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George Clooney puts forward best scientific argument yet, the “DumbF*****ery” thesis

George Clooney, climate smearist, is here with a slick advert to train Useful Idiots on what they should say.

George explains that because science can cure diseases, make phones work, and fly planes, therefore, the equilibrium climate sensitivity of carbon dioxide is 3.3 degrees Celcius. Ergo prompter sock post hoc, and all that. Sure.

Who’s the dumbcluck?

You might almost think Clooney is doing a parody of climate schmucks:

“Tragically, the volumes of knowledge gathered over centuries are now threatened by an epidemic of dumbf***ing idiots saying dumbf***ing things.”

Exactly, while tens of thousands of scientists protest about the death of science, Clooney is working to make it happen. Some people just fail their science tests at school, others make a global informercial.

Skip Jimmy and jump to George at 54 sec:

United to Defeat Untruthful Misinformation and Support Science, aka UDUMASS

The brand name “Science” was ripe for stealing, and if you can pronounce “subatomic particle” you can do it too.

Welcome to the drone-age where thousands of 13 year old girls are impressed by a movie star who knows how to swear.

h/t To Climate Depot

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Rating: 9.6/10 (64 votes cast)
George Clooney puts forward best scientific argument yet, the "DumbF*****ery" thesis, 9.6 out of 10 based on 64 ratings

191 comments to George Clooney puts forward best scientific argument yet, the “DumbF*****ery” thesis

  • #
    Peter C

    I very much doubt many of these ‘celebrities’ actually believe in or truly care about anything beyond themselves really. They parrot the message du jour in the Media in order to promote their image and whatever social credentials are deemed proper by our masters. Were the powers and media supporting regimes such as 1930s Germany enjoyed they would just as happily chase ratings and approbation by extolling the wonders and virtues of fascism. To me they are nothing more than privileged and disgusting opportunists as demonstrated in how they somehow never see the need to actually ‘live’ their ‘principles’.

    623

    • #
      Geoff

      Catch 22 promotion. He is getting old and needs face time without paying. Its ALL about the money.

      230

      • #
        MudCrab

        Catch 22 v2.0 – No one listens to Climate Change(tm) panic these days unless they are sworn at… but anyone who swears as a major part of their argument can’t have an argument worth listening to in the first place.

        Hmmm… all I need now is some dragons, some cut price CGI and a ‘less is more’ wardrobe policy for all the female actresses and I sell this concept to HBO.

        40

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      Who the f*ck is George Clooney
      Ignorant foreign yank dude ?
      I’m out of here.

      62

      • #
        Bill in Oz

        Doris day just died
        She was better looking
        And had more brains
        At 97
        Than dopey George.
        RIP Doris Day !

        212

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        He’s about to announce himself as the 22ND (or maybe 23RD) runner for the Democratic nomination for the 2020 election.

        Like all “Climate Scientists” he will be unable to quantify the amount of warming except as VERY SERIOUS & ALARMING
        but then most “Climate Scientists” have only worked out how to put a white coat on for the TV.

        100

      • #
        glen Michel

        Most likely what is called a “useful idiot” – a term that applies to 97% of climate alarmists.The other 3% are the engineers of this nonsense.

        70

    • #
      Roy Hogue

      …need to actually ‘live’ their ‘principles’.

      I have trouble discovering what their principles are. What is behind celebrity authority to speak, to dictate, to demand to be listened to. It’s a lack of principles if anything, downright usurpation of authority they don’t have and as dishonest as you can get.

      George Clooney has nothing to offer the world except his mothers name and the fact that he can actually act if he wants to. Having his mother’s name is not worth anything because it meant a lifetime of useful accomplishment for his mother not for him. His acting ability means something because I have enjoyed the acting he got right and so have probably hundreds of thousands of others. Good. He shares something with his mother and all the rest of us. He’s got a job and at least if he tries he can do it quite well.

      But what other than their accomplishments made George or his mother any more worth paying attention to than I am or than Joanne Nova is. All of us are just people doing a job. I don’t think having done my job well makes me eligible to tell the world its getting everything wrong and they better listen to me and do as I say. What has gone to George Clooney’s head that makes him believe he can tell the rest of us what to do?

      And I think the adoring fellow screen actor’s guild members and the fawning public make that happen. We give these people the power they think they have to pontificate like they actually know something. And it is power as surely as I’m sitting here typing right now. And just like power obtained any other way, it corrupts, it puffs up their heads until they see themselves as anointed by god or some equally non existent source of authority they never earned. It boils down to just that; they never earned the authority they seek to exert over us. And we have fallen for this over and over.

      We should be angry about it. We should shun these celebrity types unless they’re getting their live right, not listening to them.

      20

  • #
    Curious George

    Notice the “Suggested: May 6″ in the top right corner of the screen several seconds in the video. This is a carefully orchestrated campaign.

    220

  • #
    RicDre

    Another “dumbcluck” says “Nevermind!”

    “#AOC recants: ‘…world ending in 12 years due to climate change’ – it was “a joke””

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/05/13/aoc-recants-world-ending-in-12-years-due-to-climate-change-it-was-a-joke

    and Ava Martinez does a new parody of AOC:

    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/05/mini-aoc-strikes-again-with-another-spot-on-video-mocking-ocasio-cortez/

    I wonder if there is a way to have Ava replace AOC as Representative for New York’s 14th Congressional District. Ava seems much smarter than AOC and much better at “dry humor + sarcasm”.

    251

    • #
      Greg Cavanagh

      It was always a joke, it just took her this long to figure it out.

      140

      • #
        RicDre

        “It was always a joke, it just took her this long to figure it out.”

        True, but I think it would be more accurate to say “It was always a joke, it just took her this long to figure out the joke was on her.”

        130

        • #
          C. Paul Barreira

          But what does it say about the very highly-placed people who produced the “12-year” story? In AOC’s own words (PJMedia):

          Like the “world ending in 12 years” thing, you’d have to have the social intelligence of a sea sponge to think it’s literal.

          Hmm.

          90

        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Speaking of “ya gotta be kiding…”

          https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-14/ace-electric-vehicles-to-be-assembled-in-adelaide/11109132

          “Electric vans, utes and eventually cars will be assembled in Adelaide from next year, with start-up company ACE EV to sign an agreement with an Adelaide-based business today.

          Key points:

          * ACE EV to sign agreement with Adelaide’s Aldom Motor Body Builders to assemble electric commercial vehicles
          * The companies hope to build up to 15,000 vans, utes and cars a year by 2025
          * Aldom plans to start work at its Wingfield factory next year and expand to a new site later

          “ACE EV will work with Adelaide’s Aldom Motor Body Builders to build up to 15,000 vehicles a year by 2025.

          “ACE EV’s first electric car manufactured in Australia was built in a warehouse south of Brisbane by a team that included a German engineer, a translator and a handful of workers.
          The company’s managing director, Greg McGarvie, told the ABC the company would be signing an agreement with Aldom today.

          30

          • #
            Bill in Oz

            Maybe it will happen..
            Not sure
            but I do know that
            The claim that there
            Will be No government
            Subsidies is a fairy tale for the kids

            51

    • #
      robert rosicka

      I love that kids work and so accurate , it must really hurt AOC and the usual pundits when a kid can show them just how stupid they really are .
      And unlike the brainwashing of the left on kids there is no protesting here , no fear of the end of the world .
      This is fighting fire with something much bigger .

      110

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      Meanwhile back here in Australia,
      A bunch of Greenists
      And an ‘indigenous’ man
      Have gone to Oslo
      In Norway !
      To protest against
      The Equinor application
      to Explore for oil
      In the Southern Ocean
      And ‘Mirning’ ‘elder’
      Bunna Lawrie
      Is lodging an indigenous
      Sea claim for sea
      290 Ks off the SA coast
      From Ceduna.

      Bugger me !
      They certainly sailed
      A huge long way out
      In their red gum bark
      Canoes !

      Or maybe not !
      Maybe just dopey
      Greenists !

      https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-13/aboriginal-elder-speaks-to-crowd-in-norway-1/11106972

      21

  • #
    Yonniestone

    This Hollywood style of self congratulatory display has become nauseating and boring, as a children we were impressed by stars and celebrities that could portray characters and make you believe they were real, today that art appears to have taken a back seat to their hard left political opinions that are expressed with vulgarity and aggression.

    Considering the amount of immoral and illegal going ons that has been exposed throughout this industry I think I’ll keep my hero’s such as the great couple behind this blog and sleep a bit better at night.

    240

    • #

      “Tragically, the volumes of knowledge gathered over centuries are now threatened by an epidemic of dumbf***ing celebrities saying dumbf***ing things.”

      Fixed.

      And here’s something to ponder:

      The world has become a place where media personalities are mistaken for people of importance.

      I’ve needed a doctor
      I’ve needed a teacher
      I’ve needed a plumber
      I need farmers
      I need all manner of trades etc

      But I’ve never, not ever, needed a media personality for anything.

      370

      • #
        Robert Swan

        That crack is ok for a laugh, but doesn’t stand up to much of that pondering.

        Sure, I’ve never needed a media personality for anything, but I’m guessing that some people have appreciated media intervention (e.g. 60 Minutes, or the old Investigators) in some injustice or other.

        And, on the other side of the ledger, I wouldn’t believe a doctor, teacher, farmer or tradie preaching at me about CO2 emissions any more than I’d believe Clooney.

        70

        • #

          But ponder who you could do without and who you could not do without. You being people and the well-being of society in general.

          50

          • #
            Robert Swan

            Margaret Thatcher said “there’s no such thing as society”, and I agree; society is just a collection of individuals, all with their own motivations. I know the motivations of exactly one. It might be that what get’s my plumber out of bed in the mornings is the prospect of earning enough to watch every last product of Hollywood. Surprise: no actors, no plumber.

            I suppose the nearest we can come to objectively measuring a person’s value is how much they are paid. On that score, Cloony certainly beats me, and probably everyone else reading this comment.

            But it doesn’t matter. How much I value the work of a teacher or farmer or actor has no bearing on how much I value their opinions. That comes down to how well they argue their case. Points off for every use of “Dumbf***” or the like.

            62

            • #

              Somehow I think you’ve missed my point.

              60

              • #
                Robert Swan

                No doubt I have. Seemed to me that in saying:
                :

                You being people and the well-being of society in general.

                you were inviting me to think on behalf of society. Hence the long screed on my inability to say who society could really get by without.

                Your quotation stands up fine as a joke. Perhaps I was being too literal-minded in accepting your invitations to “ponder” it.

                20

              • #

                I wasn’t talking about the opinions expressed by the various skills and trades that I noted, but what they contribute towards society. What contribution would we miss if there were no celebrities about? I’m talking about ‘celebrities’, not someone who may appear on TV or radio as a talking head. The latter can offer some value at some point in time.

