Wednesday

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82 comments to Wednesday

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    Ireneusz Palmowski

    The division of the polar vortex in the lower stratosphere is strengthening, which will strengthen the highs in eastern Europe and bring Arctic air to the US.
    https://i.ibb.co/Smr8YM0/gfs-z100-nh-f00.png

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    CO2 Lover

    A sunny day has been forecast for Melbourne – not many of these so far this Summer!

    Begining to think I was living in the UK!

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      The UK is famously sunny which is why the govt is so Clever in expanding our solar farms .

      We should be able to have solar power in such quantity that it will become virtually free and our brilliant scientists will tweak the panels so energy will be available 24/7

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        Graeme No.3

        Even under snow?

        And thanks to Neville (on the other post today) World solar 0.82% of world primary energy (wind 1.31%) so quite a bit of way to go to Nett Zero.

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      David Maddison

      As with all Leftist propaganda, I generally assume any “forecast” from the BoM is the opposite of the truth.

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      Greg in NZ

      The West Island (Australia) looks totally average today, according to the BoM-bastic’s home page: nothing out of the ordinary temp-wise, yet maybe somewhat wetter than expected (hint: Flim Flammery).

      Here in the Shaky Isles (NZ), much ado is being made of Christchurch’s 34.6C yesterday (thanks to a foehn NW breeze off the mountains) yet complete silence about today’s max of 20C (thanks to a seabreeze from the NE). Instead, ‘heat alerts’ are being issued for Upper Hutt, north of Wellington, where it may reach 29C – again, thanks to a NW breeze which has NutZero to do with CO2 nor methane nor farmers’ tractors’ belches.

      BTW our dams are 95% full – quelle horreur! – hence warnings to conserve water as sumpfink hot & dry cometh thus way… soon… maybe… the models say.

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        Greg in NZ

        To reiterate, the record for NZ’s hottest day EVAH! still stands after 51 years: 42.4C on 7 Feb 1973 north of Chch, again in a roaring NW foehn gale, just before a southerly buster came through and it turned to custard.

        Fifty-one years & no change: FAIL.

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          Greg in NZ

          Update to failed fearmongering:
          Upper Hutt only managed 28C so ‘heat alert’ was false advertising, again.
          Christchurch only made 19C.
          However, 2 towns in the King Country (central North Island) hit 29C according to a breathless newsreader who sounded shocked and horrified – even though low-30s are the norm for this inland area in summer.
          We peaked at 26C on the north-east coast, chilled by a ferocious howling onshore breeze: another 1.5 degrees would’ve been greatly appreciated, but sadly, ’twas a no-show.

          Maybe the j-a-b wiped people’s memories as well as their immune systems: patiently waiting on a [real] heat wave.

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      Annie

      Actually, we were in England in June last year and it was warm and sunny and BIL was panicking over the so-called drought. The local rivers were fairly dry. In July we were sent a photo of those local rivers roaring and full of water! As for this year, I see there are photos of the floods, around Tewkesbury for example, looking like it did in 2007.

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    CO2 Lover

    The Deindustrialisation of Australia.

    The cost of electicity for business in Australia is around 0.123 USD per kWh compared to China at around 0.08 USD. The USA in 0.12 USD

    In renewable loving Germany it is double that of Australia at 0.255 and in the UK it is 0.238

    So electricity prices still have a long way to rise in Australia as Labor fails to learn from the mistakes of Germany and the UK.

    Chrissy Bowen claims that nuclear energy is too expensive, however the cost of electricity for business in France is 0.143 USD per kwh much cheaper than Germany and the UK.

    China is the world’s largest producer of Aluminium. Aluminium smelters in Australia consume 10% of our electrity production.

    The total subsidy to aluminium smelters in Australia amounts to A$410 million per annum (The Australia Institute).

    Their days are clearly numbered.

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      So electricty in Oz is virtually the same as in the US? That gives your businesses a big advantage.

      Do you know the relative costs for Residential electricty?

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      David Maddison

      The aluminium smelting industry originally came to Australia because of some of the world’s cheapest electricity. Now it has to be subsidised to survive. And there is a further subsidy payable for the “right” to shed their load when the wind stops blowing and the sun stops shining.

      I am surprised that the industrial price for electricity is the same as the USA. What is the basis for that? I am sure small businesses and even much larger businesses pay far more than that. A lot of Australian businesses have failed solely because of high electricity prices.

