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Al Gore tries “back door” and gets knocked back by Australian Firenado filmmaker again

It’s good to know some people just can’t be bought and Chris Tangey is one of them. He refuses to allow any part of his work to be used to “decieve” people.

Al Gore or someone in his team, really wanted the firestorm footage for his 24 hour televised special coming up this week (which Watts Up is matching hour for hour). One arm of his team (the Office of the Honorable Al Gore) asked Chris Tangey of Alice Springs Film & TV for permission to use the spectacular footage in late September, and Tangey said “No” it would be “deliberately deceptive”,  which caused media stories around the world. Now another arm, The Climate Reality Project has quietly tried dressing up in their nonprofit-documentary-group-cloak and again offering money to secure the rights.

The full recent email exchange is below. The Gore team mean “no disrespect” but their representative Andrea Smith was still happy to insult people with names, and was perplexed, writing that ” the US is the only country in the world that has an active Climate Denier movement – every other country in the world has accepted this as a fact.” We can see how well informed Al’s team are about the skeptics.

Tangey doesn’t buy it for a moment: “Apparently “climate deniers” are people with a different viewpoint to yours, so are fair game to be labelled , put in a box and publicly pilloried. I would have though the correct scientific response would be to simply convince them of your argument.”

It’s not hard to see why someone who wants to scare people out of their dollars would find this footage appealing.

It would have been something to see. Apparently it was originally a man-made fire that had burned for ten days. The firestorm occurred on a cloudless day without a breeze… So nothing to do with man-made emissions, and not even a natural fire.

If anyone needs a film-maker you can trust, call Chris Tangey. :-)

Watch this one with the sound up to “feel” the ominous approaching rumble grow thunderous.

(If this clip above doesn’t work, watch it in Vimeo  https://vimeo.com/49671213 or this one https://vimeo.com/49985537. They are both excellent!)

Firestorm near Alice Springs

——————————————————————

On 07/11/2012, Andrea Smith wrote:

Hi Chris! Wasn’t sure if this is the same Chris who shot the fire tornado? But I was curious if Alice Springs Television still controlled the rights to the footage? I’m a producer working on some documentary pieces for a nonprofit organization doing an internet broadcast,and was wondering how much it would be to license some of the footage?Thank you so much for your help and time!Best wishes,

Andrea L. Smith
Producer/The Climate Reality Project

——————————————————————

On Wed, Nov 7, 2012, chris tangey wrote:

Andrea,

I mean no disrespect, but I have to say that at best your organisation has some serious internal communication problems. At worst, Mr. Gore is now requesting these images  ”through the back door”,  and I note in your email that you completely omit mentioning Mr. Gore or the specific intentions you have for its usage.
As I’m sure you are aware I have previously refused a request for this footage from your Founder and Chairman on the grounds that there is no evidence to support your proposed usage.  That is, that this intense, but incredibly localised, event has any relationship whatsoever to climate change/global warming.  In fact from the expert advice I have received, I believe the evidence is to the contrary. I am happy to be proved wrong, but that appears highly unlikely.
In any case, even if “the left hand doesn’t know what the right hand is doing” in Mr. Gore’s organisation,  I again have to ask the question; Why would you request this footage  if you do not have firm evidence to prove that this particular event was caused by, or was in any way attributable to, global or even regional climate change?
If a project is bold enough to call itself “Climate Reality, “ then I would reasonably expect a great deal of fact and reality attached to it. I believe viewers all over the world would expect the same. If I tune into your special event “24 hours of reality” on November 14 and 15, how will I know which event you present is really factual and directly attributable, and which is not? Dare I say, what will be truth and what won’t be? How will anyone watching know? Especially, how will the 4,000 activists around the world your project has trained to “educate and inspire others” know?
Are all your requests for visual material to support climate change presentations made without any prior requirement for supporting evidence?I must say that this continuing episode has adversely affected my view of those promoting anthropological climate change , and I now view any programs about it with a more sceptical eye.
So, yet again, I cannot in all conscience accept your offer, for any amount.
                 Sincerely
              Chris Tangey
——————————————————————

On 08/11/2012, Andrea Smith wrote:

Chris,

First of all, I in no way meant to disrespect or offend you. I am an independent, freelance producer, and I don’t think anyone is trying to acquire the footage through “the back door.”  I can assure you that the Climate Reality people have been very very tough on us as far as what stories we are able to cover. For instance, I have produced a piece on climate change and coffee in Colombia with scientists from CIAT, so it is very grounded in science, and both fascinating and terrifying as to what is happening all over this planet.
The program this year is to discuss “Dirty Weather” and “Extremes” of weather. It’s an open point for discussion for the scientists and panelists that will be participating.  It’s to invite conversation and discussion. As a freelance producer I had no idea when I started this project that the US is the only country in the world that has an active Climate Denier movement – every other country in the world has accepted this as a fact and is moving forward to do something about it. From what I understand, Australia has implemented a very innovative carbon tax and has a number of other programs in place in many of their cities.  I’m somewhat embarrassed I live in a country where we so greedily use up so much of the earth’s resources and seem immune to it.
Anyway, it’s an incredible piece of footage and fantastic you captured it. I have been lucky enough to have the opportunity to visit your country twice for extended periods of time, including Alice Springs. I can easily say Australia is one of my favorite places in the world.  Again, no offense meant, and none taken.  I hope you do have the opportunity to watch part of the programming and that you find merit in it.
Very best wishes,
Andrea L. Smith
——————————————————————