                All that ‘celebrities’ seem to do nowadays is ponce around with airs of self-importance and a belief that they can dictate what others should do and think. Most don’t even provide any entertainment value anymore, which was their reason for being in the first place. And most are the biggest hypocrites that you can find, the subject of this article being one of the biggest, owning numerous homes, jetting about all the time, and leaving Italy because there were too many refugees where he lived.

                So when have you ever wished that there was a celebrity about to fix a problem that you have?

                40

              • #
                Robert Swan

                I don’t directly value celebrities, but I don’t discount that they might still serve a purpose. I similarly don’t value golf caddies, or personal trainers, but I don’t resent what they do. Depending on how you interpret Juvenal’s line about bread and circuses, celebrities might provide a kind of anaesthetic to keep the plebs peaceful. If a lot of people weren’t distracted by the goings on of Paris Hilton or Kim Kardashian or whoever, if they were to ponder instead how the riches of our country are being squandered, there might be an uprising.

                Rather than an uprising (which I don’t think would go well for any of us), I’d like to see real change at the top. To that end, wasn’t Donald Trump a celebrity? And a certain level of fame hasn’t hurt Nigel Farage’s rise either.

                31

  • #
    Travis T. Jones

    Nostradumbass pontificates on climate dumbf***ery.

    The ironing is palpable.

    210

    • #
      Greg in NZ

      Actor Bill Nye the non-science guy is getting in on the act, too, dropping F-bombs and blow-torching plastic globes, with a bucket of sand, a blanket, and a CO₂ fire extinguisher harmlessly (subliminally?) off to one side, from HBO’s Last Week Tonight with John Oliver, 13 May –

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFgBFYkBZ6E

      Warning: Contains 97% bs and 3% canned laughter. Rating: 100% failed.

      61

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    Kind of reminds me of someone who ignorantly thinks if they speak louder, the foreigner they are speaking to can magically understand them.

    Funny how people in the ” dress up and pkay make believe” industry think they can lecture scientists on science. Arogance 101.

    220

    • #
      John Westman

      Good one Steve,

      Most of us grow out of playing “pretendies” in our early teens-some do not.

      Those that do not, continue to live in a world of make believe and unearned pretentiousness. And they have huge “carbon footprints”.

      100

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    4 legs good, 2 legs baaaaaaaadddddd….

    110

  • #
    robert rosicka

    Back at ya George .

    60

  • #
    robert rosicka

    After seeing the film clip I’m reminded of that comedy called “Team America” , if you haven’t seen it do yourself a favour and watch it .
    But a warning it’s full of language such as George in the above clip .

    40

  • #
    Adaminaby Angler

    [SNIP!] the blighter, and likewise the lot of them celebrity ponceys.

    Here in rural Aussie, celebrities are largely unknown—and rightfully so. These urban elitist plonkers are well and truly the lowest of the lot.

    [This is the second time in 24 hours that you've posted something we had to snip. Even if the comment is made in jest we won't be publishing it. Kindly refrain from making any such comments.]ED

    50

  • #
    Binny Pegler

    Good ole George. Typical of the ageing power brokers of the ‘old’ media, who struggle to come to grips with the internet age. 60 minutes recently spent a few $100k and weeks on a sinking Solomon Islands propaganda piece.

    A 5 second google search came with this -

    The volcanoes of the Solomon Islands form a NW-SW trending island chain continuing the Bougainvilla Island chain (which belongs to Papua New Guinea). The islands belong to a volcanic arc caused by the subduction of the oceanic crust of the small Solomon Plate under the Pacific Plate.
    The area is a tectonically complex, marked by the interaction of several closely spaced oceanic microplates separated by subduction zones and short spreading centers, such as one extending from SE New Guinea to Kavachi volcano.

    These guy just can’t get their head around the fact that they are no longer the gate keepers to peoples information. Most of the world now has the combined knowledge of humanity at their finger tips.

    211

    • #
      yarpos

      Sadly Binny although most of the world now has the combined knowledge of humanity at their finger tips, they are either sadly ill equpped to access and understand it, or are too lazy, or are already so indoctrinated they dont even look.

      A little while ago we went out to lunch with a couple, I knew they male partner from my old employer. At work he was perceived to be a smart if quirky guy. Smart enough to get an expat assignment up to Hong Kong and be managing IT projects around Asia Pacific. When the conversation drifted around to climate change it was clear his beliefs were very strong and he was adamantly in the alarmist camp. He only gleaned his information from and very superficial contact with the MSM, had not scratched one layer deep but was most strident in his views. It was surprising and a little dissapointing.

      120

  • #
    Another Ian

    On the other hand

    “Delingpole: Farage Spoke the Truth on Climate Change. Why Does No Other Politician Dare?”

    https://www.breitbart.com/europe/2019/05/13/conservative-politicians-need-to-come-clean-on-climate-change/

    100

  • #
    Another Ian

    Readymade excuse for BS Bill if he loses (and others)

    “#AOC recants: ‘…world ending in 12 years due to climate change’ – it was “a joke” ”

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2019/05/13/aoc-recants-world-ending-in-12-years-due-to-climate-change-it-was-a-joke/

    70

  • #
    David Maddison

    Hedy Lamarr was probably the first and last Hollywood actress of any scientific worth. She invented frequency hopping, the basis of WiFi and had many other inventions. As she was Jewish, she had to escape from Nazi Germany and move to America.

    Short video: https://youtu.be/_rlXHNeQD-s

    150

  • #
    David Maddison

    Of course, it is no surprise that Clooney is a Trump hater, just like most Hollyweirdos.

    80

  • #
    Bruce of Newcastle

    Climate alarmists like to be rude it seems. Bill Nye is in the news today with two stories:

    Bill Nye explains global warming: ‘The planet is on f—ing fire’

    Bill Nye blasts inaction on climate change due to cost: ‘Grow the f— up!’

    Maybe they think using rude words will convince people. Doesn’t convince me since the data I am seeing still suggests nothing much is happening.

    160

  • #

    Unrelated to topic, but of vital and continuing interest top anyone who likes to eat –
    “California jury says Bayer must pay $2 billion to couple in Roundup cancer trial”

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-bayer-glyphosate-lawsuit/california-jury-says-bayer-must-pay-2-billion-to-couple-in-roundup-cancer-trial-idUSKCN1SJ29F?utm_source=twitter&utm_medium=Social

    Epidemiology is the best indicator of actual usage risk (see “tobacco Industry”), so if this vital ag chemical caused cancer it would be a simple exercise to compare cancer rates between countries late to adopt it and those using it for decades. Only in California..
    The cost of the eventual loss of the use of this chemical will probably be measured in the millions of deaths, as whole production systems will have to change, and the necessary weed control through cultivation will re-introduce soil erosion in a major way.

    100

  • #
    Kinky Keith

    For a long time Peter C has been my role model with his “Take Back the Green” icon. That’s all changed now. The Clooneys are winning.

    The meaning of words is at the mercy of the people like George Clooney who act with gay abandon to mould our thinking.

    Let’s at least try to hold on to Green, we need it for inspiration in our push to recover sanity in the world.

    :-) KK.

    70

  • #
    yarpos

    Celebs are just glowing examples of the Hierachy of Needs model of behaviour. The are filthy rich and have lackies running around organising their lives and doing all the menial stuff like paying bills and buying basics and maintaining or replacing stuff. Now they have time to focus on improving themselves and improving the world and being “the best they can be” so they caught up with gurus and bullsh1t like scientology and climate alarmism.

    Occasionally one will do something useful but that is exceptional, and usually not the realm of on Hollywood type celebs, Diana and the mine clearing work might be an example of that.

    60

  • #
    • #
      robert rosicka

      They should have shut down the bridge for a few hours to give them heaps of publicity and earn the wrath of the thousands who were inconvenienced.

      120

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      Let em hang there
      For a couple of days !
      Object lesson in
      Being stupid
      And it”s consequences

      31

  • #
    PeterFitzroy

    Sent my donation to UDUMAS /Sarc off

    20

  • #
    pattoh

    Perhaps it all come down to “Control Files”.

    Look at att the high profile actor & “celebs” who realy, really hate Trump. Are they still acting & getting well paid for it?

    In their world, where even marriages & scandals are “designed” by Public Relations Consultants, what have they sold for the lives they lead?

    Personally, I would rather argue philosophy whith the garbo & the nurse down the pub. At least I know that they know about life & the vagaries of the culture that I live in.

    Throw you iSpy away & talk to your neighbour.

    70

  • #
    MarkMcD

    “He attended Northern Kentucky University from 1979 to 1981, majoring in broadcast journalism, and very briefly attended the University of Cincinnati, but did not graduate from either.[29] He earned money selling women’s shoes, insurance door-to-door, stocking shelves, working in construction, and cutting tobacco”

    This is Clooney. As you can see, he has all the hallmarks of someone who should be listened to for anything scientific.

    I don’t know why ANYONE would bother doing all those years of skull-sweat when you can know science by having famous relatives.

    60

  • #
    Penguinite

    Sorry! Don’t see any point in promoting the cooky Clooney Clutch ! I wonder how many dumbo’s phone the number?

    60

    • #
      el gordo

      No worries, we don’t get that sort of traffic through here.

      20

    • #
      PeterFitzroy

      it is satire, its not real

      31

      • #
        robert rosicka

        That’s what we keep telling you Fitz , CAGW is satire .

        50

      • #
        el gordo

        Mr Fitz, thats not quite right.

        ‘Satire is the use of humour, irony, exaggeration, or ridicule to expose and criticize people’s stupidity or vices, particularly in the context of contemporary politics and other topical issues.’ wiki

        30

  • #
    TdeF

    These are actors. Shallowood. These are people who spend their lives pretending to be other people with other people’s ideas, other people’s lives, other people’s attitudes and no idea how to do more than learn their lines.

    At what point did they become convinced that they are world leaders? Barbra Streisand, Cher, Robert De Niro and a whole slew of not funny comedians and late night show hosts. The lowest point was the call to boycott Georgia for the heartbeat abortion law and some companies have already ceased business. This is blatant extortion to override the democratic process.

    So Hollywood is now the incredibly wealthy extreme Left of American politics, a contradiction in itself.

    Rich and influential, this by people who spend their lives pretending to be people they are not. The ultimate poseurs, but we knew that. These self righteous people defended Harvey Weinstein as a great guy and said there was no casting couch at all. Really? Isn’t that how Hollywood works? Hypocrisy is not difficult for actors. They never mean what they say.

    How can you believe actors and entertainers? The great Peter Sellers had so many voices, at times he could not remember his real voice and
    how can anyone take George Clooney seriously on science?

    150

  • #
    GeorgeHatesScience

    Notice how he weaves in “ClimateChange”, “Vaccination” and “Creation Science” to block critical thinking.

    Firstly, name-calling is oh so very mature.

