Got Solar PV? Don’t let the kids play on the roof
Would you like a 240Volt shock with that?
In Australia, shonky fly-by-night installers are botching the wiring and not screwing the panels on properly. As many as a quarter of solar panels pose a high or severe “electrical safety” risk. Since there are two million households with solar panels, that’s half a million homes sitting under a live problem.
By mismanagement and delusional climate-changing schemes the government has entirely and artificially created the solar bubble. Hopefully people won’t die like they did in the Pink Batts Bubble. Back then, to stop droughts and storms and save the nation from the Global Financial Crisis, the government decided to rush out home insulation. The artificial bubble brought in poorly trained workers and four people died. Kevin Rudd (former PM) now says he wouldn’t have done it if he’d known the risks. But heck, way back in 2010 no one could have realized that artificial government industry bubbles wouldn’t mix well with 240 Volts. Sure.
Australia’s big advance seems to be to stop unnecessary deaths under roofs, and start doing them on top.
Warning of deaths over solar panel installations
-
Simon Benson, The Australian
Energy Minister Angus Taylor has written to his state counterparts to warn that lives could be at risk from unsafe or sub-standard solar panel installations, with a national audit report finding up to one-quarter of all rooftop units inspected posed a severe or high risk.
The national audit of the Renewable Energy Target has revealed that between 21 and 26 per cent of small-scale rooftop solar installations inspected every year since 2011 had been found to have faulty wiring and unsecured panels. Some posed a “severe risk” where wiring was exposed. This required units to be shut down immediately and remediated.
A total of 35 licensed installation contractors have been warned they face the possibility of suspension…
There are so many upstart sharks in the solar installation industry that the faulty panels they leave behind are known as “solar orphans”.
Fly-by-night operators installing faulty solar panels
Sam Buckingham-Jones, The Australian
Rod Grono spends about half of his time repairing poorly installed and cheap solar panels in Sydney’s west. ‘‘Solar orphans’’, as the 50-year-old boss of Western Sydney Solar calls them, are installed quickly by companies that fold, change their name or simply don’t answer phones or complaints.
“I get a lot of calls. A lot of them are solar orphans. The sharks have come in, they’ve whacked it in. No design, no care, poor workmanship,” Mr Grono said. “There are thousands that have closed. They change their name, they have a different director. Half of my customers are solar orphans. The companies may be there, but they don’t answer.”
I know a team who’ve been installing panels for ten years and they plan to get out because the margins are wafer thin, and they can’t compete with cut-price teams who won’t survive long enough to honor their warrantees. More fun coming in Australia.
If the cat goes missing, check the roof (and turn the power off).
h/t Belatedly to Pat
Naturally, The Australian spinmeisters would delightedly adopt the phrase “orphan panels” to describe those poor dangerous rooftop malcontents. It fits the oppressed victim group vernacular of identity politics
Call them what they really are, b’astard panels.
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I have to say Latus that where government sudsidised solar panels are concerned the main victim group are people like myself who do not install panels (for whatever reason).
As such we are forced to to subsidise the cost of electricty for those with panels because of an ill thought out green ideology that has encouraged governments to go down this path.
For those who do find themselves left with a ‘dodgy’ solar installation I do have sympathy.
GeoffW
430
I can be sympathetic for those who were forced to deploy solar, either due to a remote location or idiotic legislation. But, for those who deploy it for virtue signaling purposes or think they’re saving the planet, they probably didn’t do the due diligence on the installer either, so let them pay again to have it installed right.
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I thank you for your fiscal contribution to my panels Geoffrey but at least the lesson in socialism we taught you is free .
74
Socialism is an ideology just like climate alarmist virtue. I don’t need either.
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Geoffrey, while your contributions are no doubt appreciated by the solar folk, they are often overstated by Jo and many of the commenters here. The last ACCC report on retail electricity prices (which Jo had linked to in an earlier post) put the total environmental costs on the average bill at $106 pa or 6.5% of your bill. Half of that 6.5% was then due to the large scale renewable certificates. Small scale certificates (SRES)which the home solar folk generate (albeit out of thin air) are only responsible for 17% of the 6.5%, so 1.1% of your bill. Also the old Feed In Tariffs are responsible for about 23% of that 6.5% so 1.5% of your bill but of course that is a little disguised in some states like Qld where the Gov (read taxpayer) foots the bill for the old FiTs so by the time you add on the state based subsidies, that 23% is more like 33% and so you are paying 33% of that 6.5% so 2.1%. So all up the solar roofed folk are costing you about 3.2% of your bill.
Don’t forget that you give the Gov himself 10% cash in hand for his troubles – three times what you give the solar folk.
And you fork out a huge network subsidy for those hippie farmer folks living out in whoop-whoop – why can’t they farm in the inner suburbs or at least near those power stations so the wires are shorter? Maybe ten times what you give the solar folk.
And don’t get me started on all those old folk and poor folk who get subsidies for their electricity 🙁 , who knows how much they are costing the hard working folk and fellow commenters here.
23
Joe, you left out the very pertinent fact that all the solar and wind requires back up, so there is the almost entirely another network that has to back them up…. here’s a thought…why not just build the back up? Oh that’s right Australia is trying to save the planet from its <2% of 4% of 400ppm of CO2…. which from a quick calculation amounts to about 4/100ths of a degree of warming in 100 years… stupid is as stupid does
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Spot on!
Some years ago, a Metropolitan Council I was involved with, was surrounded by 5 other Councils, all of which granted an “early payment discount” of up to 5% of Council rates. We did not, and we copped dozens of letters of complaint every year about our lack of a discount.
The reason we gave no discount was that every year, we did an extensive investigation into the number of accounts (mostly pensioner ones) already paying in full without any discount, and we also looked at the number of additional early payments we would need to attract in order to come out in front. We found that at current bank interest rates, we could never attract sufficient additional early payments to justify the cost of discount.
I asked one of the neighbouring Mayors how he could afford to give the discount, and he said: “We can’t; it’s a stupid idea, but everybody wants it, so we just jack up the rates every year by 5% to pay for the cost of the discount granted”.
Those poor suckers of ratepayers who didn’t have the ready cash to pay their bills early in those neighbouring Council areas, were losing out twice – once through missing out on the discount, and again through having to pay 5% extra to subsidise the rates of those early-payers richer than themselves.
The same situation applies in these stepped-tariff electricity arrangements for those with roof-top solar panels and it makes me angry whenever I see one. The A.L.P. and Greens are picking the pockets of the poor, in order to supply substantial subsidies to those who are richer.
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Jack up the cost to give a discount is standard business practice but ratepayers should be made aware of it .
And yes the subsidies given for solar panels are paid for by those that can’t afford them and they keep paying through dearer electricity prices , this scam should be made clear to those thinking of buying solar and to the general public as most have no idea .
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The converted sunlight to electricity from a rooftop costs less than the converted wind and sunlight from grid scale installations. While the RET remains, rooftop panels are providing lower cost ambient sourced power than if it come from a grid scale ambient generator.
The situation may change if the RET is not increased and prices for LGCs collapse. Electricity Bill is promising to increase the RET and has a better than even chance of getting power. An increased RET gives investors the “certainty” needed to keep farming subsidies. Prices of LGCs should jump when Labor get power.
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Always find the certainty thing interesting. How many industries get to get government assurances of future revenue flows before they invest? Farmers would like certainty, BHP woud like certainty, Coles would like certainty.
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I forgot myself! I would like some certainty, surely the government should ensure my future revenues and remove share market and other financial instabilites. Its only fair.
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Yep indeed GW, there is a long litany of hierarchical victim groups, one or more of which you appear to belong. There always is in identity politics. Must be very satisfying in its way, all that belonging..
As you no doubt realised but chose to ignore, my sardonic post referred specifically to the misnomer and hapless depiction of ‘orphan’ solar panel, not only inaccurate but an insult to orphans.
So now we have to feel a tinge of pity for incompetently and dangerously installed inanimate toxic solar panels? You must be kidding. (/rhet ..in case you missed that).
As I wrote, they are illegitimate, and in ao more ways than one, as have been described on this site for years: justification, policy, economics, viability, stability, utility, reliability and on an on.
B’stard describes illegitimacy quaintly if not quite well, particularly in this instance.
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OK Latus you make some good points and with some eloquence.
I think that we probably agree on most things.
GeoffW
10
At least you now know why they kept saying how renewables were going to create more jobs – jobs to install them, jobs to fix the installations, and eventually jobs to replace them. Cool.
50
Now that’s a clever blog . . .
Well said.
GeoffW
00
Wait too until people start tallying how many homes have leaking roofs. No fun climbing on a tile roof every few years to recall penetrations and then have to replace soggy pink batts and drywall.
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Re-caulk.
80
Interesting that they only show tiled roofs. What about all the corrugated iron roofs in use? Could that mean an entire electrified roof and gutter?
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Potentially! Ho ho <— readers voice
I worked on a house that gave me a belt when I reached from the top of the ladder to the tin roof. Not funny as I was only trying to empty the leaves out of the gutters.
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My neighbour had panels installed on a steeply pitched iron roof. The inspector who has to sign off on the grid connect picked up that the panel attachments were only screws into/through the roof metal and not attached to structure in anyway.
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This is destined to hit California in spades as our insane legislature has made solar panels required for all new construction starting in 2020.
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Californians and their governments are hotbeds of misplaced green climate change enthusiasm.
One day the birds will come home to roost. Who will be crowing then?
GeoffW
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There’ll be no birds coming home to roost; they would have all been chomped up by the windmills.
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Or friend in the solar thermal plant!
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The birds came home after they got inundated with floods and mudslides after the wildfires.
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Yet another reason to flee:
Residents Increasingly Fleeing New York, Los Angeles and Chicago
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trouble is that unless they have been red pilled they will just spread their disease to those other locations. I really hope not.
20
Hi jo,
you may have come across this already, but for all followers, not constantly following the GWPF site,
have some fun.. Christmas Competition- The Tallest Climate Tales Of 2018
• Date: 19/12/18
• Global Warming Policy Forum
An international competition for our readers, friends and supporters
We at the Global Warming Policy Forum like to keep a close eye on what the press and the broadcast media have to say about global warming science. Some of it is, it’s fair to say, pretty far removed from anything a reasonable person would recognise as, well, science. We had a very apt example, just this week, with the BBC caught making up spurious “facts” about penguins in Africa.
