JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


Handbooks


Advertising


Australian Speakers Agency



GoldNerds

The nerds have the numbers on precious metals investments on the ASX



The Skeptics Handbook

Think it has been debunked? See here.

The Skeptics Handbook II

Climate Money Paper



Archives

Cult of Green: Because no 1,000 year old forest is complete without industrial wind turbines

In Germany, praise be to Gaia, it’s Green to knock down a forest that has sat undisturbed for a thousand years to put wind farms in, and then plant saplings in a fake forest somewhere else as a carbon sink.

When will the environmentalists realize they have been taken for a ride by investment bankers and the renewables industry? Let’s help them speed up that “transition”. There’s a Red-pill moment here. File the story of the Reinhardswald, “fairy-tale forest” away for those moments when a teenager turns up to tell you how important it is to save old growth forest. Exactly, you can say… would you like too help stop the latest rapacious attack on rare heritage forest?

Being “Green” is nothing more than a badge people wear to their weekend dinner party.

NoTricksZone has reported on this environmental crime in February 2022 when the access roads started to go in. In the latest news Swiss  NZZ Daily has described it as the absurdity of the German energy transition:

In the fall, the Documenta management planted oaks in the fairytale Reinhardswald near Kassel to save the climate. Now the forest is to give way to wind turbines, which will save the climate even better.

Germany’s last scenic spot to get industrial wind turbines

The area is the largest contiguous forested area in Hessen, virtually uninhabited, undisturbed, and therefore a precious natural area in itself. Its beauty is an entertainment field of outstanding importance [1] in the middle of a landscape that is partly classified as cultural – historical and has the highest value. Even according to Environment Minister Hessian Priska Hinz (Greens), this is one of the most scenic regions in Germany. [2]….

 

Pierre Gosslin is

“it’s all being industrially raped, gangbang-style, by crony, greedy bastards under the guise of environmental virtue. It’s a grand swindle that in normal times would have everyone enraged.

Wind park proponents defend the deforestation of one of Europe’s remaining virgin forests by claiming that only sick areas of the forest are being cleared away and that the turbines will “free Germany from the clinging grip of Russian energy imports”….and save our climate for generations to come.

That’ll be eighteen 240-meter-high wind turbines. Hope the birds, deer and wild cats can get some sleep.

Pierre Gosselin notes the extraordinary irony that to keep tourists coming they are literally building an artificial forest in the Brothers Grimm Square:

“While the real, historically grown fairytale forest outside the city is being cut down, artificial substitutes are being created within the city. For example, Kassel’s civic society has been fighting for months over the redesign of the Brothers Grimm Square, which is conceived in the form of a “fairy tale forest” of pine trees and shrubbery – whereby at best a light miniature forest on a traffic island can emerge.”

Read it all at NoTricksZone.

7.6 out of 10 based on 89 ratings

162 comments to Cult of Green: Because no 1,000 year old forest is complete without industrial wind turbines

  • #
    Jojodogfacedboy

    Makes the same sense of saving the trees and the forest fires from not cutting and using the wood burns down your neighborhood.
    The smoke is worse than the industrialization that used to be in the area but now has been exported overseas by much fossil fuels.

    1710

  • #

    All the Germans have to do is to restart all those Nuclear Power Plants that they shut down. If they can that is. If not then, build new ones. Then, get some nice HELE Coal fired Plants built. Then work on their own Gas supplies from the North Sea and local fracking where feasible. To destroy a 1,000 year old Forest is surely criminal…………………..

    421

    • #
      William

      They took all the trees
      Put ’em in a tree museum *
      And they charged the people
      A dollar and a half just to see ’em

      Don’t it always seem to go
      That you don’t know what you’ve got
      Till it’s gone
      They paved paradise
      And put up a wind farm …

      171

      • #
        Saighdear

        You are so so right ….’That you don’t know what you’ve got, Till it’s gone’ and then there’s “those who have it don’t know what to do / how to do, with it, and those who don’t have it want it”

        61

        • #
          Gerry

          The things of the past are irrelevant …it’s the past that got us here …and we know that “here” is where the world will end at any time soon …..

          00

    • #
      Saighdear

      Huh, getting VERY MUCH to the point where “All the Germans have to do is….” – is SHUT UP for a while and let others DO something and learn FROM it !!!! Yes, really. I watch Satellite TV to get the jist of life in europe. They think they are so far ahead of the world ( are other words I’ll not use here ) in enviro things when they’ve got it all wrong. All their Eco engineering …. time their yooung should come back to the REAL WORLD and fix the Scheiss they are making. and then they join in to sing that awful song about Alice. Hmm, the original was ok, but poor Alice – and don’t ask who she was!

      61

  • #
    David Maddison

    A few points:

    1) Where are the greens chaining themselves to these trees?

    2) Also, during the Cold War, certain West German forests were protected as they provided a barrier to Soviet tank invasion. I am not sure if this is one of those.

    3) I do a lot of bushwalking (US = hiking) and am yet to encounter a green in the bush. They can’t tear themselves away from their inner city cafes drinking their soy lattes. I never see them as volunteers cleaning up bushland of litter or doing invasive weed control either.

    4) I recommend the book “Green Tyranny – “Exposing the Totalitarian Roots of the Climate Industrial Complex” by Rupert Darwall. The author take about his book here: https://youtu.be/Ud14oTQpbAE

    5414

    • #
      Sambar

      A fair number of “greenies” in the bush up my way David, all driving their very modern diesel four wheel drives and dressed in their designer outdoor clobber.
      All heading for any logging coup to disrupt the legal harvesting of timber.
      Given that Victoriastan has already declared that native timber harvesting will end in 2030, this is not good enough for the green groups and everything must end now.

      381

      • #
        David Maddison

        Most greens / Leftoids think the forests of the Dandenong Ranges, just outside Melbournistan are native virgin forests.

        They don’t realise the whole area was clear felled about 100 years ago…

        231

        • #
          Dennis

          They don’t want to know the truth, another example during the 1980s was the Bunnings Group pine plantation timber planted just after WW2 for Bunning’s future business needs, the harvesting of the timber had commenced and Greens were blockading the trails to disrupt truck movements, chaining themselves to heavy machinery, etc.

          They called it natural old growth forest.

          161

        • #
          skeptocynic

          Even though it was logged 100 years ago, clear felled areas must have been somewhat limited in the steepest sections because I remember 65 years ago massive mountain ash tree butts ten feet thick, and seeing lyrebirds in the moist dark tunnels, creeks and waterfalls of long lost fern gullies when exploring with my father, a contract logger back then.
          The January 1963 bushfires devastated the area, killed off all those understories, and burned out the tops of the forest giants. As the fire raced up the mountain all those treetops just exploded. What was left were like big black candles burning and glowing long after the fires had gone out . The fire was so intense as it raced up the steep northwest facing slopes at what was reported as 40 miles an hour but seemed instantaneous. My grandparents house was just a smoking patch on the ground with blobs of molten glass and molten metal.
          You are 100% correct, people nowadays think State Forests and other hardwood production reserves like the Wombat Forest northwest of Melbourne are native virgin forests when they are just scrubby regrowth tree plantations full of young trees and no actual forest.
          There’s only a couple of tiny patches of old growth forest in Victoria, well hidden, and doomed to infestation and degradation.

          41

      • #
        Dennis

        Greens who camp out to protest against the sustainable logging of state forests and who burn wood to keep themselves warm and for cooking purposes, that is acceptable because it’s renewable energy.

        121

        • #
          skeptocynic

          acceptable because it’s renewable energy.