    Secondly, anyone with any real scientific knowledge (and knows the history of Polio, Measels, etc.) knows that vaccination works – that’s why we do it. Additionally, the Anti-Vaccination crowd basis their beliefs on a 1995 medical journal article written by a doctor who was later found to have fraudulantly messed with the results of that study. Additionally, recently a team of doctiors published an article of a 20-year vaccination study of 20,0000 children, taking the DNA of each child before and after each vaccination, and they showed that the Down-Syndrom genes were present in the DNA before the first vaccination and that the DNA did not change during the course of the vaccination study. This study effectively kills any anti-vaccination belief.

    Thirdly, he lumps all Christians together (whether a Christian believes in “Evolution” or “Creation” or anything in between) and calls them all imbeciles and idiots. Way to go George – you are so Tolerant and Incusive (that’s sarcasm).

    60

    • #
      joseph

      “Secondly, anyone with any real scientific knowledge (and knows the history of Polio, Measels, etc.) knows that vaccination works – that’s why we do it. Additionally, the Anti-Vaccination crowd basis their beliefs on a 1995 medical journal article written by a doctor who was later found to have fraudulantly messed with the results of that study.”

      George, the doctor you mention above has been vindicated. The result of the case having been taken to the high court by one of the other doctors on the team that did the research that was the basis for the article you reference. It was determined that no fraud had been committed.

      If you read his book, ‘Callous Disregard’, you’ll discover there’s much more to the story.

      And there is more than one history of Polio, Measles, etc. too . . . .

      As far as the DNA study is concerned, I don’t see how it proves the safety of vaccines?!? I mean, other damage is known to occur.

      A lot of people who are called anti-vaxxers aren’t necessarily anti-vaccine, but, they don’t want to be forced to adhere to a vaccine schedule, that gets underway on day one, and that they don’t see as being in accord with what’s best for their children.

      Cheers

      [Links to the high court case would be useful here. - Jo]

      13

  • #
    Reed Coray

    Is this the same George Looney who said “There’s not going to be a President Donald Trump. That’s not going to happen.”?
    https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=george+clooney+on+donald+trump+youtube&view=detail&mid=78A6C7C6A6FBAA8FCFB878A6C7C6A6FBAA8FCFB8&FORM=VIRE
    Talk about a dumbf*&^*. If we use his political opinion track record to assess his scientific opinions, well even a blind person can connect the dots.

    PS. To Peter Fitzroy. I have responded [http://joannenova.com.au/2019/04/midweek-unthreaded-67/#comment-2135864] to your comment http://joannenova.com.au/2019/04/midweek-unthreaded-67/#comment-2135581. The ball is back in your court.

    60

    • #
      Reed Coray

      Political science, climate science — six of one, half-dozen of the other.

      50

    • #
      PeterFitzroy

      Reed I think we’ll have to continue our debate on the next midweek unthreaded, comments are now closed on our original one. but to you r last post
      Seems like we are on the same page Reed. I think we agree that the equilibrium temp is more or less a value which balances the energy equations that describe the inputs to, in this case – the atmosphere. You make a valid point that the would also be one between interior sources of heat and the atmosphere as well.

      Now for the axioms;
      A value (which could be the equilibrium temp) can be calculated for a earth like body (that is one that represents us) to which we can compare our recorded values.
      Any difference can be explained by fine tuning our calculation, by including more parameters.

      This is slightly different to your point 11. The reason is that there are processes which may work in opposition to the radiative forcing changes as you have described them. An example would be a major volcanic event.

      3rd axiom
      we can calculate and measure values from prior history (using proxies) that can show what effect various atmospheric changes (like CO2, O2 etc) have on our value, defined in axiom 1

      For the 2nd axiom, and this is in line with your point 11. We will refine the calculation in reference to a particular baseline ( which we will derive in axiom 3)

      20

      • #
        AndyG55

        All that to say ABSOLUTELY NOTHING !!

        Practicing your “gibberish”, are you.

        Well done.

        41

      • #
        Reed Coray

        Peter, I sent Joanne the following email: “Is there any chance you can reopen the thread [http://joannenova.com.au/2019/04/midweek-unthreaded-67/] for comments? I would like the entire discussion [Peter's and mine] to be located on a single thread. That will make it much easier for the thousands (ha-ha) of rapt readers to follow our discussion. If not, we’ll make do.” I’ll let you know what she says.

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          Reed Coray

          Peter Fitzroy,

          Joanne listed several problems associated with reopening threads. I recommended that she NOT reopen our thread. We’ll carry on using this and future unthreaded posts. Having said that, I believe it’s your turn to make the case for greenhouse gas induced global warming. Based on what you have written to date, I sense that your arguments are going to follow the lines of correlation between temperature and atmospheric CO2 levels. I was hoping they would be more along the lines of a scientific argument that given our simplified model you would demonstrate that greenhouse gases must increase surface temperature. However, their your arguments, not mine. My arguments were and are going to be along the lines that, yes greenhouse gases might increase surface temperature, but situations exists where they don’t–in fact, situations can be constructed where all else being equal, the presence of CO2 not only doesn’t result in higher temperatures, it results in lower temperatures. In any event, I look forward to your arguments.

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        Reed Coray

        Peter Fitzroy

        I have problems with your axioms. I agree with a part of your first axiom—specifically that we can calculate an energy-rate-equilibrium (ERE) temperature for the surface of an earth-like body. However, I don’t see how we can compare that calculation with “recorded values.” We don’t have any “recorded values.” We have recorded values for the earth/earth-atmosphere system, but as of now we lack “recorded values” for our earth-like body.

        In addition, I question the position that “any difference [i.e., difference between our calculated value and our “recorded value(s)] can be explained by fine tuning our calculation, by including more parameters.” That methodology reminds me of the “fudge factor” students used to include when handing in reports describing their lab experiments. In particular, if their experimental results didn’t agree with theory, to account for the differences they would add a “fudge factor” term to the theory. Such a methodology will always produce agreement between experiment and theory; but the methodology introduces a new issue—how valid is the added theory? This line of reasoning leads down a never ending path.

        Your third axiom. We decided to construct a simplified earth-like body because we both realize that a comprehensive theoretical treatment of the earth/earth-atmosphere system is outside our ability to perform. Our earth-like body has well-defined characteristics, and for that earth-like body we apply physical theory to compute the earth-like body’s surface temperature. As such, I have no problem with “calculating” the effects various parameter values of the earth-like body will have on the earth-like body’s surface temperature. However (repeating what I said previously), the only way to compare those theoretical results with measured data is to construct and perform experiments on the earth-like body. If we compare theoretical results that apply to the earth-like body against measured results of the real earth/earth-atmosphere system, we are re-introducing the very issues that led us to create a simplified earth-like model in the first place. It takes a giant leap of faith to believe that the experimental results for our earth-like body will be the same as measured data from our earth/earth-atmosphere system. To put it mildly, this is a leap of faith I am extremely reluctant to take.

        Your second axiom. I have no problem with refining calculations with respect to our base-line earth-like system; but the refinements can represent a different baseline system only to the degree that they don’t violate any condition of the original baseline system.

        I think we’ve reached the point where the next actions to be taken are for you to “make your case” and I will “make my case.” After posting those cases on this blog, we can critique each other’s arguments. In that regard, if at all possible I would like the posting of our cases to be on the original “midweek unthreaded” post. Joanne has reopened that post for further comments. How long she keeps the post open, I don’t know. But let’s use that post as long as we can. What say you?

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    Jonesy

    Keanu Reeves is still the best “Star” He alone would acknowledge what he did…get paid a lot of money for dressing up…its all for the kids. Hope his line of motorcycles takes off

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    Rocket Rod

    “Tragically, the volumes of knowledge gathered over centuries are now threatened by an epidemic of dumbf***ing idiots saying dumbf***ing things.”

    Absolutely correct but he’s blaming the wrong people.
    The AGW BS is being exposed and people waking up at record pace, so we now face the fake ‘crisis’ phase of this fiasco.
    Real scientists engaging in real science, and untold others both professional and layperson, know the truth. If the rest weren’t afraid of losing their jobs and funding, this nonsense would have been wiped out decades ago. Salary – 1, integrity – 0.
    It’s all natural cycles, not manmade.
    Blame the late Margaret Thatcher as she started all this 40 years ago as a political move.
    It’s grown into a religion – or maybe better described as a suicide cult- “we believe brother, we believe !.
    Bow down and pray to the holy alter of AGW”
    Burn the unbelievers, arrest them, destroy history.
    But reality doesn’t care. Reality will do what reality always does. Wipe out the weak and stupid.
    This winter should be very interesting ;-)

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  • #
    theRealUniverse

    George Clooney Clowney..
    What can you say..

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      Sceptical Sam

      Not much.

      This is the clown that owns a pretty spiffy mansion on the shore of Lake Como, Italy. Beautiful garden, nicely trimmed. Lit up at night. However, not a solar panel in sight. Not on the roof nor in the grounds. I’ve been there. I’ve seen it.

      It gets cold on Lake Como in winter. I don’t know how Clowny heats his holiday house (or cools it in summer) but you can be assured it’s not by using renewables.

      The man is a complete flake. Why he gets the time of day is a mystery.

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    RickWill

    Off topic, however we are counting down to Saturday.

    I sent a goodwill message to Cory Bernardi and got a nice reply:

    On behalf of Senator Bernardi, thank you for your recent email.

    We would like to acknowledge that your correspondence has been received.

    We appreciate your support for the Conservatives.

    Please know your message and well wishes will be passed on to the Senator.

    Once again, thank you for taking the time to write.

    Kind regards

    Frances Mulholland
    Electorate Officer I Office of Senator Cory Bernardi
    Senator for South Australia
    Leader of Australian Conservatives I http://www.conservatives.org.au

    36 Grenfell Street, Kent Town SA 5067 I PO Box 2192, Kent Town SA 5071
    Phone (08) 8362 8600 I Fax (08) 8362 8579

    S1.87 Parliament House, Canberra ACT 2600
    Phone (02) 6277 3278 I Fax (02) 6277 5783

    I hope he and a few more like minded make it. The Victorian Senate candidate has an impressive resume:
    https://www.conservatives.org.au/kevin_bailey
    I hop he makes it in Victoria.

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    Skip Jimmy? It’s all I’ve ever done.

    But it’s good that centuries of geology, stratigraphy, speleology, oceanography, glaciology, archaeology and history have been exposed by UDUMASS as DumbF*****ery. It’s been made clear by “Broadcaster” Attenborough and climate was pretty stable till CO2 levels soared. These old school scientists just imagined the whole Holocene and Quaternary thing. Of course, they were working without the aid of BBC docos and Hollywood disaster flicks, resources we take for granted.

    Those who question Clooney Science will be subjected to sniggering and patronising worse than anything from “Bedroom Eyes” deGrasse-Tyson. A quip from George is more terrible than an hour of Brian Cox smirking. Yes, more terrible even than that.

