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Watching the Three Gorges Dam

Eyes are still on the Three Gorges Dam as a rare flooding event spreads across Asia. Bridges that have stood for 500 years have succumbed.

Pity the poor people of Wuhan, the flood waters released from the Three Gorges Dam have arrived. That dam and all upstream dams have opened the flood gates, and cities as far downstream as Wuhan are flooding.

According to the South China Morning Post, 19,380,000 people have been affected by flooding across China as of July 3rd. Chriss Street says “a record 16.8 inches falling between Sunday and Monday morning, and inflows running at 40 acre-feet per second after, CMA on July 4 issued an 80-percent risk of thundershowers for each of the next 11 days.”

Check out the brief shot of the flood in a supermarket.

 

Apparently the dam is so large and heavy it even ranks in discussions of seismic potential – namely that some people are concerned the weight of the water may trigger earthquakes.

The “word on the street” according to Gravitasis that Chinese people are wondering if the flooding water released from  is convenient for the CCP government to wash away evidence from the Wu flu outbreak.

Watch the Gravitas vid (at the link) from 1:30 (before that it’s a revision of the virus).

For disaster flood porn trawl through Twitter Three Gorges Dam. It’s an unbelievable amount of water.

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Rating: 9.6/10 (65 votes cast)
Watching the Three Gorges Dam, 9.6 out of 10 based on 65 ratings

167 comments to Watching the Three Gorges Dam

  • #
    David Maddison

    Sad to see these people, who are victims of communism, suffering. Sadly the “climate change” catastrophists will probably blame supposed global warming when in reality this sort of weather and flooding is not unusual for China.

    184

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      From the South Chiina Morning Post report :”Fan Xiao, chief engineer at the Sichuan Geology and Mineral Bureau in Chengdu, said the effectiveness of the flood defence network depended on individual dams and the severity of the rainfall. ‘If there is severe flooding with persistent torrential rain, like what happened in 1998, it would be difficult to say how effective the dams will be,” he said, referring to devastating floods that killed more than 2,000 people. “The dams have operated well but we haven’t had any real tests so far.’ ”

      In other words, the last major flood was in 1998 before the Three Gorges dam was completed. So the Three Gorges dam has never before been stressed by a major flood. This will indeed be major challenge.
      https://www.scmp.com/news/china/society/article/3092060/chinas-flood-defence-network-put-test-it-braces-more-storms

      Once again our own public media, the ABC, has chosen not to report on this situation in China. Why, I wonder ? Does the ABC think it is of no interest to Australians ? But we do have a substantial population with a Chinese background.

      256

      • #
        Analitik

        Indeed. Last night, I was having a last family gathering before the Metro Melbourne CoViD-19 re-lockdown and I asked if anyone else had read/heard/seen news on the flooding in China over the past month. Of 7 adults, I was the only one who was aware of this, let alone the scale of the flooding and potential consequences – the others knew about the flooding in India, Bangladesh, Japan, Philippines

        What is going on with the entire MSM (not just the ABC and SBS) on this?

        311

        • #
          David Maddison

          I wonder why the legacy media is ignoring it?

          Surely it would be in their interests to promote it as a supposed anthropogenic global warming catastrophe? Or to use it to lobby for a transfer of Australian taxpayer money to China? Or to accept “climate change refugees” from China?

          I can’t understand why they’re ignoring it.

          112

          • #
            PeterS

            They can’t use the CAGW excuse because it’s not happening here otherwise they would be to force us to close all our coal fired power plants ASAP. Since it’s in China where they are building hundreds of new coal fired power stations it’s ignored. Hypocrisy is not a strong enough term to describe the MSM.

            140

        • #
          Deano

          Can’t account for the ABC or BBC but apparently, Chinese money is heavily invested in western media companies for obvious reasons. It explains why, for instance, the only stories we hear about India concern corruption and women being beaten and raped. The Chinese aren’t stupid, so low level criticism of Chinese affairs is allowed to create the impression of being balanced. However the 3 Gorge’s Dam is a Chinese engineering show piece however.

          That’s just my half-baked theory.

          100

        • #
          Analitik

          Heard mention of it on SBS last night for the first time (reported along with flooding in Japan)

          30

      • #
        Phillip Bratby

        Nothing on the BBC either.

        100

  • #
    David A

    Look for photos of the dam deforming. Apparently 3 gorges was built on sections, very heavy sections and not anchored to the bedrock! There are pictures showing clear changes.

    Of course, despite massive past floods, this will be blamed on CO2.

    111

    • #
    • #
      Salome

      I was beginning to think, yup, a one in 1000-year flood: Climate Change!!!

      40

    • #
      David Maddison

      While I don’t trust communist engineering or their claims that this dam is safe, it has been suggested that the apparent distortion in those images is due to a digital compositing error.

      115

      • #
        Analitik

        I have read this as well but there are long roads in the image that a dead straight. I suspect there is a bit of both

        80

      • #
        James West

        Or more likely, a straight photoshopping fraud “error”.

        21

    • #
      James West

      I’d be reasonably confident that those photos are a result of some creative digital tweaking on the part of hoaxers. The dam would basically already have failed if they were real.

      121

      • #
        Chris

        The dam wall is a series of very large concrete blocks sitting on top of each other and not anchored to the bedrock. The possibility that the blocks have moved is real. One Chinese professor commented that the volume of water was 2 meters above the flood level and the total weight of the water was more than 40 billion tons, which explains the earthquakes and the pressure behind the insecure wall. However the volume of water in the Yangtze River after the release of water two weeks ago is so high that the dam authorities are now unable to further release any more.

        Is it possible that the high water level in the river is helping to equalise and alleviate the pressure on the dam wall thus holding the wall in place?

        20

    • #
      MudCrab

      I am not remotely civil, but I feel pretty confident that concrete doesn’t bend that way.

      It either holds, or it fails.

      There is also the other objects in the photo that show the same bending effect.

      Not claiming the dam is fine, just that this photo should not be regarded as evidence.

      71

    • #
      Phil R

      Not an expert, but apparently a result of different photos being stitched together. If you look at the dam on Google Earth and look at recent and historical photos, it appears warped or bent (displaced) in some, but arrow straight in others, including the most recent one I see, which is dated June 2020.

      00

  • #
    David Maddison

    In the case of the Three Gorges Dam, communist mega-engineering, what could possibly go wrong?

    135

    • #
      Salome

      If it’s anything like the plumbing in their hotels . . .

      100

      • #
        Serp

        The bullet train was relaunched in 2017 after the 2011 disaster; they’ll just build the dam better next time.