          But more polluting than coal, which is also natural.

          30

  • #
    David Maddison

    Apart from numerous other problems, the windmills also destroy flying wildlife, cause maddening infrasound, slow down the wind causing local temperature increases and dry out the soil due to increased local temperatures and removal of trees.

    Let’s not forget the huge impact of the massive concrete foundations which are never removed, even after the windmills have served their short, parasitic and useless life.

    6011

    • #
      Jemma

      A debate is not possible. All of our posts trying to have a reasonable conversation are not being published.

      This is how a scientific discourse is “encouraged” here…

      [No posts (save this one) from Jemma, nothing found in Pending, Spam, or Trash. – LVA]

      [Email sent but bounced Jemma. You are welcome to try again. Thanks for looking LVA. – Jo]

      16

  • #
    David Maddison

    Contrast thousands of windmills distributed over a vast area with the equivalent annual production, albeit random, of one proper coal, gas or nuclear power station. The proper power station is compact in area and even if the coal power station is built next to its own open cut coal mine, the mines are invisible to most people and of limited area.

    With the tips of the blades of the largest windmills reaching nearly 300m at their highest point, they can be seen from about 50km away. In a densely populated country like Germany, you cannot escape them. Even a 150m tall structure can be seem from about 47km.

    4711

  • #
    Dirk K.

    Hey Jo,

    None of your blogs I’ve read thus far demonstrate any scientific evidence (research) nor citations of any facts, figures, analyses that you analyse yourself and come to a conclusion.

    Any self-proclaimed scientist is certainly entitled to his/her opinion but it doesn’t make it scientific nor true. Scientists take all data and evidence and demonstrate how they support AND (!!!) contradict an investigated theory and then come to a conclusion. All is then presented in an objective and comprehesive way for others to challenge and advance on it.

    Unfortunately, this is not what you have been publishing. Based on your blog content, someone could say that you are not better than any of the YOUTUBE or TikTok influencers.

    What a waste of intellectual capacity, IT resources and electricity for this server as well as time.

    Dirk

    235

  • #
    MrGrimNasty

    Scotland, Tasmania, Germany, and a million other places no doubt. Same story.

    367

  • #
    David Maddison

    Look at all the red thumbs today! There must be a whole army of greens who don’t like hearing the truth. But obviously they can’t debate any of the points.

    483

    • #
      David Maddison

      So, I guess all the red thumbs mean the greens/Left approve of chopping down ancient forests. Hmmmm….

      521

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      They are massively into debating.

      261

    • #

      Yes Dave – obviously somebody has made a call to arms and the lefties are out in force.

      But as noted, they are cowards when it comes to actual discussion and debate. They far prefer deplatforming, shadow banning and outright removal of “offending” posts. If kids behave this way then we discipline them, but these “kids” are allowed to carry on in a completely reprehensible way. A way that they would not tolerate against them.

      Its utterly sickening how our “civilised” society puts up with this evil hypocrisy.

      251

  • #
    Zane

    The Kremlin wants to keep Germany dependent on Russian gas, thus the infiltration and corruption of German politics to favour the green agenda. Let’s also not forget the malign influence of the recently deceased German billionaire wind baron Aloys Wobben, owner and founder of German wind turbine manufacturer Enercon. A moniker which is highly appropriate, since wind power is an energy con, alright 😄.

    332

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Some years ago there was an article describing the devotion to the local forests in Germany by nearby residents.

    Apparently they would carefully clean out undergrowth to make the area below the canopy a place to walk and be inspired by nature.

    Compare this with the Green Australian strumph where nobody is allowed in the bush and no maintenance is permitted so that the ultimate natural growth is achieved.

    The end purpose is to ensure that when the inevitable fire starts it burns naturally in a ferocious manner that ensures that all birds and animals trapped there are treated equally along with the noxious imported plant growth.

    It’s all natural.

    But think of the money saved by state and local governments in not doing regular bush maintenance as was once the case sixty years ago.

    I prefer the original German approach.

    KK

    411

  • #
    Lawrie

    Where is the b***** media? The media is either the problem or part of the great scam. When will the madness end? NSW goes plastic bag free on Wednesday. Bring your own bags to pick up the takeaway. A badge of honour will be walking down the street looking like a bag lady.

    261

    • #
      David Maddison

      They falsely described plastic bags as “single use” but everyone I know had multiple uses for them and then eventually responsibly disposed of them. There was no legitimate reason to get rid of them.

      The Left are at war against everything good and decent about Western Civilisation from the minor to the huge. Banning an important convenience item like plastic bags is part of their destructive agenda, just to add to the frustrations of daily life and grind people down.

      301

    • #
      Bruce

      Where is the b***** media?

      Leading the cheer squad.

      First they steal the language, then your liberty. SOP.

      101

    • #
      Earl

      According to this media report the pain is going to be even worse in WA particularly with the 2nd stage of legislation which will ban “thin plastic produce bags, cotton buds with plastic shafts, polystyrene packaging, microbeads, oxo‑degradable plastics, takeaway coffee cups and lids, and polystyrene cups”. Of particular interest is the “thin plastic produce bags” which I assume refers to the (very single use) plastic bags supplied throughout the fruit and veg section of all supermarkets however will it also apply to loaves of bread? Are they going to have to go to paper bags? (Rhetorical questions not meant for you to have to answer).

      As David replied the supermarket bags always had secondary uses at our place and when the free ones were stopped we just started buying the rolls of plastic bags sold in the storage section and use them for rubbish. If they too get banned household rubbish disposal is going to be a nightmare and next there will be health warnings because of the sudden and unexplainable increase in flies and state governments will consider legislating a total ban on food scraps. But then we in QLD are already being subtly led to that outcome with the council sharing helpful information on how you can add certain food waste to compost bins – they are even offering a $70 rebate on compost bin purchases. Of course the same fly increase health warnings will be raised with this in due course.

      121

      • #
        David Maddison

        Earl, as regards to the ban on polystyrene packaging, many consumer appliances are packed with that. As WA is such a small market, it just means companies won’t bother making alternative packaging for their products or they might just supply one product with the approved packaging. There will be less or no freedom of choice, but I guess that’s all part of the plan.

        And how are people meant to pick up their dog excrement? Many things not thought through for a plastic waste problem that doesn’t really exist. Most plastic in the ocean comes from rivers in Asia and Africa, not Western countries.

        101

      • #
        skeptocynic

        Look at all the throwaway plastic being wasted in the Krazy Kult of Kovid.
        Test kits and face shields are full of throwaway plastic and what about the mythical massive floating island of disposable masks in the Pacific and Atlantic gyres?

        40

  • #
    Neville

    Thanks for your efforts Jo trying to keep us informed about the latest infantile Green lunacy.
    Even the clueless Bob Brown protested via his best NIMBYISM when they wanted to construct these fra-dulent, TOXIC monstrosities near his residence in Tasmania.
    But S & W are just more obvious con tricks to wreck our electricity grids around the world and inflict more hardship on poor people and the elderly.
    Of course none of this TOXIC,fra-dulent nonsense will change the weather or climate or temperature at all, but does ruin the environment both above and below the ground FOREVER.

    241

  • #
    OldOzzie

    PANIC STOP GENERATING ELECTRICITY

    The Day the Electricity Died

    Imagine one of your kids freezing to death in your home. Eleven-year-old Cristian Pineda’s mother found her son dead during the Texas blackout in February 2021. Or you have a power outage for three days, losing a couple of hundred dollars worth of food because your refrigerator didn’t work, as Michelle Jones did last summer. The food she had just bought to feed herself, her daughter, and her granddaughter spoiled without electricity.

