JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Weekend Unthreaded

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Rating: 9.7/10 (19 votes cast)
Weekend Unthreaded, 9.7 out of 10 based on 19 ratings

306 comments to Weekend Unthreaded

  • #
    RicDre

    Economic impact of energy consumption change caused by global warming

    https://judithcurry.com/2020/02/08/economic-impact-of-energy-consumption-change-caused-by-global-warming/

    H/T:
    Judith Curry
    Climate Etc.

    40

    • #
      RicDre

      Oops, I forgot to add this comment about the paper:

      “A new paper ‘Economic impact of energy consumption change caused by global warming’ finds global warming may be beneficial.”

      110

      • #
        Graeme#4

        I believe that the MWP was a time of great progress and population increase in Europe. Conversely, the colder periods were when most of the plagues and famines occurred.

        120

        • #
          theRealUniverse (in NZ)

          I never get it why they continually push warming = civilisation’s collapse.
          Of course we know why..

          60

    • #
      PeterS

      Actually global warming would be beneficial to food production whereas global cooling would be bad for many more reasons than what global warming, such as more diseases as well as poorer food production. I personally prefer global cooling as I hate hot humid summers but the reality is global cooling might be a disaster for the world whereas global warming would be somewhat beneficial. Global warming alarmists of course would disagree but what else would one expect? Their track record on being correct is abysmal.

      220

      • #

        Here is the NASA document confirming the huge extent of this greening

        https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard/2016/carbon-dioxide-fertilization-greening-earth

        Which beggars the question, without this greening caused by the known effects of co2 would we be able to feed the growing world population?

        Tonyb

        190

        • #
          bobl

          The answer is NO we can’t, or more exactly, we would have to work far harder to produce food in a cooling, lower CO2 environment, for each 2PPM CO2, food production increases about 1% ((1% for 5PPM if you believe CSIRO) population is increasing about 1% P/A so CO2 fertilization is sustaining the worlds increasing population. Reduce CO2 you risk famine. Extinction Rebellion and sour princess Greta the gruesome don’t care if poor people die from lack of food! Their personal crusades come first.

          141

        • #
          GlenM

          We have to give nitrogen some credit,but its portion hasn’t changed so, yes, go with the added CO2. From an accepted mean temperature around 14-15 degree celsius and increased plant growth what more could you want you lefty bourgois greens out there.

          90

        • #
          el gordo

          The artificial production of CO2 at the end of the Holocene appears to be divine intervention, or perhaps just a lucky coincidence. Either way, its going to save our necks.

          On the ground people are confused by weather extremes, too hot then too cold in south east Australia, this is a global cooling signal. No need to put on sack cloth to atone for our human frailties, the new normal has begun and there is not a damn thing we can do about it.

          101

          • #

            So if co2 was somehow stabilised at todays level then the population would also need to be stabilised .at today’s levels.

            As population is expected to continue to rise for at least fifty years how will they be fed if co2 was stabilised?

            60

            • #
              el gordo

              We shouldn’t go out of our way to stabilise CO2, its a harmless trace gas, beneficial to all life on this planet. Historians will laugh at us, so enlightened yet so ignorant.

              Lets get to the chase, the subtropical ridge has collapsed and a blocking high has slipped down close to Antarctica. Do you think its an anomaly?

              http://www.bom.gov.au/fwo/IDY65100.pdf

              71

              • #
                Furiously curious

                I don’t understand. The sub tropical ridge has collapsed and a high has slipped down to Antarctica. But wasnt the collapse of the sub tropical high the cause of the continuous stream of highs, that streamed across the middle of the continent, for the last 2 years? I was thinking the change to a normal summer pattern, with the tropical lows pushing the highs south would be saying the sub tropical ridge must be back?

                20

              • #
                GlenM

                The STR has collapsed. I also noted the inclination is towards the SE, not NE -the latter pushed hotter air over the continent as the winds outward flowing collected hot air from the cloudless interior. Now the cloud is back and temperatures are cooler. Amazing. You would reckon that someone from our BoM would say to the chookless heads out there that all of this is ..well..normal.

                60

              • #
                el gordo

                Looking at the weekly forecast and the blocking pattern seems to intensify low pressure to troughs snake down. Its a complex system FC and the klimatariat at BoM have no answer to what is happening, but we are certain its not in the AGW script.

                https://www.weatherzone.com.au/synoptic

                61

              • #
                Peter C

                Do you think its an anomaly?

                No. High pressure systems typically pass to the south of Victoria during Summer, which is where we are now.

                That brings SE winds to Victoria, which is what we have just had. So everything is Normal!

                30

              • #
              • #
                Mark

                El Gordo

                http://www.bom.gov.au/climate/updates/articles/a025.shtml

                That was an article released in 2017.

                I remember here in Melbourne we had 3 days straight of 28C and humid with thunderstorms. It started on 1st of September and that was back in 1978. The weather map at the time showed the whole continent covered in a heat low and the highs well south of the continent.

                This does happen quite a lot so you shouldn’t be too worried about the highs being too far south it’s just another weather pattern but also keep in mind that they remained too far north for much of this summer so their southern movement now should be very welcome.

                30

              • #
                el gordo

                ‘ … they remained too far north for much of this summer …’

                It was the primary cause of this horrendous bushfire season and now that its too far south its chilly in the south east. First too hot and then too cold for weeks on end, its natural climate change and very welcome.

                A blocking high pressure pattern began in July 2017 with the collapse of the STR, around the time this came out in the SMH.

                ‘Asked why the outlook was drier than average for the coming months, Dr Paul Gregory, senior climatologist at the Bureau of Meteorology, said: “At the moment it’s mainly due to what’s called the subtropical ridge, which is the high pressure region over mainland Australia – and it’s much higher than normal, in terms of strength.”

                Because this subtropical ridge was stronger and further south than normal, it was preventing cold fronts and low pressure systems from the south from moving up and bringing rain to southern mainland Australia, he said.’

                00

            • #
              yarpos

              there are probably other variables we could work on

              10

        • #
          Graeme#4

          One book I read said that if the global temp drops by more than one degree, the impact on the grain-growing areas of northern North America would be major.

          50

          • #
            el gordo

            That is true and we only need to see what happened in Europe during the LIA with a drop of one degree, this sums it up.

            ‘Lamb (1966) points out that the growing season changed by 15 to 20 percent between the warmest and coldest times of the millenium. That is enough to affect almost any type of food production, especially crops highly adapted to use the full-season warm climatic periods.

            ‘During the coldest times of the LIA, England’s growing season was shortened by one to two months compared to present day values. The availability of varieties of seed today that can withstand extreme cold or warmth, wetness or dryness, was not available in the past. Therefore, climate changes had a much greater impact on agricultural output in the past.’

            50

        • #
          Sapel Mirrup

          Good point and info shared. But I think you mean “begs the question” – although even that phrase is used incorrectly by most people these days. “elicits” or “evokes” perhaps…

          10

          • #
            Roger Knights

            ““begs the question” – although even that phrase is used incorrectly by most people these days. “elicits” or “evokes” perhaps…”

            The common and correct term used to be, “RAISES the question …”

            00

    • #
      Furiously curious

      There was one huge benefit from the little ice age; in Europe the black plague, enhanced by cold induced famine, wiped out so much of the population, that our feudal overlords had to start paying wages to get workers to tend their lands, leading to innovations in agriculture, and a bit of a transfer of wealth. Maybe it’s taken this long to return to feudal times, with our present abundance of cheap labour. Sam Viknam has a couple of great you tubes on the topic. The one on capitalism and communism is a beauty.

      30

      • #
        PeterS

        Yes he is spot on saying psychology is not a science and never will be, much for the same reason the “science” as used by the global warming alarmists is not a real science.

        20

    • #
      David Maddison

      The interaction between increased crop production due to the natural increase of CO2 vs the future decrease in crop production due to the likely cooling period the world is entering will be interesting.

      Australia and similar woke nations that are destroying their energy supplies will struggle to survive. The US under Trump and his successors will prosper and be a great breadbasket for the world due to plentiful cheap energy.

      China is busy buying land in other countries to relocate their food production in the coming cooling as during periods of global cooling China fares very poorly.

      20

  • #
    RicDre

    Cambridge Professor: “The only way to hit net zero [carbon] by 2050 is to stop flying”

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/02/08/cambridge-professor-the-only-way-to-hit-net-zero-by-2050-is-to-stop-flying/

    60

  • #

    “Providing 100% Energy from Renewable Sources is Impossible”
    By David Wojick

    See: https://www.heartland.org/_template-assets/documents/newsletter-issues/February%202020%20Environment%20and%20Climate%20News.pdf
    Page 21

    Synopsis: The astronomical cost of batteries makes anything even close to 100% renewables economically impossible. At today’s prices, the batteries required to properly back up a wind farm would cost about 250 times as much as the farm itself. So even if the price dropped enormously the cost would still be prohibitive.

    The reason is extreme intermittency, which never gets mentioned in the grand schemes for renewable power. It is common for a wind farm to generate little to no power for an entire week. To supply that missing power from backup batteries is unbelievably expensive, if it can be done at all.

    290

    • #
      PeterS

      Yes renewables is far more expensive for power generation in the real world as distinct from the fictitious world of global warming alarmists. However, since when were governments really concerned about the cost? The ridiculous submarine project, the NBN and Snowy 2.0 are some examples. So using cost as a justification against renewables does not register with both major parties.

      220

      • #

        It will register if they ever try to do it. At present the battery backup claims are a hoax, running around a trivial 100 MWh.

        120

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        Were are being NBNed next week….my 3mb/s adsl2 link gas been fine for most things, now i gain a 10mb/s link but it costs an extra 20/month but my phone dies if power goes off. Not really a step forward.

        In India the average fibre to the house ( not the curb) speed is 100mb/s.

        40

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          Original Steve:
          A wireless phone is a necessity, although these too can stop working if there are electricity cuts.

          Have they installed a new cable to supply your area? I know someone who switched to NBN and complained (and complained) that his line speed was no better. Eventually someone at Telstra told him that the cable hadn’t got as far as his street and he was still on the old system, but he was assured that once the new cable was installed (the last 300 metres) that the speed would improve. In the meantime he still has to pay the new rates.

          40

          • #
            Hasbeen

            I went onto the NBN in early December. The fiber ends a kilometer away, but it is still NBN.

            It worked for 14 days with no difference I could detect. It then stopped working for 16 days. It is now back, still with no detectable improvement. I still can’t watch a HD U tube video, without stops for it to catch up.

            30

        • #
          PeterS

          I’m due (forced) to be on the NBN in about a year. I’m not looking forward to it. I’ve been delaying the changeover. At least I’m on cable so in the end it will use that as the last “mile”. They were having problems with that sort of hybrid but I think they have ironed them out recently. I believe the Ombudsman has been scathing on the NBN availability, and reliability. Once the price comes down for 5G I will be looking at dropping the NBN if I experience too many problems. 6G is on the horizon and 7G is on the drawing boards.

          10

          • #
            Chad

            Re NBN.
            …….. no one id “forced” to go on the NBN.
            You may have your land line and ADSL services cut off, but that does not mean NBN is your only option.
            If you have effective Mobile coverage, you can use “Mobile Internet” ..IE internet access via the Mobile network via a SIM enabled Router and get 20 -40 Mb/sec on current 4G service. Service is about $55-$60/month for 200Gb
            If you are really lucky you may soon get it via 5G with speeds higjer than even NBN.
            You can test what speeds to expect by runnng one of the “Internet Speed Test” apps , on your current mobile phone
            I have been using this service (via Optus) for over a year on multiple wireless devices inclusing movie streeming on a smart TV with no problems, and i am in a relatively low mobile signal strength area on the south coast.

            33

            • #
              PeterS

              I like to keep my Foxtel for a while longer. There are a couple or so channels that are simply not available anywhere else. I’ve tried Netflix but it’s mostly rubbish just like Foxtel in general. Although satellite is one option I’m not going down that path. That’s what I mean by being “forced” to the NBN.

              20

              • #
                Chad

                I like to keep my Foxtel for a while longer. There are a couple or so channels that are simply not available anywhere else. I’ve tried Netflix but it’s mostly rubbish just like Foxtel in general. Although satellite is one option I’m not going down that path. That’s what I mean by being “forced” to the NBN.

                Well Peter, Foxtel are also “forcing” customers to satelite connection when NBN is connected via the fibre cable used by Fox
                Ultimately They intend to move all subscribers to satelite.
                If you change your fax package or have to upgrade your Fox reciever, you will be moved to satelite.anyway…if not before !

                01

            • #
              OriginalSteve

              I resent the fact i have perfectly good albeit slower than most adsl connection that i have to drop. I also resent the fact now if the power goes off, that to have no phone service unless i shell out gor a motorcycle battery at my expense to keep my crappy nbn phone connection alive. I live in a city but thankfully gave access to uhf, hf and sat phone, but a lot of people dont have anything else. Yes i can have wireless internet but why should i?

              One thing the south coast fires showed was how flimsy our telecoms infrastructure truly us. Had it not been for American iridium sat phones we’d have been cactus.

