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Don’t throw your vote away. Australian Senate preferences are a wild-card

This election everyone is talking preferences. The Senate is a wild-card and no one is game to say how things will pan out. (Antony Green is scathing about our current system). The preference deals were subject to a major networking gambits with much wheeling and dealing behind the scenes.

Leon Ashby, president of the Climate Sceptics has been working very hard in South Australia, and convincingly makes a case that he has a very good chance. I wish him the best of luck. It would be something to see him beat Sarah Hansen Young of The Greens for the last senate seat position in South Australia. (The Shooters and Fishers Party took out the local Green Senator here in the West Australian State election last March. It happens).

Instead of accepting the preference deals, you may prefer to vote below the line  but it means numbering up to 110 candidates.   (Hints below for foreigners to follow the lingo*) Is it worth the effort? Above the line voting means preferences will flow as per these lists at the links below.  It may be more effort to follow these lists than to number 1 – 110.

Australian Electoral Commission Links

NSW Preferences
Tas preferences
WA Preferences
SA Preferences
VIC Preferences
QLD Preferences
NT Preferences
ACT Preferences

On ABC radio yesterday, it was obvious a lot of people don’t understand the system. So at the risk of saying the obvious, the first choice on the ballot may score a few taxpayer dollars — which you may prefer not to give to a major party. The catch (or you might think “benefit”) is that a party needs to get 4% of the vote to get any funds at all — so if you vote for the micro-party first, they may get nothing. But it is a chance to spread the power away from the majors.

The Climate Realists at Five Dock looked at the climate policies of the NSW senate candidates. Jim Simpson sent me their recommended voting list for the Senate “below the line”. (The climate realists are an amazingly successful social group that came together through this blog three years ago and still meet every Thursday.)

Climate Realists NSW Voting list

  Bernd has a diagram of preference flows for WA.

The Climate Sceptics “No Carbon Tax” Party controversially split their party preferences

Commenter Neville on this site spotted that the Climate Skeptics have split their preference ticket to Labor over Liberal in three of six states. Only in WA, SA and QLD does a 1 above the line for Climate Sceptics mean the Senate ticket ends (potentially) in Lib rather than Labor. In NSW, Vic, and Tas, the Climate Sceptics preferenced Labor before Liberal. Voters ought to be aware. 

Bill Koutalianos of The Climate Skeptics, explains the decision below:.

Yes, we’ve put Libs ahead of Labor in QLD. So that works out to preferencing Labor ahead of the Libs in 3 states and the Libs ahead of Labor in 3 states.

Whilst we gravitate to the Libs on most policy areas, on the issue that’s most important to us, i.e. the climate deceit, the Libs are equally as complicit as Labor in deceiving the public and hence worthy of an equal amount of respect.

Whilst we had originally anticipated preferencing the Libs ahead of Labor, they have since had the gall to back the Kyoto 2 Protocol & apparently with some enthusiasm. Greg Hunt at his Sydney Institute speech of 30th May 2013 spoke approvingly of a ‘market mechanism’. What do you think he might be talking about?

We all know the sceptics’ case has become so much more compelling of late, so how much longer should we wait for the Libs to come clean on the climate issue? Should climate sceptics be satisfied with the Coalition’s Direct Action Plan because it might save a few dollars over Labor’s carbon tax/ETS? Or do we want to expose this scam once and for all?

The Libs have been marketing themselves as the ‘No Carbon Tax’ party since 1st December 2009 & where has it got us? I remember that day well and I was happy for my opponent in the Bradfield by-election to adopt my 3 word slogan, but as it turned out, it apparently means something completely different to the Libs.

By voting below the line you’re free to rectify any of our misdemeanors and mishaps and preference one set of fraudsters and liars over another, should you so desire. Please help support the No Carbon Tax Climate Sceptics Party with your first preference.

—————————————-

*Preferential voting — “What?” — it means voters have to number every candidate “below the line” or take the shortcut option “above the line” — where they choose one party and accept that party’s preference list as published at the Australian Electoral Commission (see link above). If your number 1 choice is knocked out, your vote moves to your number 2 choice and so on, down the list. Ultimately, unless a minor party wins the spot, your preference will end up with one of the two big parties, so even if Labor is your 96th choice, they may end up with your vote — sometimes it matters whether the liberal candidate is #95 or #97. Sometimes it can take days to shuffle the piles of ballots to decide the winner; usually it works faster somehow, and is not the mess it sounds like.

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198 comments to Don’t throw your vote away. Australian Senate preferences are a wild-card

  • #
    Kevin Lohse

    I never realised that every Aussie was a qualified psephologist! The strength of your system appears to be that all shades of opinion get an airing , it’s just that at this time 2 parties with similar agendas control the votes. I’m still quietly rooting for the Libs though, as their policies are more likely to benefit my son and grandson than the other shambles.

    131

  • #
    Bob Malloy

    Over the past few elections I have taken the time to check every party’s policies on all the matters that concern me, then numbered every box below the line, 1 to 100 and what ever. It’s taken more time than I care to remember,not to mention the time it takes to fill in all the boxes.

    This year I have checked where different party’s are distributing there preferences, found one I broadly agree with and will be voting above the line. I don’t really agree with the above the line voting system, as it makes it too easy for the lazy and unconcerned. but C’est la vie.

    81

    • #
      John Brookes

      Its easy for me. Greens above the line. They preference the ALP before the Libs – and none of the minor parties on WA will get in. Easy.

      376

      • #

        So you want the Australian Sports Party to get a seat by being a preferences bucket.

        That’s the party whose policy (paraphrased) is “Sport is good. OK?”

        They say “Our philosophy is to ensure simplicity for Australians …”

        I personally find that quite frightening. I’ve been to a place where life was simple for its citizens. It was called “East Germany”; the German Democratic Republic.

        211

      • #
        Bob Malloy

        geez, John, I leave the page for a short time, when i return not only have you added a comment, but you have achieved what must rate as one of the fastest 5 thumbs down on the blog, well done.

        212

        • #
          MemoryVault

          .
          That’s our John.
          He’s a real red thumbs magnet.

          It’s sort of like sex appeal, but opposite.

          212

          • #
            Angry

            Maybe he is a member of the Sex Party……

            40

            • #
              Bulldust

              Is Rise Up Australia related to the Sex Party?

              150

              • #
                Rereke Whakaaro

                You really don’t want to know.

                20

              • #
                ColdinOz

                No but they are so far to the left that they might just fall off the planet.

                20

              • #
                Angry

                NO!

                The Rise Up Australia Party has many great pro Australian policies.

                People need to try and think for themselves for a change instead of being sheeple….

                26 Policy Principles – Rise Up Australia Party

                http://riseupaustraliaparty.com/?page_id=18

                20

              • #
                Robert JM

                Your confusing Rise up australia with get up australia!
                RUAP seems to be a cross between the Nationals and libertarians with a more secular view than Katars party. They are also anti AGW!
                From the FAQ on their web site.

                Q: Global warming – What stance do you have regarding Global Warming and climate change?
                A: We do not acknowledge global warming and climate change (although devastating), as a reality in contemporary times, but rather a shadow governmental agenda to bring in taxes and enslave societies. We specifically acknowledge natural seasonal and generational climatic fluctuations as normality. For example, we have seen cyclical ice-melts, climatic changes in temperature, seasonal flooding which are all a normal part of living in the Earth’s dynamic ecosystems and various geographic locations. We do not support a notion of anthropogenic climate change (human induced). We do not support climatic tax and will work to completely abolish this tax. We also want to rid the media with wasted climate change/ global warming advertisement material which is both fear mongering and non-productive to our society. We take a stance in line with Lord Monckton who shows vast evidence of falsified climatic warming data, charts and documentation. All of which completely nullify any logical or reasonable evidence for such climatic concerns. In fact they show the trend of global cooling in recent times. Note: Opposing climate change and global warming doctrine does NOT mean we will not work tirelessly to conserve our environment (flora and fauna).