        50

        • #
          Roger Knights

          At the time the dam was being built critics said they had told the authorities it would be safer to build a series of smaller dams on the tributaries. But the authorities wanted a big showpiece dam.

          10

  • #
    Clyde Spencer

    “… some people are concerned the weight of the water may trigger earthquakes.”

    It is not unusual for large dams to trigger small earthquakes.

    https://www.internationalrivers.org/dam%E2%80%93induced-seismicity

    60

  • #
    James Poulos

    They should have used Australian steel…

    150

    • #
      TedM

      So should we.

      341

    • #
      WXcycles

      Sticks to flip-flops like chewing gum.

      73

      • #
        WXcycles

        Somehow Australia is jumping up and down again and again. It is like chewing gum stuck to the bottom of China’s shoe. Sometimes you just have to find a rock and rub it off

        - Hu Xijin, Editor of state-run Global Times, on Chinese social media platform, Weibo

        61

  • #
    David Maddison

    The filling of the Three Gorges Dam, resulting in the redistribution and raising in height of 42 billion tons of water slowed the rotational period of earth by 0.06 microseconds.

    85

  • #
    Another Ian

    Somewhat O/T – not water but a shadow in that area

    “Bank Runs In China”

    https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2020/07/08/bank-runs-in-china/#comments

    20

  • #
    TdeF

    So the floods have now hit Wuhan. What suffering. Plague, bats, rabbits, Black Death and now floods. It’s starting to look like the biblical plagues of Egypt. What’s next? Frogs, lice, fire or locusts? My money is on frogs. And it won’t be long before Grumpy Greta says it’s Climate Change. Which would be odd because technically China is exempt from the Paris agreement.

    233

    • #
      David Maddison

      It’s amazing but not surprising that despite having the most US$ billionaires in the world and being the world’s second largest economy, it gets to be classified as a “developing country” just like the Central African Republic or PNG.

      Anyone that’s ever been there would see it is at least as advanced as any Western country.

      Australia is the biggest thermal coal supplier (for their imports) to China so they get to burn our coal to produce cheap electricity at the December 2019 domestic price of 0.077 U.S. Dollar per kWh, about one third that of Australia.

      On the basis of being a developing country they can generate CO2 to an unlimited extent and build one or two new coal power stations per week, not that CO2 or coal are bad things, they are both wonderful!

      However they can use coal, plus fund and build 25% of coal power stations around the world, and Australia, one of the world’s most frighteningly committed believers in the lie of anthropogenic global warming can build not one coal power station and even makes public spectacles of demolishing working plant.

      305

    • #
      Geoff Croker

      FAMINE is next. It ALWAYS follows FLOOD.

      Its going to be hard to start a war with no FOOD.

      In GOD we trust.

      140

    • #
      Analitik

      What’s next? Frogs, lice, fire or locusts?

      The locusts are already in the Western part of the country having traveled from Africa across areas of the Middle East, Pakistan and India. I read somewhere that some have even crossed the Atlantic into South America although they could be a local variety.
      https://www.forbes.com/sites/carlieporterfield/2020/06/27/apocalyptic-pests-locust-swarms-hit-asia-and-south-america-affecting-millions/#5c17fe5b1269
      https://www.reuters.com/article/us-argentina-brazil-grains-locusts/argentina-brazil-monitor-massive-locust-swarm-crop-damage-seen-limited-idUSKBN23W34K

      I mentioned in another thread that locusts only transform from the normal desert grasshopper when there is a lot of rainfall in their breeding areas – levels of rain that the climate alarmists said would never occur again.

      111

  • #
    joseph

    Interesting times . . . .

    50

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      Historically floods have been bad news in China. The yellow river (Huang He) wasn’t named China’s sorrow for placid behaviour.
      The usual result in the past has been famine afterwards as the crops are either destroyed by the floods or planting delayed. A hungry population is a restive one and the last thing the Communists need.

      110

  • #
    Greg in NZ

    Talking of ‘damn the dam’ (may be of interest to Tony ‘Nameplate’ from Oz) -

    Rio Tinto plays its annual tune of “We’re bailing, unless…” as they announce (again) the closure of their Tiwai Aluminium Smelter in Southland, NZ, freeing up (800?) megawatts of hydro power from Manapouri Dam in Fiordland.

    Urban Greens are dancing in the street thinking this will enable their Electric Vehicle Dream to finally come to fruition, while rural realists are shaking their heads: bread and circuses, rinse and repeat.

    170

    • #
      RickWill

      The Tiwai Point smelter makes a large portion of its profit from selling the purest grade aluminium produced worldwide to the aircraft industry. That market is on life support right now with both Boeing and Airbus making huge reductions in workforce. The prospect are dime for maybe three years. And I expect a lot of businesses will choose to Zoom rather than fly.

      In the circumstances, the threat has a strong possibility of materialising. Making aluminium is a marginal business highly dependent on electricity price. It has occasional good times interspersed with long periods of low margins. NZ would probably need to supply the electricity at zero cost to make the present operation viable given that the sale of their premium production is in the toilet.

      111

    • #
      John Robertson

      Gee perhaps they,NZ,could restore the flow of the Waiau River?
      It was mighty when I was young,the gravel would be driven far out into the sea.
      After the diversion dam,the mouth closed over with a huge gravel bar and then the gravel ground along the beach,West of the river mouth destroying most of the Toheroa Beds.
      And the welfare state wasted every penny of the “wealth” generated at Bluff.
      In hindsight ?
      Did NZ gain?

      30

  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    Good point, as we know, only western democratic capitalism can do civil engineering, like that border wall between USA and Mexico, oh wait, bits of that fell down in a breeze, don’t worry I’ll think of something.

    523

    • #
      David Maddison

      Not really a big deal Peter. No one was hurt and it was a result of unexpected high winds pushing against a section of wall with freshly poured, uncured concrete.

      But all means, allow your life to depend on communist engineering. I’ll stick to Western or Japanese engineering.

      143

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Go have a coffee & wake up properly Fitz !
      Apart from being off topic, that comment is well below your normal sub par standard.

      85

    • #
      TedM

      Please wait until you have something factual to complete Peter F.

      91

    • #
      AndyG55

      LOL, the comedy act that is PF, swings and misses, yet again!

      The wall that fell didn’t even have its concrete foundations poured at that stage.

      “don’t worry I’ll think of something.”

      It would be a first !

      141

    • #
      AndyG55

      China happen to be very good at civil engineering.

      They have built many structure which are fantastic pieces of engineering.

      Problem they have is the reputation of being somewhat lax in the quality control area.

