JoNova

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Global Warming to destroy sea-food as well

It’s a disaster for fish and chip shops. Children won’t know what a sea-food restaurant is.

Our oceans are warming by 0.005 °C per year (if you believe a thermometer system with a 0.5 °C error). But fish that cope with five degrees of natural variation will apparently be devastated by an average rise of five thousands of a degree per year. Who knew?

Earth’s oceans vary from 0 – 30° C. Warm and cold currents wander, eddy currents swirl. Very little of the ocean’s surface is actually at the exact “average” temperature. In any one spot, temperatures can be a full five degrees above or below average (as in this NOAA graph, below).

Global Sea Surface Temperature, NOAA, anomaly

The sea surface temperature varies by up to five degrees from average every day

Humans may well be changing global fish stocks, but why toss in the unscientific advertising for “climate change”? As for the acidification scare, ocean pH changes on a daily basis, and hundreds of studies show that marine life might even benefit from a slight increase in “acidification”.

ScienceDaily

Seafood supply altered by climate change

The global supply of seafood is set to change substantially and many people will not be able to enjoy the same quantity and dishes in the future due to climate change and ocean acidification, according to UBC scientists.

These findings were released today in Japan by the Nereus program, an international research team led by UBC scientists and supported by the Nippon Foundation. The Nereus program was formed to study the future of the world’s oceans and seafood resources. Today it released a summary of the first phase of its research in a report titled ‘Predicting Future Ocean.’ Researchers say that the future supply of seafood will be substantially altered by climate change, overfishing and other human activities.

“The types of fish that we will have on our dinner table will be very different in the future,” said William Cheung, UBC associate professor and the co-director of the Nereus program. “Fisheries will be catching more warm-water species, with smaller size, and that will affect fish supply through our domestic and oversea fisheries as well as imports.”

The report highlighted climate change, ocean acidification, overfishing and destruction of marine ecosystems as the primary drivers of ocean change. Researchers say these changes will lead to a decline in fisheries in many regions and alter marine biodiversity and food web structures.

Researchers say there are solutions to help the ocean and communities prepare for the future. These include improving ocean governance globally to ensure sustainable fisheries and the need to limit carbon dioxide emissions.

“Global marine ecosystems have already been largely altered by overfishing,” said Daniel Pauly, professor at UBC and an advisor to Nereus. “This report clearly points out that any solution needs to deal with the CO2 problem as well.”

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90 comments to Global Warming to destroy sea-food as well

  • #
    Andrew

    Tim Blair notes that warming causes shark attacks in N Carolina. As usual, 0.01C kills all plant and animal life except the ones we hate.

    242

    • #
      Rick

      Q: What’s a more likely cause for the record number of shark attacks in North Carolina?

      A: Chum lines near swimming areas.

      I’m sure the sharks couldn’t care less about the supposed 0.01 C temperature rise (assuming they could perceive a 0.01 C temperature rise).

      112

  • #
    TdeF

    Stocks of flying fish will be depleted too as higher air temperatures mean lower pressures and the fish will not glide as far to escape predators. Marginally higher surface temperatures will lower friction for high speed predators too, lowering fish stocks further. Then increased ice in arctic regions due to global warming will confuse fish who will bump into ice when fleeing, making them easy prey for seals. As Charles Darwin discovered, there is no way any species with a short life will quickly adapt by selection, so they are all doomed and without fish and chips, the British people will vanish. The end of the world is nigh, unless you send all your ready cash to the Climate Council, if you care about your children and your children’s children.

    511

  • #
    TdeF

    Sorry flying fish. No one thinks of the flying fish.

    140

    • #
      Rereke Whakaaro

      Air Traffic Controllers worry about them all of the time. Mind you, they worry about a lot of things.

      70

      • #
        ROM

        Yeh!
        CASA worries about those Flying Fish because they aren’t sure if those Flying Fish have read those 800 or so pages of CASA regulations that flying schools and private flyers are supposed to have read and obeyed on bended knee in homage to still another over staffed, over paid, Canberra based Orwellian CASA bureaucracy.

        40

  • #
    Oswald Thake

    Mad! Quite, quite mad. As mad as wee Madelaine McMad of Madtown, County Mad.

    170

  • #
    Byron

    So if all the tasty fish are so sensitive to a slight real or homogenised rise in temperature that they’ll become extinct then they must have became extinct during the Eemian only to become extinct again during the Holocene optimum and became extinct again during the Minoan warm period ? This means that either all the tasty fish that exist today are figments of Our imaginations or that the threat to the tasty fish from a slight rise in temperature is a figment of someone else’s overheated imagination . Hmmm , which is it I wonder ?

    241

    • #
      handjive

      A new record of past climate change shows that a warm climate in northern Europe can be hit by a sudden cooling associated with an interruption of the North Atlantic Ocean circulation and the Gulf Stream.

      The investigated time interval, called the Eemian, occurred before the last Ice Age and was characterized by warmer-than-present temperatures in large parts of the globe. The Eemian climate evolution can therefore serve as an analogue for a future warmer climate.
      . . .
      Wait! What?
      So 2014 wasn’t the hottest year “evah”?

      91

  • #
    john karajas

    Does this actually mean that fish will become extinct in ski fields and that they will join the climate refugee polar bears?

    100

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      There is an obvious feedback mechanism. As the sea ice melts the polar bears will fall off into the sea, and eat the sharks etc.

      90

    • #
      Just Thinkin'

      John,
      Talking about Polar Bears, there was a report in
      today’s Courier Mail (QLD) (page 38) headline
      “Polar Bears in peril due to climate”.
      From a report of the US Fish and Wildlife Service
      in a draft recovery plan. This was part of the
      process after the agency listed the species as
      threatened in 2008.

