JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).



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Burn those deniers houses down

A Tennessee Fireman’s Solution to Climate Change

Steve Zwick,

This propaganda has already set us back two decades, …

… there is a very public record of who has been lying to the public and who hasn’t – and it’s time to start using this information to make the liars and shirkers pay.

Let’s take a page from those Tennessee firemen we heard about a few times last year – the ones who stood idly by as houses burned to the ground because their owners had refused to pay a measly $75 fee.

We can apply this same logic to climate change.

We know who the active denialists are – not the people who buy the lies, mind you, but the people who create the lies.  Let’s start keeping track of them now, and when the famines come, let’s make them pay.  Let’s let their houses burn.  Let’s swap their safe land for submerged islands.  Let’s force them to bear the cost of rising food prices.

They broke the climate.  Why should the rest of us have to pay for it?

Dear Steve,

I’ve got great news for you, all you have to do to avert a global catastrophe is to find peer reviewed papers that support the models. I’ve been asking for two years, three months and four days, and no one can find one that suggests CO2 will cause much more than 1 degree of warming at most.

On Jan 2nd 2010: I asked “Is there any evidence? Do read it, because lots of things you’ve been told are evidence, are not. We want results from instruments (not opinion polls) — things like ice cores, weather balloons, satellites, or lake sludge, heck… it could even be stuff from dead insects, dust, bits of rock, broken beach shells. Whatever. But only the real deal matters. Simulated evidence does not count. No models.

If you find it (and good luck) do rush, send it to Real Climate, the IPCC and the Goddard Institute of Space Studies too. The evidence is overwhelming, but they can’t find that paper either.

Sincerely,

Jo-the-former-Green

PS: If you have some worthless Pacific Islands in grave danger of disappearing, I’d like to buy them.

Hat tip: Climate Depot

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109 comments to Burn those deniers houses down

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    DougS

    You have to check the date when you read stuff like this – to make sure it’s not April fools’ day!

    Not quite sure who Steve Zwick is, ‘Wiki’ hasn’t heard of him – all we can be sure of is that he’s from the planet ‘Eco-Loon’, somewhere beyond Pluto.


    ….They broke the climate. Why should the rest of us have to pay for it?”

    Who dreams up this utter tripe?


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    Brian Lemon

    Cant figure out how Zwick gets space in Forbes – his only credential seems to be that he sells global warming services of some sort and writes for Forbes. And he’s not very bright.


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  • #

    Put another way, if someone was convicted in a court of law on this level of “overwhelming evidence” and then defense counsel were branded “deniers of the truth” most people would be outraged.


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    Sean2829

    If the famine comes as a result of global cooling, who gets their food ration cut off?


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    Jake

    Came across this which sums it up nicely

    “We have to offer up scary scenarios, make simplified, dramatic statements, and make little mention of any doubts we may have. Each of us has to decide what the right balance is between being effective and being honest.”
    by
    Stephen Schneider (leading advocate of the global warming theory)
    (in interview for Discover magazine, Oct 1989)

    “In the United States…we have to first convince the American People and the Congress that the climate problem is real.”
    by
    former President Bill Clinton in a 1997 address to the United Nations

    “Nobody is interested in solutions if they don’t think there’s a problem. Given that starting point, I believe it is appropriate to have an over-representation of factual presentations on how dangerous (global warming) is, as a predicate for opening up the audience to listen to what the solutions are…”
    by
    former Vice President Al Gore
    (now, chairman and co-founder of Generation Investment Management–
    a London-based business that sells carbon credits)
    (in interview with Grist Magazine May 9, 2006, concerning his book, An Inconvenient Truth)

    Goebbels had another mantra, I have to find the exact words, along the lines of: If you repeat the lie often enough people will believe it.

    Whoever Zwick is seems to be following in any, or all, of the above footsteps.

    I side with Jo, let’s buy all those islands which are about to drown, in 10 years we will be making a financial killing.
    Is Al Gore’s San Francisco, at water level, mansion already up for sale due to increasing sea levels?


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    • #
      Grumpy Old Man

      You may be thinking also of Stalin’s dictum. “The Truth can be smothered by a thousand little lies”. Both Goebbels and Stalin were socialists, and obviously thought along the same lines.


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        Rereke Whakaaro

        Not quite right. Stalin was a Communist, and Goebbels was a Fascist.

        They are actually both on the same point if you draw the political scale in a circle, like a donut. But these two “gentlemen” approached that point from different directions.


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          Grumpy Old Man

          I think we are in general agreement, but I maintain that that national socialism and international socialism are essentially the same in their applications to the masses who suffered under either,(or both) of the political philosophies. Schumpeter explores the origin of both, and finds common philosophical roots dating back to the early 19th Century. Stalin himself as a young man explored the philosophy of national socialism and wrote several pamphlets before returning to international socialism. Lenin and Trotsky expressed admiration for some of Mussolini’s more robust tactics in dealing with political enemies, clearly finding philosophical similarities. It was not until Hitler came to power and made Communism one of the scapegoats for Germany’s humiliation in WW1 that the split became apparent, and even then, Stalin famously did not see the Nazi regime as an enemy until 1941 and the German invasion of Russia. The western Allies found it in their short-term interests to assist Stalin in separating the 2 socialisms, and we ended up with one socialism being,”right” and necessarily evil, and the other being, “Left” and necessarily good. We all know how that has turned out!


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            Rereke Whakaaro

            Points taken, and yes we are in general agreement.

            But I would point out that there was a major philosophical difference between the two socialisms in terms of ownership of the means of production.

            National Socialism assumed private ownership of factories. For example, the Krupp contribution to the Nazi war effort. International Socialism placed all industry under state ownership, run by politically appointed committees of the workers.

            It is also worth noting that, although both Stalin and Goebbels employed propaganda, it was originally an American invention. It was originally developed by Edward Bernays during the First World War, based on some earlier work by Walter Lippman. The Germans may have given it the name, “Propaganda”, but the techniques were as American as apple pie (or Apfel strudel).

            Bernays opened a “consultancy” in 1919, in New York, and advised several future Presidents on speech-writing techniques.

            In 1929, he published a book, simply entitled “Propaganda”, that lays out many of the techniques used in modern public relations. That text is still used in some Intelligence training courses.


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            wes george

            Another parallel between national and international socialism is their hatred of the middle class, a shared philosophical turn against the individual, against the idea of the human being as the self-evident basic component of society in favour of an abstract collective.

            The Nazi embraced collectivism as tribalism, in terms of pure race and original nation. Eerily, like Obama with his massive styro-foam Greek column displays at one of his important early national addresses, the Nazi styled themselves as the “New Dorians” to signal they were the true heirs of Western civilisation.

            The Socialists rejected individualism because theirs was economic critique in terms of wealth distribution, in terms of class distinction and envy.

            Both sides believed that the shopkeeper’s ethics of fair trade and free markets, family comforts and the natural complacencies of what we would recognise as ordinary happy suburban life were antithesis to the values of violent revolution and the heroic willingness to sacrifice even life itself in the name of the sacred collectivist ideal on the epic quest for an utopian society..

            Although he probably doesn’t know his ass from his elbow, unconsciously this is where Steve Zwick is coming from.

            Zwick’s idealism – which is neither Nazi or Communist – shares with them the fanatical/heroic impulse that the cause is bigger than the sanctity of human life and certainly trumps mere private property and individual civil rights. This is why he hates us who live quietly on our farms or in our comfortable modern homes… keeping our shops, tending our businesses, driving the kids to school, paying our taxes, working 40 and 50 hour weeks, watching TV, shopping at the mall and having barbies around the pool with mates not chosen for their political correctness. None of us are really willing to die for an abstract ideology or a religion.

            We are too busy living life… And that is what the Nazis, the Communists, the Islamofascists and the Greens hate about us.

            It’s why the insane Norwegian guy shot all those children. It’s why the Islamists use people as bombs. It’s why the Greens made this video.

            It’s why Zwick has fantasies of burning people’s houses down who don’t share his zealotry.


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      Allen Ford

      Here is a quote from Doktor G, himself, on this subject:

      “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”

      The addendum is just as important as the basic assertion.


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        Jake

        Thanks Allen, that was the one I had in mind with my referral.
        So really nothing much has changed.


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        wes george

        Allen Ford,

        You’ve nailed the operative mode of the Greens, our ABC and the Gillard government.

        The wrench in the works is the bloody Internet. Somebody forgot install the kill switch on blogosphere free speech before trying to scare us into surrendering our liberties to the Big Lie.