      Let’s hope for all, that is not the case with the Three Gorges Dam.

      In the Western world, if a Civil Engineer makes a big error, they loose their job and career.

      In China, I suspect the government response would be somewhat more direct and permanent!

      112

    • #
      James Murphy

      There have been engineering disasters in all parts of the world, what’s your point Peter?

      60

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        If you had traveled on the lake made by the dam, you would have noted the incredible range between the high and low levels of the lake. To think that this is a new problem is naive.
        But more to the point is that this post continues the long standing position that only western capitalists, and not any other society or type of economy can built things.

        516

        • #
          el gordo

          How good is their steel compared to ours? I’m happy to have them be involved with our HSR, but we should use only Australian steel and concrete.

          40

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            As Ronald Reagan said “trust, but verify” – or buyer beware. Auditing and QC are vital in civil engineering

            81

            • #
              el gordo

              Yes, but while you’re there, do you think CO2 has caused this 1-1000 year flood, or is it a quiet sun?

              50

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                As a 1-1000 year event it is more likely to be a quite sun. I will keep in mind that this could not be effect of one factor, and I hope you do too.

                62

              • #
                el gordo

                Of course, I’m losing faith in the solar hypothesis, so I’m happy to meet you half way.

                We could start with the idea that 1-1000 years is even accurate, I’ll read a little history.

                50

              • #
                AndyG55

                Certainly there is absolutely ZERO EVIDENCE that this rain event is anything but natural.

                [Snip insults -J]

                12

              • #
                el gordo

                If we leave out a quiet sun and CO2, we only have a strong La Nina as the cause.

                ‘One of the major objectives of the Three Gorges Dam project was to alleviate flooding on the lower Yangtze. The dam proved effective during the extraordinarily rainy summer of 2010 by holding back much of the resultant floodwaters and thus minimizing the impact of flooding downstream. However, the dam still had to open its floodgates to reduce the high water volume in the reservoir, and flooding and landslides in the Yangtze basin killed several hundred people and caused extensive property damage.’

                Brittanica

                30

              • #
                el gordo

                Floods are not solar driven.

                ‘More frequent extreme floods occurred in the 1770s, 1790s, 1820s, 1880s, 1910s and 1950s–1960s.’ Zheng et al 2018

                20

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                El gordo – a big flood (like this one) is possible because there is enough energy in the atmospheric system to evaporate and move that amount of water. That energy, in a chaotic system as the atmosphere is, would have built up over years, and only now did the conditions allow for that flood. I would think that events over the last few years, and particularly in the northern hemisphere for the source of what we see here.

                37

              • #
                Bill In Oz

                BOM has officially announced at La Nina watch for the coming Spring in Australia.

                I wonder if the floods in Asia are an indicator of floods to come here in Oz ?

                15

              • #
                el gordo

                Floods and droughts in China are down to ENSO, with El Nino the flood watch. Here they go back to the depths of the LIA and come forward to the present.

                https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/abs/pii/S1040618205000947

                A big La Nina is coming, so theoretically this flood seems out of phase and they’ll say its because of AGW.

                10

              • #
                el gordo

                ‘ … there is enough energy in the atmospheric system to evaporate and move that amount of water.’

                The dam has changed precipitation in the area of the new lake, called the ‘lake effect’, but its not significant.

                20

            • #
              Kalm Keith

              Quiet so.

              20

        • #
          MudCrab

          …noted the incredible range between the high and low levels of the lake.

          Exactly what are you trying to say here?

          Also which lake? Dam made lakes in general? Or Three Gorges?

          Why would any of us been to Three Gorges? Do we look like ALP politicians?

          60

        • #
          AndyG55

          There is absolutely NOTHING in Jo’s post that questions Chinese engineering

          You are just making stuff up to make a pointless non-point.

          … just like you always do. !

          13

          • #

            C’mon Andy, I’m pretty sure I’ve questioned Chinese Communist project management in many threads, and the quality of their steel is “well known”. If I implied the 3G-Dam was well built in the post above, that was my mistake.

            Chinese people are smart. Communism is stupid.

            112

            • #
              AndyG55

              You don’t mention anything either way in this post, Jo.

              Peter is making up things that you did not say in the post.

              This is nothing unusual.

              21

            • #
              Peter Fitzroy

              Dam still there, no sign of evacuations downstream, I’d say the dam is operating exactly as designed. But China bad.

              40

        • #
          MudCrab

          Wait – I mused on your typings some more and remembered again what your technical background was.

          You are claiming that since water has gone up and water has gone down in the past then all is good in the present and the future.

          Yeah… No.

          Remember the volume of the lake is controlled by two factors – Water In and Water Out.

          Water In is from the catchment area based on ground water and rainfall and possibly also deliberate pumping from downstream.

          Water Out is from discharge.

          If Water In > Water Out then Lake increases.

          If Water In than Water In the problem goes away, but if it doesn’t… Lets get back to that in a moment as well.

          Third is the Lake continues to increase until it breaches the top of the dam walls. This would be bad. The tops of the dam are incredibly likely to NOT be designed to have water flowing over them. Minor fittings such as hand rails and lights are likely to have their mountings fail which in return will allow water to act in more areas that are not designed to have water flowing over them. Erosion and all those other unwanted things.

          Now, let us also consider downstream. The lake and dam are not a closed system. Water Out from the dam is also Water In for those downstream and if Water In > Water Out then the water level goes up.

          Case Study for those playing at home? Brisbane – they delayed the discharge of water from the dam for so long that when they finally increased the flow to save the dam Water In at Brisbane was > then the ability to Water Out. Brisbane flooded.

          Okay – so we flood Wuhan. They already have Wet Markets. Nuk Nuk Nuk.

          Now I have a cold black heart already, so Pfffffff to Wuhan, but this may not save the dam. Spillways et al have a finite design for water flow rates. You start exceeding these and firstly the pressure of the backfill forces the water discharge out at a higher velocity. This can be bad and if you can’t visualise why then try using a fire hose next time you water your garden.

          You also have the backpressure to deal with. Water waiting to discharge from the lake is going to excert pressure on whatever is preventing it from flowing (ie the dam wall). What more than likely happened is the original designers worked out the pressure based on Lake Max, multiplied it by a safety factor and designed against that. Pretty standard engineering so far.

          What we don’t know is how big this safety factor is relative to the fact we have now exceeded Lake Max and also just how strong the dam is above the designed high water mark. Maybe the wall itself IS a feat of wonder and not in danger of failing, however even if it is we still have the problem that Water Out at the dam is Water In for people downstream. Brisbane again.

          High and low water marks from casual strolls have little to do with this.