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      David Maddison

      https://www.savvy.com.au/energy/average-electricity-cost-for-small-business/

      It’s worth noting that generally, electricity tariffs for small business accounts are higher than for domestic retail accounts. The average business pays around 32c/kWh for their electricity, whereas domestic customers pay an average of 26c/kWh.

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      CO2 Lover

      As of February 2023, the average residential electricity rate in the U.S. is about 23 cents per kilowatt-hour (kWh). Importantly, electricity rates can vary widely based on where you live. Rates vary from a low of 10.35 ¢ / kWh in Idaho to a high of 28.38 ¢ / kWh in California.

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    CO2 Lover

    Fauci testifies

    Dr Anthony Fauci evaded more than 100 questions about Covid, the lab leak theory and his ties to Wuhan during a landmark Congressional hearing Monday.

    House Republicans who quizzed the ex-White House advisor said he ‘played semantics’ to avoid conceding that he funded dangerous research in China that is feared to have started the pandemic.

    Dr Fauci, 82, also admitted that he signed off on millions of dollars worth of grants without reviewing the proposals – and appeared to admit his agency had little oversight of the foreign labs it bankrolled.

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    Slowly but surely: Exposure of communities and infrastructure to subsidence on the US east coast

    Abstract

    Coastal communities are vulnerable to multihazards, which are exacerbated by land subsidence. On the US east coast, the high density of population and assets amplifies the region’s exposure to coastal hazards. We utilized measurements of vertical land motion rates obtained from analysis of radar datasets to evaluate the subsidence-hazard exposure to population, assets, and infrastructure systems/facilities along the US east coast. Here, we show that 2,000 to 74,000 km2 land area, 1.2 to 14 million people, 476,000 to 6.3 million properties, and >50% of infrastructures in major cities such as New York, Baltimore, and Norfolk are exposed to subsidence rates between 1 and 2 mm per year. Additionally, our analysis indicates a notable trend: as subsidence rates increase, the extent of area exposed to these hazards correspondingly decreases. Our analysis has far-reaching implications for community and infrastructure resilience planning, emphasizing the need for a targeted approach in transitioning from reactive to proactive hazard mitigation strategies in the era of climate change.

    For what reason they mention CC ?

    ‘The impacts are real’: New satellite images show East Coast sinking faster than we thought

    New satellite images show the eastern U.S. coast is sinking at a faster rate than what was first reported last year, according to a new study published in the journal PNAS Nexus.

    Back in September, a team of scientists out of Southern California found that the New York City metro area is sinking at an average of 0.06 inches annually, USA TODAY previously reported. That number is now 0.08 inches in some areas, according to the new study published on Jan. 2.

    Why they thougt (headline) instead of measure and compare ?

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      No name man

      Krishna

      Maybe the huge number of massive buildings, infrastructure et cetera, acts like a partial return of the 2 mile high ice that existed prior to the current (Holocene) interglacial. I recall Prof Ian Plimer, or one of his ilk, referring to uplift of the land once the ice melted; Scandanavia (I think) is still uplifting following the ice melt, so check the professor out, as he might have an answer.

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    Nick Jasper

    Honest question for the Brainiacs of JoNova-land:

    I can look up this answer on Wiki, and have, but would prefer to utilize the scientific expertise here instead.

    Background: an individual with whom I am in a discussion, claims that I fail to understand the nature of work (in the classical Physics definition, viz., W = Fd [Work, a vector, equals Force (vector) times distance (scalar)]).

    That said, I would like to have a complete understanding (within the limitations of explaining something on a blog like this), how does a solar panel work? I’ve read the Wiki explanation, and it is adequate enough, but I’m looking to have a slightly deeper understanding, and specifically in the context of W = Fd as above.

    Thanks in advance,

    NJ

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      Interesting question and one I won’t attempt to answer.

      In the UK they have about 10% efficiency so it would also be interesting to know whether development of the technology can raise it substantially above this pitiful level.

      The panels Tracking the sun would help but can anything alse be done to maximise the energy output

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        CO2 Lover

        With solar panles there is “efficiency” and there is “Capacity Factor”.

        “Efficiency” is converting solar energy into electricity at noon on a sunny day – some solar panel makers claim 80% efficiency.

        “Capacity Factor” is output in the real world and depends on location and weather.

        Sunny Spain has a Capacity Factor of 18%, while overcast UK is only 11%. New Zealand is 9%. Norway is 6%.