              The NBN just represents another debacle thats placed a lot of elderly at risk with dodgy home phones now, and all its done is effectively re-nationalized telecoms and given the spooks a single land infrastructure area to monitor for thier convenience, not ours.

              31

            • #
              yarpos

              Friend of our went that way also using a 4g enaled router when he moved into his new house , he is quite happy. He chucks the whole lot in his caravan when he goes on holidays.

              We hot spot one of our phones when travelling and it seems to give a good usable connection.

              20

        • #
          yarpos

          Bit of a false equivalence with India. 100M connections may occur in small pockets just like it does here but also a lot of the countries citizens dont have electricity, running water or sewerage let alone fast internet (or a residence to connect it to)

          20

        • #
          PeterPetrum

          I went NBN with Vodafone. As they have no line service I lost my handset, and rely entirely on my mobile now – no great loss. But Vodafone have a simcard in their modem and if the NBN goes down (it does, from time to time) I still have the internet with speeds good enough for email (I only get 3G indoors). The guys and girls from Vodafone (in India!) were terrific at getting me set up and dealing with a burnout when we got struck by lightening.

          20

        • #
          James

          How much does that cost per month?

          00

      • #
        Chad

        Peter,
        Remember, power generation in most states has been privatised, so the generation companies will install those technologies that make them the MOST PROFIT.
        Currently, that means Wind and solar, due to the low capital cost and high wholesale prices together with subsidies and LGCs etc.
        They are not concernerd with the final cost to the consumer once back up base load, peak load and generation are accounted for.

        30

    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      Is super capacitor technology advancing?

      20

      • #

        All technology is advancing. Just ask the people promoting it.

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      • #
        Graeme#4

        While supercaps can be used to reliably backup electronic equipment during short brownouts, I doubt very much that supercap technology will expand to the point where they could replace batteries for large storage systems.

        30

    • #
      Dave in the States

      I’m pretty sure it is impossible for unreliables to provide even a much smaller fraction than anywhere near 100%. Not even close to 50%. The only way they could get a large fraction of all energy consumed by modern society to be from unreliables is if the whole was shrunk down, so that only the wealthy elites will be able to afford to use energy and every one else in fuel poverty.

      10

    • #
      Graeme#4

      Many renewables are backed up by gas these days, SA being a prime example, to the extent that they can hide their lack of baseload somewhat. It’s only obvious in their domestic energy pricing.

      30

      • #
        yarpos

        SA is poster child for wind energy, and to a lesser extent behind the meter solar.

        The achieved 39% wind power over the last 12 months, but in a small market with a coal fired 600MW interconnector and half a billion $ worth of recently installed gas generators.

        20

      • #
        Chad

        SA is in effect using Gas as a base load generator.
        It is the only source they have that operates continuously, although at very variable levels.

        20

  • #
    PeterS

    I don’t see as yet MSM showing an exaggerated map of Australia being flooded with rains, just like they did for the fires. Doesn’t fit with catastrophic global warming agenda I suppose.

    220

    • #
      bobl

      Dorothea MacKellar the Sage…

      I love a sunburnt country,
      A land of sweeping plains,
      Of ragged mountain ranges,
      Of droughts and flooding rains.
      I love her far horizons,
      I love her jewel-sea,
      Her beauty and her terror
      The wide brown land for me!

      Drought and flooding rains… Beauty and Terror… Wide and Brown… sounds like an Aussie decade all around.

      150

      • #
        RickWill

        With no more than I learnt from Dorothea, I was able to accurately predict floods would follow the drought induced fires when the fires were raging.

        Maybe the BoM BoH need to pin a copy of My Country on every noticeboard. Nothing occurring in the climate in 2020 is different to anything that has occurred in the past 1000 years.

        80

        • #
          Ted O'Brien.

          The fires do indeed lead to floods. This is visible as it happens.

          With the ground bare and maybe blackened, the surface air temperature is raised. This leads to stronger updrafts which lead to bigger storms.

          Then with the ground bare there is increased runoff and soil erosion.

          31

        • #
          Bill In Oz

          I like BOH as a joke
          But I’m going to stick to Bureau of Misinformation
          BOM !
          Why ? Not many of the younger generation know that poem
          About Hanrahan & “We’ll All Be Roooned ”
          It’s not taught in school any more
          Old fashioned !
          Bugger !

          20

  • #
    Another Ian

    “Understanding The Difference Between Global Warming And Climate Change”

    https://realclimatescience.com/2020/02/understanding-the-difference-between-global-warming-and-climate-change/

    50

  • #
    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Does Tesla constitute a stock bubble?

      It appears to only survive via handouts which in effect makes govt the largest shareholder…

      00

      • #
        yarpos

        Just youthful enthusiasm and blind faith from retail investors I think. Many of the institutional investors have been bailing or partially bailing around 900.

        People are buying futures and promises, as long as the future is as bright as Elon paints it all will be good. It will be interesting to see how they react to the next QTRs results. Lots of sizzle at the moment with the solar roof (up to version 3 now) E Semis are going make billions (apparently) as are Cybertrucks (the ones with the bullet proof windows)so a valuation of 20x identifiable assets seems to be appropriate. I hope it keeps working out for them)

        10

    • #
      Lewis P Buckingham

      With interest rates now so low or even negative,what is to stop companies, through proxies, from buying their own shares?
      If this is happening with Tesla then, while interest rates remain low, the bubble will continue to expand.

      00

  • #
    Another Ian

    “IT’S OFFICIAL – TRUMP LIED”

    https://richardsonpost.com/howellwoltz/15612/trump-lied/

    (/s aplenty)

    90

    • #
      TdeF

      And there is all the stuff not said. You can guarantee that the worst possible things about Trump have been said. But for a man who ran Miss America for 20 years, where are the accusations? And three wives? Where is the bad Trump? And all those profits. Where is the criminal?

      On the other hand, the openly Crooked Clintons and Crooked Bidens are protected by the press and Washington. Now Trump has fired Vindman who passed information on his phone call to the CIA ‘whistleblower’. It’s a wonder they are not both tried for treason, but according to Pelosi, firing Vindman was ‘shameful’.

      If you ignore what the press say endlessly about Trump, he is the most successful President since Eisenhower. Economically easily. And don’t Hollywood and Washington and the Democrats hate him. If he farted in an elevator that would be a Climate Crime causing Global Warming. And Nancy Pelosi would demand his resignation or removal by impeachment.

      As for Trump’s refusal to appoint Mitt Romney as Secretary of State that is looking like a demand he found easy to refuse and no doubt Romney has carried out his threat as the Malcolm Turnbull of the Republican Party.

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      • #
        Graeme Bird

        Its interesting that the Democratic leadership are not interested in digging up any real crimes. They prefer to deal in fantasies. I think they could nail Trump on a few real things but they don’t want to. The Democratic elite get so above themselves at times. Or all the time. If a President of the United States cannot have a friendly chat with a foreign counterpart, not excluding the topic of American exploitation of his country, its hard to know who is allowed to talk about what. The Bidens aren’t the beginning and end to the looting of the Ukraine. What the Democratic elite did, was throw a smokescreen over international wrong-doing in that country.

        32

    • #
      PeterS

      Oh dear! A politician has been caught out telling a lie. Wonders will never cease. Well I suppose they should impeach each and every President elected from now on the day they are sworn into office. The truth be known the Democrats have turned viral and want to destroy the US Constitution. In effect they are hell bent on reviving the American Civil War but with different states ending up fighting. All this won’t end well for the West.

      81

      • #
        TdeF

        At best Trump’s ‘lies’ were generalizations or exaggeration or even just his view of the same events. The Democrats say the economy is a disaster. He disagrees. That is called lying.

        101

        • #
          PeterS

          I know some Trump haters believe he should have been impeached and removed from office simply because he lied. That’s proof the logic of those people are totally flawed simply because they hate him so much.

          20

    • #
      Curious George

      A reminder from 2016 elections: Democrats took Trump literally but not seriously. Republicans took him seriously but not literally.

      80

      • #
        PeterS

        At the next election we will see if the Democrat candidate will be taken both seriously and literally or not. My guess is a lot of Democrat supporters will not bother to vote paving the way for an easy win fro Trump. Just a guess so easily could be wrong.

        21

  • #
    Mal

    3 weeks ago, the BOM was forecasting no significant rain in NSW until April or probably May
    If their models can’t predict the significant rain we are now having (175mm in last 3 days in my rain gauge in Wollongong and more in the next 24 hours) 3 weeks out, then how on earth can they have any credibility in fcasting climate change 100 years out!!

    220

    • #
      Dennis

      Don’t forget that any records earlier than 1910 cannot be taken seriously the BoM claim, so 122 years of colonisation should be ignored?

      120

    • #
      Graeme#4

      Not only did the BOM forecast no rain until April, they told that to a meeting of state and federal ministers in early December. The commenters in The Oz have been giving the BOM heaps over this statement over the last few days.

      120

    • #
      yarpos

      Townsville got one of those forecasts before their last floods as well, if I recall correctly.

      10

  • #
    Robber

    Breaking down the last decade of climate change in 7 charts.
    Now if only this could be studied as an assignment in our schools. 2010′s: Humanity’s Best Decade Yet.
    - The earth is greening
    - Lower losses due to weather as % of GDP
    - Unadjusted temperatures show no increase in the last decade
    - When people worldwide are polled about climate change, such as the United Nations does, it comes in dead last as a concern
    - Renewables are still a tiny % of energy supplies. Fossil fuels continue to Rule!!

    150

    • #
      TdeF

      It is why the inventors of man made Climate Change have given up pretending that there are any facts in their story. Michael Mann just made it up. So did James Hansen and Al gore. And now they have an army of believers and another army of self interested pseudo scientists.

      I contacted Australia’s ANSTO on Friday. They believe it and stated that the 50% increase in CO2 is all man made, without any doubt at all. The fact that it was not true in 1958 according to C14 does not matter, 2.1% instead of 14%. It is true today because they say so. That is the voice of authority from Australia’s premier laboratory on C14.

      Money, jobs, careers, mortgages, travel and fame for thousands all hinge on man made Global Warming. Now if they can only make it to comfortable indexed pensions before it all blows up?

      So where are the CSIRO, BOM and all the others? What did the 350 full time CSIRO ‘Climate Scientists’ discover? Nothing to see here folks. Just keep moving along.

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      • #
        OriginalSteve

        What youre describing sounds like some semi functional eastern europe -istan govt bureacracy ….it really is funny…

        Actually, if they remake the Borat movie, we could nominate some material for him…

        61

  • #
    RickWill

    I have made a time series plot of monthly global total precipitable water and outgoing long wave radiation using data from NASA’s Earth Observation for the last three calendar years:
    https://1drv.ms/b/s!Aq1iAj8Yo7jNg1uzA-KKFEvD5BzX

    Both TPW and OLR are in phase over their annual cycle; as water vapour increases, OLR increases. When TPW reduces, OLR reduces.

    TPW has a significant upward trend, increasing by 2.5mm over the past three years. OLR has a slight upward trend of 1W/sq.m Ove the three years.

    60

  • #
    Murray Shaw

    Michael E Mann appearing on 60 Minutes tonight. Has this man no shame. Bet he gets an armchair ride. Barnaby Joyce needs to be armed, better get in touch with him Jo!

    80

    • #
      Dennis

      Do used car salesmen know shame?

      60

    • #
      TdeF

      When he could not succeed in his attempt at a PhD in Physics, he went after a PhD which gave him fame and fortune. Even if he had to make up the data and break all the rules of science. Shame? He has fame.

      140

    • #
      John

      They’re a serious program! They wouldn’t just give him a free ride to spruik his message. No, we can expect some tough hard-hitting questions. Time to take a closer look at the dirt. Right?

      30

    • #
      John

      They’re a serious program! They wouldn’t just give him a free ride to spruik his message. No, we can expect some tough hard-hitting questions. Time to take a closer look at the dirt. Right?

      11

  • #
    hatband

    Rather than sequestering Carbon, has any thought been given to the positive results of burning stored Carbon, Coal in particular?
    Carbon Dioxide is an essential Gas, and while Oxygen is everywhere in the atmosphere, Carbon is in short supply.

    21

  • #
    Liberator

    So the UK wants all petrol and diesel vehicles banned by 2035. Not very green to do so really. dispose of the 30 plus million ICE vehicles and then replace them with what, Ev’s? Imagine the CO2 produced to manufacture all those replacement vehicles and the costs and waste generated through the disposal of all of the fossil fueled vehicles.

    70

    • #
      RickWill

      The EVs will not be produced in the UK. They will be made in China using electricity produced with a large slice of Australian coal.

      90

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        If this virus gets worse, China manufacturing is offline for a year at least. Maybe other countries coukd step in and do chinas role? Its a free market after all.

        Actually, could chinas govt fall from internal troubles if things dont go well regards its current trouble? Another reason to move manufacturing elsewhere if internal stability issues arise…and they could….

        30

    • #

      Not the UK, just BoJo & Co. Moving the impossible target from 2040 to 2035 is a way of showing action while doing nothing. We will see a lot of this political magic in 2020.
      https://www.cfact.org/2019/04/05/2020-climate-madness-looms/

      70

    • #
      yarpos

      Wont happen , at some stage when they get scared enough it will at least get watered down to make hybrids acceptable (or dumped all together) If there are serious serious moves across many fronts need to start yesterday, not the lest of which is additional real generation.