        The Big Worry is that they’ll learn the lesson and when they cycle back to power again, say in 2025, with the next Big Lie, they’ll be sure to have “licensed” free speech online first.

        Our mission, should we choose to accept it, is to nip that $hit in the bud.


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      Dennis

      One of the many pathetic attempts to convince the gullible that Pacific islands are being swamped is the television image of an island shortly after a serious storm with palm trees lying on the ground.


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      Howie

      “If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
      Joseph Goebbels, Propaganda Minister of the Third Reich


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    Athlete

    Well at least Zwick got one thing right. There is a very detailed and documented record of who has been lying to the public and who hasn’t.


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    mike

    Zwick wants his two minutes of fame and he’s getting it thanks to the skeptics who are only raising the profile of this loon.


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  • #

    I think Steve’s diatribes should be spread wide and far. Give a fanatic a big platform and they can be relied on to alienate the average sane person. Go Steve, go.

    Pointman


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    JohnBUK

    I can only think the “editors” and “owners” of Forbes must be “Deniers” themselves. They cannot possibly have thought that by publishing this bilge it would aid the CAGW case by one jot surely?
    Allowing this imbecile the chance to show what type of mentality stalks the pro CAGW camp can only diminish their case.
    Pillock.


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    Juergen

    Something is changing for the last three years that effects the mild climate where I live.
    Frost this morning on my car window. Still heating in late April. Last year the coldest winter in 130 years. I can continue.
    One more thing. Arctic sea ice acting against AGW. http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/N_stddev_timeseries.png
    Not to forget the Antarctica that is above average: http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_timeseries.png
    Is the cooling coming and what kind? Little ice age or even worse? The next one will come!


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    Bob Malloy

    Steve Zwick says of himself.

    I edit Ecosystem Marketplace, an online news service that reports on (carbon) market-based solutions to environmental problems — a calling (?) I received after a career trading futures, writing about business, and getting entangled in a few local environmental campaigns.

    all comments in () are my additions.

    In MHO,He’s no different than manbearpig, he’s fighting not to lose the money he anticipated making from trading in C.C’s.


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    brc

    I think it’s a fine idea, and I applaud Steve Zwick for raising it.

    Why does it get my support? Of course, the principle cuts both ways.

    If it turns out that all this dangerous warming scare turns out to be utter nonsense on a time scale of, say, the next 10-20 years, then we know who was making all the noise and scaring the kiddies. And we get to come around and extract all the money from them. We get to switch off their reliable electricity source and connect it to renewable power only. We get to ensure that their food is tilled by ox and transported by donkey.

    Either that, or I’d settle for a good tar and feathering and some time in the stocks with rotten tomatoes.


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    • #
      Ally E.

      But Brc, the time scale has already been running for thirty years…

      When o when o when will the warmists/alarmists decide AGW just isn’t going to deliver the catastophe they want? I guess never. If it doesn’t get hot enough, they’ll light some fires… Sheesh!


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      wes george

      The warmists are unconsciously projecting their worst fears.

      Well-informed Warmists are now fully aware of which side is dishonest and who the big fat liars really are. They’re aware by now that they have wasted billions of dollars and burnt through any good will the general public felt towards Green evangelicals. They know who is going to be held to account in the end.

      Poor Steve Zwick is expressing his personal existential terror unconsciously as hatred of the much feared “other.” It’s a classic illustration of psychological projection and a clear sign that warmist culture is entering the second stage of the Kubler-Ross model of how people deal with great personal tragedy, also know as the Five Stages of Denial.

      * *

      Here’s the FIVE STAGES OF DENIAL every evangelical Warmist must pass through…*

      Stage 1: TOTAL DENIAL. “Denial can be conscious or unconscious refusal to accept facts, information, or the reality of the situation. Denial is a defense mechanism and some people can become locked in this stage.”

      This is a real psychological condition we see every day. People are presented with cognitive information as clear as a bell, but are unable to emotionally or rationally process it appropriately. Psychological denial is caused by many different kinds of human and cultural situations. Denial syndromes can also occur at the institutional levels. The ABC and the BOM are examples of institutional cultures so deep in denial that they wilfully violate their mission charters rather than submit to the preponderance of evidence before them.

      But don’t confuse psychological or cultural denial with the ad hominem concept of “Denialism” as in “Jo Nova is a denialist.” The use of the root word Denial in this sense is an allusion to Neo-Nazi groups who attempt to re-write the Holocaust out of history. A “Denialist” is an advocate who knowingly attempts to cause harm by deceptively denying something, rather than a patient who is suffering from the mental state of Denial.

      The propaganda value of “Denialism” to the Warmists was to dehumanise skeptical critics of AGW to signal the public it’s OK to hate them as a kind of subhuman, Nazi-like “other.” In practice, this strategy backfired, because it created an unhealthy atmosphere where even scientists felt it was OK to commit fraud, lie, destroy data, exaggerate and even commit felonies since they believed they were fighting against sub-human denialist shills. They fell for their own hate and fear-based propaganda. Thus the warmist cult will not only go down in history as just plain wrong, but also as contemptibly brutal.

      *

      Stage 2: ANGER: See poor Stevo’s rant above. “the individual recognizes that denial cannot continue. Because of anger, the person is very difficult to care for due to misplaced feelings of rage and envy. Anger can manifest itself in different ways….It is important to remain detached and nonjudgmental when dealing with a person experiencing anger from grief.”

      *

      Stage 3: BARGAINING: This will come about when the Warmists accept they’re going to get wiped out at the next election. When the Anger and Bargaining stages overlap in a sociological context, it’s likely that we’ll see the rise of isolated underground Green radical cells which might or might not be violent, but will attempt to use illegal and nefarious means to an end.

      *

      Stage 4: DEPRESSION: “…the individual may become silent, refuse visitors and spend much of the time crying and grieving…. It is not recommended to attempt to cheer up an individual who is in this stage. It is an important time for grieving that must be processed. . Depression could be referred to as the dress rehearsal for the ‘aftermath’. It is a kind of acceptance with emotional attachment. It’s natural to feel sadness, regret, fear, and uncertainty when going through this stage. Feeling those emotions shows that the person has begun to accept the situation.”

      Stage 4 is where vast bulk of recovering Warmists are today. That’s why skeptical blog threads have become devoid of any warmists commenters challenging our positions. Their silence speaks volumes. This is a far cry from the robust state of the online climate debate which peaked in 2007-9. After Climategate hit in November of 2009 it’s been a slow decline into Warmist depression since then, with failure after failure dogging the Orthodoxy… And now warmists blogs are slowly going silent too one by one falling off the Alexa radar.

      *

      Stage 5: ACCEPTANCE: The final cure comes with admitting you are wrong and saying sorry. Saying sorry will be a necessary part of the rehabilitation for any Warmist wishing to restore his or her reputation.

      Perhaps more importantly for individual mental health, by admitting you’re wrong and apologising also cleans your emotional slate, allowing you to get on with fully embracing new ways of understanding. Without this stage no true state of healthy life balance can be achieved. Sadly, history is littered with men (it’s mostly man issue) so pigheaded they’d rather go to their graves then admit they were in error.

      Such is life.

      *quotes from wiki.


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        ExWarmist

        An Excellent summation.

        I went through my process in 2008, and have been out the other side and awake since then.

        The realisation of being duped was one of the hardest to overcome, and I had substantial anger towards those who had actively lied to me and pity for the rest.


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          Wes,

          wonderful explanation.

          My problem was that I couldn’t see what the problem was.

          For the life of me, I wanted to believe, because why would (seemingly) so many people with so much knowledge of the Science be saying approximately the same thing.

          We had a community radio station on the Gold Coast, and once a week, they would have Professor Ron Nielsen, a retired nuclear physicist on to speak and then take questions. I actually phoned in one morning and missed the ‘on air’ queue, luckily, as it turned out. I was the last caller, and at the dedicated news break at the top of the hour, he finished his segment, but as I was the last, he took my call off air, and we spoke for almost half an hour, something not possible if we had have been on air.

          I asked him in general terms about Global Warming (still not changed to Climate Change) and he said that while there were two distinct ‘sides’ to the debate, the reality was probably somewhere in the middle, but not as far left as some of the most vocal people at the time.

          That spurred me to go looking for myself, and he mentioned that it would be difficult to separate the dross from the truth, so I would need to search very carefully, and I was probably hamstrung in that I had no real background in Science, so it would be difficult to know what was right, and what was not quite right.

