By Jo Nova
In the great Covid backpedalling of 2023, even the Australian ABC has finally admitted that natural immunity from Covid “lasts as long as vaccination” which is still false and misleading (because it lasts longer and is higher) but must have caused angst at the office. They go on to say their holy rosary incantation: “but experts have cautioned that vaccines are still the safer option”. Safer than what now, though? The new meta-review in the Lancet says nothing at all about side effects of vaccines or new variants, but people-who-believe-experts and people who think they are “good journalists” need to say their medical Hail-Marys, otherwise they have to admit to themselves that they were wrong and sometimes obnoxiously, insufferably, stupidly so.
The new Lancet metastudy looked at 65 studies from 19 countries. They found the reinfection rate of people who caught Covid was lower than people who were given Pfizer or Moderna. About a year after catching Covid, people with natural immunity still had about 37% protection against getting Omicron BA.1, about four times higher than people who had two Moderna doses. Yet the people with the better protection were locked out, punished, and sometimes even banned from treatment like organ transplants.
For some reason that no one can explain, despite millions of people using Pfizer vaccines, there were apparently no useful studies lasting beyond 30 weeks against reinfection.
But there is no apology, and no admission that they should have been collecting and publishing the data on natural immunity all along. There’s no admission that vaccines were never the right tool to use in a coronavirus pandemic, especially when results were so uncertain and there were so many safe alternatives.
Figure 4 Comparison of protection efficacy from past COVID-19 infection versus protection from vaccination (by vaccine type and dose) against re-infection… for omicron BA.1 variants
Our immune systems can tell the difference between a real infectious threat and a pretend virus
It makes sense that a true infection generates a longer stronger response than a fake one. We evolved from people whose immune systems didn’t waste protein and energy on things that don’t matter. Our personal defense force can’t be bothered staying in DefCon 1 when it’s only the Avon lady at the door again and not the Vikings. So it’s no surprise that usually the antibody protection varies according to the threat. The older nastier SARS-1 virus killed about 10% of those infected, and T-cell immunity was still there 17 years later. Its dark cousin MERS killed about 35% and is not as well studied, but antibodies were still present three years after infection.
On the other hand, protection against the tame common cold sort of coronaviruses is a big “so what” for our immune system. Immunity wears off in months which means we can catch the exact same dang virus the next year, and year after year. Since vaccines are (supposedly) safe, the hard part in vaccine design is to trick our immune system into caring at all about something that isn’t very scary.
In this graph below we see the waning of protection against not just reinfection but “getting sick” or being symptomatic. The result is much like the graph above, with a few more variants of vaccines. I added the labels on the lines in these graphs to hone the point that the top line in every graph was natural immunity. (It wasn’t always obvious which lines were which, especially for anyone who was colorblind).
Figure 4 (D) Comparison between waning of immunity with time of the protection conferred by SARS-CoV-2 infection against symptomatic disease with omicron variant versus vaccine protection against primary infection with omicron by type of vaccine and dose.
“Risk of COVID death or hospitalisation 88 per cent lower for those previously infected…”
The headline conclusion of the ABC story is shown in the graph below. Most people who caught Covid have good protection against getting a severe case of Covid on the second round. But try looking at this graph and reading the ABC description with a straight face: “…natural immunity [is] “at least as durable, if not more so” than two doses of Pfizer or Moderna’s vaccines… “
At least indeed… natural infection had higher efficacy than all the vaccines for 50 out of the last 60 weeks.
Figure 4 Comparison of protection efficacy from past COVID-19 infection versus protection from vaccination (by vaccine type and dose) against re-infection… for omicron BA.1 variants
Hallelujah. 18 months too late we get the big admission — those who had natural immunity should be treated as equivalent to being “vaccinated”
One day we might even hear that the unvaccinated should be treated as equivalent to being human. We live in hope.
For the moment at least researchers are saying what we’ve known for a hundred years: We should take natural immunity into account when making policies.
Our findings have several important policy implications. … restrictions of movement and access to venues based on immune status and vaccine mandates for workers should take into account immunity conferred by vaccination and that provided by natural infection. Countries have taken different approaches to this; for example, immunity from past infection was considered as part of eligibility for the EU COVID certificate but not in countries such as the USA or Australia.
People with natural immunity are still to this day — barred from entering the USA unless they get a vaccine. I’ve turned down an expenses paid trip to Florida this very week. Hawaii too! — (Thanks Craig and thanks Stephen.)
The bottom line is that far from sacking people who had already had covid — they would have made ideal employees. (As would the uninfected when using anti-virals, ivermectin or some other protocol prophylactically like the FLCCC suggests). We could have tested for prior infection long ago. The San Diego Blood Bank was already testing donations for antibodies by the end of May 2020. The FDA approved the first blood test for antibodies as early as April 3, 2020. And before vaccinations were even being conducted we had tests that could tell whether someone was vaccinated or naturally immune by looking for antibodies to the parts of the virus that were not in the vaccine (like the N or nucleocapsid antibodies as opposed to the S or Spike antibodies). Yet those tests were largely banned, as were the safe, cheap antivirals like ivermectin and HCQ.
Hypothetically: If the entire medical system were a mafia cabal designed to create Pfizer profits by banning cheap drugs and useful tests, while guaranteeing indemnity in secret contracts and forcing drugs on people who didn’t want them, what exactly would our Minister of Health have done differently?
And ignorance is no excuse. When there was only a few months of data on the efficacy of vaccines, there was already a whole year of data with natural immunity. In fact, doctors were saying natural immunity worked very well in the BMJ as early as September 2021:
Infection generates immunity. The “SIREN” study in the Lancet addressed the relationships between seropositivity in people with previous COVID-19 infection and subsequent risk of severe acute respiratory syndrome due to SARS-CoV-2 infection over the subsequent 7-12 months (2). Prior infection decreased risk of symptomatic re-infection by 93%. A large cohort study published in JAMA Internal Medicine looked at 3.2 million US patients and showed that the risk of infection was significantly lower (0.3%) in seropositive patients v/s those who are seronegative (3%) (3).
But the study, which is funded by the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation comes too late to help thousands forced into vaccinations they didn’t want, and we have to wonder whether the purpose of the study is not just a belated nod to a reality which has become obvious, but as the Defender suggests — to tacitly still endorse vaccine passports, now with the minor, fairly useless proviso that people with natural immunity would have qualified “if only we’d known”. But they knew this was likely. And they had enough data 18 months ago.