From: chris tangey

Date: 8 November 2012 11:25:39 AM ACST
To: Andrea Smith
Subject: Re: Firenado footage

Andrea,

Thanks for your response, I’m sure from your comments below that you are personally committed to the cause of anthropological climate change, but as copyright owner my primary concern is that any usage of this material should be scientifically valid and in context. I find that your response hasn’t addressed my specific questions on whether it would be scientifically appropriate to use it in an extreme weather context .
As has been widely reported, it was such a highly localised event it was most likely caused by the fire itself, let alone any external “weather” and certainly not anything on a climatic scale. The cattle station owners (who have been on that property for 55 years) have indicated that is their firm belief, and that in fact its heat and severity was caused by the fact that they have deliberately protected that patch of resin-filled spinifex grass for over half a century, allowing that resin to build up over time. Spinifex (Triodia) is highly flammable and creates intense heat in any case.
Joel Lisonbee, Manager of the Northern Territory Climate Services Centre, was quoted as saying he also saw no connection between this event and climate change/global warming. “This event was better described as a dust devil within a fire. Most of us have seen dust devils and know they are not uncommon,” Mr Lisonbee said”You need hot, dry conditions but you get those in desert-like conditions everywhere, regardless of global warming.”
I know that we could just “agree to disagree” but I feel I must raise some real concerns to your response. Firstly your title indicates your are employed at the highest level of the Climate Reality Project, a Producer, freelancer or not, so I am confused as to why you refer to “the Climate Reality people” in the third person. Assuming for a moment that these people are separate to yourself you go on to say that they “have been very very tough  on us as far as what stories we are able to cover”. So clearly this indicates they must have approved not just your enquiry about the footage, but the next stage of actually offering to buy it.
Since Mr. Gore’s office first contacted me to buy the rights, which indicated Mr. Gore himself had made the request to purchase, I have had cause to conduct considerable research on climate change.In the course of this research I have discovered a lot of non-scientific, apparently agenda-driven name-calling going on, including your below “Climate Denier” tag. Apparently “climate deniers” are people with a different viewpoint to yours, so are fair game to be labelled , put in a box and publicly pilloried. I would have though the correct scientific response would be to  simply convince them of your argument. I think few people have doubt that the climate is changing, the questions are to what extent and whether it is human-induced. I am happy to be convinced, but by simply labelling questioners who need more information  ”climate deniers” might be colorful politics, but would seem a doomed approach to science education.
Now, the doubts that I mention don’t appear from thin air, but have actually been introduced by your own “team” so to speak , so it would appear a bit rich to be blaming others, let alone calling them childish names
 for them now having doubts:
Much more relevant to me is that my research has shown that your own Founder and Chairman has had his own share of controversy:
I have even found a quote from Mr. Gore saying that ”the science is settled”.  As far as I know true operational science is never settled, it is always open to additional data that may later arrive at a new conclusion.
You say the context of using my footage on this global media event would merely be as “an open point for discussion for the scientists and panelists that will be participating” and to “invite conversation and discussion.”
If there is going to be an “open discussion”, then I presume there will be Scientists with opposing opinions, if not, how will it be “open”?
I’m sorry, but this seems to me both disingenuous and illogical and echoes Mr. Gore’s original request to simply use it in “presentations”  on “environmental topics”.  In barely the space of a month 2 major Al Gore
organisations, Climate Reality Project and Carthage Group have asked to buy this footage. Given the very reason for the existence of these organisations is to promote anthropological climate change,
 I am to believe that the purpose is actually NOT to sell viewers on climate change? Then sorry… why do you wish to buy it?
For your information I am no stranger to either science or extreme, wind-related weather events. For instance, I was Associate Producer, Head of Research and Co-Writer on the 1 hour long, 2001 National Geographic Channel (U.S.)
documentary “Red Storm” which dealt with dust storms and the relevant science globally.
It seems to me I am the type of person you are making this program for, those of us yet to be convinced, but after the experience of the last month or so I’m afraid I am left less convinced than ever.
                   Cheers
                Chris Tangey
The footage:
H/t: Tom N
VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 9.2/10 (74 votes cast)
Al Gore tries "back door" and gets knocked back by Australian Firenado filmmaker again, 9.2 out of 10 based on 74 ratings

Tiny Url for this post: http://tinyurl.com/aobbx2j

88 comments to Al Gore tries “back door” and gets knocked back by Australian Firenado filmmaker again

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    Roy Hogue

    Kinda nauseating isn’t it?

    Hooray once again to Chris Tangey! :-)


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    MadJak

    Good on you Chris,

    I just wish that there were more in the media industry who put their ethics above temptation – regardless of the topic.

    I continue to become nauseated when seeing natural events portrayed as something they’re not – it’s actually an insult to the power nature has and always will hold over us. All it does is to breed arrogance and ignorance to misrepresent these things.

    And yet, we have Ban Ki Moon now trying to attribute Sandy to AGW. I sure wish the UN would concentrate on minimising conflict around the world instead of playing armchair science wannabes.