          He asked me what my background was, and when I mentioned that I was from the electrical trade, he said that I might be better placed to investigate why we were being told (even more than four years ago) we should be moving towards renewable power, as that might be the end result of all this, and that, of itself, could end up being more of a problem than global warming, even though he himself is somewhat of a supporter, to a degree, of solar power.

          That’s the path I moved down, but I still really wanted to (begin to) understand at least some of the Science.

          As it has turned out, that attempt at understanding the Science is still happening, and if it’s taken me four years to get to this lowly point, I can imagine why the general public have indeed been sucked in, because over those four years, I have begun to realise that nearly everywhere I turn, I’m seeing that we have indeed been hoodwinked.

          Some might say that I was probably leaning in that direction anyway, and that maybe I’m just looking for things to confirm my own belief, but for the life of me I actually wanted to know why so many people who should know were indeed spinning all this up.

          Oddly, that chase I started for this mad rush to renewables, assisted me partly in the need to understand the Science, because if so many of those people spinning the science agree that renewables are the way of the future, when they patently are not, then if they are so wrong on that subject, then it lessens what they have to say about the science, in my mind, if you can see that point.

          Oddly, trying to make people understand the realities of electrical power generation puts me almost in the same position as those exhorting us that the science is solid. People will take that science basically on faith alone, because surely they don’t understand it. However, because they have no concept of what I am attempting to say, then I’m the one who is spinning what I have to say, and that is why I have to be so careful and long winded in my explanations. That of itself was the hardest part of all, trying to explain something in a manner that people actually can understand.

          Tony.


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          • #
            Sonny

            Hi Tony,

            My journey to the truth began with Al Gore’s
            an inconvenient lie. I soon smelt a rat. Spoke with science students at university who Hardly ever studied but just drank goon who seemed obsessed with global warming and told me how that was the “boom” industry for getting research grants. I started reading everything, documenting everything. I have collected a small museum worth of climate change propoganda. I am part of an intelligent minority that actively questions consensus thinking. I became an anti climate change activist when I realized how this was the single greatest threat to individual freedom and prosperity.
            Posting on this site has been the only practical avenue I have to express myself.
            The general public just doesn’t care (as I found out through Facebook). I am seeking employment as a skeptic. My interest is in educating people about what has happened from an ethical breakdown point of view.


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            rukidding

            Tony

            My enlightenment came when I read that Goldman Sachs were heavily pushing cap and trade.
            From that day on I realized that it was not about the science but about money.Hell I even voted for the ALP in the 2007 election.


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            Greg Cavanagh

            I had other interests I was following, and was mostly ignoring Global Warming. I accepted that it might be right, I never accept what is said on TV as being the correct trueth, or that a study has come to this or that conclusion. I’ve always known studies are narrow points of view of the auther and often turned around a couple years later.

            I kept a mental tally of the Global Warming stuff, fully expecting that it would quietly go away (why spend my time researching something I expected to fade from memory in the short term).

            Then our government announced that it would tax us to save the world. Well that done it.

            I used my usual research method. I googled searched Global Warming, I opened up a dozen sites and started reading any and all articles. I remember reading Climate Audit and being amaized by the hard effort and detail that went into the reasoning. I used the hyperlink and read the offending and countering articles and was promptly amaized at the vitriol and anger on those pages. Once I figured out which site was pro or anti GW, it was easy to identify who was the theif. Anger never wins and argument.

            All up, it took my 3 hours of reading to be fully convinced that it was a crock.


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          wes george

          Tony and Ex-warmist, thanks ;-)

          In my debauched youth as a Greens activist back in the mid-1980′s I latched on to the AGW meme. Back then it was a totally different world. There was almost zero popular material out about AGW other than an occasional Time or Sci Am wag about it. You had to go to a university library and look up the various journals yourself if you wanted the details. AGW was honestly conceived as pure scientific speculation originally. But it wasn’t long before the environmental movement co-opted AGW as a critique of capitalist consumer society. The Greens took the AGW critique straight to the extreme left-wing of American politics — who didn’t much trust eco-long hairs because back then Socialism was about the rights of workers and workers worked in dirty industry and the Socialists rightfully understood environmentalists as a natural “class enemy.”

          The Greens of the 1980′s said to the socialists, look, you commies gotta admit Marx’s analysis of history and capitalism is failing. Capitalism is not going to self-destruct because the new science of economics has developed methods for smoothing out the great market cycles of boom and bust into manageable fluctuations. BUT, Capitalism is still going to destroy the biosphere, leading to the collapse of markets, therefore a kind of Green Socialist utopia is still the inevitable final outcome. So if the Left fitted the Green critique of capitalism to Marx, the Marxist critique could still be ultimately right, if only for the wrong reason. Got that? The neo-Marxists said, you know, if you read Marx carefully he really was an Environmentalist!!!… The Green convinced the Socialist workers that in spite of the class differences they were brothers in arms…. That’s when the AGW meme began to gather momentum, although the debate was still dominated by neo-Malhusian projections of resource scarcity and Hobbesian fear of a “war of all against all” as population soared out of control. Most eco-types believed that we’d run out of resources before destroying the planet with AGW.

          But later in the 1990′s it became clear The Club of Rome was a really The Crew of Maths Failures. The Earth wasn’t going to run out of resources, nor population spiral out of control. Worst of all, Capitalism looked stronger than ever due to information-based technologies powering productivity increases unimagined just a few years earlier. Wired Magazine popularised the notion of “The Long Boom” in which capitalism would spread globally and lift everyone’s standard of living for decades to come.

          This is moment in 1996/7 when the Greens and the academic Left decided to bet the farm on CAGW – as opposed to neo-Malhusianism claptrap of the 1970-80′s – as the best critique of Capitalism. In 1998 Michael Mann came out with his famous hockey stick reconstruction of past climate temps, which disappeared the MWP and the LIA in order to make modern warming unprecedented and catastrophic and the CAGW meme began to soar in the popular imagination as the great moral challenge of our age.

          Still, most non-climate scientists didn’t take AGW alarmism seriously because, as a geophysicist friend of mine explained to me in 1996, the logarithmic effect of CO2 was well understood so there was no possibility of temperatures rising more than another 1c over the next century due to human activity.

          I’m not sure how the CAGW meme became so powerful between 2000 and the Climategate scandals of Nov 2009, which was the beginning of the end for CAGW as a political force. CAGW seemed to have percolated up quietly in academia and the UN IPPC during the Bush and Howard years, while slyly colonising the Internet so throughly with the CAGW narrative that by 2005 it was very difficult to find citations online to support skeptical arguments in blog debates with climate alarmists. And the Alarmist always vociferously demanded peer-reviewed evidence back then, unlike today when they’d rather not debate on hard evidence anymore.

          With 20/20 hindsight CAGW really was the perfect anti-free market, collectivist ideology because CAGW possesses all the explanatory power of one of the world’s great mythologies. It answers the big human questions: Who are we? How did we get here? Where are we going? What should we do? In an agnostic age where many people are bereft of any universal moral compass, but are still close enough to the Christian era to remember the Abrahamic traditions, CAGW borrows ideas like guilt, original sin, prophecy, The Garden of Eden, redemption, paradise, fear of God and the Apocalypse, distills them into scientific-sounding jargon. Combine overwhelming media support, with an eagerness to persecute heretics and CAGW became something like the inexorable utopian zeitgeists of the early 20th century, Communism and Nazism. CAGW just rolled over the rational minority who naturally had no magnificently unified global vision to offer in its stead.

          Fortunately, it seems that the history of ideas is largely virtual theatre in the networked information age. CAGW sophistry might well have caused violent revolutions and trench warfare had it become the great ideology of the 1920′s or 30′s. Surely, Steve Zwick seems likely to have volunteered to go in for a Green Kristallnacht walk … But today whole battles are decided in cyberspace, wars won and lost online without a single house being burnt down, based almost entirely on the quality of your evidence and argument…the coming election will be nothing less than the formal surrender of the CAGW flag.

          Thank God for Watts, McIntyre, Warwick Hughes, Bishop Hill, Lucia, Jen Maharossy, Jeff Id and our own Jo Nova and many, many others who dedicated the best part of the last decade to setting the record straight.


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    Bob Malloy

    Zwick, is alo one of many to have written a derogatory piece on Heartland, that is yet to remove or update his article and condemn Gliek. If Heartland, and I hope they do, take legal action, Zwick is amongst those that taste the action they so readily propose.

    In his Heartland tirade he does espouse one enlightened thought,” Let’s look at the science and not the subterfuge”. If only he realised he’s looking from the wrong side of the looking glass.