    This is likely to become all too common in the future.

    Why?

    My years as a Wisconsin state senator and in Gov. Scott Walker’s administration gave me some insights. My senate district included a coal plant, a natural gas plant, two nuclear plants, a biogas plant, biodigesters, wind towers, and many miles of Lake Michigan shoreline—and since then it has added a solar plant. Here are some lessons I’ve learned.

    First, we need to understand a little bit about how electric grids work. They cannot store electricity without a battery. Batteries are scarce and expensive. Electric demand must be met with electricity generation, always. If supply cannot keep up with demand, the utility will shut down electricity for some or many.

    For nearly a week, Texas utilities were unable to meet demand. They shut down the electric grid. Five million people lost power, and from 250 to 700 died. If an electric grid breaks, all the people it serves will be without electricity for weeks or months.

    Nonetheless, Progressives favor energy policies that will make grid failures more frequent, widespread, and prolonged. They want to close coal plants without enough full-time power ready to take their place. They seem unconcerned about reliability. They want coal plants torn down even if we have to keep paying them—like selling your car to get a newer one while you still owe lots on the first.

    What do they all have in common? Increasing their reliance on solar and wind and closing coal plants. A dirty green secret is that coal is full-time power and wind and solar are not. Electric grids must have full-time, on-demand power all the time—plus some—or blackouts are guaranteed.

    Another dirty secret: wind and solar produce little or no energy 70% of the time. This means that to replace 1,000 MW of coal, it will take 3,500 MW of wind turbines’ “nameplate capacity,” or 5,000 MW of solar’s. That’s about 1,200 3 MW wind turbines or 13 million solar panels, in either case occupying nearly 40 square miles.

    About 240 coal plants in the United States deliver about 22% of our electricity. About71,000 wind towers produce about 9% of our electricity on a part-time, when-the-wind-blows, basis. We are adding about 3,000 wind turbines a year, in the whole country. If wind didn’t have the part-time problem, those 3,000 could replace 2.5 coal plants a year. At that rate, it would take 96 years to replace them all.

    Progressives have been demanding that we close coal plants faster than 2.5 a year. If we want our electric grid to serve us full time, we need to reject this policy. We also need to stop everything they do to make coal and natural gas more expensive because that will raise our electric rates even faster.

    291

    • #
      b.nice

      “This means that to replace 1,000 MW of coal, it will take 3,500 MW of wind turbines’ “nameplate capacity,” or 5,000 MW of solar’s. That’s about 1,200 3 MW wind turbines or 13 million solar panels, in either case occupying nearly 40 square miles.”

      This is a furphy..

      At times, those numerous wind turbines will produce basically NOTHING, no matter how many of them there are.

      And solar produces NOTHING all night , every night (except in Spain)

      You cannot “replace” coal with any number of wind turbines or solar panels.

      401

      • #
        PeterS

        You cannot “replace” coal with any number of wind turbines or solar panels.

        That is true and so why are they trying do do it? Two possible broad answers. One, those in control are devoid of any common sense. Two, it’s deliberate to instigate a regime change.

        91

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      Very articulate and to the point.

      And sooner or later the diastrous natural consequences of part time power will show up. A large slice of the populace has gone mad in a teal coloured cloud. Sanity will return one person at a time.

      101

      • #
        b.nice

        “Sanity will return one person at a time.”

        Its rich Sydney area… I’m not sure sanity can ever return ! 😉

        102

        • #
          Forrest Gardener

          It is true that the well off have many layers of insulation against reality. But there is nothing like the power going off at regular intervals to penetrate the most sincerely held delusion.

          71

    • #
      RickWill

      This means that to replace 1,000 MW of coal, it will take 3,500 MW of wind turbines’ “nameplate capacity,” or 5,000 MW of solar’s. That’s about 1,200 3 MW wind turbines or 13 million solar panels, in either case occupying nearly 40 square miles.

      It is this simplistic view that causes the problem. It fails to recognise that the guaranteed output of wind or solar generators is precisely ZERO. No amount of them can provide dispatchable generation – they are inherently unreliable.

      71

  • #
    Neville

    Meanwhile the tiny hybrid King island system is up to the regular pattern and is hopeless and unable to supply RELIABLE, BASE-LOAD electricity without the Diesel generator.
    And if this S & W + battery disaster can’t supply just 1600+ people, then you’d have to be insane to waste endless billions $ trying to inflict this on the 26 million citizens across Australia.

    https://www.hydro.com.au/clean-energy/hybrid-energy-solutions/success-stories/king-island

    251

    • #
      David Maddison

      then you’d have to be insane

      “Insane” is the new “normal”.

      221

    • #
      Earl

      And neighbour Flinders Island is acting like the King’s twin:
      As at 10.01am:
      Wind – off
      Battery – off
      Solar – 32kW 4%
      Diesel – 837kW 96%

      Could be wrong but the ABC weather report this morning is warning of high winds and reported on widespread wind damage in SA. Guess the Island “twins” have stowed their wind machines given the velocities that are expected which they “CANT HANDLE THE TRUTH”. Image a world where the sun shines 24×7 and the wind gently puffs not too hard not too soft – yeah right.

      161

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      The King Island system may in fact turn out to be a significant teaching point.

      The lesson for the teals out there of course is that you need more windmills for when the wind doesn’t blow, more solar panels for when the sun does not shine, and the whole of the island’s power would be from windmills and solar power if only that damned diesel generator was turned off and blown up. Where on earth are those unicorns when we need them.

      141

  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    Forests should be protected. And apart from national parks, and individual acts like “ green groups buy Belize forest to protect it ‘in perpetuity’” a forest is seen as a resource which can be exploited.

    Note: the wind farm is actually less destructive than the gas project in the Pilliga forest in NSW, given that the German proposal is for 18 turbines to be built in an area of 200 sq km, vs the Pilliga project is 450 wells located on around 1000ha of the 95,000 hectare project area.

    Colour me cynical

    133

    • #
      David Maddison

      The affected area is short trees and shrubs, not massive trees. And minimal environmental impact is expected.

      In any case, people need affordable, reliable energy. If you ban coal and nuclear and any new hydro, and gas is still temporarily allowed, then that will be used.

      Affordable reliable energy only comes from coal, gas, nuclear and proper hydro (not SH2). That’s all there is.

      Let me know if you know of any other source of energy that can deliver it affordably and reliably like coal, gas, nuclear and hydro.

      271

    • #
      el+gordo

      For those unfamiliar with the story, Santos says they’ll return the place to pristine beauty.

      https://narrabrigasproject.com.au/uploads/2018/02/Fact-sheet-Working-in-the-Pilliga.pdf

      I’ll reserve my judgement.

      61

      • #
        OldOzzie

        At full production, our activities will cover less than half
        a percent of the Pilliga’s 500,000 hectares

        + Access will be via agreement with NSW Forestry Corporation

        Great Pig Shooting Pilliga – memories of the 60s

        Pilliga East State forest is open 7 days a week to hunting with firearms, bows and dogs. It is one of the largest NSW State forests, occupying approximately 160,000 hectares or semi-arid woodland.

        Narrabri is the closest major centre for Pilliga East, just 42 km north. There is also Coonabarabran 66 km to the south and Gunnedah 80 km to the south east. Fuel, food, accommodation and emergency supplies are all available at these locations

        Pilliga East State forest provides habitat for large populations of pigs and goats spread throughout the forest. Good numbers of foxes, cats, hares and rabbits also call Pilliga East State forest home.