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      Mark D.

      I agree, Chris is doing the right thing.

      MadJak, you might already know this but others may not. Sandy was downgraded to a tropical storm shortly before coming ashore. Nothing much was unusual about Sandy! not her birth place nor the track she took. Timing wasn’t the best she came into land during a full moon high tide. The last I checked humans nor CO2 cause high tides. For the people that don’t have gasoline or electricity I feel bad enough but I feel worse that they aren’t being served well by the Federal government.


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      Bulldust

      It gives me an inner glow to see such integrity on display – Chris Tangey shouldn’t hold his breath for any accolades from left-leaning governments. The bitter irony is, had he sold the rights (and his soul) much like our mates Flanners and Garnaut, he’d be set for Labor endowments for quite some time. That is the harsh reality.

      Might even be in line for an honorary doctorate like Carbon Cate… That kind of cr@p makes me happy I didn’t finish my PhD. The status of such degrees is inevitably diminished when universities hand them out willy-nilly to stooges for the left. But I digress…

      I applaud Chris Tangey and his integrity.


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    AndyG55

    “that the US is the only country in the world that has an active Climate Denier movement”

    China pays lip service, Russia just laughs.


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    Otter

    Waiting for the Three Blind Mice to chime in, any second now… mattie? brooksie? filly….?


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    Philip

    Want to bet they use it anyway?
    Several short clips could arguably meet the “fair use” criteria.

    Remember who we are dealing with here.


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      memoryvault

      I’m with you Philip.

      In fact, I’ll take it a step further. For its faults, the material Gore uses is nothing if not professionally slick and well put together. This latest propaganda-fest is due to go to air in two days. More importantly, Andrea’s request was made on November 7, exactly a week before showtime.

      I’d bet London to a brick that whatever is planned to go to air had well and truly been put to bed by the time of Andrea’s request, and it includes at least some of Chris Tangey’s footage. The above offer seems to me to be nothing more than an attempt to get Chris to indicate a willingness to negotiate with a seemingly unrelated (to Gore) business entity.

      That way the claim could be made – after the event – that Climate Reality, rightly or wrongly, had reasonably assumed Chris was in agreement and all that was being negotiated was a price.

      It will be interesting to see what happens now.


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        Tim

        I totally agree MV and will be surprised if the image is not ‘borrowed’, now or in the future. Like the mythical Hydra, this political movement grows two heads every time one is cut off – and integrity is not their strong point. Chris deserves to be assisted by a supportive legal team able to take his case further and bring the ethics of these people to the world stage – with the accompanying publicity.


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    • #

      I hope they do. I will only aid in crucifying whatever alarmist crap they put in.


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    stephen

    well done Chris


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    KinkyKeith

    A heartening response.

    Good to see that someone still has their head screwed on the right way even if society as a whole seems messed up.

    KK :)


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    little polyp

    Congratulations to Chris Tangey for taking a measured stand against this unpleasant propaganda machine


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    Annie

    Well done Chris Tangey. It’s wonderful to know there are principled people out there.


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    RoyFOMR

    ”the US is the only country in the world that has an active Climate Denier movement – every other country in the world has accepted this as a fact.”
    In your dreams Andrea that, incidently, are the same dreams had by the BBC TwentyEightGate team back in the winter of 2006!
    ‘Member lass, just saying ‘Every day, in every way, I get better and better’ is an aspiration not a recipe!


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    ken moerman

    from the us love your site. linked from wuwt. from the us.


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    Peter Miller

    Personally speaking, I hope Al Gore illegally uses some of the clip and gets his butt sued off.

    There are far too many people out there who still believe Gore is a decent, honourable and truthful human being.


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      RoHa

      “There are far too many people out there who still believe Gore is a decent, honourable and truthful human being.”

      Incredibly naive of them. He’s a politician. Pity he was robbed of the presidency. As prexy he would have done far less harm than GWB, and he would have had other things to do than obsess about the climate, so we would have been spared “An Inconvenient Truth”.


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      • #
        OldColdMan

        I am in touch with the Minister of Finance in Nigeria and I am told you are open to idealistic enterprise in the name of the advancement of humanity.

        We have $10m US dollars sitting in an account and are looking to distribute this to deserving personages in countries around the world.

        In order to receive some of this bounteous gift, please forward your bank account details to. . .


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        • #
          RoHa

          Are you suggesting that after he had finished being president he would have hit us with “An Inconvenient Truth” anyway?

          Perhaps, but I think he would have been satisfied with the presidency. As it was, he redirected his ambition into climate craziness.


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    • #
      Len

      Tipper isn’t one of them.


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    Neville

    Chris is a man of principle compared to super HIPPO and fraudster Al.

    BTW the Combet idiot should yell BS at his clueless boss. Abbott’s just a rank amateur on BS and alarmism when compared to Gillard and labor.

    http://blogs.news.com.au/heraldsun/andrewbolt/index.php/heraldsun/comments/column_combets_bull/#commentsmore


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    Truthseeker

    I would like to direct everyone to this article from the Australian Financial Review. It is about a new book from a modern Frech philosphopher Pascal Bruckner as reviewed by Emma-Kate Symmons (freelance journalist).

