Nadi cyclone warning centre seemed not to have noticed the cyclone yesterday, even thought it was about overhead. Today they give the pressure measurement as 990HPa, same as the BOM. Do they take a feed from the BOM?

      30

  • #
    pat

    plenty of folks at wimbledon not wearing hats & enjoying the sunny weather, but it was record heat at heathrow!

    2 July: Guardian: Heatwave live: Britain swelters on hottest July day on record
    We bring you the latest on the UK heatwave, from soaring temperatures and thunderstorm threats to how to keep cool and enjoy the sunny spell
    6 hrs ago: As the temperatures start to cool into the evening, we are going to bring this blog to a close. Thank you very much for following and for all your comments. Happy rest of heatwave!
    6 hrs ago: As temperatures reached 36.7 °C at Heathrow, commuters were facing difficult journeys on the London Underground…
    8 hrs ago:
    Summary: Britain swelters on hottest July day since records began
    Here’s what’s been happening so far today:
    Heathrow has recorded temperatures of 36.7C, beating the previous record for the month of July from 2006.
    It is hotter than Miami, LA, Rome and Barcelona, with Kingston-upon-Thames hotter than Kingston, Jamaica.
    The United Nations has urged countries to create better warning systems as a heatwave sweeping western Europe saw temperatures reach 40C.
    8 hrs ago: It’s the hottest July day on record – 36.7C
    Just like that, the temperature has soared at Heathrow to make this the hottest day in July since records began. That’s 0.2C higher than 2006’s record.
    …The hottest day in the UK ever recorded was 38.5C on 10th August 2003 in Faversham, Kent….
    http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/live/2015/jul/01/heatwave-live-britain-hottest-day-2015

    1 July: BBC: Jonathan Jurejko: Wimbledon 2015: How players and fans cope with record heat
    The temperature in SW19 reached 35.7C on Wednesday, and it even touched 41.2C on Centre Court.
    “I was starting to get dizzy out there with the heat hitting me,” said Australia’s 27th seed Bernard Tomic.
    Not all the players complained. Some revelled in it – as did most of the sun-baked spectators, who were armed with sun cream, water, shades, hats and even parasols…
    However, Spain’s two-time champion Rafael Nadal had fun in the sun, according to his trainer and uncle Toni Nadal.
    ***”For us, it is good to play with the sun because normally Majorca has lots of sun. Rafa feels good about this type of weather,” he told BBC Sport.
    Nadal senior said the unexpected temperatures in south-west London did not change his nephew’s game plan or his hydration techniques before, during or after matches…
    (Toni Nadal) But he said the heat was no harder for players to deal with than at the Australian Open, held in January in Melbourne, or September’s US Open in New York.
    “Australia is the hottest Slam,” he said…
    Australia’s Bernard Tomic, who grew up in the Queensland city of Gold Coast, is one player who admitted he was feeling the heat…
    Ice-cool seven-time champion Roger Federer said the conditions were “totally fine” after winning his first-round match in straight sets on Tuesday.
    ***”It was perfect playing conditions, to be honest. It was nice. No clouds whatsoever.” …
    http://www.bbc.com/sport/0/tennis/33348162

    1 July: ABC: Europe swelters as heatwave hits, prompting possible suspension of Wimbledon

    2 July: ABC: Wimbledon: Novak Djokovic, Serena Williams and Maria Sharapova advance amid stifling heat

    20

  • #
    pat

    to be fair, which ABC most definitely is not – Nadal and Federer played Tuesday and had Wednesday off. lol.

    31

  • #
    RoHa

    “It doesn’t matter what his qualifications are, anyone who pretends solar panels can stop tsunamis ought to be grilled.”

    Depends on how big your solar panels are, and where you place them.