        The average capacity factor for Australia is 15% – but will vary widely from sunny north central Australia to Tasmania.

        Remember Twiggy Forrest’s grand plan with Sun Cable to use solar panels in WA to make electricity for Singapore (Capacity Factor 19%)!!!

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        CO2 Lover

        Relocate UK solar panels to Spain!

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        Graeme#4

        The theoretical maximum efficiency for monocrystalline solar cells, called the Shockley-Queisser Limit, is around 33.7%. Currently the most practical efficiency achieved is 26.89%. Most solar panels are between 20 to 24%.

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      Given the only thing that moves are electrons and the distance is undefined I do not see how the concept of work applies. But I have never worked with work so maybe the work people found a way.

      Tried searching on “do PV cells do work?” And only got answers to “how do PVcells work?”

      Please let us know.

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      Nick Jasper

      So, at this point, allow me to clarify the situation a bit more:

      In the discussion, this other individual, a CAGW-alarmist, says that I do not understand ‘Work’ properly, in that ‘work’ can only be done if there is a temperature difference; i.e., and engine takes in fuel, combines it with air, ignites the fuel/air mixture, creates heat and mechanical energy.

      Simple enough; there is no argument about the details of that aspect of ‘work’.

      In the same vein, I then asked about solar PV cells, and how they do their ‘ … making electricity … ‘ conversion: a solar PV cell, to make electricity, should display a similar temperature difference; once the electricity is generated, it can do ‘work’ in the sense of driving an electric motor, or lighting a light, or generating heat through a resistance-type heating coil.

      At this point, this alarmist advised me that I failed to understand ‘work’. So, aside from the Wiki entry into how a solar PV cell generates electricity, I am trying to verify that I understand the process: a solar photon knocks an electron out of a lattice, which makes it mobile, and able to flow as a current.

      The “reframe” of the question thusly is: does a solar PV panel work by the existence of a temperature difference, and nothing else?

      Does that help w/ trying to answer the initial question?

      NH

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        Graeme No.3

        Not sure, but solar panels lose efficiency as they heat up (from solar rays). ASAIK the incoming solar rays lose energy by conversion into lower wavelengths.

        As far as I can see the CAGW alarmist is trying to bring in Carnot’s principle about heat engines, which (as Dave Maddison points out) doesn’t seem to be taught in Engineering these days, so he has some incline.

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          Graeme#4

          Not as much as I would have thought. Have been watching my peak solar power output on normal summer days compared to really hot days, and I’m not seeing much of a reduction, if any, on the really hot days.
          For example, today a lot hotter than yesterday, seems to be peaking at around 4000 W. Yesterday peaked at 4200-4300 W. So only a 5-6% reduction.

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        CO2 Lover

        If you lift a stone off the ground you are doing “work” – no temperature difference required.

        If you then drop the stone – the work you did is converted to kinetic energy.

        When work done on an object increases only its kinetic energy, then the net work equals the change in the value of the quantity 1/2mv2
        . This is a statement of the work–energy theorem, which is expressed mathematically as

        W=ΔKE = 1/2mv2(2)−1/2mv2(1) -{Squared}.

        The subscripts (2) and (1) indicate the final and initial velocity, respectively. This theorem was proposed and successfully tested by James Joule,

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        Robert Swan

        Nick Jasper,

        I’m no “brainiac”, but it sounds like a pretty muddy debate. I think you might both be getting mixed up with “heat engine” theory.

        Temperature is a “big-picture” item. It’s an average over many molecules. E.g.,at this page, it says:

        Any single atom or molecule has kinetic energy, but not a temperature. This is an important distinction. Populations of molecules have a temperature related to their average velocity but the concept of temperature is not relevant to individual molecules, they have kinetic energy but not a temperature.

        That makes it pretty much nonsense to talk about temperature when pushing individual electrons around.

        The photovoltaic solar panel uses the light of the Sun, not its heat. Light is electromagnetic radiation, and the panel harnesses this to cause a flow of electrons. These electrons can be used by electric motors to do work, or by other electrical things to generate heat, magnetism, etc. It comes down to the conservation of energy. Energy is measured in Joules; that’s also the unit for work. Electrical energy is typically measured in kWh, but 1kWh is 3.6 million Joules.

        It sounds a bit weird for a climate discussion to get worked up about work. It might be more to the point to explore *temperature*, and the rather special things climatologists do with it. A global surface temperature does exist — just average the energy of all the molecules at the Earth’s surface — but what use could it possibly have? With convection and evaporation, rain, snow, volcanoes, blah, blah, the molecules at the surface are changing all the time. Why would anyone expect this to be a stable measure of anything?