    “A searing critique of environmental thought …” – Donna Laframoise at No Frakking Consensus.


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    • #
      Streetcred

      Powerful article Truthseeker … Pascal Bruckner’s work needs to be more publicly and widely discussed.


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      Manfred

      Thanks Truthseeker. Superb recommendation. A definite buy.
      Bruckner says in his work ‘Fanaticism of the Apocalypse’:

      “We are afraid of everything – of mobile phones, of food, of dummies, of nappies, of antennas. We are living in a society which has a horror of risk and therefore is afraid of its own shadow.”

      Emma-Kate Symons (Financial Review) highlights Bruckner’s “passion” of concern in Western guilt. What a perfect motivation from which to philosophically pop the balloon of self-righteous “green wash.”

      As I have often said, having labeled carbon dioxide the chief protagonist in the AGW drama it is a short step away to be to censoring nations on the basis of population based emissions derived from collective exhalation.

      Widespread fear is easy to cultivate in a risk adverse society. It makes control all the easier.


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      A Lovell

      I have mentioned this marvellous article on various sites. My favourite quote is: ‘Catastrophe is not their fear, but their joy.’ I think that says it all………….


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    sophocles

    Andrea Smith was still happy to insult people with names, and was perplexed, writing that ” the US is the only country in the world that has an active Climate Denier movement – every other country in the world has accepted this as a fact.”

    I see. And no one in any country other than the USA has taken their government climate research organisation to court? Nor fired “leading” scientists when they were caught molesting the data?
    (both NZ …).

    If this represents the breadth of their research and the depth of their understanding then this
    year’s “Climate Reality” project is going to be one of the most advanced CGI projects since the
    Lord of the Rings … and as historically accurate.


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    Streetcred

    Al Gore tries “back door” and gets knocked back

    I always had my suspicions …


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    justjoshin

    He should set up an organisation “Climate Sham” and allow them to use the footage if his organisation is promininently credited across the bottom of the footage.


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    Rick Bradford

    Andrea Smith perfectly fits the profile of the Left/Green activist.

    She is disingenuous (pretending to be independent from Gore), immature (running away from any answer to Tangey’s key point), rude (throwing in the ‘denier’ slur), and clueless (recycling alarmist garbage without question).


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  • #

    (Copied from my response at WUWT)

    Andrea clearly needs to learn how to use web search engines to find those who don’t believe in imminent climate catastrophe.

    Of course, she could be of the sort who never stay around to talk or listen about climate. Pierre Gosselin reports from Germany: Professor Vahrenholt: Climate Science “A Real Effrontery”… “Scientists Leave The Room When They See Me”

    One long-standing and strong science advocacy organization in the German-speaking sphere has been EIKE. There’s also the NIPCC.

    There has long been a significant presence of cAGW infidels and heretics in the blogsphere in probably all languages, AFAICT. EcoTretas lists just a few of the non-english heretic sites.


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    pat

    congrats chris tangey. perfectly crafted responses. admire your principles.

    btw folks, this does need to be documented here so no-one can claim they didn’t know. all MSM have it:

    keeps calling an increase ‘reform’ yet has no trouble calling the State Govts ‘beneficiaries’. as if the public would want the GST to increase when they are already struggling? reduce the size of govt instead is what most people i know would suggest:

    11 Nov: News Ltd: AAP: Up to states to lobby on GST, says Joe Hockey
    SHADOW treasurer Joe Hockey says if the states want GST reform, it’s up to them to convince the Australian people that the changes are necessary.
    Mr Hockey says as the beneficiaries of any tax hike, it’s the job of the states not the commonwealth to make the case…
    “They’ve got to campaign for it and they’ve got to win the Australian people over.”…
    A future coalition government would only consider GST reform if it had the bipartisan support of all the state governments and the backing of the Australian public.
    Former NSW Liberal premier Nick Greiner last week called for a reassessment of the way the consumption tax was applied, saying that ruling out any discussion was “stupid”…
    But he’s (Wayne Swan) ruled out hiking the 10 per cent GST, arguing it would hurt battlers doing it tough.
    Assistant Treasurer David Bradbury seized on Mr Hockey’s comments, saying they revealed a “secret plan” to increase the GST.
    “This is the third time in recent weeks Joe Hockey has been specifically asked to rule out increasing the GST under a coalition government – and has refused to do so,” Mr Bradbury said in a statement.
    “Joe Hockey has let the cat out of the bag.
    “He wants the states to do the hard work for his secret plan to jack up the GST.”
    http://www.news.com.au/national/up-to-states-to-lobby-on-gst-hockey/story-fndo4eg9-1226514648425


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    handjive

    ‘…a little haven for fire’

    CARBON SUNK – LANDLINE:

    Broadcast: 11/11/2012

    It was launched with great fanfare a little over a year ago by Federal Environment Minister Tony Burke and RM Williams Agricultural Holdings.

    For nearly 100 years, Henbury Station was a thriving cattle empire, but not anymore.

    Henbury’s new owners, RM Williams Agricultural Holdings, have switched cattle for carbon in an audacious bid to prove sequestration can work in an arid range land environment.

    The company snapped up Henbury last July for $13 million, using $9 million in Federal Government funding.