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    RobK

    Australian physicist John Reid has just published a book called “The Fluid Catastrophy”. He has a blog for it http://fluidcatastrophe.net . The book covers many topics. The bits covering climate change are as follows.

    “CLIMATE CHANGE”

    1) There is no significant trend in global average temperature. The apparent trend is due to spurious regression (Chapters 8 and 9)
    2) The apparent correlation between global average temperature and atmospheric CO 2 concentration is also spurious. (Chapter 8)
    3) Items 1 and 2 are both a consequence of global average temperature being a centrally biased random walk with a red-noise variance spectrum. (Chapter 7)
    4) The bomb-test curve shows that about 80 percent of recent increases in atmospheric CO 2 concentration are due to ocean upwelling and only 20 percent are due to human activity. The ratio of the total contribution of anthropogenic CO 2 to the total in the ocean-atmosphere system since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution is only 1 percent. This would have no measurable effect. (Chapter 12)
    5) Predictions of temperature increases based on numerical coupled ocean-atmosphere general circulation models (i.e. climate models) are meaningless because such deterministic models cannot account for turbulence, which is stochastic. Because of this they include unrealistically large values of parameters such as eddy viscosity in order to remain stable and so can never faithfully emulate reality. (Chapter 3, Figures 3.1 and 3.2)
    6) Climate modellers ignore the effect of subaqueous volcanic activity on ocean circulation despite that fact that 85 percent of volcanic activity occurs beneath the ocean and that heating from a major oceanic eruption would dwarf all other ocean processes. This aspect of ocean circulation and climate has not simply been forgotten; it is conscientiously avoided. It is the elephant in the room. (Chapter 13)

    Based on the above we can conclude that, at multidecadal time scales, unexplained variations in global temperature and in global mean sea level may be attributed to subaqueous volcanism and are unrelated to human activity.

    I have read the book and thoroughly recommend it. Some of the maths gets heavy going but the rest is fasinating and thought provoking.
    The intro from the blog goes;

    APRIL 26, 2019

    Welcome

    The Fluid Catastrophe by John Reid is primarily about the failure of theoretical Fluid Dynamics to account for turbulence.  It is published by Cambridge Scholars Publishing and is available here: https://www.cambridgescholars.com/the-fluid-catastrophe

    Contemporary fluid dynamics is all about the mathematical description of a theoretical construct called the fluid continuum. In the real world there is no such thing as a fluid continuum. All real fluids are comprised of atoms and molecules and are are ultimately subject to the laws of quantum mechanics. All real fluids are non-Newtonian; they are granular and stochastic not discrete and deterministic.

    This  misconception has kept Fluid Dynamics trapped in the nineteenth century, unable to deal with  planetary scale fluid phenomena such as ocean waves, ocean circulation, climate, paleoclimate and the dynamics of the Core and Mantle of the Earth.  These topics are discussed in the book which also addresses the analysis of time series and discrete time spectral analysis without using Newtonian concepts of differentiability and continuity.

    The code for processing time series in order to generate many of the graphs in the book are included in the Appendices. Those programs are now available online.

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      TdeF

      “4) The bomb-test curve shows that about 80 percent of recent increases in atmospheric CO 2 concentration are due to ocean upwelling and only 20 percent are due to human activity. The ratio of the total contribution of anthropogenic CO 2 to the total in the ocean-atmosphere system since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution is only 1 percent.”

      The core deceit is that CO2 levels are all man made. There is absolute proof that is utterly false.

      I have banged on about the bomb test curve for a decade now. It tells you everything, especially the fact that CO2 is in rapid equilibrium with the 98% of CO2 which is dissolved in the gigantic oceans.

      Even if we humans wanted to do so, we could not ever change the CO2 levels. Windmills, solar panels, direct action, electric cars are all fantasies if their intention is to change CO2. It is the greatest waste of human resources and world peace in human history. There is no Climate problem. It is all made up.

      Sell the ABC/SBS/BOM/CSIRO, stop the RET milking our electricity bills illegally and stop Carbon taxes of all forms. We and all living things are made from CO2 and H2O and precious little else. Green is a long chain hydrocarbon.

      As head of physics for James Cook University, Peter Ridd is totally correct. Amazingly strong quietly spoken person. Real science will not be silenced by money grubbing administrators.

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        TdeF

        and opportunistic money men like Malcolm Turnbull and John Hewson, both faux conservatives.

        We can only hope that Union puppet and serial political assassin Bill Shorten loses the unloseable election, as Hewson did. As the British people want BREXIT and freedom, we Australians want freedom from the Climate Fantasies and their taxes.

        We want dams, coal power, proper water management and to choose what we eat, what we drive and not be dictated by opportunistic Green hypocrites like Di Natale and Bandt. We want to decide who comes to Australia and under what conditions. We want our country back from the EU/UN and Agenda 21.

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          TdeF

          Not fake scientists like Bill Nye appearing Sunday on HBO’s “Last Week Tonight with John Oliver,” Bill Nye launched into an profanity-laden and hyperbolic rant about climate change, exclaiming “the planet’s on f*cking fire!”

          No Bill, it isn’t.

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      Slithers

      Try this link for Peters site.

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  • #
    Alice Thermopolis

    Loony Clooney clones also infest the ALP:

    https://thenewdaily.com.au/news/national/2019/05/13/labor-attack-ad-climate-change/

    Labor believes it has finally found the “killer ad” to prosecute the Liberal Party’s inaction on climate change and connect with younger voters in the final days of the campaign.

    With just 48 hours until an advertising blackout hits free-to-air television, the ALP has dumped a powerful negative ad into the mix designed to capture swinging voters worried about climate change.

    The Liberal Party is also preparing to dump millions of dollars of negative ads into TV, radio and Facebook in a final pitch to stop the election of a Bill Shorten government.

    Labor’s new “doomsday” advertisement opens with the words “climate change” before running images of natural disasters including bushfires, floods and cyclones.

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      Bill in Oz

      Time to take evasive action
      And turn off the commercial TV channels !
      mind you just using the mute button
      All the time
      Works as well

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        robert rosicka

        Bill I came across a faceache post that claimed Cory Bernardi and Labor were on a unity ticket as far as franking credits go .
        I choose to disbelieve.

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          robert rosicka

          Sorry was worded badly it’s ACP calling out the other party with a similar name

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    PeterS

    George Looney might be a good actor but is proven to be a dumbass scientist. If I wanted advice from someone about say how to fix my car the last person I would talk to is an actor. The second last one would be a politician.

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    Antoine D'Arche

    Salvor Hardin once said (or will say?…..), that “violence is the last resort of the incompetent. I’m pretty sure he’d be happy extending that to ad hominem arguments made by global warmist ageing actors.

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    Travis T. Jones

    “Internal CSIRO correspondence reveals the science agency was pushed to formally accept the Federal Government’s approval of Adani’s water plans in a single afternoon.”

    ‘The devil is in the detail that we do not have’

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-14/adani-csiro-emails-foi-melissa-price/11107276

    Wait. What?

    The science is settled:

    Coal miners to blame for Queensland floods, says Australian Greens leader Bob Brown

    https://www.news.com.au/breaking-news/coal-miners-to-blame-for-queensland-floods-says-australian-greens-leader-bob-brown/news-story/cbfe12042fa9c4149ea3c10524f57344

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    pat

    this mob say there’s such “a huge appetite” for electric vehicles in Australia, they will export 12,000 of their projected 15,000 in 2025! 3 taxpayer-funded ABC staff swallow the whole story:

    14 May: ABC: ACE EV to sign agreement to build electric vehicles in Adelaide starting in 2020
    By Brittany Evins, Camron Slessor and Eugene Boisvert
    Electric vans, utes and eventually cars will be assembled in Adelaide from next year, with start-up company ACE EV to sign an agreement with an Adelaide-based business today.
    ACE EV will work with Adelaide’s Aldom Motor Body Builders to build up to 15,000 vehicles a year by 2025.

    ACE EV’s first electric car manufactured in Australia was built in a warehouse south of Brisbane by a team that included a German engineer, a translator and a handful of workers
    The company’s managing director, Greg McGarvie, told the ABC the company would be signing an agreement with Aldom today…
    Up to half of the parts will be made in South Australia, with the rest to be imported mostly from China…

    Mr McGarvie said the company was taking orders already for the vehicles and full-scale assembly would begin in Adelaide in 2020.
    ***”We know for sure that there’s a huge appetite for electric vehicles in Australia,” he said…
    “We’re hoping that we’ll get up to 15,000 [built] a year.
    “Of that 15,000 we would expect ***around 80 per cent will be export…
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-14/ace-electric-vehicles-to-be-assembled-in-adelaide/11109132

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    • #
      Sceptical Sam

      hoping

      Hope.

      Pandora managed to save that and keep it sealed in her jar.

      Sealed away. Blind.

      On the other hand Aeschylus, in Prometheus Bound, had this to say:

      Chorus: Did you perhaps go further than you have told us?
      Prometheus – I stopped mortals from foreseeing their fate.
      Chorus – What kind of cure did you discover for this sickness?
      Prometheus – I established in them blind hopes.
      Chorus – This is a great benefit you gave to men.

      I suspect that Aeschylus is on the money.

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    toorightmate

    Clooney has starred in a few good box office movies.
    However, scan through the list of all the movies he has been in and you will find that the majority have been C Grade gutter tripe.

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    pat

    headline on ABC’s “Just In” page – lol:

    ***Dreaming of warmer weather? An inflatable water park is on the cards for Canberra
    By Kate Midena
    Posted about 3 hours ago | Updated 48 minutes ago

    actual headline – nothing worth reading:

    14 May: ABC: Canberra Aqua Park proposal for inflatable water playground to develop Black Mountain Peninsula
    By Kate Midena
    The proposed aqua park would only be operational during the warmer months, between November and April, and the structure would be packed up and stored during the off season…
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-05-14/canberra-aqua-park-inflatable-water-playground-black-mountain/11110204

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    Greg in NZ

    Kind of off-topic yet all within the same big nasty picture, via NZ Herald / Pravda / Newspeak:

    “Police have been accused of targeting ‘everyday Kiwis’ during recent armed raids to seize firearms on rural South Island properties”.

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12230601

    Who would’ve thought Roger Donaldson’s 1977 film, Sleeping Dogs, would ‘go live’ in 2019 –

    https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0076725/

    except today, 42 years later, it’s the Leftist Gorilla NZ Govt [sic] versus The People. It would appear the mythical Glorious World Of Next Tuesday has arrived.

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    pat

    13 May: CNN: Australian islanders file landmark climate change complaint against government
    By Sheena McKenzie
    The eight Torres Strait Islanders filed the complaint with the United Nations Human Rights Committee, claiming that rising sea levels were having a devastating effect on their communities…
    “We’re currently seeing the effects of climate change on our islands daily, with rising seas, tidal surges, coastal erosion and inundation of our communities,” said one of the complaint’s authors, Kabay Tamu, in a statement.