                70

              • #
                Robert JM

                That Being said RUAP are still pro christian, pro life and anti gay.
                Kind of a weird combination!

                42

              • #
                Rereke Whakaaro

                I came out as a lesbian as soon as I had come to terms with the way I felt about women, as opposed to men.

                20

            • #
              Angry

              What the hell is wrong with “pro christian, pro life and anti gay”??????

              71

              • #
                Rod Stuart

                My sentiments exactly.
                ‘Anti-gay’ being used to define a stand against ‘gay marriage’.
                That is one of the most obvious red herrings.
                Marriage is a construct of the major religions in the world.
                It has absolutely nothing whatever to do with politics or government.
                The government treats couples in co-habitation as married whether the couple is the same sex or the same species, in order to be better able to steal assets from said couple.
                If your religion doesn’t agree to marry you to whatever, then find another religion. It’s that simple.

                50

      • #

        The Greens will not get an absolute quota (16%) at first count in any State, and the way Prefs are flowing, they will be hard pressed to gain a single quota in any State after preferences are distributed.

        Tony.

        240

        • #
          Rohan

          I hope you’re right Tony.

          121

          • #
            Graeme No.3

            (Sarah hyphen What’s her name) the green senator from SA, is reported as having spent over $1 million on political advertising, and is more than likely to lose.

            It would rub salt into her wounds if the No Carbon Tax-Climate Sceptics party were her replacement.

            101

            • #
              Andrew

              Where did Hyphen-Yuk get that kind of money? Oh right – Big Green. The party’s owner is one of Oz’s richest men (and a meeja owner). Puts their opposition to free speech right into context.

              71

        • #
          Angry

          PUT THE COMMUNIST GREENS LAST……….

          41

        • #
          ColdinOz

          That’s great news Tony. Praying you are right.

          20

      • #
        Safetyguy66

        Ok you deserve your red thumbs for that. Why would an intelligent man such as yourself want to vote for a party of drugged up hippies led by a senile old granny who cant even knit?

        https://docs.google.com/file/d/0BxUZq-oWGcY2UVNyaXJMVEgzSkU/edit?usp=sharing

        40

    • #
      Bulldust

      Bob – I have been suggesting (on the ABC for example) that a third option should exist. Senate places are pretty much determined by party, so why can’t we simply number the parties in order of preference above the line? This would result in the party preference being utilised per the ballot and then the candidate order determined by the party. This means substantially less numbering, less informals, and more control over your preferences. Therefore an improvement over the current simple or painful system options.

      Seems to me this would be the preferred option for a lot of informed voters that don’t want to risk a potentially informal vote by accidently missing a number or duplicating in the full-below-the-line senate system.

      100

      • #

        It’d be even easier if one were allowed to place up to six (6) crosses (X) against the candisdates that one wants to sit (at a half-senate election) and have “none of the other buggers” benefit from the vote.

        That’s preferential: I prefer not to have any of the others!

        100

        • #

          I’ve lodged the eviction notices now.

          Completing the second one, in my break from numbering forwards to numbering backwards from the “most-despicable”, I noticed that the pencil could have used resharpening, but continued on, even more boldly.

          00

      • #

        While doing my shift at the local polling place we discussed just that solution for a problem raised by a number of voters. They wanted to direct their preferences but not wear out two pencils and a pair of glasses doing it. It would be so simple to simply vote by party above the line. It would also speed up the counting process. The AEC needs an overhaul and maybe Bronwyn Bishop will have the will to do it.

        30

  • #
    MemoryVault

    Whilst we gravitate to the Libs on most policy areas, on the issue that’s most important to us, i.e. the climate deceit, the Libs are equally as complicit as Labor in deceiving the public and hence worthy of an equal amount of respect.

    There, fixed it for you, Bill.

    101

    • #
      Bulldust

      I think Bill doesn’t understand the difference between core and non-core promises. The Libs (under Tony) are clearly not going to rush into any climate change related expenditure. They will discover the Budget is in much worse shape than they ecpected and the razor will come out. Climate initiatives will be amongst the first to go, or I will be very, very, very …. very surprised.

      180

      • #
        MemoryVault

        .
        One thing I continue to admire, even though it is beyond my comprehension, is the eternal optimism of Coalition voters. The accursed socialist government, which is supposedly the supporter of all things climate change, scrapped the position of “Minister for Climate Change” several months ago. But the Coalition, so-called saviours of Australia from the dreaded scourge of all things climate change, still has a “Shadow” Minister for Climate Change. Go figure.

        And here we are, on the very eve of an election. For the past week the accursed socialist government, supporters of all things climate change, have been avoiding the subject like the plague. Which is relatively easy to do, if you don’t even have a spokesman – Minister – for it.

        Over the same week the Coalition Shadow Minister for Climate Change – Greg Hunt – Green Saviour of the Planet – has got his face in front of every microphone he possibly can, to brag about his “G4 plan***”, which he plans to start implementing as soon as the Coalition is sworn into government.

        .
        *** For those of you who have managed to miss it, Greg Hunt – future Minister for Climate Change in a government we’re supposed to believe doesn’t even believe in it, sees himself forming, and being the chair of, a new grouping of nations – the G4 – aka The Group of Four – aka the EU, the USA, India and China, to thrash out a new GLOBAL emissions trading scheme, to save the planet from dreaded threat of climate change.

        .
        It’s truly hard to know who to feel most sorry for.
        All those poor bastards who vote Labor tomorrow and wake up Sunday to discover they were dudded and backed a loser.
        Or all those poor bastards who vote Coalition tomorrow and wake up in six months to discover they were dudded and backed a loser.

        105

        • #

          Sunday would be a nice day for Greg Hunt to have an epiphany.

          140

        • #
          Dave

          MV,

          Don’t believe everything anything the ALP tell you.

          “scrapped the position of “Minister for Climate Change” several months ago.”

          But Climate Change Minister Mark Butler 3 days ago on the ABC?

          Plus the Hon Mark Butler is listed as
          1. Minister of Climate Change.
          2. Minister of Environment, Heritage and Water.

          The ALP has a minister of Climate Change right now, but very shortly MV there will be no Minister of Climate Change. Hopefully Greg Hunt is also gone to the back bench at the very least.

          130

          • #
            MemoryVault

            .
            Playing semantics is not debating, Dave.

            KRudd may have given the fancy title of “Minister for Climate Change” to Mark Butler for the sake of the election, and the ABC and others may like to repeat it, but the truth is the current government officially NO LONGER HAS a “Department of Climate Change”, and therefore, officially, NO LONGER HAS an official “Minister for Climate Change”.

            After KRudd’s last UNsuccessful challenge to Gillard for the PM job, Gillard disbanded the Department of Climate Change, discharged the Minister (Greg Combet) and rolled the rump of the department into the new, super-department, The Department of Industry, Innovation, Climate Change, Science , Research, and Tertiary Education, under captainship of her former lover and rap artist, then Minister for Almost Everything, Craig Emerson.

            The Department of Climate Change continues to officially not exist under the current government, except as a rump sub-department. Mark Butler’s title of “Minister for Climate Change” (Minister for a non-existent department) exists only as an election ploy.