With the season of goodwill and merriment upon us, we thought it would be fun to celebrate the dedicated work of our friends in green public relations. We are therefore inviting you to take part in our special competition, with a chance to win some excellent prizes. Simply tell us about what you think was the tallest green tale of 2018, and explain to us why it was so daft.
Nominations together with rebuttals should be emailed to [email protected]
Deadline: 31 December 2018.
Prize: Two GWPF books (Group Think and Population Bombed) plus a bottle of House of Lords whisky.
The GWPF team will decide the winner of the competition early in in the new year.
Good luck, and Merry Christmas!
The Forum team
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The need two divisions. The Al Gore talking head medal for media darlings that talk rubbish and/or are grossly hypocritical. Then the Mann Medal for those with enough education to know better
20
It’s sad that we can no longer trust our Government to act on our behalf to simply run the country well.
Whether at Local, State or Federal levels, so much of what is done is to benefit Politicians, the elected elite, or the permanent support team, aka Public Servants.
Money is the driving force in all decision making and anything that’s needed to keep the parliamentary salary intact will be the guide for action. The attached bureaucracies want their share too.
The Rooftop Solar period is not going to end well.
A very interesting comment by Dave in the States the other day showed how Japan lost control of it’s country to Bureaucrats.
It didn’t end well. The Global Warming Scam is not going to end well either considering that world society has not moved forward in any area of life in the last 20 years.
KK
250
What must be remembered about to whole Government system is, it’s ‘ONLY’ function is to spend tax payers money. How that money is spent is secondary at best.
A politican can’t fix any problem or issue, they can only decide how much to spend on it.
No politican ever says ‘We’ll fix this problem’ What they say is ‘ We’ll spend $X on this problem.’
Public service management is not judged or benched marked on how well they solved a problem or fix an issue. Their job is to spend to money the politicians have allocated. The worst crime any public service manager can commit is to not spend ‘ALL’ of their budget. In fact they are bench marked on the size of their budget, not what they have achieved.
280
Nothing is going to end well with our current delinquent and insane politicians we keep electing. The only way to stop the rot is to stop voting for them. Of course that’s not going to happen because most people don’t yet understand how bad things are getting. ZZZZZZZ
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There is probably”Trillions”of dollars tied up in this”Global Warming” scam and when it does prove to be”Unsustainable”there will be a lot of people who will get”Crucified”The scammers are just hopng that they are long gone before the”$hit Hits the Fan”It WILL be UGLY….
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‘….considering that world society has not moved forward in any area of life in the last 20 years.’
Medical science and space exploration?
10
O.K. I was exaggerating.
30
Ive told you at least a billion times to stop exaggerating!!
20
Sounds suspiciously like a rerun of Pink Battes MkII.
Ironically, Georg Wilhelm Friedrich Hegel, of all people, seems to have got it right:
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So, you trust your government? Why? No seriously, why?
There are many various models of business interaction for the purchase and supply of goods and services, here as some of the possibilities-
The fair-trade model:
You go to the shops with money in your pocket. The shop has a stock of the items you need at a price you can afford. You select what you want from the store, the shopkeeper gives you your selection and then you pay for it on receipt.
The fair investment model:
You go to the shops with money in your pocket. The shop is out of stock of the items you need. You place an order and give a deposit as part-payment. On delivery of the item you collect your purchase and pay the outstanding balance.
The fair risk-share model:
A business offers you a service for a task that you cannot do yourself. You pay a deposit to cover the cost of the materials, and then on satisfactory completion of the task you pay the outstanding balance.
The Mafia Business model:
An organization mandates that you need a service they will supply for you. They require you to pay for the service up-front whether you need it or no. This organization has the power and the will to damage your wellbeing if you do not comply with their demands for payment.
Sounds familiar?
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Public servants serve the public. Seriously, most people employed in government ARE working for the public and in the public’s behalf, as best as they are allowed. There are entrenched people, however, that only work for their own advantage. Sadly, THEY are the ones most people think about when they see the words “public servant,” not the thousands that actually DO work for them.
10
True.
00
Money is power, and as Lord Acton observed, “Power corrupts…”
00
a couple of hundred volts ac can be deadly.
thats why it is mandated that everybody has an RCD (safety switch).
In Aust these days almost every single circuit is RCD protected.
a PV string? could be easily be 300Vdc
there are inverters with RCDs to detect faults on the DC side and de-couple the the inverter’s DC bus
but the thing is they’re not rated to protect dad when he’s on the roof retrieving the footy.
300mA is typical when as little as 30mA can make the rest of yr life unpleasant to non-existant.
of course there is the real possibility of part of that string of PV cells has some sort of earth fault, some sort of water ingress, some unlucky sequence of events and connected to the inverter or not and the whole roof could easily be at several hundred volts DC.
Some of the buildings I work in have pretty extensive solar arrays. 15 or 25 kW. Panels cover the roof tops behind the parapet that nobody ever sees except service personnel like me.
Personally, I wouldnt even dream of touching any part of that installation without a multi-meter first
what’s a few hundred volts dc between friends?
any body ever seen a DC arc?
…might be the last thing you ever see.
360
One 250W panel (I have one for battery charging and small (free) power supplying, Short circuit current 8 A, open voltage 37V. So 6 panels in series is 222V , Yep thatl do damage to you if shorted OR you connect yourself to both ends! Leakage current only works for AC not panel DC. If these things arent install with breakers properly you are asking for trouble. Of course theres going to be alot of sharks in the industry. Should be properly regulated WITH an electrical inspector checking each install as for standard electrical work. ASNZ standards.
90
Never be totally reliant on RCD’s or Trip Switches to stop people from being electrocuted, the device will only work if the set circuit load is reached meaning a person can receive the full current if they are grounded and the RCD’s limit isn’t reached, I learnt this the hard way as a Boilermaker with welders and was on a site when a worker was badly electrocuted, he touched the back of of an exposed power point thinking the power was off and got 240 volts for 10 seconds without the Trip Switch activating, a flying drop kick from a workmate saved him.
80
One of the reasons I went with microinverters. Ive seen the result of dropping a shifter across some 1000A busbars in a telephone exchanges. It was pretty spectacular. Only 48V but as much current as you can eat.
50
The batteries at one main exchange I remember were made up of 8000 Amp/Hour, 2volt cells. Two separate strings of 24 (one in use, one standby). They were open topped, in lead lined wooden cases. There were NO main fuses – nobody made one big enough, but each floor’s distribution had one – several thousand amps, as I recall…
10
Lots of advantages but price isnt one of them
00
I’m surprised to read that apparently the low-voltage PVs are wired in series to increase the voltage. I would have thought that the source-voltage would be kept low, to avoid electrolysis and arcing, and then have the voltage increased at the output of the inverter.
00
input 200 to 600 Vdc for inverters.
panels might be 300W say 9A at 32V at peak power
a 3kW system might be 10 panels in series at 320V
a 15 kW system with a single inverter might be 5x 3kW systems in parallel.
so thats 320 V and 45A
when the sun is shining its an arc welder … with more punch.
20
Because 1) “Daisy Chaining” multiple panels in series is much simpler than connecting them in parallel, which would require multi-way connector blocks, and careful layout to keep the individual panel leads the same length. 2) It keeps the down-leads to the inverter smaller – look up Ohms Law, and calculate the cable size required to handle (say) 5kw at 32 volts compared to the same power at 600 volts.
20
I’m surprised someone didn’t mention another hazard. Pigeons.
Solar panel installations create a convenient place to nest and bring up a family.
I call the Paris agreement the Paris excrement. The pigeons produce an overload of solar excrement.
301
The possums in my neighbourhood are very wary of panels. Several home owners have had to fork out hundreds of dollars to have dead (electrocuted) possums from under their panels. Myself included. New wiring is also essential. Electrician warned that fire from possums chewing on cables is also possible
Best put up signs that read ” chewing of cables in daylight hours is deadly”.
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I had a brushtail possum nest under my panels once.
Must get bloody hot mid summer with a tiled roof.
30
Any statistics from house insurers? One source on top ten causes:
Cooking – Heating – Smoking – Appliances – Candles – Children – Wiring – Flammable liquids – Lighting.
Rooftop solar could be included in 4 and 7, but doesn’t get a mention.
DC arc faults on solar PV systems have been identified as the root cause of over 250 domestic and commercial building fires in Australia.
Figures from the electricity safety watchdog in WA show that in the two years to June 30, there were 24 “incidents” caused by defective solar panel installations.
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“Kevin Rudd: we would have stopped home insulation scheme if risks were known“
When you’re getting away with slogans like “the great moral challenge of our generation” and claim you are saving the planet, well, it can be intoxicating to pronounce, toxic for everyone else suffering the consequences of the moralising stupidity.
Rudd was warned and laughed at on this website, for one, and to claim he was not aware of risks is not acceptable.
If he was not made aware of risks from folk defying the madness, more so.
Innocent folk are dead, and Rudd walks free with that pathetic excuse.
Accountability please.
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I would think there are many people who should be held accountable for those deaths, not just Rudd.
In my industry at least (oil & gas), when it comes to safety, anyone can, and indeed, should “stop the job” if they don’t think it’s safe for them, or others, if they have questions, if they don’t understand the overall job, or their part of it…etc. There’s also the other matter of ‘take 5’, ‘step back for safety’, etc, where people are encouraged to think a bit before leaping in to a task. The…there’s also the basic hazard and risk assessment process…
While everyone grumbles and groans when the HSE person shows up, and at some of the paperwork involved, in reality, barring some totally overboard rules, this sort of safety culture is far from a bad thing, and, indeed, I have found myself being far more safety conscious at home than I used to be.
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many people = people in the Rudd government, in the public service, and other various political parasites in or associated with the Labor party at the time.
100
In The Australian: Let’s find some balance in managing climate change by Bjorn Lomborg.
“The latest global climate summit in Poland has generated familiar predictions of doom and disaster from environmental activists. Climate change seems to freeze our capacity for critical thinking.”
“Globally, solar and wind satisfy less than 1 per cent of our energy needs. The International Energy Agency estimates that by 2040, even if the Paris Agreement holds, this will increase to just above 4 per cent.”
“Just as activists and the media engender fear by associating every fire, flood and hurricane with climate change, they generate a false belief that there are simple solutions to the problem.”
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Oh to have been a fly on the wall for this – must have been a real ripper of a brawl…..