      “Halting Arctic warming will require a global
      commitment.”
      “Greenhouse gas emissions contribute to global warming,
      which is reducing the amount of Summer sea ice in
      the Arctic.”
      This from Jennifer Kohout, their regional program
      manager.

      These people never miss an opportunity to
      carry on with their fraud, do they?

      20

  • #
    Sonny

    Im getting bored of this Jo, i’m surprised you can keep going.
    Well done.

    91

  • #
    Graeme No.3

    It must be the acid in the water that makes me repeat:

    From the Chiefio:
    http://abcnews.go.com/Technology/wireStory/iowa-state-scientist-prison-faking-aids-research-32161935

    Ex-Iowa State Scientist Gets Prison for Faking HIV Research

    Now that is a trend that could catch on.

    110

  • #
    Robert O

    I would have thought that the Japanese had a lot more to do with reducing fish stocks by over-fishing than a highly debatable insignificant increase in water temperature. Looking at the loss of fish stocks on a world basis water temperature is the least worrying concern. Water temperature didn’t reduce the stocks of cod to nothing on the Newfoundland Banks, the Atlantic salmon on the East coast of Canada and the US, tuna stocks in the Pacific, herring in the North Sea,…..

    120

    • #
      Bill

      Don’t forget the Pacific Salmon, Halibut, Abalone, Scallops, etc

      50

    • #

      The only way humanity has had any impact on numbers of fish and shellfish is via overfishing and overharvest.

      The assumption the water temperature warriors make is that nobody knows about the PDO or the ADO, both of which involve changes in water temperature over a massive area of the North Pacific and the North Atlantic. Cheers -

      91

      • #
        el gordo

        Unlike trees, which don’t handle abrupt climate change very well, fish have easily moved around for millions of years and avoided extinction.

        61

    • #
      TdeF

      No one is really concerned about fish stocks, of course. It is just another fantasy beat up to join the thousands of others. However real depletion of world fish stocks is a huge worry.

      The early attempts by Sir Walter Raleigh (he signed Rawley) to colonize the Eastern seaboard of the US failed, on the coast of North Carolina, a combination of isolation, disease, Indian conflict, the war with the Spanish and the failure of the tobacco. What really made US colonization successful were the enormous fish stocks off the US coast. It was the entire justification for settling on places like Cape Cod. By 1600 thousands of tons a year of cod were being caught by 650 ships with just hand lines and baited hooks. The whaling was also an important industry and ultimately gave rise to the tale of Moby Dick. As in the Etymologicon, Ahab’s second in command was a Mr Starbuck after whom the coffee chain was named (It was nearly named after Perquod, the ship)

      Now that the US, Mexico and Canada have a population of near 400 million people, 100x that of Elizabeth I’s England, you have to wonder how there are any fish left at all before the warmists start their silly story of 0.005C affecting fish stocks.

      61

    • #
      Glenn999

      Perhaps they’re taking advantage of a situation, in which the world’s people seem gullible enough to believe anything you say about global warming, to cover their collective butts on the whole overfishing thing.

      60

  • #
    leon

    Jo
    i have been following your site for a while.
    Why has sensationalist headlines and overblown rhetoric started to creep into the articles.
    I come here for balance and educated overview of the latest news.
    The comments and responses are very much a part of my decision process and I will always have you as a shortcut on my favorites bar.
    Anyone searching around the issues will find your site.
    So why the tabloid headlines.

    51

    • #

      Leon, I’ve been doing satire since the beginning. It’s too hard to take these articles seriously.

      201

      • #
        Canadian

        So sad to see UBC, a once respected and respectable university, sink to such lows and sign onto this nonsense. Pardon me while I go in search of a tissue.

        40

        • #
          Another Ian

          Isn’t that the one with Weaver as the poster boy?

          31

          • #
            Bill

            That’s UVic. He’s now an MLA in the BC Provincial Legislature – the token greenie.

            31

            • #
              mark fraser

              Elected in a riding of politically correct, snooty coupon clippers doing their bit to leave their mark on the earth – in a positive and loving way. Sort of like a half-Brit version of Marin County.

              41

              • #
                Bill

                they don’t rate that highly. I live in the next riding over, he was elected by the gullible elderly and university students.

                10

        • #
          Allen Fod

          For an outfit to retain its credibility, it must use the correct terms. “Ocean Acidification”, indeed!

          We have if on impeccable authority that the correct term is “assification.”

          31

    • #
      Yonniestone

      A sense of humor… is needed armor. Joy in one’s heart and some laughter on one’s lips is a sign that the person down deep has a pretty good grasp of life….. Hugh Sidney.

      20

    • #
      Rereke Whakaaro

      One of the problems we face, has nothing to do with science, but has everything to do with propaganda, and conditioning.

      A lot of the “stuff” that comes out of “think tanks”, or is spouted by academics “off the record” to journalists, is utter rubbish.

      But it sounds plausible, and it certainly sounds frightening, so it gets reported, but it rarely has any scientific basis that can be challenged.

      Satire and humour are appropriate counter measures against propaganda and conditioning.

      There was a magical creature in the Harry Potter books that could take on the form of your worst nightmare. The counter to that was to make it look ridiculous. Same principle.

      60

  • #
    Skeptik

    “affect fish supply through our domestic and oversea fisheries”
    Does he mean the overseas fisheries in the Southern Ocean where Japan sends its 25000 tonne trawlers.

    60

    • #
      Rereke Whakaaro

      All of the countries along the North Eastern Pacific rim, have fish, as a staple in their diet. It is not just Japan.

      As these countries get relatively more prosperous, by avoiding the imposts laid on the developed world, by the UN, their populations can afford to eat more fish. This increased demand depletes the local stock, and so the fishing fleets have to travel further to catch it.