The vaccines promising immunity,
Could be seen as a sly opportunity,
To sell boosters to follow,
Which would also prove hollow,
And all this was done with impunity.
–Ruairi
h/t David B, another ian, crakar24
The Abstract
We identified a total of 65 studies from 19 different countries. Our meta-analyses showed that protection from past infection and any symptomatic disease was high for ancestral, alpha, beta, and delta variants, but was substantially lower for the omicron BA.1 variant. Pooled effectiveness against re-infection by the omicron BA.1 variant was 45·3% (95% uncertainty interval [UI] 17·3–76·1) and 44·0% (26·5–65·0) against omicron BA.1 symptomatic disease. Mean pooled effectiveness was greater than 78% against severe disease (hospitalisation and death) for all variants, including omicron BA.1. Protection from re-infection from ancestral, alpha, and delta variants declined over time but remained at 78·6% (49·8–93·6) at 40 weeks. Protection against re-infection by the omicron BA.1 variant declined more rapidly and was estimated at 36·1% (24·4–51·3) at 40 weeks. On the other hand, protection against severe disease remained high for all variants, with 90·2% (69·7–97·5) for ancestral, alpha, and delta variants, and 88·9% (84·7–90·9) for omicron BA.1 at 40 weeks.
We identified 65 studies from 19 different countries (Austria, Belgium, Brazil, Canada, Czechia, Denmark, France, India, Italy, Netherlands, Nicaragua, Norway, Qatar, Scotland, South Africa, Sweden, Switzerland, the UK, and the USA; figure 1A)
REFERENCE
Covid forecasting team (2023) Past SARS-CoV-2 infection protection against re-infection: a systematic review and meta-analysis, Published:February 16, 2023 DOI:https://doi.org/10.1016/S0140-6736(22)02465-5
And the gaslighting ramps up.
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The lie was obvious from the start – immunity is your bodies systems and the source of the antigen is irrelevant.
What has transpired is the mRNA vaccines are likely responsible for indeterminate side effects, probably the rapid rise of mutated virus and less effective protection.
They failed totally in the claim of preventing transmission and probably enhanced transmission.
They remain after years unproven genetic engineering.
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From the start the published fatality rate was about 1% of those diagnosed. SAd if you are one of the 1%, but not a big number.
With normal past practice that 1% would have quickly reduced as research found better treatments.
Instead we saw authorities prohibiting early treatment and private research within their jurisdiction. This was absolutely unprecedented!
We must have a Royal Commission, and it must find that we must never see this happen again.
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And even that 1% was fake, because it included Covid-positive patients who had heart attacks, fell off ladders or died in a car crash. Add to this those (usually elderly or already very sick) patients who died as a result of the ‘care’ they received in hospital.
Literally NOTHING we were told by the government, media, health service and pharmas was true.
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I won’t be popular for saying it. But while IFR (Infection Fatality Rate) was just 0·001% at 5 years of age, it was 8.4% at age 80.* You might be fine with that risk, but I’m not so excited about a civilization that says the deaths of 1 in 12 80+ year olds is “not big”. (And it was a 20% death rate for 90 year olds). Dismissing elderly lives has a perverse effect on the young. Not only are they losing grandparents but we’re sending a message that they can pay tax for decades to come or risk their own life in military service but we as a society won’t value them for doing that in years to come. (*Estimates of death rates were done with 5131 seroprevalence surveys to estimate how many people had really caught Covid, regardless of official cases reported).
I don’t believe democracies could ever ignore a 0.5% death rate, even if it sounds trivial. They had to do something, at least initially, though chose so terribly badly. The crimes here remain the lack of sovereign borders against bioweapons (which help deter the next one), and the corrupt grip of Big Pharma in medicine such that cheap anti-virals were outlawed and nutrition, exercise, sun, vitamins and natural immunity were actively suppressed by force. Effectively the threat of jail and financial loss stopped doctors saying what they thought, and people having a choice or informed consent about what they put in their own bodies.
PS: Royal commissions often only find what they are told to find. We must win this in the Court of Public Opinion.
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I agree, up to a point. COVID very soon, certainly by the middle of 2020, showed itself to be predominantly a disease of the old and infirm. The resources should have been targetted at the old and infirm. We (I’m one of the old and infirm) should have been advised to shield, the rest of you should have been allowed, even encouraged, to return to normal.
And a Royal Commission will take three, four or five years, certainly taking it beyond the next election which is all the politicians care about. It will tell us that lessons have been learnt and measures put in place so it won’t happen again. (Until the next time.) I’m getting cynical in my old age. 🙁
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I tend to agree, Jo. 0.5% is a still a lot of people. There are some among people on our side of the fence who’ve downplayed the risk to the elderly and infirm, etc. My parents are in their 70s and 80s, and for quite some time they were shocked at my refusal to get the jab because they couldn’t comprehend that the jabs didn’t stop the virus in its tracks and are more of a risk to us young(er) ‘uns than the virus. Plus they bought into the horse paste propaganda. My Dad seems to have come around, and Mum I think tacitly admits I was right, but alas it’s not in her nature to say it out loud.
Of course I want them to stick around as long as possible, and they’re both very healthy in body and mind for their age. I just want them to get the best prevention and treatment available, and these jabs don’t come within light years of doing that. The ones that were banned or censored, on the other hand…
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See all protocols from the FLCCC here: https://covid19criticalcare.com/treatment-protocols/
They have a plan for post vaccine recovery as well as post virus, and pre virus, and long covid. Your parents may benefit.
I think there are a lot of people in your parents camp who realize “it was about profits” not medicine.
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Democracies do not usually ignore a 0.5% fatality rate.
Democracies do not usually prohibit early treatment.
Democracies do not usually prohibit private research.
Both of which in normal circumstances reduce the 0.5%.
In this case, democracy never got a look in.
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That’s a good summary Steve.
And the big weapon, Statistics, was heavily corrupted and abused.
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How do you know if you have ‘natural immunity’ to a specific virus?
What are my chances of being ‘naturally immune’?
Of course, as the post points out in the last paragraph- if you survive the initial infection, your chances of surviving subsequent infections are higher. Edward Jenner would be proud
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Well Peter, over the years you have been subject to a lot exposure to common sense from contributors here and it’s obvious that you have developed a strong immunity to it.