        121

      • #
        b.nice

        “I’ll reserve my judgement.”

        A small diameter hole in the ground is easy to plug.. All the drilling rig and gas control structure can and will be re-used.

        Compare this to thousands of tonnes of steel and concrete left in the ground after the removal of wind turbines, if they actually get removed…

        … and the massive waste that has to be disposed of in terms of wind turbine blades and towers if the turbines are removed.

        Gas drilling is nothing more than an mozzie bite on an elephants bum !

        241

        • #
          el+gordo

          The court has decided to give Santos the nod, so I’ll leave it there.

          There is nothing we can do about wind turbines in a country far far away.

          40

      • #
        OldOzzie

        The Narrabri gas project, 100 per cent of which is committed to the domestic gas market, is now desperately needed.

        In other jurisdictions such as Victoria, policy uncertainty is risking investment and supply – right as we need it. The many fingers of regulation – and those willing to use it as a commercial or philosophical tool – could cost us all dearly.

        Although domestic prices are still relatively low compared with those paid internationally, we simply must ensure new supply comes online to underpin ongoing energy security, maximise our international advantage and meet domestic needs.

        Now is the time for us to work together to ensure that gas reaches our customers and that regulation facilitates, rather than stifles, a functioning market.

        101

        • #
          OldOzzie

          Runway cleared for Santos on Narrabri gas

          Santos chief executive Kevin Gallagher says the company for the first time has a “clean pathway” to proceed with its Narrabri coal seam gas project, where it expects to have no difficulty bringing in new partners amid soaring international prices for gas.

          The deadline for an appeal to October’s decision in the NSW Land & Environment Court to dismiss a legal challenge to the approval for the project passed on Tuesday, allowing Santos to move forward with drilling needed ahead of a final investment decision.

          The contentious project, which could supply up to half of NSW’s gas needs, has been more than 10 years in the making and cost about $1.5 billion of investment while never getting beyond the planning stage.

          And while Santos revealed on Thursday that its 20 per cent partner in Narrabri gas, EnergyAustralia, had handed back its stake, Mr Gallagher anticipates keen interest from potential replacement partners, despite the controversy over the development, as the price for imported LNG goes through the roof.

          “Gas is a good market to be in right now, right?” he told AFR Weekend.

          “We can supply gas much cheaper than that from Narrabri, so I don’t think there’s going to be an awful lot of difficulty in finding partners who want to get into that project once that project is firmed up a bit.”

          Spot gas prices in southern Australian markets have recently been trading at $10-$11 a gigajoule, which, while much higher than recent averages, is still well below the price that international gas would be available for through a NSW import terminal.

          “You compare that to what you’re paying for gas if you’re buying it in the LNG market right now, which is more than $US20 ($27.80) per gigajoule,” Mr Gallagher said.

          “If we were pumping gas into NSW through an import terminal, that’s what you would be paying when you pick it up, plus shipping, and then plus your transport to your customers, so for those people pushing that import terminal option for NSW, that is the alternative in a higher cost energy world.”

          While Australia is one of the world’s biggest LNG exporters, as many as five groups are hoping to develop LNG import terminals around the south-east coast amid warnings from the Australian Energy Market Operator and the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission of potential shortages in southern markets, starting about mid-decade.

          The Narrabri venture has preliminary agreements to supply gas to manufacturers Brickworks and Perdaman Group, and to gas wholesaler Weston Energy.

          EnergyAustralia, which wrote down the value of its stake in the Narrabri project several years ago, sold its 20 per cent holding back to Santos for a “nominal” sum, Mr Gallagher said, adding it was good to clear up a longstanding “misalignment” between the partners on the project.

          With the possibility of a further legal challenge on approvals now put to bed, that clears the way forward on the project, he said.

          “We’ve got a clean pathway now for the first time at Narrabri, and it’s time to get on with our appraisal process, which will be another 12 to 18 months,” he said.

          The Narrabri project involves developing up to 850 gas wells, gas processing and water treatment facilities in the Pilliga region over a 25-year period.

          91

          • #
            OldOzzie

            No Wonder We Never get anything done in Australia

            The contentious project, which could supply up to half of NSW’s gas needs, has been more than 10 years in the making and cost about $1.5 billion of investment while never getting beyond the planning stage.

            The Narrabri project involves developing up to 850 gas wells, gas processing and water treatment facilities in the Pilliga region over a 25-year period.

            Opponents, including several local groups, have vowed to continue their campaign against it, while the escalation of climate concerns and ESG issues have also heightened risks around financing for the project, which Santos has estimated will cost $US650 million in the first phase.

            Decisions are also needed for the route of a gas pipeline to transport the gas, a venture that is also fiercely opposed by several landowners and communities in the region.

            The latest delay in the project suggests that a final investment decision on the first phase would come in 2023, subject to the results of the drilling.

            91

            • #
              OldOzzie

              ESG Needs to be the Next CRT – and We Will Destroy it With RCF

              Without Australian oil and gas, Asia will burn coal and wood

              The Greens’ call for moratoriums on fossil-fuel projects would make integration of renewables into the grid more expensive and halt billions of dollars in funding for cleaner energy.

              Oblivious to the reality of global energy markets where LNG demand in our region will double by 2050, our opponents are still pursuing a complete phase-out of fossil fuels, which is simply unachievable. Minority calls to end oil and gas projects are calls to return to coal and wood burning in Asia, to make integration of renewables into the grid more expensive and to halt billions of committed funding in cleaner energy.

              They also ignore other very real priorities for the Australian people: cost of living, national security and our ability to make things – the essential products that underpin modern life such as fertilisers, packaging, medical equipment and the polymers that still provide 60 per cent of the world’s clothing fibres.

              Moratoriums and project bans from the mid-2000s are coming home to roost – as are the effects of market intervention.

              Ironically, a retailer of last resort event in NSW this week has pushed the gas market there into administration, sending a market that had been effectively matching supply with demand right until the day of intervention, into turmoil.

              This is a state that imports more than 95 per cent of its gas from other states and has refused to support investment in new gas supply for most of the past decade.

              The Narrabri gas project, 100 per cent of which is committed to the domestic gas market, is now desperately needed.

              101

              • #
                OldOzzie

                Meanwhile

                APRA urges banks to ‘proactively address’ climate risks

                The prudential regulator says it is intent on ensuring Australian banks are carefully managing the rising risks from the heating planet and wants to see improvements in climate risk management capabilities on the back of extensive stress tests currently under way.

                Climate risk assessment is a growing focus of prudential supervisors globally and the Australian Prudential Regulation Authority released on Friday details of the scenarios it is using for a new “climate vulnerability assessment” (CVA) program.

                APRA said it had chosen beef cattle, dairy and grain as three commodities to scrutinise given they “may be impacted by physical climate risk” while banks are also monitoring “transition risk”, which relates to changes in economic activity.

                APRA said it will publish aggregated results from the assessments next year but will not make public results from individual banks.

                41

            • #
              Dennis

              Another example of the mess we are in because of the Federation of States, the former Colonial Governments now Commonwealth of Australia that formed the Federal Government but retained most of the areas of responsibility and powers each State had as a Colonial British Government.

              Example natural gas onshore requires State approval, offshore is Federal approval but there are In understand State requirements involved especially when the ship loading terminal is coastal onshore. And then agreements on exporting is a mixed responsibilities area.