      They are now frequently found in the South Pacific, with support vessels, and huge factory ships, that process and freeze the fish as, when, and where, it is caught.

      They totally ignore any exclusive rights that the Island Nations may think they have, because those Island nations have no pragmatic way of enforcing those rights.

      And besides, the Asian maritime nations well understand the giving of gifts, as a mark of respect, to key leaders in any community.

      60

      • #
        sophocles

        Did I miss a magnetic field reversal or did the Old Sheila leave you in the pub too long, Rereke? The countries along the North Eastern Pacific Rim are Canada and the United States of America.

        If we turn the globe the right way up :-) so that Down Under becomes Up Over, we still have a problem when we apply the convention for North to be up. The North Eastern Pacific Rim becomes NZ, and Oz.

        10

        • #
          Rereke Whakaaro

          Oh, you spotted it. I was hoping nobody would notice. I should have said the North Western Pacific Rim. Fingers touch-typing on autopilot, with brain out to lunch. Sorry.

          However, for some reason I do not understand, the Eastern Pacific stops at the 45N parallel. Above that, you have the sea of Okhotsk (although it is written in Russian), and the Bearing Sea (where the Polar Bears live?), the rest is just “Pacific”.

          10

          • #
            sophocles

            You’ll see it clearly if you look at this map (I think you can enlarge sections of it by clicking on the section.)

            The arc from the SW tip if Alaska loops west across to the Kamchatka Peninsular. The island chain of the Aleutians forms that arc and the dividing `barrier’ between the Pacific Ocean and the Bering Sea.

            From the tip of Kamchatka down to Hokkaido Island of Japan are the Kurile Islands. They form the `barrier’ between the Pacific and the Sea of Okhotsk.

            The Kuriles, Kamchatka and the Aleutians are volcanic in origin and many are still active with quite a few erupting over the last five years. They are all on the North American Plate under which the Pacific Plate is subducting. So the Pacific is pretty accurately named. We could, perhaps name the Eastern portion over the Nazca Plate the Sea of Peru or the Andes Ocean :-) but nobody’s done it. When a dividing arc of islands forms, then maybe.

            Similarly, the Southern Ocean starts well south of Oz and NZ, somewhere around the Screaming Sixties and completely surrounds Antarctica.

            00

  • #
    MikeSiesel

    Not to worry. The Brits simply need to adjust their taste buds and eat Silver Carp. Never mind the bones. Could be a major US export if our friends across the pond weren’t so picky.

    https://youtu.be/rPeg1tbBt0A

    50

  • #
    John Smith

    I’m getting old and grumpy
    and it closely tracks with global temp increases
    especially the grumpy part
    the grumpy plateau disappears when I smooth out the data

    121

    • #
      John F. Hultquist

      The word of the day: “grumpy

      We have had global warming to climate weirding, and so on.
      I like the sound of Grumpy Climate.

      Can I take credit? Will y’all send money?

      60

    • #
      Leo G

      You haven’t been swallowing too much Climate Grange by any chance?

      20

  • #
    Colin Henderson

    The real danger is species confusion which will lead to interbreeding and homogenization.

    61

  • #

    The family biz, who are our village chippie are not Italian, whom everybody obviously knows are the best Chippies. However, they do come from Madeira, which sort of counts as being vaguely Dagoish. Their kids have all gone to school with ours, they’re village family, but they still won’t open up on Sundays. Buggers – go figure. They do a hellishly good Doner kebab with all the fresh salad trimmings and with great juicy chillies, all drenched in the hot sauce from hell. You ain’t lived until you’ve lost a few taste buds to their food.

    We’re an adaptable species. We can move off Fish & Chips to kebabs with not too much trouble. I’d still probably miss the chips though …

    Pointman

    101

    • #
      Radical Rodent

      Doner kebab and chips? Use your imagination, lad! Chips are an essential to the average Anglo diet, and have been since William the Bastard brought over French fries in 1066, and we adapted it to its proper form, to complement the battered fish of Alfred the Great, who discovered this while burning his cakes. How can anyone doubt that?

      70

      • #
        sophocles

        Chips are an essential to the average Anglo diet, and have been since William the Bastard brought over French fries in 1066, and we adapted it to its proper form, to complement the battered fish of Alfred the Great,

        Nah. The English were a lot more sensible than that. They fought a vigorous rear-guard action right into the 19th-century ending when the activist group dedicated to keeping the potato out of Britain, and called “The Society for the Prevention of an Unwholesome Diet” lost the war. As for the fish, it was orginally whale, as in “I’ll ‘ave ‘arf a ton of chips and a battered whale, please mate.

        Everybody knows that.

        00

    • #
      Allen Fod

      Can’t say I have tried Italian chips, but they had better be good to excel the chips from the Chinese-run kiosk on Hornsby station, only available between the hours of 3:00pm-6:00pm, or thereabouts, Mon-Fri.

      Well worth the trip!

      00

  • #
    Owen Morgan

    In 2011, round about exactly four years ago, I was on a ferry from Shetland to Orkney. Just south of Fair Isle, it crossed paths with a Danish factory ship. These ships hoover up Sand Eels for fertiliser, but Sand Eels are a vital part of the food supply for Puffins and Arctic Terns and other birds. What was clear from the wake of the factory ship was that by-products from processed Sand Eels were just as essential to the Fulmar population. I reckon that the Fulmar flock, trailing the Danish ship, was several miles long.

    Ninety-nine years ago, when the last White-Tailed Eagle in Britain was shot, the Fulmar was pretty much confined, in British waters, to St Kilda, the really outer bit of the Outer Hebrides. By the 1960s, the oily and, by then, conspicuously widespread, Fulmar was interfering with attempts to re-introducce the White-Tailed Eagle. Subsequently, much more successful breeding programmes of the eagle took place away from concentrations of Fulmars.

