JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Weekend Unthreaded

For all those other topics…

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Weekend Unthreaded, 8.8 out of 10 based on 17 ratings

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107 comments to Weekend Unthreaded

  • #

    I see that the Government is going to hold an inquiry into the RET scheme. The Labor/Greens and their green pinko followers up in arms about this, and the ABC, never one to actually find out about something like this are, as usual, taking what they perceive as the moral high ground, saying it’s what you would expect from these environmental vandals current government.

    But hey, were they ever going to get there, considering it was supposed to be achieved by 2020, only 6 years away now?

    Let’s actually pretend for a millisecond that they could find the requisite $90 Billion to achieve this, and hey, what’s $15 Billion a year to these green acolytes, as it’s not their money anyway.

    Not many people would really be aware what the actual target is, and what it entails to reach that target, keeping in mind it is supposed to be by 2020 which is now only 6 years away.

    That target was originally 45,000GWH, and now that overall electrical power consumption has (supposedly) fallen, (yeah! right!) it is 41,000GigaWattHours (GWH) of power generated from renewable sources, as indicated in the ABC News article at this link.

    So then, let’s look at what there already is in place right now, from renewable sources, and from that, we can see what is needed, and hey, thank heavens for Hydro.

    Hydro – 14,000GWH

    Wind – 7,000GWH

    Rooftop Solar – 1,200GWH (All of it, half consumed by the residences, and half fed back to the grids)

    Commercial Solar Plants – virtually nothing that would add much to this total, around 50GWH total, if that.

    Biomass – 1,800GWH (if that much, and all of this is used by the on site sugar mills and none is returned to the grids anywhere)

    So, the current Total from All Renewables – 24,000GWH

    Now, and here I’ll even go with the lesser target, because even that is totally unattainable. With a target of 41,000GWH, and current supply of 24,000GWH, then they need a NEW total from renewables of 17,000GWH of power supplied to grids.

    Now, as you can see, rooftop solar is only supplying 1200GWH, so even at best case scenario, if they actually double the existing total, something totally out of the question, then it still barely makes a dent in what is required.

    Any type of Commercial solar power plants would be so small as to be virtually non existent, so anything there is virtually negligible as well.

    You tell me how many large scale (or any scale) hydro plants would get approval these days.

    So, now we see that the vast bulk of it has to come from Wind power, so that means a NEW total of around 17,000GWH from wind power.

    Now, working backwards from that total, and using the current Capacity Factor of 30%, that means we need a new Nameplate Capacity of 6500MW of NEW wind power. The current TOTAL Nameplate Capacity for Wind is 2660MW, so we now need a new total of 2.44 times the existing Capacity.

    Using the largest current wind tower which has a 3MW generator, that means a further 2200 of these towers, and using Musselroe in Tasmania as a guide with its 56 towers, then that’s a further 40 of these very large wind plants.

    That’s 40 NEW HUGE Wind plants between now and 2020, 6 years away, not planned, but actually finished and delivering power to the grids, or around 7 new plants each year, not your piddling few towers here, few towers there, but large scale plants of 50 or more towers at each site.

    That means these NEW plants would need to be in planning right now, because it takes 3 to 5 years to finish, if all goes 100% to plan, and that’s a best case scenario.

    Those 40 new plants are not even thought bubbles at the moment, let alone being planned.

    Effectively, that means that this target will not be reached, and was not even a chance of being reached.

    A bland statement of that 41,000GWH is something which people would see, and not even knowing what it actually means, they might think it would be achievable, something so patently false as to be laughable.

    Tony.

    PostScript: Using the proposed King Island plant as guide, and at $2.2 Billion for that, then 40 new Wind Plants at $2.2 Billion comes in at close to that $90 Billion, and King Island is actually smaller than what I have here as a proposed large scale Wind Plant.


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    • #

      Pretty major mea culpa here.

      The proposed Wind Plant on King Island is actually 600MW, so that costing I had there is only 23 Billion and not the $90 Billion I mentioned here. Even so, it’s still unattainable at $4 Billion of Investor money each year, and if it was so viable, then entrepreneurs would be crawling out of the woodwork.

      Should have checked first.

      Tony.


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    • #
      el gordo

      ‘The Labor/Greens and their green pinko followers up in arms about this’

      Indeed they are, Tony. They are scathing of Abbott ‘choosing a denier’ to dismantle the green machine by removing subsidies. Let the revolution begin.


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    • #

      You mentioned commercial solar.

      Even the poster-boys of that have no future
      . (NoTricksZone)

      Large Andasol 3 Parabolic Solar Plant Losing Tens Of Millions After Broke Spain Eliminates Green Energy Subsidies
      …The Andasol 3 solar power station is owned by a consortium of German power companies RWE, Rheinenergie and Stadtwerke Munich and is located in the Spanish province of Granada. …
      And when Andasol 3 went online in 2011, Stadtwerke München director Kurt Mühlhäuser boasted:

      Andasol 3 is the the best example that we have to achieve the transition to renewable energies at the European level.

      According to Wikipedia, Andasol 3 was completed at a cost of 315 million euros and generates approximately 165 GW-hr each per year.…

      But today the Handelsblatt writes the plant is losing money and cannot operate profitably. Stadtwerke München has had to write off 64 million euros, Rheinenergie 17 million, and RWE has admitted that the write-offs will be “considerable”.

      I “thought” that those things were supposed to be sustainable.


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      • #

        Andasol 3.

        This is a Parabolic Trough Concentrating Solar Plant, so here the mirrors are laid in long lengths, curved in a half circle format, with a number or rows, and electrically operated to track the passage of the Sun across the sky. The fluid is passed through a pipe at the focal point of the mirrors, and is heated to a molten state to boil water to steam to drive a traditional turbine/generator unit, however, because they cannot make enough steam, the best they can manage is a unit of 50MW.

        Nameplate Capacity – 50MW.

        Heat Storage – 7.5 hours, so, feasibly, this type of plant can operate for all the daylight and 7.5 hours after dark. Now, that’s the headline thing that the punters see, and then quote its equivalence with traditional power plants, conveniently forgetting that it’s only 50MW.

        This plant delivers 165GWH of power each year, and that gives this plant a Capacity Factor of 37%, around average for this type of plant ….. which has 7.5 hours of heat storage.

        However, keep in mind that the CF is worked out across the whole year. So, while the plant, umm, may be able to deliver power for 7.5 hours after Sunset, umm in Summer, that does not apply outside of the middle of the Summer Months, as that 37% Capacity Factor attests.

        So while it’s good in Summer, the rest cancels that out, because, effectively at a CF of 37% per year, and then averaged out to a daily basis, then 37% of 24 hours is only 8.8 hours, so if the plant can run for 7.5 hours after Sunset in Midsummer, then imagine how many hours it runs in Winter to take that average back to under 9 hours.

        And hey, 50MW only, so here you’d only need 53 of these plants to replace Bayswater, and even then you’ll only get power for 9 hours a day.

        And, on top of that, they use a Natural Gas fired turbine to start the unit up until the solar part can take over, as do most of these Concentrating Solar Plants.

        Incidentally, that total delivered from this Andasol Plant, the quoted 165GWH is delivered by Bayswater in 62 hours with all 4 units in operation.

        Tony.