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    wes george

    Hey, I think we’re making progress. Two years ago the Warmists created a global advertising campaign based upon sick Taliban-style fantasies about mass murdering skeptics.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JfnddMpzPsM&feature=player_embedded

    Now all they want to do is sell us their beach front property on the cheap?

    ROFL!

    I smell an investment opportunity here!


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    pat

    Zwick is considered a “a veteran derivatives industry journalist”:

    2009: Ecosystemmarketplace: Steve Zwick: Markit: Gathering – and Mining – the Data for Tomorrow’s Ecosystem Marketplace
    Zwick: Which market do you see taking off first after carbon?
    Niall Cameron (Markit’s Executive Vice President of Commodities, Indices, Equities and Risk Management): We are interested in how the water market develops. Unlike carbon credits, water is a real commodity, and possibly the most important one in the world.
    http://www.ecosystemmarketplace.com/pages/dynamic/article.page.php?page_id=7133&section=home

    his column coincides nicely with the following:

    17 April: NYT: Ben Protess: Regulators to Ease a Rule on Derivatives Dealers
    As federal regulators put the finishing touches on an overhaul of the $700 trillion derivatives market, a major provision has been tempered in the face of industry pressure.
    On Wednesday, the Securities and Exchange Commission and the Commodity Futures Trading Commission are expected to approve a rule that would exempt broad swaths of energy companies, hedge funds and banks from oversight. Firms would not face scrutiny if they annually arrange less than $8 billion worth of swaps, the derivative contracts tied to interest rates and commodities like oil and gas.
    The threshold is a not-insignificant sum. By one limited set of regulatory data, 85 percent of companies would not be subject to oversight…
    http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2012/04/17/regulators-to-ease-a-rule-on-derivatives-dealers/

    19 April: Bloomberg: Jesse Hamilton/Steven Sloan: Smaller Companies Getting a Pass From Tougher Swaps Regulation
    Farm co-ops, small banks and the local gas company may be toasting U.S. regulators whose votes yesterday freed them from strict Dodd-Frank Act oversight of dealers in the $708 trillion global swaps market…
    The Commodity Futures Trading Commission and Securities and Exchange Commission approved a final rule to start with an $8- billion-a-year threshold that will drop to $3 billion within five years unless incoming data suggest a different course. The threshold increase means firms with a notional value of swaps below $8 billion in the preceding 12 months won’t be considered a dealer…
    Crisis Contribution
    Largely unregulated derivatives trading helped fuel the 2008 financial crisis…
    Today’s “major dealers” listed by the Federal Reserve Bank of New York’s OTC Derivatives Supervisors Group have included the largest banks, such as Bank of America Corp. and Deutsche Bank AG. (DB) …
    Wall Street banks dominate dealing of swaps and other derivatives. JPMorgan Chase & Co. (JPM), Bank of America Corp., Citigroup Inc. (C), Morgan Stanley (MS) and Goldman Sachs Group Inc. (GS) controlled 95 percent of cash and derivatives trading for U.S. bank holding companies as of Dec. 31, according to the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency…
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-04-18/smaller-companies-getting-a-pass-from-tougher-swaps-regulation.html


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    mc

    This situation has the appearance of one where the warmists are actually right on a certain level. That is, we are reaching or have reached a tipping point, but it is not the tipping point they imagine, it is a tipping and falling into brutality and totalitarianism! Many of them know this, though some are more conscious than others. This produces terrible guilt which in turn produces intense anger towards the object of that guilt, us. All these negative feelings are intolerable and must be shifted somewhere; a scapegoat must be identified and attacked with utmost conviction and force. This is the only way, so they perceive, at some murky subconscious level, that these unbearable feelings of guilt, anger and shame can be dissipated or removed. We have seen it all before, have we not?


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    Sonny

    Nice. Incitement to murder and destroy property from climate alarmists.
    They really seem to be getting more desperate and dangerous with each passing week.
    This will make for very interesting reading in 20 years time.


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    mc

    PS, you’ve heard the acronym SNAG right, well here’s one appropriate to the current topic; SNAT, sensitive new age totalitarian.


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    Hasbeen

    I think the CAGW bunch are right about tipping points. All they have to do to have the science right, is change the sign in front of the feedback.

    I believe we reached a tipping point about 12 years ago, & the negative feed back kicked in. It is now winding up its response. This will make things quite cool in the near future.

    I do not think this is good news for the hundreds of hibiscus that I am growing, in an area about as cool as they can handle all ready.


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    warcroft

    I think its time to reverse labels.
    Deniers can now be called ‘Normalists’.
    Warmists can now be called Deniers because they flat out continue to deny that nothing is happening to the climate.


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    Bob Malloy

    Totally off topic.

    Thomas Jefferson is no stranger to me as an historical figure, however as an Australian I have failed to do due diligence in expanding my knowledge of this extraordinary man.

    This morning I recieved the following in an email currently doing the rounds.

    Thomas Jefferson–wow

    How true this has become.

    Thomas Jefferson was a remarkable man who began his learning very early in
    life and never stopped.

    At 5, he began studying under his cousins’ tutor.

    At 9, he studied Latin, Greek and French.

    At 14, he studied classical literature and additional languages.

    At 16, he entered the College of William and Mary.

    At 19, he studied Law for 5 years, starting under George Wythe.

    At 23, he started his own law practice.

    At 25, he was elected to the Virginia House of Burgesses.

    At 31, he wrote the widely circulated “Summary View of the Rights of British
    America ” and retired from his law practice.

    At 32, he was a Delegate to the Second Continental Congress.

    At 33,he wrote the Declaration of Independence.

    At 33, he took three years to revise Virginia ‘s legal code and wrote a
    Public Education bill and a statute for Religious Freedom.

    At 36, he was elected the second Governor of Virginia succeeding Patrick
    Henry.

    At 40, he served in Congress for two years.

    At 41, he was the American minister to France and negotiated commercial
    treaties with European nations along with Ben Franklin and John Adams.

    At 46, he served as the first Secretary of State under George Washington.

    At 53, he served as Vice President and was elected president of the American
    Philosophical Society.

    At 55,he drafted the Kentucky Resolutions and became the active head of
    Republican Party.

    At 57, he was elected the third president of the United States .

    At 60, he obtained the Louisiana Purchase , doubling the nation’s size.

    At 61, he was elected to a second term as President.

    At 65, he retired to Monticello .

    At 80, he helped President Monroe shape the Monroe Doctrine.

    At 81, he almost singlehandedly created the University of Virginia and
    served as its first president.

    At 83, he died, on the 50th anniversary of the Signing of the Declaration of
    Independence along with John Adams.

    Thomas Jefferson knew because he himself had studied the previously failed
    attempts at government. He understood actual history, the nature of God,
    God’s laws, and the nature of man. That happens to be way more than what
    most understand today. His is a voice from the past to lead us into the
    future.

    John F. Kennedy held a dinner in the white House for a group of the
    brightest minds in the nation at that time.. He made this statement:” This
    is perhaps the assembly of the most intelligence ever to gather at one time
    in the White House with the exception of when Thomas Jefferson dined alone.”

    When we get piled upon one another in large cities, as in Europe , we shall
    become as corrupt as Europe .
    Thomas Jefferson

    The democracy will cease to exist when you take away from those who are
    willing to work and give to those who would not.
    Thomas Jefferson

    It is incumbent on every generation to pay its own debts as it goes, a
    principle which if acted on, would save one-half the wars of the world.
    Thomas Jefferson

    I predict future happiness for Americans if they can prevent the government
    from wasting the labors of the people under the pretense of taking care of
    them.
    Thomas Jefferson

    My reading of history convinces me that most bad government results from too
    much government.
    Thomas Jefferson

    No free man shall ever be deprived the use of arms.
    Thomas Jefferson

    The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear
    arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in
    government.
    Thomas Jefferson

    The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time with the blood of
    patriots and tyrants.
    Thomas Jefferson

    To compel a man to subsidize with his taxes the propagation of ideas which
    he disbelieves and abhors is sinful and tyrannical.
    Thomas Jefferson

    Thomas Jefferson said in 1802:
    I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than
    standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control
    the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the
    banks and corporations that will grow up around the banks will deprive the
    people of all property – until their children wake-up homeless on the
    continent their fathers conquered.

    It leaves me dumfounded that the quality of politicians can fall so far in just 200 years, that despite Jefferson so eloquently outlining all the possible pitfalls they have come to pass and we were unable or unwilling to see it until now.