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Gold
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🙂
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I suggest it’s probably better to boost everyone’s immune system with vitamin D3 to ensure the blood levels exceed 40ng/ml (100 nmol/L) and also take zinc which the system can use to stop the virus from replicating. Low cost. No adverse reactions. Just a few pills.
Cheers
Dave B
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Peter raises a valid point. How do you know you’ll survive a dose of the virus in order to get your effective immunity. You can’t just dismiss vaccination if it does show an immunity benefit even if for a short period.
It seems to me the discussion/argument against vaccination shouldn’t be whether having survived the virus gives better immunity or longer immunity than the vaccines. The discussion should be about whether there is any need to get vaccinated in the first place and whether it’s a good idea for the vulnerable in the community to get vaccinated because there is some benefit and we don’t know if they’ll survive the virus to get the longer term immunity.
It’s really a matter of informed consent. Which is the other point regularly made around here that valid information is supressed when it contradicts the govt’s initial position.
The vaccines aren’t as effective as we’d hoped they’d be or as safe as they need to be. But as long as they’re not compulsory or people are coerced (effectively compulsory for employment etc) and people can choose with knowledge then that’s really what matters.
Unfortunately our Aus state govts had got so much wrong about the virus and wouldn’t back down even as new information became available and even when logic wasn’t working for them even without new info.
But just because Peter’s opinions usually differ to most here (including mine) his comment shouldn’t be dismissed because Peter made it. It should be dismissed on merit and/or addressed.
I see the validity in the question.
Most people who are healthy have sufficient immune systems that they’ll cope with the virus. Even if it’s unpleasant for a few days. Is this natural immunity or just the immune system working? I assume the latter. So the valid question is, how do I know my immune system is sufficient and I don’t need a short term boost from the vaccine? To which the short answer is because practically everyone does unless they are aged with multiple comorbidities.
Then there’s another valid question Peter never asks. If I’m healthy and will therefore survive the virus with a good immune system, why should I risk a vaccine injury and why is this govt forcing me to have a vaccine?
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The above doesn’t mean KK’s ummunity comment didn’t make me laugh. It was very funny.
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Hi Strop, A good comment by flyingduk , https://joannenova.com.au/2023/02/18-months-too-late-natural-immunity-is-almost-as-good-as-vaccination-except-when-its-better/#comment-2633704
helps to put Peter’s comment in context. The last paragraph pretty much sums it up.
Be healthy, live well and let nature challenge your immune system so that it it is as strong as possible.
It may be that excessive, constant vaccinations could take away from our natural immunity.
I was very pro vax until the advent of the Annu$l flu shot and some serious injury reports on it. My own recent brush with vaxxinj has turned that view around and I have some guilt over my carefree approach to letting my two children cop so many jabs so trustingly. Both nearing 50.
Beware of politicians touting the wonderful boosters they want you to take, there may be a rich pharmaceutical company lurking close by.
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“there may be a rich pharmaceutical company lurking close by.”
“Right behind” might be the more definitive direction?
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Thought I addressed/included that aspect in my comment. (without having seen flyingduck’s comment)
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It really doesn’t matter, unless you’re elderly, frail of in some way vulnerable. You see, Covid isn’t the Angel of Death anyway and the vast majority of people are in no danger. In fact, more and more data suggests that, while the chances of a vaccine injury are statistically small (albeit much higher than used to be acceptable in a medication), they are still higher than your chances of suffering severe (i.e. life threatening) illness from Covid itself.
And don’t forget that while Covid severity is reducing, vaccine injuries just keep climbing and may impact the vaccinated for decades to come.
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Natural immunity is the immunity you acquire from having had the virus.
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The answer is in the article you didn’t read well, try again and you might find it.
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The link to Jenner’s bio is a cheap stunt of propagandist.
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I have heard that there is no cure for stupidity.
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There is., become a conservative !!
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So stupid people rename themselves conservative?
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Neo-Liberals like your good self
propping up predatory capitalism via big pharma
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Correct, “natural immunity” is a vague euphemism that can be confused with pre-existing immunity.
It actually means you need to risk being infected to illicit the immune response. The “natural” part is that nit is uncontrolled- a much more accurate word than “natural”
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Well actually and naturally quite well controlled. The organisms that survived to this point in our evolutionary process tend to be quite gregarious. The most amusing part of coming out of lockdowns was to watch poor buggers who had been living in isolation, masked and panicked eventually finding themselves wanting to hug and kiss their friends and relatives.
So quite natural to share our bugs.
The immunity we should really be aware of is sold as unnatural immunity. Sticking unnatural stuff in our body that has had limited trials in the hope that the immune system will create an unnatural antibody in our blood stream to protect us from a respiratory virus.
Only
would continue to advocate the benefits of such a strategy without careful examination of the evidence.
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…illicit, but!
Tch! Tch! Tch!
The one that got away.
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*elicit
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Peter, I trust you and your comrades are up to the sixth plus “jab” by now?
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Peter,
There is also a practical problem demanding an answer now.
Context. Wife and I are about 80 years old. She takes immuno-suppressives for advanced arthritis. We are both in the very high risk group for death from Covid. We followed G.P. advice and avoided the horrible social threats to the unvaccinated, so she has had 3 jabs, over a year ago, I have had 2. We were not informed of any risks or dangers.
We did RATs about 20 times, never a positive. So far as we know, we never caught Covid. But, we do not know if we had one or even several mild episodes of Covid. When you are around 80, you typically have assorted other pains and headaches that camouflage Covid symptoms.
,….
Therefore, we cannot plan ongoing medication because we do not know if we have adequate general natural protection, or natural protection specific for Covid, or specific for certain Covid variants. It would be helpful to have a test that tells if we had Covid already.
Without such a test, neither our medicos nor we can plan future vaccinations, if any. Solutions are sought from readers here.
..,..
In addition, the global medical sector, particularly the vaccine makers and the regulators, has behaved in highly questionable ways. We have decided emphatically to resist further Covid type vaccines, on grounds of trust rather than science, because we cannot find proper science to evaluate it.
…….
As responsible people in society, we must actively seek out the individuals and organisations that have been less than honest, to have their actions and motives investigated and punished if they failed basic norms. At this point in history, we are seeing the groundwork being put in place by devious people and groups to convince the public that potentially harmful, even lethal, new medical administrations and medications will be forced upon us as if they were acceptable and normal.
We owe it to our successors to root out mass evil.