It seems NSW just loves its UN-slavery…or more to the point – are the people NSW being sold down the river to life in a UN “straight jacket”?
https://www.afr.com/news/coag-energy-meeting-tempers-flare-as-angus-taylor-blocks-nsw-net-zero-plan-20181219-h19acd
“NSW Climate and Energy Minister Don Harwin vowed to push on with his crusade to “end the Canberra climate wars” after federal minister Angus Taylor derailed his proposal to plot a national pathway to net zero emissions by 2050 at an acrimonious Council of Australian Governments’ meeting.
“Tempers flared at the meeting of energy ministers in Adelaide after Mr Taylor used an obscure procedural rule to block Mr Harwin’s motion for a net zero emissions pathway. A furious Mr Harwin said that if Mr Taylor was going to use obscure procedural rules to block a motion supported by most state and territory energy ministers “be it on your own head”.
“The bitter split between the NSW and federal coalition governments comes as Gladys Berejiklian’s NSW Coalition government faces a March 23 election in which climate policy looms large after voters sharply rejected the Morrison government’s climate change agnostic energy policies at the Wentworth byelection in October and the Victorian state election in November.
“Mr Harwin said in a statement after the meeting: “I am very disappointed by the actions of the federal government at COAG Energy Council in Adelaide today.
“The refusal, on procedural grounds, to let the vital matter of restoring an emissions obligation into national energy policy be discussed is extraordinary. NSW will continue to pursue this critical matter with COAG Energy Council.”
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Angus has his orders and his minders are looking after him, all good. As I mentioned on the previous thread, Harwin is not privy to what is coming and should consider his future outside of Energy.
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A bit rich coming from someone who asked for $990 per head from coal companies invited to a fund raising dinner. In today’s Australian.
30
“.. net zero emissions..” I dont know what part of the total impossibility of ‘net zero emissions ‘ dont they understand.
110
Its totally possible! hold my beer and let me at that spreadsheet!! Oh, you mean like in reality? well yeah maybe not so much.
30
Oh no, we have a new report to be released today from the Bureau of Meteorology and CSIRO “Climate report warns of no escape from rising heat.”
“We’ll all be rooned,” said Hanrahan.
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Well, in the USA, people are battening down for the next 2 winters which according to cyclical records utilized the publication “Farmers Almanac” will be bitterly cold.
I personally know of US rural folk selling unnecessary livestock now so they dont have to feed them.
NASA has also take one of its sunspot satellites off line, possibly so people cant get the data of a silent sun….
Time to start installing double glazed everything….
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https://www.iceagenow.info/lack-of-sunspots-to-bring-record-cold-warns-nasa-scientist/
“It could happen in a matter of months,” says Martin Mlynczak of NASA’s Langley Research Center.
________________
“The sun is entering one of the deepest Solar Minima of the Space Age,” wrote Dr Tony Phillips just six weeks ago, on 27 Sep 2018.
Sunspots have been absent for most of 2018 and Earth’s upper atmosphere is responding, says Phillips, editor of spaceweather.com.
Data from NASA’s TIMED satellite show that the thermosphere (the uppermost layer of air around our planet) is cooling and shrinking, literally decreasing the radius of the atmosphere.
To help track the latest developments, Martin Mlynczak of NASA’s Langley Research Center and his colleagues recently introduced the “Thermosphere Climate Index.”
The Thermosphere Climate Index (TCI) tells how much heat nitric oxide (NO) molecules are dumping into space. During Solar Maximum, TCI is high (meaning “Hot”); during Solar Minimum, it is low (meaning “Cold”).
“Right now, it is very low indeed … 10 times smaller than we see during more active phases of the solar cycle,” says Mlynczak
“If current trends continue, it could soon set a Space Age record for cold,” says Mlynczak. “We’re not there quite yet, but it could happen in a matter of months.”
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From https://climate.nasa.gov/evidence/:
It appears that NASA believes that ONLY CO2 can cause warming and lack of sun-spots causes cooling.
I see a disconnect here
120
Entirely true. I think the great ‘NASA” has been totally embarrassed by the whole warming (not happening) fiasco its now running for cover.
70
No shortage of cover in the swamp.
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BoM/CSIRO 2018 State of the Climate: Thank goodness for ocean sinks currently holding more warming extremes at bay
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-20/bom-csiro-biennial-state-of-the-climate/10631122
Wait. What?
Climate correction: when scientists get it wrong
On November 1, AFP joined news outlets around the world in covering the release of a major academic paper warning that our oceans were warming dramatically quicker than previously thought.
There was just one problem: it was wrong.
https://phys.org/news/2018-11-climate-scientists-wrong.html
Wait. What?
3 x half the GBR dead?
“LIFE FINDS A WAY: Great Barrier Reef somehow adapting to global warming … Cancel the coral-bleaching apocalypse … life has somehow found a way to adapt to temperature increases, you know, just like life on the planet has done for the past 500M yrs or so” …
https://twitchy.com/gregp-3534/2018/12/17/life-finds-a-way-great-barrier-reef-somehow-adapting-to-global-warming/
30
The excuses (for cooling instead of warming) will keep coming..and coming..and coming..we told you so!!
40
My replies in BOLD:
‘Climate hoax’ true
The correction prompted some climate deniers to wheel out the conspiracy theory that manmade global warming is made up. it is you scammers get a life!
Some Twitter users suggested the study was funded by the Democrats, that human-induced planetary warming was invented by former presidential hopeful Al Gore so he could buy a house, and that decades of evidence-based research into the phenomenon constituted “pseudoscience”. another truth
But scientists rallied round the authors, pointing out that the process surrounding the Nature paper’s publication and correction was, really, how scientific research is supposed to work. = birds of a feather stick together
“Science is a human endeavour and it’s therefore imperfect. What’s important is that results are scrutinised and replicated by others so that we can assess what is robust and what isn’t,” Gavin A. Schmidt, director at the Goddard Institute for Space Sciences at NASA, told AFP. so if you are imperfect STOP TELLING CLIMATE LIES WITH FAKE DATA!!
“Current climate change has been looked at by thousands of scientists (and other interested people) and our understanding of it is pretty solid,” he said.
thousands of scientists with BIG GOV funding and pay packets to keep up the scam or get fired
Read more at: https://phys.org/news/2018-11-climate-scientists-wrong.html#jCp
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Real shame is that more scientists like Curry and Lewis are no longer employed by our institutions. If they were, this embarrassing mistake would have been found in peer review before it was published instead of after it went “global”.
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“97%” went global – aided and abetted by Oh Bummer.
90
“Life finds a way” good grief, as if there are no coral reefs in warmer water neaer the equator. Never mind it will all be dissolved in boiling acid if you nelieve the more rabid alarmists.
20
“We believe that it’s due to the same overall mechanism, which is a shift in circulation,” Dr Braganza said.
“As the planet has warmed, we’ve pushed the cold fronts and cut off lows that bring this rainfall to the southern parts of the continent, further south.”
‘According to Dr Braganza, the south-west has been drying at a greater rate because it is more dependent on those southerly systems coming through.’
————-
This all changed in the Austral winter of 2017 and since then cold fronts and moisture have returned. So in a Royal Commission the prosecutor would simply resort to the facts and prove these boffins are asleep at the wheel.
50
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-20/bom-csiro-biennial-state-of-the-climate/10631122
The oceans “absorb” heat from the atmosphere. Right. Nobble that donkey with a Nobel.
The Sun is benign apparently in the new world of CSIRO/BoM science.
It’s laughable.
50
it clearly much,much worse than we thought
possibly a tipping point, but definitely a crisis
this will require more research. Oh, and funding
20
This report from Poland is interesting, from Morning Mail;
http://morningmail.org/cop-24-climate-change-conference-end/#more-94936
40
Hi there talk about shoddy installations we had a 2 kilowatt system installed
about 7 years ago ( shouldn’t have done it in retrospect) the idea at the time
seemed Ok.However in the course of time I began to wake up to the global warming/
climate change non science scam and its associated green carpet baggers selling
solar panels and installing them .One such company in the blue mountains called Aussie
Solar did our installation (and of course received the government funded subsidy certificates)
What has happened and what have I learnt since this job was done:
1.Well the systems output was really only a third of the 2 kilowatt rating it had it in fact averaged over the 7years
2. I came to realise that this green scheme was ripping off other electricity customers by increasing their electricity bills to help pay for my panels through these subsidy certificates.
3. About 6 months ago after returning from a holiday we found the inverter box hanging off
Timber clad wall -it had not been properly secured to the frame behind the cladding.
4. Then we had our electrician around to look at some other wiring job and to diagnose the
“No utility “ error reading on the inverter.
5 . This young hard working decent electrician told us that this company who had sold and installed the panels were no longer in business at least in our area of the blue mountains anymore
6. He told us that the company had made big money by importing lots of panels from China and
in fact installing them across NSW
7. The company had gone to the wall over not paying superannuation entitlements to their
employees,enough said that it would only be their customers and employees who have been
stung by this operation and I’m sure not it’s owners.
Cheers Mike R
220
” my customers are solar orphans ”
Great term.
Most home owners are not trained nor physically prepared to check their system.
We visited with a person that broke a wrist trying to put up Christmas lights on the house.
Found this: around 48,000 people a year in the UK now attend hospital Accident and Emergency departments following a ladder accident in and around the home.
Further, these folks won’t know they are “solar orphans” until something bad happens and they try to call. Along that line of thinking, every one of these installations ought to be inspected every year. Won’t happen.
Our heating and AC service wants to inspect every year, but it gets done only about every other year. Ours is electric, well designed, inspected, and with a strong/sound installation.
This home solar thing is going to grow into a big mess.
110
As the population ages, ladders (and anything climbed upon to reach a height)
become one of the greatest causes of injury and death around, especially if
taking aspirin or on anticoagulants where intracranial bleeding does the job.
Warning! Warning! Warning!
30
24 hours in Emergency is a TV show littered with old blokes who have come off ladders.
I found a really safe way to do my gutters, I put the ladder on tray of the truck. Much better, I mean what could possibly go wrong?
10
Still be careful. I remind my husband about a friend’s 80-year-old father (in England) who fell off a ladder from only about a metre off the ground and was seriously injured.
21
I’m sure everyone that does this stuff is being careful, right up to the point they plummet. I am theoretically banned from ladders , its one of those flexible bans it seems to me. If the ban-er wants something done suddenly ladders are OK just for this job 🙂
Would be ironic if I met my end of a ladder. I chucked myself out of planes for a decade in my youth.
10
I’m very aware of the danger of ladders for older people. Nevertheless, I am about to buy a small three-step ladder from Kogan so that I can change my light bulbs.