      10

  • #
    Liberator

    So the UK wants all petrol and diesel vehicles banned by 2035. Not very green to do so really. dispose of the 30 plus million ICE vehicles and then replace them with what, Ev’s? Imagine the CO2 produced to manufacture all those replacement vehicles and the costs and waste generated through the disposal of all of the fossil fueled vehicles.

    20

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Stupidity writ large….and where except by huge nuclear plants, would they get the power to charge them?

      50

      • #
        PeterS

        Stupid is as stupid does. Eventually though the public at large will wake up to the big con of reducing emissions. Then and only then will our political leaders (PM Morrison included) will be dispensed with and replaced by more useful leaders.

        20

        • #
          Robdel

          Until we get a PM with some spine, things will continue in their merry way. The only thing that will wake the people up is when power outages become a regular occurrence.

          20

        • #
          Robdel

          Until we get a PM with some spine, things will continue in their merry way. The only thing that will wake the people up is when power outages become a regular occurrence.

          10

      • #
        sophocles

        and where would they find the A*****n children to dig up the cobalt — slowly and by hand — for the EV batteries?

        At the start of 2018, cobalt’s price shot up from $2000.00 per ton to $80,000 per ton. By late 2018, the price had dropped to $56,000 per ton.

        Must be a very scarce element.

        00

    • #
      Bulldust

      It’s a ban on selling petrol cars, so the petrol cars could be around for a few decades after that. There will have to be a lot of duplication in terms of petrol and charging stations in the transition.

      To be honest I think the number of vehicles is going to peak and drop (in the West). Increased urbanisation leads to less demand (I don’t own a car for example, or motorcycle, as it is pointless when living and working in the city). Also, when self-driving cars become the norm, which is inevitable, cars will become a service rather than something to own. This will lead to a dramatic reduction in the number of vehicles required.

      Less cars on the roads means roads can shrink (turn side lanes into bike paths perhaps) and parking lots become largely redundant, although they could be repurposed as charging stations or redeveloped.

      15

      • #
        PeterS

        You forget one thing; population growth. Unless we start using flying cars I don’t see our roads being used less.

        50

      • #
        Bill In Oz

        I wonder how you came by your name ?
        It’s so appropriate !

        10

        • #
        • #
          Bulldust

          Nickname from the Hash House Harriers. There was probably a time when more people knew me as Bulldust than my real name.

          I really don’t understand why people don’t see the car industry is in for a major disruption. You can bet Uber or someone like them will be the big push behind driverless vehicles on demand. I get that a lot of people like and need their vehicles at the moment, and this will take some years to change, but it seems almost inevitable, at least in cities.

          People will still own driverless vehicles as well. But when the vehicles are not in use, why not let them drive around and make money? I bet most family vehicles these days sit idle 80% or 90% of the time.

          Also, as a complete aside, when driverless vehicles become safer than human drivers (again this seems an inevitability with time) what makes people think humans will be allowed to drive anymore? Just as many kids today wouldn’t be able to drive a stick, in a generation or two many won’t bother to learn to drive, and eventually it will be as rare as someone knowing how to fly today.

          Not sure why any of this seems controversial or unhinged.

          00

      • #
        Graeme#4

        The main problem with predictions about the future is that something unexpected usually turns up, or an inventive and ingenious human comes up with something that totally derails the prediction. History is full of examples of this.

        00

      • #
        Sceptical Sam

        What do you do at the weekends, Bulldust?

        Blue mountains for a bush walk?

        Ulladulla for a surf?

        Ride your push bike do you?

        Or into Newtown for another latte?

        00

        • #
          Bulldust

          Seeing as we have free public transport in the Perth CBD and most of what I need is here, I rent my car bay out rather than waste thousands per year on an asset I would not use all that much. On the odd occasion we want to head out further or need to lug something around there are car rental places around the corner … i.e. cars as a service. Then there’s Uber, DiDi, Ola for trips to the airport and back.

          I get it that people in the burbs with kids etc need a car or two in order to get around, but I see that as becoming less of an issue in coming decades. Once driverless car services become cheap enough (the driver is the main cost) economics will take over. If it cost someone half as much per year for a car service, why would one want to own a wasting asset? That’s where I see it going.

          00

          • #
            Graeme#4

            Don’t go down south much? You know, visit the wineries, enjoy the beautiful scenery, see a bit of our wonderful country.

            00

      • #
        yarpos

        yes Bull, city = world

        00

        • #
          Bulldust

          With urbanisation rates increasing around the world, sorta … yes. Massive urban sprawl is hardly practical nor attractive in most cases.

          00

  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    England to abolish petrol, diesel, and hybrid cars staring in 2035. Australia, for heath reasons alone, should follow suit.

    /this does not apply to trucks, in case you missed the bold highlight above

    020

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      And where are you going to find a charging station in the midst of the outback to charge a massive road train? They have huge long range fuel tanks for good reason.

      And a 4×4 that can cross 1m deep rivers without water getting into its electric motors….bang!

      The problem is, some of australia is suitable for EVs, but charging time is a major drag if it needs to be done out and about, and think of the number of commuters who firget to charge each night and the number of NRMA calls for emergency battery packs?

      EVs are just a dumb idea beyond a highly congested mega city like Tokyo or Shanghai where garages and asdociated costs are very high.

      EVs also restrict personal freedom and freedom of movement as they need to be charged only where grid power is available.

      And…EVs are to solve a non existant problem of “climate change”…fail….

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      • #
        BoyfromTottenham

        OS, if I ever need to buy an EV I will make sure to buy one that has an IP66 rating.
        /sarc

        00

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        We are talking about cars – as to 4×4′s what are BMW, Mercedes, Posche doing?
        I deliberately said “this does not apply to trucks, in case you missed the bold highlight above” to cover your road train straw man.
        Have you looked at the market? Both Toyota and Kia are going to release models with built in solar panels, which would work better in Australia than England
        Finally what is your average drive? is it similar to this? https://www.budgetdirect.com.au/car-insurance/research/average-kilometers-driven.html – this is a perfect market for an EV

        06

        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Yeah but youre excluding a key piece of the puzzle, which is why i included it…..

          What are you going to do with la la pie in the sky EV tech and stuff that needs diesel to transport heavy frieght all over australia including sone hard to get to places?

          You wrongly effectively assume trucks dont exist, but if trucks stop, so does australia.

          Most city dwellers coukd use a spark as mums runaroubd, they are no more than glorified short hop shopping trollies. Yep then can be driven 200 km but then need to be recharged, whereas i can drive 650km on a tank of diesel and haul a boat at the same time.

          EVs are rinky tink town fodder.

          40

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            Obviously you are just expressing your point of view without reading anything I’ve said.

            07

            • #
              AndyG55

              You haven’t really said anything, just shown that O.Steve is totally correct.

              EV will only ever be a dinky toy for the virtue seeking rich.

              Maybe as a local run-around as a second or third, if people remember to charge it…..

              but as a solid reliable car.. nope…

              more than a bit like wind and solar are to electricity.

              …. a NUISANCE more than anything else.

              20

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                Average K’s make a powerful argument for an EV – and if you have given a Tesla a test drive, you would not be making the “dinky toy” jibe. If you had read the reviews of the EV’s you would understand that Tesla’s 66 grand tag is more than recouped in operating costs, when compared to a petrol or diesel equivalent. We did not ditch horses because they made the cities stink, but it was a major force.

                08

              • #
                Dave

                Tesla’s “66 Grand tag”

                Where can I buy one for this price Peter?

                00

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                Dave – I quoted prices from the “Aussie prices” website – and that’s all the help I’m giving you for free

                01

              • #
                OriginalSteve

                You are ignoring the reality they are a niche dinky toy for people with too much money and love virtue signalling…they fail the basic cross purpose usability test – if i want to drive to some spot miles out west i likely cant unless i am “tethered” to some proximity to a charging station. But then i have to use a charging station, whereas any normal car can use any petrol station, fill up and be gone in 90 seconds.

                They are niche dinky toys, and a waste of money to solve non existant climate change, and requure huge infrastructure overhaul we dont ned and shouldnt spend the money on.

                All in all a dumb idea, writ large….

                Meanwhile…. go Barnaby….

                https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-09/labor-critical-of-government-coal-record-while-sitting-on-fence/11947812

                “The Federal Government announced $6 million would be spent on two feasibility studies for new electricity generation projects, including a coal-fired power plant at Collinsville in north Queensland.

                “Tensions were high in the Coalition party room on Tuesday between conservative Nationals MPs, who wanted the Government to focus more on coal, and moderate Liberals who believed more needed to be done to tackle climate change.

                “Fresh from his unsuccessful tilt for the Nationals’ leadership, Barnaby Joyce said there are significant government subsidies for renewable energy projects across the country and coal-fired plants should not be discounted.

                “The former Nationals leader believed a feasibility study into the Collinsville plant would show it was viable.

                20

              • #
                AndyG55

                You are still living a fantasy.

                Yes its a marvelous piece of machinery,

                ..but it is totally unnecessary and totally impractical for Australian conditions

                Its just a virtue seeking rich boy toy.

                And I’m sure you know that.

                00

              • #
                AndyG55

                “We did not ditch horses because they made the cities stink,”

                Thanks for finally admitting its ONLY use is in short distance around town use.

                They used to use them for milk carts.

                ICE SUVs will still be the vehicle of choice for the family situation, because they are practical, easy to use, can fill then in a few minutes.

                No-one wants to have to waste 30-40 minutes time in a busy day’s schedule.

                00

              • #
                sophocles

                We did not ditch horses because they made the cities stink

                but that’s exactly why we did ditch horses. They didn’t just make the cities stink, they filled the cities up with … um … horse excrement.
                https://www.historic-uk.com/HistoryUK/HistoryofBritain/Great-Horse-Manure-Crisis-of-1894/

                00

            • #
              Fred Streeter

              Tesla’s 66 grand tag is more than recouped in operating costs, when compared to a petrol or diesel equivalent.

              Plus, EVs free up (possibly cheaper) fuel for more oil-fired power stations to replace the pointless wind turbines.

              And to maintain a beneficial level of CO2 in the atmosphere to green the planet.

              Win-win.

              00

        • #
          yarpos

          Yes its tough PF when you arent the centre of attention.

          Have you looked at the market beyond novelty cars? there are nearly a 100 million cars built each year, yet you think a couple of “gunna” cars are indicative of something.

          Average drive means nothing. People purchase cars for their overall utility. When EVs make financial and functional sense they will be successful. The city shopping trolley/commuter niche will probably get filled first when people can afford it.

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      • #
        Sceptical Sam

        EVs also restrict personal freedom and freedom of movement as they need to be charged only where grid power is available.

        That’s just the point.

        The fascist greens and socialist/Communists don’t like you having freedom of movement. How can they control you if you are able to keep on moving around the joint?

        50

        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Yep. As to self driving cars…they can keep that.

          Any vehicle i gave will have full manual overide if needed, or i just bypass the control box myself…

          40

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Original Steve:
        There are problems even if you can reach a charging point.

        Some 60,000 Ausgrid customers are without power due to the severe storms, mainly in Sydney’s north, and parts of the Central Coast, as well as pockets of the greater Sydney, Newcastle and Hunter regions.
        Power supply to some 19,000 Endeavour Energy customers in NSW have also interrupted. Some 270 electrical hazards need repairing, mostly from large trees being blown over powerlines, the company said on Sunday morning.
        The amount of customers currently without power in WA is not yet known as damage assessments are still being carried out, although 10,000 lost power last night.

        50

        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Yep…now image a road train trying to recharge with 200 head of cattle in the middle of summer….and it cant…..

          EVs are play toy city fodder…..

          40

    • #
      Roger Knights

      “England to abolish petrol, diesel, and hybrid cars”

      Nope—just sales of them, and only of new cars, not used ones.

      50

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Read what I said – ‘starting’

        06

        • #
          farmerbraun

          “Read what I said”

          Good luck with that one :-)

          20

        • #
          Fred Streeter

          What you wrote was:

          England to abolish petrol, diesel, and hybrid cars staring in 2035.

          HM Government doesn’t like the way these vehicles look at them. By 2035, all must have kinder, gentler expressions.

          00

        • #
          Roger Knights

          “Read what I said – ‘starting’”

          I didn’t dispute that. What I disputed was your “abolish,” which suggests an abolition or prohibition of ICE cars on the roads. Instead what the UK proposes to do is prohibit the SALES of new-car ICEs—and not the sales of used ICEs. That is far from “abolish.”

          10

    • #
      AndyG55

      By then , hopefully this whole anti-CO2 garbage will be over and people can use the most efficient,convenient form of transport.

      It will not be EVs, because unless they go heavily into nuclear, there will not be the electricity available, except for the rich.

      And there will still not be any evidence that atmospheric CO2 causes warming, or affects the climate in any way whatsoever.

      80

    • #
      Graeme Bird

      England is not going to do these things Peter. Any attempt to get off hydrocarbons in a hurry is at least a two hundred year project. Attempting to do things faster than that cannot make it happen. It can only lead to economic degradation.