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    Rohan Baker

    PS: If you have some worthless Pacific Islands in grave danger of disappearing, I’d like to buy them.

    I’ve got $3.50 left in my pocket at the end of this week. I wonder if I can buy Fiji for that in order to save it from the impending apocalypse caused by me?

    Do cocktail umbrellas and banana lounges stop global warming and sea level rises?


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      Gee Aye

      I know this is a silly reply to see the world if Fiji goes under type 4000 in the red box and click “Go”.

      http://maps.google.com/maps/mapplets?moduleurl=http://www.heywhatsthat.com/mapplets/sealevel.xml

      There is high ground near Canberra


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        Gee Aye

        and on a side note to a side note, and sorry if this has been noted before, when I was making the above ground breaking discovery I came across this page:

        http://www.science.org.au/nova/environment/climate-change/

        If you can’t beat em, join em.


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          Bruce of Newcastle

          Think I’d prefer Tuvalu, and you get a valuable web domain to boot when the locals all flee to Fiji.

          Regarding the AAS, yes that IS a flying saucer. Hence geoengineering as the first item.

          Actually their coverage is fine, the problem of geoeng is it is completely unnecessary. I proposed an aerosol option back in 2006 which still stands up as one of the best (not SO2), and gained formal approval to work on it. See top right. But in looking at the data in a couple of weeks I found the whole CAGW edifice was not founded on reality and I gave up that project. If I’d proceeded I’d have been a (comfortably rich) hypocrite.

          I could demolish it and their other 17 points but I have a life I’d prefer to experience.

          I live in hope that the Men in Black franchise will one day set a sequel in Canberra.


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    I left my response to Zwick’s rant attached to Warren Meyer’s article A Vivid Reminder of How The Climate Debate is Broken.

    Steve Zwick says that extreme weather events are related to climate change.

    Denier-central’s, peak sceptics at the IPCC beg to differ:
    IPCC Special Report
    Managing the Risks of Extreme Events and Disasters to Advance Climate Change Adaptation (SREX)

    etc. :-)


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      Jake

      Haven’t read the whole report yet but came across the following statement which in my opinion says it quite well

      There is evidence that some extremes have changed as a result of anthropogenic influences, including increases in atmospheric concentrations of greenhouse gases. It is likely that anthropogenic influences have led to warming of extreme daily minimum and maximum temperatures at the global scale. There is medium confidence that anthropogenic influences have contributed to intensification of extreme precipitation at the global scale. It is likely that there has been an anthropogenic influence on increasing extreme coastal high water due to an increase in mean sea level. The uncertainties in the historical tropical cyclone records, the incomplete understanding of the physical mechanisms linking tropical cyclone metrics to climate change, and the degree of tropical cyclone variability provide only low confidence for the attribution of any detectable changes in tropical cyclone activity to anthropogenic influences. Attribution of single extreme events to anthropogenic climate change is challenging. [3.2.2, 3.3.1, 3.3.2, 3.4.4, 3.5.3, Table 3-1]

      They really do not have confidence in anything.

      But what they do know is that the increasing concentrations of people in coastal areas is likely to result in a negative impact on the population of that area if a weather disaster were to strike, cyclones etc.
      There is even a case study to back this up.

      Who would have thought of that.

      If my apple tree is full of fruit and a decent storm hits it is likely that more fruit will fall from the tree then at a time when there are not so many apples hanging.
      That is my case study on the subject and it is just as applicable to population centers.

      Can I receive my $10 million now please.


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    warcroft

    OT. . .

    Latest issue of ‘Science’ magazine (20th April), the cover has a photo of a polar bear, standing on ice, looking down at its own reflection in the water.

    The story write up is:
    “A young polar bear (Ursus maritimus) on a piece of ice that is drifting in the Barents Sea, northeast of Svalbard, Norway. Polar bears depend on sea ice as a platform for hunting seals, but current melting and retreat of sea ice is increasingly forcing them onto land.”

    Once again, a once reputable scientific magazine resorting to spins about climate change.

    Go here for the cover and write up:
    http://www.sciencemag.org/content/336/6079.cover-expansion


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    handjive

    “PS: If you have some worthless Pacific Islands in grave danger of disappearing, I’d like to buy them.”

    The Department of Climate Change (pg.127) warned in 2009 that if sea levels continue to rise, The Cocos (Keeling) Islands, 2950 kilometres north-west of Perth, with elevations of just one to four metres above sea level – mere dustings of land in a gigantic ocean – are exceedingly vulnerable to climate change.

    FF>>
    April 2012: American drones just another hazard for Cocos islanders

    A $28m upgrade of the Cocos airstrip is already under way, although it has nothing to do with drones and is more about much-needed repair work.

    Defence Minister Stephen Smith said the Cocos Islands’ airfield would require a $75 million to $100m upgrade before the territory could be used as a base for US Global Hawk drones and that the plans were a long way off.

    A long way off? Danger?
    Oops. They are in the Indian Ocean.
    Could I interest you in the Carribean?
    Have sent a ‘forward party’ to ‘fly the world’ to assess the sustainability of the Necker Island. Here is their report:

    My next trip was to Necker Island in the Caribbean.
    The place is a tropical paradise and we stayed in a pavilion perched above a reef.
    One morning my wife Alexandra and I had the chance to stroll one of Necker’s more remote beaches.
    It was pure bliss to feel the warm sea between our toes, and on the sand I found a brightly coloured helmet shell the size of my head.

    On second thoughts, there are no islands for sale ‘cheep’ due to ‘global warming’.


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    Bulldust

    Update on my ongoing fun at the ABC AYCC blog thread:

    http://www.abc.net.au/environment/articles/2012/04/19/3480456.htm

    My latest (assuming it gets up) contribution:

    If you want to spend a few minutes research time have a look at who sponsors AYCC. It is on the back two pages of their annual report. The main sponsors fall into three categories:

    1) astroturfing Green organisations like Purves;
    2) state Governments (NWS, VIC, QLD & SA);
    3) universities.

    They see AYCC as a convenient vehicle to promote Government policy of the socialist variety (not that there’s necessarily anything wrong with that) and ultimately benefits the sponsor agencies. The people who end up wearing blue shirts because they desperately want to feel like they are part of something important and want to save the planet are, what the communist party in the Cold War days used to call, “useful idiots.”

    But rather than being narky, I would challenge the current generation to be skeptical (not just about climate science) and try to think things through for themselves rather than swallowing gallons of motherhood pap from vested interest organisations. I challenge thee to think!*

    * It’s not really that hard, but you have to be willing…

    It’s about time that organisations like the AYCC were exposed for what they are. Then again, with the young generation’s attention span they are probably as passe as Kony 2012, whatever the heck that was… something about a naked guy in America or sumptin’…


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    dogstar060763

    Mr Zwick is another in a long, inglorious line of CAGW evangelists who have allowed their own sneering hubris to get the better of themselves. In the end, they just begin to sound totalitarian. Whether this is intentional or merely an unfortunate side-effect of having to keep up the propaganda at whatever cost to reason, I cannot say. Sadly, much of the ‘green’, pro-CAGW movement has shifted to a deplorably authoritarian position – dangerously so, given its access to governments and public funding. From the UN to the regrettable antics of unelected bureaucrats in the EU, the mind-set of these people, having been permitted to carry out this political experiment unhindered by a critical media, is now deeply entrenched and becoming positively hostile to dissidents.

    All this, and Rio+20 just around the corner.


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    Stacey

    “there is a very public record of who has been lying to the public and who hasn’t – and it’s time to start using this information to make the liars and shirkers pay.”

    When I first read this I thought, Oh I’ll read on it must be an article about the Fiddlestick Team?

    I think Steve Twit needs to go and lie down in a dark room weraing boxing gloves.

    Jo I hope you are looking after my Lord Gwent, I don’t want him coming back wering a silly hat with corks bobbling from it.

    In the UK we are having the worst drought in living memory, heavy storms, flooding everywhere, lightning and thunderstorms, hail and strong winds. I think one day people will look back and write songs about April showers?


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      Ian Hill

      I spent the entire month of April 1988 in England, Wales and Scotland. It rained once and tried to snow once. That was it!


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      Lord Gwent? If you mean Dellers, we’re not just looking after him to make sure he doesn’t go home with cork bobbling from hats, we’re looking after him so well he doesn’t want to go home at all. :-)

      Jo


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        Stacey

        I knew this would happen I said to him JD you’ll never come back.
        Stace he said “what are you talking about”
        Well JD they’re all of the east end persuasion, the inside of the scrubs would be home from home to them. Don’t you say that becuase they are very sensitive from eating too much Vegimite.