          60

          • #
            MudCrab

            Hmmmm… 2 entire paragraphs seem to have disappeared from my post.

            I mentioned spillways and increasing flow through the turbines as ‘First’ and ‘Second’ points but they seem to have done a runner… I blame Global Warming(tm)

            40

          • #
            AndyG55

            “The tops of the dam are incredibly likely to NOT be designed to have water flowing over them.”

            It depends a lot on how the dam is designed.

            I would assume that since they knew it didn’t have the storage capacity to control a major flood event, it would be designed to be safe from collapse if over-topped.

            Many dams are designed in exactly that way.

            21

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            so you are saying the dam is not only poorly built, but the builders had no knowledge of previous flows. I’m saying that the water level in the lake behind the 3G Dam varies on massive scale

            from wikipedia
            The reservoir’s flood storage capacity is 22 cubic kilometres (5.3 cu mi; 18,000,000 acre⋅ft). This capacity will reduce the frequency of major downstream flooding from once every 10 years to once every 100 years. The dam is expected to minimise the effect of even a “super” flood. In 1954, the river flooded 193,000 km2 (74,500 sq mi), killing 33,169 people and forcing 18,884,000 people to move. The flood covered Wuhan, a city of eight million people, for over three months, and the Jingguang Railway was out of service for more than 100 days.

            In 1998, a flood in the same area caused billions of dollars in damage; 2,039 km2 (787 sq mi) of farm land were flooded. The flood affected more than 2.3 million people, killing 1,526.[105] In early August 2009, the largest flood in five years passed through the dam site. The dam limited the water flow to less than 40,000 cubic metres (1,400,000 cu ft) per second, raising the upstream water level from 145.13 m (476.1 ft) on August 1, 2009, to 152.88 m (501.6 ft) on August 8, 2009. A full 4.27 km3 (1.02 cu mi) of flood water was captured and the river flow was cut by as much as 15,000 m3 (530,000 cu ft) per second.

            The dam discharges its reservoir during the dry season between December and March every year. This increases the flow rate of the river downstream, and provides fresh water for agricultural and industrial usage. It also improves shipping conditions. The water level upstream drops from 175 to 145 m (574 to 476 ft),[107] preparing for the rainy season. The water also powers the Gezhouba Dam downstream.

            Since the filling of the reservoir in 2003, the Three Gorges Dam has supplied an extra 11 km3 (2.6 cu mi) of fresh water to downstream cities and farms during the dry season.

            During the 2010 South China floods in July, inflows at the Three Gorges Dam reached a peak of 70,000 m3/s (2,500,000 cu ft/s), exceeding the peak during the 1998 Yangtze River Floods. The dam’s reservoir rose nearly 3 m (9.8 ft) in 24 hours and reduced the outflow to 40,000 m3/s (1,400,000 cu ft/s) in discharges downstream, effectively alleviating serious impacts on the middle and lower river

            So the dam seems to working as planned.

            64

            • #
              Roger Knights

              Here’s the link to the Wikipedia page on the 3 Gorges dam:
              https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Three_Gorges_Dam

              00

            • #
              AndyG55

              “but the builders had no knowledge of previous flows. “

              At no point did I say that.

              Your lack of basic comprehension and understanding is showing through, YET AGAIN.

              Sorry if you are incapable of comprehending that things have to be build to meet requirements.

              Great cut and paste though…. Always a substitute for understanding and comprehension..

              10

        • #
          Deplorable Lord Kek

          the long standing position that only western capitalists, and not any other society or type of economy can built things

          maybe in leftie-latte land.

          in the real world:
          -pyramids
          -sphinx
          -Chichen Itza, Izamal and Dzibilchaltun.
          -taj mahal
          -stone henge
          -roman empire
          -byzantium

          and i would quite happily trade the ‘elite’s’ preferred method of de-culturalzation, aka ‘brutalism’, for any of the architecture of 13-17th century italy or the ME.

          10

  • #
    AndyG55

    This is the problem of trying to tame nature, especially water.

    Attempting to constrain flood waters when you don’t actually know what the largest flows will be.

    How “big” do you design for?

    We see the same thing with the Mississippi, Ganges, Brahmaputra Rivers etc .

    Even local drainage systems need to be designed to a certain ARI level

    Anything rainfall event or flood event that goes above the design level will always be an issue…

    THAT’S NATURE.

    She’s a tough boss !

    110

  • #
    robert rosicka

    Is it a one in 500 year event or just a case of mismanagement as in Wivenhoe Dam ?

    60

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Either way I bet Flim Flam Flannery wouldn’t be popular in China right now !

      40

    • #
      AndyG55

      ARI of this rain event looks like it might be statistically a 1 in 10,000 year event.

      That dam should have been designed for at least that much.

      But how large is a 1 in 10,000 year event.??

      In fact, a dam in that situation should be designed for the PMF (probably maximum flood)

      Unfortunately, that is something it is not possible to know..

      … only to get a statistical estimate with HUGE error margins.

      They are dealing with Mother Nature, and she can be a real B!tch !

      80

      • #
        robert rosicka

        Do we know what storage levels were in the Dams before the event ?

        40

        • #
          AndyG55

          “Do we know what storage levels were in the Dams before the event ?”

          I don’t think it would have mattered. This storm would fill it to “normal levels very quickly.

          20

      • #
        RicDre

        From Bill In Oz’s comment @ #1.1,“Fan Xiao, chief engineer at the Sichuan Geology and Mineral Bureau in Chengdu, said the effectiveness of the flood defence network depended on individual dams and the severity of the rainfall. ‘If there is severe flooding with persistent torrential rain, like what happened in 1998, it would be difficult to say how effective the dams will be …” it sounds like the chief engineer is not sure if the dams will be effective for a 1 in 22 year flood.

        41

        • #
          Bill In Oz

          Ric it may be 22 years since the 1998 floods..
          But that does not make the current floods a 1 in 22 year flood…
          It’s the long term odds that matter.

          36

          • #
            RicDre

            “Ric it may be 22 years since the 1998 floods…”

            Yes, I know that, but if they are not confident the dams will be effective for a flood of known magnitude that happened 22 years earlier, how confident could they be of it being effective for a 1 in 1,000 year or 1 in 10,000 year flood?

            71

        • #
          AndyG55

          Depends what they mean by “effective”

          Designing for flood control is very difficult.

          …. and just because there was a severe storm 22 years ago, does NOT mean its a “statistical” 1 in 22 year event

          20

          • #
            RicDre

            “Designing for flood control is very difficult.”

            True.