      61

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Guess which nation after America has lost more of its manufacturing capacity (hint – it is a union of former kingdoms), so I would look to that for economic degradation.

        The time frame is not the point really now is it? Australia uses dirty fuel, and the resultant hit to air quality. Replacing the car fleet will remove that, and have a flow on community health as well.

        010

        • #
          AndyG55

          USA has regaining its manufacturing ability very quickly over the last couple of years.

          Now I wonder why that would be ;-)

          Australia has lost a lot of its manufacturing ability, because China, India can do it so much cheaper because of labour rules and the greenie agenda.

          Australia does not use dirty fuel, It could use more gas, but the greenie agenda has stopped that.

          Air quality is very good in Australia, except in the really closed in parts of the cities.

          Nobody is going to replace the ICE engine for Australian conditions, except in some weird FANTASY scenario.

          There is no need to, and nobody wants the inconvenience or cost, except as a form of virtue seeking.

          60

        • #
          farmerbraun

          Read your last two sentences ; they’re nonsensical.

          11

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          Peter Fitzroy:

          Have you ever been to London? Don’t talk to me about air quality here. London’s death rate has reduced despite all that diesel exhaust. And a Tesla would be useless there with traffic crawling along.

          51

        • #
          Fred Streeter

          I would second Graeme #3.

          I lived on the outskirts of London during the late 40s and in London from mid 50s to the mid 70s.

          I can remember really thick, dirty fogs.
          One, when I was 5/6, where my father had had to feel his way home, counting turnings etc. And this in the suburbs.

          The speed with which this all changed as we recovered from WW2 was real progress.

          To spend similar amounts to remove a harmless gas when there are still so many real pollutants that require removal – ridiculous.

          (BTW, I do not, and never have, owned or driven a motor vehicle. Walk, Bike, Bus, Train – and on 3 occasions – Plane.)

          20

        • #
          Roger Knights

          “Replacing the car fleet will remove that, and have a flow on community health as well.”

          I’ve read that new-car auto emissions have become 90% cleaner in the U.S. over the past 25 years. But there has been only a minimal, if any, health improvement as a result. So I doubt that eliminating the last 10%, as BEVs do, will have any noticeable impact either.

          40

        • #
          Graeme Bird

          The loss of manufacturing since the end of Bretton Woods has been a feature of money and banking. But now it looks like stupidity in energy policy will be as large a factor Peter.

          20

  • #
    dinn, rob

    While bats account for a quarter of mammalian species, rodents are 50 per cent, and then there’s the rest of us. https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/techandscience/how-do-bats-live-with-so-many-viruses/ar-BBZsljQ

    40

  • #
    Bulldust

    In case people haven’t seen it before the Nullschool Earth web tool is great for tracking weather around the globe:

    https://earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/surface/level/orthographic=-238.72,-21.65,3000

    Zoom in and out, spin the globe, change parameters. It’s basically a Google earth for weather.

    51

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Looks fascinating.

      10

      • #
        BoyfromTottenham

        KK, yes I have been watching it for a while. I set it to display Total Precipitable Water before the rain came here in Qld. Most of AU had a low TPW reading (30 kg/m2 over an arc from SW WA to the NE of NSW, then the rain started. I wonder if the BOM know about this simple fact?

        40

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Yes pretty pictures !
      But be aware that the owners of this site
      are Global Climate Alarmists
      And have that as a hidden agenda !

      20

      • #
        Bill In Oz

        And has it’s very weird
        Operating rules for showing anything on screen.
        I’m not going to bother using it.

        10

    • #
      Furiously curious

      Ventusky. com is similar. Maybe easier to look at different scenarios – precipitation, pressure, precipitation……

      00

    • #
      Graeme#4

      I use Nullschool to predict what our Perth weather will be in about a week. Usually more accurate than BOM.

      20

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Graeme

        Eye of newt and toe of frog,
        Wool of bat and tongue of dog,
        would be more accurate than the BoM.

        Assuming that the practitioners were appropriately politically correct and acceptable to the authorities.

        20

    • #
      Speedy

      Thanks Bulldust – it really shows how complex the weather can be. Saved it to my Favourites.
      Cheers,
      Speedy

      00

  • #
    PeterS

    The heavy rains appear to be causing problems with the internet in some areas. No doubt due to pits in suburban streets being flooded. So much for the NBN. All we need is a week or two of heavy rain and the internet goes down for a lot more people.

    50

  • #
    Brian

    The only reason we are able to feed the current global population is through the massive expenditure of fossil fuel (oil and gas). Manufacturing fertiliser, ploughing. seeding, harvesting, transportation and distribution. All of this requires diesel to provide the necessary torque. The number of calories that have to be expended to put a single calorie on a plate in the urban ghettos is frankly daunting. The most ridiculous report I have seen is a renewables activist extolling the virtues of a prototype John Deere electric tractor. This operates with a 1,000 metre extension cable that needs to draw 300 kW off a grid connection at the side of the trial paddock. Good luck with being able to get that level of power in rural areas, let alone setting up the connections on a real sized field.

    120

  • #

    The largest wind farm plant in Australia, Macarthur Wind is off line and delivering zero power to the grid. It has a Nameplate of 420MW, but at the average Capacity Factor (CF) of 30%, that comes down to 125MW. Even so, the total Nameplate for wind power is (now) 6960MW, effectively, (at that 30% CF) 2090MW. So that makes Macarthur Wind the supplier of 6% of all wind power.

    It went off line to zero output at 2.30PM on Friday 31st January, (the day of the largest power consumption in Australia’s history) and here we are now, Sunday 9th February, and it is still off line and delivering zero power to the grid.

    Nine days, ZERO power.

    If one Unit at a Victorian coal fired plant went off line, you would read ALL about it in the media the next morning.

    Try and find a mention of Macarthur at zero anywhere and you’d be hard pressed. I have looked using as many wording combinations as I can find to try and find a mention as to why it’s off line, and nothing.

    It was a similar thing late last year when Macarthur changed owners and it was down for ten to fourteen days, and again, no mention of zero output for that either.

    I know some of you will try and look for yourselves, and if you find anything, get back to me ….. us all here.

    Nine days of zero output is surely something the public needs to be aware of.

    As some of you may know, I am collating all the wind data for Australia on a daily basis. I have consistently used the CF of 30% as a guide, and the data now backs that up, because after 70 weeks of daily data collection, the long term CF is actually 29.5%, and in all that time, it has never been above 30%

    Tony.

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    • #
      Serp

      Maybe some journalist will have a question on this for Lily d’Ambrosio, Victoria’s Minister for nurturing the flow of renewable investment funds.

      70

    • #

      You should call them up, explain that you blog about electric power, and ask why they have been down so long. They must have a press office.

      60

      • #

        David,

        I actually tried that. The call does not go through to the wind plant itself, but to the operator of the plant, AGL, their normal customer line.

        After navigating the convoluted Menu, I finally did get through, and all I got was an automated response to leave a message, and we’ll try and get back to you.

        I’ll try again during working hours during the week.

        Tony.

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    • #

      That nine DAYS of zero power output is a huge amount of power missing from the grid.

      It’s actually 27.2GWH in total across those nine days, umm, you know, the same power delivered by Bayswater in a little over ten ….. HOURS.

      Tony.

      110

      • #
        Robber

        No, no Tony, you must be wrong. From their website: “The 420 MW Macarthur Wind Farm can generate enough clean, green energy to power the equivalent of approximately 181,000 average Australian homes.” “It’s currently the largest of its kind in the Southern Hemisphere.”
        And on Seek Feb 4: “Vestas is currently recruiting for a Service Technician with an A Grade Electrical license to work on site at the Macarthur Wind Farm in Western Regional Victoria.” “You will be responsible for installation, operation and maintenance of Wind Turbines Generators.”
        Found at RenewEconomy Feb 2: “South Australia’s electricity grid will be effectively “islanded” for up to two weeks, following the dramatic weather events on Friday that resulted in a tornado knocking down at six large transmission towers on one of the main 500kV lines in Victoria.” “The loss of the towers north of Colac, on the Moorabool to Mortlake and Moorabool to Tarrone transmission lines, has effectively closed the main electricity highway between Victoria and South Australia (the Heywood Interconnector).” “But to deal with this unique situation, AEMO is implementing a series of constraints – including limiting and shutting down the output of four wind farm operations.”

        60

        • #
          Chad

          Well, SA is not “islanded” enough to prevent it importing and exporting power according to NEMlog ?

          10

          • #
            Robber

            Chad, that’s the smaller Murray Link connector still operating. It’s the larger 650 MW Heywood connector that is down. AEMO has also reconfigured the network to allow SA to supply electricity through the smaller MurrayLink interconnector, to ensure continued power to the Alcoa Aluminium Smelter in Portland, Victoria.

            00

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Tony,
        see my bit above at 15.1.3

        It must be convenient for those who insist on unreliable supply to blame it on ClimateChange.

        And SA s having problems. The ‘wind’ blew 6? pylons over on the Heywood interconnector and it will be 2 weeks (at least) before the connection is restored.
        And how did the authorities react? They curtailed output from wind farms. Gas fired generation is much more reliable.

        60

    • #
      Lance

      /Sarc On

      Mr. Tony, you seem to miss the point that 9 days of nothing is simply Proof of the need for More “imaginary generation”.

      You see, More of Something that produces Nothing (when you need it but don’t have it) simply proves that More of More of Something Times Nothing is the solution to having Less of Nothing that Means Nothing which means you have More of Something that isn’t.

      It is the Liberal/Progressive Theory of Modern Monetary Theory applied to Energy.

      Don’t you “Like Get That?”

      Everything from Nothingness at all times at zero costs for everyone.
      It’s the Unicorn and Pixie Way.

      If all those stodgy Engineers and Producers would simply drop some LSD (Lazy Stupid BullSchei…) then everything would be resolved for everyone, everywhere, forever, for nothing.

      If you were only as smart as a New York Bartender, you’d understand.

      QED.

      “Like, I’m Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez, aka AOC, and, like, I want to talk about, like, climate change, because, like, there’s no doubt cow farts are making the climate change.”

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rVk3CHlL-NM

      /Sarc Off

      40

    • #
      Kim

      Hi Tony Great respect for your work, AGL is advertising they have updated the Turbines at the Bayswater power plant, could you please provide an assessment

      20

  • #
    Graeme Bird

    “….what is the mechanism that causes the stratosphere to become buoyant for a few decades, then to sink once more?”

    Thats a thing to dwell on isn’t it? If thin cold air stays suspended above thicker “wetter” air thats a little bit strange since you would expect some low level mixing the whole time. But still its fair enough. Its lighter, its drier. But if that same thinner drier air starts felling kind of daffy and invades down below into the troposphere, we would want to know what has changed. And we’d want to go through the whole process of coming up with hypotheses and ranking and re-ranking them for plausibility as the data rolls in. We don’t want to leave this question just hanging in the air (ho ho). I already think I know the answer. But two people who downvoted me on the prior open thread must each have more and better potential explanations. So you know. Don’t act like a trace gas hysteric. Give it up.

    So why the excessive self-segregation in the first place during some periods. But why the behaviour change at other times and thinner drier ducking below where it is supposed to be. That would seem defy any amount of physics. As if the melted butter on top of someones a brew went and ducked under the hot coffee. Something is afoot here. Because its those little anomalies that are ignored that we rely on to guide us to superior paradigms.

    22

  • #
    pat

    pathetic. looks more like the Govt is a bit concerned about Qld voters, Matt Canavan being left on the back bench, et:

    8 Feb: Brisbane Times: AAP: Two coal-fired and hydroelectric power projects being explored for Qld
    The federal government says it will spend up to $6 million on two new Queensland electricity generation projects – including a coal-fired power plant – as part of a bid to lower power prices.

    About $2 million has been set aside for a pre-feasibility study on a 1.5 gigawatt hydroelectric plant to be developed as part of the planned Urannah Water Scheme, while up to $4 million will support a feasibility study for a 1GW “high efficiency, low emissions” coal plant at Collinsville…
    https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/national/queensland/two-coal-fired-and-hydroelectric-power-projects-being-explored-for-qld-20200208-p53yy8.html

    nonetheless:

    9 Feb: Bloomberg: Australia to Fund Study Into New Coal-Fired Power Station
    By James Thornhill
    The Australian government will give financial backing to a study into a new coal-fired power plant in Queensland that it said would lower power prices and improve grid reliability, drawing criticism from environmentalists who say it’s not doing enough to tackle climate change…
    Clean energy specialist Simon Holmes a Court said the plan isn’t realistic and the government was wasting public money “on an ideological crusade”…
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-02-08/australia-to-fund-study-into-new-coal-fired-power-station

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    • #
      Dennis

      The Federal Government does not have the powers to approve power stations, or dams and other infrastructure projects, the planning approvals etc., are State Government powers.

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      • #
        Dennis

        Gas fired power stations have been approved for SEQ and VIC by those State governments, funding to be underwritten by the Federal Government for the private sector owners.

        And an agreement with the NSW Government has been signed to release substantially more natural gas into the east coast market. Negotiations continue with VIC.