    This was also having an impact on “the social and emotional wellbeing of our communities who practice culture and traditions,” he added…
    The complaint is the first legal action worldwide brought by low-lying islands against a nation state, said lawyers from environmental campaign group, ClientEarth, which is representing the group. It is also the first climate ligation against Australia on the basis of human rights…
    Australia relies heavily on coal-fired power plants, and the country’s own Climate Change Authority has recommended more ambitious emissions targets…
    https://edition.cnn.com/2019/05/13/australia/torres-strait-islanders-australia-climate-change-intl/index.html

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      TdeF

      “We’re currently seeing the effects of climate change on our islands daily”

      You would have to agree. In Melbourne the temperature can climb 10-20C in a few hours when the sun comes up. A sudden drop when it goes down. We have four seasons in one day, often. All caused by coal, cattle and cars. We need immediate compensation from the Chinese government for Melbourne’s Daily Climate Change.

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      theRealUniverse

      So exactly how are they going to PROVE CO2 causes sea level rise in a court of law?? OR that the sea levels are actually rising?
      They CANT, so they need a fake kangaroo court and fake lawyers, who present fake data, (who will make a fortune) to hear their case.

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    Chris

    In breaking news…to demonstrate what a serious problem co2 ‘emissions’ is posing to the world, George Clooney and Leonado DiCaprio will reduce their own massive co2 footprints by moving into 100% renewable powered, modest 3 bedroom brick veneer houses and demolish all their co2 intensive mansions, yachts and vehicles (so that no one else can generate copious amounts of co2 with them). They will also be forgoing all forms of travel, until co2 ‘emissions’ drop back below acceptable levels.

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    pat

    the old FakeNewsMSM trick – call a pollie a “rock star”, but Bill?

    13 May: news.com.au: Bill Shorten receives rock star welcome at school on NSW Central Coast
    Students screamed his name and tried desperately to get close enough to touch the Opposition leader today. Here, they explain why.
    by Charis Chang
    The Labor leader seemed shocked as dozens of screeching teenage girls surrounded him during a visit to St Joseph’s Catholic College, East Gosford on the NSW Central Coast…
    But the girls were only interested in one person: Bill…

    The excitement started as soon as Mr Shorten entered the school property, with one girl gushing to her friend “he shook my hand”, while another said: “he smiled at me”.
    It was a small sign of things to come.
    As Mr Shorten made his way towards the school’s quadrangle, a group of girls formed and started screaming as he came towards them…
    But there was chaos once Mr Shorten entered the quadrangle, with a huge mob of girls clambering to get close to him…

    News.com.au asked a few of the girls in the crowd why they were so keen to see Mr Shorten.
    ***“I don’t know, I’m just following the crowd,” one girl said, as her friends agreed.
    “I want to get a high-five from a famous person.”
    Another student said she had never met a politician.
    “I want to sort-of ask him about his climate change policy because he’s spoken about it but not about what it actually is and that’s the world we’re going to grow up with.”…

    On climate change, Mr Shorten outlined some of his party’s policies including support for renewables, to get large companies to offset their pollution and support for electric cars…
    https://www.news.com.au/national/federal-election/bill-shorten-receives-rock-star-welcome-at-school-on-nsw-central-coast/news-story/a47ad4e776948c57a5a63e7860acbadf

    13 May: NorthernDailyLeader: Students mob Shorten in rock star welcome
    by Matt Coughlan, AAP
    PIC: Bill Shorten has been mobbed by high school students while campaigning on the NSW Central Coast.
    Billmania spread across the schoolyard with students mobbing the Labor leader as if he was a pop star rather than a politician.
    Unfortunately for Bill Shorten most of them won’t be voting on Saturday…

    Above, more students looked down as he dished out high-fives to a swarm of girls jockeying for a selfie.
    “I touched his hand,” said one girl to her friend, who hit back with: “I got a video.”
    The school is in the electorate of Robertson, which Liberal MP Lucy Wicks holds by a mere 1.1 per cent…
    “Australia’s political adults have yet again failed the future so we’re really interested in taking action on climate change,” he (Shorten) said…
    https://www.northerndailyleader.com.au/story/6119673/students-mob-shorten-in-rock-star-welcome/

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    pat

    even if true, and not manufacture by the CAGW zealots themselves, maybe people are trying to find out if Shorten has finally revealed the cost of his climate policies!

    14 May: AFR: Climate change is the most searched election issue
    by Luke Housego
    ***Climate change was the most searched political issue and ***Bill Shorten topped searches of political leaders, according to an analysis of internet search data over the past two weeks.
    An assessment of all Google searches on politics found climate change was the most searched over the period, according to analysis that ranked the top 22 categories.
    “Some of them were predictable and others were surprising,” University of Queensland political analyst and historian Chris Salisbury said…
    GRAPH
    https://www.afr.com/news/politics/national/climate-change-is-the-most-searched-election-issue-20190512-p51mh4

    of course, why should Shorten reveal anything when the CAGW gate-keepers, including MSM, will cover for him. neither piece below link to TAI’s review:

    14 May: Guardian: Climate modelling used to attack Labor policies a ‘complete outlier’, analysis finds
    Greater action to address climate change is not ‘economy wrecking’, Australia Institute concludes
    by Lisa Cox
    The Australia Institute has published a review comparing the work of Brian Fisher with 19 other reports and and three Treasury models that examined the potential effects of higher climate targets.
    Ten of those reports examined the economy-wide effects of higher targets, while 12 looked at the impacts on the electricity sector, including five reports modelling 100% renewable energy.
    The analysis found none of the reports showed greater action to address climate change was “economy wrecking” and that higher targets had, at most, “a very small impact on GDP growth compared to no action”…

    Fisher’s analysis has been widely criticised for, among other things, assumptions about abatement costs that the Australian National University’s Frank Jotzo has said are implausibly high…
    The Australia Institute found that the 12 reports examining the electricity sector showed higher ambition targets would reduce power costs, or result in “a modest and manageable increase”, including for 100% renewables…
    “The majority of Australians want the country to mobilise in a state of emergency to combat climate change with the same cooperation and commitment as a war effort,” (TAI’s Richie) Merzian said…
    https://www.theguardian.com/australia-news/2019/may/14/climate-modelling-used-to-attack-labor-policies-a-complete-outlier-analysis-finds

    13 May: BrisbaneTimes: Coalition attacking Labor on climate costs with ‘complete outlier’ modelling
    By Nicole Hasham
    According to analysis by the progressive Australia Institute think tank, Dr Fisher’s findings also diverge starkly from comparable modelling.
    The institute analysed 22 other reports, mostly from the past five years. They comprised work in peer-reviewed journals and reports by academics, government agencies and consultants. Authors included the Commonwealth Treasury, CSIRO, the Australian National University, the University of NSW and work commissioned by the federal Climate Change Authority…

    The institute says they all showed Australia would enjoy strong economic growth under higher emissions reduction targets, with a “small to negligible” effect on GDP growth compared to no or low-level action…
    The 12 other reports focused on the electricity sector. They showed that higher emission reduction targets reduced power costs or led to a “modest and manageable increase, including for 100 per cent renewables”, the institute says…
    https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/federal-election-2019/lnp-climate-cost-estimates-wildly-out-of-step-with-22-other-reports-20190513-p51mtl.html?ref=rss&utm_medium=rss&utm_source=rss_feed

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    pat

    hmmm. AFR not convinced Bill’s climate policy will not be costly?

    14 May: AFR: The AFR View: Adani shows Labor climate split that never went away
    During the Rudd-Gillard era it was clear a rift had opened up between Labor’s blue collar working class support and its inner city left-progressive wing.
    Conventional wisdom has it that the Coalition has a big climate change problem…The moderates say the conservatives are troglodytes who are out of touch with the community (and possibly reality). The conservative rejoinder is that the moderates all represent wealthy, inner-city seats and are out of touch with hip-pocket issues of ordinary Australians in swing seats, who don’t want to pay more for energy or anything else for the sake of the climate…

    Yet the Coalition is not the only party riven by climate change trouble. It is easy to forget that climate killed Kevin Rudd, then Julia Gillard partly because ordinary voters – and the unions that represented them – were worried that working people would bear the brunt of an economy with a higher cost base. During the Rudd-Gillard era, it was clear a rift had opened up between its blue collar working class support and the inner-city, left-progressive wing made up of professionals and public service workers in secure, well-paid employment. Tony Abbott, with his own form of big government, Democratic Labor Party-style conservatism ***was able to successfully capitalise on this rift to attract working class voters away from Labor in 2013…

    But the climate change problem – and a structural split between the blue collar workers and the left-progressives – has not gone away. Mr Shorten has merely been able to paper over the cracks while Labor has been in opposition, most recently by refusing to admit how much Labor’s higher emissions reduction target will cost and calling the Prime MInister dishonest for raising it…
    https://www.afr.com/opinion/editorials/adani-shows-labor-climate-split-that-never-went-away-20190513-p51mwc

    ***which was why Abbott had to be destroyed, and why the same mob in the US think Trump needs to be destroyed – because of his popularity among blue-collar workers.

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      pat

      Hobart Mercury includes a StopAdani video; simply calls “Josh Creaser” a man – can’t do a quick online search? (Daiy Telegraph, Adelaide Advertiser, news.com.au also carrying it):

      VIDEO: 51sec: 14 May: Hobart Mercury: Tony Abbott Asked to Apologize Over Climate Change Bet
      Former Australian Prime Minister Tony Abbott was challenged by a voter on May 13 over a bet he made relating to his views on climate change. Abbott was campaigning in his electoral district of Warringah on the day according to his Facebook page. A man identified as ***Josh Creaser asked the former prime minister to apologize for betting one hundred dollars that climate change “is not going to happen over the next ten years”. Creaser, referring to a Guardian article about a bet made between Abbott and a woman over climate change in a Manly cafe, called the bet “insulting” and said that students in Warringah had been asking for an apology. Abbott answered by saying that he is “absolutely confident” that the government is doing the right thing regarding the environment and that “we know” that climates change over time. He continued by listing different time periods such as the “Roman warm period” and the “medieval warm period” and finished by questioning how much mankind contributes to the changes. Credit: Stop Adani via Storyful
      https://www.themercury.com.au/news/national/tony-abbott-asked-to-apologize-over-climate-change-bet/video/4366d52e12cf6d3d28fb8c9fe249f2fe

      ***VIDEO: 1min53sec: BobBrownFoundation: 2016 Young Environmentalist of the Year
      The 2016 Young Environmentalist of the Year, with $2000 prize money, is ***Josh Creaser.
      A 25 year-old born and bred Canberran, Josh is 350.org Australia’s Frontline Projects Coordinator, working on national campaigns to stop the expansion of the coal and gas industry and support a rapid and fair transition to a fossil free energy system…

      “Josh has helped organise some of the most inspirational direct actions of the last few years, involving thousands of people in creative, peaceful protests against the coal and gas giants responsible for dangerous climate change”, Bob Brown said.
      “Young, articulate and with a vision for a clean energy future backed by science and public opinion, campaigners like Josh must be a nightmare for the coal and gas industry”, Bob Brown said…

      Josh studied environmental science and human ecology at the ANU, ***where he discovered the world of campaigning and activism…
      Josh (was) instrumental in organising the visit by the Pacific Climate activists to Parliament in Canberra and the flotilla to the Break Free flotilla that shut down Newcastle coal port in early 2016.
      https://www.bobbrown.org.au/2016_young_environmentalist_of_the_year

      still active in Canberra:

      Alicia Payne and Stop Adani group lock horns over candidate forum
      Canberra Times – 17 April 2019
      The Climate Election Candidates Forum was organised by the inner north Stop Adani group, and the four known candidates for the Canberra electorate were invited.
      Labor candidate for Canberra Alicia Payne has been criticised for her decision … At the event, Josh Creaser who was MC and one of the event’s organisers, told…

      Josh is now also listed as “staff” at Tipping Point, a project of Friends of the Earth Australia.