    30

  • #
    handjive

    If tsunamis are evidence of global warming, the Japanese have many stones showing lotsa global warming.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21stones.html?_r=1

    10

  • #
    pat

    keep in mind the crazy figures being thrown about are in POUNDS, not dollars. if only the ABC would report such figures to the Australian public:

    1 July: CarbonBrief: Sophie Yeo: Raise carbon price to address aviation emissions, says Airports Commission
    The Airports Commission has recommended a third runway at Heathrow, advising that this is the best way to expand the UK’s aviation sector…
    The Committee on Climate Change (CCC) has recommended that, in order for the UK to cut its emissions 80% by 2050, emissions from aviation must be limited to 2005 levels. At this time, the sector emitted 37.5 million tonnes of carbon dioxide…
    A new runway at either Heathrow and Gatwick would push the UK’s aviation sector beyond this limit – although Heathrow expansion would do so by a wider margin…
    In his letter to (head of the commission, Howard) Davies, (CCC chairman Lord) Deben wrote:
    “Aviation emissions at 2005 levels could be achieved with fuel and operational efficiency improvements, use of sustainable biofuels and by limiting demand growth to around 60% by 2050 compared to 2005.”
    But limiting growth to 60% is easier said than done. The CCC says that the number of passengers travelling by aeroplane could grow by more than 200% if airport expansion is unconstrained and there is no attempt to put a price on carbon.
    With some constraints and a carbon price of £200 per tonne of CO2 by 2050, growth in demand could be limited to 115% says the CCC – but this is still almost double its target…
    Davies provides two potential solutions to the problem in his letter to Lord Deben, outlining the approach that he took in his report.
    ***One approach is allow growth to continue unconstrained, but to trade the excess carbon on the EU carbon market up to 2030, and on a (currently non-existent) international carbon market subsequently.
    The other option is to hike the carbon price…
    Davies writes:
    “For the Gatwick option, the changes required are ***modest, an increase in the carbon price (to around £330 per tonne in 2050)…BLAH BLAH…
    But the suggestion also leaves many questions unanswered.
    ***For instance, it is not clear whether the £330 price tag applies to a tonne of carbon, or to a tonne of carbon dioxide -an important nuance which would affect the price by a factor of almost four.
    However, it seems likely that Davies is referring to carbon dioxide, where the £330 figure more closely matchesmodelling by the CCC, which came up with a potential range of £100-£300 per tonne of CO2…
    ***It also fails to answer the question of whether the £330 per tonne of CO2 would apply to aviation alone, or to the whole economy.
    Currently, power plants in the UK have to pay £18 to emit a tonne of CO2, plus around an additional €6 as a result of the EU emissions trading system…
    Can such a cost be justified?
    ***(Cambridge economist Chris) Hope adds that the leap in price is roughly in line with the figure that models are suggesting could be an appropriate cost for carbon by mid-century…
    And Davies has not included some alternative figures from 2014 modelling by the Airports Commission.
    ***These suggest that, under a scenario where demand for aviation grows across all regions of the world, a carbon price of £1,316 per tonne of CO2 equivalent will be required by 2050 in order to keep aviation within its 37.5MtCO2 boundary.
    http://www.carbonbrief.org/blog/2015/07/raise-carbon-price-to-address-aviation-emissions/

    21

  • #
    pat

    German public radio admitting to what ABC will not report:

    1 July: NoTricksZone: Calamitous Planning: German Wind Parks Overload Power Grid …”At Its Limits” …Record 50,000 Grid Interventions In May!
    Online German NDR public radio here wrote last week how northern Germany’s power grid had suffered a major bottleneck that led to the overload of the Flensburg-Niebüll power transmission line in Schleswig Holstein last week.
    The overload resulted from a power surge from North Sea wind parks when winds picked up a bit. What is unusual in this case, however, is that there was no storm present and the overload was caused by normal wind fluctuations. Thus the incident illustrates the increasing volatility of wind as a power supply, even under regular weather conditions…
    Not only is grid stability a problem, but “waste power” is also growing astronomically, NDR writes, citing the Bundesnetzagentur (German Network Agency), that 555 gigawatt-hrs of renewable power went unused in 2013 because of overloading and the surplus had to be discarded. The trend of “waste electricity” is skyrocketing, NDR writes. According to the provisions of Germany’s EEG renewable energy feed-in act, waste electricity still needs to be paid for, which means that consumers foot a bill for something that is never delivered. Consumers are also required to pay for the electricity that doesn’t get produced when a wind park gets shut down…
    Orders and contracts for new projects have been drying up and wind and solar companies are now being hit hard.
    http://notrickszone.com/2015/07/01/calamitous-planning-german-wind-parks-overload-power-grid-at-its-limits-record-50000-grid-interventions-in-may/#sthash.Hgi4BKL2.DUx8kgTn.dpbs