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      • #
        OriginalSteve

        If the national grid is at risk and threatens defence of the country, they coukd do them und emergency powers perhaps…

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      • #

        The Feds can still find the studies.

        00

  • #
    Dennis

    Tom Foolery has a new climate business venture, farming seaweeds and shredding them to release CO2 into the oceans.

    Apparently thermal power stations are no longer being pursued.

    40

    • #
      Serp

      A search on your “farming seaweeds and shredding them to release CO2 into the oceans” more than satisfies my lust for Vonnegut level hare-brainedness. Thanks for the glimpse of dystopia.

      20

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Perception Management 101.

    We have been told as part of the Man Made Global Warming theme that world temperatures are rising and that this leads to melting ice caps and glaciers, which of course causes sea level rise.

    Like so much of modern control paradigms that seek to bind us in fear, the truth is often contrary to the “advertising”.

    A recent couple of posts suggested that sea levels may actually fall when rising temperature increases evaporation from the oceans. This may well be the case when parched continents need topping up and any precipitation at the poles is trapped as ice.

    Regardless of the mechanism the evidence is there in the world’s geology that sea levels have been falling for most of recorded human history.

    http://joannenova.com.au/2020/02/on-cue-after-droughts-and-fires-then-come-the-floods/#comment-2272576

    KK

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  • #
    pat

    i’m neither here nor there on the man, but some might find this interesting/concerning:

    8 Feb: NY Post: Jordan Peterson recovering from tranquilizer addiction in Russia
    By Isabel Vincent
    https://nypost.com/2020/02/08/jordan-peterson-recovering-from-tranquilizer-addiction-in-russia/

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  • #
    pat

    and it took nearly a year to notice? lol:

    3 Feb: Union of Concerned Scientists: The US Navy Quietly Shut Down its Task Force on Climate Change
    What happened: The US Navy has dismantled its Task Force on Climate Change, which was designed to use the best available science to prepare naval leadership for global shifts in sea levels, melting ice sheets and ocean temperatures. The task force was shut down in March 2019 without a public announcement and climate change science and information has been scrubbed from the Department’s website. According to a Navy spokesperson the task force was “duplicative” and no longer needed, though the task force’s work has not been fully incorporated into the Navy’s decisionmaking process.

    Why it matters…
    By dismantling its Task Force Climate Change, which has been in operation since 2009, the US Navy has cut itself off from receiving important scientific information on one of the biggest threats facing the Navy, climate change…
    https://www.ucsusa.org/resources/attacks-on-science/navy-quietly-shut-down-climate-task-force

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    • #
      Graeme Bird

      “which was designed to use the best available science to prepare naval leadership for global shifts in sea levels, melting ice sheets and ocean temperatures.”

      What a waste of money. That seems just so bizarre. As if the water level goes up 2 millimetres in Manhattan and you’ve got to retool all your submarines? Its like the taxeaters didn’t figure it out that the problem with a sea level rise is a problem for those on land. And that the people who are at sea are the ones with the least amount to worry about such a thing. Maybe if it was just three dudes with a part-time gig to wonder about the implications for wharves and docking facilities you could understand it.

      Just shows how spending has gotten so far out of control. So much fat to cut. I quite like this young Andrew Yang fellow. Because if he came out with his allowance, the next obvious thing to do would be to indulge in a sustained frenzy of BS job destruction in both the public and private sectors. And no-one would even get hurt because everyone would have that nice cushion to fall back on. Years of funny money has lead to an explosion of Graeber’s BS jobs.

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    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      WHADDAYAKNOW!?

      At long last the NOAA has updated its front page chart for Sydney’s Fort Denison, which for years terMinated at 2010.

      And what do you know, it shows that the rate of sea level rise has increased from 0.65 mm/year to 0.75 mm/year.

      And a glance at the chart suggests that ALL of the increase happened in those ten years since they terminated their rpublishing..

      I have for years cited Fort Denison’s remarkably stable chart as debunking alarmism. I was not surprised that they stopped the news on that chart. I have been watching, though not closely of late, expecting that when they resumed publication they would have a new story.

      From the noaa website:

      https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/sltrends/sltrends_station.shtml?id=680-140

      http://www.sealevel.info/MSL_graph.php?id=Sydney&boxcar=1&boxwidth=3

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  • #
    Aussie Pete

    The MSM tried hard to make Cyclone Damien into a category four. It must have been through gritted teeth that the All ‘Bout Climate news have reported this morning that it maxed out at three and has been downgraded to a two already.

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    • #
      toorightmate

      There is a weak tropical low in the New Britain area and has been there for several days.
      Last Monday, our BoM said that “a cyclone COULD form in the Coral Sea by the end of the week”. That has not yet happened.
      I will match that statement with my own. “The cow COULD jump over the moon by the end of the week” OR “Saturn COULD have major dust storms by the end of February”.

      20

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Wow!

        Major dust storms on Saturn! This could be proof of ClimateChange©. All we have to do is correlate it with the rising CO2 level and Financial Grants will flow.
        A syndicate of Michael Mann (consultant), the BoM and NASA will do the figuring.

        It will be called the Saturn Atmospheric Research Cooperative,

        30

    • #
      Graeme#4

      Has been interesting watching Channel 7 trying to get some mileage from installing a news reporter in Karratha. As expected, not much damage, as most house built these days up there are cyclone proof, and they seem to have finally realised that certain street trees tend to fall over in cyclones.

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  • #
    pat

    some of the stuff has been written about on minor websites, but Beck presents it quite well here:

    Youtube: 1h27m20s: 6 Feb: Glenn Beck Presents: Ukraine: The Final Piece
    The media and the Left drove the narrative from the start on the July 25 phone call between President Trump and Ukrainian President Zelensky. They wanted us to see only one thing. It’s time to look at more. Glenn Beck connects the dots between the phone call that led to the impeachment of President Trump and why an investigation into Hunter Biden is so important. Ultimately, this was never about Trump. It wasn’t even about the Bidens. This is about a violation of constitutional power by Barack Obama that will horrify even his most ardent supporters.
    Glenn pulls back the curtain on the theft of billions in international funds to Ukraine by following the clues in the phone call. Those clues could lead to mountains of corruption, and Hunter Biden might be the lynchpin to uncovering the entire thing.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dCSwqca8KXU&feature=emb_logo

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    • #
      hatband

      Perhaps that’s the real reason for Joe Bidens 2020 run, to put the coverup to bed, plus protect his son, who’s gotten mixed up with extremely dangerous people.

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  • #
    WXcycles

    Mid-level and upper-level jetstream intensity in both hemispheres looks about the same.

    I created an animated .gif this morning to illustrate conclusively that as we move toward late Summer’s peak, that the southern and northern hemisphere are essentially looking visually identical above the convection level of about 18 K feet. These hemispheres should not be the same at all, they should look unmistakably distinctly different when they are at their respective peak of Summer and Winter. You should be able to visually tell which is which at a glance, but you can’t see much difference during the past 2.5 months.

    .GIF of Global Jetstream – ECMWF – 18th Feb 2020 Forecast:

    https://i.ibb.co/KG6prMc/Global-Jetstream-ECMWF-18th-Feb-2020-Forecast.gif

    The sinking stratospheric ultra-dry air has transformed the Southern hemisphere’s upper and mid-level pressure gradient into that of a Winter hemisphere. Before these past few months I would have thought that was impossible. Take note of the now one month old relatively stable “equatorial-jets”, within the eastern equatorial Pacific, and equatorial Atlantic. There’s no sign these equator-crossing jets are fading, they have become standing features which continuously link the two hemispheres. Note also the continuous and increasing volume of air streaming across the equator almost everywhere within the upper-level.

    None of this is ‘normal’, at least not during the past 40 years of warming, then El-Nino punctuated ‘Hiatus’. It may have been normal prior to the warming phase though.

    Since about early November 2019 the atmospheric jetstream flow has been strongly expanding in both hemispheres and the jetstream moved more equatorward until they linked directly and continuously across the equator during early January. The precursor to this was the emergence of a very zonal major jet which formed from the equatorial Atlantic ocean area, crossed the Sahara, the Persian Gulf, Central Asia, China and Japan, then half way into the central Pacific. Before diverging mid-pacific to join the new east-Pacific ‘equatorial-jet’, while its northern arm looped cross western Canada and the USA. It did this to skirt around the Low and adjacent high that were driving the northern half of the new east Pacific equatorial jet. These are part of one whole northern hemispheric structure, and it does not occur without linkage to the southern hemisphere jetstream.

    We’ve all seen the news reports of the sustained cold and extreme snow events from Africa, to the ME, all of Central and south Asia. It was that massive sustained jet which produced it, and its linkage to the strongly meridional polar jet north of it.

    But this major zonal jet which wrapped 2/3rd of the way around the northern hemisphere’s tropics and sub-tropics was and still is chock full of continuously falling former stratosphere at 0.0% relative humidity. As seen in these images in bright pink:

    34 k ft
    https://i.ibb.co/c3SZbPJ/34-k-ft-Asian-Zonal-Jet-RH-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted.jpg

    18 k ft
    https://i.ibb.co/bQsdTrB/18-k-ft-Asian-Zonal-Jet-RH-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted-1.jpg

    The intensity of the jet varies as the quantity of 0.0% humidity air in it varies, and its location.

    I made a further detailed comment yesterday evening about a 439 km/h jet that was *observed* yesterday (about 50 images) within the prior ‘Unthreaded’ post page, but the comment got stuck in moderation overnight so here’s the direct link to that comment:

    http://joannenova.com.au/2020/02/thursday-unthreaded/#comment-2272439

    I require a better animation program or an online app to help illustrate such changes bought about from this sinking stratospheric air (I know about the Windy animation option but it is too limited). If anyone knows of better quality image animating options please leave a note below, thanks.

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  • #
    pat

    FakeNewsMSM has been insisting Buttigieg is a “moderate”:

    In New Hampshire, Pete Buttigieg Makes the Case for Moderation By Rob Fischer
    The New Yorker – 7 Feb 2020
    Pete Buttigieg is, at thirty-eight, the youngest candidate in this year’s …but he is running what amounts to a moderate campaign but he is running what amounts to a moderate campaign in the current field…

    Pete Buttigieg Makes a Play for Iowa Conservatives Who Don’t Like Donald Trump
    TIME – 29 Jan 2020

    3 Feb: TheFederalist: The Myth Of Pete Buttigieg, ‘Moderate’
    From health care and abortion to guns and immigration, and from the Supreme Court to the Electoral College, the man is decidedly a radical.
    by Christopher Bedford
    What are Pete Buttigieg’s politics?
    If you read CBS, The Atlantic, The New York Times, The Guardian, and a host of their friends, the former mayor is decidedly a moderate. According to The Washington Post and a few more, he’s “a traditional centrist” who embodies “the Democratic primary’s rightward drift.” And if you listen to the left-wing activists trailing him around, he’s “Wall Street Pete” and “will kill us.”…
    https://thefederalist.com/2020/02/03/the-myth-of-pete-buttigieg-moderate/

    29 Apr 2019: ChurchMilitant: Pete Buttigieg’s Marxist Father
    by Christine Niles, M.St. (Oxon.), J.D.
    Dr. Joseph Buttigieg was an avid proponent of the work of Antonio Gramsci, godfather of cultural marxism.
    Dr. Joseph Buttigieg served as professor of English at the University of Notre Dame, where he was a faculty member for nearly 40 years before his passing at age 71 on Jan. 27.
    A founding member and president of the International Gramsci Society, Prof. Buttigieg edited and translated Antonio Gramsci’s Prison Notebooks, a manifesto on communist revolution. He was also appointed by the Italian minister of culture to a commission of experts supervising Gramsci’s complete works. His articles on Gramsci have been translated into multiple languages.

    Professor Buttigieg sat on the advisory board of the journal “Rethinking Marxism,” and was an editor of “Boundary 2,” a journal that also promoted socialist thought. He also participated in the 150th anniversary of Karl Marx & Richard Engels’ Communist Manifesto, whose prose he lauded for its “poignancy.”
    Father John Jenkins, controversial president of Notre Dame, praised Prof. Buttigieg after his passing…
    https://www.churchmilitant.com/news/article/pete-buttigiegs-marxist-father?fbclid=IwAR3l208324ijeY3Lu5knTnlX2EK5iR6TnduY5Q68JA_upFWrHWiKvcOtZw8

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  • #
    toorightmate

    I Have witnessed some intensive rainfall events over the years having sat through several cyclones in North West WA and North Queensland and having witnessed some impressive electrical storms in Brisbane.
    However, yesterday, a section of Rockhampton received 76mm of rain in 1 hour.
    Can anyone beat this rainfall intensity? – I cant.