            On the other hand, Greg Hunt, SHADOW Minister for Climate Change, has been one of the most vocal, and dominant voices in this election campaign.

            .
            You people are in for a rude awakening.

            62

            • #
              Chris M

              Tiresome as usual MV. Still stuck in your 1980s Ray Martin Show view of our fine land. This is the dawn of a new era of benign pragmatism in Australian government, already plain for all to see. Tony Abbott runs the show, not Greg Hunt. Get up to date and enjoy the fresh spring breeze!

              60

            • #
              farmerbraun

              “benign pragmatism” “the dawn of a new era”
              Whoa! Touching!

              I’ll give that a couple of months , possibly only weeks , to be shown for what it is.

              41

              • #
                MemoryVault

                Farmerbraun,

                “benign pragmatism” = The Fraser Years, Mark II
                “the dawn of a new era” = Rearranging the deckchairs on the Titanic – again.

                Hope the translation helps.

                01

        • #
          Peter Miller

          In the UK, there is a similar problem.

          Most Conservative Party supporters are realistic and sceptic. Most Labour Party supporters find the subject of climate to complex to have an opinion and most Liberal Democrat Party supporters are rabidly green and alarmist.

          Unfortunately, the Conservative Prime Minister David Cameron is also a rabid greenie and alarmist, which is one of the reasons the UK has one of the most insane energy policies on the planet.

          So, it is the same as in Australia, you vote for the lesser of two evils. Then there is the matter of competence, which is something spread woefully thin amongst most political parties, but especially thin among those of the left and the greenies.

          The Coalition appears to be the lesser of two evils in terms of competence and climate policies. I still don’t understand why any country needs the luxury of an expensive climate policy, something which is as useless as it is pointless.

          160

          • #
            Andrew

            I think the theory of Direct Action is to do stuff that carries theoretical possibility of CO2 abatement but stands on its own as economic policy. An example: LED street lights. If the payback period is 3 years, then there’s a 33% ROI (assuming they require no more maintenance than other lights). The filthy green-leaning voters see it in tonnes of carbon (sic) but that’s irrelevant to the exercise. I’m hoping the first Direct Action is a $200m subsidy for coal power stations to replace with new Chinese turbines that produce 30% less CO2.

            90

            • #
              Robert JM

              Street lights help take up base load during off peak power generation. LED lights would be a negative in this regard. Of course I’m all in favour of using something with an improved life cycle and cheaper replacement cost if that was the case.

              10

            • #

              Hmm!

              Just wondering here.

              Why would you replace what is without doubt the most efficient method of street lighting, Sodium Vapor, (you know, those orange street lights that are everywhere) with a lesser intensity LED lighting.

              As to street lighting taking up Base Load, that’s a furphy. Tell me, what local government entity would even risk turning off street lighting ….. anywhere.

              Tony.

              41

              • #

                They turned off half the street lights in WA in order to “save the planet”.

                Now, when one of the remaining street lights fails on a freeway, one has to often use high beam lights to see properly instead of getting by on low beam.

                The new street lamp in front of my house is so bright that I’ve got to get new curtains to get a good night’s sleep in the front bedroom. Of I get a chair and read a paper on the front porch, using the light from the street lamp.

                Maybe I could mow the front lawn by it. :-)

                It’s not a sodium vapour lamp now; there’s too much white light. One of the advantages of the sodium vapour lights is that they don’t wreck one’s night-vision sensitivity as badly as white light. That means that one is able to see better when moving out of the a primary area of illumination.

                30

              • #

                What I find utterly amazing is that tried and true methods of lighting that have been in effective operation for decades are discarded because of some perceived green agenda.

                Turning off half the street lights to save the Planet. What a joke.

                Tony.

                40

              • #
                Peter Miller

                Tony

                In Spain, it is common practice in some towns and cities.

                00

        • #
          farmerbraun

          Is this word “dudded” a new entry in the Strine Deekshinree?

          21

        • #
          Rereke Whakaaro

          … the G4 – aka The Group of Four – aka the EU, the USA, India and China

          Point of order, Madam Speaker.

          Greg Hunt, an Australian, could not be the chair of the G4, unless it was the G5, or he gained citizenship of the EU, US, India, or China.

          50

      • #
        Annie

        I hope you are right.

        20

  • #
    Angry

    A great summary of the last 6 years of HELL……

    http://www.2gb.com/audioplayer/13566#.UioZ0rXPvmI

    CLEAN UP AUSTRALIA DAY 7TH SEPTEMBER !!!

    61

    • #
      Winston

      When I reflect on the last 6 years, I think the watershed defining moment for me (among many) that set the current government apart from merely incompetent predecessors was when Gillard announced asylum seekers would be processed in East Timor, with full knowledge that such an arrangement had not only failed to have been agreed to, but actually had not even been discussed. This showed such an utter disdain for the sovereignty of East Timor as a nation, but also showed complete contempt for its leaders and its people. I firmly believe the election tomorrow will be far more demoralising and comprehensive than the polls suggest, and the hubris and narcissism of Rudd will deliver him a comeuppance brimming full and running over. After such a dysfunctional and incompetent display in government (especially when Labor had all six state governments as well- talk about missed opportunities), could they expect anything else?

      I believe most of the Australian public is far more sophisticated and knowledgeable than one would believe if reading the Age or the SMH would suggest. Most mainstream media sources actively covered up and ran interference for the glaring inadequacies of the current government until the writing was on the wall, and then miraculously switched sides at the eleventh hour to falsely appear impartial. I noted the change in Laurie Oakes for example, now openly acknowledging that Rudd’s campaign was “hopeless” and the coalition now deserved to win office, after years of saying Gillard was a great leader with great policies who just couldn’t get “traction” in the electorate due to that nasty misogynistic Abbott. Tony Jones also suddenly calling Kevin Rudd to task (albeit in the mildest and meekest possible way), twice if you can believe it, on Q&A over his “70 Billion dollar black hole” lie, which in the true sociopathic fashion of the inveterate liar that he no doubt is, Rudd proceeded to repeat anyway.

      Abbott as leader of the nation is a far more palatable option than Turnbull would have been for any number of reasons, in spite of Malcolm’s apparent affable nature and undoubted personal charm. Turnbull is of course forever tarnished and sullied by his association with Goldman-Sachs, but also his sycophantic and unquestioning “me-tooism” about climate change and his zeal to introduce a banker scam carbon currency to the detriment of his fellow countrymen’s livelihoods, which made him a liability we could well do without (and led to his demise, in no small measure due to skeptics on this blog and the efforts of Jo and others). Abbott OTOH is very community minded, is family-oriented and moral/ethics based in his philosophy, which is in stark contrast to many of his adversaries, who would happily dance on the mass graves of their countrymen if they could remain in power for another term.

      In spite of some moments of anger and aggro noted in some of my posts in the past, I am generally not noted for actually “hating” anyone. I’m a lifelong pacifist who has dedicated himself to socialised Medicine, even in service to a system that I believe will ultimately collapse under its own weight, more’s the pity. However, I must say I actively despise these Labor government creatures, that have pretended to govern us these last 6 years, with every fibre of my being. They have been vicious, nasty, self-serving and manipulative, right from Rudd’s very first thought bubble policy in 2007 (which he later backflipped due to howls of protest) of cancelling the carer benefit for those with disabled children (remember that all you NDIS believers out there!), to then falsely claiming saving us from the GFC (which he could have done by doing precisely nothing) by spraying tax payers money around in an unprecedented orgy of spending, right the way through to the latest dishonest grab bag of ad hoc policies, many on the never never mind you, but mainly designed to poison the fiscal well for any incoming opponent to make governing responsibly difficult (and the wellbeing of the country be damned) to maximise their chances of returning to power in 2016 or 2019.