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        • #
          gnome

          So is the nameplate capacity enough to provide that amount of power for the daylight hours as well as putting juice into the batteries for seven and a half hours afterwards, or should we apply a discount to get a megawatt hour (or whatever) production figure?


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          • #

            gnome,

            they don’t use batteries for the storage.

            They try and keep the compound as molten as possible for as long as possible, and the molten compound is used to boil water to steam.

            That process to achieve this is enormously expensive and adds considerably to the initial cost of the plant itself.

            If heat storage was not used, (perhaps) the plant could run two or three X 50MW turbine/generator units for maybe 6 hours a day, depending on the size of the plant, and the largest of the Spanish ones is Solnova which has 3 units for a total Nameplate of 150MW, a Plant which cover 966 Acres, and no, I’m not joking here as those plants without heat storage are currently running at a Capacity Factor of 25 to 27%, which is around that 6 hours a day, on average, and that Capacity Factor is even lower than for Wind Power.

            With that heat storage, the down side is that they can only manage one 50MW unit.

            I have a graph (at this link) which explains how it happens and the power scale is down the right vertical axis, and for this example, this is for mid summer, best case scenario, showing the power delivery as that bottom solid red line at 50MW for 17 hours a day.

            Tony.


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        • #
          Tel

          So while it’s good in Summer, the rest cancels that out, because, effectively at a CF of 37% per year, and then averaged out to a daily basis, then 37% of 24 hours is only 8.8 hours, so if the plant can run for 7.5 hours after Sunset in Midsummer, then imagine how many hours it runs in Winter to take that average back to under 9 hours.

          Basically it’s great for handling the afternoon air-conditioner load if you live in a hot climate.

          Heating during the night in winter… is quite another story.


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      • #
        Roy Hogue

        I “thought” that those things were supposed to be sustainable.

        Perhaps sustainable refers to the inevitable losses? ;-)


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    • #
      Truthseeker

      For Solar, the environmental picture is even worse.

      For Wind Power, we have the rare earth required for the nacelles causing an environmental disaster (but it’s OK because it is in China …), the large numbers of birds and bats killed by wind turbines, the health effects of the noise that they generate, and the fact that large numbers of wind turbines will affect local weather patterns because they will be taking energy out of the wind (if they don’t do this at a significant level then why bother with them at all?).


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      • #
        Bob Malloy

        Please forgive my little ego trip here, when I saw your link to China’s wind energy, “environmental disaster” I anticipated where I would be taken, every time I see that article linked too It brings a smile to my face as I believe I was the first here to post that link.

        I found it when a local radio host, always followed the Rudd Gillard line on Climate Change/Global Warming was going on about China leading the way on renewables and having more than a suspicion it was all BS I decided to check a few facts,hence your linked article, now I see it linked here and other blogs on a semi regular basis, this pleases me no end, while enlightening in it’s own right it didn’t really counter his assertion on China’s leading the world on green energy uptake.

        That information I found in an article in Forbes which also produced some interesting facts like,

        China’s wind turbine installation boom kicked off in 2006 as a result of a law that required power companies with over 5 gW of production capacity to build enough non-hydro renewable power sources to make up at least 3% of their installed capacity by 2010, and at least 8% by 2020. However, the regulations do not stipulate how much energy must actually be generated from renewable power sources.

        As wind power plants are 50% cheaper to install than solar and simpler to operate than biomass plants, China’s top five state-owned power groups–Guodian, Datang, Huaneng, Huadian and CPI Group–all became wind chasers, scrambling for the windiest sites such as Hebei province and northern Inner Mongolia.

        To construct wind turbines in Inner Mongolia to capture the strong winds from the Mongolian and Siberian steppes seems logical at first glance. “However, most of the wind farms in Inner Mongolia are erected in remote places too far away from the transmission network and thus uneconomical for the grid to extend the cables to collect the wind power,” Pierre Lau of Citi said.

        All that pollution during the manufacturing process, then to be left rusting in the wilderness because they’re too far from the grid to be connected.


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        • #
          Roy Hogue

          Remember, the wind always changes.

          Just think of the business opportunity hanging right around the corner when these windmills all over the world need to be cut down and disposed of. Save your investment capital for this because it’s bound to happen. It won’t be all that expensive a business to get into either. You can probably pick up cranes and other heavy equipment at fire sale prices from the folks who’ve been installing these things for so long. And scrap metal prices are decent too. Charge through the nose for the work and then sell the junk at an additional profit. How can you lose? :-)

          On the other hand, cleaning up the stinking mess from the manufacturing won’t be so easy. I don’t envy anyone that job.


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        • #
          Angry

          Here is a great article about the failure of wind power (bird munchers).

          Wind Energy’s Ghosts……

          http://www.americanthinker.com/2010/02/wind_energys_ghosts_1.html


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        • #
          Angry

          In China, the true cost the clean, green wind power experiment: Pollution on a disastrous scale

          http://www.dailymail.co.uk/home/moslive/article-1350811/In-China-true-cost-Britains-clean-green-wind-power-experiment-Pollution-disastrous-scale.html

          More people should be made aware of this.


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          • #
            Bob Malloy

            More people should be made aware of this.

            I fully agree with your above statement, this is why in my reply to truthseeker above, I said, I smile every time someone links to it. If anyone here has not taken the time to read and bookmark/save the article, I recommend you do, also if you have acquaintances, friends etc, that believe wind turbines are part of our salvation encourage them to read it, as well as the other article I linked above If they are telling you China is fair dinkum about green energy.

            From your linked article.

            Jamie Choi, an expert on toxics for Greenpeace China, says villagers living near the lake face horrendous health risks from the carcinogenic and radioactive waste.

            ‘There’s not one step of the rare earth mining process that is not disastrous for the environment. Ores are being extracted by pumping acid into the ground, and then they are processed using more acid and chemicals.
            Inside the Baotou Xijun Rare Earth refinery in Baotou, where neodymium, essential in new wind turbine magnets, is processed

            Finally they are dumped into tailing lakes that are often very poorly constructed and maintained. And throughout this process, large amounts of highly toxic acids, heavy metals and other chemicals are emitted into the air that people breathe, and leak into surface and ground water. Villagers rely on this for irrigation of their crops and for drinking water. Whenever we purchase products that contain rare earth metals, we are unknowingly taking part in massive environmental degradation and the destruction of communities.

            The fact that the wind-turbine industry relies on neodymium, which even in legal factories has a catastrophic environmental impact, is an irony Ms Choi acknowledges.

            ‘It is a real dilemma for environmentalists who want to see the growth of the industry,’ she says. ‘But we have the responsibility to recognise the environmental destruction that is being caused while making these wind turbines.’


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    • #
      J Martin

      I wish I’d bookmarked it, but I read somewhere that wind turbines consumed more energy in their mining and smelting of the rare earths and metals, manufacture, transport, installation and maintenance than the energy they produce during their lifetimes. If true then wind turbines are completely pointless.


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      • #

        Unless you’re using fly-ash from coal-fired power stations, the cement to make the rest of the iceberg (the footings holding up the windmills) uses a “stupid” amount of energy and emits lots of CO2.

        Of course, running a power station for just the fly ash is even less efficient.