    The property was then destocked, with the promise of producing carbon credits and providing a model and range land methodology for other central Australian producers wanting to jump on the green band wagon.

    Qantas even got on board this year by agreeing to purchase 1 million tonnes of carbon credits from Henbury.

    But 18 months on results are scant and there’s now rising speculation that the whole project could crash.

    ROY CHISHOLM: If it falls arse over head, well what’s it going to do?
    Is it going to revert back to a cattle property or are we going to lock it up and grow rabbits and weeds and make it a little haven for fire? ❞

    ☞ The Department of Climate Change says that once converted to a carbon reserve, Henbury can’t ever return to being a pastoral lease.

    It will have to remain destocked and locked up for conservation.

    ⚑. But that’s not all:

    This week, the Henbury project was joined by the $13m purchase of the 178,000ha Fish River Station, about 150km south of Darwin.

    The property is a three-way deal involving the federal government, Indigenous Land Corporation and non-profit conservation groups, with the government making the biggest contribution of $8.6m.

    The aim is to de-stock the property of feral cattle, buffalo and donkeys, and establish an environmental management regime that is at least part-funded through the sale of carbon offset credits to private industry.

    .

    If only we could de-stock parliament of donkeys & feral greens.

    What a monumental waste of taxpayer funds.

    Call the carbon cops.


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      AndyG55

      “non-profit conservation groups” yeah … right !


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      OldColdMan

      The Department of Climate Change says that once converted to a carbon reserve, Henbury can’t ever return to being a pastoral lease.

      It will have to remain destocked and locked up for conservation.

      Sounds very much like Agenda 21 in action. The gradual removal of people and animals from the land.


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  • #

    Moderators: Please check the spam trap for my posting. It’s got a few links.

    [There you go ...] Fly


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    pat

    10 Nov: Bloomberg: Sonja Elmquist: Murray Energy Fires 163 Workers, Citing a ‘War on Coal’
    Murray Energy Corp., the largest closely held coal company in the U.S., is firing 163 workers at three subsidiaries, citing a “War on Coal” by the Obama administration.
    “The actions of Mr. Obama and his appointees in the U.S. Environmental Protection Agency, Department of Interior, Office of Surface Mining, and Department of Labor, have already led to the closure by 2014 of 204 American coal-fired power plants,” the company said in three statements e-mailed today…
    Chief Executive Officer Robert Murray read a prayer to workers asking God’s forgiveness for “decisions that we are now forced to make to preserve the very existence of any of the enterprises that you have helped us build,” the Washington Post reported…
    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-11-09/murray-energy-fires-163-workers-citing-a-war-on-coal-.html


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    pat

    henbury has failed but, before these schemes proliferate, the insanity of trading CO2 needs to be stopped dead in its tracks. where is greg hunt, for crying out loud:

    11 Nov: ABC Landline: Carbon Sunk
    PIP COURTNEY: A controversial plan to turn a central Australian cattle station into an arid zone carbon farm has hit a snag.
    It was launched with great fanfare a little over a year ago by Federal Environment Minister Tony Burke and RM Williams Agricultural Holdings.
    But now the management team at Henbury Station near Alice Springs has quit the project and neighbouring pastoralists are asking why the Commonwealth sank nearly $10 million into such an unproven scheme…
    Qantas even got on board this year by agreeing to purchase 1 million tonnes of carbon credits from Henbury.
    But 18 months on results are scant and there’s now rising speculation that the whole project could crash…
    ***KRISTY O’BRIEN: RM Williams Agricultural Holdings added Henbury to its portfolio to bulk up its green credentials and branch out into what it believes is a booming new market. But that task is proving every bit as hard as ***sceptics*** imagined it would be…
    KRISTY O’BRIEN: Scientists are also cautious about whether a carbon farming methodology can be developed for Central Australia’s dry and hugely varied landscape.
    DR GARY COOK, CSIRO: We do need to do a lot more on-ground measurements of the amount of carbon in the soil, the amount of carbon in the vegetation and how that changes over time.
    ***We need to have computer models that allow us to predict that into the future with the seasonal variation that we know exists down there…
    ***ROY CHISHOLM. NAPPERBY STATION: If it falls arse over head, well what’s it going to do? Is it going to revert back to a cattle property or are we going to lock it up and grow rabbits and weeds and make it a little haven for fire?…
    The Department of Climate Change says that once converted to a carbon reserve, Henbury can’t ever return to being a pastoral lease. It will have to remain destocked and locked up for conservation.
    It’s not clear from either side of the fence what exactly would happen to the Government’s $9 million investment. The former Agricultural Minister Tony Burke, who signed off on the Henbury deal, was unavailable for comment, leaving some in the local pastoral industry uneasy…
    LYNDEE SEVERIN: It seems to be a long way away from what the traditional base is and certainly very few people in Central Australia could understand with any common sense what that was all about. It seemed to be about pacifying a city-based stakeholder, not necessarily having very much to do with what actually happens on the land…
    http://www.abc.net.au/landline/content/2012/s3630155.htm


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    Campbell

    In the the present and recent “climate”, the integrity of Chris Tangey is much to be admired! And appreciated, when we so badly need more truth.