        Stace he said your being alarmist, uh moi, no I says they’ll make you an offer you can’t refuse.

        What’s that then?

        Well they’ll show you the fantastic beaches, lovely weather and all those beautiful women, which won’t apply to you cos you are married. :-)


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    Stacey

    Arrgh I am spell bound by my own typos :-)


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    Tim

    If propaganda is focused on something that you don’t want to happen, then it is fear propaganda.

    I believe that this poor guy is the result of a masterminded long-term plan of fear propaganda. If this globalist cabal have planned these outcomes for at least 30 years and have limitless funds to hire the best mercenary/turncoat scientists, politicians, public servants, strategy planners and global PR specialists, it’s very probable that they have also predicted this kind of end result.

    They are encouraging violence from the brainwashed against the imagined enemy – The devilish ‘deniers’.


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    Jean-Paul

    And when two days ago, all I jokingly said was : “Save the environment : [snip]“, you moderated me because you thought I was being rude for the poor ecologists. Was I as rude as that Steve Zwick – who wasn’t even joking?


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    Jimmy Haigh

    Steve Zwikipedia.


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    A you people checking the latest on Peter Slipper – our Fed parliament speaker – over at Tim Blair -
    http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/timblair/
    he will need a teflon coating -


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    Jock

    As Steve is breathing and therefore expiring CO2, using planes, using electricity and overall himself contributing to CO2 emissions, one would presume that as Steve knows where he is he can charge himself or visit whatever punishment on himself he wishes. But that is not Steves way. It is always someone else causing the ill never him. Ahhh those Nazis never did die out after the war. They are still with us.

    Steve, we know you are lying. And we know where you live. And we want all the money back spent on mad schemes to produce renewable energy, on the IPCC and Had Crut, and all the other “Agencies”. Every cent paid , so far, on “green” energy and the warming scandal. Pony up.


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    Kevin Moore

    http://news.softpedia.com/news/NAS-Recognises-Global-Warming-as-Established-Theory-182263.shtml

    The planet is warming due to increases in heat trapping gases in our atmosphere,says NAS.

    Last year marked an important event for people fighting against global warming and climate change. The US National Academy of Sciences (NAS) acknowledged the validity of theories related to the two phenomena, and put them on par with such theories as Earth’s age, the Big Bang and evolution.

    These are some of the most important sets of data by which modern life unfolds. Charles Darwin’s theory on evolution, Albert Einstein’s theory of general relativity and Newton’s theory of gravity are just a few of the tremendously important theories that we use in most aspects of our life.

    For many years, climate change deniers – some of them motivated by interests, and other simply manipulated into forming totally wrong opinions about things – have argued that there was no truth to global warming.

    Examples included harsh winters in areas that were once spared from such manifestations, and the fact that some glaciers, and the East Antarctic Ice Sheet were growing rather than declining.

    Using these arguments to combat global warming is as narrow-minded as possible. Generally speaking, using exceptions to contradict a general trend is just a means of delaying the inevitable, not form opinions.

    The reason why this issue has resurfaced is because many climate change deniers are using the snow storms plaguing the United States and other parts of the world as an argument that the planet is not getting warmer. These people are apparently unfamiliar with the concept of seasonal variation.

    “The planet is warming due to increased concentrations of heat-trapping gases in our atmosphere. A snowy winter in Washington does not alter this fact,” the NAS said in a statement last year.

    “Climate change is a theory as certain as the theory of the Earth’s age (4.5 billion years), the Big Bang Theory, and the theory of evolution,” the highest US science body went on to say.

    The statement was made in response to the fact that Sen. James M. Inhofe denounced climate change as a “hoax.” Maybe the top US official should leave scientific issues to scientists, people who actually studies the problems at hand, and have an idea of what they are talking about.

    Following the senator’s questionable announcement, more than 255 prominent climate scientists signed the NAS conclusions, and published their reply in Science Magazine. Unfortunately, global warming is becoming an increasingly politicized debate, which shouldn’t be happening.

    The phenomenon affects all regions of the political spectrum. Pacific Institute director Peter Gleick says that deniers (such as the senator) “are typically driven by special interests or dogma, not by an honest effort to provide an alternative theory that credibly satisfies the evidence.”

    Publications such as The New York Times, The Wall Street Journal and The Washington Post rejected the letter, which goes to demonstrate that not even newspapers are bias-free, Daily Galaxy reports.

    “Society has two choices. We can ignore the science and hide our heads in the sand and hope we are lucky, or we can act in the public interest to reduce the threat of global climate change quickly and substantively,” the 255 scientists said.

    “The good news is that smart and effective actions are possible. But delay must not be an option,” they added, saying that “McCarthy-like threats of criminal prosecution against our colleagues based on innuendo and guilt by association” need to stop.

    The aforementioned senator and his clique were leading efforts to lead prosecutions into the so-called Climategate scandal, a clearly-political maneuver that failed miserably at discrediting global warming proponents, as intended.

    Unfortunately, those who released the “incriminatory” emails managed to hijack the Copenhagen climate talks of 2009, essentially delaying any significant measures against climate change by a year.

    Self-motivated figures of authority such as Inhofe took it upon themselves to “fix” the situation, and to exploit it for their own use. Thankfully, their political moves failed, and the people know the truth.


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      Winston

      They should change their acronym from NAS to AOD- “The Academy of the Deluded”. The article above is such a load of hand-wringing wet blanket BS that one struggles to believe that academics could lack such intellectual rigour as to allow themselves to associate their names with such a compendium of ad hominems (“deniers’, “narrow-minded”), projection (“narrow minded”, “global warming is becoming an increasingly politicized debate, which shouldn’t be happening”, “typically driven by special interests or dogma”), hubris (“leave scientific issues to scientists”, “Climategate scandal, a clearly-political maneuver that failed miserably at discrediting global warming proponents”), Chicken Little cowardice (“hide our heads in the sand and hope we are lucky”) and complete unexpurgated delusional thinking (“”which goes to demonstrate that not even newspapers are bias-free”, “delay must not be an option”, “Climategate…….failed miserably at discrediting global warming proponents”, “Thankfully, their political moves failed, and the people know the truth”).

      One senses that if the REAL truth eventually surfaces that these institutions will be shown to have been laughably compliant to pseudoscience, and therefore derelict in their duties as overseers, with themselves totally lacking in critical thinking skills, and thus the shame and embarrassment will be completely terminal to their academic and professional reputation as an organisation, and as individuals within that organisation.


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      Kevin Moore

      What are the thumbs down meant to indicate?


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        Bob Malloy

        Kevin,

        While none of the thumbs down are from me, I noticed them earlier this morning,leading me to re-read your piece.

        I have had the same happen to me in the past, when like you I reposted pro warming material, failing to make it clear I did not agree with the content of my post, that I was only highlighting what the MSM was pushing.

        In the future if what you have posted does not align with your own view, make it plain for readers to understand.


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      AndyG55

      “Peter Gleick says “………. not by an honest effort …………….”

      roflmao !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


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      AndyG55

      Several “national scientific bodies” have backed the AGW agenda.

      Usually it turns out to be a couple of people at the top who have put forward their funded opinions, very much to the detriment of the standing of those once asteemed organisation.

      The same with several of the scientifc journals that have let themselves be coerced by the AGW priesthood: reputation soon to be in tatters, (if not already).

      Their own fault !! They should have looked more closely at the science, and questioned it, like any real scientist would.


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    KeithH

    How have people been dumbed-down to the extent they will apparently believe that a few human induced extra parts per million of a trace gas CO2, (additional to what every animal exhales in normal breathing), absolutely essential to sustaining all life on our planet, can not only cause significant measurable global temperature change, but lead to runaway Catastrophic Anthropogenic Global Warming?

    Further, that it can not only be labelled a pollutant (by the EPA in the USA) and verbally by politicians all over the world seeking to control and regulate every facet of our lives, as well as those rapacious scammers and carpet-baggers who see massive profits from investment in heavily subsidised renewables, carbon credits trading and related lucrative spin-offs, all based on inadequate computer climate modelling with not a shred of empirical evidence to support the hypothesis, but be touted as a major driver of climate change?