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    • #
      Joe

      So we are really not that far advanced on the original targets set by John Howard’s Government. While I appreciate that much of the renewable sources such as the hydro were already in place by then and represent a big chunk of the current renewable mix, I think it is worth remembering that Howard was not a big friend of coal. I don’t think a single new coal fired station got built in his time in office. Howard started the Greenhouse Office too. The current Environment Minister, Greg Hunt, was very enthusiastic in 2009 to support the Bill to increase the RET and spoke highly of the Spanish project mentioned here so it is a bit hard to know really what is going on behind the political curtains and I think it would be a bit simplistic to put it all down to a pinky greeny initiative when other key Government players like Malcolm Turnbull fully supported the increase when in Opposition too. I doubt very much that cheap electricity is the true agenda of any flavour of Government.

      http://greghunt.com.au/Media/Speeches/tabid/87/articleType/ArticleView/articleId/1226/Renewable-Energy-Target-Bills–Parliament-House.aspx

      I wonder too how the pumped hydro sources get accounted in the mix with respect to the coal stations that pump them up? Do we count the capacity twice?


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    • #
      Matty from England

      Why don’t Aus convert more of its Coal capacity to burning BioMass, like what they’ve done at Britains largest Coal plant, Drax ?

      Then they could collect up and transport all the bush cleared in making firebreaks, .
      They could even start growing trees for the purpose, in greenhouses to avoid shipping them in from abroad. They could even force feed them with CO2 too, to speed up the growth.

      Haven’t they thought if it, or would it just be too stupid for such coal rich country to consider ?


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      • #

        What’ll you burn for the other 51 weeks of the year?

        Senate Ballot papers?


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      • #
        Matty from England

        Only trying to help. Well if that wont work and all other options for generation won’t deliver, that just leaves slashing consumption by 2020.


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        • #
          The Griss

          “that just leaves slashing consumption by 2020.’

          Why ??? There is no need to slash consumption.

          The only sensible option for base load generation in most of Australia is coal.

          Even when thorium power does eventually start to become properly available, coal will still be the mainstay for power generation in Australia.

          We should be upgrading out current stations to “best practice”, and making over electrical energy as cheap as possible for the benefit of all Australian.
          Why the Unions aren’t pushing this, is beyond my understanding.

          Cheaper energy ➜ more industry ➜ more jobs ➜ more unionists ➜ more money for the union bosses to spend on whoever takes their fancy.


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      • #
        Angry

        WHY?????????
        Australia has hundreds of years of coal available to produce cheap electricity….


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  • #

    James Hansen’s 1981 Remarkable Conclusion

    This speaks to blatant warmist data manipulation, and that the warming, even in the 20th century, was actually minimal, as the 1930s were likely hotter than today!

    James Hansen (from NASA, and Chief Fear Monger) wrote this in 1981: “A remarkable conclusion from Fig. 3 is that the global temperature is almost as high today as it was in 1940.”

    At the time, he showed 1980 temperatures about 0.15C cooler than 1940. Now, NASA shows 1980 temperatures about 0.20C warmer than 1940. HUGE! They made a relative shift of 0.35C. See graphs at link: http://stevengoddard.wordpress.com/2014/02/20/hansens-1981-remarkable-conclusion/


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    • #
      Manfred

      Thanks Eric.
      Were life normal, the folk that perpetrated this would be experiencing ‘correction’ in the school of hard knocks. Instead, in a post-normal world, they get a collective Nobel Peace Prize.

      As this sort of truth leaks into common knowledge, ‘inconvenient ‘ won’t even begin to define it.


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  • #
  • #

    My guess is that there might be some of you out there who would like to know the Maths behind this.

    The standard Industry Formula for delivered power is this.

    NP X 24 X 325.25 X CF (where NP is Nameplate Capacity, 24 hours in a day and 365.25 days in a year, with the leap year added to this is the 0.25, and CF is Capacity Factor)

    Now, currently, Wind power is averaging 30% for its Capacity Factor.

    So then, let’s construct an imaginary Wind Plant with 50 towers, each topped with a Nacelle containing a 3MW generator, hence 150MW.

    So, here we have this:

    150 X 24 X 365.25 X 0.3 and the result is 394,470 MegaWattHours so using the conversion factor (Kilo, Mega, Giga, Tera) that now comes in at (rounded) 395GWH.

    So now, from Comment 1, if we need 17,000GWH of new Renewable power, nearly all of it from Wind, then that comes in at 43 of these (imaginary) new plants.

    As the Latin phrase goes ….. QED!

    Tony.


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  • #
  • #

    The usual presstitutes are hard(ly) working at trying to conceal the clusterflub of flooding of England as dictated by EU regulation, inspired by environmental policies. (EUReferendum)

    In the Parrett catchment, where most of the flooding has occurred, we find that hydraulic structures – i.e., ditches and rivers – “were generally shown to be more effective in reducing flood risk than crop management at the catchment scale in a typical flooding season”.

    Here, of course, we see the malign effects of the EU’s habitat directive where Natural England seeks to turn every ditch and watercourse into a miniature nature reserve, where biodiversity is king, losing sight of the original purposes of such “hydraulic structures”.

    The ultimate irony though, is that the essential requirement for maintaining biodiversity in permanent pasture is, according to Defra-funded research, to avoid waterlogging the site, “specifying a maximum water level to limit the degree of surface flooding”.

    Those viewing from a distance may observe parallel policies in e.g. Western Australia, where puddles are declared watercourses that are to be maintained over 7 to years 10 of subsequent (regular) drought.


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    • #

      P.S. While I blogged my own summary on the subject just last Tuesday, Richard North and his elves at EUReferendum have since then dredged up much more muck in just a few days. If you click here, that site’s search function will show all the flood-related blog articles.

      I suspect that many building and other infrastructure may be condemned after another 2 months of being submerged. Some farmers have already written off a whole year’s production as they think the land may not be fit to be worked until September, at the end of summer.


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  • #
    el gordo

    High school students who question the AGW consensus, run the risk of being expelled. In the heat of battle its hard to keep a civil tongue in one’s head.

    http://catallaxyfiles.com/2014/02/20/question-climate-change-in-school-or-how-to-get-expelled/


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    • #
      Manfred

      This is an outstanding account.

      ‘Out of babes and sucklings thou hast brought perfect praise’!


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      Matty from England

      That kid needs schooling only in how to put his message across without losing his rag or letting his rage show.

      While some will have got the message most will have noticed only the swearing and the target will play on that, highlighting the personal animosity that was on display.

      Recognising fallacies is one thing. Exposing them is another.
      Get him to study some of Lord Moncktons material.


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      • #
        el gordo

        ‘…how to put his message across without losing his rag or letting his rage show.’

        Its difficult, even for adults, to avoid getting emotional about weather and climate.

        Teachers in particular have swallowed the global warming meme hook line and sinker, which has been unfortunate for our children. Nevertheless, vengeance will be sweet and its coming fast.


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      • #

        I agree, Matty. Yes, el gordo, adults have difficulty with emotional control when it comes to climate change. However, having difficulty with something is not justification for blowing it off and saying it’s “hard”. It is hard. It took me a while to write my climate change blog without wanting to tear heads off frequently. Over time, I learned to use the blog to develop my ability to present my position calmly. It’s stil a work in progress. It is never appropriate to swear at a teacher–nor was it ever appropriate. We all had teachers that did not like us personally and took it out in the grading. We dealt with it. Parents need to talk to their children about the reasons for the teacher’s attempts to indoctrinate and provide guidance for dealing with it. (The request for a picture of the horrors of climate change could have been met with a picture of a minor flood. When the teacher questions the choice, tell her it was what you thought was the truth. Offer to find another picture if it would make her happy. You don’t have to disagree vehemently to disagree. Face it, kids are not in the position to “win” this battle. Confrontation does not work. Monckton’s material might help, though part of Monckton is just his bravo.)