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        Geoff Sherrington

        Nick,
        Take a photo-electric cell, but it in an oven and see if it generates a voltage as it heats and cools.
        It will not, so the voltage from solar cells involves light.
        Greenie question answered?
        Geoff S

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        Kalm Keith

        Hi Nick,

        Sometimes there are questions that are so poorly framed that we shouldn’t bother answering them. The constant misuse of the term photon by the IPCCC mob is a dead giveaway that they don’t have a clue about atomic physics.

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      CO2 Lover

      The joule (J) is the metric unit of measurement for both work and energy. The measurement of work and energy with the same unit reinforces the idea that work and energy are related and can be converted into one another. 1.0 J = 1.0 N∙m, the units of force multiplied by distance. 1.0 N = 1.0 kg∙m/s2, so 1.0 J = 1.0 kg∙m2/s2. Analyzing the units of the term (1/2)mv2 will produce the same units for joules.

      1kwh=3.6×10^6 Joules.

      The average solar panel has a power output rating of 250 to 400 watts (W) and generates around 1.5 kilowatt-hours (kWh) of energy per day.

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        Geoff Sherrington

        Lover,
        For context, as you would know, the familiar old 240 volt single bar heater/radiator is 1,000 watt, so running one takes all of a typical solar panel outut on a good day.
        Geoff S

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        Graeme#4

        I’m achieving 2kWh per panel per day from my solar system. 34.9kWh yesterday from 17 panels.

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      RickWill

      What is the context of the debate?

      You are better starting with energy because it is conserved unless you have fusion or fission.

      Work is considered “mechanical” energy. The two forms are potential and kinetic. If you weigh 80kg climb a single step 0.2m high in Earth’s gravity field you have expended 156.8joules. If you go up 16 steps then you have produced 2508J. Do that in 10 seconds and you have worked at a rate of 250W.

      Drop from the top step 3.2m to the floor below and you will reach 7.91m/s before hitting the floor. The potential energy was transferred to kinetic energy of 0.5X80X7.91^2=2508J just before you come to thundering stop and that kinetic energy gets converted to broken tissue.

      Waves on water are the result of the interchange of kinetic and potential energy. The particles move vertically in the gravity field. There is no particle transmission, just wave energy. The phase velocity of the waves of length L is Vp=(gL/2pi)^0.5.

      Heat energy is the internal kinetic energy of matter. It takes 4184J to heat 1kg of water 1C. If you work at a rate of 250W turning a stirrer in a well insulated jug holding 1kg of water for 10 minutes, you will convert your kinetic energy to heat energy in the water. The temperature will rise 150,000/4124/1 = 36C. You have traded your kinetic energy to internal kinetic energy of the water as measured by its temperature.

      Electrical energy in joule is the result of moving a charge of 1coulomb through a voltage difference of 1 volt. Electric current in amperes is charge flow rate in coulombs per second, Electrical energy is connected to magnetic energy in a similar way mechanical energy connects potential and kinetic. Magnetic energy is 0.5XinductanceXcurrent^2.

      Electro-magnetic waves exist in the EM field similar to ocean surface waves in the gravitational field. But EM waves can travel in 3D and the phase velocity is constant for all wavelengths in a particular material. Vp=1/(electrical permitivityx magnetic permeability)^0.5. If you use the respective values for a vacuum, you get what is commonly known as the speed of light.

      Solar panels work when an EM wave excites an electron (1.6E-16coulombs) to jump a junction with typical gap voltage of 0.5V. They convert high frequency EM waves to just electrical energy. The best solar panels will utilise as much of the EM wave spectrum as possible. The best commercial solar panels can convert about 25% of the incident solar energy to electrical energy. A 250W solar will typically have 72 junctions in series to give an open circuit voltage of 36V and a maximum power voltage of 25V. So the maximum power current of 10A equates to 62,500,000,000,000,000 electrons circulating through the panel.

      I suggest you drop the notion of a “photon” it is outdated and confusing. There is only one electromagnetic field in the entire universe that has countless wave interactions at any point in space and time. The EM field is mostly like a very confused ocean in 3D. Solar panels are tuned to extract some of the higher frequency wave energy from that EM ocean.

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        Nick Jasper

        Hey, everyone!!