      Tomorrow is a day of reckoning, and I plan to celebrate by getting right royally stonkered.

      331

  • #
    Angry

    A good read…..

    Australian Electoral Commission to look into claims Kevin Rudd election campaign material is fake after voters deny giving quotes

    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/australian-electoral-commission-to-look-into-claims-kevin-rudd-election-campaign-material-is-fake-after-voters-deny-giving-quotes/story-fnihsrf2-1226712703173

    70

  • #
    Angry

    LABOR’S CARBON DIOXIDE TAX AND FUEL……..A MUST READ !!

    AUSTRALIANS SHOULD BE AWARE THAT UNLESS THIS TAX IS REPEALED BY A NEW FEDERAL GOVERNMENT IT WILL BE APPLIED TO FUEL AS FROM 1ST JULY 2014 (CURRENTLY FUEL IS EXEMPT).

    THIS WILL INCREASE TRANSPORT COSTS AND WILL OF COURSE BE PASSED ON TO CONSUMERS WITH HIGHER PRICES FOR FOOD AND OTHER GOODS.

    SOMETHING TO CONSIDE WHEN VOTING IN THE FEDERAL ELECTION ON 7TH SEPTEMBER.

    http://www.truck.net.au/public/2013-election-carbon-tax-truck-fuel

    61

  • #
    Angry

    The many hands of PM Kevin Rudd in gif form

    WHAT A BULLSHIT ARTIST !

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2013-08-30/the-many-hands-of-rudd-gifs/4924468

    41

  • #
    Angry

    Rudd hits Salvos with a $4 million tax hike….WTF !!

    WHAT A DESPICABLE FEDERAL ALP/GREENS GOVERNMENT THIS IS !!

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/rudd_hits_salvos_with_a_4_million_tax_hike/

    I don’t think Kevin Rudd and Chris Bowen thought through their tax grab:
    THE Salvation Army is facing a $4 million hit – the equivalent of nearly half the money raised by Red Shield Appeal door knockers – because of the Rudd Government’s controversial Fringe Benefits Tax changes.
    The charity has warned its frontline services will be affected by the tax whack, which is set to see its costs in NSW and Queensland spiral by $1.5 million and $2.5 million across Victoria, South Australia, West Australia, Tasmania and Northern Territory.
    Many other leading charities would be hit with an extra tax bill of up to a half a million dollars, News Corp has learned…
    Dr Bruce Redman, a spokesman for the Salvation Army’s southern region, confirmed to News Corp the $4 million estimate was accurate and said: “If this goes ahead we’ll be spending a significant amount of money on FBT which means less money is available for our frontline services.”

    111

    • #
      Tim

      Each year two million Australians rely on food relief – around half of them are children. That’s one in every ten Australians in need.

      Any government that reduces charities’ ability to help these people is nothing less than despicable.

      The ALP ‘back-of-the-envelope-thought bubbles’ can actually destroy lives.

      00

  • #
    OzWizard

    Jo,

    Where you have 110 possible Senate candidates, there is nothing in the electoral act to prevent you from numbering as follows:

    1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7….7, 7, 7, 7.

    The following is the text of s.239(1)(b) regarding the requirement for preferential voting “below the line” in the Senate

    “239.(1)(b)… a person shall mark his or her vote on the ballot paper by:… writing the numbers 2, 3, 4 (and so on, as the case requires) in the squares opposite the names of all the remaining candidates so as to indicate the order of the person’s preference for them.”

    The wording for the House of Reps (S.240) is different, in that it requires

    240.(2) The numbers referred to in paragraph (1)(b) are to be consecutive numbers, without the repetition of any number.

    So, save yourself some time and ‘go below’ for the Senate and use YOUR OWN prefereence list.

    [You can download the Electoral Act from the Austlii website.]

    20

    • #

      Mind you, if a scrutineer is not familiar with the finer points of constitutional law I expect 99% of votes so numbered to be tossed in the bin. I wouldn’t want to rely on their knowledge of absent subclauses…

      You would think though that we ought have the freedom to number the first 10 and still have those counted. Not so.

      90

      • #

        I’m doing some scrutineering work tomorrow in the seat of Lilley (Former treasurers seat), there always is many scrutineers. Plus, the informal pile is always given a once over before being tallied.

        30

      • #
        OzWizard

        Scrutineers must surely have to read the only 2 sections of the Act relevant to their function? They aren’t difficult to understand.

        20

        • #
          Dave

          OzWizard,

          You said this as the first example:
          1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 7, 7, 7, 7….7, 7, 7, 7.

          But what about:
          1, 2, 2, 2, 2, 2, etc

          And then something invalid like:
          1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, 1, etc which doesn’t indicate any voting preference?

          It also states “so as to indicate the order of the person’s preference”

          Surely this indicates sequential numbering?

          Just asking, because it will save me time tomorrow.

          10

    • #
      Angry

      I strongly suspect, as Jo has already mentioned, that so marking the preferences with duplicate numbers would be classed as invalid by the majority of election staff…….

      30

    • #

      According to Antony Green of the ABC, even the spoilt ones will eventually be counted.

      The instructions say you must fill in every square, but the savings provision of the act require that only 90% of the squares be filled in, and will allow a maximum of three sequencing errors. A sequencing error is any doubling up of numbers and any break in the number sequence.

      If you want to be ultra safe, fill in below the line and the fill in one of the above the line squares. The below the line vote takes priority, but if proves to be informal, the ballot paper will revert to the above the line option.

      40

      • #
        Debbie

        Yes Bernd,
        That’s the best way to go.
        Take the time to fill in the whole paper according to your own preference but also put a 1 above the line to cover the possibilty that you may have inadvertently messed up & therefore have your vote deemed ‘informal’.
        Your vote below the line takes priority.

        00

  • #

    While most Americans think Australia is a great place to go skiing, some are aware of us as our own people, and some are actually aware that we are indeed having an election this weekend.

    Alan Caruba, the respected blogger from New Jersey, is aware and even devoted his daily Post to our election.

    Will Australians Vote to End the Carbon Tax?

    Tony.

    200

    • #
      Bob Malloy

      Tony,your comment at Alans blog is worth a thumbs up, enjoy ;-)

      60

    • #
      DavidH

      “most Americans think Australia is a great place to go skiing”

      In the same way that unwitting tourists in Austria ask where all the kangaroos are?

      50

    • #
      Apoxonbothyourhouses

      Clearly Tony is not a skier nor has he talked to any US skiers. To suggest that, compared to US ski fields, Oz is a great place to ski is akin to suggesting the Sahara is great for scuba diving.

      10

    • #

      bothhouses,

      I, umm, guess you didn’t see the subtle point.

      When asked what place in Australia they would most want to visit, some replied ….. Innsbruck!

      Tony.

      10

      • #
        RoHa

        I have long suspected that one of the reasons Howard joined the Americans and sent Australian troops to Afghanistan was an attempt to make sure that Americans could distinguish between Australian and Afghanistan. Both start with “A”, so there was a risk of us being bombed by mistake.

        40

        • #
          MemoryVault

          .
          American knowledge of geography has always been a worry, as this clip shows.
          All good, but the the fun really starts at the 2.00 minute mark when Yanks who want to bomb Iran are asked to locate it on a map.

          10

          • #

            Now that is scary.

            All of it!