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          Rod Stuart

          Sheri, in this particular instance, the 17 year old student Alfred was not in school.
          He attended a political campaign speech by one of the most odious, ignorant, vile Green politicians you could not even imagine in your wildest dreams.
          To put hings in perspective, Tasmania is where this Green nonsense started, with died in the wool ardent Communist (with a capital C) back about 1970 by the name of Bob Brown.
          The Greens party has decimated this Australian State, and turned it into the ultimate welfare state, by systematically shutting down the most productive industries (forestry and mining)and turning it into a park the size of Ireland. Because of the most ridiculous proportional voting system ever devised (Hare-Clark) by outright idiots, these parasites and charlatans might even stand a chance of remaining with some power.
          We now have a chance to purge these nasty devils from the political scene. The leader of the Greens had just been expounding on the “97%” myth, even though the scat has been told over and over that it is a crock. The young fellow was responding to that. Because he could be identified as one of several Hobart College students, he is apparently in danger of being expelled. I wrote a scathing letter to the principal of the joint pointing out that if she finds such language offensive she is in the wrong profession. Then I explained how offended I am that my tax dollars are wasted on the propaganda in her school. Since you are in a land far far away, I thought this might put some context around the Catallaxy Files story.


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            Thank you, Rod. That does help explain things. I would still stand by my statement that his language was inappropriate, however. And in the US, you can be expelled from school for things you do off the school grounds. It’s not common, but it does happen. I’m afraid I would not find your letter very persuasive–I don’t believe profanity proves much other than one has a limited vocabulary. There was a time when it was used rarely enough to sound a warning of extreme anger, but now it’s just easier than thinking up a proper way of expressing oneself. I don’t see profanity and texting adding anything to the IQ of a person. Perhaps the principal should have more appropriately threatened to send the boy back to 3rd grade for improvement his language skills. I do agree that wasting tax dollars on this propaganda is wrong, but a battle you won’t win. Do you seriously think the teacher cares?? In America, probably the best route is the school board–they’re elected. They might be reachable. The BEST route is to educate your children that teachers can be propagandists and teach them not believe anything the teacher says without researching it on thier own. This then covers all such problems.


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      Eddie

      What was the school thinking off, taking him to an electoral meeting anyway ?
      Don’t they know these can be emotion charged events
      Would it have been better if he had used the other ‘c’ word that can be more incisivelylevelled at political Greens and called him a Communist ?


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      Roy Hogue

      High school students who question the AGW consensus, run the risk of being expelled. In the heat of battle its hard to keep a civil tongue in one’s head.

      While it may feel good to fight back, it looks like the fix is in nearly everywhere and so a more useful solution would be to move the son to a private school where they aren’t beholden to the party line if that’s possible. I know I would make every sacrifice I could to get my child out of such a place.


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        Matty from England

        I think this particular kid has demonstrated he’s not succumbing to the doctrinaire approach. Weeker minds might well benefit from the attention of a Private Education though


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        scaper...

        What makes you believe that the propaganda is not taught at private schools?

        I’ve related here on occasion the experience of my daughter that is remarkably similar to the person at the link.

        Once identified as a non-conformist to the religion, the campaign of intimidation commences.

        The final straw for my daughter was the principal requesting her to turn on her phone to look up the bus timetable.

        Then the principal demanded her phone for using it at school! A nice set up. Result…phone hits principal in head.

        Daughter is now educated on line, a superior education devoid of the leftist bullshit that infects the private/public system.


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          Vic G Gallus

          Why did you send her to a school with religious affiliations if you’re against it? Every atheist that I know who sends their children to a Catholic school is CAGWy.


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            Franny

            Catholic schools are prized , at least in GB, by non-believers for offering a better education. Of course there will always be a few anti-religious types driven more by their ideology than by. the quality of education for their children.


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          Roy Hogue

          Scaper,

          Yes, some are running with the same party line. But there are still those where they don’t. And congratulations on home schooling. I have never met a family with better educated children than those I knew to have been home schooled.

          ——————————-

          Catholic schools enjoy a fine reputation but they give priority to Catholics. There is also the possibility that they adopt the climate change party line — witness recent papal statements. So no matter where you go you need to ask some questions in advance. And if the answers are wrong or the school is evasive. Keep looking.


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            scaper...

            Roy, home schooling is taking off…I am told.

            The girl absolutely loves it and we get the opportunity to have more input and participation which many parents of the old schooling method are denied.

            Also the opportunity to take on extra curricular studies. My girl is commencing advanced maths. Her best subject.


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              Roy Hogue

              Roy, home schooling is taking off…I am told.

              It is here too. But now the teacher’s unions are bound and determined to stop it by any means they can. In some states legal burdens have been placed on home schooling that make it quite difficult to swallow the requirements and accomplish what you wanted with your home school.

              The problems for the teacher’s unions (and school districts) are these two:

              1. Money goes to the school district (from both the state and federal government) according to the number of students enrolled. And who want’s to “lose” money? Put lose in quotes because it’s not really a loss. They’re only entitled to funding per student, whatever the student load is. So there’s no honest possibility that a home schooled child represents a loss of money.

              2. Loss of control over the content. These days not only the unions but the school districts and government want nearly absolute control. I have heard reports (unverified by me) of parents being denied access to the classroom in order to actually see what’s being taught. This used to be possible if the parent simply asked in advance. After all, who has any better vested interest than the parents? And in spite of my not having a way to verify these reports they’re quite believable even if some of the details are reported inaccurately.

              But keep on truckin brother. You’re on the right course!


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                Wyoming has two online k to 12 schools. They are part of two school districts in Wyoming. I know a high schooler who is going to school this way. While you don’t have the option to skip the “propaganda” parts that are in public schools but since you are presumably home with the child, there is a chance to discuss these things. It’s easier than actual home-schooling. It’s part of what is called “distance learning” which may be unique to Wyoming, I’m not sure.


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                Roy Hogue

                Hooray for Wyoming!

                Is it safe to presume that these online schools are at least in part motivated by the bad winter weather and the long distances some students would need to travel between home and school?

                But what a good option for mitigating the nonsense. Only the parents and the student can tell what the parents and student discussed about climate change or what the parents may have told their children about the authority of teachers not being absolute, as it certainly isn’t. The parents have not only the option to counter the nonsense but to make up for any deficiencies.

                Nice going!

                Question: Is there any tuition charge for these online schools?


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                It was originally started because of weather and distance, plus the realization that not all kids fit into traditional schools. The girl I know using could not handle high school–not sure why. So she uses the online course. There is no charge for the classes since they are considered part of two public school systems. I actually look for this to replace the few “one room schoolhouses” that remain in the state, since paying a teacher for less than six children and transporting those children is very expensive. With high speed internet available virtually everywhere (wireless, cable, satelittle, radio), it just makes sense to me.

                I was impressed with the idea. Many parents simply are not equipped to home school. This is an excellent alternative.

                (Other states have similar programs.)