            “and just because there was a severe storm 22 years ago, does NOT mean its a “statistical” 1 in 22 year event”

            True.

            “Depends what they mean by ‘effective’”

            True. Given that there have been major floods on the Yangtze River in 1870, 1931, 1954, 1998, and 2010 they should at least have some idea of what ‘effective’ flood control would be.

            30

      • #
        RickWill

        Designing for the PMF for a dam like this is primarily sizing the overflow for safety reasons. Three Gorges Dam is a power generating dam with limited capacity for flood mitigation. Its working volume is only 5% of the annual throughput.

        It could be expected that once the overflow is operating that the dam actually makes downstream flooding worse because the water velocity through the storage is greatly reduced. That eliminates the natural backing up that occurs in a river valley. Some of the natural storage in the river system is now flooded to gain elevation for the hydropower generators.

        20

        • #
          RicDre

          RickWill, you make very good points about the Three Gorges Dam’s limited utility for flood control, but flood control was one of the talking points the Chinese Government used to justify its construction and they still use it today:

          Three Gorges Dam mitigates Yangtze flood

          http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/a/202007/03/WS5efe85dba310834817256f22.html

          20

          • #
            RickWill

            The dam can clip the top off small flood events but will likely make large flood events worse as could be the case now. Once the storage is at capacity and the overflow is in operation the dam no longer acts as a buffer. Although it can provide a bit more reaction time in the initial stages.

            This paper provides the detail on the dam flood mitigation:
            https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1674237017301047
            It concludes:

            The TGD alone cannot eliminate flood disasters related to large flood events, but can mitigate them partially. To prevent potentially significant flood disasters, comprehensive flood management is necessary.

            40

            • #
              RicDre

              RickWill: All very good points. I suppose you could interpret “Three Gorges Dam mitigates Yangtze flood” to mean “Three Gorges Dam was helpful controlling the Yangtze flood as long as it stayed small “. Reading the China Daily is kind of like reading Pravda in the old USSR.

              30

          • #

            Tho’ you could break,Three Gorges Dam,
            And bring down bad government via
            that cultural Mandate of Heaven,

            Yet do not break, Three Gorges Dam,
            The cost is too high in human
            Suffering.

            30

            • #
              Bill In Oz

              It would be the last resort of the desperate.
              And Taiwan left alone and isolated, on the verge of invasion
              Fits exactly this situation.

              11

    • #
      RickWill

      The dam is there mainly for power generation. It provides little benefit in flood mitigation. There is some potential to shave peaks for small events but it releases water in the larger events.

      40

  • #
    David Maddison

    While searching to see if Australia still gives taxpayer money to China as we do with that other nuclear weapon power, Pakistan, I came across this little gem from the Australian Government.

    https://www.dfat.gov.au/geo/china/Pages/china-country-brief

    QUOTES
    -Australia adheres to its one-China policy, which means we do not recognize Taiwan as a country.

    -Climate change is another area of cooperation between Australia and China.

    -Australia’s approach to managing differences on human rights in China aims to be constructive and is based on dialogue.

    54

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Diplomatic contortions
      Lead to this sort of foul tasting international ‘spaghetti’

      56

    • #
      James Murphy

      A clear call for dialogue:
      https://youtu.be/9WjEmi49d0A

      30

    • #
      Analitik

      I came across this little gem from the Australian Government

      I imagine this policy was formed during the tenure of Julie Bishop as Minister for Foreign Affairs

      30

    • #
      el gordo

      ‘Australia adheres to its one-China policy, which means we do not recognize Taiwan as a country.’

      That is the official stance, Taiwan is a remnant of the civil war and Beijing would like to snuff out the ROC once and for all. Only the western world is stopping them.

      https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taiwan,_China

      41

      • #
        Serp

        China repeatedly demonstrates that the “western world is stopping them” from doing nothing whatsoever; we’ve been advised on an earlier thread that Taiwan has publicly threatened to destroy the Three Gorges Dam as a counter move to invasion.

        If the dam fails and the PRC loses a third of its people and is plunged into famine Taiwan will be obliged to choose another target but more likely it will devote resources to a massive aid effort.

        30

        • #
          el gordo

          The western world has encouraged them to leave Taiwan alone, its history. Of corse they will continue to posture, but its fake, they have no intention of invading.

          The dam won’t crumble, so we can breathe a sigh of relief that WW3 will be averted.

          13

          • #
            Bill In Oz

            Ummmm ?
            Now why would Taiwan ever rely on the the ‘encouragement’ of the Western world to deter China ?
            It’s own defence forces are adequate.
            And the Three Gorges dam offers a target which is sufficient deterrent to any actual attack.
            China will as in the past make lots of blathering noisy nonsense
            And attempt to undermine Taiwan economically & psychologically.

            02

            • #
              el gordo

              The time is not right for Beijing to move on Taiwan, the world would be in uproar. You can see how fragile things are after the pandemic, Premier Xi needs to save face and cannot risk any further deterioration in international relations.

              31

              • #
                Bill In Oz

                Xi is the Fascist dictator of China.
                The track record for such ‘leaders’ is poor.

                11

  • #
    RicDre

    And if you like crazy conspiracy theories, how about this one:

    Crazy idea, but it might happen

    https://www.adirondackdailyenterprise.com/opinion/letters-to-the-editor/2020/07/crazy-idea-but-it-might-happen/

    11

    • #
      el gordo

      ‘If over the next few months, Xi Jinping receives word from his advisors that the dam is going to fail, he may order it to be blown. Western spy agencies will be able to confirm the dam’s failure due to explosives (but not who did it). This can be his Reichstag fire and Pearl Harbor all in one.’

      That won’t happen.

      Nostradamus clearly predicted the antichrist would emerge from the east, which was a safe bet because he already knew they were heathens.

      If Premier Xi thinks the dam is under unprecedented pressure he would warn the people to clear out and if it collapsed there would be an outpouring of sympathy from the rest of the world. The Covid-19 debacle will fade into history.

      31

  • #
    TdeF

    It’s odd. If this potential Climate related disaster was happening anywhere else, the Greens would be up in arms, demanding immediate punishment of the Climate Criminals responsible.

    In fact I have never read a negative comment about China’s massive consumption of coal. It’s only our fault for producing it. Not Indonesia’s fault.

    Amazingly there are no marches demanding Saudi Arabia stop flooding the world with super cheap petrol. Odd. No protests in Riyadh or Havana or Caracas or Beijing or Moscow about Climate Extinction or even Black Lives Matter? We had the protests in the middle of a pandemic and the argument that we had to apologise for the slave trade in ab*rigines.