I live in a federation cottage with high ceilings. The building is almost a hundred years old. The light bulb in the kitchen blows out at least once a month. I’ll be careful.
20
Our new neighbour injured himself off a ladder. Has the video as he was working in view of a CCTV camera. Things go pear shaped really quickly.
00
The term ‘Orphans’ Reminded me of the Oliver Twist musical Oliver,
Consider yourself a Green
Consider yourself one of the gullible
We’ve taken you for heaps
It’s clear you’re getting in real deep
Consider yourself well had
Consider yourself part of the subsidies
There isn’t a lot to spare
Who cares?.What ever we’ve got, we snare!
If it should chance to be
We should see
Some kaput days
Empty output days
Why groan?
Always-a-chance we’ll fleece
Somebody
To foot the bill
Then the money is on the house!
Consider yourself our pay
We don’t want to have guarantees,
For after some consideration, we can say
Consider yourself
Out of your tree!
60
Another thing to add to the list of when solar panels don’t work .
1 – Night time
2 – Cloudy
3 – when over voltage
4 – During a blackout
5 – When on fire
140
“Ms Zibelman said solar panels were less efficient on days of extreme heat however.”
https://www.afr.com/business/energy/better-to-turn-off-pool-pumps-then-build-power-stations-aemo-20181002-h164s0
If the BoM/CSIRO state of the climate report 2018 is correct about future warming that is here, now, current solar panels haven’t prevented future droughts …
https://theconversation.com/state-of-the-climate-2018-bureau-of-meteorology-and-csiro-109001
60
Yes, solar panels get less efficient the hotter they get. Maybe someone could integrate using water cooling to coll the panels, and pump the resulting hot water into a tank to lower the cost of their hot water?
The design would have to be pretty safe….
41
Actually I think hybrid systems do exist .
30
Just read the blurb on Weatherzone and noticed the use of weasel words such as “could” , but then the kicker ” ocean acidity” which automatically nullified the whole statement and proved it’s not science just a scary fable to scare the population into submission.
No the ocean is not becoming more acidic it’s still caustic or alkaline .
70
CO2 cant acidify the oceans as pointed out on this blog before, 98% CO2 is ALREADY in the oceans and they arent acidic.
91
Add
6 – when a fuse blows that you are unaware of .
20
OT but I’m starting to see a trend in the Liberal party , they seem to be slowly turning green .
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-20/duck-hunters-under-fire-from-left-and-right-in-vic-parli/10636688
This along with the NSW lib minister who wants a 100% emissions reduction .
120
I suspect its the brainwashed 30 somethings starting to have an influence…..
100
We’re in agreement Robert; ‘slowly turning green’ probably caused by a long time lack of blood flow to the brain!
GeoffW
60
As in – the whole gang goes green – and you get – financial/social/political gangrene?
Maybe thats a new meme….?
30
It may indeed be happening quicker than we thought. The Nationals have stated that they are going to run a separate campaign from the Liberals at the state election.
30
A bunch of lizards?
20
Scenario #1: Have a small number of large scale baseload electrical power generators (Nuclear, Coal) with gas peaking units, managed and operated by skilled engineering professionals with a technically mature management framework.
Scenario #2: Have slightly less of the above, and add large numbers of locally installed co-generation units (solar, small windmills, etc) installed and managed by unskilled labor (including the homeowner) without a technically mature management framework.
One of these scenarios socializes risk to the community and leaves that risk unmitigated.
90
What is the life of a solar panel?
how much will it cost to replace or decommission the panels or the system?
How will the panels be disposed of?
What are the environmental consequences?
Will the heavy metals etc become the new “asbestos”
Is this another unintended consequence?
If due diligence had been carried out, we would know the answers.
190
I think like wind turbines, many of them will just be left in place to rot
20
thought the Angus Taylor letter re unsafe/dangerous solar installation (which potentially involves many millions of Australians, given the number of houses/schools, etc which have panels) was a perfect opportunity for the Coalition to go on the offensive about “renewables”, especially in light of Don Harwin’s stunt. (thought Coalition could also draw attention to AEMO/Zibelman’s warning at COAG about risks of blackouts in Vic and SA this summer, reported as an afterthought, in half a sentence, by AFR)
19 Dec: AFR: COAG energy meeting: Tempers flare as Angus Taylor blocks NSW ‘net zero’ plan
By Ben Potter and Simon Evans
***’Shut down’
The meeting heard from Australian Energy Market Operator Audrey Zibelman on the agency’s plans for the summer, with a risk of hot weather and blackouts in ***Victoria and ***South Australia, and agreed to the inclusion of a retailer reliability obligation, part of the abandoned National Energy Guarantee, into national grid rules…
https://www.afr.com/news/coag-energy-meeting-tempers-flare-as-angus-taylor-blocks-nsw-net-zero-plan-20181219-h19acd
2GB/4BC news bulletin this morning. plenty of irrelevant items. second last item a single sentence without even naming the Minister:
(paraphrasing) The federal energy minister has written to his state counterparts warning about the risk of unsafe solar installations.
(in the latest bulletin just now, it’s been moved slightly up the news agenda, and mentions it’s based on an audit and the potential 26%)
Chris Smith (standing in for Alan Jones) then interviewed Angus Taylor. a hurried final question from Smith – you’ve written to your counterparts re solar blah blah.
Taylor goes on without stating any figures or mentioning the audit;
Smith interrupts with possibility of up to 26% unsafe solar installations – this is shocking – pink batts all over again (Coalition and Labor have administered the solar take-up).
yes, says Taylor, cheerily, I’ve known about it for some time. (???)
cannot see any MSM – other than The Australian piece i posted last nite – even bothering to report the story.
note: most solar panel fires are only reported in regional newspapers and downplayed. guess they would be listed simply under house fires in annual stats.
90
Rudd, as is usual, is lying. He was made VERY aware of the risks posed by the insulation scheme. Industry warned him repeatedly. The NZ experience was explained to him. Peter Garrett wrote to him on several occasions warning of the risks. There is still one cabinet document that he refuses to reveal, undoubtedly because it would reveal that he ignored the advice and proceeded anyway. Now, he could face a charge of perjury, if only someone could procure the right pieces of paper.
And we got Rudd instead of Howard. And everything that followed.
160
We got Rudd instead of Howard because more people got bored of to the good times and wanted a change. Just one of man’s fatal attributes. Now we are following the pied piper over the cliff of climate change. We just have to learn the truth the hard way I’m afraid.
140
Peter Garrett should have done more. The industry should have done more. People, including Garrett and Rudd should have been facing criminal charges.
It’s not enough to abrogate responsibility for deaths in a shonky industry by saying “I told you this would happen”.
Angus Taylor also has a responsibility to do more than he has. He should be fighting tooth and nail to get his point across, and to somehow improve the situation. Anything less is unacceptable.
50
Deadly in more ways than one. More house fires will occur due to faulty wiring. More deaths.
60
following looks like an Angus Taylor story? not really. full of Mark Butler, Lily d’Ambrosio, Don Harwin and a no-context comment from Matt Canavan. much space given to pro-“renewables” Liberal South Australian Energy Minister Dan van Holst Pellekaan; no mention of the solar audit/Taylor’s letter:
19 Dec: AFR: Angus Taylor brushes off Gladys Berejikian energy split
By Simon Evans and Ben Potter
SA-NSW interconnector
(Liberal South Australian Energy Minister) Mr Van Holst Pellekaan said having states compete on different local renewable energy targets doesn’t benefit anybody, and spruiked SA’s proposed $1 billion high voltage interconnector to NSW, which the two states are pursuing under a newy signed a memorandum of understanding.
The interconnector will help the heavily wind and solar power dependent state ***offload its surplus energy when conditions are favourable, and back it up with imported energy from NSW when the wind isn’t blowing and the sun isn’t shining. But it must undergo a rigorous regulatory investment test administered before getting the green light…
“This is an agreement to actually get our hands dirty,” Mr van Holst Pellekaan said. He said the best estimate on the ultimate cost for the project was from the draft report by SA’s transmission company ElectraNet, which projected a cost of about $1 billion. “There are some estimates that are a little bit higher than that,” he said…
https://www.afr.com/news/angus-taylor-brushes-off-gladys-berejikian-energy-split-20181219-h199ue
***notice offloading excess “renewable” energy takes prominence over importing energy (no mention it would be fossil fuel energy).
all of this will be lost today anyway, as the Coalition comes under attack for allowing the culling of the brumbies Singleton Army Base in the upper Hunter.
50
And if they build it the towers will be made to lowest bidder specs so the first puff of wind blows down the towers .
20
This project will increase power costs in NSW in two ways. First there is the billion dollars that needs to be paid for. Then there is all that additional intermittency that will upset the NSW network. It will accelerate the demise of Liddell and then there will be a jump in electricity prices as gas takes more market share.
20
“But it must undergo a rigorous regulatory investment test administered before getting the green light” mmmmmm, rigorous. You can just imagine.
20
How many reliable coal fired power stations could they build with that money?
10
“The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: I’m from the government and I’m here to electrify.”
The place for solar panels is on the ground, where you can monitor and maintain. If you must put ’em on the roof, get a long-established rural guy who was installing twenty years ago, pre-bubble, for people who actually needed a solar fit-out.
At least with pink batts you got to see those balls of yellow (who got pink?) Chinese fluff blowing about the streets like tumbleweed in old Westerns. There was a grim poetry in that. You could actually see the nation’s revenues blowing away or clinging pathetically to drains.
40
The ground makes sense for lots of reasons unfortunately most people live in the city on tiny blocks or in townhouses and units. Its nearly always going to be the roof. We went for the garage, but placed them over a carport area so future leaks are outside if they happen.
10
Here ya go;
https://business.financialpost.com/opinion/philip-cross-statcan-just-exposed-how-worthless-green-industries-are-to-canadas-economy
30
I remember we had the same big scare about 10 years ago, just after the initial rush for rooftop solar.
Mainly to do with DC circuit breakers.
They went around and inspected all the systems in NSW.
Most of the non compliance was minor technicalities.
Installers do actually need a lot of official qualifications.
After the millions of installations over decades, we still haven’t had one serious injury AFAIK.
I am not advocating renewables, but I don’t see this issue as a big argument against rooftop solar.
50
Most installers use labourers to do the main installing bit with a sparky only required to wire the inverter in to the fuse box and dumb meter .