Geoff S
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You are doing well under the circumstances. That’s what I think in our similar situation.
I always wondered if they were “over egging” the situation, and now am quite sure they were. I had 2 AZs, with pressure from family, with no side effects at all. Don’t want any more. 2 adult kids both lost a day’s work; 8 yo grandson tested positive at school, with no sign of illness.
In recent months 2 sibling couples got it and were sick.
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Peter,
78 – live in blended 3 generation Family of Wife, Youngest Daughter, Son-in-law, Grandkids 7/8/9 – 6/9/11 Years
Only Unvaxxed and only one in Family, who has not had Covid – with 3 Grandkids at School, constant some sort of illness, flu, stomach etc
My Immune System I assume is Lousy, over 90 Times at RNSH during 2 years of Covid – 34 Rounds Cancer Immunotherapy with 34 Blood test the day before every 3 weeks, 4 Minor Ops, 1 B/Major Op, pre ops, post ops, ENT, Eye, Plastic Clinics
Was going to do Novavax, but by the time it came around, happy to stick with Anti-Virals
Just off to RNSH to see how Cancer is going from MRI Monday & Bloods yesterday
Feeling Fine & Healthy
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Sorry that was reply to Geoff
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🙂 🙂 🙂
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Geoff, you raise a very good point. In a free world consenting adults should be able to pay for a test to let them know how much immunity they have, so they can make decisions accordingly. Part of the problem is that we don’t know exactly which antibodies are protective, or how much you need, or which will work against future variants. But we didn’t know all those things about vaccines either and the response they provoked, and that didn’t stop them mandating them. The hypocrisy of it all speaks volumes.
But medical science is capable of letting you know if you have had covid.
I still recommend high and monitored levels of Vitamin D3, plus the use of iota carrageenan sprays (Flo Travel), melatonin, zinc, vitamin A, black seed oil (Nigella Sativa) — check the latest FLCCC protocols.
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How is “medical science” going to let you know if you have Covid, Jo? They have still never isolated a virus, and I have not seen any tests that aren’t “emergency use only”, i.e. “use at your own risk, we have no idea what this does”. This system is more rotten than you think.
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Steve, the system is willing to kill children to boost their profits. It can’t be more rotten than I think.
We’re in a biotech war and a medical revolution. A virus is a chemical code and they have isolated the virus 5 million times — all 29,000 bases of it. See Nextstrain. Click on the dots. See the lab names, the mutations, it’s all there. Open source. It’s backed up and cross checked with antigen studies, blood tests, electronmicrographs, drug interactions, blood oxygen readings, contact tracing and plaque assays. Genes are my first love in science. I’ve worked at the bench. I know how those tests work, their errors and all.
Good people need to learn the chemistry of DNA and RNA. It’s extraordinary and already changing your life. The psychopaths at the top are cheating and corrupt and using it against you, but the isolation arguments are not the way to win this — they’re not scientifically correct.
You can’t isolate a computer virus in a jar — but we know it exists. It’s the code that matters, and we have the code.
Right now people in labs are playing games with deadly viruses, and some are our enemies. You are smart enough to learn molecular biology, and I hope you find it as fascinating as I do, because its power is awesome and we need all the voices we can get. Think of how computer code changed the world in the last 50 years, and imagine what the code of biology will do.
Follow Paul Marik, Pierre Kory, Peter McCullogh.
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“You can’t isolate a computer virus in a jar — but we know it exists.”
You can isolate a computer virus from the rest of the computer code that it lives in. Then you can inject it into another computer, and re-activate it. It follows Koch’s postulates. You can’t do that with a biological virus. Why not?
I’m not disputing gene science per se, it’s wonderful, but lots of scientists and medical professionals have serious issues with the way virology in particular is being done, because it lacks the key step of isolation. If you don’t have isolation, then everything you do has been tainted with something else. Monkey cells, cancer cells, various chemicals, all kinds of crap. How do you know that the gene sequences you get after doing all that to a biological sample are meaningful in any way? They certainly aren’t the same sequences you would get from a healthy cell living in a healthy stress-free environment, and cannot be used to gain any productive insights into the difference between health and disease. This much has been clear for decades.
“they have isolated the virus 5 million times”
No they haven’t. None of those 5 million procedures are what a layman like me thinks of when we hear the word “isolation”, which means “separated from everything else around it”, ideally without altering the thing you are looking for in the process. A better phrase for what virologists do would be “mangled and corrupted”.
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Steve, sigh. We can isolate the genetic code as I have said, with data, please follow the links I give you. Nextstrain. Nextstrain. Nextstrain. Like seriously, it’s unbelievable how much data and how many independent cross checks there are.
We can not only sequence the pure 29,000 base code in all its RNA ACGU glory, and have done millions of times, we can sequence up to 2 million nucleic acid bases in a row, so 29k is easy. But modern molecular biology, despite these glorious achievements, is just copying nature. Your body has replicated entire chromosomes from one fertilized egg up to 100 trillion times accurately to fill all your cells. Your largest DNA sequence is 249 million bases in one linear continuous row (Chromosome 1). A dog can do it, and now even the average pathology lab can easily reliably repeat a sequence that is 8000 times smaller than that.
Those enzymes that make it possible, have error checking mechanisms that evolved over a billion years. We humans are merely using those same enzymes that nature invented to do very small, modest tasks, and we do that millions of times all over the world in thousands of independent labs and have done for decades.
Just because a layman can’t imagine what genetic isolation looks like is not really an argument. Think of a layman who can’t see a computer virus in ascii or binary — it doesn’t mean”they don’t exist”.
Koch’s pure postulates apply to bacteria, an entirely different form of life. Those rules are 130 years old and needs an update to deal with viruses which were not known when he set it up.
We have exactly proven the existence of this virus and met those postulates anyhow, just with different tools (as would be expected). Same outcome.
Having isolated the EXACT code, we followed people with contact tracing. At times we could tell who they caught the virus from, and who they infected. We could follow them on a plane and see the exact same sequence turn up in the Seychelles, or Madagascar, or Hong Kong. We then checked their blood and they had the exact antibody protein patterns we expected, developed over an exact sequence of antibody development that took 6 weeks to mature. Other people took tissue samples from these people and used labeled antibodies to mark infected cells. Still other labs in other universities took electron-micrographs of these cells. Further different labs took those tissue samples and diluted them in sequences called plaque assays in agar plates, thus proving that whatever was in that sample was able to kill the cells in the Agar plates, and also the infectious number of particles could be exactly calculated per ml. Furthermore, we are so so capable with all this chemistry we can predict on computers what the protein product of the RNA code will be so accurately that we can “test” in silico which molecules will bind to them. EG We can predict that Ivermectin binds to the spike. We can and have then shown we were right by testing that in the lab, and in real people.