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      Angry

      The child would be well out of a school that promotes this global warming BS !


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      gnome

      Its been a very good week, what with this, Steyn now countersuing Mann, the Abbott gov reviewing the MRET and the American Physical Society reviewing its climate change statement.

      I don’t know about anyone else, but I am shouting loud hosannas this weekend- it may be global warming’s first tipping point.


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        Manfred

        Yep, if it goes on imploding like this, the expensive bottle of champagne languishing safely at the bottom of the fridge for unexpectedly good moments is going to develop an genuine insecurity complex.


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      wayne, s. Job

      That fact that Mann is being counter sued, gives him two choices.
      1. Release his data and try to win the original case. [ not a real option as data is corrupt]
      2. Fold and apologise. [with his ego also not an option]

      This leaves him with no options, as he can not win the second case without the first.
      The use of lawfare to silence critics is coming back to bite him on the arse.

      The court and politics is the only way to destroy this hydra, thank our lucky stars
      for a few brave souls willing to stand up to tyrany.


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    john

    Jack Lew Does a West Coast Crony Sit Down with Al Gore
    http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2014/02/jack-lew-does-west-coast-crony-sit-down.html

    On his way to Australia for a G-20 meeting, Treasury Secretary Jack Lew stopped off in San Francisco and held a private meeting with the West Coast “business leaders.” EPJ has obtained a list of the attendees:

    Al Gore KPCB
    Brett Kopf Remind101
    Dan’l Lewin Microsoft
    Dave Morin Path
    Drew Houston Dropbox
    Halle Tecco Rock Health
    John Doerr KPCB
    Kate Mitchell Scale Venture Partners
    Max Ventilla AltSchool
    Megan Quinn KPCB
    Mike Abbott KPCB
    Weili Dai Marvel Semiconductor
    Mike Lee MyFitnessPal
    Wally Adeyemo Staffer
    Victoria Esser Staffer


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    john

    Wind turbine catches fire in Benton County
    http://wlfi.com/2014/02/21/wind-turbine-catches-fire-in-benton-county/

    BENTON COUNTY, Ind. (WLFI) – A wind turbine in Fowler catches fire in Benton County Friday morning. Witnesses report seeing the turbine shooting flames and sparks from its motor.

    The turbine is just off U.S. 52 and County Road 100 South in Benton County. At 6:30 a.m., the Fowler Fire Department dispatched a crew to create a perimeter around the tower.

    BP Wind Energy owns the turbine. Fowler Fire Chief Bill Burton said BP told him, whenever this happens, crews should secure the area and not attempt to put the fire out. He said this is something crews are prepared for, but never thought they would see.
    ——————–

    This is the same farm that is suing a utility over a PPA.

    http://www.newsbug.info/williamsport_review_republican/article_53dc4d8a-722d-11e3-97c2-0019bb2963f4.html


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    john

    Lawsuit involving Manchester energy consultant going to federal court

    http://www.unionleader.com/article/20140220/NEWS02/140229973

    MANCHESTER — An effort by the Federal Energy Regulatory Commission to levy $8.75 million in fines against Manchester’s energy consultant is moving to federal court, with a jury trial requested by FERC lawyers.

    The fines against Competitive Energy Services of Maine, which arranges energy purchase deals for the city of Manchester, were first announced in July of 2012.

    The parties have been unable to settle the case, and in December FERC lawyers petitioned the U.S. District Court in Massachusetts for a jury trial affirming the civil penalties against CES and its owner, Richard Silkman.

    Silkman is accused of colluding with large-scale energy users in Maine to overstate their baseline energy use so as to qualify for incentives designed to encourage conservation during periods of peak use, making it appear that the users were conserving power when they weren’t.

    Silkman has denied the charges and his attorneys are attempting to have them dismissed, claiming that the statute of limitations has expired and that FERC’s anti-manipulation statute does not apply to consultants…

    ———

    FERC/CES

    http://www.cov.com/files/Publication/cfeffdbb-2b1a-461e-8817-15c824ed38df/Presentation/PublicationAttachment/f3f4a12a-4c70-4b7f-83ba-23fea2a4e52a/FERC_Imposes_Civil_Penalties_for_Demand_Response_Manipulation.pdf


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      john

      More:

      Freedom wind developers subject of federal investigation

      http://www.wind-watch.org/news/2011/02/17/freedom-wind-developers-subject-of-federal-investigation/

      [snip]

      Competitive Energy Services of Portland, the original parent company of the Beaver Ridge Wind development, and Richard Silkman, a co-managing partner of CES, are each named in separate staff notices of alleged violations released Jan. 25, by FERC.

      http://www.energymaine.com/mrepress/pressRelease.asp

      [snip]

      Competitive Energy Services, LLC (“CES”), of Portland, Maine, announced today that it is now selling “Green Power” to Maine residential and small businesses consumers. The product is being sold through Maine Renewable Energy (“MRE”), an affiliate of Competitive Energy Services and in partnership with Maine Interfaith Power and Light (“MeIPL”).

      Richard Silkman, Managing Partner of Competitive Energy Services, said, “Today, we are helping to bring the promise of competitive electricity markets to Maine homes and small businesses by offering Mainers a choice of where their electricity comes from. Our product is 100% renewable and 100% generated within the State of Maine.


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    Roy Hogue

    If you live in the U.S. and depend on Medicare, brace yourself because here come the cuts that anyone with a brain said would be the result of Obamacare.

    I wonder why learning can only happen after it’s too late. :-(


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      Roy Hogue

      Note the timing of the announcement, just after the markets had closed for the weekend so as to give the dust time to settle before they reopen on Monday.


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      Angry

      What about the fact that Muslims can opt out of Obamacare but Christians can’t…….


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        Roy Hogue

        Just one more injury added to insult. I have a long list if you’re interested.

        Or is it insult added to injury? But either way, one more reason to be very angry come Election Day in both the primaries and November.


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    john

    Shaw Joins KKR Buying Cleaner Energy Rivals Won’t Touch: Energy

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-02-18/shaw-joins-kkr-buying-cleaner-energy-rivals-won-t-touch-energy.html

    Hedge funds and private equity firms from D.E. Shaw & Co. to KKR & Co. (KKR) are ramping up their investments in renewable energy projects.

    D.E. Shaw, the $30 billion hedge fund manager, bought stakes in five California solar plants in July and is co-developing a wind farm off Rhode Island’s coast. KKR has completed five clean-energy deals in three years, and Altus Power America Management LLC announced a joint venture Feb. 4 to develop $150 million of commercial solar projects.

    What’s driving this are projections of stable yields of 8 percent to 10 percent in the next few years — better than most corporate bonds. Wind farms and industrial-scale solar plants typically have decades-long deals, known as power-purchase agreements, to sell electricity to utilities. D.E. Shaw is betting those contracts make renewable energy as safe and reliable as, say, conventional utility bonds have always been regarded, said Bryan Martin, a managing director at the New York-based firm.

    Only a minority of investors understand that such contracts with investment-grade utilities or cities “are capable of providing a steady income stream comparable to high-quality corporate bonds,” Martin said by e-mail.

    Investment-grade corporate bonds returned an annualized 5.8 percent since the end of 2010 through Feb. 14 of this year, according to the Bank of America Merrill Lynch U.S. Corporate Index.