    In the meantime, populations of Puffins, of related auks, and of Arctic Terns have declined. One reason has been put forward, apart from over-fishing of Sand Eels, to explain the sudden decline of Puffins in British waters. Puffin colonies, consisting of huge numbers of burrows, inevitably collapse over time. Having said that, there’s no reason to expect widespread, simultaneous collapses of Puffin colonies. The Kittiwake (a kind of gull) has also declined catastrophically in recent decades. The Kittiwake hunts Sand Eels, too, but nests on cliff-ledges. It’s immune to collapsing burrows, because it doesn’t burrow. Then there is the Arctic Tern, one of the world’s truly remarkable birds, capable of incredible feats of migration. Anybody who has strayed too close to an Arctic Tern colony on Shetland will know that these birds are ground-nesters, who don’t appreciate visitors. Again, the factory ships must explain the decline in numbers, because the terns’ nesting strategy can’t.

    91

    • #
      Peter Miller

      Owen

      You have touched on a subject I used to campaign about, namely the over-fishing of sand eels in the North Sea.

      As this was real environmentalism, it was a given that no environmental activist group, like Greenpeace or Friends of the Earth, would dream of touching the subject.

      The villains in this story were an unlikely group of people, namely the Danes.

      In the 1990s, they were extracting around 750,000-1,000,000 tonnes of sand eels annually from the North Sea and – I kid you not – burning them in power stations. The EU eventually banned this, so the Danes turned them into fish meal and margarine. Sadly, the EU quota has recently risen back to 200,000 tonnes per year.

      Sand eels are at the bottom of the food chain sea and just about everything there eats them – taking out 750,000-1,000,000 tonnes of food from the bottom of the food chain had catastrophic consequences in terms of fish populations and catches, not to mention sea birds. For a chart on sand eel catches, see: http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=6&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=0CD0QFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.gov.scot%2FUploads%2FDocuments%2FME01ASandeels.pdf&ei=hdeWVankFcOR7AaPnJDQAg&usg=AFQjCNFy8E5HwC1ZMoyDAATq3F2rhqXalg

      However, this was only part of the problem, for every tonne of sand eels caught on the sea floor, approximately another tonne of juvenile fish were caught and then thrown back into the sea dead. In 2005, the EU finally put an almost total ban on sand eel fishing; it took a few years, but now the North Sea is in a very much healthier state.

      Of course, when the sand eel and other fisheries collapsed in the North Sea, who do you think the Danish ‘scientists’ blamed. Of course, you got it in one, it was obviously the fault of global warming.

      I could not find a North Sea temperature chart, but here is a NOAA one of the North Atlantic, which shows – amongst other things – a steep decline in temperature there over the past 4 years: http://www.climate4you.com/images/NOAA%20SST-NorthAtlantic%20GlobalMonthlyTempSince1979%20With37monthRunningAverage.gif

      Bottom line? Most scary climate stories are the result of grant addiction. Without the scary stuff, there will be no future grants – so, how is a guy going to feed his family without churning out the scary stuff?

      132

    • #

      It’s such a relief to hear people discuss actual conservation. When you hear the word “environment” these days it’s usually about selling Segway-based monorails to folks in River City to help save the planet thingy.

      20

  • #
    Ruairi

    The warmists see climate-change dread,
    More clearly,the more decades ahead,
    Such as fish stocks decline,
    So far down the line,
    When those who could check them are dead.

    121

  • #
    Binny

    ‘governance globally’ What more do you need to know?

    40

  • #
    tom0mason

    There are 3 basic science facts wrong with the BBC reporting of the very slight warming causing deoxygenizing of the seas to the point of possibly killing fish.

    1. Oxygen in the atmosphere is around 21%, CO2 is at 400ppm (0.04%). There is so much less CO2 than oxygen available to dissolve in the sea as shown by the figures for seawater — Oxygen = 34.3%, CO2 = 1.4%.

    2. Oxygen’s solubility in seawater varies far less than CO2, and is already at a relatively low level compared to CO2. See Water Solubility of Oxygen, Carbon Dioxide, and Nitrogen where 1.Oxygen (blue), 2.Nitrogen (Pink) and 3.CO2 (Yellow) are compared in fresh and seawater at different temperatures and pressures. Note the very small changes in Oxygen levels with temperature.

    3. They reported that the oxygen is outgassed as the temperature rises but failed to point out that this happens to all dissolved gases — including CO2.
    Henrey’s Law states

    “At a constant temperature, the amount of a given gas that dissolves in a given type and volume of liquid is directly proportional to the partial pressure of that gas in equilibrium with that liquid.

    and

    Temperature dependence of the Henry constant

    When the temperature of a system changes, the Henry constant will also change.[1] This is why some people prefer to name it Henry coefficient. Multiple equations assess the effect of temperature on the constant. … ”

    The BBC is very guilty in this report of not giving a full represenation of the science facts but then again that is what the Green Blob advocacy movement requires.

    111

    • #
      TdeF

      star comment
      Henry’s coefficient? Over what temperature range? To first order most systems are linear and Henry’s linear law works well enough in the laboratory. The ocean water temperature varies very little, 0C to 30C over the entire planet, partly because it is so vast, 400 times as massive as the atmosphere above, so for the case in point, it will be linear enough for calculations.

      The critical aspect which sets CO2 apart from O2 and N2 is its strong polarity which means it can freeze solid at -78C or convert to liquid at high pressure and the oceans get to 400 atmospheres at 4km deep. At even modest depth CO2 appears to be a liquid at 5ml/litre, 0.5% as well which will convert instantly to gas. To counter this, the IPCC argues that as deep currents take 1,000 years to mix, the bulk of CO2 does not reappear. However it is a really silly and utterly unsupported argument and clearly opportunistic rationalization and you have to doubt the behavior of CO2 is understood at these massive pressures and depths. What happens in particular at the interface of the upper ocean and the deep is probably unknown and unable to be modelled, but plumes of CO2 appear from the deep.