That’s an extraordinary predictive ability — and tested with observations.
Sorry Steve, I don’t mean to be short. I’ve gone through these arguments many times. You are not the only one who finds the lack of “isolation” argument compelling. I’ve watched several long videos with these claims — but because I know the lab techniques I can see that they ignore 99.99999% of the data in the world and focus on semantic points of definition, or things that are cherry picked, irrelevant, or out of date. It would be very hard to see that without detailed knowledge.
I wish I had a better, quicker solution than learning how the tools of molecular biology work (though I find the topic fascinating myself). Can I suggest instead people like Kory, Marik, McCullough, Malone. Malhotra?
*+*
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Well, Jo, not to belittle your experience, but how many of those SARS-nCoV-2 isolations did you do personally? Are you just taking other researchers’ word for it? Remember that the way the medical-industrial complex works, and government science in general, no publicly funded researcher is being paid to tell the truth. All of them are being paid to advance a narrative. If their work doesn’t match the narrative, it doesn’t get published. Are you being led down the garden path by your fellow geneticists?
In my field, we are very careful to watch out for the “garbage in – garbage out” phenomenon. How many of those “isolations” were performed with NO other genetic material than the original patient sample? No cow cells, no monkey cells, no human cancer cells from other humans, no nothing? Because all of that sounds a lot like “garbage in” to me. And when the CDC was asked this question, their answer was “None”, i.e. *all* of their “isolations” were contaminated with other genetic material. Because that’s just the way it’s done, you see… nothing to worry about here, move along…
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Yes to all that Jo, and it’s ridiculous that the USA still demands vaccination at (legal) immigration.
But they’ll be able to stick to their guns saying “It’s about infectiousness, not immunity; we want our borders closed to silent carriers”, and they’ll handwave about vaccination being better than prior infection on that score. Is it even possible to prove that it isn’t?
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“It’s about infectiousness, not immunity; we want our borders closed to silent carriers”
Not the southern border though…and the illegal immigrants are apparently
crossing into the US via the Canadian border!
No testing or vax required!
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Illegal immigrants are given ivermectin on arrival to the US.
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Thanks for that info. I didn’t know that.
It does raise a question though.
I can’t holiday in the USA without being fully vaxxed for the wuflu.
Will they let me in for a holiday if I willingly take ivermectin?
If not…why not?
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Why do rid them of parasites?Fauci said it was horse paste didn’t he and many others with vested interests!
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“Not the southern border though…and the illegal immigrants are apparently
crossing into the US via the Canadian border!
No testing or vax required!”
No, you’ve got that wrong. After months and months of trying their best to deal with the fallout of zero border controls, the southern border states finally got fed up and started bussing the illegals to so-called “sanctuary cities” like New York Washington DC and Martha’s Vineyard – and the oh-so-welcoming Democrats can’t wait to get rid of them.
The mayor of New York, after suggesting that such practices amount to human trafficking by the Governor of Texas, is now bussing the illegals up to the Canadian border so they can invade our country too.
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I added the labels on the lines in these graphs to hone the point that the top line in every graph was natural immunity. (It wasn’t always obvious which lines were which, especially for anyone who was colorblind).
Many thanks for that; I am only partially color blind but often have trouble telling the differences between different shades of the same color.
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‘Natural’ climate good.
Natural immunity bad.
Mongo only pawn in game of life.
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That is it Honk! You are banned for quoting from ‘Blazing Saddles’.
My grade five child is in the middle of learning that it is ‘bad’ to stereotype and ‘Blazing Saddles’ turned stereotypes into comedy that will last forever in the black market.
Oops! now I will have to go to the naughty corner too.
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The cost of this disgraceful exercise to the general health of our community and the lethal effects of vaccines have been an eye-opener. The people we elected to protect us completely disabused their position of trust by rubber-stamping WHO edicts without a skerrick of real evidence. They coerced the medical fraternity into obedience under threat of disbarment. Police forces around the country physically and forcefully repressed and restrained us. It is no wonder that we have lost respect for all three institutions.
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That might read better as “without a Skerritt of real evidence”. (Sarc)
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PS Dr Skerritt (TGA) just retired at 63 years old. I wonder?
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Yep lotsa moola in that swiss bank account….Like Jabcinda… why hang around? Exit stage left and keep a low profile is the name of the game.
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Have you seen Brett Sutton lately?
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I might be missing something but skerrick scans ok for me?
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Just a play on words, I couldn’t resist the similarity of skerrick and Skerritt. Skerritt ( was head of the TGA) is a vet and yet he could give provisional approval to experimental mRNA non “vaccines” and avoid the 10 years typical time line for drug approvals, without valid long term testing. You said nothing wrong.
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Covid is no longer racist in UK.
“Unlike earlier in the coronavirus pandemic, during the Omicron period, there is no longer evidence of ethnic minority groups having a significantly higher COVID-19 mortality rate compared with the White British group;”
https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/birthsdeathsandmarriages/deaths/articles/updatingethniccontrastsindeathsinvolvingthecoronaviruscovid19englandandwales/24january2020to23november2022
Also happened across this on Denmark which raises some interesting questions.
https://blogs.bmj.com/medical-ethics/2023/01/18/dying-like-never-before/#content
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BBC article on covid/ethnicity.
Claims social measures and vax helped even it out, even though minorities, sorry, the global majority, are less vaccinated!
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64732567
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Covid is not racist.
But the Left laughed at Vitamin D supplementation to minimise the incidence or severity of covid. Vitamin D supplementation in deficient people to confer resistance against covid is an established scientific fact and has been since the start of the pandemic.
It so happens that people whose skin colour evolved in the tropics become Vitamin D deficiency when they live in temperate latitudes. That’s why there was a supposed ethnic bias against darker-skinned people.
It was those that laughed at correcting Vitamin D deficiencies who are the true racists
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So one segment of the UK population suddenly started chomping D and Zinc etc? Nope.
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Obviously didn’t comprehend the post replied to so, consequently misconstrued it and missed the point entirely.