40
I think as the panels arent AC they dont need a licence, BUT no regs mean risky jobs. Forgetting 200+V DC kills more than AC! The 50Hz waltz as its called will throw you off more likely than DC.
40
My panels are AC from the back of the panel. I have no long haul DC cabling at all. Its the less common option but is simple and works well. Just a bit more $
10
most sparkies are as thick as a brick only following rules (AS3000, AS3008, AS5033 etc) and for the most part are utterly clueless about any of the engineering involved.
I was one once upon a time.
They, as a group, will gladly tell you how things really are, straight from their interpretation (or mis-interpretation ) of the ‘rules’
Since losing a large portion of our manufacturing base nobody has seen a decent DC voltage except for people who play with trains, trams, generators and UPS.
the guys putting in solar are little more than licensed cable monkeys that have done a ‘solar’ course at Holmsglen TAFE
In any case, ALL fixed wiring must be installed by a Licensed Electrician.
All works can only be undertaken by a licensed Electrical Contractor.
in practice though, this doesn’t really happen.
just walk the electrical isle at bunnings and you’ll soon ascertain why
yes DC breakers and isolators are quite different from AC breakers predominately because an AC arc is self-extinguishing (more or less)
it is only very recently that standards were changed to begin accommodating DC earth fault protection which means that everything before 2016-ish is probably unprotected
10
When I see headlines like this of “Were all gunna die!!! ” followed by shrieking and running around in ever decreasing circles, it reminds me of a Daffy Duck cartoon…..
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-20/bom-csiro-biennial-state-of-the-climate/10631122
“State of the Climate: Thank goodness for ocean sinks currently holding more warming extremes at bay
“The Bureau of Meteorology (BOM) and CSIRO’s joint biennial State of the Climate report has just been released and it is not the kind of report card you would want to take home to your parents just before Christmas.
“Key points:
* Australia’s climate has now warmed by over 1 degree Celsius since 1910
* Oceans have now warmed by around 1C since 1910
“For the first time, the report draws attention to “compound extreme events” when multiple variables coincide
“An extra two years has firmed-up the data to demonstrate that climate change is happening now.
Dr Helen Cleugh, the director of the climate science centre at CSIRO, said the last time the planet saw levels of CO2 this high was at least 800,000 years ago.
She said atmospheric CO2 is up 46 per cent since before the industrial era began in the 1750s.
“We know from our analysis that the cause of the increases in CO2 concentration is human activities, through burning of fossil fuels and through land use change,” Dr Cleugh said.
Land and Sea Temperature Anomalies
Mean temperatures based on 1961 to 1990 average, 21.8 degrees Celsius for mean temperature (land) and 22.2 C for sea surface temperature”
50
The alarmists keep ignoring the question how much will the global temperature be reduced as a result of all our actions on reducing CO2 emissions, real or otherwise? The answer is of course 0. So much money wasted for absolutely no benefit at all, regardless of whether one believes in CAGW or not. That’s worse than insanity.
100
People buy solar panels to virtue signal and supposedly bring down their power bills, we have to convince them that its a waste of money for no benefit and that CO2 does not cause global warming.
This implies a conspiracy of enormous proportions.
94
“An extra two years has firmed-up the data to demonstrate that climate change is happening now.”
Agreed, I have proof that climate changed in July 2017.
30
Given that the next big thing to save the planet is to throw home battery systems out to all and $6000 rebate sundry, I would say that faulty solar might be the least of people’s worries.
Wait till all these rush job batteries start catching fire.
90
True. Some will get a shock (no pun intended) when they realise their insurance will not cover a claim if a fire is caused by a badly installed battery system that doesn’t follow certain guidelines.
70
Hmm…dont forget the article I found in PubMed that indicated they give off HF gas when they burn…..nasty stuff….
Tell me again why youd do it?
*scratches head*
50
As many have said – it’s purely virtue signalling. Actually it’s not even virtue signalling because such a practice is supposed to be for a good cause. There is nothing wrong at all with the climate changing the way it is so there isn’t even a good cause to virtue signal. SO we are left with only negatives aspects, such as economic suicide and diverting lots of money from real good causes. Anyone who bothers to think for themselves instead of acting like they had the thinking power of a rock would realise that’s all it ever can be simply because no matter what we do we won’t be able to have any impact on the climate. We could kill off all land animals, shut down all industry and power generation systems then commit suicide and it will not do a damn thing to the global temperature.
71
[…] quarter of rooftop solar installations could be deadly. Read the story from Jo Nova. Share this:TwitterFacebookGoogleRedditLinkedIn This entry was posted in Global […]
10
There is an additional issue with solar system efficiency that I have not seen mentioned.
I have a 4.86KW (rated) system installed 8 years ago that, on a good day, achieves 5KW (still and I am on the old FIT rate – WHOOHOO!). This is 27 panels arranged in 3 series strings of 9 panels each with 2 of the strings paralleled after the fuses.
Each string has 2 fuses (pos and neg) which are installed underneath the end panels making them difficult to access as a panel has to be lifted. I have had 3 of those fuses fail over the 8 years, which reduced the output by a third.
As the output is variable with weather conditions, it is difficult to determine if a fuse has failed unless it is a bright, clear day and I expect better than 2/3 maximum output (for one blown fuse).
How many systems are in place with line fuses similar to mine whereby the owner does not monitor their output, understand the weather/output relationship or regularly check their fuses/system?
Reports of the take-up of solar systems generally report installed capacity, not efficiency. There are likely many thousands of systems that have failed components which is severely reducing their output.
70
Not sure if mine have fuses or not but I’ve never got anywhere near it’s supposed capacity .
40
“Reports of the take-up of solar systems generally report installed capacity, not efficiency”
Business as usual in renewables world
40
HERE’S THE REPORT – TAKE NOTE HOW TO FIND THE DOWNLOAD! SHOULD BE SIMPLER.
BEGIN AT PAGE 48 OF 76. READ MAYBE 8 OR 10 RELEVANT PAGES. NOT GOING BACK TO CHECK.
17 Dec: AustralanNationalAuditOffice: Administration of the Renewable Energy Target
DOWNLOAD 76-PAGE REPORT – YOU HAVE TO SCROLL DOWN RIGHT COLUMN HEADED “CONTENTS”
https://www.anao.gov.au/work/performance-audit/administration-renewable-energy-target
40
Thanks Pat; most interesting but you’ve got to wonder whether these regulations are enacted or simply window dressing; no prize for guessing which side of the proposition my cynicism takes me.
30
lots of callers re the audit now on 2GB. clearly, solar-panel-owners will be outraged by these revelations, IF given an opportunity to express themselves.
not listening too closely, but installers are also calling in. one says if one panel isn’t working, none are working. talk about pigeon poo problems; not earning back initial cost as quicky as promised. talk about fires, etc.
will ABC open their lines on this topic??? still can’t find any mention on ABC or SBS. why are taxpayers’ funding these orgs?
80
20 Dec: news.com.au: AAP: Audit shows many rooftop solar panels are unsafe
An audit of rooftop solar panels have found at least a fifth were unsafe, sparking warnings about potential deaths.
by Marnie Banger
State and territory energy ministers reportedly refused to discuss the issue at a Council of Australian Governments energy meeting in Adelaide on Wednesday. But NSW Energy Minister Don Harwin said the ministers noted the issue was “incredibly important” and that another COAG group focused on workplace safety is looking at the issue.
“We need to make sure there are quality providers and that there are good standards,” he told ABC Radio National on Thursday…
https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/audit-shows-many-rooftop-solar-panels-are-unsafe/news-story/772884174278a3448fbe7ad03429f2c6
haven’t found Harwin on RN as yet, but here is a very rude, interrupting Hamish Macdonald with Angus Taylor today.
11min44sec, final question, Macdonald: minister, you have written to blah blah…
note the summary is ALL ABOUT HARWIN:
AUDIO: 13min10sec: 20 Dec: ABC Breakfast: Angus Taylor rejects claims government is driven by toxic ideology on climate policy
Presented by Hamish Macdonald
State Energy Minister Don Harwin was left fuming after his federal counterpart Angus Taylor blocked his bid at yesterday’s COAG meeting to discuss a national roadmap to reaching zero carbon output by 2050.
Don Harwin says the Federal Government was on the right track when Malcolm Turnbull was still Prime Minister and energy policy included an obligation to reduce emissions.
Harwin accused the Morrison Government of being out of touch on climate policy and warned its refusal to adopt a zero emissions reduction plan will keep power prices high
https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/breakfast/government-intervention-in-electricity-market-unnecessary/10637378
30
Tactical blunder by Harwin in acknowledging power prices are high; he needs to get the downward pressure on prices script from Victoria’s Lily d’Ambrosio.
30
here is the Harwin piece mentioned by AAP.
summary is all about CAGW/Harwin.
no interruptions from Macdonald.
must listen to all, but final question (no surprise) is about the audit and begins at 9min42sec. Harwin is cut off before he can waffle on too long:
AUDIO: 11min13sec: 20 Dec: ABC Breakfast: Emissions obligation ‘most important first step’ in tackling climate change, Harwin says
The latest State of the Climate Report has found rising temperatures have triggered an increase in the frequency and intensity of extreme weather events.
At the same time, a new round of the so called “climate wars” has erupted over energy policy, this time within the Liberal Party.
The Morrison Government yesterday blocked a bid by its counterparts in New South Wales to push for a zero emissions policy at an acrimonious COAG meeting of energy ministers in Adelaide.
State Energy Minister Don Harwin accused the Federal Government of being “silly” and “out of touch” and preventing power prices from falling.
Guest: Don Harwin, NSW Minister for Resources, Energy and Utilities
https://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/breakfast/emissions-obligation-is-most-important-first-step/10637292
20
Commercial radio to the rescue in the guise of
2GB Sydney, including a contribution by an insider.in the business.
20
compare Harwin at 5min42sec hiding behind Cabinet confidentiality when asked if the NSW cabinet signed off on his initial attack on the Govt with what is suggested here. of course, ABC’s Macdonald doesn’t ask if the Premier okayed it. (as the piece is behind paywall, don’t know what evidence is provided for the ***statement):
19 Dec: Tim Blair blog: WEDNESDAY CHATTERBOX
Via Jill. Closer to home, enviro madness is erupting all over the place. Embattled NSW Greens MP Jeremy Buckingham accuses his party of corruption, rottenness and extreme leftism:
Last night, the Australian Greens and their state counterparts agreed on an independent review into the NSW branch’s decision-making and complaints processes …
“It’s a bandaid on a weeping wound that is the rotten and corrupt NSW Greens party. This type of review happened only a few years ago and resulted in virtually no reform,” [Buckingham] told The Australian.