    61

  • #
    Rod Stuart

    Last night the History Channel ran a doco on the witch hunts in early 17th century England and the resemblance to the current global warming scam is striking to say the least. The Scottish act of 1563 established witchcraft as a crime punishable by death, but it did not provide an explicit definition for what would be considered a crime.[viii] The act condemned witchcraft, sorcery, and necromancy.
    King James VI of Scotland (crowned in 1583 at the age of 17) became King James I of England in 1601. Previously, Scotland had been a hotbed of witch hunts and King James wrote a book called “Daemonology” which published in 1596. Thenceforth, witch trials followed the “principles” laid out in this text. The population by and large were taken in with the bunkum. Consequently, thousands of people, primarily women, were burned at the stake.
    So now we have This complete load of nonsense, with volume upon volume written about the non-existent phenomenon “global warming”, “climate change”, “greenhouse gases” which an only be believed by superstitious, gullible, and ignorant imbeciles. This fantasy is underscored by the rich and powerful UN, NASA, POTUS, and other idiots. It becomes an issue of faith.
    The witch trials ran for a hundred years or more before rational thought an logic dispelled the insanity. One must shudder at the thought that the current mass psychosis will be as long lived.

    30

  • #
    handjive

    The tsunami stones of Japan.

    http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/21/world/asia/21stones.html

    From iPad.hope link works.

    10

  • #
    pat

    ***a few facts that are not being reported in most MSM gushing coverage of this story:

    30 June: BBC: Helen Briggs: China climate change plan unveiled
    Analysis by the BBC’s science editor, David Shukman
    This is a significant moment in international climate negotiations…
    Now we’re witnessing the world’s largest emitter playing by the UN’s rules and promising even deeper cuts that those suggested some months back…
    The size of cuts, and the timescale, will of course be judged by many as too little and too late…
    Will it actually make any difference to global warming?
    ***Scientists always say it does not matter to the atmosphere where the emissions come from and China’s will continue to rise for the next 15 years or so, and on their already ***gargantuan scale.
    ***And today’s announcement does not mean that Chinese use of fossil fuels is coming to an end any time soon. On the same day that China has announced this climate plan it also began construction of a massive pipeline that will bring it a lot of gas from Russia…
    http://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-33317451

    30 June: Reuters: Julien Ponthus: China to cap rising emissions by 2030 in boost to Paris U.N. deal
    French Foreign Minister Laurent Fabius called China’s plan an “excellent sign” for the United Nations summit in Paris from Nov. 30 to Dec. 11, which intends to agree a global deal to combat climate change after past failures.
    ***China did not, however, say at what level its emissions would peak…
    “In our estimates the peak would be around 2025 or even earlier,” Hanna Fekete of the independent New Climate Institute think tank in Germany, which tracks pledges, told Reuters.
    She said she did not think Beijing’s plan would affect the group’s estimates last year that global temperatures are set to rise by 3.1 degrees Celsius (5.6 Fahrenheit) by 2100, far above a U.N. ceiling of 2 degrees (3.6F).
    (Additional reporting by Leigh Thomas and Nina Chestney in London, Jeff Mason and Valerie Volcovici in Washington, Alister Doyle in Oslo, Meeyoung Cho in Seoul.; Writing by Michel Rose and Alister Doyle; Editing by Keith Weir and William Hardy)
    http://www.reuters.com/article/2015/06/30/us-france-china-climatechange-idUSKCN0PA1G420150630

    21

  • #
    thingadonta

    I think she means storm surges.

    30

  • #
    LightningCamel

    Our Commission of Bias Absolute
    Reverses the trick of Canute
    The seas must rise
    To bolster their lies
    And there’s no logic for us to refute.

    61

  • #
    Harry Twinotter

    JoNova.

    Stephen O’Brien did not say climate changes causes tsunamis.

    Read your own transcript.

    35

    • #
      el gordo

      The AGW signature.

      “…exacerbated so that they are more frequent and even at times more severe…”

      51

      • #

        yes El Gordo but surprised that you agree with Harry that Jo is wrong. I presume you and Harry are saying that the “they” is “bad things” not Tsunamis and that O’Brien is saying that the effects of Tsunamis are more severe because sea levels are higher and the the impact also greater because the countries affected are already weakened by other factors caused by climate change (O’Brien’s arguement). Watch out for the backlash El g

        32

        • #
          Harry Twinotter

          Gee Aye,

          yes, the key work is “effects”. I have not seen anything in the scientific literature, but it is reasonable to assume damage from tsunamis will get worse when sea level increases.