            Tony.

            30

          • #
            Mark D.

            I won’t watch the video and I will attest to how stupid people appear when they are street interviewed. There is no street where I live that people would be so stupid. Maybe it is the winter cold or maybe it is the northern European heritage but around here, we just ain’t that stupid.

            I just hope that if you Aussies get really uppity you can’t find Boreal forests and would be terribly afraid of the poisonous and horribly scary creatures that are waiting to consume anything from the Southern hemisphere.

            If you ever do get that uppity, go for the cities.

            30

          • #
            Brian G Valentine

            Iran… lemme see, that’s somethin’ like 27 deg.S latitude, 144 E longitude, ain’t that right?

            How’m I doin’ so far

            00

  • #
    handjive

    In an effort to be fair, here is a an analysis of how to vote if your GangGreen by UN-IPCC cheerleader scientists WWF, Climate institute, University of Melbourne, 100% renewable, Australian Conservation Foundation, Environment Victoria, Climate Health Alliance, Lock The Gate, Victorian Wind Alliance.

    Alternatively, check who to number last.

    61

    • #
      llew Jones

      Have held the position that Abbott is a thorough going ACC skeptic for some time. When questioned this week Turnbull, in effect said, Tony is an intelligent climate change skeptic but not an extremist like Monckton.

      My guess is that he is closer to Lord Monckton than Turnbull imagines.

      My suggestion is that Abbott has done a lot for the skeptic’s cause during this election campaign. His constant repeating of the mantra “I will scrap the carbon tax” and equating an ETS to a carbon tax and still getting such support from the electorate is a powerful indication that he could, given he becomes PM, lead our country out of the ACC nonsense that poses as science.

      Hunt is a bit of a problem but a move to a different portfolio may neutralise his influence. Time will tell.

      110

      • #
        Bob Malloy

        Hunt is a bit of a problem but a move to a different portfolio may neutralise his influence. Time will tell.

        The problem in our times is that while many greens don’t hide their views. Too many get into the media, science institutions, lobby groups and the full range of the political spectrum, where the average punter misses there true colour, therefore failing to see their true intent. Hunt fits squarely in this box.

        80

      • #
        Len

        Hunt also has the Heritage Portfolio. Hopefully he won’t do any damage there.

        50

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          Abbott has to reduce the size of the shadow Cabinet because there aren’t enough Ministries for all, and as there is no Department of Climate Change (MemoryVault – September 6, 2013 at 10:48 pm) then Greg Hunt might be the one without a chair when the music stops.

          90

          • #

            In the long run, cabinet should only have the “senior” Ministers in it anyway. Members assisting Ministers in their portoflios don’t need to be “in Cabinet” as such, but may from time to time accompany the Minister when there are matters relating to the responsibilities delegated to the Member.

            A fleeting throught … the Pm only needs 3 Ministers; one for The Past, one for The Present and one for The Future. It’d make for tense Cabinet discussions. :-)

            20

      • #
        Manfred

        …but not an extremist like Monckton

        Why is it that rationalists together with those that seek empirical evidence are labelled ‘extreme’? There is nothing ‘extreme’ about Monckton, save his prodigious tenacity, grasp of the issue and its science, all nicely encased by an impressive intellect and education.

        One sees the same label applied to those that disagree with homeopathy, reflexology or even acupuncture. Climate alarmism much like homeopathy is politically correct, unfalsifiable nonsense. the hall mark of political correctness is the equality of value accorded to any view, irrespective of its intrinsic merit. Disagreement per se with an opinion is the crime. Strong, empirically based disagreement is regarded as ‘extreme’.

        Who knows what Abbott really, truly, personally thinks about anything? What you hear will always be politically tempered. It’s the man’s job. All positions are politically filtered to appeal to the greatest number.

        A little less relativism I say.

        50

  • #
    Michael

    I did some voting counting with Western Australian Electoral Commission and its totally disorganized put together at the last minute- no reason to expect the AEC would be any different- apparently these morons don’t expect there to be an election so do no preparation. We counted votes in hideous noisy maritime warehouse and they were still working out the vote counting procedure as we were doing it. They are just crooks really- did the dodgy on me.

    41

  • #
    Bulldust

    In WA the Climate Sceptic party put Socialist ahead of Lib or Labor … seriously WTF???? They lost all my respect with that. Just another cannot-be-taken-seriously micro party.

    100

    • #
      Apoxonbothyourhouses

      My views exactly. Following a blog on Jo’s site on the same subject they were courteous enough to email me direct asking me to reconsider. But no, if they CHOOSE to place their preferences like that they don’t get my vote.

      10

  • #
    realist

    According to this item at Catallaxy, Gillard was expected to win 49 seat. And according to some, Rudd would win 51; only 2 more. So that’s the benchmark for Rudd. All the pain of knifing Gillard (a record of a party knifing two PM’s in one term of government?) for (just) two more seats. But what if he does worse than the “benchmark”, and Labor win much less?

    The way Rudd has “run” his utterly shambolic, dreaming up ideas on the run (shifting our navy from deep water Garden Island to the mudflats of Brisbane has to take first prize for his best thought bubble), negative campaign (“we won’t talk about all our failings just instill fear for a what if Abbott will do”), one has to question is this the “real Kevin”, after all?

    As a Machiavellian on steroids, was this Rudd’s hidden agenda of inflicting his version of “Montezuma’s Revenge” on Gillard, the Labor party and the faceless trade union powerbrokers, not the least being Shorten, the severely tarnished opposition leader in waiting after Saturday night?

    Rudd will have the last laugh; they first appointed him, then knifed him, and with a final rush of cynical fanfare, brought him back from the political wilderness to help save a few seats and some furniture. Perhaps even his own (that’s now definitely in doubt). It would also fit his “Messiah complex” to be able to pout and grandstand again for a short while before the last hurrah turns into a full on knife throwing implosion beginning next week. He was able to inflict maximum damage on those who betrayed him. And then he can gloat to his heart’s content while savouring every bit of his PM perks for life.

    80

  • #
    Debbie

    You can number everything but also put a 1 above the line.

    21

  • #
    Dave

    .

    What a wonderful evening just thinking of the results tomorrow:

    1. Rudd will lose his seat so ALP won’t have to worry about him at all.
    2. Bowen, Burke, Albanese and Shorten will retain their seats.
    3. The above 4 will fight like cat and dogs for months for leadership of the ALP.
    4. Shorten will get it, as Burke and Bowen are limp licks, and Albo likes Thai chicken too much
    5. Shorten (my zip is open) will keep ALP in the wilderness for 6 to 9 years.
    6. PM Abbott’s front bench as is will be sworn in.
    7. Within 2 months Hunt will go, and Turnbull will toe the line.
    8. Adam Brandt will be booted.
    9. Wilkie and Katter (only just) will be the two independents left.
    10.Hanson-Young and Hanson won’t get in.
    11.A Katter or Palmer Senator will get in.
    12.The DLP bloke plus Xenophon also re-elected.
    13. These three independents will hold balance in Senate from July.

    And the rest is just a guess. Maybe the Coalition will get 95 seats, Independents 2 and the ALP will have 53 if they are lucky. Swan (the worlds best EVER treasurer) is also gone.

    But in SE Queensland, the word is the ALP is in for a hiding big time, and business confidence is up also on this alone. Hope they are gone by Saturday evening along with any Green Vandals currently on the gravy train.

    111

    • #
      Andrew

      Much as I would get a day’s enjoyment from watching Rudd conceding the seat of Griffith tonight, I would get 6 months of enjoyment seeing him sitting with 52 of his closest friends on the Opposition benches.