    Consider that all the world saving windmills are in rich countries which do not need them and you have to wonder about real Green priorities in stopping coal, oil gas produciton when there is no concern about consumption in China. Or even coal production in Indonesia, equal in exports to that in Australia.

    Where are the marches in Bali, demanding change from the Indonesian government and that they run Bali on Windmills? Or Thailand or Vietnam.

    It’s as if the whole Green movement and now the Black Lives Matter movement is focused on destroying Western democracies?

    Not a word from the Greens about possibly the biggest Climate related disaster of all time? And AntiFa have nothing to say about China. Not a word from the marchers about racism or slavery in China either.

    Some countries are never criticized. Why?

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    • #
      WXcycles

      Don’t forget Beijing CCP and Chinese military destruction of numerous natural coral reefs around South China Sea atolls. The greenie plus UN hypocrisy has no limitations, absent all vision, absent conscience, morals and ethic, any time it suits them to comfort and supplicate real environmental vandals engaged in considered knowing genuine destruction of the global environment. Why is it the greenies always aid and abet the corrupt, sick and perverse, while bad-mouthing and attacking the good, the proper and the just, who are and have been doing it right for a long time?

      Because they subvert the young and dumb at high school and university level with a load of fake ideological drivel, and no end of false accusations and imputations of bad intent in the Western heart.

      Frankly greenie groups in the Western world should be abolished, they have no reason or justification to exist here. Go set up shop in China and Russia, let’s see how that goes.

      102

    • #
      Gary Simpson

      Perhaps because it’s their spiritual (and idealogical) homeland.

      10

  • #
    TdeF

    It’s odd. If this potential Climate related disaster was happening anywhere else, the Greens would be up in arms, demanding immediate punishment of the Climate Criminals responsible.

    In fact I have never read a negative comment about China’s massive consumption of coal. It’s only our fault for producing some of it. Not Indonesia’s fault. Most of China’s coal is their own.

    Amazingly there are no marches demanding Saudi Arabia stop flooding the world with super cheap petrol. Odd. No protests in Riyadh or Havana or Caracas or Beijing or Moscow about Climate Extinction or even Black Lives Matter? We had the protests in the middle of a pandemic and the argument that we had to apologise for the slave trade in ab*rigines created by Captain Cook.

    Consider that all the world saving windmills are in rich countries which do not need them and you have to wonder about real Green priorities in stopping coal, oil gas production when there is no concern at all about consumption in China. Or even coal production in Indonesia, now equal in exports to that from Australia. If we stopped exporting, Indonesia would happily fill the gap.

    Where are the marches in Bali, demanding change from the Indonesian government and that they run Bali on Windmills? Or Thailand or Vietnam.

    It’s as if the whole Green movement and now the Black Lives Matter movement is focused on destroying Western democracies?

    Not a word from the Greens about possibly the biggest Climate related disaster of all time? And AntiFa have nothing to say about China. Not a word from the marchers about racism or slavery in China either.

    Some governments are never criticized. Why not?

    62

    • #
      Dennis

      Answer

      06:43 PM ET 02/10/2015
      Economic Systems: The alarmists keep telling us their concern about global warming is all about man’s stewardship of the environment. But we know that’s not true. A United Nations official has now confirmed this.

      At a news conference last week in Brussels, Christiana Figueres, executive secretary of U.N.’s Framework Convention on Climate Change, admitted that the goal of environmental activists is not to save the world from ecological calamity but to destroy capitalism.

      “This is the first time in the history of mankind that we are setting ourselves the task of intentionally, within a defined period of time, to change the economic development model that has been reigning for at least 150 years, since the Industrial Revolution,” she said.

      Referring to a new international treaty environmentalists hope will be adopted at the Paris climate change conference later this year, she added: “This is probably the most difficult task we have ever given ourselves, which is to intentionally transform the economic development model for the first time in human history.”

      The only economic model in the last 150 years that has ever worked at all is capitalism. The evidence is prima facie: From a feudal order that lasted a thousand years, produced zero growth and kept workdays long and lifespans short, the countries that have embraced free-market capitalism have enjoyed a system in which output has increased 70-fold, work days have been halved and lifespans doubled.

      Figueres is perhaps the perfect person for the job of transforming “the economic development model” because she’s really never seen it work. “If you look at Ms. Figueres’ Wikipedia page,” notes Cato economist Dan Mitchell: Making the world look at their right hand while they choke developed economies with their left.

      50

      • #
        WXcycles

        This is the first time in the history of mankind that we are setting ourselves the task of intentionally, within a defined period of time, to change the economic development model that has been reigning for at least 150 years, since the Industrial Revolution,” she said.

        Disposable political parasite prattles on with much ado about nothing, to scare-up an imaginary crythisth so she can scam people silly enough to pay attention to the silly euro-troll.

        103

        • #
          TdeF

          Study her form. An anthropologist by degree, she was the daughter of Jose Figueres, the founding President of Cost Rica (population 5million) after a short civil war. And her brother was also President. The whole family now seems to inhabit the United Nations. The UN is a second home for failed politicians and their families. And as in East Germany, socialist is what totalitarians call themselves.

          101

          • #
            Dennis

            As was pointed out by former Senator Cory Bernardi on Sky recently, note that he spent time at the United Nations as a delegate from The Australian Parliament when he was a Senator for South Australia in Canberra, that the UN has become redundant for the purposes for which it was intended to perform for member nations, infiltrated and hijacked by the CCP and other “developing nations” fellow travellers who are intent on opposing the United States of America and its allies.

            I have long been concerned about our Federal Government’s obsession with becoming a member of obviously leftist dominated UN organisations and committees, even now with COVID-19 and the very recent decision announced that the US will no longer support the WHO, and earlier defunded that UN organisation, Australia remains supportive of WHO. Same goes for the anti-CO2 Paris Agreement that the US refused to sign but Australia signed in April 2016 and then returned (Turnbull Government) to ratify that Agreement unnecessarily during November 2016.

            Why not focus on the G10 for nation to nation discussions and cooperation instead?

            80

          • #
            Bill In Oz

            But TdeF, Costa Ricca is remarkable in the world.
            It abolished it’s army in 1949.
            And since then has always had democratically elected governments
            Unlike all of it’s neighbours in Central America.

            22

            • #
              TdeF

              Population 5 million, it is small and democratic. And there is no military but the President has a Special Forces Unit.

              Costa Rica and Panama are better and more prosperous than their neighbours and Costa Rica is considered a real democracy but the refugees in Melbourne are economic refugees.
              American companies have setup there, presumably because for Central America it is safer without an ongoing civil war.