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    • #
      WXcycles

      Yup. In Townsville on Jan 10th, 1998, from 6:50 PM to 1:20 AM we received ~760 mm (in under 6 hours). It was the onshore convergence line from decaying ‘Cyclone Sid’. BOM issued a severe weather warning about 6 hrs before it occurred but the sky looked fine, bit get, nothing much. It all changed at 6:50 PM as very severe lightning and incredibly heavy rain appeared all of a sudden. I don’t believe any rain gauge would be capable of accurate measurement as you could put an empty bucket in the drive way and 5 mins later is was literally full and splashing out furiously. We did that a few times before the water backed up into the yard. Biggest rain drops I’ve ever seen, packed densely, you could barely see a house 6 doors away. The rain was so intense it created a continuous 2 foot deep overland flow and waterfall into the bay from North Ward, which wore away the whole Townsville strand and its protective rock wall. The high winds and waves did the rest. The bay side slope of Melton and Cleveland Terraces literally became sheet waterfalls on to the Eyre street to Denham Street roadway. Local teens were riding wheelie bins and floating beer kegs from the Hotel Allen and Seaview Hotels down the middle of North Ward’s streets with ~80 km/h gusts and continuous close lightning. The teens were loving it and it was hilarious to watch. No sense of their mortality. Fortunately only one person in Anandale drowned in a causeway inside their car. Next morning Halifax bay had floating cars, caravans, sheds and houses in it, which washed out the mouth of the Black River, about 15 km NW of Townsville’s northern suburbs.

      I have seen a lot of tropical rain, but if I had not seen that I would not have thought such heavy rain was possible. The downdrafts it created generated numerous strong surface gusts in the 80 to 100 km/h range. Think of the heaviest rain you’ve experienced and triple to quadruple it. Well over 100 mm per hour but not possible to measure, to much induced wind and too much splash from such big drops.

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      • #
        toorightmate

        Thank you.
        Is that why MacIntyre and Associates designed the showground area storm water drainage system?

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        • #
          WXcycles

          Don’t know about such specifics, but the area you’re talking about just NW along Ingham Rd was completely flooded. The drainage from there runs both into eastern Garbutt then through a broad storm water drain just to the east of the runway, into Rose Bay (where the bridge is on the road out to Pallarenda). But it also goes out past the ‘Causeway’, just west of the V8 Super Car track, then out the Ross Creek harbor mouth with the tidal flow. There’s a flood gate there to stop King Tides backing up into the storm water drains.

          The whole area NW of the showground was a swamp in the 1980s (and used as an awesome motorcross track). It belonged to a lumber company called Foxwood Timbers. Then it became a major shopping district and residential area, but still on a slightly raised but fairly low-laying former swamp which was once upon a time the course of Ross River. The developers turned that swampy area into a suburban housing development called, “The Lakes” project. You could catch Barramundi in those ‘lakes’. Not a good sign if you wanted to live near there. You can contract increase the flood water capacity but that area is always going to become flooded, especially around high tides. Castle Hill turned into an Island the night I described, and did again last February when Ross Dam had its emergency release.

          The ground should have been built-up higher but that would just mean that other older surrounding suburbs would flood more. So the only answer is to increase the capacity for the water to drain faster. But there is no way to stop the flooding occurring in a real deluge and no way to stop the tide from backing it up. Same applies with a cyclone storm surge.

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      toorightmate:

      When I went to Lautoka in Fiji in 1969 they were still talking about getting 25 mm in 15 minutes. According to one local, standing on a veranda visibility through the rain was less than a metre (he used imperial).

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  • #
    Graeme Bird

    I think a cheap and nasty study should be engaged upon to see if the gigantic power of the Antarctic Circumpolar current can be explained easily by wind friction alone. I would doubt it myself. I would think that what we ought to have instead, if relying on wind friction, ought to be a fairly shallow weak sort of affair. Moving around and around but only feebly so. Its a bit like those super-rotating cloud banks on Venus that lack a good conventional explanation. Not much coriolis forces to work with on Venus. Convection remains an upward, randomised swirling force and cannot be press-ganged into explaining persistent powerful horizontal movement. People try to make that convection work in their minds eye for these sorts of things. But they cannot do it, so they move on and delegate these things to the building 7 part of their brain.

    Of course even if the wind friction could explain the entirety of this power, we’d still have to have satisfying reasons for the consistency and power of the winds at sea level. But for those who are able to put together some draft back-of-the-envelope calculations to these things, from home and using only satellite data, I think its a worthy undertaking, even if you could never hope to complete the task, without funding and a team from crossover specialties. We don’t want to leave these things as eternal mysteries of life and elephants in the room. What could make the water just seem to act strange and go around and around like that? Think of the machinery that it would take to replicate such a thing artificially? The length and power of the flow of the Circumpolar Current, makes the Amazon rivers efforts, look feeble indeed. This is even the case although the Amazon has gravity working in its favour . No gravity to help out the Circumpolar Current. Plus cold salty water is far more viscous than warm fresh water. The mystery compounds on itself.

    The Gulf stream is called a thermohaline current. The Gulf Stream has heat and saltiness differentials working for it. So people assume they have that powerful North-South energy explained and they think there is nothing more to see here. Well you know. I have my doubts about that also. But those explanations, or partial explanations, aren’t there for the Circumpolar Current. So I think its a serious mystery under the paradigms that hold sway at the moment. And I think it ought to be dwelt upon and looked at with much curiosity.

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    • #
      RickWill

      The southern ocean is a big place. Area between 40 and 70 degrees south latitude is rounded to 12E12sq.m.

      Average windspeed is 10m/s. Taking air to water drag coefficient of 0.005, the power imparted to the water surface 36TW.

      To put that number in perspective the average global primary energy power output is 18TW. So the southern ocean ocean circulation is powered by twice all the power controlled by human activity, twice every power station, every motor vehicle every aeroplane, all space heating and cooling etc.

      Assuming the same drag coefficient between water and rock and the same surface area, 36TW would result in a Southern Ocean current of 2.3kts (1.2m/s). This is very close to what is measured.

      There are two slight errors with this calculation that are likely to cancel. The wind velocity is given as 8 to 12m/s. I took an average of 10m/s. The relative velocity between wind and water would then be only 8.8m/s. That would lower the power transfer. However the power imparted from water to air is a function of velocity cubed. The average of the cube is 10.7m/s. So this lifts relative velocity to 9.5m/s.

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      • #
        Graeme Bird

        That sure sounds like good work. “Average windspeed is 10m/s. Taking air to water drag coefficient of 0.005, the power imparted to the water surface 36TW.”

        Aha. But you are assuming 100% correspondence between wind direction and water direction. Thats not going to fly. Under these Ekman spirals the wind is often running at near right angles to the water and can even be running counter to the water. So that would mean, by your own admission, there is a great deal of deficit to be made up. Plus added to that we want to be able to find energy for the winds themselves. Which can only partially be put down to coriolis.

        Now you’ve only taken into account surface friction and friction and I don’t think you’ve brought in friction at the sea bottom.

        You do realise that this current goes to depths of four kilometres right? You don’t think pure volume is an issue? I mean you might be right but thats a pretty big assumption that you only need to deal with one of at least two frictions and water volume is irrelevant?

        Plus consider that at these depths and pressures, sea bottom friction and water layer friction, is going massively stronger than what you would at first think. And how about the extreme viscosity of such cold water …. and such compressed water? Remembering that though the Gulf Stream moves at a good clip at the surface. But the Circumpolar circulation is a thousands of years project. So that where the water is very deep and under pressure, it must be moving more akin to slow-motion tooth-paste. Maybe bring in a few more assumptions and the energy deficit may stick out more.

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        • #
          RickWill

          This link shows the wind direction for MacQuarie Island(54S):
          https://www.meteoblue.com/en/weather/historyclimate/climatemodelled/macquarie-island_australia_2159161
          It is predominantly from the west. The roaring forties were deemed such for the fast ride they gave sailing ships travelling west to east south of 40 degrees. First referenced in the 1600s by dutch sailors making fast trips to Java around Africa.

          I have provided a drag coefficient for the water to rock – 0.005. The density of seawater increases by 1.7% at 4000m so negligible difference to surface water. So my estimate of the water drag will be accurate. The depth does not matter much beyond the volume involved. The great volume means it takes a while to get it all going. The timing of the formation of the current has not been precisely determined. The range is from 47 to 17Myr ago. Irrespective of this wide range it still allows a few million years for the current to wind up to its present velocity. When you look at the energy in the water circulation, it would take the wind less than a year to get it moving close to present velocity.

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          • #
            Graeme Bird

            “The density of seawater increases by 1.7% at 4000m so negligible difference to surface water.”

            No chance at all. The density isn’t the thing. Thats just a measure of the lack of compressibility of water. Its the viscosity that counts. And that will be highly responsive to depth and pressure. As we see from the Gulf Stream versus the great ocean conveyor taken as a whole. The Gulf stream takes just a few months of water transport before it sinks beneath the Sea Of Labrador. But its got to be slow motion toothpaste from there on in, because the entire cycle takes thousands of years.

            13

          • #
            Graeme Bird

            Predominantly from the West means little in the context that its a giant circle we are talking about. For your calculations to work it would have to follow the surface of the water exactly. And that is with the most favourable of assumptions. No way you could get that beast moving with just one years wind. Ridiculous. Predominantly from the West, at one point of the “circle” means exactly what it says. It doesn’t mean nearly always circular, throughout the entirety of the current, and in the same direction of flow. In fact the wind goes mostly perpendicular to current and often against the current as explained in this video.

            https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaEcJc3JTb0

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  • #
    pat

    VIDEO: 8 Feb: Florida Times-Union: JSO: Van deliberately crashed into Republican registration tent
    By Teresa Stepzinski
    Jacksonville police said a van crashed into a Republican party tent where volunteers were registering voters Saturday afternoon.
    Jacksonville police say a driver intentionally crashed a van through a tent where Duval County GOP volunteers were registering voters Saturday afternoon.
    Nobody was injured in the 3:45 p.m. incident at the Walmart Supercenter, 11900 Atlantic Boulevard, near Kernan Boulevard in the Sandalwood neighborhood, Lt. Larry Gayle of the Jacksonville Sheriff’s Office told reporters at the scene.

    Several Duval County GOP volunteers were working at the registration tent when a white man in his early 20s driving an older — possibly 1980s — brown van pulled up toward the tent.
    He then drove through the tent, endangering the lives of the workers and damaging the tent and tables, Gayle said.
    The driver then stopped, got out of the van and took a video of the scene before he “flipped off” the victims and fled, Gayle said.
    Because the investigation was in the early stage, police didn’t know the motive…

    Gayle also said police are looking into the incident “as in reference to interruption of the political process.”…
    https://www.jacksonville.com/news/20200208/jso-van-deliberately-crashed-into-republican-registration-tent

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  • #
    pat

    8 Feb: BrisbaneTimes: ‘Fuel falls from the sky’: The solar revolution coming down the road
    by Peter Hannam
    Professor Ekins-Daukes said covering a roof and bonnet with solar cells can supply 20 kilometres of range a day, while layering the sides of a car with panels can add another third…

    Research to be presented at this week’s talk by UNSW’s Taha Rashidi also indicates consumers would be willing to pay more for solar panels to help power their cars.

    He found owners would shell out an extra $2000 for 30 kilometres of additional driving range per day from solar panels, and even more than $7000 if the solar panels came in matching colours with the vehicle…
    https://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/fuel-falls-from-the-sky-the-solar-revolution-coming-down-the-road-20200208-p53yye.html

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    • #
      Annie

      Is it April the 1st or have ‘they’ actually done this?

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    • #
      Graeme#4

      So that’s about 2 litres of petrol saving, or about $3. And the lifetimes of those $2000 solar cells would be lucky to be 10 years, most likely a lot less. And I’m presuming that he is using a more expensive EV. Very difficult to see where the savings would come from, and if you owned a Tesla, you wouldn’t be covering it with solar cells.

      20

      • #
        sophocles

        … one `big wrinkle’ from a nose-to-tail and the car would have to be `replated.’ Insurance company may not like that.

        00

  • #
    pat

    7 Feb: ClimateChangeNews: World misses symbolic February deadline to ratchet up climate action before Cop26
    The 2015 Paris Agreement seeks to raise global ambition every five years. But only three nations have issued upgraded climate plans nine months before Cop26 in Glasgow
    By Alister Doyle
    Almost all countries are set to miss a symbolic 9 February deadline to strengthen plans to fight climate change under the Paris Agreement even though the United Nations says action in 2020 is vital to avert runaway global warming…

    A little-noticed paragraph 25 in the 2015 UN decision implementing the Paris Agreement says that such climate action plans, known as Nationally Determined Contributions (NDCs), are meant to be submitted to the UN “at least 9 to 12 months in advance of the relevant session” of the Cop…
    https://www.climatechangenews.com/2020/02/07/world-misses-symbolic-february-deadline-ratchet-climate-action-cop26/

    7 Feb: Guardian: The EU’s green deal is a colossal exercise in greenwashing
    Ursula von der Leyen’s signature proposal co-opts the slogans of climate activism, but has none of the substance
    by Yanis Varoufakis and David Adler
    Yanis Varoufakis is the co-founder, and David Adler is the policy coordinator, of DiEM25 (Democracy in Europe Movement 2025)
    …the €1tn that Von der Leyen has promised across 10 years in her green deal – €100bn annually – is mostly smoke and mirrors.
    Contrary to Von der Leyen’s pledge to deliver a “green investment wave”, the green deal is largely composed of reshuffled money from existing EU funds and reheated promises to mobilise private-sector capital down the road…

    Setting aside the fact that the €100bn per annum is so far fictitious, it does not come close to the funding needed to deliver the targets. Don’t take our word for it. The commission itself estimates that Europe needs €260bn annually to achieve its 2030 climate and energy targets – more than double the amount on offer. And that was before the commission upgraded those targets last year…
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/feb/07/eu-green-deal-greenwash-ursula-von-der-leyen-climate

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      WXcycles

      Von der Leyen has promised across 10 years in her green deal – €100bn annually

      That is a criminal waste of taxpayer money by unelected power, money and agenda usurping dictatorial bureaucrats.