“The resolution does not deal with the immediate issues of the party refusing to conduct a democratic recount should I leave the Greens ticket, and capitulates to the extreme left who are running riot in the Greens.”…
Those stupid Greens. Yet the NSW Liberals aren’t much better:
***(excerpt) Premier Gladys Berejiklian gave the green light for her energy minister to accuse the Morrison government of being out of touch on climate policy …(LINK DAILY TELE BEHIND PAYWALL)
https://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/blogs/tim-blair/wednesday-chatterbox/news-story/584f5e8408edd37c49b51a56f57e0978
20
Listening to socialist radio talk back on the subject at hand but after a flood of listeners complaining of fires and electricity problems they cut the segment short and changed the subject , no more calls were taken about solar panels at all .
31
The Propaganda Ministry doesn’t like being caught short and quickly rectifies the problem in the hope that listeners will soon forget.
More galling is when the organisation leaves out stuff, just like China Daily. For example, the verbal altercation between the NSW energy minister and Angus Taylor didn’t get a run.
Perhaps they sense an ambush
31
With a tin roof I thought the main benefit of solar panels
would be to reduce the heating of the roof space under the tin,
reinforcing the effect of the pink bat insulation, so to speak, and save me money by
reducing the use of the air conditioner. Not much good if I simply run the risk
of early cremation by getting fried by another means!
40
The song fits about here, the dog identity is an extra
https://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2018/12/great-australian-philosopher-kevin-bloody-wilson-corresponds-with-local-council.html
Actually John Prine got there first (about 1987) with his “Common Sense ” track from the album of the same name.
“It don’t make no sense that common sense don’t make no sense no more”
Laydown misere for theme-song of the 21st century A couple of IMO’s there).
10
Willis has a question
“Where Did The Money Go?”
“Here’s what we, the US taxpayers, have spent on climate since 1993 … can anyone tell me what we bought that is worth ~ $180 BILLION dollars?”
https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/12/19/where-did-the-money-go/
30
US taxpayers, should demand their money back, does that come with a moneyback guarantee?
20
I recently spoke with a guy who used to install solar PV systems but has since jumped the fence to be a government inspector since, with the race to the bottom, margins for installations are now too thin for the level of work that he insists on (all panels and wiring installed by fully qualified electricians).
He told me that 90% of the systems he sees have one or more issues serious enough for him to advise the owner to request the installer come back to rectify issues before he can reinspect and certify the system.
Some systems are so badly installed that he has advised the owner (since that is all he is legally able to do) to disconnect the PV system until things are rectified as the fire risk is just too high to warrant the electricity savings that the system is providing.
http://www.cleanenergyregulator.gov.au/RET/Scheme-participants-and-industry/Agents-and-installers/Small-scale-Renewable-Energy-Scheme-inspections
Lest anyone accuse him of vested interests, there’s nothing in it for him as he’s not getting paid for any corrective work and the backlog for inspections means he isn’t driving business back to new installation work for himself any time soon.
20
unbelievable!
Channel 9 news on the audit. (mentions Taylor sent out the letter last week, but it has only become known yesterday! a brief mention of the problem, then on to Harwin’s attack on the Federal Govt for not doing enough on “climate change”:
TWEET: Nine News Melbourne
A national safety audit has raised concerns over rooftop solar panels on thousands of homes across Australia. #9News
19 Dec 2018
VIDEO 1min04sec
1 REPLY ONLY:
TS 6h ago: you didn’t mention what is supposedly wrong with roof solar panels? the story went on about disagreement between commonwealth and states?
https://twitter.com/9NewsMelb/status/1075477461851230208
20
should have noted news guy states its a potential problem for “thousands” of homes, which is a bit of an understatement.
20
can’t even vote “no”!
20 Dec: 9News: AAP: Australia abstains from UN migration pact
The Global Compact for Migration is the first international document dealing with the issue, though it’s not legally binding. It was endorsed overnight by a 152-5 vote.
The five countries that voted “no” on the compact were the United States, Hungary, the Czech Republic, Israel and Poland.
Austria, Switzerland, Italy and Bulgaria joined Australia in abstention…
The vote in favour of the resolution was lower than the 164 countries that approved the agreement by acclamation at a conference in Marrakech, Morocco, earlier this month.
Prime Minister Scott Morrison had refused to sign the agreement which Australia had helped draft…READ ON
https://www.9news.com.au/2018/12/20/07/36/australia-abstains-from-un-migration-pact?ocid=social-9newsM
10
can’t find anything else about this outage, which apparently happened on Monday this week, which would be 17 December. SMH tells u nothing about why it happened or how long it lasted:
20 Dec: SMH: Tax office contractors miss out on pay due to power outage
By Sally Whyte
Staff at the Australian Taxation Office’s Newcastle office arrived at work on Monday to be told a power outage at the site in the early hours of the morning meant the office would be closed for the day.
Lifts, air-conditioning and power supply to parts of the building were affected, and about 9.30am, the decision was made to close the site for safety reasons, with no shifts starting after that time.
Staff employed by the tax office itself were still paid for the day, while contractors rostered on for the site were either told they wouldn’t be paid, or if they had already arrived at work were paid only for the three-hour minimum shift required.
In an email seen by The Canberra Times, a tax office recruitment staffer managing staff from suppliers and those known as the contingent workforce said “ATO will honour/pay suppliers a minimum shift requirement of three hours for workers that entered the building this morning for their shift”…
The main public sector union said the issue highlights how tenuous the positions of those not employed as public servants are…
https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/tax-office-contractors-miss-out-on-pay-due-to-power-outage-20181219-p50n8r.html
20
Does anyone in government know about this?
‘The data demonstrates the emissions of both the U.S. and EU are and have been declining over the past 10 years but the levels of emissions of these developed nations are insignificant relative to the huge growth of emissions for the rest of the world’s developing nations. The politically contrived Paris Climate Agreement has no provisions that have any impact on controlling developing nation emissions increases.’
Larry Hamlin /wuwt
50
Well that would make a mockery of sending 1st world money to 3rd world coutries via the black hole ( the UN ) to “save the planet” then…..
30
Unless the UN somehow convinces China and India to stop building many hundreds more coal fired power stations no matter how much the West reduces their emissions it will be a total waste of time, money and effort. We might as well start child sacrifices to the gods of climate change for all the good it will do.
20
The worldwide abortion regime’s 800,000,000 preborn infant sacrifices in the last 50 years is what has been powering the surge in socialism, Gaia-ism and other toxic spiritual systems of idolatrous worship. Praying daily for the closing of the nearest abortion center is something we all should do.
30
20 Dec: Daily Mail: The death trap that could be lurking in your house: Item fitted in more than two million Australian homes could lead to electrocutions and fires
•Solar panels could be putting lives at risk and posed a ‘severe’ threat to installers
•An audit revealedone-quarter of installations were found to be a hidden danger
•Follows reports Australia was found to have the world’s cheapest solar panels
By Holly Hales
Dodgy, unsecured solar panels with faulty wiring could be putting lives at risk, according to a report that has revealed thousands of the devices pose a ‘severe’ threat to residents.
A national audit released this week disclosed almost one-quarter of installations inspected since 2011 were found to be dangerous and could lead to electrocutions and house fires.
The audit – which is included in the Renewable Energy Target – says between 21 and 26 per cent of solar panels had ‘faulty wiring and unsecured panels’, according to The Australian.
Currently more than two million Australian homes are fitted with solar panels, with owners often making the purchase due to surging power bills and the panels’ falling prices…
In September, it was also revealed Australia has the lowest-cost solar panels in the world, according to a study on renewable energy.
The report, by Deloitte’s Global Renewable Energy Trends, said wind and solar are now viewed as solutions to strengthening grid resilience and reliability, rather than being seen as an obstacle.
‘South Australia, along with China, has the lowest unsubsidised, levelised cost of energy for concentrating solar power,’ Deloitte’s Michael Rath said…
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6513491/The-death-trap-lurking-house.html
AUDIO: 8min46sec: 20 Dec: 6PR: Warning over faulty solar panel installations
Federal Energy Minister, Angus Taylor spoke with Jane Marwick on Mornings.
https://www.6pr.com.au/podcast/warning-over-faulty-solar-panel-installations/
10
Deloitte are delusional if they think solar and wind is ensuring reliability .
20
I wonder if the Deloitte expertise in this area is from the usual non STEM people that bubble to the top in renewables world?
20
The reason politicians could not care about the cost of solar panels or windmills is that they are not paying for them. You are. There is no point asking politicians why they did not do better because they bought nothing, installed nothing, contracted nothing. They forced you to pay for other people’s stuff and even force you to buy what useless, random stuff they generate when the wind blows and the sun shines, not when you need it.
Yes, the State of South Australia has bought a giant battery and their own independent diesel plant to keep the public servants in power when everyone else suffers. Victoriastan is offering to subsidize solar panels with the savings from closing industries like smelting and coal and gas power stations. Canberra has their own windmills, for which you have paid but the Canberra governement gets a direct income from that, $35Million at last glance for RET certificates owned by their own little department. That is double theft. Perhaps they can have holidays with the free money? Or pay all the public servants a dividend?
The gas people are cheering loudest with uncontrolled prices because you have to buy their stuff at any price they name because blackouts must be prevented at any cost. Your cost.
Meanwhile the Federal and State pollies are on ‘well earned’ holidays and no matter how many homes burn down, how much damage is done, thanks to the RET it is entirely their fault but no one knows that and it is not their responsibility. So tough. Not their problem.
60
So much truth in all that, but enabling that knowledge to move through the invisible PC membrane that surrounds the present voting population is just not possible.
Wisdom is a hard won state.
KK
30
OT but just found out that our glorious leaders sister got stuck in the flooding north of Wangaratta last week , also believe there were other people caught who were either in positions of power or related .
The internal backlash was apparently severe and also noted was the claim that the controversial wire rope barriers (being installed at Herr Andrews orders) exacerbated the floods after getting clogged with debris .
60
Nobody wanted to know when I objected to the wire barriers being installed between Molesworth and Yea. The previous year we had seen the result of someone going into a wire barrier at speed on the way up to Glasgow Airport on the way from the border. We had been crawling along for ages because of this accident. It was not a pretty sight. The car was sliced through horizontally from front to rear…I can’t imagine that the driver survived that.