      20

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    Tdef

    Kimmel’s attack on Pompeo over sea ice shows a typical unaddressed falsehood used by the media. Melting sea ice.

    If all the sea ice melted the water levels would not rise. In fact it happens every year. Where is the disaster? Bill Nye does not debunk such non science. No one does. So it is used to introduce this nonsense.

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  • #
    pat

    read all – aimed at the Unions?

    13 May: AFR: Renewable energy investment surge to buoy construction work: ACIF
    by Michael Bleby, Senior Reporter
    An $18 billion surge in renewable energy infrastructure is part of a stronger-than-expected spend on infrastructure that is offsetting falling residential construction and will limit job losses, the latest six-monthly forecasts from peak body Australian Construction Industry Forum show.

    The boost in new projects under the electricity and pipelines category over the past six months is more than the entire $14 billion worth spent in the sector in FY18 and nearly all of it – 97 per cent – is on infrastructure to support the growing demand for renewable energy, the Australian Construction Market Report shows…

    ElectraNet and Transgrid are in the final stage of approval for a $1.5 billon interconnector between NSW and SA, which also connects with Victoria and will allow greater and more reliable access to renewable energy sources…
    A lot of new transmission capacity is needed to move renewable power from the far-flung locations in which it is being built…
    https://www.afr.com/business/construction/renewable-energy-investment-surge-to-buoy-construction-work-acif-20190513-p51mpv

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    theRealUniverse

    The dumbf*ck moron in the intro talks about scientific fact Yep MORON its a fact that you know precisely NOTHING about scientific data. Theres no such thing as a scientific fact. So stick your climate scam where the sun dont shine.

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  • #
    pat

    The week in energy: the ‘deeply worrying’ slowdown in renewables
    Financial Times – 12 hours ago
    Renewable energy might seem like a very different proposition. It is hard to imagine any incident involving wind or solar power that could undermine public support the way Chernobyl did for nuclear…

    13 US News & World Report: Oil and Gas Investments Surge, Underscoring Slowdown in Climate Efforts
    Global uncertainty over government support for climate action has allowed energy demand to soar and renewables to stagnate – leaving oil, gas and coal to fill the gap.
    By Alan Neuhauser
    The numbers come as more countries stray further from their commitments under the 2016 Paris climate agreement. They also reflect rising uncertainty in global markets over just how far governments will go to address climate change, such as through policies supporting clean energy, energy efficiency measures and similar projects, IEA analysts said.

    It’s a trend “leading operators to focus on their most profitable projects, the ones with shorter lead times which expose them less to long term uncertainties because governments haven’t clearly committed or they have clearly not committed to reaching the Paris agreement,” Tim Gould, head of World Energy Outlook & Investment at IEA, said during a call with reporters ahead of the report’s release…

    The report corroborates other analyses, including by the IEA last week, which have recorded stagnating investments in energy efficiency measures and renewable energy projects…READ ON
    https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2019-05-13/oil-and-gas-investments-surge-underscoring-slowdown-in-climate-efforts

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    TdeF

    I have tried for years to explain radio carbon dating. Here’s another way for non scientists.

    Carbon is the one atom which can be given a date. So we can tell modern carbon from ancient carbon. This radio carbon dating technique is used for archeology and is accurate.

    So dating carbon dioxide in the air tells us that almost no carbon dioxide is from from ancient fossil fuels. So mankind is not responsible for increased CO2 and so not responsible for any warming. That should be the end of the science lesson.

    Further though carbon dioxide like oxygen is very soluble. So fish breathe and almost all Carbon dioxide is dissolved in the oceans, like the CO2 in soda, beer, lemonade, champagne. Warm the ocean surface even a little and carbon dioxide comes out. It is natural and caused by varying sun strength.

    So do warming oceans release more CO2? Duh.

    You have to see the swearing by Bill Nye, George Clooney and others as sure signs that they have abandoned real science. No one believes it. I honestly do not believe the Greens believe it either. It is just a way to political power by scaring people. It’s how communists work, create an enemy, a global enemy. In this case utterly debunked man made Global Warming.

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    • #
      PeterFitzroy

      all your talk about isotopes omits the important bit, plants have a lower C13/C12 ratio than in the atmosphere. If rising atmospheric CO2 comes fossil fuels, the C13/C12 should be falling. Which is what is occuring

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        Bill in Oz

        That assumes that there are no other sources of CO2.
        The biggest store of CO2 is the oceans
        Some arts of the oceans are warming slightly
        And that leads to CO2 coming out of solution.

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          PeterFitzroy

          while the oceans do release a lot of CO2, it is the isotope ratio which is important here. The balance between the oceans and the atmosphere is well described in the carbon cycle, and changes, say to heat, can be calculated. But as I said, it is the change in the isotope ratio which proves that the CO2 increase in the atmosphere is largely down to burning fossil fuel. You would need to explain that change as a marine phenomenon otherwise

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            el gordo

            ‘…it is the isotope ratio which is important here.’

            Its splitting hairs, this is the strong El Nino of 2015-16 and you can see the heat escaping from the Pacific and presumably the release of CO2.

            The Southern Ocean remains a steady sink, so we have equilibrium.

            https://www.ospo.noaa.gov/data/sst/anomaly/2016/anomnight.1.4.2016.gif

            I accept that the bulk of the CO2 in the atmosphere is due to burning fossil fuels.

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              TdeF

              “I accept that the bulk of the CO2 in the atmosphere is due to burning fossil fuels”

              Really? Please explain how you draw this conclusion. It is contradicted by simple measurement of C14, so what is your evidence because it is not what you
              believe, but what is true.

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                el gordo

                A new milestone has just been reached, its industrial CO2.

                https://interestingengineering.com/co2-levels-in-the-atmosphere-reach-another-record-high

                Do you think the increase is natural?

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                TdeF

                Yes, perfectly natural. There is a huge amount of CO2 in the oceans. Warming the surface will produce a lot of CO2. CO2 itself is highly beneficial.

                After all, have you wondered about the Jurassic, how there was so much plant matter as to create oceans of decomposed plants? It was Paradise for animals, dinosaurs and our ancestors. It was warm, steamy and wonderful and our ancestors were four legged scavengers but loving it. As omnivores, we survived.

                It it was not for the fantasy of the Greenhouse effect, what other problem is there with increased CO2? None.

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                Kinky Keith

                Quoted:

                “A new milestone has just been reached, its industrial CO2″.

                ?

                Nobody, not even the Global Warming proponents have denied that human origin CO2 is a quantitatively irrelevant proportion of atmospheric CO2.

                Atmospheric CO2 in turn is a very small, almost inconsequential part of the world’s free CO2, 98% of which is in the oceans and this readily determines the balance.

                On top of this there is No atmospheric greenhouse mechanism involving CO2 and especially there is No back radiation. As Will J says, the only expressed energy from CO2 is at altitude and out to deep space.
                It cools.

                Real science is different from Cloonified science and wrt CO2 requires no action from us to limit it.

                KK

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                el gordo

                Gentlemen we know CO2 is beneficial to the biosphere, but where is the Medieval Warm Period spike in CO2?

                https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/2/26/Law_dome_co2_levels_1000_AD_-_2000_AD.JPG

                The authorities will argue that we need to maintain the precautionary principle because the planet hasn’t been here in 800,000 years.

                Essentially we have to find a proxy which shows Law Dome is wrong.

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                sunsettommy

                Where is the DROP in CO2 during the LIA time frame?

                Meanwhile see this chart in the LINK showing large swings in temperature while CO2 stays flat:

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            AndyG55

            “it is the isotope ratio which is important here”

            No, it is not the least bit important.

            So long as atmospheric CO2 continues to increase, that is all that is important.

            I find it very funny that so-called “scientists on one hand blame warming of peats and permafrosts and increased biological activity as areas warm up, yet still want to blame humans for the majority of the highly beneficial atmospheric CO2 increase.

            Massive cognitive non-functionality, just like you.

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            Bill in Oz

            Please think n this Fitz
            The CO in the ocean is
            Used by plants to make organic bodies
            A host of different marine plants
            Algae, sea weeds, kelps..
            And eventually they all die
            And they release CO2 in dying
            Which is mostly which isotope of oxygen ?

            Think & ponder that one Fitz
            There is an assumption in your logic
            That does not take into account marine plants.

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      • #
        TdeF

        That’s fake science. Even advertised as the ‘Suess effect’ based on supposition and conjecture. C14 is an absolute measure. C13/C12 ratios are nonsense.

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        • #
          TdeF

          C12 and C13 are almost identical. Same chemistry. Same size. A difference of 12 vs 13 in weight only. 99% and 1%. So within a factor of 100 identical in population and almost identical. We are supposed to believe that this results in definable, universal, measureable, reproducible differences in uptake? Sure.

          Compare with C14 which is one in a million and unstable. It vanishes. It is the perfect radioactive tracer. You can measure tiny concentrations very easily and with a half life of 5400 years you can even measure the age of teeth. It does not occur in ancient fossil fuel from 150 million years ago. That is how you can tell absolutely.

          The creation of the C12/C13 story seems opportunistic and intended to confuse, to obfuscate the unequivocal message from C14. So it is marginal and debatable and dubious versus reproducible, universal and absolute.

          Dr. Suess did not have anything to do with C13. However in Wikipedia and the internet generally, C13 is the ‘new’ Suess effect. Utter rubbish, sophistry and misdirection.

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        AndyG55

        WHO CARES if the atmospheric CO2 levels rise.

        Increased atmospheric CO2 is a massive benefit to all life on Earth.