      Criminal

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    soldier

    From Whats up With That today – Cambridge Professor: “The only way to hit net zero [carbon] by 2050 is to stop flying”
    Suggests electric passenger planes instead.
    But 1 kg of jet fuel holds 49 times the energy of 1 kg of the best currently available battery. A Boeing 737 (small airliner) holds 20,000 litres of jet fuel. To match the equivalent fuel energy total an electric equivalent would need to hold 784,000 kg of battery – that’s 784 tonnes of battery in a plane that currently has a maximum take-off weight of 174 tonnes.
    That fact alone makes electric passenger aircraft a ridiculous proposition.

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    Bill In Oz

    The Un Australian Brainwashing Corporation ran story on bumble bees yesterday.
    It had me puzzled.
    Bumbebees are not native to Australia
    Though a small feral population exists in Tasmania..
    So where did Un ABC they get their story from ?
    I think it was from the BBC, here :
    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-51375600

    Curious thing is the BBC story is much more balanced mentioning pesticides and other factors.
    It also mentions something called “Climate Chaos ”
    Ummmmm ?
    This could be the new name for the whole Alarmist scare campaign !

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      robert rosicka

      Bill the ABC will never let facts get in the way of a climate change story .

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      Maptram

      No mention of wasps in these bee stories. I remember a documentary a few years ago about bees. Part of it was about wasps that invade beehives and steal the bee’s young. Apparently a wasp scout goes to the bee hive, but the bees smother it and create a temperature increase. Bees can tolerate a temperature about 1°C (or perhaps 1°F) higher than wasps so the scout wasp dies. So if the heat caused by climate change results in bees disappearing, then wasps will have disappeared earlier.

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    Ross

    Looks like the UK is getting a little bit of precipitation as well —a months rain (so a month in winter) in a day.

    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/02/08/storm-ciara-forecasters-warn80mph-winds-could-pose-danger-life/

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          WXcycles

          It definitely is not due to a “bomb cyclone”, it falls from 971 down to 952 hPa within 24 hours within the ECMWF forecast, only 19 hPa drop in 24 hrs. That is well short of a “bomb cyclone”.

          Midnight last light
          https://i.ibb.co/dk5Wmwp/971-h-Pa-midnight-lastnight-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted.png

          Midnight tonight (note that it has already east of the UK at that point)
          https://i.ibb.co/b5yWBBZ/952-h-Pa-midnight-tonight-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted-1.png

          Note also that the forecast says that the weather conditions will worsen AFTER it’s already off Norway, i.e. the surface low is just the beginning, its the jet that follows that provides the real weather and energy input.

          What’s actually occurring and is not being explained is the following. The low-level expression of the eastern end of this “strongest jetstream observation to date”, is contributing to the energy level and width of the surface low’s peripheral weather as it passes (as I described yesterday in detail how jets will add to existing storminess in the lower troposphere) and is amplifying it via adding the jetstream’s energy and induced disturbance to the pre-existing storminess.

          It is not one system, it’s two systems overprinting, and the jet will be the most damaging.

          30,000 k ft … Look at where the eastern end of it is …

          https://i.ibb.co/dmCpDWS/30-k-ft-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted.jpg

          2.5 k ft
          https://i.ibb.co/6DRJTxJ/2-5-k-ft-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted-1.jpg

          43 feet high ocean waves:

          https://i.ibb.co/kDXMSBT/43-ft-waves-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted.png

          Now what’s causing the huge waves? Is it the winds from the record deep jetstream flow that is reaching down to the ocean surface, or the named Low that’s now 780 km NNE of Scotland, near the Norwegian coast line?

          The surface Low alone is much too small, too far away, does not have the extended wind field needed to deliver such a national hit as it passes. The bulk of the energy is being delivered by the bottom of the jetstream, which reaches all the way to the surface, and is generating enormous seas under it, and the strong precipitation is on the northern limb of the jetstream’s path through the lower troposphere. If it were the surface Low alone doing it, its energy would be restricted to northern Scotland. The extremely strong and deep Jetstream is ALTERING the lower troposphere’s existing stormier weather and making it more aggressive over a much larger national area. And it is doing the worst of it after the named storm is over 1,000 km away (which is not a ‘bomb cyclone’).

          If this deep strong jetstream was not there the surface Low’s passing would be almost a non-event on a UK national scale, as there are several Lows just like it passing Scotland most years.

          This is the sort of thing I’ve been describing, these jets were always going to do this as they reach down towards the surface level, and they will keep doing it for as long as they are faster and dropping closer to the surface, being fed by ultra dry air.

          Like this:

          https://i.ibb.co/7SLFRsP/Humidity-Screenshot-2020-02-09-Windy-as-forecasted.png

          This is not a ‘bomb cyclone’ event, it is a jetstream event that’s amplifying the existing low-level disturbance and weather. There is another one due on the 16th of Feb that will do something similar, but not as strong.

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            el gordo

            Okay, what you are suggesting is that jet streams are driving weather. Its a scoop if you can connect meandering jet streams to a quiet sun.

            I’ll put this up for the general reader ….

            https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Explosive_cyclogenesis

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              WXcycles

              There’s a very similar setup on the 16th and 17th over the UK, preceded once again by a deepening surface Low on the NE edge of the mid-level jet flow (again not a bomb-cyclone, but you can bet the media will claims it is) as it moves over Scotland at ~403 km/h, at 30,000 ft.

              This next jet is going to be a bit weaker than the last one, but the strongest core winds are also 9,000 ft lower than the last one, so there’s still going to be amplification of the weather created by the surface Low’s passing, to the north of Scotland. Again its a national impact which follows after the low is moving away.

              The Low brings localized high winds and waves plus mostly rain. While the deep jetstream right behind it, and overprinting it to the S and SW of the Low, brings more wave energy over a much larger area for longer, same for winds, and tends to bring more snow than rain.

              Here’s what that forecast looks like for the next jet event, early on the 17th Feb 2020 (AEST):

              403 km/h over UK at 30 k ft:
              https://i.ibb.co/mXqQfYh/a-Jetstream-path-30-k-ft-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted.jpg

              403 km/h over UK at the surface:
              https://i.ibb.co/VCcS5C4/b-Amplified-surface-winds-from-the-jetstream-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted.jpg

              Cumulative Wind (next 10 days) – combined from Low and Jetstream winds:
              https://i.ibb.co/CKz0mpJ/1-Cumulative-Wind-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted-7.png

              Cumulative Rain (next 10 days) – mostly from the Low’s passage:
              https://i.ibb.co/7tT49wD/2-Cumulative-Rain-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted-6.png

              Cumulative Snow (next 10 days) – mostly from the north side of the Jetstream
              https://i.ibb.co/T1bQNL3/3-Cumulative-Snow-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted-5.png

              Waves – (more localized and extreme) from the Low’s passing:
              https://i.ibb.co/gVVTySf/4-Waves-as-the-Low-passes-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted-8.png

              Waves over larger area from the lower extremity of the Jetstream’s passage upon the surface:
              https://i.ibb.co/wQVMtgm/5-Waves-from-Jetstream-on-surface-Screenshot-2020-02-10-Windy-as-forecasted-1.png

              It’s the jet which creates the bigger secondary overprinting disturbance over a much larger area of ocean, and also land area.

              This surface weather effects vary according to these criteria:

              (1) How fast the maximum winds are and how long they last.

              (2) The altitude of the strongest jet winds (in this case it’s 30,000 ft, and 403 km/h over Scotland, but not for long).

              (3) The faster the jet is, the deeper the jet can become, until it projects into the stratosphere, but also reaches down to the surface level.

              (4) The faster and deeper the jet, the more the max core wind path tends to oscillate up and down, by as much as +/- 7,500 ft either side of its dominant core altitude.

              (5) The weather amplifying effect is going to be greatest where the lower troposphere is already disturbed by pre-existing weather systems in the area. But such jets can certainly create their own surface weather where it would otherwise be calm, especially when the core wind path is closest to the ground in its downwards oscillation.

              At which point colder air and stronger winds, with enhanced precipitation becomes more likely, and also the amplification of any pre-existing weather, towards more extreme levels.

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              WXcycles

              Okay, what you are suggesting is that jet streams are driving weather.

              Not “driving” weather Gordo, altering weather, over-printing it via adding the jet flow’s energy and extra disturbances to it.

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                WXcycles

                It’s a simple additive amplifying mechanism.

                (1) 0.0% rh stratosphere begins to sink to low levels.

                (2) All gradients between pressure systems steepen, so all intervening winds get faster – more energy to do work.

                (3) As a result all sub-tropical jets get much stronger and deeper than they otherwise would have been.

                (4) The very strongest and deepest of those mega-jets can affect down to sea level, directly, and even dive lower as well, from time to time.

                (5) What these are then enhancing at the surface was already being enhanced by (2).

                Thus a trend toward enhanced weather extremes is certain to occur for as long as (1) remains high enough in its volume per unit time, to generate (4).

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                el gordo

                Thanks, well said, but what causes the 0.0% rh stratosphere to sink?

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                WXcycles

                … but what causes the 0.0% rh stratosphere to sink?

                Already described here on Jan 28th.

                http://joannenova.com.au/2020/01/weekend-unthreaded-295/#comment-2264010

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                WXcycles

                Perhaps a cold thermosphere and shrinking atmosphere are involved.

                I’m keeping my mind open about the ultimate mechanism, I think it’s external, but that’s just my guess.

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                el gordo

                At least we know the thermosphere is moderated by the sun.

                ‘Infrared emissions from nitric oxide and carbon dioxide in Earth’s upper atmosphere, which are closely tied to incoming solar radiation, are drastically lower than in the previous solar cycle.’

                Source: Geophysical Research Letters / Eos 2019

                ——-

                While you’re there, is it normal for jet streams to go around high pressure?

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                el gordo

                The electromagnetic factor.

                https://royalsocietypublishing.org/doi/10.1098/rsta.2018.0101

                Maybe the thermosphere/ionosphere shrinks or expands with solar forcing, setting off a chain reaction. Do you know what causes the jet streams to meander?

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                Graeme Bird

                Its pretty clear that the jet stream meander is because of the electrical energy doing its best to earth. The pattern resembles those high-voltage experiments where electrical energy is transferred through the air.

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                WXcycles

                Maybe the thermosphere/ionosphere shrinks or expands with solar forcing, setting off a chain reaction.

                Well compaction is a real process at least. I don’t know what causes it, I tend to think it’s cooling in the Stratosphere itself, the lower third of it in particular, due to cumulative change to chemistry, driven by external photons/particles, presumably solar moderated. I’m too busy with watching what it’s doing to think a lot about why it finally starts to sink in volume, or stops sinking.

                Do you know what causes the jet streams to meander?

                It’s a fluid but its not entirely chaotic, geography matters, it has structure, like the extra zonal NH jet. Same for the equatorial jets, they are quasi-stable in location. As I pointed out a couple of weeks back, this dry stratosphere sinks into the northern hemisphere very different to the southern hemisphere. In the south it is mostly around the pole and in the sub tropics. But in the north hem it’s mostly falling in over the mid-latitudes and sub-tropics, due to the displacing severe wave activity in the lower stratosphere over the north polar region.

                If you look at the situation over the past 6 weeks the eastern Pacific and Atlantic basins were a train wreck of spaghetti, but it was actually a constant spaghetti. But at the same time, from Africa eastwards to the central pacific, the jets were relatively orderly and predictable.

                On a global level it is structure, not chaos, and if there were not a structure to the otherwise apparent chaos those two equatorial jets never would have emerged, nor been able to remain in place for a month.

                So I can’t buy the concept that it simply flips from zonal to meridional in a chaotic cycle. That isn’t what occurred, but it did get swollen and get much close to the equator, while the polar-jets seemed to do the general north to south leg work.

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                WXcycles

                … is it normal for jet streams to go around high pressure?

                Depends what sort of High it is. If it’s a full tropospheric depth High the jet will always by definition pass in between the subtropical High and an adjacent nearby usually polewards Low. But if the High is only in the lower-troposphere, a weaker jet may run over the top of it if there is a low above it in the upper levels.

                This is because jets only exist because air is being squeezed between a Low and a High pressure system, More squeeze means more jet.

                So major jets will never try to blow through a High. It will always go around it, both horizontally, and vertically, because the High pressure represents a resistance (akin to a ball rolling uphill, it’ll want to stop and diverge around). The air always takes the west to east path of least resistance (and of course sometimes it goes back westwards in eddies).