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    Crakar24

    Hey dont be too harsh on Andrea she is after all a hard hitting journo and producer as she explains here:

    I can assure you that the Climate Reality people have been very very tough on us as far as what stories we are able to cover. For instance, I have produced a piece on climate change and coffee in Colombia with scientists from CIAT, so it is very grounded in science, and both fascinating and terrifying as to what is happening all over this planet.

    No wonder Al is keen on getting his hands on this footage coz who gives a shit about columbian coffee.


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    pat

    10 Nov: UK Telegraph: Christopher Booker: David Cameron backs the EU’s grand design for energy
    Mr Cameron’s faith in these vehicles is just as absurd as his plan, confirmed again last week by an energy minister, Baroness Verma, that every home and business in Britain must be fitted with “smart meters” within seven years, at a cost of £11 billion…
    The point about smart meters is that they do not only enable us consumers to keep tabs on our electricity use: they also (though our Government does not like to spell this out) enable suppliers to exercise remote control over how much electricity we use. The EU knows that the windmills it wants to see covering Europe are unpredictably intermittent, and cannot guarantee sufficient power when it is needed. The answer the EU’s technocrats dream of, as we see from the Bornholm pilot project for a “European supergrid”, is that they can use smart meters to micro-manage the power we receive, right down to their ability to switch off whole categories of electricity use in our homes when there is insufficient power in the grid (what they call “  ‘intelligent’ control of household appliances” , such as dishwashers or televisions)…
    BBC allowed to keep its dirty little secret
    A remarkable legal drama has been unfolding recently in London’s Camden Town, pitting a lone pensioner from Wales against all the might of the BBC, represented by an array of highly-paid lawyers. It has been a battle fought to determine the BBC’s right, under the Freedom of Information Act, to keep secret how it arrived at a major policy decision which, for six years, has allowed it to operate in breach of its legal obligations under its Charter…ETC ON TONY NEWBERY CASE…
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/comment/9668782/David-Cameron-backs-the-EUs-grand-design-for-energy.html


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  • #
    JFC

    ever get the feeling your on the wrong side of history?
    You mob are down to 5%. So now we really can call you fringe loonys.

    http://theconversation.edu.au/climate-change-deniers-are-rarer-than-we-think-10670


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    • #
      Snafu

      …cough – splutter – cough again…and clean computer screen……..again.

      Black Thursday” 1851 – Australia
      The year 1850 had been one of exceptional heat and drought. Pastures had withered ; creeks had become fissured clay-pans ; water-holes had disappeared ; sheep and cattle had perished in great numbers, and the sun-burnt plains were strewn with their bleached skeletons; the very leaves upon the trees crackled in the heat and appeared to be as inflammable as tinder. As the summer advanced the temperature became torrid, and on the morning of the 6th of February, 1851, the air which blew down from the north resembled the breath of a furnace. A fierce wind
      arose, gathering strength and velocity from hour to hour, until about noon it blew with the violence of a tornado. By some inexplicable means it wrapped the whole country in a sheet of flame — fierce, awful and irresistible. Men, women and children, sheep and cattle, birds and snakes fled before the fire in a common panic…………….

      You can call me a ‘fringe loony’ if you like…..but you have NO idea of history.


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    • #
      Catamon

      You mob are down to 5%. So now we really can call you fringe loonys.

      Fringe Loonies? Harsh.

      I prefer to think of them as “special” people.


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      • #
        JFC

        Yes you’re right Cat, “special” people, fringe loony is a bit harsh, apologies. Still they do inhabit a parallel universe, they do things differently there.


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      Snafu

      Tell me JFC – what was the level of CO2 in 1850-51?
      &
      When was the first power station built?

      Hint:-

      Q1 – less than 300ppm

      Q2 – after 1850


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    • #
      memoryvault

      .
      Congratulations Finger Lickin’.
      Talk about an own goal.

      Despite the desperate spin in the covering article, what the published results actually show is that the number of people who personally believe climate change is a natural phenomenon increased from 40.2% to 43.8% in just twelve months.

      In the same short period the number of people who personally believe it is man-made dropped from 50.4% to 44.6%, and the number of people who personally believe the whole thing is total BS rose from 5.6% to 7.2%. That’s all just in one year, chicken bone.

      Only the totally politicised CSIRO – or BoM – could publish such figures and try to spin them to claim the exact opposite. They surely must think Australia is full of brain dead, ignorant idiots. After all, anybody with the simple capacity to read numbers off a graph would be able to see what the actual results were.

      But then I note you fell for it hook, line and sinker, so maybe they are onto something after all. Still, what can one expect from somebody who doesn’t even know the difference between “your” and “you’re”.

      .
      By the way, feather duster, extrapolating those results four years into the future shows that by the election after next, around 60% of Australians will believe climate change is purely a natural phenomenon and only 22% will believe it has anything to do with human activity.

      .
      Now, who exactly were you calling a “fringe loony”?


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      • #
        memoryvault

        To Catamon:

        I prefer to think of them as “special” people.

        I don’t know about “special” Cat.
        However, being able to read, write, spell, understand basic grammar and syntax, and do simple arithmetic, certainly seems to mark us a “different” in this day and age.