      I think the ALP put him in on the basis that if he doesn’t win (or get very close) they’ve got him out of the way and can go to the next generation in a “renewal” process. The worst thing for them is having Gillard preside over a bloodbath then inherit Kevni with a Messiah complex after the election looking to remake the party.

      Trouble for the ALP is if he loses big, keeps his seat and then decides to stay around. His one job was to “prevent an Abbottabbottabbott666 govt” – he had no vision of his own. He might decide he has nothing better to do. And that means it will take months and months of destabilising for Shorten to get him out. Rudd had little support as it is – imagine how they will view him if he takes them to oblivion?

      40

    • #
      Apoxonbothyourhouses

      Please can I have some of whatever Dave is smoking?

      11

    • #
      Safetyguy66

      Id say that’s all pretty spot on. Save the post so we can see how you go.

      30

  • #
    MichiCanuck

    Gee, I thought that US elections were complicated! I’ll be sure to send my Canadian relatives to this site next time they whine about their “first past the post” system. It sounds as if Oz has taken the worst parts of the parliamentary system, added a touch of US checks and balances, then stirred in a heaping dollop of European chaos. I hope sanity wins tomorrow (I guess today for you), but please post a scorecard so we know what the results mean. Given the permutations, I’d bet that you guys won’t even know what the results mean for a while.

    60

    • #
      Len

      We will know the results in the the House of Representatives (the Lower House)before voting is finished in Western Australia. The results in the Seante will take longer.

      20

  • #
    DavidH

    Not too far off topic, I hope … a music video from Bill Glasson’s campaign to unset KRudd in Griffith (thanks to Andrew Bolt for the link):

    One more day …
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2rTJc36mlU

    And now, on to http://www.belowtheline.org.au/ to sort out my Senate preferences. The Libs are keen to get Arthur Sinodinos that last seat, so I’ll be moving him to the top; Bob Carr down to just above the Greens (all of whom should be scoring centuries).

    50

    • #
      Angry

      Our friends and relatives have all put One Nation at the top.

      Pauline Hanson is one of the very few politicians willing to say the things that Australians are thinking but most are to afraid to say…..

      41

  • #
    Kevin Lohse

    A little snippet I picked up just to concentrate any wandering minds:

    http://dailycaller.com/2013/09/05/report-carbon-tax-drags-australian-economy-down-under/

    40

  • #

    To quote a rugby referee of yours “Go you good things!”. Don’t celebrate too hard tonight, leave something in the tank for tomorrow because Sunday will be the first day of the rest of your lives. We will be watching from over the ditch.

    50

  • #

    Rugby referee??!!. Freudian slip perhaps. He is actually a commentator but then they do tend to be expert refs in their own minds. (I must, I must preview my post).

    30

  • #
    Rick Bradford

    I still savour that delicious moment in 2004 when the ABC’s ‘Red’ Kerry O’Brien dolefully intoned: “I have some very bad news from Tasmania..” i.e. that the crucial seats that Labor needed to hold in that state were handing the odious Latham his hat in no uncertain terms.

    70

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      And we won’t be hearing any “swing to the ABC” comments either.

      40

    • #
      Angry

      Wait for RED KERRY to announce on Saturday night “WE have lost” to see how BIASED the ABC (Australian bullshit commission) is.

      abc===THE VOICE OF LABOR

      40

  • #
  • #
    MudCrab

    I am pretty sure that the vast majority of people do not understand the Australian system.

    On the green sheet it breaks down in the end to 2PP. What that means in real terms is that if you finish in the top two, it really doesn’t matter who else you preference. Preferences are added in by removing the lowest scoring canidate and adding them to other people until one has 50% +1 vote or greater.

    This is why on many of the ‘How to Vote’ cards, with exceptions for principle (ie – ‘We will always put ‘XXXX’ last’) the number sequence is there simply to make it easier for Mr Average Voter to fill in the card.

    For the Senate it is somewhat different, but again in real terms preferences are for ‘Minor’ parties. If you are a ‘major’ party (ie ALP or LIBs) then you are expecting to get around 30% plus of the vote. That will get you 2 senate spots straight off the bat and in real terms, when you ask a ‘major’ who they preference, then their answer is going to be ‘us’.

    Notice how those parties list 4 punters even though there are 6 spots up for grabs? That is because they understand the system and understand the expected size of their primary. In real world terms if your party is not getting something like 6% of the primary then your vote is going to someone else. As a voter you may like to give your vote to one of these minors – which is a good thing, they get funding if they hit the 4% mark and it records a protest vote that is always worth noting to see how the population is thinking – but if they are not getting 6% or greater then they are going to be eliminated from the counting rather quickly and their vote is going to go to someone else. In real terms that ‘someone else’ is going to be one of the top three parties (ALP, Libs, Greens).

    It all breaks down to the top three.

    Arguing that a party preferences the ‘Wacko Dado’ party at 37 above the ‘Dado Wacko’ party at 40 is actually completely meaningless in real terms.

    10

  • #
    MudCrab

    For the fans of the, ‘interesting’ Ms Sarah Hanson-Young, I don’t think Sunday is going to be a very happy day for you.

    I have just spent 5 days as an observer for mobile polling in SA (this is where the AEC goes into nursing homes and hospitals to allow people who are unexpectively bedridden a chance to vote) and even with the privacy screen you can normally gain a good clue to a punters senate vote based on the sheer size of the white paper.

    True the sample size is relatively small (250 maybe) and the demographic may not be reflective of the overall voter base, but Nick X was polling significantly better then the Greens were.

    Expect the SA senate to be 3 Libs, 2 ALP and Nick X and bye bye SHY.

    (and if I am wrong then I will run around my longueroom naked… but with the curtains closed as I have some young neighbours and don’t want to mentally scar them… :D )

    71

    • #
      AndyG55

      “and if I am wrong then I will run around my longueroom naked”

      soo… just a normal Sunday !

      40

    • #
      Andrew G

      Jo, should a comment that is referencing uncounted votes, even anonymously posted, be allowed to stand?

      10

      • #
        Redress

        YES…..if their ABC can cover pre election polling and claim that it appears many/most have voted LNP, then Mudcrab can voice his opinion.

        20

      • #

        Andrew, exit polls are posted all the time aren’t they? And certainly this is obviously an opinion, not an accurate count. I don’t imagine that it would be a problem. No anonymity compromised. Polls close in WA in 13 minutes.

        But if you know more about the legal aspect, please do tell. Happy to be corrected.

        10

        • #
          Andrew G

          No idea about the specifics of the legality, but Mudcrab claims to have been acting as an observer, which I can only guess puts him/her in some kind of specific confidential position with the AEC. S/he has not posted ‘exit polls’ but surmises based on a breach of the confidentiality of the secret ballot.

          00

    • #
      Manfred

      don’t you mean ‘scuttle’ MudCrab?

      00

    • #
      Safetyguy66

      I would say Sarah Hanson Young can suck my……. but I wouldn’t want her anywhere near it. The sooner her ignorant, bleating, stupidity of an existence is out of the public eye the better.

      50

  • #
    Andrew McRae

    This will probably come too late to change anybody’s voting intentions.
    Did any of you use Clueyvoter.com, Senate.io, or Belowtheline.org to figure out your Senate game plan before Saturday? Well I have some bad news. The CIA knows how you’re going to vote before you even vote.
    The Guardian, Friday 6 Sep 2013: NSA and GCHQ unlock privacy and security on the internet

    The program “actively engages US and foreign IT industries to covertly influence and/or overtly leverage their commercial products’ designs”, the document states. None of the companies involved in such partnerships are named; these details are guarded by still higher levels of classification.