    The dumbed-down seem to accept the very antithesis of real science when they believe and spout that “the science is in”, “there is overwhelming consensus” “the science is settled”. To any thinking person even with the barest minimum of scientific knowledge, the red flags went up and immediately raised the interest of countless scientists and lay people of all backgrounds and persuasions to become involved and start checking such outlandish claims.

    Politicians and “One World Government ideologues and/or control freaks” think they have found the perfect formula. Create a massive environmental scare campaign; recruit anti-human fossil-fuel hating fanatics to lead the charge aided by hoodwinked genuine environmentalists; lavishly fund compliant scientists and their organisations and lay down what they have to “find”; lavishly fund an assortment of willing supportive groups under a “Save the Planet” and “sustainability” banner; propose imposing a tax on the air we breathe and have a gaggle of eco-loons and misguided genuine people from the aforementioned groups begging the governments to go ahead!

    The tactics of infiltrating schools, colleges and universities at all levels of education has apparently been very successful in producing brainwashed children who are now growing up, becoming educators themselves and perpetuating the CAGW myth. Governments at all levels together with most of their organisations have been similarly infiltrated and we are constantly bombarded with their alarmist propoganda through compliant media. Australian Greens leader Christine Milne is a prime example. Just as with Climate Commissioner Tim Flannery, she has from day one of her public life consistently spouted the most alarming computer-modelled scenarios as the gospel truth and in so doing has terrified countless children and impressionable people. I guess that answers my own “dumbed-down” question! Perhaps the two most important questions are: How did we let it happen and are we going to continue to let it happen without a fight?

    Two good sites for climate factors.

    Potential Climatic Variables Page
    Compiled by WUWT regular “Just The Facts”

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/reference-pages/potential-climatic-variables/

    and the chapter: Factors driving climate – the dynamic sun radiating to a dynamic Earth

    from Thriving with Nature and Humanity: Malcom Roberts

    http://nzclimatescience.net/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=559&Itemid=38


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    pat

    Revkin’s got religion:

    19 April: NYT Dot Earth: Andrew C. Revkin: More on Global Warming from a Republican Meteorologist
    The meteorologist and energy entrepreneur Paul Douglas is keeping up his valuable effort to depoliticize the science pointing to a growing human influence on the climate…
    Now he’s going further, taking his argument to the commerce-oriented Bloomberg Businessweek Web site in a piece titled “Climate Change Has Nothing to Do With Al Gore” (the first of a two-part post, Douglas says). Here’s an excerpt and link: …
    ….”I’m a Christian and ultimately come to Christ through faith. With climate change no faith is required. There is a large and growing body of evidence. The way nature works applies the same to Republican and Democrat, Christian and Muslim, animal, tree and stone. Why do people who profess to love and follow God roll their eyes? Luke 16:2 says “Man has been appointed as a steward for the management of God’s property, and ultimately he will give account for his stewardship.”
    The Web site Forecast the Facts, which was set up to criticize meteorologists who talk nonsense on climate change, would do well to credit Douglas and others who do the opposite.
    http://dotearth.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/04/19/more-on-global-warming-from-a-republican-meteorologist/


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    Michael

    One of the comments in the article http://www.forbes.com/sites/warrenmeyer/2012/04/19/a-vivid-reminder-of-how-the-climate-debate-is-broken/ reference the fact that his suggestions violate several aspects of DC law,as his business is run from the DC area,and seeing that they have a Virginia area code,I’d assume the same would apply there as well. There are also criminal penalties for making a terrorist threat, and for conspiracy to the same. Here’s a tip – calling for people in writing to take an action or omit an action that would result in the burning of private or public property IS conspiracy. It’s not commentary or opinion, it’s asking people to allow or cause the destruction by fire.


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    pat

    21 April: Canberra Times: Rosslyn Beeby: Top honour for dumped researcher
    Australian oceanographer Trevor McDougall has received one of the world’s top science honours, just four months after being told by CSIRO his research had no role in the science agency’s future.
    Professor McDougall, one of Australia’s most-awarded scientists for his work on ocean physics and climate change, has been elected a Fellow of the Royal Society of London…
    He was made redundant by CSIRO late last year, less than six months after he became the first Australian to receive the peer-nominated Prince Albert medal for ocean research…
    In a written statement acknowledging his appointment, Professor McDougall said fundamental research into ocean physics ”is recognised as a crucial missing link” in the ability to improve the accuracy of climate modelling.
    Earlier this year, more than 160 of the world’s top oceans and climate scientists signed a letter emailed to CSIRO chief executive Megan Clark, protesting against Professor McDougall’s dismissal.
    http://www.canberratimes.com.au/national/top-honour-for-dumped-researcher-20120420-1xcug.html

    don’t have a date for this, and don’t know why he got dismissed:

    Position vacant: A PhD project to improve the accuracy
    of climate models
    “I like the mathematical beauty of this method,” Dr.Trevor McDougall, CSIRO.
    What is the key to being a good oceanographer?
    The key to being a good oceanographer is to think differently from everyone else.
    If you think the same as everyone else, you can get papers published and you can
    have a reasonable career. But to think differently means that you may come up
    with quite original ideas that may change oceanographic practice forever.
    http://www.imas.utas.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0006/88116/Trevor_article.pdf


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    Kevin Moore

    http://www.numberwatch.co.uk/warmlist.htm

    Go to site and click on.

    A complete list of things caused by global warming

    Afghan poppies destroyed, African holocaust, aged deaths, poppies more potent, Africa devastated, Africa in conflict, African aid threatened, aggressive weeds, Air France crash, air pockets, air pressure changes, airport farewells virtual, airport malaria, Agulhas current, Alaskan towns slowly destroyed, Al Qaeda and Taliban Being Helped, allergy increase, allergy season longer, alligators in the Thames, Alps melting, Amazon a desert, American dream end, amphibians breeding earlier (or not), anaphylactic reactions to bee stings, ancient forests dramatically changed, animals head for the hills, animals shrink, Antarctic grass flourishes, Antarctic ice grows, Antarctic ice shrinks, Antarctic sea life at risk, anxiety treatment, algal blooms, archaeological sites threatened, Arctic bogs melt, Arctic in bloom, Arctic ice free, Arctic ice melt faster, Arctic lakes disappear, Arctic tundra lost, Arctic warming (not), a rose by any other name smells of nothing, asteroid strike risk, asthma, Atlantic less salty, Atlantic more salty, atmospheric circulation modified, attack of the killer jellyfish, avalanches reduced, avalanches increased, Baghdad snow, Bahrain under water, bananas grow, barbarisation, bats decline, beer and bread prices to soar, beer better, beer worse, etc……….


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      AndyG55

      “A complete list of things caused by global warming”

      Come off it Kevin..

      They have barely started yet !!

      The word “Complete” is sort of like the word “Settled” ;-) )

      As for “beer worse” is that anything like changing from Tooheys to VB.


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        Kevin Moore

        Climate change depresses beer drinkers
        13 September 2009
        Magazine issue 2725. Subscribe and save
        For similar stories, visit the Climate Change and Drugs and Alcohol Topic Guides

        IF THE sinking Maldives aren’t enough to galvanise action on climate change, could losing a classic beer do it? Climatologist Martin Mozny of the Czech Hydrometeorological Institute and colleagues say that the quality of Saaz hops – the delicate variety used to make pilsner lager – has been decreasing in recent years. They say the culprit is climate change in the form of increased air temperature.

        Mozny’s team used a high-resolution dataset of weather patterns, crop yield and hop quality to estimate the impact of climate change on Saaz hops in the Czech Republic between 1954 and 2006. Best-quality Saaz hops contain about 5 per cent alpha acid, the compound that produces the delicate, bitter taste of pilsners.

        The study found that the concentration of alpha acids in Saaz hops has fallen by 0.06 per cent a year since 1954, and models of hop yields and quality under …

        To continue reading this article, subscribe to receive access to all of newscientist.com, including 20 years of archive content.


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      AndyG55

      Oh, and “bat decline”.. almost certainly cause by the AGW hoax !

      Its the main reason wind turbines exist, to munch bats.

      They sure don’t seem to have much other purpose.


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    Dave

    .
    Hi Kevin,

    The “Climatologist Martin Mozny” of the Czech Hydrometeorological Institute says:

    that the quality of Saaz hops – the delicate variety used to make pilsner lager – has been decreasing in recent years. They say the culprit is climate change in the form of increased air temperature.