        And if humans are even partly to blame, then that is also GREAT NEWS…

        .. Because with China and many other countries building coal fired power stations, human release of CO2 will continue to increase.

        The whole “percentage human CO2″ is IRRELEVANT, so long as it keeps increasing.

        As you are well aware, there is absolutely zero evidence of any warming by increased atmospheric CO2, or any influence on the global climate whatsoever.

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      • #
        TdeF

        The other unmentioned problem is measurement. As C12 and C13 are both carbon, nearly identical in weight as the only distinction, getting accurate measurements of one versus the other is very difficult and requires mass spectrometry, by definition. Nothing else works.

        Mass spectrometry is not a simple field measurement but requires a sophisticated accelerator. In total contrast C14 is a simple measurement. Getting the proportion of carbon is simple too as 99.999999% is not C14, so total carbon is all you need. As all plant matter is almost totally Carbon, Hydrogen and Oxygen a hand X ray spectrometer would give total C as a proportion of mass. Combining the two measurements would instantly give age with a relatively small margin of error on a geologic time scale.

        You also have the requirement that all plants can select CO2 chemically on mass alone. Given that C12 based CO2 weighs 44amu and C13 based CO2 weighs 45amu, this is a very smart plant which can dramatically select distinguish CO2 accurately on a 2% mass difference. You could throw away the mass spectrometers and use plant spectrometry. Good luck with that smart plant theory. It also has to be true for all plants, not just one or two. Y ou would also have to have consistent selection at all stages of growth of the plant.

        So you are comparing an easy absolute measurement against a theory that plants can accurately and consistently and universally can and do distinguish two otherwise identical molecules which differ by a tiny 2% in weight? The scope for error in this relative measurement is incredible and may explain the alleged phenomenon. C14 measurement against total Carbon is simple and is species independent and universal. It is not dependent on any special as yet unknown mechanism in all plants and at all stages of growth. eYou are measuring the carbon, not the plant biochemistry or filtering behaviour.

        That is why I am very suspicious of the concept that all plants are accurate mass spectrometers which can consistently and accurately and substantially distinguish between the two weights of Carbon in CO2. If they could, what is to say that some plants prefer C12 and some C13, defeating the whole proposition. Unfortunately the proposition plants can and do universally distinguish these molecules is as hard to disprove as it is to prove and in the realm of experimental error like cold fusion.

        To argue that it disproves C14 based radio carbon dating conclusions is a wrong conclusion. It is accurate and proven and simple C14 dating which disproves this most unlikely C12/C13 dating theory. Still, the people who argue that Carbon Dioxide is all man made have to try somehow to discredit Dr. Suess’ conclusions from 1956 as it is conclusive. The CO2 increase is not man made from fossil fuels beyond 1%.

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    theRealUniverse

    ‘How to destroy a state – Committing suicide by edict’
    “Washington State: Clean power goal of zero-carbon electricity by 2045 is now law,” reads the headline. LAW! As far as I’m concerned, Washington State is committing economic suicide.
    iceagenow.info

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    pat

    13 May: EnergyVoice: More onshore wind development ‘not right for England’, Government says
    by David McPhee
    A local veto on onshore wind currently stands in England, whereas in Scotland no such rules govern the industry.
    A BEIS spokeswoman said: “We continue to believe that more large-scale onshore wind is not right for England…

    13 May: RenewableEnergyMag: All The Right Pillars: An interview with Michael Phillips of Dulas (RE consultants)
    by Robin Whitlock
    A UK local authority in Warwickshire recently rejected an energy firm’s attempt to extend the operational life of a solar farm from 25 years to 40 years. This mirrors the controversy in 2017 over the proposed extension to Kirkby Moor wind farm, a debate that is still ongoing…

    PHILLIPS: Life extension on projects is not something I’ve got direct experience of, as I’ve only got experience of repowering. In terms of life extensions, I have dealt with a couple of Irish solar farms where they’ve sought extensions to their planning periods of 25-30 years, but I understand the principles involved and it’s not just a straightforward process of going through your original planning permission, digging out the condition that refers to a 25-year operational period prior to decommissioning and then applying either Section 73 or Section 75 for a variation to that condition. That condition was predicated on the basis of an original conceptual design and built design for the wind farm and a lot of things have changed over the last 15-25 years since those schemes were originally built. There may be some material planning reasons why councils would have concerns, but also they don’t tend to like the Section 73 or Section 75 amendment approach for extending projects…

    Shoehorning wind farms into old development boundaries, particularly with new wind turbines and technology can itself be fairly complex. With much larger turbines, you still need to maintain a standardised spacing between the turbines, which is typically 3 x 5 diameter or 6 x 4 diameter spacing between the turbines. In effect, that takes up quite a considerable portion of your available land area. That leads to greater restrictions on the number of turbines that you can actually deploy within the existing site…

    In addition to that, with much larger turbines, and I am saying with regard to the design and planning aspects of getting these schemes approved by local authorities, you’ve got additional planning issues around collision risk modelling, they have much longer blades that are much higher in the air, which may present a much greater threat to bird movements or bat movements across the site and, because of the precautionary principle that’s at play, typically now you need at least one year’s worth of bird data or sometimes that’s two years worth of bird data, depending on the sensitivity of your site. That has a long lead-in time for projects, for example…

    You’ve got the transport implications, with invisible loads and trying to get 65 metre blades, sometimes longer, through the highways network to a site, we know for example that where repowering and new powering forest areas in Scotland is being considered, there are quite considerable challenges to getting the new modern breed of wind turbines to a site. The cost of highway modifications and amendments sometimes can actually preclude a development going ahead…

    Add then additional amenity issues, with much larger turbines and visual impact, potential noise propagation and what they used to call shadow flicker, but we can call shadowing because, to all intents and purposes, modern wind turbines don’t create a flicker effect. They do create a shadowing effect that is below 1 Hz, which is not therefore a health issue but it is still something in the planning system that you have to deal with…
    In addition to those core planning issues, you also have the complexity of, to all intents and purposes, an onshore moratorium in England…
    https://www.renewableenergymagazine.com/interviews/iha-releases-2019-hydropower-status-report–20190513-1

    13 May: CleanTechnica: “Collapse” Of German Onshore Wind Is “Jeopardizing” German & EU Renewable Targets
    WindEurope spoke out last week regarding reports that there was only 134 megawatts (MW) of new onshore wind capacity installed in Germany during the first quarter of 2019 — an 87% drop as compared to the first quarter of 2018. These figures were reported by German non-profit wind association FA Wind (Fachagentur Windenergie an Land) in late April and were described as a “drastic slump” and a “temporary low point” of a larger decline which has been increasing for a year now.
    According to WindEurope, Germany is likely to install between 1 GW and 2 GW in 2019 — “significantly down on the past five years” through which Germany installed an average of 4.3 GW per year, and further, well below what Germany needs in order for it to meet its 65% renewable electricity target by 2030, and to deliver on its share of the European Union’s 32% renewable energy target…
    “Onshore wind energy in Germany is in deep trouble,” said WindEurope CEO Giles Dickson…

    As Dickson explained, the primary obstacle to onshore wind development is the German permitting process, which used to only take 10 months but can now take over two years for a new project to proceed through the civil service infrastructure…
    https://cleantechnica.com/2019/05/13/collapse-of-german-onshore-wind-is-jeopardizing-german-eu-renewable-targets/

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      Germany’s CO2 emissions haven’t reduced since 2009, so why would more wind turbines reduce emissions?

      10

      • #
        Analitik

        By deindustrialising the region that is foolish enough to try and depend on them as the basis for their grid.

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  • #
    pat

    hmmm!

    Careful what you wish for, Abbott haters by Maurice Newman
    The Australian-15 hours ago
    For some time now, the ABC’s Four Corners has embedded a journalist within independent environmentalist Zali Steggall’s campaign team…

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    • #
      robert rosicka

      Just heard that four corners have been doing a documentary on Steggle and her winning the seat off Abott .
      Might have to shelve this one .

      30

    • #
      toorightmate

      Four Corners would not have to “embed” a journalist in the Steggall team. All ABC journo’s are being welcomed by the Steggall/GetUp/Green/ALP team – DAILY.
      The “beautiful” clips go on ABC Radio and TV with great haste – EVERY DAY.

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    pat

    14 May: SMH: Labor backs away from vocal support for world’s biggest climate fund
    By Nicole Hasham
    Labor has retreated from its unequivocal backing of the world’s biggest climate change fund, suggesting a Shorten government may ditch the foreign aid measure that Pacific leaders deem critical to tackling planetary warming…

    A party spokesman said only that Labor was “committed to boosting international climate engagement”.
    “A Labor government will engage our Pacific neighbours bilaterally and through regional fora such as the Council of Regional Organisations of the Pacific, the Pacific Islands Forum, the Pacific Community and the secretariat of the Pacific Regional Environment Program, to provide leadership, assistance, and advice on climate change issues,” he said.
    “Specific decisions about climate finance and the GCF will be made in government in line with agency and department advice.”…

    The fund has been criticised for a lack of transparency, delaying important decisions and approving or considering controversial projects. However it continues to have broad international support…
    Meanwhile, a group of Torres Strait Islanders on Monday lodged a complaint with the United Nations human rights committee alleging Morrison government inaction on climate change…
    https://www.smh.com.au/federal-election-2019/labor-backs-away-from-vocal-backing-of-world-s-biggest-climate-fund-20190513-p51ms8.html

    behind paywall:

    ALP’s radical policies have barely been scrutinised by Judith Sloan
    The Australian – 16h ago
    Labor’s locker of radical policies has been given a very light go-over by the media…
    Then there is the complete obfuscation by Labor about the cost of its climate change policies involving a 45 per cent emissions reduction target by 2030. That Labor has never been pressured to come up with a figure about the cost of this policy is extraordinary and reflects poorly on parts of the media. Shorten’s glib response that the cost of inaction is higher is gobbledygook. No one believes that Australia can achieve anything on its own when it comes to climate change — just ask the Chief Scientist…
    He may have worried that some curious journalists could ask foreign leaders whether they intend to follow Labor’s 45 per cent target, although these fears surely would have been unfounded…

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  • #
    Carbon500

    I can’t imagine how much lower standards on television can fall having watched the Clooney recording.
    Not very articulate or informed, is he?
    Good at swearing, though.

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    Rocket Rod

    Bill Nye, the fake science guy explains it..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IFgBFYkBZ6E

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      Graeme No.3

      More arson around. What proof/ detail/ information to explain why the Earth will be much warmer in X number of years?
      The Earth (according to climate scientists) was up to 2℃ warmer than now from 8,000 years ago until about 300 A.D. (then then again 960 -1280 A.D.) so why is an unproven claim by him believable?

      I think that Twit belongs on Twitter.

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      TdeF

      The world is seeing the real Bill Nye, a n*sty arrogant dill.