      Henry’s Law is a linear rule from which the 50% increase in CO2 roughly corresponds to a quite small 1C increase in sea surface temperature if you add in the 50x reserve. If all the CO2 was released, the concentration would be 2%, not 0.04%.

      O2 and N2 also dissolve in the ocean, or the fish would drown. The CO2 is relatively light too at the surface, or they would asphyxiate. Incidentally it is amazing that floating Phytoplankton actually produce half of the world’s O2. So much for the Brazilian rainforest being the lungs of the world! Think of the plankton!

      In this whole saga of CO2 produced global warming, until very recently the oceans have been almost entirely ignored and the role of the 98% of CO2 dissolved therein. Any perturbation of that massive reserve should be the most likely source of a slight change in CO2, but that does not fit the story of man made Armageddon and a hatred of motor cars and Western democracies. Big Wind and Big Carbon and Big Solar now cannot afford to let the scare die, so it is fully funded.

      141

      • #
        TdeF

        Actually what percentage of fish are herbivores? The fantasy of Madagascar with a friendly vegetarian lion and zebra is silly stuff, but it is even worse in Finding Nemo, a great film in which no fish eats and the sharks are friendly.

        I know whiting can feed on sea grasses and returned mammals like dugongs. However just about every other fish is a carnivore. So the farm starts with the phytoplankton which are microscopic and act as the plants. They are eaten by the tiny prawns, krill and so it goes up the chain. Some baleen whales have cut out the middle man and go for the krill.

        This is typical of public science, the facts twisted to make a happy story of an animal kingdom which is something other than fish eat fish. Similarly with Climate Global Change Warming, a fantasy unsupported by science where a story of evil industrialists ruining the planet and fought by caring Greens is pushed as a sort of tale of the triumph of the poor activist over the evil giant.

        In fact the real story is the exact reverse as a $1Bn a day industry seeks to overwhelm and vilify bloggers trying to talk about science. They are ably supported by renegade faux scientists who argue that a degree, any degree in anything makes you both infallible and uncorruptible. The hero in the real story is the unfunded blog site.

        110

      • #
        sophocles

        Mass of the atmosphere = 5.148 * 10**18 kgs
        Mass of the oceans = 1.37 * 10**21 kgs

        … which makes the oceans 266 or 260-270 times more massive than the atmosphere.

        It’s still two orders of magnitude.

        00

  • #
    tom0mason

    Oops Big error…

    My failure to edit, sorry in –

    “2. Oxygen’s solubility in seawater varies far less than CO2, and is already at a relatively low level compared to CO2. See Water Solubility of Oxygen, Carbon Dioxide, and Nitrogen where 1.Oxygen (blue), 2.Nitrogen (Pink) and 3.CO2 (Yellow) are compared in fresh and seawater at different temperatures and pressures. Note the very small changes in Oxygen levels with temperature.

    Strike the references to other gases the charts are for oxygen only
    The different colors of the graphs relate to the variability of dissolved Oxygen only at different pressures.

    Sorry again my error…

    41

  • #
    handjive

    Video: Global Warming Has Likely Caused Permanent Damage To Oceans

    Sources:CBSScienceNASANASAWorld BankUnited NationsFrench Ministry of Foreign Affairs and International Development (newsy.com)

    40

  • #
    Manfred

    The Green Theatrical Travesty

    By the time the escargot population in Paris collapses under irresistible pressure from the insatiable Green chancre later this year, I sense that the klimate “scientists” and their MSM sycophants are likely to have exhausted their imaginations modeling every conceivable global catastrophe. They will probably need close watching that they don’t actually do a little ‘illustrating’ we will all regret. They’re prone to that sort of desperation to be noticed.

    Wasn’t it so much simpler and no less ineffective when a few dreary raincoat clad people wandered around with a sandwich board proclaiming ‘the end is nigh’?
    Environmentally, it was certainly far sounder.
    And then there was also the element of genuine entertainment.

    51

    • #
      Rereke Whakaaro

      The French Intelligence service came to New Zealand and blew up a Greenpeace ship in Auckland Harbour.

      Now that the next shindig, um, party, er conference, is in Paris, I was wondering if Greenpeace would exact some revenge?

      Perhaps, applying the precautionary principle, the whole of Greenpeace, and all of their fellow travellers, should be placed on the Interpol Watch List?

      For their own protection, of course.

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    Maybe sea life is going to suffer from ocean acidification. But there something even scarier. Global warming is causing random sex changes in the Australian bearded dragon (Pogona vitticeps). It is proper science as there is a peer-reviewed review article in Nature. What next? Kangeroos losing their bounce, or Koalas losing their fur? Suggestions in confidence. The madder, the more likely to get past peer-review.

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      Graeme No.3

      Bearded dragons live in the centre of Australia, where it gets rather hot in summer. The unadjusted temperature readings show no change in temperature over 100 years – See
      http://euanmearns.com/temperature-adjustments-in-australia/

      So there must be some other explanation. I point out that the Left are currently pushing for Federal Parliament to legalise Same Sex Marriages**, so obviously some of these bearded dragons are coming out in anticipation.

      They refer to the Irish Referendum, but have no intention of holding one in Australia in case the people vote the ‘wrong’ way.

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        Greame,
        I have looked at the actual paper. It raises some interesting questions.