              And of course the climate change agenda of UN influence effectively limiting exploration and extraction of gas in Australia, and consider huge shale oil deposits locked away under UN registered National Parks, former State Forest lands.

              81

              • #
                David Maddison

                Nothing more illustrated that Australia is a collection of almpst-independent colonies rather than a united country than did covid.

                81

              • #
                Dennis

                Unfortunately too many Australians did not understand the “collection” situation and that the leaders cabinet was only a forum for discussion between leaders to try and secure cooperation and coordination between state and territory governments, they own and operate public health, public hospitals, state parliaments created emergency powers legislation and state health, police and courts administered them.

                Where it fell apart was Labor state leaders plotting to use the forum to cover state actions and enforcements to blame the federal government and prime minister, interstate border closures and controls were of course state actions.

                71

              • #
                Dennis

                By the way, the Labor advertising agency has admitted that they decided on a campaign strategy of attacking the prime minister, like those advertisements using only his answers to questions; don’t hold a hose, not my job, etc. And that the campaign began soon after Scott Morrison was elected to the position of prime minister late in 2018.

                As a follower of politics the campaign raised my suspicions in 2019 because of the similarities to smearing of Abbott, including questioning relationship to women. The mysogynist Abbott for example, the doesn’t care about early morning staff misbehaviour alleged in Parliament House and many others.

                51

              • #
                Dennis

                Misogynist.

                21

            • #
              David Maddison

              Despite being gas rich, the inability to develop any projects means that Australia will continue to have a gas shortage. If Green Labor doesn’t ban gas altogether, I can see Australia importing gas. Possibly the very same gas exported from Australia from the NW Shelf under the world’s cheapest gas deal signed with the Chicomms by John Howard on a 30 yr contract. The clowns who wrote the contract forgot to provision for inflation and market prices.

              51

    • #
      • #
        OldOzzie

        Rangeland goat production in western NSW

        Case studies of seven successful enterprises

        Goats in western NSW are either harvested from wild or unmanaged populations or produced in
        managed enterprises. Producers believe the industry faces a unique challenge to ensure the
        rangeland goat is viewed as a resource rather than a pest. Goats are sold directly to processors
        or via depots that consolidate and draft lines according to different market specifications.

        It is difficult to estimate the number of rangeland goats because their numbers fluctuate with
        seasons, they are mobile and they are often in terrain that is difficult to survey. Estimates of
        Australian rangeland goat numbers range from 1.5 million (Pople et al 1996) to 5 million (DAFF
        2005) and they occupy approximately 1.2 million sq km of rangelands
        (Ballard et al 2011).

        Hunting Down Under

        71

        • #
          Zane

          Goat curry be the best, mon – ask any Jamaican 😄.

          61

          • #
            Bruce

            “Low-fat lamb” as it is described to the folk who are occasionally served it here. Rosemary, Thyme and a Bay leaf, red wine optional, a glug of olive oil. Into the slow-cooker for the requisite time per Kg. When the meat just starts falling off the bone, throttle back and bring to rest. Serve with minted peas, baked sweet potato and carrots, baked or mashed spuds.

            “Free-range” low-fat lamb, in fact. One second standing in a quiet piece of bush, next second the central nervous system terminally disrupted. We get protein, the bush gets a bit of relief.

            Primo tucker and less fooling around than for venison. (Also easier to fit in the portable fridge). If you have ever carried a deer carcass any distance on foot, and then had to do the hanging and “aging” caper, you will know what I mean.

            41

    • #
      el+gordo

      The traditional owners are against it.

      ‘In North-West New South Wales, a proposed coal-seam gas project has been met with strong opposition from Gomeroi community members.

      ‘Members of the Gomeroi nation voted against accepting an agreement proposed by energy company Santos seeking to establish the Pilliga (Narrabri) coal-seam gas project, which would see 850 coal-seam gas wells in the Pilliga forest.’ (ABC)

      11

      • #
        Forrest Gardener

        More sit down money needed.

        71

        • #
          el+gordo

          Its more complex, they are not asking for anything. Santos is going out of its way to be helpful.

          ‘Through the study process, 90 sites of cultural significance were identified in the project area. Santos said it has committed to avoiding these sites and will undertake further surveys before any new work takes place.’ (Upstream)

          21

          • #
            Forrest Gardener

            Ninety sites is nothing. The people I used to assist could find as many secret sites as they needed until enough money appeared to stop them looking for more. I vividly remember the price being as low as a second hand land cruiser.

            20

    • #
      b.nice

      The mis-information and diversion tactics from PF continue. ie the blatant lies. !

      “The Pilliga has a long history as a working forest. There are more than 5,000 km of existing roads, forest tracks, fire breaks and other easements throughout the Pilliga. Much of the Pilliga has been accessed by the timber industry for sleeper cutting and cypress harvesting. Other sections have been used for sheep and cattle grazing. These activities, along with regular wildfires and the introduction of invasive species, have modified the Pilliga over time and influenced its ecology.

      In 2005, the NSW Government completed a comprehensive review of land use in the Pilliga. A key outcome of the Brigalow and Nandewar Bioregions regional assessment resulted in around 240,000 hectares, or almost half of the Pilliga, being protected under the National Parks and Wildlife Act.

      Other parts of the Pilliga were dedicated as State Forest, and set aside for the purposes of “forestry, recreation and mineral extraction”.

      One of the strategic aims for the areas zoned State Forest was to “provide for exploration,mining, petroleum production and extractive industry”. This is the section of the Pilliga where we are seeking to work.

      So this area in NSW is an area specifically set aside for such purposes.

      Compare that to destroying a 1000 year old forest of immense environmental and historical significance.

      172

    • #
      el+gordo

      If Santos said we are going to give the gas to NSW residents at a reasonable price it may have passed muster, but they are planning to sell it on the world market to the highest bidder.

      ‘Santos chief executive Kevin Gallagher says the company for the first time has a “clean pathway” to proceed with its Narrabri coal seam gas project, where it expects to have no difficulty bringing in new partners amid soaring international prices for gas.

      ‘The deadline for an appeal to October’s decision in the NSW Land & Environment Court to dismiss a legal challenge to the approval for the project passed on Tuesday, allowing Santos to move forward with drilling needed ahead of a final investment decision.’ (AFR)

      12

      • #
        b.nice

        Ideas for agricultural fertiliser factory linked to the gas field., which would be great news for Australia.

        101

        • #
          el+gordo

          Good debating point, Santos was happy to sign up Perdman, who could possibly object in these parlous times. It is great news for Australian farmers.

          21

    • #
      James Murphy

      Peter Fitzroy, have you ever seen a well-head? Do you realise how little space they actually take up? Especially if they drill clusters of wells from pads.
      Do you realise how easy it is to rehabilitate a well site? Especially when it’s in a country with decent environmental controls on such development.

      In Australia, oil companies have rehabilitated a lot of such sites, to the point where there’s no evidence of anything being out of the ordinary, and this is in arid regions where things don’t change much by themselves, unlike higher rainfall areas where revegetation works a treat in a short time.

      The oil industry isn’t perfect, but it provides more value for money than Solar and Wind at the scales required to keep the lights on. Maybe you need to get out a bit more.

      131

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Did you read my post?

        All the arguments for the Pilliga project apply to the Wind Farm

        it comes down to this

        If you approve of the Pilliga project, you must also support the German one.

        312

        • #
          b.nice

          You obviously have not comprehended the MASSIVE difference between the two projects.