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      • #
        Catamon

        They surely must think Australia is full of brain dead, ignorant idiots.

        Actually MV, here is interesting info out there that shows this is now considerably less likely to be true than it was in June.

        The trend is your friend in the end. :)

        Sayeth Nate Silver to the wailing and tooth gnashing Repugs. :)


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        • #
          memoryvault

          .
          I note you don’t have the gumption to reply to my comment directed at you, only to a comment directed at another.

          Telling.

          You post a link to an article in ‘Crikey’ purporting a swing back to Labor? And this is supposed to prove exactly what to me? That Australia isn’t full of brain dead ignorant idiots?

          I have scored more thumbs down on this site than most trolls, writing about the futility of simply voting Liberal and thinking anything is going to change. And you think posting a link to an article that suggests the popular vote may be swinging back from tweedledum to tweedledee proves me wrong?

          If Australian conservatives vote in a Coalition government at the next election that has the same “environment policies” as they have now, then Australian conservatives are as brain dead, ignorant idiots as the people who would vote for the current lying, deceiving, corrupt cabal in power now.


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          • #
            Hasbeen

            & your alternate suggestion is?

            Not that I actually disagree with you!


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          • #
            Catamon

            Wow MV, you must have a serious supply of Mr Grumpy pills on your hands.

            And i suspect you missed the point of 30.4.2. But you did get the opportunity to have your normal “they are all as bad as each other” complain, so that must make you feel better. Do i shout BINGO now?

            MV, sure thats not code for?


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          • #
            Catamon

            I note you don’t have the gumption to reply to my comment directed at you, only to a comment directed at another.

            Well…if you insist.

            I don’t know about “special” Cat.

            I’m quite sure there are a lot of things you dont know about MV. Its ok. I think you’re very special anyway. :)


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    • #
      AndyG55

      At “the Conversation” you are probably correct. They are all far left journalists with ZERO understanding of anything remotely to do with science. They “believe” because that is what their journo tutors have told them to believe.. They have NO THOUGHTS of their own.

      And like you, totally lack ANY ability for rational, individual thought. .. Parrots and Monkees, and Asses you and the whole brain-washed moronic cult.


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      • #
        Catamon

        totally lack ANY ability for rational, individual thought. .. Parrots and Monkees, and Asses you and the whole brain-washed moronic cult.

        Are you sure you want to….hold back like that AndyG? Come on, unload…… :)

        You seriously suggesting JFC is one of these??


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        • #
          AndyG55

          Gees, I bet that took some research.. must be a first !


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        • #
          AndyG55

          I didn’t want to use the word “monkeys”, because monkeys are capable of individual though,

          and I didn’t want to insult them by linking them to “The Conversation”.

          An amoeba would have more innate intelligence than the lot that inhabit that particular rag, and more ability to learn.


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    • #
      Bite Back

      After all the commentary over #30, where are you?

      Let me call to everyone’s attention what the real lesson from the November 6 election is:

      The Obama team was campaigning for his whole first 4 years. Moreover (and much more important) they were getting organized locally, making and keeping up personal contact with the people they needed to win to (and keep on) their side. They were there if necessary, hauling them to the polls on Election Day. The sad truth is that Obama had won the election long before his opposition ever started to work.

      Now what does this mean? Memory vault, you say voters aren’t stupid. I agree! But their intellectual capacity isn’t what’s going to count. What’s going to count is people talking to people, getting out a consistent message, reinforcing it, countering the alarmist’s message and being there constantly. You can’t count on graphs, blogs or compulsory voting. You can’t count on voters deciding in their favor when they get only one side of the story. And since your government and your information media won’t tell them, you must do it.

      Obama took advantage of dissatisfaction and a generation that wanted “stuff” to put himself in an unprecedented position of power. You can do the same trick if you get out, get organized and put up as good a fight down where people live every day.

      It’s a lot of work. It will take time. It will be hard. It means getting rejected, face to face by many people you’ll talk to. It will mean a real sacrifice of time and energy. But it’s the way you need to go. If you have as much conviction about this as a generation of fools in America has, then you can pull it off.

      And remember something we all have on our side. We only need to sow significant reasonable doubt in people’s minds to win. That’s all that cost Romney his executive chair in the Oval Office. Just too much doubt is all it really took.

      Now for the other side of this coin: You clearly need to raise up some better candidates for public office. That’s also a lesson from November 6. Both the USA and Australia are hurting in this respect.

      We all need to get our butts up off our computer chairs and out on the streets working. Nothing else is going to do the job.

      The idealism of the left is what’s pushing them. Where is the idealism of freedom and individual opportunity that should be driving us?


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  • #
    lmwd

    I echo many of the comments here already in thanking Chris. His email responses are a timely boost of the inspiration we need to keep on fighting this madness.

    He has demonstrated the utmost integrity and a level of ethical behaviour that shows Gore and his acolytes up for what they are.

    Clearly the alarmists will use any means to manipulate and deceive people and ultimately, it’s all about money. It is despicable and desperate behaviour, but we all know it’s not new. They’re your garden variety con people who prey on the gullible. The only difference is they now have a slick and well-funded operation from the proceeds of scaremongering, and more than a few political connections.

    I can only hope that these emails get to a wider audience. The embarrassment of Gore getting caught out might persuade some of his political buddies to distance themselves.