          36

          • #
            James Bradley

            Harry,

            The effects of a Tsunami should lessen as sea level rises.

            43

            • #
              Harry Twinotter

              James Bradley.

              “The effects of a Tsunami should lessen as sea level rises.”

              Really?

              25

              • #
                James Bradley

                Yes, Harry, really.

                Just run a long and have a look at Tsunami dynamics, especially if your alarmist mate’s predictions of 100m sea level rise by the end of the century are correct.

                There will never be another Tsunami again.

                43

              • #
                Rereke Whakaaro

                Well done James.

                Once more you have demonstrated that Harry Twitnutter doesn’t have a clue about how the world actually works. He is all mouth and no trousers, when it comes to actually understanding the science involved (or not in this case).

                21

            • #
              Just-A-Guy

              James Bradley,

              Please James, don’t get Harry ‘cherry-pick’ Twinotter started. Like the Energizer Bunny, it/he just keeps on going. On, . . . and on, . . . and on.

              Abe

              42

          • #
            Rereke Whakaaro

            Harry, if sea levels are going to increase, as you claim, where will all the extra water come from?

            21

            • #
              Harry Twinotter

              Rereke Whakaaro.

              Do you want me to consider your question seriously, or as part of your ongoing insults and trolling?

              04

              • #
                Just-A-Guy

                Harry,

                I’ll tell you what I’d like. I’d like for you to make one sensible, rational statement for a change. Just for the sake of diversity.

                Abe

                10

    • #
      James Bradley

      Geez Harry,

      Stephen O’Brien: “The Pacific Region, and particularly the Pacific Island countries whose land, as you rightly say, are the ones just above sea-level, are the ones that really do have the greatest challenge when it comes to climate change effects on humanitarian need, with the regularity of cyclones, tropical storms, and tsunamis coming through [at 1.30 minutes]. It’s not a question of if, it’s a question of when. And we see that [these] effects of climate change seem to be exacerbated so that they are more frequent and even at times more severe…”

      You got issues, dude, your reading comprehension is back in the first grade.

      72

      • #
        Dave

        It’s funny really

        Jo didn’t even say:

        “Climate change causes tsunamis”

        She said:

        “Climate change causes more tsunamis”

        Harry leaves out the MORE

        False argument really

        Harry wasting time again

        52

        • #
          Gee Aye

          Logically if something makes more of something it also makes those things. To make more tsunamis then it also makes tsunamis

          12

        • #
          Harry Twinotter

          Dave.

          OK, a typo. I will correct it: “Stephen O’Brien did not say climate changes causes more tsunamis.”

          It does not change anything. Stephen O’Brien did not say climate change causes more tsunamis.

          13

      • #
        Harry Twinotter

        James Bradley.

        You are really scrapping the bottom of the biscuit barrel with that comment. And why use insults, are you trying to embellish a weak argument by playing the person and not the ball?

        It is clear Stephen O’Brien was talking about effects.

        “regularity of cyclones, tropical storms, and tsunamis ”

        He is actually saying the opposite of “more”; you do know what “regularity” means, don’t you?

        12

        • #
          James Bradley

          Harry,

          Many apologies, the intent of the piece obviously differs from the perception of the reader.

          By scrapping I take it you mean scraping.

          So ‘I’m scraping the bottom of the biscuit barrell’, I think that’s a low blow, sure I enjoy the odd pastry delight, and sure I put on a few extra kilos, but hell, I’m devastated that you would bring my appearance up on a world wide public forum.

          Here I thought you and I had developed a deep emotional attachment.

          All that remains now is my highest regard and respect for you.

          41

        • #
          Just-A-Guy

          Harry ‘cherry-pick’ Twinotter,

          Stephen O’Brien said:

          . . . when it comes to climate change effects on humanitarian need, and with the regularity of cyclones and tropical storms, tsunamis coming through, ahh, it’s not a question of if, it’s a question of when. And we can see the effects of climate change seem to be exacerbated[ing]* this so that these are more frequent and even at times more severe, so, . . .