21
There are now long stretches of them along the Fume Fwy.
21
I’m not convinced they contributed at north Wang but a few years back I saw video of the floods near Violet town and drove through afterwards and debris was built up all along the worst bits .
20
I worked for many years in an electrical affiliated area & was told by reps from the Master Electricians Australia that their organisation warned Kevin Rudd of the dangers of the Pink Batts & that there would be deaths.
For anyone interested there is another site for checking solar flares & magnetic storms, plus you can go back over the years to see what has happened, I have had this link for many years.
http://tesis.lebedev.ru/en/magnetic_storms.html
Re:- Shonky solar installation companies. One example I know of – young chap just finished his apprenticeship, then completed the solar installation course & had received his accreditation from the Clean Energy Council received an offer of employment, with a salary of approx $150,000.00, he asked for advice from a lecturer that was in charge & taught in that area, who thought that they must have made an error, the lad showed him the letter of offer. Nobody realised at the time, but figured afterward that this Chinese company who had just started up obviously needed his accreditation number so they could apply for all the grants.
My son is a maintenance electrician at a large semi-govt department who have had massive solar installed in large car parks & they have attempted to find a course for fault finding for solar, but have had no success, the only course available is the accreditation course, which they do not want or need.
20
Where are our red thumbers, dont they work at Christmas time?
41
They’re on their w.e.b. (well earned break)
50
Well I have told everyone on Joe’s site earlier about my wife and myselfs little transition
to green energy via solar panels and what a disaster that has finally turned out to be(a poorly
installed system that does NOT WORK anymore) a waste of effort.But we are forever reminded
by the scammers that green energy will lead us to cheaper electrical energy bills
-well ours are now at least 400 percent higher -then maybe I don’t understand what the phrase
“ transition to alternative energy “ means because unless you are paying for it you have no
idea of its real cost in terms of job losses in the real economy and inevitable recession in
Australia ‘s economy as I have talked about on this site for at least the last two years -judging
by recent the change in full term job employment rates compared increasing part time employment rates -this is not a good sign especially if there is no relief in energy costs .
Well like a famous prime minister once said “‘this is the recession we have to have”.
Cheers Mike Reed
50
My view is that a wholesale movement to renewables would be similar to conducting an EMP attack on the east coast.
30
Nice analogy
20
Hi All,
Is there an article that asks “Can a society powered by Solar and Wind create solar panels and windmills?”
I.e. can the industrial loop be closed, can solar and wind power, mine, smelt, forge iron, copper, other metals, etc, for the construction of new panels and windmills?
I figure the answer is no, but does anyone ask this?
60
Who Has Harwin’s Ear?
‘Harwin yesterday called the Morrison Government “out of touch on energy and climate policy” and urged it to aim for an incredible net zero carbon emissions by 2050.
“We need to … put science, economics and engineering ahead of ideology,” this alleged Liberal said.
‘It’s easy to dismiss Harwin as an alarmist and hypocrite.’
Andrew Bolt
30
I agree with Andrew Bolt.
40
BOM’s Karl Braganza walks us through the BoM/CSIRO State of the Climate report, 2018 on abc breakfast:
pt1: https://twitter.com/BreakfastNews/status/1075484910566035456
pt2: https://twitter.com/BreakfastNews/status/1075485993430437889
“The @BOM_au has accepted some climate change up to the mid-century is inevitable and is now turning its attention to adaption.
Things like coastal defences, and building resilience in infrastructure and energy systems.”
Whoa! Wait. What?
Where is the fact check?
abc fact check: The claim –
Liberal MP and climate sceptic Craig Kelly made headlines in November when he was caught on tape mocking “lefties” for exaggerating the effects of climate change.
“The science tells us that Tuvalu, which I often hear about, is actually growing not sinking,” he told colleagues.
The verdict –
Mr Kelly’s claim checks out.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-19/fact-check-is-the-island-nation-tuvalu-growing/10627318
via:
http://www.warwickhughes.com/blog/?p=6007
> Don’t hold your breathe waiting for any presenter on their abc to ask Braganza how that works out for his scaremongering state of the climate report.
31
Has BoM passed an audit of its findings yet or indeed passed any audit at all? Until it does any pronouncement is nothing but hot air.
21
Ivan
But peer review is corrupt, don’t you know.
10
I wonder how many deaths per year are attributed to fossil fuels, from mining to burning ?.
Oh well , what use are facts anymore ?.
57
“Oh well , what use are facts anymore ?.”
Tell us when you have some.
84
‘I wonder how many deaths per year are attributed to fossil fuels…’
–
To what degree is obesity attributable to food?
62
Thanks for the question Michael262.
As usual the facts present even more Inconvenient Truths for alarmists (and never quite match the Unions’ mantra)
Workers Compensation rates for Miners are lower than for Horticulturists, farmers, local government, construction workers.
Worker Fatalities rates for Mining are:
11% of those killed in Transport, Postal and Warehousing
12% of those killed in Agriculture, Forestry and Fishing
15% of those killed in Construction
Lower than those killed in Admin & Support Services;Electricity, water, gas & waste services; Manufacturing.
Only marginally above Arts & Recreation; Public Admin & Safety; Health Care & social assistance; Service industry generally; Retail.
It’s been the same for the past >40 years.
(The time that I’ve been in the Mining Industry)
The stats above/information from Safe Work Australia website.
70
Andrew,
Thanks for highlighting the zero death rate for solar.
56
Trouble is, you don’t recognise that as power prices rise, so will the deaths
of those old and poor that can no longer heat and cook and simply die off in
their cottages. You also don’t take into account how many people actually lived
well in the days of fossil fuels, thrived in fact and got jobs when power was so
cheap. That cheapness was the integral part of nations thriving on all counts.
You imply a condemnation of fossil fuels when you have no proof, indeed have
no interest in finding proof, that fossil fuels actually are the cause of all of the
rising CO2 that you claim, but have never yet proved, is the reason for the climate
changing. Indeed, your summation is a total denial that the climate has never ever
changed in history without CO2 being essential to that change. Worse, you totally ignore
the FACT that historically, changes in CO2 concentration has always followed warming by
a matter of centuries. Worse still, you fail to appreciate the junior science FACT, that warm
oceans release CO2 which decreases in solubility as the temperature rises, so if the CSIRO is
right in saying the oceans have warmed 1C in a hundred years, it should be expected by sane
people that CO2 will increase dramatically, not as a cause but as a result of such warming.
If the change in ocean temperatures has actually increased 1C in that time, that would imply
a tremendous increase in global warming in a century and at a time fossil fuel burning was
just getting going. I don’t believe anyone is suggesting such a global warming has occured.
51
DOH !,
The proof has been supplied by the scientists, which you ignore or don’t have the skills to understand.
As with the rest of the intelligencia here, please write a paper with your ‘proof’ and submit it before we all die for lack of paragraph breaks.
311
“The proof has been supplied by the scientists”
WRONG.
There is NO empirical evidence that enhanced atmospheric CO2 causes warming.
It is an unproven, anti-science conjecture at best, that goes against basic atmospheric physics.
You are welcome to try to produce a paper giving empirical evidence of warming by atmospheric CO2.
Waiting.
As for ocean warming, NOAA shows a warming in the whole ocean 0-2000m of 0.08ºC in 60 or so years.
SCARY, hey !! and zero evidence that humans have had anything to do with it.
52
You realise that it is technically impossible to ” prove” a scientific theory ?
BUT.. It is very simple to disprove a theory…….all that is necessary is to show that the theory doesnt work in “some” situations.
AGW , CO2 greenhouse effect is just such a scientific theory.
If you look at the IPCC model predictions for climate temperature, you will see that they are so far off the actual observed records, that the theory behind the models is totally wrong.
20
Miichael262…….ponder this…
http://joannenova.com.au/2013/06/even-with-the-best-models-warmest-decades-most-co2-models-are-proven-failures/
21
Chad
That’s great, It’s all been disproved and you’re going to get a golden thumb.
Just don’t tell the scientists on planet Earth
15
zero evidence mick262
EMPTY !!!
Produce evidence, not your gullible, non-science, brain-hosed mantra nonsense.
31
most “anti-coal” statistics are based on assumptions of deaths caused by “pollution” ie dust and particulate matter
But when studies are actually done properly.. those assumptions disappear.
http://www.phrp.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/NBv24n2.pdf pages 1-64
42
Couple of deaths in Hunter coal mines in the last few years
One guy had a heart attack while driving, One guy drove his car in front of a 400 ton truck.. oops !
These are not “coal mining” related, just normal accidents
There was a wall collapse somewhere that killed 2 people.
42
Quite a few, eveything has a cost. Don’t delude yourself that everthing is rosey in renewballs land either. Just most of the toxic stuff happens somewhere else before becoming shiney products.
20
Hi Michael 262 well how many Grand Pas and Grand mas are shivering to death (next winter)or are going
to die this summer as a result of energy poverty since they can’t use Airconditioning.Well
I suppose they have to be the sacricial lambs on your alter of the green scam of Climate Change.
Because yep that’s ok there has to be some collateral damage in the name of “saving the planet”
for whom -well I don’t know -but then I’m sure you haven’t any clue either.
Cheers Mike Reed
41
Finding 240 volts on the roof would be the least of your problems, and only likely with roof mounted micro-inverters. A more traditional installation with a single large inverter inside the building could have as much as 600 volts DC “Up Top”. And that sort of power is VERY difficult to safely isolate…
30
behind paywall. heard a bit of this being read out on Sky News tonite. it would be good if someone could excerpt some of it:
Climate-push Liberal minister Don Harwin’s coal links
by Judith Sloan
The Australian – 19 Dec 2018
NSW Energy Minister Don Harwin, who yesterday attacked Scott Morrison’s energy policy and is lobbying for more renewables and emissions cuts, invited the state’s biggest coalminers to a $990-a-head Lib fundraising dinner last month…
—
meanwhile, online searches for ABC solar audit still come up with no results, because the two RN Breakfast interviews – with Taylor and Harwin – where the FINAL questions touch on the solar audit, have no mention of the audit in the headlines or in the summaries. consequently, you don’t get them showing up in google results.
also, nothing can be found for solar audit in searches on the ABC website.
this needs to be explained by ABC.
after all, if 2 million houses have solar panels, that represents at least 6 million Australians presumably, so this story is the biggest story of the year…and ABC doesn’t consider it deserves a single article of its own!!!
20
20 Jul 2017: The West: Faulty solar panel fire alert
by Daniel Mercer
Faulty or poorly installed solar panel systems have sparked fires at more than 20 homes in WA in the past two years.