        Many thanks. Appreciate the validation.

        As to the ‘context’ of the discussion between myself and the climate alarmist:

        The issue became muddled, as was pointed out above, when we turned to the supposed ‘back-radiation’ in the 15-micron band that alarmists say is the primary cause of climate change.

        Now, please understand I am summarizing and paraphrasing a great deal of discussion. What it came down to is this: I suggested that if the CO2-15-micron thermal IR energy was capable of doing all this ‘heating’ and causing all this ‘climate change’, that it would be in the best interest of all mankind (and also you women-kind, Ms. Nova … ) if we just invented a converter that used this supposed 15-micron thermal IR energy, just like a solar panel takes visible light wavelengths and converts them to electrical energy. It was at this point that I was chided for not understanding what “work” is, and why it is impossible to take that 15-micron thermal IR energy and use it.

        That, of course, made no sense to me. Visible light is made to generate electricity; this 15-micron thermal IR energy is just EM radiation like visible light, and supposedly causing dangerous climate-changing heat (‘heat engine’ equals ‘work’ to the alarmist), so, if we create a converter that uses the 15-micron energy from CO2, to generate electricity, the problem of ‘solar panels’ is solved, because all that ‘back-radiation’ operates 24/7/365, in all weather conditions, and everywhere on the planet. Other than the cost of creating the converter, this CO2-caused energy is completely “free”, right?

        No answer to my suggestion from the alarmist, other than, ‘ … it cannot be done … ‘; I asked, ‘why?’ if all that free energy is just running around causing heating, then it should be something we can harness. Haven’t heard back from alarmist since.

        That was the impetus to make sure I was reading the Wiki entry correctly. It is the visible light, and not any heat-energy (“work”) that generates the electricity in a solar PV cell.

        As I was confident of, the JoNova brainiacs (yes, all of you are brainiacs, accept it!) have helped to clarify what I understood. That mythical ‘back-radiation’ that alarmists believe in so strongly is nothing more than clap-trap. It doesn’t exist, ergo, it cannot be harnessed. I did NOT know that solar panel efficiency drops as temperature increases; that was new, and good, information.

        So, thanks again to all who chimed in. I love these discussions and teaching and learning that takes place here.

        My best to all,

        Nick

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          RickWill

          supposed ‘back-radiation’ in the 15-micron band that alarmists say is the primary cause of climate change.

          Back radiation from a cold surface to a warm surface only exists in climate fisics. They separate the two T^4 terms in the S-B equation and think there are two components to the radiation. The temperature terms are related to electric field potentials of the EM field and only the difference of the two terms has significance as far as EM energy transfer is concerned. There is no energy transfer between two objects at the same temperature. Conductive heat transfer is a function of temperature difference so, by the same reasoning as there is back radiation, there should be back conduction and back convection.

          Michael Mischenko is probably the best physicist to work on atmospheric EM transmission. There is a lot of present instrumentation based on his theoretical work. He authored the linked paper:
          https://pdfs.semanticscholar.org/c03b/2b493f57e13d3c3e2b58d17c9656d2dee978.pdf

          7. Physical meaning of specific intensity
          The traditional definition of the specific intensity in the phenomenological RTT states that ~
          I (r, qˆ ) gives the amount of electromagnetic energy transported in the direction qˆ per unit area normal to qˆ per unit time per unit solid angle (e.g., Chandrasekhar 1950). This notion of the specific intensity implies that at the observation point r, electromagnetic energy propa-
          gates simultaneously in all directions and does it according to the angular distribution function ~
          I(r,qˆ).
          Our microphysical derivation of Eqs. (23) and (24) directly from the MMEs reveals that in ~
          the case of radiative transfer in a turbid medium this interpretation of I (r, qˆ ) is profoundly incorrect.

          Translated, “profoundly incorrect” means bu!!dung.

          This video is a lecture Michael gave:
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hjKJyn_uoIE
          If you go through the whole video it gives useful insights to the physics of EM energy transmission.

          As Mischenko points out, classic RTE are observational and not ground in basic physics. The basics physics are described by Maxwell’s equations and applied in field theory. RTEs are gross simplifications.