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Nope, DMs response states what we know/suspect, it does not explain why the situation changed – which would have required the affected population to correct their D levels – which they didn’t do.
That was the point, which you all missed.
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The people who have promoted these “vaccines” need to be brought to account.
There should be a Royal Commission into the mandates, lockdowns, mask wearing and federal and state government overreach.
Anyone that received any payment/s or stipends or any other form of recompense from the “Bio Pharmaceutical Complex” should be tried in a court of law and if found guilty stripped of any/all assets and serve time in prison. Anyone who has been an enablers should undergo due process including instances of police brutality and overreach.
Many people have lost their lives and suffered horrific injuries, some permanent, and anyone that aided and abetted the “Bio Pharmaceutical Complex” needs to answer for their misdeeds.
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Yes but no. There needs to be court cases like that being brouht by Dr Paul Marik and other eminent doctors against the FDA and HHS. https://open.substack.com/pub/pierrekory/p/the-case-against-the-fda-for-their?r=19j1r8&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web
Those responsible must be held to account.
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This might be of interest . . . . .
https://rumble.com/v2aecme-florida-county-returns-cdc-funds-after-confirming-vaxx-is-a-bioweapon.html
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You are going to see a lot of back-pedalling by the Left now.
The thinking community must not forgive the Left or forget about their lies which caused so much harm and unnecessary deaths.
The truth was known all along and easily knowable.
The Left let their anti-freedom, pro-Big-Government ideology over-rule reason and the Scientific Method.
Don’t let them claim “wir wussten es nicht” (we didn’t know).
Don’t forgive. Don’t forget. Prosecute if possible.
Reference for Left begging for forgiveness:
https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archive/2022/10/covid-response-forgiveness/671879/
Don’t let it happen!
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They knew it ( natural immunity) was likely?
It is almost 100% certain.
And is almost always better than a vaccine induced immunity, due to the exposure to a much wider array of antigens. And this is more so in the case of a genetically engineered subunit vaccine or an mRNA vaccine that produces a subunit.
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A new entry for the acronym finders:
obnoxiously, insufferably, stupidly so (OISS)
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https://twitter.com/VigilantFox/status/1626348022736031744?s=20&utm_source=substack&utm_medium=email
Above is a link to Floridas excellent Surgeon General, actually doing his job, and warning about the increased risk of death from these dangerous and useless concoctions.
Below is a link highlighting the continuing rise in excess deaths, deaths which are almost certainly the result of forcing these experimental death shots on the populace.
https://drpanda.substack.com/p/this-is-bad?utm_medium=email
Why are the TGA, ATAGI or any of our health “professionals” not acting like the Florida Surgeon General and properly thinking of the welfare of those in his state? Why are they still reciting lies that were never true about “safe and effective” and supporting Pharma, and not ordinary Australians?
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“Prophet, the advantage or benefit that is gained from doing something”
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The racist Left accuse Ladapo, the Florida SG of being an “Uncle Tom”.
https://exposingwot.com/index.php?threads/florida-uncle-tom-removed-smug-florida-surgeon-general-booted-from-at-risk-state-senators-office-for-refusal-to-put-on-a-mask.997/
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In what biological infectious challenge does “natural immunity” not develop with somebody with a functional immune system?
Why were they so keen to claim it did not happen with covid….? Well, I think we know the answer to that one…
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Before they were pulled from YouTube, you could watch the COVID White House press conferences given by Donal Trump and Anthony Fauci. This was way back in 2020. They were much more informative at the time than anything in Australia. During one of those pressers I can remember Trump asking Fauci how far had “we” progressed with widespread antibody testing. It seemed like someone practical had the idea that you could roll out antibody testing kiosks across the US. Fauci’s reply was ” yeah, we must do something about that”, or words to that effect. But, all his body language indicated the exact opposite. So yes, all the antibody testing logistics (tests etc) were clearly in place, but its implementation was obviously vetoed by either Birx or Fauci, IMO. If that had been successful in the US, it would have been adopted worldwide. But as with everything COVID, big pharma etc were at least 4 steps ahead of governments. They knew such a practical program could eventually lead to decreased vaccine sales, even back then.
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I was trying to find a video from the late 90s in which Fauci emphasised caution on rolling out potential HIV vaccines when l stumbled on this. The interview makes sense in that it’s based on the 100 year anniversary of the Spanish Flu. Evidently he’s in a very pro-vaccine stance within the interview. You can watch the whole video or focus on two points if you choose.
Context: he’s speaking about vaccines generally before moving to discussing influenza vaccines. He states “vaccines as an intervention is as good or better than any other public health intervention”. (7:30).
The more concerning quote is for all the scientists out there. He unequivocally states “There’s the misinformation, people say well l got vaccinated and I got infected the next day. Well it wasn’t the vaccine that made you get infected, you were infected even before you got the vaccine” (9:15).
That is a sweeping statement from presumably one of the top health officials in the USA. If you experienced flu like symptoms after receiving a flu vaccine, it’s undeniably because you caught the flu prior to the vaccination.
https://9now.nine.com.au/60-minutes/videos/latest/dr-anthony-faucis-2018-interview-on-influenza-and-pandemic-fears/cke7vrelx002i0iocoepk0hpd
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It’s a weird world. The wife and I are still Covid free. We have Never caught it. Plenty of flu’s from the snotty nose grandson thou.
One of us is vaxed and working. The other forced to stop working because not vaxed.
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Daily vitamin D3 and zinc for you, wife and grandson = no more flu for any of you.
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Plus a zinc ionophore, outlawed in Australia except Quercertin.
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Overkill.
Cenovis Vitamin D3 = $15 for 200, Zinc = $14 for 150, at Woolies.
Much the same at Coles.
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Yes, yes! Thanks to this blog my wife and I (80’s plus) have been on vit D and zinc (from Woolies) since early in the pandemic and despite being gregarious (when allowed in the early days) have not had Covid.
Yes, we both have had 3 jabs, before we learned better, but so did our left leaning daughter and her husband and our three grandchildren, all who had had Covid at least once and who never took the supplements.
Hardly a well resourced and replicated experiment, I admit, but it does for me!
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Back in the day, I remember how the Left were all for so-called “natural remedies” and against pharmaceutical use.
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Excellent article, thanks Jo. Well presented.
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The Lancet? Hmm.. I’ll have to ask GA if they are worth reading, they might be one of these dodgy journals pushing misinformation.