        First, the authors do not control for the evolutionary reason for the sex to change. I believe that the female-to-male ratio increases with population density, to maximize offspring.
        Second, the authors incubated the eggs at constant temperatures. I believe the eggs are buried at a few centimeters depth, so although the eggs will not be exposed to the normal daily surface temperature range of 10-15C, over the few weeks of incubation the temperature will vary by quite a few degrees.
        Third the authors say the sex change occurs in the incubation range 32-36C. Average surface temperatures are 22C, ranging from 13C in July to 31C in January. But what are the soil/sand temperatures where the eggs are incubated? In what months are they normally laid?
        Fourth, average temperatures vary from year to year. January 2000 was 29C and January 2006 35C.
        All in all, I believe that the dire claims of species extinction from global warming, even if average temperatures got up 5C, are exaggerated. The extent of the problem can only be understood by proper study. It may not then apply to any other species.
        Also, the summary is quite nuanced. The sex change ratio will change over a very long period even with very extreme warming. By the University of Canberra press release is not so nuanced. But that is normal with these things.

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      TdeF

      Kevin, the world’s oceans are alkali and as a massively buffered solution, cannot acidify ever given all the limestone. If all the aerial CO2 went into the oceans, the total CO2 in the ocean would increase by 1% and carbonic acid is very weak.

      If anything a slight and increase in CO2 at the surface makes the seas more neutral, not more acid. As for sex changes in a bearded dragon, they sound like dwarves, beards for all. It would make any dragon confused and gay marriage may well be legal. Still we have to blame everything in life and the biosphere on CO2 apparently.

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    janama

    O/T – This week Michael Voris looks at the science behind climate change and its role in Pope Francis’ new encyclical. Guests include Dr. Calvin Beisner, Founder and National Spokesman for Cornwall Alliance for the Stewardship of Creation, Lord Christopher Monckton, Chief Policy Advisor for the Science and Public Policy Institute, and Michael Hichborn, Founder of the Lepanto Institute.

    LINK HERE

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    Another Ian

    Jo,

    With all the el Nino talk going on at the moment that is a hell of a warm water stream around the Equator in the eastern Pacific shown on the map up front.

    Maybe you should highlight that the map is 1997?

    Or use something like

    http://weather.gc.ca/saisons/image_e.html?img=2014101700_054_G6_global_I_SEASON_tm@lg@sd_000&title=daily&bc=sea

    though that is anomaly not actual.

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    Geoff Williams

    Another report that is not surprising – global warming / climate change will have a detrimental effect on everything and they mean EVERYTHING!
    Oh! except of course flying – I haven’t heard any problems there. But of course that would mean we would not be able to have our meetings in;
    Paris, and Bonn, and New York, and London, and on and on etc. Never mind the emissions!! Mustn’t stop the flying must we? What no Hols abroad!
    Geoffrey Williams
    Sydney

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    pat

    funny. i heard this “EARLIER WINTER IN 2015″ quote on a radio news bulletin (either Fairfax or ABC) last nite, yet i have not found it in a single MSM report on the topic today. it is only on this website and a retailers’ website:

    3 July: Business Acumen: More positive Budget buoys retail sales, says ARA
    CONTINUED growth in Australian Bureau of Statistics (ABS) May 2015 retail trade figures released today indicate the strength of Australian retail, according to the Australian Retailers Association (ARA), with year on year sales growing 4.6 percent to $24.1 billion…
    ***“In addition to the more appealing spending conditions, many states have seen an ****EARLIER WINTER IN 2015, driving more shoppers into stores for winter essentials such as heating appliances and winter fashions.” – ARA Executive Director Russell Zimmerman…
    This is most evident in Canberra, which produced the most buoyant growth for May 2015 of all the states and territories of seven percent. The Northern Territory was the only state to see a decline in annual sales of 1.4 per cent…
    http://www.businessacumen.biz/index.php/home/business-news-rel.html

    as for climate SCIENCE, find the SCIENCE in the following!

    2 July: Insurance Journal: Don Jergler: Spate of Climate Change Reports Ahead of Global Summit
    Ahead of December’s big and much-talked about United Nations Climate Change Conference, COP21 or CMP11, it seems there’s been an information ramp up of sorts.
    I’m not just talking about Pope Francis’ crusade to call attention to climate change – he most recently said humanity’s reckless behavior has pushed the planet to a breaking point, and that Earth is beginning to resemble an “immense pile of filth” – or actor Robert Redford’s recent appeal to U.N. ambassadors.
    Beyond the catchy headlines and big names, the pace of reports and studies on climate change seems to have accelerated recently.
    Last month Lloyd’s of London produced a stark report, “Food System Shock: The Insurance Impacts of Acute Disruption to Global Food Supply,” which refers a great deal to the potential impact of climate change…
    Swiss Re has been big on climate change reports.
    One of its latest reports, “Natural catastrophes and man-made disasters in 2014: convective and winter storms generate most losses,” focuses on the 189 natural catastrophes last year and notes that number of victims of disaster events in 2014 was one of the lowest recorded.
    This is despite the number of natural catastrophes being the highest in a single year…
    Beyond insurance-related reports there have been numerous documents, papers, and authorities weighing in on climate change.
    A paper just out on Australia’s defense system, “The Longest Conflict: Australia’s Climate Security Challenge,” flags the consequences of environmental pressures as a significant security risk for the country…
    A report from the Nippon Foundation, “Predicting Future Oceans: Climate Change, Oceans & Fisheries,” suggests that world’s future seafood supply will be “substantially altered” by climate change, overfishing and habitat destruction if no actions are taken.
    The U.S. Environmental Protection Agency released a report quantifying the economic, health and environmental benefits of reducing global carbon pollution…
    As reports go, most have of course been fairly dire – this makes for good reading and helps sell whatever point the authors wish to make – but one of the most dreadful outlooks was recently delivered by Nafeez Ahmed, an international security scholar, who points to the risks of civilization’s collapse by 2040.
    Fittingly for the topic of global warming, Ahmed, the author of several controversial books, has had his credibility often attacked, some even calling his past assertions “half baked.” (THE END)
    http://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2015/07/02/374073.htm