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  • #
    Graeme No.3

    Now let me guess JFC;
    you live in the inner city.
    Your income derives from the Government.
    All your friends think that Climate Deniers are evil loonies.

    For your information, the 5 % saying that climate change isn’t happening wouldn’t include 97% of those appearing on this blog. Practically every sceptic believes in climate change, natural climate change. There may well be some contribution by man to climate change; I wouldn’t rule it out. But in 40 years of people trying to induce panic, the one thing they have never been able to measure is the amount due to humans. There is NO EVIDENCE that has been produced at all. Back in the early days of television we used to have advertisements where some actor in a (very clean, neatly ironed, unlike real life) white lab coat would intone 99% of all doctors/dentists/confidence tricksters recommend product X.

    Most people woke up to this very quickly. Nice to know that you belong to those people who can be fooled all the time!


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  • #
    pat

    when i posted the Landline “carbon sunk” excerpts, i didn’t realise handjive had already posted on the program. however, i did include comment from Lyndee Severin, which i also posted on WUWT, and Chris Tangey has commented over there, in part:

    “…and in the comment immediately below it is a quote from Lyndee Severin, her and her husband Ashley ARE the very same landowners. As I am going 50% with them on any news footage sales (to help them for their losses from the fire) I was a bit nervous about telling them about my refusal to Al Gore the first time.
    But when I shared the news they enthusiastically agreed and were very happy. You see, no matter where you live on Earth, you can’t fool those who live on the land.”

    what a small world!

    meanwhile, BBC is in meltdown. note Orlowski’s gives Tony Newbery’s Tribunal another mention here:

    12 Noc: Register: Andrew Orlowski: BBC places news chief and her deputy beyond use in Savile row
    Latest DG leaps overboard from rudderless behemoth
    Boaden was paid £354,000 last year, and a fortnight ago took time out to fend off a freedom-of-information request at a tribunal…
    Fran Unsworth takes over as acting head of news. In 2006 she helped set a new agenda for reporting environmental issues in a blog post of some historical interest. (see excerpt below)
    Worse may yet come. Paleo-commentator Simon Heffer points out that the peer wrongly accused on Twitter following the BBC’s Newsnight report has an ancient antipathy towards BBC Trust chairman Lord Patten…
    http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/12/bbc_news_heads/

    1 Aug 2006: BBC: Fran Unsworth: Environmental Changes
    You would have had to have been in hibernation for the past few years to have missed the ascent of the environment up the news agenda. We have been suffering a heat wave this week that many people have found unpleasant, the south east is crippled with drought and the UK apparently now produces award-winning wine because we can grow vines successfully in this country.
    Many are questioning whether climate change is responsible for all this; others argue these events are cyclical.
    There is a huge responsibility on us to be a trusted and reliable source of information. But to report the subject properly we have to look not only at the science, but also the impact of environmental issues on economics, business and politics. Like all journalistic organisations we tend to have difficulty doing joined-up reporting…
    That’s why we have decided to appoint an environment analyst to try to pull together some of these threads. Roger Harrabin has covered the environment for two decades, largely for radio where he has reported the story as it appears through energy, transport, housing and politics.
    In his new post he will spread this approach across a wider range of BBC outlets offering original stories and new perspectives, and tackling such subjects as…
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditors/2006/08/environmental_changes.html
    (COMMENT by Christopher Tierney: The only voices arguing against Climate change are those whose words are motivated by ignorance or money, and it’s a shame that so many of the media find it necessary to do the oil companies’ work for them by planting the seeds of doubt. Not one credible scientific paper published in the last 15 years casts doubt on the fact that we’re causing global climate change, but scepticism among politicians and the media go against this concensus, with 53% of newspaper articles published in that time expressing doubt over our responsibility for the current crisis.When is the overwhelming weight of scientific evidence going to change hearts and minds? It took decades for tobacco’s health hazards to become commonly accepted because of industry pressure; will the ability of Big Oil to buy the hearts and minds of politicans mean that the same will be true of climate change? I’m afraid we don’t have time to find out.)

    incredible the tobacco/oil meme was being used under the Unsworth piece in 2006?


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  • #
    pat

    jo,

    get a new thread started ASAP.

    +++BBC Climate 28 revealed+++
    Maurizio Morabito has obtained the details of the BBC climate 28. It had been published by the International Broadcasting Trust.
    Greenpeace, Tearfund, Television for the Environment (one of the companies involved in the BBC free programming scandal), Stop Climate Chaos, Npower Renewables, E3G, and dear old Mike Hulme from UEA. Just the group you’d want guiding climate change coverage. Read the whole thing…
    http://bishophill.squarespace.com/blog/2012/11/12/bbc-climate-28-revealed.html

    BP, the Insurance Industry, Renewables Industry, blah blah and virtually no scientists, and certainly no sceptics.

    hallelujah.


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  • #
    RoyFOMR

    Pat,WUWT is on this as well.Don’t forget to go to Maurizios’ omnologos site where he first broke the list. TwentyEightGate has only just begun!!!!


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  • #
    Bruce D Scott

    What a mendacious, corrupt, totalitarian, power mad ideologues are Gore and friends.


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