              And Costa Rica has been pushing Christiana Figueres to be the next Secretary General of the United Nations.

              “Figueres’s anti-capitalism has deep roots. Her father, Jose Figueres Ferrer, President of Costa Rica from 1953–1958 (and Provisional President 1948–1949) was a self-described “farmer-socialist” running under the banner of the National Liberation Party who led what he called “a deeper and more human revolution than that of Cuba” while nationalizing the banking industry. Her brother, Jose Maria Figueres, was President from 1994–1998. She earned her masters in social anthropology from the Left-dominated London School of Economics. Perhaps not surprisingly, the family is heavily invested in the renewable energy industry they hope will replace fossil fuels.

              Combine an anti-capitalist ideological commitment to socialism with the pursuit of their own profit through mandated renewable energy, and Figueres’s complaint against heavy industry needs no further explanation.”

              60

  • #
    WXcycles

    The rain indicator shown is at the lower dam wall of three Gorges Dam region, showing rainfall map totals over next 10-days (ECMWF). Eastern Himalaya has rainfall totals in areas between 1,200mm to 1,780mm.

    https://i.ibb.co/KGPdbn6/1-Three-Gorges-2020-07-09-ECMWF-10day-rain-total-forecast.jpg

    https://i.ibb.co/CskM6hF/2-Three-Gorges-2020-07-09-ECMWF-10day-rain-total-forecast.jpg

    Most of it’s below 6 inches of rain over 10-days though.

    43

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Since when have forecasts for rain 10 days into the future been accurate ? I do not accept that WXC.

      However the map does indicate that this flooding is a consequence of a South West monsoonal movement of saturated air from the Pacific & Indian oceans Northwards. It’s a major weather event. Sp major floods not just in China but also India, Bangladesh, Nepal, Burma, etc. as the waters from these rain move downstream back to the sea.

      15

      • #
        WXcycles

        I tracked the developments leading up to and then right through the Townsville and NQ flood in Feb last year. It was stunningly accurate, I’ve monitored it through several other events, and the same, it is a very useful guide to likely rainfall range totals. I do accept it as a valid and useful indicator as it’s proven it’s utility to me many times.

        82

        • #
          Bill In Oz

          Do you pay for access ?
          The single image is just that a single image.

          04

          • #
            WXcycles

            You don’t understand what you’re criticizing Bill, it’s free open access, and is not a single image source. Anyone can get full detail on each individual 3-hour section of the forecast for the first 5 days of any run, then every 6 hours for the next 5 days after that. It’s very accurate in my extensive experience with using it. And this is not about opinion, it’s about verified performance on multiple occasions. It’s a professional level forecast, which is widely considered to be the best available in the world today on the global scale. What you see on all the commercial and public broadcasters and internet sites today is almost always a subset of this ECMWF model. I’m very confident of its performance it rarely gets it much wrong within the first 5 days, on a regional forecast scale, and is quite accurate and useful as a guide out to 10 days.

            There’s in fact no ‘event’ left here in the forecast over central China, what’s currently forecast is prosaic summer rain storms, on top of prior ground saturation conditions resulting in overland flow. Unfortunate for the existing flooded people and cities, but otherwise not unusual in the forecast period.

            20

  • #
    William Astley

    I believe this is the official Chinese Party response, as it was issued from one of the Chinese Party run fake news outlets, June 22, 2020.

    The Three gorges Dam, is designed to handle a water level of up to 175 meters and the water level in the dam was at 147 meters, two meters over normal high level, June 20th.

    There is a system that is built into the dam that measures stress on the dam and deformation. If there was a problem, that system would provide warning.

    There is no risk of the three-gorge dam failing. The dam will just open its flood gates now. It would be interesting to see how high the water is now in the dam and what is the flow out of the dam.

    There is severe downstream flooding now that the flow into the dam must be the same as the flow out of the dam.

    https://www.globaltimes.cn/content/1192443.shtml

    So, if there really is no problem, why did the Chinese Ministry of Water resources issue a warning of a black swan flooding event? He did not specify location.

    Cover his butt? He would have the detailed data for the water sheds.

    From a scientific standpoint there is in the paleo record evidence of periods of unusual flooding, in specific regions, that goes on and on and on. The evidence points to a flood weather pattern that seems to keep forming. i.e. There is something that is causing the same weather pattern to reform in specific regions.

    There is evidence of very, very large floods in the paleo record, for the US West coast, for example.

    60

    • #
      Chad

      William Astley
      July 9, 2020 at 12:19 pm · Reply
      I believe this is the official Chinese Party response, as it was issued from one of the Chinese Party run fake news outlets, June 22, 2020.

      The Three gorges Dam, is designed to handle a water level of up to 175 meters and the water level in the dam was at 147 meters, two meters over normal high level, June 20th.

      There is a system that is built into the dam that measures stress on the dam and deformation. If there was a problem, that system would provide warning.

      There is no risk of the three-gorge dam failing.

      Whilst i do not believe the dam will fail,…
      … there is a big difference between what it is DESIGNED to do, and what might happen.
      China, and many other countries,..have suffered multiple dam failures on what were presumeably not designed to fail.
      Nature has a way of throwing up all sorts of unexpected events that cannot be anticipated.
      So , never say there is NO risk.!

      40

      • #
        William Astley

        Hi Chad,

        I agree 110%.

        Particularly as the Three Gorges Dam is a super big, one of a kind construction project, which supplies a 1/3 of China’s power.

        It is asserted, in the Chinese ‘system’. a super, high profile, project that has enormous energy benefits…. there is no one that can say no, could stop that project.

        … That big picture, Three Gorges Dam’s fact provides the opportunity for amazing failure.

        Also super big construction projects run by one company, with no independent oversight provides the opportunity for amazing failure.

        The Three Gorges Dam’s Spillway, is apparently submerged…

        … and a submerged spillway design at high flow rates can lead and has led to cavitation, destruction of the spillway could cause failure of the dam.

        The second issue is with cracking of the dam’s structure.

        60

    • #
      el gordo

      ‘There is something that is causing the same weather pattern to reform in specific regions.’

      ENSO is a major player.

      40

  • #
    Serge Wright

    The cause of the 1/1000 year flood is from which of the following:
    a. Random weather event
    b. Climate change
    c. Bad karma for releasing COVID
    d. Bad karma for targeting Australia with trade sanctions and travel bans

    I’m picking “d” :)

    60

    • #
      TdeF

      So if it was a once in a 1,000 year event, it was expected?