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    Ross Stacey

    I presume this UBC research was a by product of the Japaneze whaling fleets research into whales(sarc)

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    3-16-2015 The result is of global importance because the ice flowing through Totten Glacier alone is sufficient to raise global sea level by at least 11 feet see https://balance1010.wordpress.com/2015/07/04/totten-glacier-of-antarctica/

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    Neville

    The German weather service now thinks that the UHIE may be as high as 10C. If that’s the case it sure doesn’t leave much room for CAGW.

    http://notrickszone.com/2015/07/03/dwd-german-weather-service-says-uhi-effect-as-much-as-10c-judith-curry-puts-heat-waves-on-ice/#sthash.bfROlfQz.dpbs

    Also that so called runaway warming at the Antarctic peninsula doesn’t seem to add up to much since the 1950s. After looking at the graph you’d have to ask where is their CAGW?

    http://notrickszone.com/2015/07/02/awis-sloppy-antarctic-peninsula-science-oversaw-giss-temperature-data-snowfall-amounts/#sthash.DV6X89mT.dpbs

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      el gordo

      Reading through the comments Ed Caryl said: ‘All the stations on the Antarctic Peninsula have been cooling since 1998.’

      Excellent news and its a wonder the MSM hasn’t picked up on it.

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    pat

    3 July: Science Mag Editorial: The beyond-two-degree inferno
    by Marcia McNutt Editor-in-Chief Science Journals
    In the history of humankind, there is a dearth of examples of global threats so far-reaching in their impact, so dire in their consequences, and considered so likely to occur that they have engaged all nations in risk mitigation. But now with climate change, we face a slowly escalating but long-enduring global threat to food supplies, health, ecosystem services, and the general viability of the planet to support a population of more than 7 billion people. The projected costs of addressing the problem grow with every year that we delay confronting it. In recognition of the shared risks we face and the collective action that will be necessary, an international meeting of stakeholders will convene in Paris next week (www.commonfuture-paris2015.org), ahead of the United Nations Climate Change Conference (COP21) in December, to discuss solutions for both climate mitigation and adaptation.
    The time for debate has ended…
    I applaud the forthright climate statement of Pope Francis, currently our most visible champion for mitigating climate change, and lament the vacuum in political leadership in the United States…
    In Dante’s Inferno, he describes the nine circles of Hell, each dedicated to different sorts of sinners, with the outermost being occupied by those who didn’t know any better, and the innermost reserved for the most treacherous offenders. I wonder where in the nine circles Dante would place all of us who are borrowing against this Earth in the name of economic growth, accumulating an environmental debt by burning fossil fuels, the consequences of which will be left for our children and grandchildren to bear?
    http://www.sciencemag.org/content/349/6243/7.summary

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    pat

    India, the world’s fourth largest carbon emitter, says thanks but no thanks:

    2 July: RTCC: Alex Pashley: India won’t peak emissions in climate pledge – govt
    Country won’t buckle to pressure to state when CO2 emissions will fall, environment minister Javadekar says
    “The world is not expecting… India to announce its peaking year,” said Prakash Javadekar, environment minister, the BBC reported on Thursday.
    “Countries know where India stands and what its requirements [development needs] are and therefore nobody has asked us for [the] peaking year,” added Javadekar, who steers the Asian country at climate talks…
    Javadekar said the government would submit its ‘intended nationally determined contribution’ in ***UN jargon “soon” and that it would be more ambitious than expected…
    India has per capita annual emissions of two tonnes of CO2 against China’s 20, he told the BBC…
    http://www.rtcc.org/2015/07/02/india-wont-peak-emissions-in-climate-pledge-govt/

    “summit of stars”!

    2 July: RTCC: Alex Pashley: Regions on four continents vow to cut carbon at ‘summit of stars’
    Local governments give first ever global account of CO2 curbs at World Summit – Climate and Territories in Lyon
    Twenty states and regions from the Basque Country to British Columbia have set carbon-cutting targets at a summit probing how sub-national governments could confront climate change.Over 40 nations have delivered plans detailing how they will reduce greenhouse gas emissions as part of a UN climate pact…
    Representing 220 million people and US$8.3 trillion in GDP, they account for 5% of global emissions…
    The territories were “leading by example” and “underlining their determination” to make a crunch climate conference in Paris in December a success, said Christiana Figueres, the UN’s top climate official…
    National efforts weren’t enough – mobilising local authorities to take climate action was not an “option, it’s an obligation,” said French foreign minister Laurent Fabius in a video address to delegates…
    Louisa Casson at the E3G think tank said the presence of mayors and local chiefs made it a “summit of stars”, but questioned how they would swell the ranks…
    http://www.rtcc.org/2015/07/02/regions-on-four-continents-vow-to-cut-carbon-at-summit-of-stars/

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      pat brings up something really interesting here where he quotes this:

      India, the world’s fourth largest carbon emitter, says thanks but no thanks:

      2 July: RTCC: Alex Pashley: India won’t peak emissions in climate pledge – govt
      Country won’t buckle to pressure to state when CO2 emissions will fall, environment minister Javadekar says
      “The world is not expecting… India to announce its peaking year,” said Prakash Javadekar, environment minister, the BBC reported on Thursday.

      What is interesting here is not what India is doing, but what is happening with the already Developed Countries ….. with respect to India.

      Because of the current anti coal fired power sentiment which is so strong in those Western Countries, some of them, most interestingly the U.S. are working on new technology coal fired plants, not in their own Countries but going to India to do it.