Figures from the electricity safety watchdog show that in the two years to June 30, there were 24 “incidents” caused by defective solar panel installations.
While the solar panels themselves were not in question, it is understood the fires were started by substandard or incorrectly installed isolators or inverters which form part of the systems.
The figures come as the nation’s standards body and the renewable energy industry are at odds over the adoption of battery storage devices.
They also come after revelations that Queensland firefighters had attended more than 60 house fires started by solar panel systems since the start of 2015.
Standards Australia has released draft guidelines for the installation of lithium-ion batteries, but installers have claimed they would all but ban the devices by making the safeguards too onerous…
However, batteries made using lithium-ion have previously been linked to major fire risks in other products such as hover boards and mobile phones…
“Western Power is participating with industry, government and Standards Australia to help develop a new standard called ‘Electrical installations — Safety of battery systems for use with power conversion equipment’.
“This new standard will set out the installation and safety requirements for residential and commercial battery systems connected to or integrated with an intelligent energy system.”
https://thewest.com.au/news/wa/faulty-solar-panel-fire-alert-ng-b88540502z
20
reminders:
‘Years to understand’ fire risk of solar power systems
The Australian – Jul 12, 2017
Victoria’s Metropolitan Fire Brigade has responded to more than 40 fires caused by home solar power systems in the past five years… SunSeeker Electrical owner Abdullah Sultan says he knows of hundreds of fires caused by poor installation of solar panels…
2014: JoNova: Solar panels: warm your house or burn it down? Bankrupt your company?
Solar panels in Queensland and NSW in Australia have been providing some householders with energy in a more concentrated form than they bargained for. At least 70 houses with rooftop solar panel arrays have had solar driven burnouts. The fire risk means that nearly 30,000 faulty solar power isolators have been recalled. The company that imported them went bust on Friday. (Ain’t that the way?)…
[The Australian]
A QUEENSLAND company that sold allegedly faulty circuit breakers that caused at least 70 burnouts in rooftop solar panel arrays has gone bust, leaving tens of thousands of homeowners at risk of electrical fires.
Advancetech, based on the Sunshine Coast, went into receivership on Friday, only four days after Queensland Attorney-General Jarrod Bleijie ordered the immediate recall of 27,600 Avanco-branded DC solar power isolators imported and sold by the company…
http://joannenova.com.au/2014/05/solar-panels-warm-your-house-or-burn-it-down-bankrupt-your-company/
20
18 Nov: Canberra Times: ‘It’s scary’: Denman Prospect residents fear homes could burn
by Blake Foden
Denman Prospect residents fear their homes could burn after a component of the solar power system installed across Australia’s first mandated solar suburb caused a fire that significantly damaged a display home.
An unoccupied Rawson Homes display home caught fire on Kondelea Way about 10.30am on October 13, with the solar isolator switch in the garage identified as the cause.
ACT Fire and Rescue’s fire investigation report said the blaze caused an estimated $600,000 worth of damage to the display home, which Rawson Homes general manager Craig Moore said would be demolished and rebuilt.
The fire has sparked concern among residents who are worried there could be a repeat of the blaze in their own homes.
***But the ACT government has described the blaze as an isolated incident, and says it will not be investigating further…
ActewAGL partnered with Denman Prospect developer Capital Estate Developments to supply solar to the first 350 houses in the new suburb, where each household must have a three-kilowatt solar power system as a minimum.
Anita Chatfield and Lizzie Christiansen, who live on the same street as the display home, called for an independent review of systems across the suburb to ensure they were safe.
Both women said components of the solar power systems in their garages have heated up to a point where they were worried a fire could break out.
“It’s like touching a kettle after it’s finished boiling,” Ms Chatfield said.
“I leave the garage door open a bit to get some air in because I get quite concerned about [whether there could be a fire].
“It freaks me out a bit. It’s scary.”
Ms Christiansen said she had experienced “lots of problems” with the system in her garage, across the road from Ms Chatfield’s.
Her isolator and inverter have been replaced because of issues including the solar power system failing to work, but she said the replacement components in her garage still heated up to a worrying level.
Ms Christiansen said she was impressed with Capital Estate Developments’ commitment to solar power, but not with the system it had supplied for Denman Prospect homes.
“The bills are huge,” she said.
“It hasn’t saved me any money at all. It’s about the same, or worse.”
Ms Christiansen said the systems should be independently reviewed so residents knew what they were dealing with.
“We don’t know whether [the fire] was caused by the installation, the manufacturing or something else,” she said…
An ActewAGL spokeswoman said more than 2000 solar power systems purchased through the company were installed in homes across the ACT and surrounding parts of NSW.
About 170 systems had been installed so far in Denman Prospect, she said, but it was unclear how many of those contained the same isolator switch as the display home because a different switch had been used since October 2017…
“We are taking this matter seriously and will continue to engage with the ACT electrical regulator to ensure peace of mind for the Denman Prospect community.”
The spokeswoman said an ACT government electrical inspector looked at the system in question on June 25 last year and found no defects.
***An ACT government spokeswoman said the Denman Prospect fire was an isolated incident and would not be investigated further.
https://www.canberratimes.com.au/national/act/it-s-scary-denman-prospect-residents-fear-homes-could-burn-20181031-p50d5p.html
30
very interesting. read all:
19 Jun 2017: ShootersFishers&Farmers: Are “power-brokers” letting us run out of power?
As prices rise, John Preston says that electricity policy is seemingly being made in a telephone booth by the two people running the New South Wales Liberal Party: Energy Minister Don Harwin, and the lobbyist for AGL Energy Michael Photios…
“Minister Harwin must come clean on a clear conflict of interest with a key factional ally.”…READ ALL
https://www.shootersfishersandfarmers.org.au/are_power_brokers_letting_us_run_out_of_power
10
Shooters and fishers backed Clive Palmer when he was last elected so I’m thinking take with a grain of salt anything they say .
Palmer met with man bear pig , wanted emissions reduction , and the kicker for me was he was anti gun .
So are shooters and fishers inept and stupid or have some other agenda ?
10
Off-topic but I didn’t see any other way to pass info to Jo:
Here’s more Gaia worship, at the expense of Christmas, and in Australia too.
https://www.newswars.com/church-choirs-singing-climate-change-christmas-carols/
30
Jo covered this this a few days ago Dean .
20
Thanks! I was sick then and missed it. Thanks for bringing me up to speed!
10
Prices to fall by 2% in the eastern states, thanks to renewables.
https://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-12-21/power-prices-to-drop-with-more-renewables-report-finds/10638102
20
When the government, anyone’s government starts pushing something, especially with subsidies to the end consumer, the fly by night artists get into high gear real fast. They know better than anyone that subsidies cannot possibly last and they hope to fold up their tent and disappear into the night as soon as that happens.
Of course there’s no incentive to provide durable goods or sound installation. It’s strictly sell as much as you can, then be ready to disappear when the demand created by government disappears.
So the installations turn out to be shoddy and sometimes dangerous? So what? No one will care until it’s too late. Government has no incentive to police the sellers, quite to opposite in fact. And the sellers certainly don’t want to police themselves.
40
I watched this happen when Ronald Reagan foolishly tried to push solar water heating. Up and down every block around there were suddenly a variety of systems on the roof. I’ll assert confidently that not s one of them ever paid for itself in savings on the gas bill.
There have been none of them left for better than 25 years.
And so will go the solar panels. As several have pointed out, when there are too many solar panels on the grid the real generators will have to start shutting down. Then what?
40
Moral of the story: Never buy from someone with 2 left arms.
20
Thats odd re solar hot water. I am happy to be shouted down but it appears to work pretty well in my own experience and just from observation here in OZ. Seems to be one of the more usefull applications of solar.
30
Yarpos,
I would need the details of your system and the alternative cost using conventional energy so I won’t even try to shoot you down. But I live at a about 34 north and theoretically there’s plenty of sun with panels tilted upward 34 degrees facing south. But when pumps freeze and pipes rust shut there’s no chance for it to keep working. Poor choice of materials to keep the cost down and panels that were not water tight allowing rain to get inside where condensation formed on the inside of the glass and oh yes, one other thing…nightly condensation would cause the next day’s dust to stick like glue and how transparent is all that dirt?
Soon you have an expensive piece of junk on your roof. A gas water heater lasts me approximate 10 years. But let’s say it’s just 8 for the sake of argument. It’s working for all that time. The solar system never made a difference from day one.
To me the only thing a roof is useful for is to keep out the rain.
40
Yes, I installed a second-hand one 15 years ago. Basic glass box with some copper pipes in it, a pump and a storage tank. Pre heats the water beautifully. Soo hot in summer I turn my gas system off completely. Can’t even imagine what my $1000 investment has saved me so far. Such basic technology I can’t even start to figure how the left get credit for its existence.
20
Does Australia get hotter sunshine than I do? My system never exceeded the temperate I could get with natural gas. And the messing around I had to do to keep it running for the several years I was willing to do that messing around kinda negates any small savings in less gas bought and paid for.
When you consider what I paid for it after the subsidy, I lost money and only came out on top because inflation allowed me to refinance and pay off the loan with cheaper dollars.
And I’m not quite sure I can call that, coning out on top.
10
With a system designed right — no dissimilar metals like galvanized and copper in it the result could have been much better.
00
Ooooh yes the sun in Australian can get so hot you get 3rd degree burns off railing . I actually have gas hot water but the solar pre heats it. Off course peak summer the water off solar has to be cooled down (mixed with cold). Damn I can’t imagine just running gas. It’s so expensive here. I have solar electricity on my shed roof. Read something about toxic runoff. In in the city so pretty much most is toxic to a degree. Only use it on the garden. The solar electricity is great. I installed it 10 years ago for next to nothing, before it was greenie cool. Use to run the whole house but kids have grown and so have their gadget use. Might have to slap on another system to go the extra yards. I’m guessing Roy you’re in some sub temp climate having to wear tennis rackets on your feet to get to the pub?!
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for the full GetUp article in The Australian, go to the following comment at Pickering Post (scroll down) and continue reading the text in the comments.
Ducktracy Fri 21 Dec 2018 07:34:22 am
The GetUp SetUp – Brad Norrington, The Australian
by Jim Ball | Dec 21, 2018
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Solar makes no sense, many people install solar because want to offset paying 40 cents a kWh, but only paying 40 cents kWh for the breaking of a perfect good electric generators
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