    From my hurried reading it seems basically since 2010 a growing portion of Internet devices, Internet services from major companies, commercial encryption libraries, and probably all Windows operating systems, have had backdoors inserted into their HTTPS and VPN software to retransmit part of the session encryption key in a form that can be collected and decoded in realtime by the NSA.

    Oh, you use Linux or Mac? There’s an app for that.

    Bruce Schneier • September 5, 2013 4:35 PM

    “Could the NSA be intercepting downloads of open-source encryption software and silently replacing these with their own versions?”

    Yes, I believe so.

    Not even Bill Binney foresaw a spy grid of this magnitude, and he was proven right about everything else:

    Sitting in a restaurant not far from NSA headquarters, the place where he spent nearly 40 years of his life, Binney held his thumb and forefinger close together. “We are, like, that far from a turnkey totalitarian state,” he says.

    The Wikileaks Party officially supports action on global warming, but perhaps they should be given a higher Senate preference due to this far more important issue of freedom and government accountability. My state doesn’t have any Wikileaks candidates but most of you will have one. I mean seriously people, take off the Single-Issue-Fanatic hat just for a few seconds and put this surveillance news in a historical perspective.

    00

    • #
      MemoryVault

      Sorry Andrew,

      But NSA spying on every aspect of Australians’ lives, including the monitoring and recording of all forms of communications, WITH the full blessing and support of the Australian government, was fully exposed back in 1987.

      The average Aussie was too stupid/ignorant/lazy to give a damn back then when something might just have been done about it. The average Aussie has remained too stupid/ignorant/lazy to do anything about it, in the intervening 26 years, under successive Labor AND Coalition governments.

      Getting all excited about it now, a quarter of a century later, is a pointless exercise.

      00

      • #
        Andrew McRae

        Hmmm, fatalism, now there’s a plan for inaction I could really get behind!

        Sorry, you are incorrect. Inserting back doors into mass market devices and software is a new deal for them, it wasn’t happening in 1987. The telcos have had wiretap ability since forever, but not encryption software and operating systems.
        Sorry you are also being illogical. Getting OTHER PEOPLE excited about it now will help reverse the “stupid/ignorant/lazy” state, so it is not pointless to get excited. We are still at the stage where just keeping the issue alive and talking about it will help make a difference. While not entirely new in quality, by many degrees Snowden has given us a gift of insight and currency. What he can’t do is illustrate why anyone should care about this topic. For that we have to look at history.

        If you had told the East Germans in August 1988 that within just two years they will have free elections and will be drinking and making Coca Cola they would not have believed you and they could have pointed to 40 dreary years of Stasi stasis as proof.

        Viva la declaración! Give me victory or give me irony!

        20

        • #
          Andrew McRae

          I would love to know which combination of keywords triggered the auto-moderation on that one.

          00

        • #
          MemoryVault

          .
          I won’t argue with you Rereke since I’m not going to be around long enough for it to bother me.
          However I will point out the big difference between 1987 and now.

          In 1987 a meaningful number of Australians owned a meaningful number of meaningful guns.
          Now they don’t.

          Good luck with the revolution – whenever it comes.

          10

          • #
            Andrew McRae

            Gosh, I was mistaken for Rereke?
            Was it the Cold War nostalgia?
            Was it the carefully composed and hyperlinked research?
            Was it the devilish good looks?
            Was it the self-deprecating humour?
            Was it the post-election celebratory beverages kicking in early? ;)
            Whatever it was, the compliment is appreciated.

            00

  • #
    Brian G Valentine

    Australian Senate preferences are a wild-card

    So Long, Senator Christine Milne and your small following of stoned-out solar-panel worshiping flunkies!

    fat chance of that

    30

    • #
      Mark

      Brian, unfortunately only three of the nine Green misanthropes are up for re-election this time.

      There is a good chance that the one with the hyphenated name will get the heave-ho. She’s the one who has never held down a real job. Straight from university into an activist lifestyle at the taxpayer’s expense.

      I feel disgust that 46% of my countrymen believe this mob deserve yet another term.

      40

      • #
        Angry

        How could 46 PEOPLE in the whole of Australia vote for these COMMUNISTS???

        20

        • #
          Brian G Valentine

          I have no idea, but I know how these flea bags get elected here in the US, which is essentially to promise people free marijuana, and this is not an exaggeration by any means

          30

          • #
            Manfred

            …whilst in the same breath they try to ban tobacco. Go figure.

            10

            • #
              Brian G Valentine

              Tobacco doesn’t leave people in a susceptible, stupefied state.

              Besides, “tobacco lobbyists” pay people to say that AGW is a stinking, pathetic, and sickening farce or something to that effect.

              10

  • #

    This from the British Daily Telegraph on the polls pointing towards a clear Coalition win.

    The Australian prime minister, Kevin Rudd, remained defiant, refusing to admit defeat or speculate on his post-election future.
    “There is fight in the old dog yet,” he said. “I believe we can do it. This is not wishful thinking – it’s a matter of looking at the maths.”
    But the final polls before the election on Saturday showed that Mr Abbott’s strong lead was only increasing and would become Australia’s 28th prime minister.

    So take this with you to the polling booth. Kevin Rudd believes the exact opposite of what the evidence clearly shows. No wonder Labor has got Australia in a fix, and no wonder they believe in climate change. Tony Abbott may not solve all your problems, but he is not such a slave to spin as the your current PM.

    100

  • #
    Gamecock

    I wish we had a Shooters and Fishers Party in the U.S.A.

    30

    • #
      Safetyguy66

      Your whole country is the shooters and fishers party man.

      I wish we had your gun laws. Australia has abandoned personal freedom and libertarian values. We are hurtling along a path to totalitarianism with minute invasive laws controlling every aspect of our existence. Hopefully (but I doubt it) this change of Government will at least slow the inevitable day when a future left admininistration passes the law for barcodes on the back of babies necks.

      50

  • #
    Neville

    Here’s my guesstimate for Reps and the Senate.
    Worst case for Coalition is 85 seats in Reps and best for Labor 65.

    Most probable is 90 C and 60 L, but 100 C and 50 L is still possible.
    But I think I’ll stick my neck out and give it 95 C and 55 L.

    Labor/ Greens will lose control of the senate after July next year and DLP,Xenophon, Palmer? or Katter? parties, Family First? One Nation? will have control.

    20

    • #
      Angry

      We pray that One Nation gets control to force the Coalition to stop the muslim problem in Australia before it as serious as that in the UK and Europe…….

      30

  • #
    John Reid

    Whatever your political preferences please put Climate Skeptics first for the Senate. A big vote for Climate Skeptics will tell the new government that Greg Hunt and his Warmist ideas are a liability. It is time everyone realized that this guy is in the wrong party.

    61

    • #
      Angry

      Greg Hunt should join the greens (REDS) party.

      40

      • #
        Safetyguy66

        I know what your saying, but its a mistake to align greens with communism/socialism. They are about as far from left politics as you can possibly get. They are extreme conservatives with a bent towards anti humanism and eugenics.

        They have no plans that align with left values, they don’t care about employment, wages, education, health etc (left values) because all of those values increase industry and productivity and those things come at the expense of the environment. They deceive people with some soft core alignment with a couple of union values to gain votes, but they have no intention of doing anything that expands productivity.