    David E. Shaw, a researcher in computational biochemistry who founded the firm bearing his name in 1988, was appointed to the President’s Council of Advisors on Science and Technology by Bill Clinton and later by Barack Obama.


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    Fenbeagleblog

    Following a thread…..Britain’s Climate Change policy road tested

    http://fenbeagleblog.wordpress.com/2014/02/22/recycled-intention/


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    Global cooling in North America as the Great Lakes freeze over. Note that this particular story is now a fortnight old. There are lots more stories on the web if you need more information.


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    liberato

    Just have to show you this link with regards to sugar: Can anyone not see the parallels to climate change? – Deniers, pressure groups etc. Its not the sun its CO2, its not natural variation its C02, its not…you get it.

    http://www.theage.com.au/lifestyle/diet-and-fitness/john-yudkin-the-man-who-tried-to-warn-us-about-sugar-20140212-32h03.html

    “his evidence often relied on observations, rather than on explanations” Hum how does this compare to the skeptics – “their evidence relies on observations rather than on modelling?”

    Its certainly an interesting read – and I must go find a copy of the book myself. Its the calories that count not the fat.


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      Angry

      “liberato”,
      There almost seems to be a pattern to the CRAP that these fools try and promote !
      Eggs no good.
      Butter no good.
      Sugar no good.
      etc etc.
      In other words products that are natural and healthy they want to tell us are “no good” !
      They would rather have people consume something that is cooked up in a laboratory.
      Who listens to these f..king idiots ????
      I’m not one of their lab rats…..


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    US Gulf Coast set for gas boom. Jobs and money. This is what happens when you don’t let leftist extremists use lies to stop fracking.

    The tragedy for the US, though, is that Obama is still blocking Keystone, which would bring energy security and untold wealth to the US. Harm to the environment from leaks, ruptures and sabotage is a matter of great importance and it is essential that federal and state governments deal with the issue. However, it seems that Obama is holding out for no other reason than to pander to fossil-fuel-hating leftist extremists.


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      Angry

      “Barry”, Have a look at this and then tell us all how safe coal seam gas mining is again!
      PS I am not a greenie however activities such as coal seam as mining which destroy people’s health, pollute underground aquifers with a cocktail of carcinogenic chemicals etc, all for the want of a precious dollar are NOT ACCEPTABLE.

      MONK – Gas In Water Bore Proof – YouTube

      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EryAtW-aNNU


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        scaper...

        I’m against it too!

        Here is another story.

        Unlike America, Australia landholders have no say if these so called miners drill on their properties and receive paltry payment per well from the cowboys.

        If the carcinogens get into the Great Artesian Basin they will eventually effect groundwater of the whole Basin!

        The Water Trigger legislation will hopefully protect the Basin but without oversight, that is non existent, I suspect the damage will be done.


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    Angry

    Second release of secret Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement documents…….

    PEOPLE SHOULD BE VERY WORRIED ABOUT THIS ………….

    On 13 November 2013 WikiLeaks released the draft text (https://wikileaks.org/tpp/) of the crucial Trans-Pacific Partnership Agreement (TPP) Intellectual Property chapter during the lead-up to a TPP chief negotiators’ meeting in Salt Lake City on 19-24 November 2013. Today, 9 December 2013, WikiLeaks has released two more secret TPP documents that show the state of negotiations as the twelve TPP countries began supposedly final negotiations at a trade ministers’ meeting in Singapore this week.
    One document describes deep divisions between the United States and other nations, and “great pressure” being exerted by the US negotiators to move other nations to their position. The other document lists, country-by-country, the many areas of disagreement remaining. It covers intellectual property and thirteen other chapters of the draft agreement. This suggests that the TPP negotiations can only be concluded if the Asia-Pacific countries back down on key national interest issues, otherwise the treaty will fail altogether.
    http://wikileaks.org/Second-release-of-secret-Trans.html?update

    At the same time the Obama administration may be trying to resurrect (http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-switch/wp/2013/08/05/sopa-died-in-2012-but-obama-administration-wants-to-revive-part-of-it/) the controversial Stop Online Piracy Act (SOPA), the White House is now pushing another opaque acronym – TPP – that watchdog groups say represents a similar threat to Internet freedom.
    TPP stands for the Trans-Pacific Partnership — a proposal that could, among other things, bake SOPA-like provisions (http://blogs.computerworld.com/internet/23154/secret-tpp-agreement-sopa-steroids-may-be-end-internet-we-know-it) into an international trade treaty. As with so many other trade pacts before it (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/david-sirota/secret-trade-deal-report-_b_62998.html) , details of TPP has been kept completely secret (http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_tense/2014/01/10/tpp_negotiations_bill_would_allow_the_white_house_to_fast_track_the_controversial.html) . Indeed, before a draft was Wikileaked into the public spotlight (http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/11/14/wikileaks-reveals-secret-trade-agreement-that-could-crack-down-on-web-freedom/) , members of President Obama’s own party in Congress had to resort to publicly demanding access (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/06/25/trans-pacific-partnership-documents-sherrod-brown-jeff-merkley-ron-wyden-robert-menendez_n_1624956.html) to the proposal they could have to vote on.
    “Could,” though, is the operative word, as the White House has just launched (http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/wireStory/bill-key-obama-trade-push-faces-dem-opposition-21479807) an attempt to enact a so-called “fast track” bill (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lori-wallach/corporate-lobby-cheers-co_b_4591102.html) that would give the president unilateral power to enact the TPP and other lobbyist-written trade pacts without significant congressional input. The Obama administration is trying to orchestrate this end run around the legislative branch precisely because as more and more questions are raised about the proposed deal, members of Obama’s own party are threatening (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/11/fast-track-trade-democrats_n_4580720.html) to scuttle it in the Congress.
    As alluded to, one key set of questions that is raising the most concerns revolves around how the intellectual property provisions in the pact could curtail online communications. Those concerns are now coming to the forefront as the Electronic Frontier Foundation is using the anniversary of the 2012 SOPA protests to launched what it is calling Copyright Week (https://www.eff.org/copyrightweek). In that effort, the watchdog group is labeling the TPP the ”biggest threat to the Internet you’ve never heard of.”


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    Angry

    Meanwhile in New South Wales the “co called” conservative state government is attempting to enact this OFFENSIVE LEGISLATION……