          The Pilliga project is on land specifically set aside for such a purpose

          “One of the strategic aims for the areas zoned State Forest was to “provide for exploration, mining, petroleum production and extractive industry”. This is the section of the Pilliga where we are seeking to work.“”

          Only a complete m***n, with zero comprehension, would compare that to destroying a 1000 year old forest of immense environmental and historical significance.

          101

        • #
          b.nice

          “Did you read my post?”

          Yes, it was a bunch of ignorance based garbage.

          111

        • #
          b.nice

          “The Pilliga has a long history as a working forest. There are more than 5,000 km of existing roads, forest tracks, fire breaks and other easements throughout the Pilliga. Much of the Pilliga has been accessed by the timber industry for sleeper cutting and cypress harvesting. Other sections have been used for sheep and cattle grazing. These activities, along with regular wildfires and the introduction of invasive species,”

          So, very few new roads needed. The will also clean up a lot of the invasive species.

          Once the wells are tapped out, they will be sealed, and the native grown re-established..
          All infrastructure will be removed and reused.
          They will leave the land in a better state than when they started..

          This is something that can never be said for wind turbine, which leave huge chunks of steel and concrete in the ground, as well as filling up landfill with un-degradable fiber waste.

          The German project will destroy the forest FOREVER.

          There is absolute no comparison between the two projects.

          61

    • #
      b.nice

      18 turbines to be built in an area of 200 sq km

      Each of which will require large areas of cleared land around it, plus wide roads to be pushed through 1000 year old woods.

      “At full production, our activities will cover less than half a percent of the Pilliga’s 500,000 hectares”

      And the roads already exist, and each drill-point is a very small area.

      Again.. No comparison.

      41

    • #
      Andrew Wilkins

      Good to see you flinging logic out the window Peter.

      10

  • #
    DLK

    the proper place for wind turbines is as close as possible to the people who voted for them.

    201

  • #
    David Maddison

    The world is going to get worse, FAR WORSE, unless people on the rational side of society e.g. conservatives and libertarians stop allowing themselves to be bullied by the Left and stand up for their garbage and say NO, YOU CAN’T DO THAT.

    The Left are relentless and will not stop if there is no resistance offered.

    91

    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      I’d be looking for ways to turn the strengths of the teals against themselves. Decoy campaigns for wind turbines in well to do suburban areas for example.

      21

  • #
    Peter

    I have a 4.5kW rooftop solar system, installed around 8 years ago, because it made economic sense. Recently I had to cut down some trees that had started to shade my solar panels during peak sunlight. How ‘Green’ is that? Now the Government have reduced the feed-in tariff via retrospective legislation, so the economic sense has deteriorated, though I can now get a new grant to install a battery….

    131

    • #
      Bruce

      Last time I looked, “old-growth” forests are NET CO2 producers, what with the constant decay of leaf litter and the fact that ALL plants go into “reverse-mode” in the absence of sunlight, (hint; night-time).

      NEW growth, be it crops or forests, does a lot of photosynthesizing “carbon sequestering” ,(spit!), in sunlight.

      Australia also has vast areas of real-estate populated with fire-climax tree species; Acacias and Eucalypts.

      No regular, creeping ground fires, no seed-pod germination, no trees, eventually. If there is an over abundance of understorey, WHEN, not if, it burns, the heat of that amassed litter and understorey WILL KILL the trees and utterly sterilizes the soil to a considerable depth. The next rain washes the dead soil into the gullies and chokes them and the only things that will grow in the remnant ashes are a few WEEDS.. This is why, in the absence of nomadic tribes systematically torching the countryside for food, “controlled burns” are vital to the survival of our native forest rmnants

      62

    • #
      Earl

      Peter, which (Australian state?) government has reduced the feed-in tariff? The QLD one is legislated till 1 July 2028 what have I missed? Cheers.

      11

      • #
        Queenslander

        In Queensland the old original ones are in force until 2028, but they dropped that scheme some 8-10 years ago.

        I’ve just ben dropped from 15c/kwh to 11c for first 1162 kwh then 5c kwh for every kwh thereafter. Luckily it has covered its cost before the reduction but it now looks like I won’t be getting any FIT payments.

        41

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      Peter:
      South Australians who applied to install solar panels before the 30th of September 2011 could lock in a 44 cent FIT until the 30th of June 2028. Those who applied from the 1st of October 2011 to the 30 of September 2013 could lock in a 16 cent feed-in tariff until the 30th of September 2016. This 16 cent feed-in tariff is now over. NOTE no retrospectivity
      As at January 2022, rates on offer from electricity retailers include:
      AGL: 5c – 12c per kilowatt-hour Energy Australia : 8.5c per kilowatt-hour
      Origin: standard – 6c , Solar Boost – 10c per kilowatt-hour
      Diamond: currently 7c per kilowatt-hour
      Victoria
      For the financial year beginning 1 July 2021, customers on the current minimum FiT will receive at least a single-rate of 6.7 cents per kilowatt hour (c/kWh). This is a 3.5 c/kWh decrease compared to the 2020-21 rate.
      Retailers can also offer solar customers a time-varying minimum FiT. From 1 July 2021, customers on the time-varying FiT rate will receive an off-peak rate of 6.7 c/kWh, a shoulder rate of 6.1 c/kWh and a peak rate of 10.9 c/kWh. The time-varying rates have all decreased slightly compared with the respective 2020-21 rates.

      31

  • #
    Neville

    So why do so many people still BELIEVE in the Malthusian disaster story?
    We’ve had 220 + years of data to test the accuracy of his claims and they’ve failed every test.
    His book published in 1798 said that as the population increased we’d have more poverty and Humans would suffer until population levels fell again.
    Of course this theory has failed completely for over 220 + years and today Humans are much wealthier and healthier than 30 years ago or 50 years or 100 years or 200 years or for the last 200,000 years.
    AGAIN population in 1798 about 1 billion then 2 bn by 1927
    then 3 bn by 1960
    then 4 bn by 1974
    then 5 bn by 1987
    then 6 bn by 1999
    then 7 bn by 2011
    then 8 bn by 2023
    But our Human birth rate started to fall every year since about 1965.
    Today our global average life expectancy is about 73 and even poor African life expectancy is now about 63.5 years.
    Look up the UN data for yourselves and then perhaps even our blog donkeys may start to THINK for themselves?
    But I won’t hold my breath waiting for them to WAKE UP.

    https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/WLD/world/population

    61

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      It has been disputed for that whole 220 years. Initially by Economists who seemed to think that Malthus was trying to cover up the Bengal famine in the 1790’s for his employer The East India Company.
      Later objections came from Frederick Engels (hardly a Conservative) and Henry George (1879) who noted that “Both the jay-hawk and men eat chickens. The more jay-hawks the less chickens, the more men the more chickens.” i.e. Man can increase his supply of food.
      Then there were the Club of Rome and Paul Erhlich (The Population Bomb – the world cannot sustain 2.5 billion so many will starve to death).

      David Attenborough and many in the Establishment believe that there are too many humans. Without exception, as far as I know, all lead privileged lives without shortage (except any Climate Disaster). If they really believed this surely they would volunteer for euthanasia.

      31

  • #
    DLK

    ‘climate change action’ = ‘we must destroy the planet to save it’.

    71

    • #
      Bruce

      “It’s a Death Cult, Jim

      Beam me up, Scotty, there’s not enough intelligent life here.”

      51

    • #
      Earl

      Reminds me of a customer once who mentioned all the sales and special offers the stores were offering and beautifully summarised it with “we will go broke saving money”. On reflection of course that is why credit cards were invented to ensure we don’t LOL.