          This video has a good demonstration on the destructive interference of coherent light:
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RRi4dv9KgCg

          This video shows the double slit experiment for light and something similar with water waves interacting to give a totally different wave pattern from the two originating sources:
          https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Iuv6hY6zsd0

          The main points are:
          1. There is only ONE electromagnetic field in the whole universe.
          2. Electromagnetic radiation energy is in the form of a wave with sinusoidal interchange of electric and magnetic energy.
          3. Radiant energy flow is unidirectional at any point in space at any instant.
          4. Radiant energy always transmits from warmer to colder objects – never the reverse.

          Most of climate science is junk science built on its own special branch of physics that has no basis in real science. Mischenko must turn in his grave whenever Hansen’s energy balance diagram is updated in the IPCC ASSessment Reports.

          My suggestion for anyone trying to convince me that there is “greenhouse effect” is to give me the solution for Maxwell’s equations for Earth.

          All of the so-called radiation balance from satellites is calibrated to the data on ocean energy uptake as now measured by the Argo buoys. There is no way of actually measuring the incoming and outgoing radiation to and from Earth to any level of accuracy.

          It is interesting that gravity waves also travel at the speed of light in a vacuum. But the connection between matter, EM field and gravity field is something I do not understand. The sun senses the presence of Earth as matter due to the connection through both gravity field and EM field but delayed by 8 minutes. If Earth disintegrated in an instant, it would be 8 minutes before the sun adjusted and radiant energy was emitted in that direction where Earth was as if it was free space. There would also be a slight adjustment to the sun’s orbital forcing after 8 minutes.

          You will find that instruments used to “measure” back radiation are calibrated to the S-B equation. They do not measure energy. When the instrument is pointed at a colder atmosphere it loses energy to the atmosphere. If it was measuring energy input, it would not need a battery to power it.

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            Kalm Keith

            Huge 🙂

            But
            “There would also be a slight adjustment to the sun’s orbital forcing after 8 minutes.”

            Forcing? Sounds like an IPCCC unit.

            Maybe replace with pattern or trajectory?

            🙂

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          Simon Derricutt

          Nick – yep, it is possible to build a “solar panel” that converts lower-energy photons to electrical output. Two ways of doing this. One is to use a combination of a very small antenna and diode (nantenna arrays) to receive and rectify the EM waves, and the other is to reduce the band-gap of the semiconductor used but use the same structure as a standard solar panel. A good start to why solar panels work is in the wiki at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_cell, but if you’re interested there is much more to learn (and better sources). Currently the lowest band-gap commercially-available semiconductor is an alloy of Mercury and Cadmium, doped with Tellurium, giving a MerCaT IR detector with a desired band-gap. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mercury_cadmium_telluride for that one. Difficult to make and control the composition, so they are expensive (about $1500 for a die size of about 0.5mm²). For use as a sensor, to measure the quantity of this wavelength received, you need to cool it with liquid Nitrogen, but of course it’s just a PV and thus if you don’t cool it it will see radiation from its enclosure and internally and thus deliver a small amount of current at around 100mV.

          So yep, it’s not only possible but you can buy one. The interesting thing happens when you can make this cheaply and easily, and I’m working on that.

          I’ll disagree with Rick here, and say that radiation actually does go both ways between a colder and warmer object. You can measure the temperature of something optically with a thermal camera, and if the hotter object sent out only the “correct” amount of energy to be received by a cooler object in its field of view, and didn’t sent any energy out in the direction of a hotter object, then that breaks Causality because it can’t know where a moving object will be by the time that radiation reaches it. Also as Rick states, if the Earth suddenly disappeared and the Sun had to adjust the energy it sends out, when should it do that? The time-span gets more difficult when we’re using the JWST and are looking back billions of years into the past, in that in order to send out the right amount of radiation in our direction a star would have to know the entire future of the universe for billions of years in it’s future. It’s simpler to accept that the radiation (and indeed any heat transfer) is bidirectional and independent (and without any knowledge) of what will at some point receive that radiation. Thus an object radiates as if the whole rest of the universe was at absolute zero. The reason it doesn’t cool down to absolute zero is that it’s receiving radiation from other objects that also have no knowledge of what receives that radiation.

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            Kalm Keith

            Quote,

            “I’ll disagree with Rick here, and say that radiation actually does go both ways between a colder and warmer object “.

            Sounds like IPCCC siense.

            As Will J and I agreed, there’s a potential and energy will only move from higher to lower.

            btw if anybody can catch a photon could they please put it in a plastic bag and show us?

            🙂

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            RickWill

            you need to cool it with liquid Nitrogen

            That should give you the clue that EM radiation only transmits from hot to cold. The temperature of liquid nitrogen is minus 196C. The atmosphere will radiate to it.