          *muffled. Could be either …ed or …ing.

          the effects of climate change seem to be exacerbated[ing] this – refering to the regularity of bla bla bla…
          so that these are more frequent and even at times more severe bla bla bla…

          As has become customary with you, your comments pick out a small portion of text, to which you append your misleading obfuscation.

          The jig is up.

          Abe

          52

          • #
            el gordo

            Its interesting that we should be arguing over words, obfuscation and splitting hairs is a distraction which our opponents use regularly.

            51

            • #
              James Bradley

              el gordo,

              The warmists obfuscate and divert out of necessity because they lack the evidence to support their beliefs, we mostly do it for personal amusement and sport.

              32

              • #
                el gordo

                Yep, something to do with logical fallacy.

                And Gee Aye is wrong on interpretation and Jo is correct, look back up the thread.

                ‘Quakes, volcanic eruptions, giant landslides and tsunamis may become more frequent as global warming changes the earth’s crust, scientists said on Wednesday.’

                41

              • #
                James Bradley

                el gordo,

                Sshhh, don’t prod, Gee Aye’s probably otherwise occupied baking another batch of corn pone and may not notice your last remark.

                30

              • #
                Gee Aye

                Excellent JB but wrong again. Bean burgers!

                20

            • #
              Harry Twinotter

              El Gordo.

              Can’t avoid discussing semantics when someone is trying to use semantics to show someone said something that they didn’t say.

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                el gordo

                ‘The effects of climate change which are already being felt…’

                He is quite explicit.

                Do you believe rising sea level is the problem or a dry crust?

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                Just-A-Guy

                Yet another useless comment by the ‘cherry-picker’.

                Abe

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                Just-A-Guy

                I propose a moist interior. Pie-in-the-sky needs to have a ‘special’ recipe.

                Abe

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    el gordo

    If there is a trend in South Pacific cyclones, it would show up as increased TC activity in a cooler world.

    https://research.jcu.edu.au/tess/news-and-events/tess-seminar-Jon-Nott

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    manalive

    Maximum monthly temperatures for Heathrow airport 1950 – 2010 (nothing to see here folks).

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    Another Ian

    Reckon the ABC would believe this?

    From

    https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2015/07/02/hey-global-warming-theorist-data-changers-mess-with-the-research-go-to-prison/

    “Hey Global Warming Theorist Data Changers: Mess With The Research, Go To Prison.

    Posted on 2 July 2015 by E.M.Smith

    A nice precedent has been set. Tamper with the data, try to make yourself look like a hero, make “false statements in research reports”: Go To Prison.”

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    pat

    yes, ABC are dreadful, but how to explain the following?
    did Greg Hunt really bring up DiCaprio or was the idea put to him?
    DiCaprio is a ***noted marine conservationist?

    2 July: News Corp: Environment Minister Greg Hunt has a battle to convince Leonardo DiCaprio on reef plan
    by CHARLES MIRANDA in Bonn, Germany
    HE may have won over world leaders but Environment Minister Greg Hunt may have a tougher battle convincing Leonardo DiCaprio Australia is no longer the “Wild West” sheriff of the Great Barrier Reef.
    Yesterday, there was a unanimous vote and even applause for Environment Minister Greg Hunt and his delegation at the UNESCO 39th session of the World Heritage Committee, for their draft management plan for the coral reef…
    But Hunt said now he hoped the rest of the world including the multi Oscar-nominated Hollywood actor DiCaprio, who famously slammed Australia last year, will realise this was a new dawn on the actor’s so called Wild West.
    He even invited DiCaprio to come join him on a dive or snorkel about the reef.
    “I think everyone will look at the unanimous decision and say that there’s been unprecedented change in Australia and we would invite everybody including Mr DiCaprio to come dive the reef and see the best of it and see that it is still the world’s greatest reef,” Mr Hunt told News Corp Australia yesterday…
    DiCaprio, a ***noted marine conservationist, last year told an oceans conference in Washington DC he had seen first-hand the dire straits of the reef.
    “Since my very first dive in the Great Barrier Reef in Australia 20-years-ago to the dive I got to do in the very same location just two years ago, I’ve witnessed environmental devastation first-hand,” he said.
    “What once had looked like an endless underwater utopia is now riddled with bleached coral reefs and massive dead zones.
    “Unfortunately today, there’s no proper law enforcement capacity and little accountability for violating the law. It’s the Wild West on the high seas.” (THE END)
    http://www.news.com.au/technology/environment/environment-minister-greg-hunt-has-a-battle-to-convince-leonardo-dicaprio-on-reef-plan/story-fnjww010-1227425586709