    A GRAVE might no longer be your final resting place after a controversial law to offer graves on 10-year to 99-year leases passed its first hurdle in the NSW parliament.
    WTF !!!
    A group of 25 NSW Coalition MPs, including the Premier, did not show up to vote on the controversial law which puts time limits on burial plots.
    Under the changes, graves across NSW will be “leased” for either 10, 25 or 99 years, after which another body can be buried in the plot.
    Planning Minister Brad Hazzard alerted MPs by email there would be a vote on the bill only 30 minutes before it was due to take place – around 6pm on Wednesday.
    The Premier, some ministers and MPs said they had leave to attend other events but coalition sources said a “contingent” refused to vote because of serious concerns with “time limits” on graves.
    The sources said the joint party room was not told about the time limits on burial sites when Primary Industries minister Katrina Hodgkinson last month briefed them on the bill.
    “No one knew they were going to turf bodies out in 25 years,” one source said.
    “She did not highlight that.”
    Another coalition source said, while some members had leave from the vote for official functions, others “purposely abstained” from attending.
    “The problem is, it creates two types of plots, one more expensive than the other,” the source said.
    “A lot of people with strong Christian convictions were very upset by that.”
    Ms Hodgkinson introduced the changes because Sydney is running out of burial space.
    “It puts in place a new legal framework that will help ensure the burial needs of all NSW communities are met for many generations to come,” Ms Hodgkinson recently told state parliament.
    She noted two NSW cemeteries already offered the option of “renewable” leases on burial plots, and the new legislation would regulate the industry across the state.
    Ms Hodgkinson’s National Party colleague, Coffs Harbour MP Andrew Fraser, voted for the bill but told parliament it worried him because it protected the religious beliefs of Muslims and Jews, but not those of Christians.
    “Those faiths will be given the option to have a perpetual site but a Christian of poor means who cannot afford to maintain a gravesite may find that after 25 years granny gets moved,” Mr Fraser said.
    Labor MP for Cessnock Clayton Barr told parliament it would create a difference between “the rights of the haves and the have nots” even in death. The changes are unlikely to pass the Upper House, with Shooters and Fishers MPs “seriously concerned” about the changes. Labor has resolved to oppose it.
    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/news/nsw/uproar-over-plan-to-rent-out-graves/story-fni0cx12-1226760157161


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    pat

    this is dated 14 Feb, but was held over it seems, because i heard a repeat of this program early this morning, which should mean it was first broadcast friday 21 Feb. what went out 14 Feb was “Green cooking – We’re chewing over the topic of food footprints: How green is your lunchbox? What’s the environmental impact of your weekly food shop?” according to the NS website:

    14 Feb: ABC Naked Scientist: Chris Smith: Naked at the AAAS
    Do scientists resort to propaganda to defend climate change? How do we deal with evolution unbelievers? How do governments and policy-makers decide what science should be funded? Where will the next generation of communicators come from? Why are western countries spending more on baldness than malaria? Live at the AAAS 2014 meeting in Chicago, panellists David Willetts, the UK Minister for Universities and Science, Robyn Williams, of the Science Show on the ABC, MIT Enterprise Forum president, Kathleen Kennedy, IgNobel Awards founder Marc Abrahams and University of Madison-Wisconsin scientist Molly Jahn join Chris Smith to answer questions live from the audience…
    CONDENSED TRANSCRIPT:
    My name is Chris Smith otherwise known as the Naked Scientist. We’re here at this conference with people from all over the world who are authorities in their own rights and we’ve been hearing about lots of discoveries and challenges that are going on…

    Now, the AAAS meeting is all about science and innovation…
    ROBYN WILLIAMS: Robyn – Well first of all, a point about entrepreneurship which I find rather fascinating. We mainly think about great entrepreneurs like Steve Jobs, but a point made by Professor Mariana Mazzucato, who’s at the University of Sussex and she specialises in innovation is that if you take Steve Jobs’ wonderful invention kind of, the Smartphone, all seven technologies and scientific discoveries for that device came from state-funded campuses and he put them together. It wasn’t done in his firm. It was done at state-funded universities. So, we need to bear that in mind…

    ***Joel Veness, science journalist. Like most good ideas at this conference, this question came from some spirited drinks we had after the session yesterday. Climate deniers often use the tools of propaganda to further their campaign. Should science be embracing these similar tools?
    Chris – What propaganda?
    Joel – Yeah.
    Marc – Propaganda and lies, that’s what you’re asking?
    Joel – Maybe not lies because that goes against the whole principles of science I guess, but maybe propaganda?
    Chris – Marc?
    Marc – It’s difficult. Arguments between somebody who wants to discuss whatever the topic is and somebody who simply wants to stick their foot out and trip the other person, they’re not fair fights in either direction. Does anybody here have any guidance for anybody in dealing with that?
    Kathleen – I’ve been doing a lot of work in Russia lately. I was actually in Moscow 4 weeks ago, I think. It’s interesting, this propaganda question that there’s in society like that. there is still this idea of – I’m in meetings and often they talk about science innovation policy that they’re trying to build that we should just do that in the innovation Marcets. They sort of talk about – if they talk about it enough, things will happen. It’s such a counter thinking to how science and technology is done here and in the UK I’m sure. That it’s a very much a bottom up type thing and I think propaganda is about being a top down methodology. And so, I think that there are certainly places in the world that are trying to do that and they think if they push it down enough that it will happen. My thinking is that I see the way science works here and I don’t know that – it seems to me, counter the way that science actually happens…
    David – Yes, I think it will be dangerous to get into propaganda because the origins of propaganda is propagating the faith and science has to be a rational and sceptical inquiry. I think the problem with the climate change deniers is that they’ve taken one of the tools of science which is scepticism and taken it to such an extreme. It’s become a new form of kind of irrationality. I think where science has to get it right is, how sceptical you can be. If you’re being asked to believe that almost all major western scientists and researchers working in this discipline are engaged in a kind of organised conspiracy, at that point, calling it scepticism doesn’t capture then the sort of irrationality of it. So, I think getting the balance, getting the scepticism right is the best approach.
    Marc – Rather than going for the tools of propaganda.
    Robyn – It just so happens, I did my programme the Science Show, the first one in August 1975 and one would guess it was Lord Ritchie Calder and he happened to be talking about the energy crisis then back in 1975. And he said, “Amongst other things, we’ve been so concerned about the use of oil and coal, and fossil fuels that this is going to change the atmosphere and affect the climate drastically. We’ve been talking about this since 1961 and here we are in ’75 and no one has done anything yet.” Which was, when I heard it back, rather chilling. But I think what has been shown Naomi Oreskes who was at San Diego and is now at Harvard in her book “Merchants of Doubt”. As Marc said, what one side is using is rational argument and trying to get the information over and it’s complex. When there’s something that knocks their ideas, they write a 20-page article which is published in one of the journal which their mates read and on the other side, the people who are knocking climate science are using all the techniques of advertising, of propaganda and the sowing of doubt. Naomi Oreskes is sighting the tobacco companies who, for 40 years or more were trying to say that cigarettes may be okay. There is doubt about the science. So, it’s unequal and I think it’s time the scientists really got up, didn’t use propaganda, but use short, sharp sentences and fought equally.
    ***Chris – And stun guns might help as well.
    Robyn – Yes…
    http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/naked-scientists/show/20140214-1/nocache/1/?cHash=7cc4c94970a73724aa3bd0a2037b8257&tx_nakscishow_pi1%5Btranscript%5D=1

    ***Joel Veness: find proof anywhere online that shows Veness is a science journalist. i have found nothing whatsoever.

    however, Veness was previously with UNSW &. on his website heading, he is now Adjunct Professor at University of Alberta in Canada, tho his own website says he moved from Sydney to the UK. who knows or cares, but he’s into REINFORCEMENT LEARNING, which sounds very much like PROPAGANDA to me:

    Joel Veness: GOOGLE SCHOLAR
    University of Alberta
    Artificial Intelligence – Reinforcement Learning – Data Compression
    http://scholar.google.com.au/citations?user=_iYrAxEAAAAJ&hl=en

    much, much more craziness in the transcript at The Naked Scientists/AAAS link.


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      Andrew McRae

      Their aim is “getting the balance, getting the scepticism right”.
      They want to impose limits on scepticism?
      That is a synonym for “bounded rationality”.
      `Nuff said.