            You can measure the temperature of something optically with a thermal camera

            It will not operate with a battery. If the target is cooler than the camera it will lose energy to the target and that loss of energy is related to a temperature using the S-B equation for calibration.

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    CO2 Lover

    Fun Fact: Plants growing in CO2 enriched air prefer warmer temperatures.

    The net photosynthetic rate (umol Co2/m2/sec)is around 10 at 24-28 degrees C at ambient CO2 concentrations.

    However, in a CO2 enriched greenhouse the net photosynthetic rate increases to around 35 umol Co2/m2/sec at around 38 degrees C.

    Therefore if increasing CO2 were to lead to “global warming”, the plants will get a double benefit!

    So what is all the fuss about with CO2 emissions????

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    Obituary of Ray Bates by Lord Monckton
    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2024/01/09/in-memoriam-professor-ray-bates/

    Unsurprisingly it is more about Monckton than Bates but still good. I did not know both converted to skepticism.

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    David Maddison

    Spotted on Farcebook:

    POST THE TRUTH.

    LET THEM HATE YOU, UNFRIEND YOU, BLOCK YOU, AND MOCK YOU.

    WE ARE HERE TO FEED THE LIONS NOT ENTERTAIN THE SHEEP.

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    another ian

    FWIW

    “The crime of the century goes to court”

    “Getting this case on the docket with the SCOTUS was in itself a major effort and a monumental achievement. If the Supreme Court agrees to hear the case, and it could be days or weeks before they reach that decision, it will be a watershed moment: the first time that the public health response to C0VlD l9 and its grave implications will be challenged in court.”

    More at

    https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2024-01-09/crime-century-goes-court

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    another ian

    It CAN happen

    “Seven days in a row, wind went to zero in Saskatchewan”

    https://www.smalldeadanimals.com/2024/01/09/seven-days-in-a-row-wind-went-to-zero-in-saskatchewan/

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      KP

      So once a mathematician steps in the modelleers are shown to be dickheads as usual! The trouble is, the original assumptions are never published, or people would have just laughed at Neil Ferguson and his ideas about how many people we meet each day.

      Sounds just like global warming to me!

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    MrGrimNasty

    The Channel Islands had a little bit of snow, more than anywhere else last night!
    https://www.itv.com/news/channel/2024-01-09/channel-islands-wake-up-to-snow

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      Adellad

      What a great mind and convincing speaker. No wonder the Forces of Evil have conspired to attack him on contrived “conflict of interest” rubbish. No doubt Soon would be too difficult to counter with logic and rational debate.

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    Greg in NZ

    Zeke How’s-yer-father, from Barking Mad Berkeley, questions the Settled Science Consensus? Shirley Knot!

    His Holeyness is “unsure about exactly what is going on”, as El Niño refuses to play ball with his hellfire prophecies. Meanwhile, Dr Otto from Imperial College London [warning ⚠️] counteracted with:

    “Every tenth of a degree matters”.

    I’m sure it does when yer pet theory fails to materialise yet, to keep the peasants fearful and in awe of your all-knowing prophetic powers [sic], ALL FRACTIONS MATTER! Bo!!ocks.

    via RNZ/BBC ‘2023 Hottest Ever’ 💩

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      Greg in NZ

      Principal Media Sc!ent!st, Brangelina & his sidekick Ben Noll from NIWA, are milking the media-waves today, now that summer has finally arrived (late, but everyone’s happy it turned up!).

      Jumping on the hottest ever bandwagon, they’re firing-off stats & percentages & endless voodoo numbers except – whoops! – 2023 wasn’t NZ’s hottest year: ’twas 2022. And it was only the 23rd wettest. Meh, who cares: find a few towns with windiest / driest / wettest / sunniest and milk it baby, milk it.

      Warmest day was 35.6C in Middlemarch, Otago on 4 Feb 2023… a long way (7 degrees cooler) than 1973’s record 42.4C, yet we should ‘stay vigilant’ for the imminent onslaught of… sumpfink.

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    R.B.

    Something Google Chrome recommended.
    Rising Temperatures as Hot Streak Kicks Off.

    The
    Rising temperatures as hot streak kicks off in SA
    The weekend will see continued sunny weather, just in time for the women’s Tour Down Under race, starting with Saturday, January 13th, predicted to be mostly sunny with a high of 31°C and southeasterly winds, and Sunday, January 14th, with a high of 32°C and partly cloudy skies.