    Greg Hunt doesn’t have to answer to DiCaprio or Greenpeace, Charles Miranda:

    1 July: PerthNow: Great Barrier Reef UNESCO verdict confirmed
    CHARLES MIRANDA in Bonn, Germany
    Australia’s reputation on the environment has gone from zero to hero, with 18 months of intense lobbying convincing the world that enough was being done to protect the Great Barrier Reef…
    Greenpeace Australia political adviser Jess Panegyres was granted permission to address the chamber with an “intervention”. She said the reef continued to be in danger and the government was still approving coal mining expansion, particularly the Galilee Basin in western Queensland, at a time when the world had to respond to climate change.
    Support for Australia was somewhat of a forgone conclusion with UNESCO director general Irina Bokova telling Mr Hunt Australia would now be held up as a model on how to do things…
    Mr Hunt said the Federal Government’s recently announced ban on dredge disposal had also put delegations at ease but he would have to work harder to convince Greenpeace…
    “There were some who were trying to ensure that 500km away in the middle of a dry dusty desert you don’t have mining and economic activity,” he said of the controversial Galilee Basin.
    “I visited the site it’s hard to imagine anything else that better fits the definition of the hard Australia outback, it’s dry, dusty, remote, inland, very sparsely vegetated. If you were going to do this anywhere you would mine in a place like that.
    “Greenpeace has basically conceded it’s not about the reef but ‘we are just against all mining. Yes we fly around in large planes, yes we use electricity and yes we use refrigeration but we will draw a disconnect between those things’.”…
    Ms Panegyres said inland coal mining and the protection of the reef, which had already lost 50 per cent of its coral cover, were tied since more mining meant more coal, more shipping about the reef and ultimately climate change from the use of coal…
    But she said having a plan at least was a step in the right direction.
    “Australian doesn’t always do what it is told by international bodies and it is the job of the Australian public, civil society and NGOs like Greenpeace to hold the government to account and make sure these (coal) projects don’t go ahead,” she said.
    http://www.perthnow.com.au/technology/great-barrier-reef-unesco-verdict-confirmed/story-fnjww5vl-1227424170888

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    pat

    just want to note that Charles Miranda, an old News Corp pro who knows all the tricks of the trade, gave DiCaprio’s old June 2014 words the final paragraphs in the Great Barrier Reef piece which went online an hour ago, just as he gave Greenpeace all the final negative paragraphs in his earlier piece for Perth Now. the MSM is disgusting.

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    Roy Hogue

    Climate change causes more tsunamis — The ABC will believe anything

    Or is it simply that they’ll use anything they think can advance the cause? It isn’t necessary to believe something in order to figure that others might believe it and it will work to your advantage. It might even be simple sensationalism seeking.

    This is a question I’ve been pondering for quite a while. Is it belief or dishonesty? And how do we tell?

    I don’t know the answer. And unless someone steps up and blows the whistle on them, what can we be sure of?

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      I don’t believe that its an active conspiracy driven by dishonesty, but the result of science being driven by a political agenda. The IPCC somehow became the arbiter of consensus climate science, yet requires significant CAGW to justify their existence. In the publish or perish academic environment, papers must conform to the IPCC agenda in order to see the light of day, thus when anyone doing climate research makes a mistake that lends support the agenda, they stop looking and accept the mistake. Over decades, this has pushed the science to a state of ignorance about physical reality that is unprecedented in the modern age. Most simply can not believe that so many ostensibly intelligent scientists can be so wrong so they blindly accept the broken science with all of its bogus complexity. Once partisan politics picked sides, the possibility of objective science all but disappeared. The bottom line is that scientific method has been replaced by political correctness, which I’ve always considered is just a lie to obfuscate an inconvenient truth.

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        el gordo

        Its has not been an organised conspiracy between journalists, politicians and scientists, its an organic process which has fed off itself.

        Over the next couple of years we’ll have front row seats to watch the downfall of a disorganised conspiracy.

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    Michel Lasouris

    One word for Frank Elly….Doh!

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