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    pat

    just realised the link i posted for the transcript to “Naked at the AAAS” is on the UK Cambridge University “Naked Scientists” website, which does the bbc “naked scientists” radio program, which would explain the 14 Feb date.

    can’t see that it has been broadcast over there as yet, but i linked to it because ABC didn’t provide a transcript. horrific to see Dr. Karl & Chris Smith all over the BBC website:

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/podcasts/series/drkarl


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      Pat the Naked Scients AAAS Q&A is not on the BBC link you gave
      it is on their own http://www.thenakedscientists.com/HTML/podcasts/naked-scientists/show/20140214-1/

      It’s actually more extreme than you thought cos I recognize the name and the voice
      and thought “flip me that is Joel Werner, who works for the ABC alongside Robyn making climate alarmist progs, they just broadcast his 4 parter about Oceans in Crisis
      ..so to me seems to be a planted question.”
      ..I will now post more under Jo’s new thread on Scottish Skeptics survey


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      Ah Pat I see you spotted my item on WUWT yesterday
      Yes I rushed to get the message out before that NS prog was rebroadcast on Friday
      ..So I was’t aware that the podcast is not there now on the ABC.
      Yes I already have written about Joels BBC Oceans prog where I first encounterered him over on Bishop-hill.net Unthreaded.
      - I think these are mega stories..it is a pity only you and me are highlighting it
      - if you like contact me by clicking my name above


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    handjive

    June, 2007
    Wetter north only temporary: Flannery
    “Australia should forget about moving people and agriculture to the country’s north because the increased rainfall there won’t last, scientist Tim Flannery says.
    The Australian of the Year says people instead should learn to live in a permanently drier climate.

    Prof Flannery wrote that growing evidence suggests that the drier conditions in Australia are caused by global warming and that the change is permanent.
    “I believe the first thing Australians need to do is stop worrying about ‘the drought’ – which is transient – and start talking about the new climate.”

    Feb, 2014:
    BoM: Weekly rainfall totals for Australia
    . . .
    Oh, he meant in 100 years time.
    I see what he did there.


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    Rod Stuart

    I was talking to a cousin in Florida this morning and she brought up the subject of H.A.A.R.P installations around the world, especially in Alaska and there are a few in Straya.
    It seems there is considerable concern, but then there is someone out there concerned about anything and everything.
    Does anyone have the skinny on this programme?


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      Andrew McRae

      Rod, despite my considerable tolerance for, and occasional indulgence in, conspiracy theories, I still have not heard anything about HAARP that would convince me it is anything more than an ionosphere and magnetosphere research project, just like it says.

      As a diversion, you may find it fun to test the signals intelligence hypothesis for these antennas. For comparison, note the French ostensibly have a similar system on Kergulean island right here. An aerial picture is here. That is part of the SuperDARN network, ostensibly the southern hemisphere equivalent of HAARP.
      If you load that map location in Google Earth, use the ruler tool to create a line starting at the eastern end of the antenna array, run the line westwards along the baseline direction of the array which is on a heading of 257.5 degrees, and extend that line for 15000km you will find it passes within 150 km of Washington DC. A random co-incidence, or something more? You can see the appeal of colourful speculation about these systems.

      But any beamforming antenna array is designed to receive signals optimally along a direction orthogonal to its antenna baseline, which means that the French antenna poles are pointing in a 167 degree bearing. That means it optimally points toward the south pole and is pointing within 30 degrees of the magnetic south pole, a direction which can be easily selected by a linear 16-element phased array.

      I’ve never heard of a HAARP array in Australia but will assume your cousin meant the SuperDARN sites for the same purpose. There is only one publicly listed Australian location for SuperDARN, down in Tassie. If you check the direction of that antenna on the map it points exactly due south, just as you’d expect for auroral research.

      Now it may seem a bit suspicious that the Australian array points south whereas the French array does not and the French array has that co-incidental alignment with Washington. There is one more pertinent fact about the French and Australian arrays. The photos show horizontal antenna radiators on top of the masts, which means actually those systems are designed to send/receive only upwards in a vertical plane, not sideways. It can’t direct its beam towards surface locations at all. So it looks very much like an ionosphere research system only.

      Ionospheric weather prediction is quite important for being able to bounce signals off the ionosphere and receive them from much further away than is normally possible. So whilst this research may have military applications, it is likely to be only radar and communications related. At a radar frequency of 22MHz you’re unlikely to detect anything smaller than the wavelength of 13.6m, which may be too large for some smaller military targets such as a Chinese DF-31 ICBM in boost phase. After bouncing off the ionosphere the radar return would be so garbled as to probably be useless (unless that’s the problem that HAARP/SuperDARN are secretly working on.) Anyhow, the antenna poles are about 15m apart so the actual build dimensions and orientation match the publicly stated purpose of the system.

      Admittedly I’ve had a southern hemisphere bias. I haven’t looked at the HAARP arrays in Alaska/Canada etc but I’d guess if you try the above analysis with Google Earth on the HAARP sites you’ll find they are similarly sized and oriented.


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        Rod Stuart

        Thanks, Andrew. There are a lot of things on the ‘net about this that look pretty suspicious.
        There is this youtube regarding HAARP in Australia, but for all I know they might be just television stations.
        The size of the installation in Gakona, Alaska, about 300 km south of Anchorage, certainly does look like the US poured some money into it.
        There are suggestions that it is directly related to Nicola Tesla’s work on wireless power transmission is intriguing, if there is a bar of Truth to it.


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    High Treason

    Interesting Jo has not picked up the comments from IPCC chief, Christiana Figueres from January 15th, where she stated that Democracy is a poor political system for fighting global warming. Chinese Communism is the best model. That the UN did not admonish her for this suggests they tacitly agree! Who would have guessed, the UN was always about promoting a world Communist system with the iron fist of dictatorship that does not have to abide by the wishes of humanity.This was also missed by WUWT.

    Talking about WUWT, things could be looking grim for Michael Mann(boo-hoo). Hopefully he is exposed as the fabulist/habitual liar he is and the IPCC left with a monstrous lump of egg or Komodo Dragon feces all over their faces.To think, all their predictions of doom-and-gloom scenarios, carbon taxes etc were based on Mann’s fantasies.Will the IPCC continue plugging the lie or will they have to back down in total defeat? Will Michael Mann become like the 8 bankers who “suicided” by jumping out of windows or shooting themselves several times in the back of the head with a nail gun? What we do know, is that if Mr Mann goes to jail, he can be in his Mann cave, complete with his favourite sporting trophy, his hockey stick.


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    Anything is possible

    New papers (three in all) which I think may be of interest to you Jo, since they analyse Radiosonde data and conclude that the Greenhouse effect is “negligible.”

    Here are the links to the first two. Enjoy! :

    http://oprj.net/oprj-archive/atmospheric-science/19/oprj-article-atmospheric-science-19.pdf

    http://oprj.net/oprj-archive/atmospheric-science/22/oprj-article-atmospheric-science-22.pdf


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    Speaking of Flannery watch him here live at 1830 AEDT

    http://www.canberra.edu.au/public-lectures/live-lectures

    maybe hop on to this thread as a venue for live banter and ranter.


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    Anything is possible

    I have an earlier comment stuck in moderation, which may have gone into the spam filter as it has 2 links.

    If so, I think you will find it worth your while to rescue it.


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