      The Chinese have got to the stage now where they are in effect the World leader in USC (UltraSuperCritical) coal fired plant technology, but the next stage, Advanced USC, while the Chinese are working on it, so are a couple of other Countries, Western Countries, and all the work they are doing on it is referenced to what they are doing for India, and in fact, India is commissioning these Countries, including the U.S. to do the early work, the R and D, etc.

      While USC has already proved that we can achieve almost 15% less emissions for an equivalent power generation, Advanced USC is showing already that they can get a further 5% to 8% reduction on top of USC.

      So, while you hear of so called advances in Wind and Solar, be aware that coal fired power is also making advances. The REAL advantage here is that coal fired power is a supplier of humungous amounts of electrical power on a stable, constant, and regular basis.

      Solar power (Concentrating Solar Power) has in effect plateaued. While they had hopes to reach the driving of a 250MW generator eight years back now, and to be able to use this technology to drive a 500MW unit by 2012 (now three years back) and to do that on the same basis as coal fired power, in other words a 24/7/365 basis, they have stalled, in fact virtually stopped at a 125MW unit which they cannot even drive on a basis without heat diversion (that hoped for 24/7/365 basis) and even that is not achievable without gas fired starting capability.

      Advanced USC could see the advent of 1800MW Generators, and that’s a single unit. One of these is the equivalent of 600 to 720 Wind Towers (in Nameplate only) and will deliver the same power which would require around 1800+ towers, and probably around 4000+ Towers over the life of the coal fired plant ….. FROM JUST THE ONE UNIT.

      These Companies working in India give me the impression that they are keeping their hand in so to speak, until the time all this fuss just goes away.

      Then we won’t have to go cap in hand to China.

      Tony.

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        And all you hear from the bleeding heart green left is how coal is dying.

        Trust me. Coal is most definitely not dying. It’s just that you won’t hear of any advances. Why would the MSM report it, even if they had the nous to go looking for it in the first place.

        Tony.

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    pat

    3 July: Business Green: Will Nichols: Budget cuts could ‘undermine’ energy and climate change policies
    Academics write to Oliver Letwin to voice concerns over impact of proposed cuts, after Green Alliance study suggests DECC may have to delay key programmes and cut staff
    In a letter to government policy minister Oliver Letwin outlining their concerns, eight academics, including Professors Paul Ekins of UCL, Jim Watson of the UK Energy Research, and Catherine Mitchell of the University of Exeter, warn the next round of Whitehall budget reductions could “inadvertently undermine” crucial climate and energy programmes…
    Chancellor George Osborne last month unveiled a £4.5bn package of departmental cuts, which is set to be reinforced at next Wednesday’s Budget. Under the new spending plans, DECC will have to find savings of around £70m in the next year, of which £40m is set to come from funds that had bee earmarked for energy efficiency schemes.
    The steep cuts sparked further consternation after an ***independent report (by Green Alliance) of government major projects declared the energy efficiency programme off-track, although DECC officials have said its initiatives are now back on course since the assessment was made in September…
    Matthew Spencer, director of Green Alliance, added that next Wednesday’s Budget must afford DECC the funds to continue its “core mission” of reducing energy costs and accelerating low carbon energy investment…
    http://www.businessgreen.com/bg/news/2416092/budget-cuts-could-undermine-energy-and-climate-change-policies

    ***authors of the “independent report”!

    Wikipedia: Green Alliance
    Green Alliance is a charity and an independent think tank focused on ambitious leadership for the environment in the United Kingdom (UK). Founded in 1979, it works with influential leaders from the NGO, business, and political communities. Its work aims to generate new thinking and dialogue, and has increased political action and support for environmental solutions in the UK…
    The current director Matthew Spencer was previously head of government affairs at the Carbon Trust. He sits on the Department for Energy and Climate Change’s Carbon Capture and Storage Development Forum and regularly advises government on energy and environment policy…
    It has an individual membership of approximately 400, including environment professionals and ***well known personalities…
    Its work on environment as a foreign policy issue led to the formation, in 1998, of the Green Globe Network of foreign policy experts, based at Green Alliance and supported by cross-cutting funding from three government departments: the Foreign and Commonwealth Office, Department for International Development and the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs…
    Green Alliance staff and associates are often quoted as expert sources in national and specialist news outlets such as The Guardian, The Independent, BusinessGreen, The Financial Times and The ENDS Report…
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Green_Alliance

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    Gary in Erko

    “Let them eat kelp” said Marie Antoinette, smirking disdainfully.

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    pat

    3 July: UK Register: Lewis Page: Will rising CO2 damage the world’s oceans? NOT SO MUCH – new boffinry
    Tests show key processes will be undisturbed come 2100
    Those who fear that the oceans and their ability to support life on Earth may be doomed by rising CO2 – take heart!
    A recent scientific study shows that one of the basic engines of the ocean, namely the life cycle of phytoplankton, will probably not be disrupted by the rising levels of carbon dioxide to be expected later this century…
    The new science is published here (LINK)
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2015/07/03/will_rising_co2_damage_the_worlds_oceans_not_so_much_new_boffinry/

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    RoHa

    Hooray! No more sushi!

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    Dennis

    If Australia is running out of seafood it is because of the Agenda 21 creation of marine national parks onshore and offshore. The Australian fishing industry has been severely damaged by the closure of their traditional fishing grounds and many trawlers have been taken out of service. Fishing Coops have closed and others are struggling. To maintain seafood supplies stock is being imported.

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    Unmentionable

    Seafood supply altered by climate change

    Well, at least it has nothing to do with fishing depleting stocks. :D

    Oh … I see, … either way you go with this one … the monkey gets the blame …

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    Angry

    This new prediction from the Church of Climatology sounds very FISHY to me……………

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