      61

  • #
    Phillip Sweeney

    Europe to commit more than 1 trillion for more environmental vandalism

    https://www.zerohedge.com/energy/eu-needs-more-1-trillion-plan-ditch-russian-oil-and-gas

    31

  • #
    Zane

    Has anyone noticed the wooden toothbrushes appearing on the shelves? Also brushes claimed to be made from ” recycled ” materials. Not cheap either. Not sure if I have seen bamboo ones. Bamboo is actually a very versatile hard wearing and pest resistant material – ask any Asian. I can see a future world where you are fined negative social discredit points for not recycling your toothbrush adequately, and real recalcitrant cases might be shipped off to a reeducation camp or worse.

    Brave new world, innit? 😅

    61

  • #

    In hindsight, was this inevitable? I think it was. Green lunacy always ends this way.

    51

  • #

    In the text, Joanne mentions this: (my bolding here)

    That’ll be eighteen 240-meter-high wind turbines.

    Huh!
    For some perspective on this, look at an image of the Sydney skyline, and see all those hyoooooge tall skyscrapers.

    Only eight of those buildings on that Sydney skyline are taller than these wind turbines!

    Tony.

    171

    • #
      Philip

      The windmills between Glen Innes and Inverell in North NSW is a good place to see them on scale if you ever get the chance. The road goes straight between them as they run down the tip of the mountain range.

      31

  • #
    Dennis

    Tasmania is fortunate to have the former Greens leader as a resident and property owner, saving the landscape and forests from the blight of wind turbines on the horizon, his own views from home.

    Not opposite my backyard he says.

    61

  • #

    You have no idea how difficult this was at the time.

    I had read a ‘rumour’ on the Internet that the coming ‘saviour’ for power generation, wind power, was a flop in Germany. The Internet then was not as comprehensive as it is now. I had to use the Google translator tab and search for many many days, and a number of hours each day. I finally did find something, but it went so far against everything that was being said about how good wind power was, that I was afraid to publish it, thinking it was wrong, and that I would pretty much look like a fool if I did say that ….. when the real truth came out about it.

    So, I worked on it, using that translator tab, read it, read it all again, and then tried to find something that disproved it. Then I took my heart in hand and went ahead and wrote up two Posts about it.

    The upshot of it all was that wind power was indeed a fail, and in fact, a fail of EPIC proportions.

    At the time, German wind generation, the largest wind fleet on Planet Earth was delivering its power at a Capacity Factor of 21.5%, and in most cases they (that wind fleet) could not even reach the guaranteed 6% power delivery they promised.

    Blah blah blah Tony.

    Here’s the link to the Two Posts.

    Wind Power – Epic Fail
    Wind Power – Epic Fail – Update

    You can go and read them if you want to, but if you do, look at the date at the top of each article ….. October 2009.

    THIRTEEN YEARS AGO.

    This is when I started to think I was right all along in saying wind power was a failure, something I always thought would be proved wrong, and that would make me look like a f00l for actually being $t00pid enough to actually believe it and then publish it.

    Even though I was consistently laughed at, I kept at it, now safe in the knowledge that I was correct.

    Tony.

    211

  • #
  • #
    Ross

    I’ve got them bird choppers all around me here in regional Victoria. Initially, I too thought they were a good thing 20 years ago. Mainly because where they were situated was very often the poorer agricultural land and so a lot of cockies ( farmers) got decent money for siting them on their farms. Matt Ridley was the bloke who informed me how inefficient they were. First MR introduced the concept of “capacity factor” and I was gobsmacked how inefficient they were.( 27% for most of Australia’s wind fleet ). Then, MR also wrote about the “Betz” limit, which is the limit to how much energy you can extract from a moving fluid,(wind being are very thin liquid )and wind turbines are already close to it. Their effectiveness (the load factor, to use the engineering term) is determined by the wind that is available, and that varies at its own sweet will from second to second, day to day, year to year. In other words, they are about as efficient as you can get them. Which is really inefficient compared to any thermal electricity generation.

    121

    • #
      Dennis

      Those twenty years old installations must be very close to needing replacement by now?

      I wonder how many landowners have clauses in the lease covering removal including foundations?

      A cost rarely mentioned is that the accountable working life before asset is written off for power stations is usually fifty years so a wind or solar installation must be removed and replaced twice to reach sixty years.

      But then again, they are getting cheaper you know (/sarc.)

      81

      • #
        Ross

        The Waubra and Challicum Hills wind turbines must be due soon? They actually look much smaller in comparison to some of the more recent installs, because their blade and towers are so much shorter. But that’s the problem – I’m not sure they are making those older smaller blades any more.

        21

        • #
          YallaYPoora Kid

          It is not only the blades Ross, the whole structure and foundation will be at the end of it’s design life plus that size turbine and support base will no longer be manufactured in any case.
          It will be a pull down and bury with some electrical component recycling. If lucky some structural steel may be recycled.

          10

  • #
    DLK

    the next step in wind tech
    is installing diesel or coal-powered wind generators in front of the wind turbines
    so that the wind is always blowing.

    81

  • #
    David Maddison

    Conservatives shouldn’t be fooled into thinking the Leftoids that want wind power are merely ignorant fools that don’t know you can’t run an industrial electrical grid on wind and solar.

    Ok, many of them ARE that stupid.

    But the leaders of the movement are fully aware you can’t do that.

    Fundamentally this is about the deliberate lowering of our standard of living, among other things.

    It is going to get far worse if rational thinkers keep allowing themselves to be bullied by the Left.

    61

    • #
      Ross

      You’re being a bit partisan there David. I think you might agree there are plenty of delusional wind power supporters in the LNP as well. Dan Tehan is the Member for Wannon, who has a lot of wind turbines in his electorate, plus a blade construction company facility at Portland? He’s not going anti wind any time soon.

      41

      • #
        David Maddison

        Ross, I never said LNP was a conservative party. It hasn’t been for a long time and has taken a significant turn to the Left under Turnbull and then Morrison. And people like Matt Kean in NSW put any Green / Teal to shame.

        I think the LNP’s turn to the Left contributed greatly to their failure at the last election.

        81

        • #
          Ross

          All agreed, you’re talking to the choir here! It get worse DM. Today I see the Nationals have elected Littleproud as their leader? I think that is correct. He’s a warmist and you will see even the Nationals veer to the left. I also have seen comments from some of the state Nationals here in Victoria. Some of them are also believers in AGW. You can bet some of them are wind boosters as well.

          61

          • #
            DLK

            so the plan was to get elected by joyce then knife him in the back?

            sounds like what the ‘liberals’ did to abbott.

            31

            • #
              el+gordo

              Politics is a dirty business and I sense the Party may split now that the moderates are in charge.

              21

          • #
            Serp

            He has an indelible streak of authoritarianism which I am surprised to see did not affect the outcome; I suppose that means they’re all stalinists.

            21

      • #
        Dave

        Ross,

        Vesta did construct a turbine blade facility at Portland.
        It started in 2005 and closed in 2007. It was built by VESTA to supply blades for the nearby Portland wind farm .

        Vesta closed it due to “Too little investment by the federal government

        It did not supply ONE blade. All the blades were sourced from over seas.

        31

        • #
          Ross

          Thanks Dave. I should have said Keppel Prince Engineering plant. They make sections of the towers for the wind turbines. I watch the “Portland” ads on FTA TV and they feature in those ads.

          00

  • #
    Ian Hill

    Looks like the logic from the song “There’s A Hole In My Bucket” is being applied!