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Don’t worry. A couple of posters here will vouch for it.
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Judge the article by the data and arguments, not the publisher.
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On the other hand, protection against the tame common cold sort of coronaviruses is a big “so what” for our immune system. Immunity wears off in months which means we can catch the exact same dang virus the next year, and year after year. Since vaccines are (supposedly) safe, the hard part in vaccine design is to trick our immune system into caring at all about something that isn’t very scary.
Not correct – its not the ‘exact same virus’ next year, its a changed and mutated virus. That is why natural immunity wanes over time (but much more slowly than the narrow immunity provided by vaxxines).
It should be blindingly clear by now that you CANNOT avoid fast changing respiratory viruses by avoiding them, or by immunising against them -they mutate too fast. Your real defence is to have a healthy immune system that defeats them when encountered, and this means natural light, healthy weight and avoidance of inflammatory foods, carbs and seed oils in particular.
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🙂 🙂
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No Flyingduk. You are probably thinking of influenza rather than the corona common colds. All viruses mutate but immunity wanes against some viruses even without those changes.
The four common coronaviruses are HCoV-NL63, HCoV-229E, HCoV-OC43 and HCoV-HKU1 cause regular reinfections every 2 – 3 years but their evolution is much slower than Influenza. See the remarkable long study done of reinfection done in the 1980s Ref 2 here. https://www.nature.com/articles/s41591-020-1083-1
See also:
and https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7204879/
“It is estimated that 1%–10% of the population suffers annually from cold-like symptoms related to infection with HCoV-NL63″ Wow. That’s just one of the four HCovs. “Annually”!
Antigenic changes in HCov viruses were about a quarter of the rate of influenza. But we only catch influenza every 5 years or so. Our immunity just works so much better against influenza and lasts longer. Also https://academic.oup.com/ve/article/7/1/veab020/6157737?login=false
Then there are 160 different Rhinoviruses to catch in a lifetime. That’s different again. Without mutations you will still be catching new versions each year.
And influenza viruses change for another reason, they have 8 pieces of genetic material, so they can swap genes as whole blocks more easily. Eg H1 N1 influenza or H2N1 or H5N2 etc.
Yes, virology and immunology is much more complicated than most people think.
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The “used to be misinformation” list keeps growing:
-Natural immunity is stronger
-Masking doesn’t work for the general public
-The vax has side effects
-The vax doesn’t stop spread
-Lockdowns are harmful & ineffective
-School closures are a disaster
-Covid isn’t spread outside or on surfaces
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The vaccines promising immunity,
Could be seen as a sly opportunity,
To sell boosters to follow,
Which would also prove hollow,
And all this was done with impunity.
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That’s an extra good one!
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I guess chucking all the data together is one way to proceed. If you look at the IFR of minimally jabbed (90%) countries the DEATH RATE IS 10 TIMES LOWER. Game Set Match.
For the less experienced readers, the biomedical researchers / reporters can bury or minimise “Bad News Bears” by study design.
Learn to read between the lines!
BTW I would welcome massive litigation against Svengali motivated Dan Andrews Govt and Brett Sutton for the economic loss that their LARP totalitarian “Measures” that were unabashed science fiction.
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should be “Look at the IFR of minimally jabbed (90%) countries”
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The problem with those comparisons is the countries with less jabs are younger, and work outdoors more. They are not so Vit D deficient, nor as old, and sometimes not so fat and inactive either. The age factor is a logarithmic additional risk.
It is a scandal that we don’t have the data from within countries because it was obvious and imperative to get “if our health mattered”.
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Simon,
Thank you for those informed words.
Early in 2020, just as Covid alarm was getting whipped up, I read a recent paper by Dr Sutton and 3 co-authors from Victoria’s health department. The topic was on climate change and it’s medical implications, with reference to the health department prescriptions to force people by legislation to act to combat their perceived dangers.
The paper contained much poor science and special pleading, so I wrote a critique and asked that the paper be retracted because of its many imperfections. My request was ignored.
Then as 2020 became 2021, we saw and heard Dr Sutton pounding his wisdom about Covid and assisting the enforcement of draconian measures.
It was quite difficult to watch and listen to the words of a person with such poor understanding of how science works, telling us what we could and could not do, for fear of substantial punishment.
Our public service badly needs better personnel selection processes. We are past the era of regulatory bodies staffed by little Hitlers. Geoff S
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Geoff , you are within your rights to put in an AHPRA complaint about Sutton. His delusions are a great danger to the public after all! The goons that call themselves “ATAGI” can self report too!
Indeed, at the dawn of the plandemic he was speechifying his global warming catastrophe delusion.
Remember, he has held the FRACP qualification for <4 years- unless being Jane's Brother-in law was his qualification. N.B. His deputy Chan had 19 years experience post FRACP- Why was he overlooked?
Not that AHPRA would investigate this as they are culpable too!
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I haven’t been paying close attention, but the St BAsil’s inquiry should wipe him out.
That’s if the inquiry has any integrity at all, which cannot be taken for granted in Victoria.
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Old sluggo himself!! Actually Sutton was bad, but he was no worse than any of the other CHO’s. Chant, Young, etc. It was because he did so many press conferences, that gave him more opportunity to tell lies.
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2nd try: should be “Look at the IFR of minimally jabbed compared with maximally jabbed countries”
minimally = less than 10% ; maximally= greater than 90% doubly jabbed
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Covid = the original game of Russian Roulette i.e. with 1 bullet
Covid + inoculation = the big pharma version of the game of Russian Roulette i.e. with 2 bullets.
As an anti THIS vaxer I knew what gave me the better odds…. and still do.
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Hear-hear! Same-same: Covert Zero shots for this fella, while
friendsassociates who raced off to get #1 and #2, then #3 and #4, have all had recurring bouts of nastiness. Now ™authorities™ are pushing #5, just like they are in Aus.Having lost 2 jobs and 2 flats in 3 years – yet still I live! – not about to ruin my healthy immune system now with toxic poisonous goop Version 2.023. Bourla Fauci & Co can go xxxx themselves.
BTW it’s still snowing in the South Island and now Mt Ruapehu in the North is in for 3 days’ snow, even though there’s a near-complete blackout of news re Summer Snow Storm as authorities push their [ex-] cyclone in cyclone season CCCrap propaganda.