    Bull$%%T

    I love beer – and this guy has no idea on the breeding of hop bine (not hop vine) simply because the have stiff hairs not tendrils to aid in support! Hops gow nearly 6 meters in 70 days anytime between October and February. Nothing at all to do with climate change – it’s all day length of light! Temperature in Belgium has been decreasing and they are importing Hops from Australia to keep up demand! So how can he say temperature increase is a cause of alpha acid decrease? This is a typical UN, IPCC & The Greens grant man!

    The majority of Australian Hop bine is not genetically modified unlike the majority of European sources. Australian export & local consumption of hops is increasing because the producers seem to have more stock available and maybe they like the INCREASED CO2!

    This is a first – Martin the Climatologist from the Czech Republic has suddenly discovered a new species of Humulus lupuslus that responds to temperature not light hours – the whole report is utter garbage. Humulus lupuslus contains nearly 200 aromatic oils that make my choice of beer important – yet this turkey claims it all got to do with alpha acids percentage! Hey Martin – what about the Beta acids – also light dependant?


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      Dave

      .
      Forgot to add – the Alpha acids are bittering compounds when boiled with wort! The alpha acid rating is made by its proportion compared to the weight of hop! There is a demand for low alpha acid hop product!

      Sorry about the rant – I love beer!


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    Siliggy

    Disabled man rescued after house set alight
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-04-21/disabled-man-rescued-after-house-set-alight/3964182
    The police should check out the local warmist activists.


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    Catamon

    Burn those deniers houses down

    But only after they have been tattooed of course.


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    jon

    Like radical previous regimes before they are just kicking the butts of what they have in front of them.


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    BobC

    PS: If you have some worthless Pacific Islands in grave danger of disappearing, I’d like to buy them.

    Actual studies (egad! empirical data!) show what should have been obvious — that coral islands, being based on the skeletons of creatures that can only live near the surface, grow as the seas rise and erode as they fall. Wave action builds them up from broken coral skeletons and wind and rain erode them. The equilibrium point (which is where they always are) is about 1 – 2 meters above mean sea level.

    The sea level has risen 120 meters in the last 17,000 years, as the icecaps from the last iceage melted. The warmists must think that these islands were towering spires of dead coral back then (having somehow managed to avoid eroding over the previous 100,000 years), and are just at this historical moment (when they think Mankind has caused less than 1 meter of rise) about to disappear. Some of these islands are over 50,000,000 years old and have seen huge changes in sea level (and survived just fine) — but NOW Man is about to cause them to be destroyed with a measly 1 or 2 meters change in sea level.

    (SkepticalScience actually acknowledges that coral islands grow and shrink naturally. In this post, they even admit that many former coral atolls drowned when they couldn’t “keep up with sea level rise” in the distant past. They don’t mention the probability that accelerated subsidence of the extinct volcanos that many atolls are based on might have had as much or more to do with this than sea levels. An atoll’s growth has to keep up with both the sea level changes and the sea mount’s subsidence to stay at or near the surface.
    After ‘explaining’ that atolls have often drowned over the last 10′s of millions of years due to completely natural forces, SS just skips by the problem of attributing the current [non]crisis to Humans. At best, they make the case that people who choose to live on atolls should be treated the same as Californians who build on sea clifts — as responsible for the consequences of their own actions.)

    Aerial photographs of Pacific coral atolls from WWII compared with photographs today show that all these islands have either stayed the same, or grown as the seas rose ~12 inches.

    The few islands that are in trouble (like Male, the capitol of the Maldives) are in that fix because of man alright — but not anything to do with the atmosphere. In Male’s case, runoff from the island-covering capitol city has killed the coral.


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    Kevin Moore

    Who should own the weather? -

    http://csat.au.af.mil/2025/volume3/vol3ch15.pdf

    Executive Summary

    In 2025, US aerospace forces can “own the weather” by capitalizing on emerging technologies and focusing development of those technologies to war-fighting applications. Such a capability offers the war fighter tools to shape the battlespace in ways never before possible. It provides opportunities to impact operations across the full spectrum of conflict and is pertinent to all possible futures.

    The purpose of this paper is to outline a strategy for the use of a future weather-modification system to achieve military objectives rather than to provide a detailed technical road map.A high-risk, high-reward endeavor, weather-modification offers a dilemma not unlike the splitting of the atom.

    While some segments of society will always be reluctant to examine controversial issues such as weather-modification, the tremendous military capabilities that could result from this field are ignored at our own peril. From enhancing friendly operations or disrupting those of the enemy via small-scale tailoring of natural weather patterns to complete dominance of global communications and counterspace control, weather-modification offers the war fighter a wide-range of possible options to defeat or coerce an adversary. Some of the potential capabilities a weather-modification system could provide to a war-fighting commander in chief (CINC) are listed in table 1.

    Technology advancements in five major areas are necessary for an integrated weather-modification capability: (1) advanced nonlinear modeling techniques, (2) computational capability, (3) information gathering and transmission, (4) a global sensor array, and (5) weather intervention techniques. Some intervention tools exist today and others may be developed and refined in the future…


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      Kevin Moore

      http://www.un-documents.net/enmod.htm

      UN Documents

      Gathering a body of global agreements

      home | sustainable sevelopment | education | water | culture of peace | human rights | keywords | search

      Adopted by Resolution 31/72 of the United Nations General Assembly on 10 December 1976.

      The Convention was opened for signature at Geneva on 18 May 1977.

      Convention on the Prohibition of Military or Any Other Hostile Use of Environmental Modification Techniques


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    crakar24

    From Ice age now

    Yes, warmist Steve Zwick said this in Forbes magazine!

    If “skeptics” said something like this, we’d be thrown in jail as terrorists. This kind of intimidation is inexcusable. What in the hell is Forbes doing, giving coverage to this sort of tripe?

    Looks like old-fashioned Soviet purge techniques to me.

    With NASA scientists disputing their global-warming mantra, with the Bering Sea setting new records for the most ice in recorded history, with polar bears and penguins thriving, and with Himalayan glaciers growing bigger, global-warming alarmists have apparently decided to become more aggressive against anyone who dares question their twisted beliefs.

    Just last month, Professor Kari Norgaard of the University of Oregon called for climate skeptics to be likened to racists and ‘treated’ for having a mental disorder. “Resistance at individual and societal levels must be recognized and treated,” yelled Norgaard.

    Norgaard has also urged Obama to act like a dictator, virtually suspend democracy, ignore public sentiment, and enforce climate change mandates by executive fiat.

    This is scary! I hope the American public rebels against these sorts of terror tactics.

    By the way we are sooooooooooooooooo close

    http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/N_stddev_timeseries.png

    Once we cross the line i am going to ask the booga booga scare mongerers here where is all the heat because afterall their feeble excuse for record NH snowfall is because all the heat has moved into the Arctic.

    “oh shut up crakar, i hope your house burns down”


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    Bruce D Scott

    Totalitarians, dont ya just luv em!!!


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    PositivePaul

    facts are facts. When I hear the debate for warming and even for the opposite I can’t help thinking that it’s a useless debate when you recall the undeniable facts which will overwhelm the warming debate anyway. Here are but a few massively overwhelming facts. The PM and her puppet, Swan- lied to the people in order to gain government. Australians don’t like being lied to. So the FACT is that nothing will change the minds of those who despise this PM and her Ministers. FACT: more of our money has been wasted on pink batts, school halls, solar power, wind power and the NBN than would have taken to fix our troubled health system. FACT: Anthony Albanesy described the Convoy of No Confidence as “The Convoy of No Consequence” a statement exposing his disregard for the people who pay his wage – the country folk will never change their vote thanks to him. FACT: The Craig Thompson and Peter Slipper affair is showing that we have a problem finding decent people to sit in the high seats of government – The NSW and QLD elections are telling the rest of us that the issue is not WARMING. The truth about warming of course is that it isn’t occuring. No Tax in history has ever improved a nation. No rational mind would ever vote to be taxed….as Kerry Packer once said “only a bloody idiot would pay more tax than he has to”.
    FACT: The Fort Dennison water gauge station in Sydney Harbour is one of the worlds oldest continuous monitoring gauges and has recorded a zero change in water level right up to today. I have viewed the data myself. FACT: CO2 is not a pollutant and not a gas that initiates warming. FACT: Greenhouse growers pump CO2 into their greenhouses to increase the health of the plants. THE BIG FACT is that the people want an end to the warming debate and want to get back to building the nation. Abbott will remove the carbon tax and that solves that. Keep in mind that we are a small population taking on the worlds largest carbon tax whilst producing a tiny 1.3% of the worlds output keeping in mind that our bushfires alone (which are never mentioned) leave us humans with about 3% of that 1.3% – close to nothing.


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