    The hot streak continues next week, with Monday, January 15th, forecast for 31°C and Tuesday set for a high of 33°C.

    It’s January in Adelaide. It’s only above average because of the occasional spells of low 20s like we just had. They have a picture of a thermometer with a red hot background because it will finally be warm enough to go to the beach!

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      Adellad

      BoM’s West Terrace screen (near a 12-lane road), it’s “innovative” 1-second electronic readings and other tricks combine to ensure average maxima that bear little resemblance to actual experience. For example, November – you will recall that cool/cold and wet month by our standards – was a tiny fraction below average overall according to BoM. Risible – at least it would be were it not for the fact that this climate change fantasy is being weaponised against ordinary people.

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      Hanrahan

      The youth unemployment rate is already >20% and they are restless.

      Even Russia, home of the Lada, is complaining about tofu dregs cars and precision machine tools. They are in trouble.

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        el+gordo

        Word on the ground suggests youth unemployment is closer to 40%, they will lie down flat and watch it rot.

        The scuffles in the street between angry workers and the men in black must be causing heartburn in Beijing. Finally removing the shackles of oppression.

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        el+gordo

        “The working class is revolutionary or it is nothing at all.” Karl Marx

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    GreatAuntJanet

    Oooh, oooh, just finished listening to Willie Soon being interviewed by Tucker Carlson. Don’t miss it, he did a great job. https://rumble.com/v462w0x-this-is-what-they-dont-want-you-to-know-about-the-climate-agenda.html

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    another ian

    FWIW

    “‘Plant-Based Peanut Butter’ Is a Thing People Buy, and I Can’t Stop Laughing”

    “There’s a miracle health product you can buy right now, today. It has all the advantages of a vegan diet and none of the drawbacks. The best part? It’s available without a prescription, without having to wait for a pharmacist, and without having to show a photo ID. It’s sold openly on the shelves of supermarkets and even convenience stores from coast to coast.”

    “It’s plant-based peanut butter.”

    More at

    https://pjmedia.com/vodkapundit/2024/01/09/plant-based-peanut-butter-is-a-thing-and-i-cant-stop-laughing-n4925340

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    John Connor II

    Selfie biometrics app for farmers launches in Australia; digital ID program looms

    The nostalgic image of the agrarian farmer is pixelating in Australia, where AgPick Technology, an agritech provider based out of Aldinga, is now offering a face biometric authentication app designed to protect growers, suppliers and pickers from identity fraud.

    The global fresh produce and banana news trade publication Fresh Plaza reports that the AgPick app uses face biometrics and commercially available AI functionality to verify worker selfies and match their registered identity to details logged in the AgPick data store, such as visa status and payment methods. Any Android device can be used to capture the face image, and matching is immediate.

    The government has priced the proposed expansion of the existing MyGovID system at roughly $800 million Australian (roughly US$535 million), including the establishment of a regulatory body. The scheme faces familiar questions about data security, convenience versus risk, and intent versus actual use. However, Wilson says the biggest hurdle to successful implementation of a national digital ID scheme might still be communication – noting that “most Australians still have no idea that this is even happening.”

    https://www.freshplaza.com/north-america/article/9590182/facial-recognition-app-launched-to-protect-growers-from-id-fraud-in-australia/

    90% have no idea what’s happening, which is why history will repeat. I’m not interested in waking up those who want to stay asleep until 1 second to midnight and THEN run around screaming “what”s going on?”. They’ve had many many years to do that and CHOSE not to.😎

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    another ian

    “Woolworths withdraws all Australia Day products from sale.”

    https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2024/01/woolworths-withdraws-all-australia-day-products-from-sale.html

    Might be time to leave a message for management that you’re not shopping there

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      MP

      From the comments,
      “Barbara said…
      So Woolworths choose the minority over the majority. Every time you go to Woolworths, take a small Australian flag and wear an Australia Day hat or tshirt. They disgust me.”

      Aptly fits the comment of JC’s, you can’t fix that mentality, they can’t be saved from themselves.

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    MrGrimNasty

    The BBC is destroying its own programs by employing climate activists as presenters. They don’t even get it. They can’t entertain the idea that constantly pushing their climate agenda down people’s throats is turning them off. No, it’s because they aren’t giving us enough stories about supposed solutions!
    https://ca.news.yahoo.com/bbc-wildlife-shows-gloomy-climate-060000915.html

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