      As an aeronautical engineer who worked for Boeing, what would he know about chemical equilibrium or anything else? You can learn about photosynthesis from google. He joins the ABC’s former Science guy in Robyn Williams in ignorance of chemistry, biology and equilibrium and as someone who agreed the sea could rise 100 metres by 2100? A nut job. The water should already be above the Sydney Habour bridge according to Williams.

      Still being obviously completely wrong for a lifetime is some sort of retirement plan. No wonder they are all swearing.

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    Chris

    This is probably the wrong place to ask this……however the Skeptics Handbook is fantastic but now dated so critics tend to use the date to dismiss it. Would love to find out an updated edition is in the offing? Does anyone know?
    Thanks

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    • #

      Good question. The amazing thing is that there’s not a lot that needs changing. The hot spot still isn’t found, the pause got much longer, the log effect of CO2 is exactly the same, and the ice cores lag is still a lag. The date argument is what they say when they have no proper argument. I see your point. Perhaps I can update the PDF just to acknowledge the last few hot years?
      Jo

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        sunsettommy

        Also include the numerous per decade warming rate failures from the 1990 IPCC report onwards.

        Important because so many warmists are pushing the hottest year on record narrative, which is highly misleading. The RATE of warming is better material to assess what is going on.

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    Peter C

    The latest from Viv Forbes and the Saltbush Club:

    The Election
    by Viv Forbes
    15 May 2019.
    We have not changed our opinion on the best way to vote:
    1. Make sure LNP controls the House of Representatives. Number all squares, put all Greens last and ALP second last. Beware of “Independents” – they may be turncoats like Windsor and Oakshott a while back.
    2. Make sure neither ALP/Greens nor LNP control the Senate. Pick sensible minor parties and give them your first vote. Keep numbering until you get to the LNP so your vote does not expire.
    3. Put Greens dead last on every ballot paper and ALP just above them. On the Senate keep numbering until you reach the LNP and give no votes to ALP/Greens.
    The main aim of Saltbush is to change the climate of public opinion. Politicians are driven by public opinion, which drives voting behaviour. So we need to change public opinion. It only needs a couple of percent of people to switch, and politicians will notice, and trim their sails to the new wind.
    We can only do that if we can communicate subversive ideas as widely as possible among opinion leaders, media and the public. In an attempt to change public opinions we have been releasing (every day) statements designed to dramatise and highlight the stupidity of the climate/energy policies or all major parties.
    Most of them are here: https://saltbushclub.com/w4pl/post-list-summary/
    And here are Saltbush Priorities, which have not changed:
    https://saltbushclub.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/01/saltbush-priorities.pdf
    It would help our campaign if all supporters circulated these links or individual posts as far as possible to your mail lists and on social media. Pls help, time is short. DO IT NOW before the election.
    If you have a web site, a mail list or can post on social media pls contact us and we will also add you to our list to get every new article and statement as it is released so you can help spread it around.

    Viv Forbes

    Sadly he does not give any specific advice.

    Nor does he mention the Australian Conservatives.

    We have candidates standing and support all of the Saltbush Club objectives. So I do not understand his reticence. Please, when you vote, consider the Australian Conservative Party for your {[1] Senate vote.

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      AndyG55

      Voted early. ACP #1 on senate. Be away on Saturday.

      Not much choice in the HOR, safe Labor seat. Put Labor 2nd last, Greens last.

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      Kinky Keith

      Thanks Peter, good advice.

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        Analitik

        I did this on my own accord and it took AGES due to our senate slip having THIRTY parties on it. I did vote slightly differently in that I put the ALP above all the “climate change” and “sustainability” parties but I was determined to have my slip with The Greens dead last.

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    Yes Peter – voted. Put Labor and Greens last. In Senate, Aus Conservatives Numbers 1,2,3.

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    toorightmate

    Refer to Michael Smith News for a promising development.
    The lady who claimed to have been raped by Bill Shorten when she was 16YO now has a barrister representing her.
    Vic Police did not investigate the matter when she reported it a few years back on the basis that “it would only be your word against Bill’s”.
    Hopefully this gets big, big coverage over the next 72 hours. If so, it should be enough to cook the goose.

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    pat

    14 May: TotalCroatia: Beginning of May Coldest on Record, Snow and Bura in Dalmatia
    By Daniela Rogulj
    If you’re in Dalmatia and have said this is the “coldest May of your life”, you’re absolutely right – and thanks to official data measured at the DHMZ Split Marjan station, your claim can be confirmed.
    Namely, Dalmacija Danas reports that the first 13 days of May had an average air temperature of 14.6°C, while the average from 1948 to 2018 was 19.1°C. At the moment, we are experiencing temperatures in Dalmatia 4.5°C cooler than the monthly average, which is an extreme temperature deviation…
    Let’s note that until now, the official coldest May was recorded in 1991 with an average temperature of 15.6°C…

    The sea temperatures are exceptionally low for this part of the year, too, with temperatures ranging from 13°C to 17°C in the Dubrovnik area…
    The cold weather continues throughout the country on Tuesday, especially on the continent where the average air temperature is in the single digits. Velika Duvjakuša on Dinara and Zavižan on Velebit are the coldest in the country, measuring 3 degrees Celsius.
    There was even snow in the higher areas of Dinara and Kamešnica early Tuesday morning…
    https://www.total-croatia-news.com/lifestyle/35891-dalmatia

    14 May: BostonGlobe: Another gray, rainy day is on the way
    By Peter Bailey-Wells and Emily Sweeney
    Welcome to mid-May. You’d be forgiven for thinking it’s March.
    A lingering threat of snow is limited to the upper elevations of New England through midday Tuesday, but forecasters are warning that temperatures in the Boston area may not escape the 40s in what may be a historically chilly day. Some patchy drizzle and wind will accompany that cold air, forecasters expect.

    The National Weather Service is predicting highs in the upper 40s on Tuesday, which would place it among the coldest May 14ths on record. Only five times since 1872 has the high temperature been in the 40s on May 14…
    https://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2019/05/14/another-gray-rainy-day-way/OblBDeqrp8PJIJLYg5wLjO/story.html

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      pat

      Weather: Record Cold Hits the City (This Is May?)
      The New York Times-2 hours ago
      That temperature set a record for being the lowest high temperature of any of any May 13 since the city started keeping track. Before that, the record was 50, set in 1931…

      13 May: SacramentoBeeCalifornia: Sacramento will be 15 degrees below normal. How much will it rain?
      By Michael McGough
      NWS says temperatures will be 10 to 20 degrees below average for mid-May, and some areas could set records for coldest daily high temperatures…

      13 May: DetroitFreePress: Temperatures around 10-15 degrees below normal kick off week, but a warm-up is coming
      by Aleanna Siacon
      Alex Manion, a NWS White Lake Office meteorologist, told the Free Press that Monday’s temperatures are expected to be around 10 to 15 degrees below normal…

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      TdeF

      It’s interesting how good people who disagree with man made Global Warming are attacked as ‘right wing’, ‘populist’, ‘deniers’. The Guardian is behind the times. The current attack on people who say it is all rubbish is just outright abuse. The most important rule is to attack and never discuss anything.

      After all the allegedly man made Global Warming has been stopped for 20 years and no rampant editing of historic temperatures can change that. Only abuse is left, itself a tautology. Always attack the speaker’s character, in this case Lord Monckton.

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        TdeF

        However sometimes the attack on ‘populists’ is reversed. You have to love Italy’s Salvini

        “Populist Italian Interior Minister Matteo Salvini reacted with anger following the latest far-left protests against him on the European election campaign trail, labelling them “fascists.”

        The far-left protesters, many of whom come from the Italian left-wing social centres that are often communist or anarchist, chanted “Fascist! Fascist!” at the Lega leader following a meeting in the northern commune of Settimo Torinese in the city of Turin.

        “You go around Piedmont looking for fascists, but you are the only fascists,” Salvini said to the protesters.

        It’s about time somebody called the violent black shirt thugs of AntiFA Fascists too, like socialists Hitler and Mussolini and the modern Greens. Global Warming, Climate change, uncontrolled invasion level immigration, public assault on Jews and Christians and the massive ripoffs for windmills and solar panels and carbon credits. All part of the Fascist assault on fair democratic society.

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          TdeF

          He also told them to get a job.

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            Kinky Keith

            You got it all there TdeF but that phrase:

            “uncontrolled invasion level immigration” is what shows us the contempt that modern politicians have for the serfs.

            What’s more worrying is that the politicians who carried out this wholesale distortion of European civilisation were elected by the public.
            This suggests that the public has poor judgment or limited intelligence but more likely it reflects the evil in those putting themselves up for leadership roles.
            When leadership becomes as poor as it currently is worldwide we, humanity, are in big trouble and Australia is not immune from It.

            The ease with which millions of dollars was taken to the U.S. – Clinton Foundation? U.N. special fund, MalEx444, the great big barrier reef fund etc, is astounding to me.

            Change in thinking needed by Voters on Saturday.

            KK

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    Despite being a successful and popular actor, George Clooney is also a ‘dumbf***ing idiot’, as he put it himself.

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      Tdef

      Yes, he leaves himself wide open for that. It is the more likely explanation when he piys his skills as an actor against real scientists.

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    Reed Coray

    Is it just me, or does anyone else get the impression George Looney believes he is sophisticated? The manner in which he says things is reminiscent of someone who believes he is mentally superior to just about anyone he talks to, but he grudgingly condescends to communicate with the unwashed so that they may benefit from his wisdom. Where I come from, there’s a saying that aptly applies to people like George Looney: “If you could buy him for what he’s really worth and sell him for what he think’s he’s worth, you’d be a rich man.”

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      Phoenix 44

      His condescension is off the charts, as is his ignorance. Science is not what he thinks, and knowledge does not advance as he thinks. Rather than being rather clever, he sounds like those doctors who endlessly dismissed the evidence, for washing their hands after helping women give birth. They shouted down their opponents too, for over a hundred years, causing tens of thousands of needless deaths.

      “The science” is often wrong and always will be. That’s why we keep testing and retesting it, not shutting down challenges to it.

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    Phoenix 44

    Just off the top of my head I can think of ten hugely important science discoveries that were dismissed by scientists as dumb****ry, often for centuries. Plate tectonics, relativity, atomic subparticles, puerperal fever, quantum mechanics, Earth around the sun, Big Bang, DNA rather than protein based genes, bacteria causing ulcers, atomic fission.

    And hundreds of examples of science being wrong – indeed probably 99% of science before say 1900 was just wrong. You have to be both arrogant and stupid to think that in 100 years or so people won’t look back and say the same thing about our science.

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    oldbrew

    Why is Greenland’s largest glacier growing? GC ought to know.

    BBC: ‘Where previously this was dropping in height by 20m a year, it’s now thickening by 20m a year.’
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-48265217

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