    We used to sing this in Grade 3.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/There%27s_a_Hole_in_My_Bucket#:~:text=%22There%27s%20a%20Hole%20in%20My%20Bucket%22%20%28or%20%22

    21

    • #
      Ian Hill

      That was meant to be a reply to DLK just above.

      21

    • #
      Ian Hill

      I had no idea the Liberal Party had used the song as part of their election campaign, as noted at the bottom of the Wiki article.

      11

  • #
    beowulf

    What they really need is geothermal — it’s so simple.

    14/9/19 — The local community of Winton Shire in Australia is set to benefit from the numerous opportunities that the upcoming geothermal project could provide.

    The Winton geothermal plant has a planned capacity of 310 kW, which is enough to power about 200 households at peak capacity.

    Financing for the project was provided by the Winton Shire Council (AU$3.5 million) and the Queensland Department of State Development grant (AU$500,000).

    https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/new-geothermal-plant-in-winton-australia-provides-local-economic-opportunities/

    23/10/19 — A small-scale geothermal power plant has started operations in Winton in the State of Queensland in Australia. This is the second geothermal power plant of the country and hopefully a sign for more to come.

    https://www.thinkgeoenergy.com/310-kw-winton-geothermal-power-plant-in-queensland-australia-starts-operation/

    30/5/22 — OH DEAR

    Council launches legal action over $4m geothermal plant that’s never delivered power

    But more than two years since construction finished, it has never delivered power and is not operational.

    Construction was finished in 2019 but issues arose in the commissioning stage of the project.

    “There’s no power being delivered to the network at all,” Mr Baskett said.

    The Winton plant was one of several the LGAQ had planned for western Queensland. Others slated for Thargomindah, Quilpie, Normanton, and Ilfracombe near Longreach, have all stalled.

    Martin Pujol, principal hydrogeologist at Rockwater, said at 86C, the Winton project would have been one of the lowest temperatures globally used to produce electricity.

    “It is unfortunate that technical issues have meant the project hasn’t delivered on the promises, however, producing electricity was always going to be challenging at these low temperatures,” Mr Pujol said.

    “In Australia, the whole debate about geothermal has been very electricity focused, and electricity is probably the hardest thing to do for geothermal in Australia, because of the geological context.

    https://www.msn.com/en-au/money/markets/council-launches-legal-action-over-4m-geothermal-plant-that-s-never-delivered-power/ar-AAXRrU8

    32

    • #
      David Maddison

      At Winton it seemed implausible to be able to economically generate electricity with watèr thst was only 86C temperature.

      How was that not even questioned before wasting all that money?

      Obviously science and engineering considerations don’t apply to “green” energy.

      41

  • #
    David Maddison

    Geothermal energy promoters have short memories when it comes to these failed schemes, always with taxpayer money involved…

    And how about the $90 million of taxpayer money wasted on “hotrocks”?

    https://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/another-flannery-fail-geothermal-project-scrapped/news-story/331390329e1af9da27ec28a80163b45d

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2021/12/06/hot-rocks-2-melbourne-uni-professor-urges-more-geothermal-energy/

    41

  • #
    Zane

    I notice that, with wind turbines and their associated cabling requiring massive amounts of copper and steel, along with concrete and composites, the mining giants BHP and Rio Tinto are fully supportive of the wind and solar lunacy. Why not, since it means large profits. Local shire bosses like the extra revenues and jobs for contractors. Like many bad agendas, it is driven by vested interests for the oldest reason of all – money.

    51

    • #
      Peter Fitzroy

      While coal levitates out of the ground and loads itself into the power station’s furnace, while gas precipitation also occurs in those power stations using that fuel, as does uranium and water (hydro)

      29

  • #
    DOC

    Nothing new here. The last election had the teals financed by a very rich man In Australia it is common for the wealthy to seek to protect their government ensured profits at the cost of the poorest who can’t even afford a solar panel. Reading the business columns occasionally is like reading a need for certainty by the big green investors that the government (any Party now) is going to stay the course.

    The entire AGW mess is boosted by two major defective government decisions
    1. Our governments – all Parties – decided they prove science and nobody must ever be allowed to challenge them No debate allowed in the public arena, enforced by cancellation. Even Universities got into the act. AskPeter Ridd. The Universities mention brings me to

    2) Activists, monies supplied to institutions, and monies invested for big profits ?using guaranties via ‘independent’ organisations set up, carbon ‘credits’ schemes, and cancellations and derision of those that thought we had freedom of ideas and speech applicable to AGW theory.

    The climate movement involves many agendas. The gaia believers the earth is being raped, but only in Western nations of course). The marxists that see the destruction of the Democracies built into the original UN documents available for download right at the start in the ‘i80’’. The universities dependent on maintaing AGW theory for investments in courses and studies. The business profiteers, so keen to keep it running they now pollute our politics using their funds as per the election, presenting as a moral issue but comes with big profits for applied businesses..

    The only way to stop the rot is to break the silence towards the public on the real meaning all this stuff holds for their immediate future existence. The rot will extend into every corner of our existence. Power, fuel supplies, transport of everyone and everything, construction, water supplies,food supplies, added enforcement taxes, loss of jobs, huge losses of GDP with ever increasing unpayable massive loans for governments, cuts to services and welfare.

    Presentations of [CO2]at in percentage terms, is a blind to the public. Look at the current waste and costs of multiple fortunes to counter unproven AGW, with already, at just 26% cut, the grid supply and distribution area disaster waiting to happen. All the while the price of gas,in short supply, hits a high and governments destroy the cheap coal power stations that could save our bacon. Just try to imagine what Labor’s 82% will look like in 2030!

    Governments, activists, Universities, billionaires and all businesses pushing this stuff must no longer be allowed to get away with fear campaigns, denigrations, cancellations and intimidation to force this stuff down the publics throat. A public so naive, terrified, disinterested or plain ignorant that it thinks it is being saved and votes accordingly. In fact, it is being totally misled, has no idea at the destruction this stuff is to bring down on its future. Why do people think Bjorn Lomborg has been so vilified and blocked? His adaptation plan blocks most of the agendas, costs are not destructive, profiteering chances minimalist design, adaptation is a slow, non destructive process and disturbs few. The nation continues to prosper and can pay those bills.

    52

  • #
    Zane

    Your point, if there is one, is moot.

    01

  • #
    Ed Zuiderwijk

    They are chopping down the trees because they know too well that without trees nobody can hang from them.

    51

  • #
    Zane

    A lot of silly stuff is happening in Germany. German farmers are subsidized to grow crops for biofuels. Some is used for biodiesel, others put into tanks to ferment and produce biogas which is burned on-farm to generate electricity to be purchased at a favourable price by the grid. It doesn’t make much sense except to win Germany medals at the green virtue-signalling Olympics. The result is less food grown and expensive inefficient dispersed electricity generation, all subsidized by the overtaxed average German worker.

    It’s a Marxist central committee bureaucrat’s dream. Maybe that is the point?

    50

  • #

    Jo Nova should be declared a World Heritage worthy of protection! Give’em Hell, Jo.

    80

  • #
    Mike

    And to make matters worse, they are forced to cut down the mightiest trees with…

    a herring.

    A double environmental disaster.

    10

  • #
    Yonason

    “…no 1,000 year old forest is complete without industrial wind turbines.”

    To understand how that works, consider that no modern parliament of sane knowledgeable and serious representatives is complete w/o it’s compliment of clowns.

    Sadly, given the over abundance of clown’s in the parliaments, the forests may stand a better chance of survival than the countries whose representation is overrun by clowns.

    21

  • #