        The greens would be more closely aligned historically with the German National Socialists of Hitler’s era, except instead of wanting to exterminate Jews, they want to exterminate everyone that doesn’t agree with them. They would be more than happy to see mass starvation in the 3rd world, more than happy to see massive unemployment in Australia and more than happy to see developing nations keep burning dung, provided they don’t burn coal.

        They are the worst kind of scum, I cant even describe to you how bad they are without probably having my poste deleted because it would involve too many expletives.

        52

        • #
          Rod Stuart

          You’ve hit the nail on the head Safety Guy.
          This left and right crap is not a linear continuum. Consider it more like at horseshoe, where the extremes of left and right are separated by a single gap. The extreme left does not allow individual ownership of anything. The extreme right allow an individual to own an asset, so long as the elite control it.
          The green policy statement, when compared to the 1923 demands of the German National Socialist Workers’ Party have many similarities.
          Anti-antisemitism only became part to the scheme when it was necessary to find scapegoat. If the Green fascists ever get to follow the Nazi route, they will pick another scapegoat, more than likely ‘deniers’.

          20

          • #
            Safetyguy66

            Spot on. The greens like most extremists are interested only in controlling everything and everyone. Even if you look at the small amount of good policies they have (and they are few) its the fact that they are prepared to expand and enhance the power of Government to force those views on people that makes them dangerous.

            Adam Bent said in response to Abbotts line that he would not form a minority Government, that Abbott was ignoring the wishes of voters if he did that. A short time later Granny Milne emerged from her senility for just long enough to say that the greens would block any attempts to repeal the fantasy I mean carbon tax in the Senate. So there it is in stark black and white. Democracy only applies on topics where you agree with the greens. They are happy to ignore a clear mandate generated by Abbott making this election about the carbon tax for 3 freakin years or more, but don’t accept it as a strategy when it applies to little boy bent.

            No hypocrisy there then.

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    Jo
    Thankyou for the links and clues. I am going to make mine count!

    Saw this here and will keep this lot high on my list.
    “The Palmer United Party will set up a national commission to investigate the Carbon issue and seek submissions from all Australians so that the government is fully informed.”
    http://palmerunited.com/national-policy/

    Saw this here and moved these people up my list too.

    “We believe in “climate change” – for thousands of years the climate has been changing and it will continue to change; the notion that anthropogenic emissions of the plant-food carbon dioxide have affected, or will affect, the macro-climatic changes that would have occurred anyway as part of nature (e.g. volcanoes, solar variations etc) is a quasi-religious hypothesis unproven by objective scientific facts. Computer modelling always involves subjectivity and should not be used as the sole basis for policies;”
    http://riseupaustraliaparty.com/?page_id=18

    Lance

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    RoHa

    “you’re free to rectify any of our misdemeanors and mishaps and preference one set of fraudsters and liars over another,”

    Recognition of possible error and honest assessment of the situation? They can’t be real politicians.

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    Bob Malloy

    In the seat of Charlton, Combet’s old seat, Kevin Baker the dis-indorsed Lib candidate says he will serve as an independent if elected. Until this morning the story was that once dis-indorsed he had withdrawn from the election, he now says as he is still on the ballet paper and we have to give him a number, he will serve should he be elected.

    This I guess gives the Lib voters a chance to gain a de facto member and remove another former union high flyer and the worst type of Labor elite.

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      Bob Malloy

      Just to clarify, Baker was dis-endorsed over some unsavory post on a mini minor enthusiast blog he controlled. To the best of my knowledge none of the racist or sexist post were of Bakers doing, however his failure to remove them cast a shadow over his character. As nominations were closed at the time of the dis-endorsement The Libs could not nominate a new candidate.

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    Safetyguy66

    Well I got my TAS vote about right, except I put Peter Smug Dick Whish Wilson 54…. only because there wasn’t an option to tick “execute immediately”

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    robyninformed

    the really sad thing about you lot is that you don’t understand just how pathetically ignorant you are.

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      Well thanks for bringing all your best arguments here to educate us fools.

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      Angry

      “robyninformed”, look into a mirror and you will see the epitome of ignorant and arrogant….

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        Andrew McRae

        Well as long as we’re bringing our ‘best arguments’…

        Their user name ‘robyninformed’ could really be an anagram of…
        * Their personality: Robin Defy Norm
        * Their view on the main climate forcings: Deny Orb Inform
        * Their cooking technique: Dinner From Boy
        * Their dietary salt intake: Briny Fed Moron
        * Their favourite psychedelic drug: Borneo Fry Mind
        …and scraping the bottom of the barrel…
        * Their father: Inbred Of Mr Yon
        Oh yeah, there’s the bottom of the barrel, right there.

        But we can do serious debate – if we’re actually told the topic.

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      AndyG55

      ooo robyn’s bff told him/her a secret… so now.. robyn is informed.

      irrelevance personified.

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      Rereke Whakaaro

      Hey, give the guy a break! I think he did very well, considering that he had to type his comment entirely with his left hand. The other one was busy doing something else.

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      Safetyguy66

      Typical lefty statement. “We are superior and more intelligent, you poor fools are lucky to have us.”

      You do realise that it is that exact smug, moral high ground crap that lost Julia her job and lost this Government it’s support don’t you?

      When Julia said “getting people in line with the carbon tax is like getting children to eat their veggies” it summed up the entire situation. One day you people will realise it doesn’t even matter when your right, this is a DEMOCRACY, majority rules baby. Enjoy the next 8-10 years, of Libs, you guys have earned it.

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      Tim

      Dear Ms Informed. Please state your reasoned case together with facts and figures and then we can judge just where you stand.

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    Angry

    This demonstrates a stark contrast between rudd and Bill Glasson in the seat of Griffith.

    A no brainer choice really.

    A tale of two campaigns:-

    http://blogs.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/mirandadevine/index.php/dailytelegraph/comments/its_all_happening_in_griffith/

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    ALERT FOR JOANNE AND THE MODERATORS if you are planning on a coverage Thread, then you may wish to add the link.

    Say, I just know there will be some International readers here waiting for the result.

    There is now the facility that you can watch the Labor train wreck election results as they happen in real time.

    ABC News 24 has removed the International geoblock from their site, so you can actually watch the election results coverage as it happens.

    While they are streaming live all day, the real coverage doesn’t start until 6PM Australian Eastern, and I know you international readers are time savvy enough to work out what time that is locally where you all live.

    Also, I’m not sure if there is an election coverage embargo in WA, (and there used to be) because their Polls do not close until 2 hours after the coverage starts in the East, so, if that is the case, then you guys in WA can also watch this from 4PM your time.

    Perhaps comment here with some feedback if you can actually pick it up. I’ve already tried it with a friend who lives in Stockton California, and he says it works just fine.

    The Following is the link to the coverage, streaming live now, but with just the happenings around the Country as people vote. This coverage will be the main ABC coverage.

    ABC News 24

    Just press Play.

    Tony.

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    Rod Stuart

    About six weeks ago a I read an article by Lord Monckton regarding the data from HADCRUT3, HADCRUT4, UAH, and RSS in which he demonstrates that the average of this data illustrates the 17 year pause in warming, and the slight decline since 2006 from RSS and UAH. I thought this was on WUWT, or ACM, but I can’t find it. Can anyone help with that please. It was a series of graphical presentations, done in Excel.
    Thanks.

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    Rod Stuart

    Exit polls showing Coalition 97, ALP 51, Wilkie, and Katter.
    Krudd 50/50 depending on preferences.
    Wayne Swine gone.

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    We are having a party today. Hope you are too.
    New thread for the Election updated as results come in.

    It is not far off being called.

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