      21

      • #
        TdeF

        And these historical views. When Charles XII invaded Russia , in 1708 he was beaten by the ‘coldest winter in 500 years’. As with Napoleon in 1812. And Hitler in 1942.
        It’s amazing how winter is always unexpectedly cold when you lose. Who said history was written by the winners? Excuses are certainly written by the losers.
        All the more remarkable as no one had thermometers.

        So with the Federation drought, the Millenium drought exactly 100 years later. The planet must have a clock which ticks in 100 year interval.

        Now we have thermometers accurate to 0.001C. But you can never trust them as the reading is never right until it is homogenized by experts in homogenization and Australia leads the world. And homogenization can take 100 years to complete.

        At least China will not have another such flood for another 1,000 years.

        71

      • #
        David A

        What is the evidence for a one in one thousand year event?

        00

        • #
          AndyG55

          The 1 in 1000 is a statistical value derived from past rainfall extreme events using a fitting algorithm (usually what is called a Log Pearson III, because that transform usually gives a reasonably straight line)

          Trouble is, that once you get outside the time range of the data you actually have, the errors get rather large, to say the least !!!

          So any ARI (average recurrence interval) or AEP (annual exceedance probability) value is purely a sort of semi-educated guestimate.

          Here is an example using 53 years of data from a gauge station on the Tyers River in Gippsland.. Remember that the vertical axis is a log axis, so those dotted lines show very large range of possible events.

          https://tonyladson.files.wordpress.com/2018/08/tyers_browns_ffa_plot.png

          Hope that helps a bit.

          20

      • #
        David A

        What is the evidence for a one in one thousand year event?

        00

    • #
      WXcycles

      Darwin Xmas morning 1974 was about Gough Whitlam?

      41

      • #
        TdeF

        Political Climate Change. It can be sudden.

        31

        • #
          TdeF

          And it is intriguing, if anyone has noticed, how these days infamous polls are usually wrong. Brexit, Boris, Trump, Morrison.

          It seems asking 1,000 people across an entire country what they think gives little indication of the result. This is despite the common practice of quoting the standard deviation of sqrt(1000) or 3.16% as some sort of meaningful number. Like average temperature. Or the average family of 2 1/2 children. Polls are never random and rarely representative of anyone but the people polled. Social Science Fiction like Climate Science Fiction.

          31

  • #
    MarkMcD

    This is the place where I grow the F***s I have to give for other People’s problems.

    So I have none to give for China right now

    10

  • #
    PeterS

    I wonder if this will lead to mass starvation due to a significant loss of farming and crop losses thus compounding the problems facing not just China but also surrounding nations.

    10

    • #
      Dennis

      China plans ahead, Australians jump up and down when they hear about another acquisition of farmland or related business by foreign investment from China but do they realise what China really wants, being food supplies?

      In recent times two milk processing businesses were sold to Chinese buyers, businesses sold by Japanese owners. Why were those businesses sold? Lack of profits.

      China is not focused on profitability, they want to secure food supplies for their 1.4 billion people long term.

      By the way, if Australia stopped dancing to the UN tunes, stopped implementing UN Treaties such as Agenda 21 now 30 – Sustainability, and did not lock up public land and marine areas as National Parks prohibiting logging, dam building, fishing, mining and even recreational activities and cattle grazing, national prosperity would increase. Eliminating CO2 via the IPCC Paris Agreement resulting in very high pricing unreliable electricity supply via unreliable energy and developing electric vehicle transition, and much more like needing UN permission to plan flight paths for the new Sydney Badgerys Creek International Airport and limiting new dams with water licensing restrictions, our future as a nation would be far brighter.

      30

      • #
        Dennis

        Of course without the UN influenced destruction of businesses including manufacturing industry and segments of irrigation farming China would buy the food products they instead buy the sources.

        10

      • #
        WXcycles

        China is not focused on profitability, they want to secure food supplies for their 1.4 billion people long term.

        Missing something there though Dennis, they want the giant economy to build the worlds largest and most advanced military. It’s not just about food and social stability.

        “Power grows out of the barrel of a gun.” – Mao Tse-tung

        “War can only be abolished through war, and in order to get rid of the gun it is necessary to take up the gun.” – Mao Tse-tung

        By which he meant, to go to war, to seize power and ultimate control. The Western military superiority approach has always emphasized deterrence against going to war, and maintaining a relatively peaceful world in the interim, and it’s worked fairly well for 75 years now, the deaths and woundings from war have routinely dropped to a low level since WWII. And continues to do so.

        That will all change if the Chinese Communists exert their Power via war philosophy to try to take global power and force their authoritarian ‘socialism’, with Chinese characteristics, on to the whole world (and no wonder they favor the European Commission so much).

        20

  • #
    David Maddison

    This graph shows why China is buying up farmland and food manufacturers all around the world.

    They know that as the climate continues to change and the world finishes the current warm interglacial the planet continues to cool and China is particularly susceptible to famine, disease and war due to global cooling.

    At the same time they benefit from promoting global warming to ignorant Western countries like Australia (courtesy of our plentiful useful idiots) and sell us vast numbers of solar panels, such unreliable energy also having the additional benefit for them of weakening Western economies, except Trump’s USA.

    GRAPH: https://c3headlines.typepad.com/.a/6a010536b58035970c01b8d0f76684970c-pi

    COMMENTS: https://www.c3headlines.com/2015/03/climate-antiquity-china-evidence-reveals-long-history-of-climate-change-war.html

    31

    • #
      Dennis

      Is China a developing country?

      Read the informed comments, one I noted was the possibility of economic collapse resulting in war, but many others are interesting;

      https://www.quora.com/Is-China-a-developing-country?share=1

      10

      • #
        PeterS

        Yes it’s a developing country. It’s developing into a dangerous monster. It’s not the fault of the Chinese people but solely on the CCP.

        20

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Chinese people ( not China ) have been buying businesses and land for those businesses for the past 30 years.
      The Chinese people have a very acute awareness of their own nation’s history – especially since 1910
      With all it’s natural & man made catastrophes.
      Investing elsewhere and gaining residency visas elsewhere, makes good sense in this context.
      And there are now over 50 million Chinese living around the world outside CCP China.

      23

  • #
    yarpos

    If the 3 Gorges Dam fails this will be used as “logic” for why no dams can be built anywhere, along the lines of nuclear power always raising the spectres of Chernobyl (irrelevant due to technology) and Fukushima (irrelevant due to sensible location of proposed reactors)

    50

  • #
    Roger Knights

    Is Shanghai at risk of being flooded?

    00

    • #
      Roger Knights

      I’ve just learned there’s no flooding risk, because the factory is actually on the bank of the Yellow Sea.

      10