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Stand proud Greg. We did it tough also with both losing our jobs while at least our house was secure – moving can be a struggle so admiration with you with your quick 2. All the very best for your future. You are a winner. Cheers.
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To extend the analogy, for young people COFID was Russion roulette with a blank chambered, the Faoxinnes included a live round.
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Snow huh. 39 here yesterday, similar today, >40 tomorrow. You didn’t do as I respectfully requested the other day.
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So have their abc made a formal apology to Novak Djokovic yet?
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Or the Australian Government who deported him.
Or Tennis Australia.
Or the huge numbers of clueless Sheeple that libeled and slandered him.
He should be given a freedom award for standing up to the tyranny.
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Let’s keep an eye on the linked ABC story to see if it’s removed because of its failure to follow “The Narrative“.
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This paper really is a psyop – they are admitting they were wrong without admitting they were wrong. I am sure this bs (“the vaccines are still effective”) has the backing of many studies into how to manipulate opinions when you find out you unleashed a murderous experimental medication upon the populace, with coercion.
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Exactly Panda, the pure-bloods will be “Damned with faint praise”. This is the classic “Limited hangout” where you support your propaganda with a modicum of truth telling . Watch how NO-ONE will take responsibility for any of this- it is all “Group effort” and they “Dindunuthing”.
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NSW statistics (until they were ceased recently), showed the more shots you have, the worse the outcome with covid. Unvaxxed have been registering zero deaths for months. How on earth can anyone still call this a ‘vaccine’, let alone mandate it? The other states with hardcore socialist tyrants, ceased their vaxx status reporting ages ago, because the data for the faux vaxx was so bad – infections went through the roof when mandates rolled out. Remember when they shut down an entire state on the back of covid fragments detected in sewage? Bashed grannies for not wearing face nappies outdoors? How the average punter questions none of this and lines up for more ‘boosters’ is beyond belief.
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A lot of people are addicted to doomsday narratives. Some people WANT things to be worse than they are, so their neuroticism and paranoia will be vindicated.
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Just talk to people though – they’ve all magically transformed into vaccine skeptics everywhere.
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Reality has a way of doing that, Panda.
I spent Christmas in hospital. The place was hopelessly understaffed with at best 70% of employees available on any day. This despite staff working split shifts (eight hours on eight hours off), extended shifts (twelve hours) and double shifts (sixteen hours or more straight).
They even had first year nursing students seconded from uni doing routine nursing procedures, and casual employees like uber drivers filling in as orderlies, moving patients around. Meals were limited and largely prepared by offsite caterers.
The reason? So many staff off, sick with covid. Need I add that ALL QLD Health employees were mandated to be fully vaxxinated or lose their jobs?
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Proudly: “My two adult daughters didn’t get the jab”
At the time:”you don’t care about me! You want me to get infected!”
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The ABC’s holy rosary incantation and The Lancet journalist’s medical Hail-Mary’s. Have the respective journalists become fundamentalist pre-millenial Catholic Christian terrorists?
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Actually, I wondered if they were fair lines to use at all. After all, these ancient prayers involve admitting to sin. It is not really equivalent.
The medico-incantation is more of a cargo cult saying, or a medical talisman for “protection” and faith. It is not about forgiveness, not the growth and humility of admitting to being less than perfect.
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As a medico, the logic of treating a virus with 0.0003% IFR for working age is GET IT AND GET OVER IT to acquire natural immunity with adjuvant Vit D, Zn etc. You can then proceed to work with a clear conscience- no masks, or anti social distancing, curfews, 5 km travel restriction etc.
To be told that we have to sit on our hands and wait for the magic Jab-jab hitting 80% with the implied fouxxine created “Herd immunity” was simply WRONG.
The powers that be that are doubling down on a poor hand by promoting “Boosters” are plainly malfeasant.
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there is more back pedalling around covid than you get from a bunch of clowns at a circus
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There is actually very little difference between them and the clowns at a circus.
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At least the clowns know they are being clownish
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and do no harm
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This is the ABC’s response to Jo Nova’s version of germ theory
https://www.abc.net.au/news/health/2023-02-22/new-pfizer-bivalent-covid-vaccine-available-march/101999092
Essentially the ABC view is if its been 6 months since you either caught covid or had a shot you need the new one. This one differs because it covers BA.4/5, next up will be the XBB (XBooga Booga) variant so there is another jab for the junkies to salivate in anticipation of.
My question is when does it end, does it end when everyone ends up like this?
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2023/02/healthy-22-year-old-woman-collapses-during-lunch-with-friends-had-7-cardiac-arrests-over-11-days-experts-suspect-virus-caused-heart-inflammation/
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It doesn’t end. Covid is like “climate change”, the gift that just keeps on giving and is all the excuse the Left need to censor and control us.
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And no mention that the “heart trouble” may have been caused by the VaXXine.
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O/T but can’t wait to point this out.
Channel 7 news finally reported on East Palestine, as if the derailment just happened. Made fun of Trump’s claim that Biden and EPA refused help by pointing out that he said it after a tweet by Biden that they will do whatever they can. No mention that it was almost 3 weeks ago.
Vox reports
Phosgene was used in WW1 as a chemical weapon, killing 85 000, FFS.
No mention of the demon CO2.
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some more info on dioxins in Ohio
https://www.naturalnews.com/2023-02-17-east-palestine-train-wreck-largest-dioxin-plume.html
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It’s everywhere, and we’re in big trouble, make no mistake.
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As the “Experts” climb down from their 3 years of frenzied Hysteria,there is a point I would highlight.
Declaring an emergency and suspending the citizens rights.
Any politician or public official declaring a state of emergency,is telling us all, that they are declaring themselves incompetent.
That they are unable to cope with the situation at hand.
Yet none of them then resign and get their idiotic selves out of the way..
Instead they declare an “Emergency” and work us over real good.
And stay in power,preventing us from finding some rational adults to clean up their mess.
We need to reward this lot,reward them in such a manner that none of their ilk ever dream of “helping us” ever again.
And we need the resignation of every one of those who claimed Covid-19 as a State Emergency.
I would much rather have their heads in spikes,but so sad,too bad..we are “civilized”..
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As David M keeps reminding us, They Must Be Held To Account.
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If you all want to get up to speed on how your immune system works and how the mrna covid 19 vaccines interferes , listen to GEERT VANDEN BOSSCHE on the topic , nobody explains the immune system in such great detail , God help us all if he continues being correct .
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