                The air in the jet is neither low pressure or high pressure, it’s seeking an equilibrium pressure which it’s always disturbed way from and flowing to the east. So if the pressure is accentuated by the in-falling 0.0% humidity air pumping up both highs and the cold-core lows, then the departure from equilibrium gets stronger, so it flows faster between stronger pressure systems in a vain attempt to approximate equilibrium.

                Sinking calm air with 0.0% rh stratosphere initiates major tropospheric disturbances, until it begins to approximate the properties of the air around it. As it does so the disturbance declines.

                Thus the in-falling air has to be enough per unit volume to trigger strong enough departure from a mixed ‘equilibrium’, and to maintain that departure, to sustain the stimulation of increased energy flow, as the air gradually mixes in.

                So if you have that much very dry air constantly mixing in, its also going to be decreasing the NET water vapor in the air column, thus continuous drying, increases OLR, thus drying leads to cumulative cooling from the changed energy balance.

                So there are short-term and longer-term implications to the induced disturbances what will lead to more prompt dynamic surface weather, and to prompt surface cooling, but also an OLR driven cumulative cooling that leads to a planet with slightly more ice at the end of most summer melts.

                And a colder earth with more ice also has stronger Highs, and stronger cold-core lows, so jets would tend to get a bit stronger again.

                In other words, whatever makes those jets stronger is going to create more aggressive weather more often at the surface.

                Say you have a High at 90 deg E Long and 30 deg S Lat.

                And a Low at 90 deg E Long and 60 deg S Lat

                Then the jet will be strongest at 90 E Long and 45 S Lat.

                As it is squeezed by the High and the Low it has nowhere to go but simultaneously up and down in altitude as it accelerates between them.

                So with that mental image you can see how stronger Highs and Stronger lows will inevitably lead to the mega-jets reaching the ground.

                Thus the colder the planets gets the more aggressive the surface weather must become. And it got colder because it already got dried-out thus OLR increased.

                Colder is not drier, on the contrary, drier is what makes it colder. And colder = stronger Highs, Lows and deeper jets.

                The saying, “If you’re dry you fry”, is not generally true, if there’s enough drying you both fry, and you freeze, just like in a desert.

                Thus variability increases at the very same time that the jets begin to deliver greater extremes to the surface!

                Nice huh?

                We are seeing the drying, and we are seeing jet effects at the ground, and we will see aggressive cold and heat events from here.

                Indeed, what was the dryness of the bush this Spring and Summer but just that? The IOD? Nope, it was the pink 0.0% air with ALTERED the entire lower troposphere, which also led to a late wet in Darwin. And IOD usually affects southern Australia, not Darwin and Townsville.

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                Graeme Bird

                “Well compaction is a real process at least. I don’t know what causes it, I tend to think it’s cooling in the Stratosphere itself, the lower third of it in particular, due to cumulative change to chemistry, driven by external photons/particles, presumably solar moderated. I’m too busy with watching what it’s doing to think a lot about why it finally starts to sink in volume, or stops sinking.”

                Gases in the stratosphere are all but inert with regards to each other. What kind of chemistry do you imagine could be going on? Must be a magic chemistry set in the sky. driven by external photons/particles, There goes those magic photons again. This time the magic photons are causing magic chemistry that no-one knows about.

                Epicycles, epicycles, epicycles, epicycles, epicycles. What have we done to deserve such feeble explanations?

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    David Maddison

    EXACTLY as I predicted. Don’t they ever get sick of their own made-up bull excrement?

    January 2020 hottest month globally eeevvveeerrr.

    https://www.sbs.com.au/news/january-2020-was-the-hottest-month-on-record-globally

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      PeterS

      No they will never get sick of it. In fact they thrive in it and the more BS they throw at us the more they like it. It’s only a matter of time before the public in general get sick of it and they things will become very heated (no pun intended) and fight back the elite.

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    robert rosicka

    Maybe another scientific causation correlation long bow .
    MND cases have doubled in 30 years but the population has also increased as much .

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-09/research-to-explore-blue-green-algae-and-motor-neurone-disease/11946856

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    Graeme Bird

    It was only yesterday that I figured out which way the river ran, right next to my place. I should have known or guessed that it would flow towards the coast. But there was no clue to it before Friday the 8th.
    Today the river is swollen. Some sandbags have been up in front of shops a couple of days but now all the shop-keepers are beginning to get leery. I went for a walk to the shops and the river maybe another 16 feet to go before overflowing the banks and flooding the town. On my way back it looked noticeably less than that. All the firetrucks are out now, just like they were 7 or 8 weeks ago. Our town was the sanctuary when the fires were threatening everywhere else. But our town will be the first one to flood, being as it is surrounded by hills.

    So why don’t I have a job 5 days per fortnight, digging swales for minimum wage? Why isn’t someone tapping me on the shoulder, calling me a bludger and telling me where I have to go to get things done? We have adopted the worst of both the libertarian and socialist worlds. We have this big government, outrageous public sector spending, and yet when there are things that need to be done we don’t get them done. In the 50′s we had a small government, a far more egalitarian society, yet I’m sure we were more able to respond to the needs of the day, better then we are now. BS jobs, and near useless bureaucracies, appear to have achieved something akin to eternal youth.

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    Graeme Bird

    Just got the email on my mobile phone. Flash flood alert in my town. My stuff is all safe because I’m on the second floor. Better go help the lady downstairs.

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    pat

    VIDEO: 6m08s: 7 Feb: Fox News: Rudy Giuliani predicts Trump will be ‘totally vindicated’ by ‘smoking gun’ in Hunter Biden probe: ‘We’ve got the documents’
    By Victor Garcia
    Three witnesses are ready to “name names” in an investigation into Hunter Biden and alleged Ukraine corruption, Rudy Giuliani claimed Saturday night.
    President Trump’s personal lawyer, who is a former mayor of New York City, made the disclosure during a wild interview on Fox News’ “Watters’ World.”…READ ON
    https://www.foxnews.com/media/rudy-giuliani-tells-sen-graham-to-get-started-on-the-hunter-biden-investigation

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    pat

    should have dated the Fox/Watters/Giuliani piece 8 Feb.

    heard an item on the Katanning and one other fire on ABC News Radio this morning and had a giggle when it ended with how they were happening as the State was experiencing INTENSE weather events, including Cyclone Damien, as if they were connected in some CAGW way:

    9 Feb: ABC: Bushfire destroys Katanning home as it rips through WA’s Great Southern region
    By John Dobson
    Updated about 2 hours ago
    The fire was sparked by lightning on Friday but as temperatures reached more than 40 degrees Celsius in the town yesterday, strong winds pushed the fire to emergency level…
    It was one of three major bushfires burning in the region on Saturday.
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-09/bushfire-destroys-homes-in-katanning-in-wa-south/11947824

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    pat

    enough said:

    6 Feb: ClimateChangeNews: Offshore wind deployment boom ‘too slow’ to meet EU climate target
    Europe needs between 230 and 450 GW of offshore wind by 2050 to decarbonise its energy system, according to the EU Commission
    By Frédéric Simon for Euractiv
    https://www.climatechangenews.com/2020/02/06/offshore-wind-deployment-boom-slow-meet-eu-climate-target/

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    yarpos

    Watching a climate doom show that cherry picked its way around mainly the US and found climate change everywhere (of course).

    There were some stunning examples of evidence being used overtly in the show but then just having climate change yelled over the top of it. In one they were looking at an island in Chesapeake Bay that is disappearing and displacing 500 people. In the interiew the resident said the island is sinking , to which the interviewer asserted and the ocean is rising so it is a big problem, and then only went on to talk about sea level.

    In the other they were in Houston looking at flooding , they spent 5 minutes decribing how urban growth and greed had people building in places that were identified flood zones (seems OK because Ol Joe hadnt see that in his vast 60 years on the planet). The resulting floods are of course a climate change issue and not a common sense building issue.

    The visted an native (Inuit?) coastal village in Alaska, bemoaning how erosion was destroying their home. As the story unfolds it turns out they were placed there in 1950 reservation style. Apparently and wisely it seems they lived elsewhere. But of course this is a historically bad site selection, its climate change.

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    AndyG55

    Warming would be BENEFICIAL for the global economy.

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2020/02/09/shocker-study-finds-global-warming-may-be-net-beneficial-for-the-global-economy/

    Well .. DUH !!!

    Added atmospheric CO2 is also highly BENEFICIAL to the planet.

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      PeterS

      Although true both our major parties will ignore that assessment outright. They are now committed to drastic emission reduction targets. The only difference between the two major parties is the speed at which they want to achieve it. Both want to rely on renewables at the expense of coal. So there we have it. Vote for either party and the vote is in support of the CAGW scam.

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    Furiously curious

    Looking around to see what I could see about jet streams, and came across this, where they claim they are using new technology for mapping. It looks pretty similar to what you’re using WXcycles, so it maybe old hat? Anyway.

    https://www.netweather.tv/charts-and-data/global-jetstream#2020/02/09/1800Z/jetstream/surface/level/overlay=jetstream/orthographic=-6.72,57.59,712

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    PeterS

    Liberal MP Dave Sharma exposes on Sky News the LNP as a whole, despite some dissenters, is committed to reducing emissions by moving towards more and more renewables, and against supporting new coal or nuclear power stations. He wants us to be like the UK where reducing emissions to 0% has bipartisan support. The hypocrisy though is the UK relies a lot on nuclear so it’s so easy for them to reach a 0% target. We on the other hand would have to close down all our coal and gas fired power stations to reach a 0% target, which would be a disaster without nuclear. Our politicians just don’t get it. IMHO we have the worst or pretty close to the worst in the whole world. They are thick as a brick on both sides.

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      pat

      PeterS –

      you beat me to it.
      yesterday I posted – comment #35 -

      7 Feb: ClimateChangeNews: World misses symbolic February deadline to ratchet up climate action before Cop26
      But only three nations have issued upgraded climate plans nine months before Cop26 in Glasgow…
      Almost all countries are set to miss a symbolic 9 February deadline…

      little did I know:

      9 Feb: SMH: Australia will take new emissions reduction target to Glasgow climate summit
      By Rob Harris
      Australia will take a new long-term emissions reduction target to November’s UN climate summit, as the Morrison government weighs up whether to join more than 80 countries to commit to net zero carbon emissions by 2050.
      A review into the potential economic impacts of adopting the goal will be finalised later this year in time for the Glasgow summit, as a growing number of Liberal MPs speak out on the need for the Coalition government to adopt more-ambitious climate policies…

      Federal Energy and Emissions Reduction Minister Angus Taylor told The Age and the Sydney Morning Herald the government would settle on its 2050 strategy before Glasgow, which has been billed as the most-critical meeting since Paris five years ago.
      “The government expects to deliver a long-term emissions reduction strategy before COP26 (the Glasgow summit),” Mr Taylor said…

      While Nationals MPs Barnaby Joyce, George Christensen, David Gillespie and former minister Matt Canavan have called for greater support for the coal industry, a group of Liberals including Tim Wilson, Katie Allen, Fiona Martin, Trent Zimmerman and John Alexander warned their constituents wanted greater action.
      Independent MP Zali Steggall, who deposed former prime minister Tony Abbott on a platform of climate action last May, will on Monday seek support from a number of disaffected Liberal MPs following two months of devastating bushfires and smoke-choked capital cities…READ ON
      https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/australia-will-take-new-emissions-reduction-target-to-glasgow-climate-summit-20200209-p53z4b.html

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        pat

        10 Feb: SBS: Australia is considering adopting a net-zero carbon emissions target by 2050
        Australia will discuss adopting a net-zero carbon emissions target by 2050, in line with the United Kingdom
        Updated 1 hour ago by AAP/SBS
        LINK: Sir David Attenborough hits out at Australia’s climate platform amid global ‘moment of crisis’

        Finance Minister Mathias Cormann said coal still had a future in Australia but renewable energy supplies would continue to grow.
        “We’re assessing what is both environmentally appropriate and economically responsible,” Senator Cormann said…

        Nationals MP Michelle Landry said Australia needed cheap, reliable power for the manufacturing sector.
        “That’s what this (strategy) is about,” Ms Landry told reporters…
        “What does annoy me is that there are people in Melbourne who are dead against coal, but where does the power come from?”
        Inner-city Liberals are agitating for more government action on climate change…

        But former resources minister Matt Canavan is ramping up calls for a new coal-fired power station in Queensland

        Senator Canavan described renewable energy providers as dole bludgers.
        “Renewables are the dole bludgers of the energy system, they only turn up to work when they want to,” he wrote in an opinion piece for the Courier-Mail…
        https://www.sbs.com.au/news/australia-is-considering-adopting-a-net-zero-carbon-emissions-target-by-2050

        behind paywall:

        BCA plots path to zero emissions
        The Australian – 9 Feb 2020
        The lobby group for the nation’s biggest companies is on a collision course with the Morrison government over climate…
        The BCA has been sandwiched between climate progressives and conservatives in … to help the BCA secretariat with the project, is understood to have been sent last week to the Business Council of Australia’s 130 members…

        TWEET: Clover Moore
        BREAKING: We’re bringing our net zero emissions target forward a decade, from 2050 to 2040!
        The accelerated target will form part of the City’s new strategic plan, Sustainable Sydney 2050 – it’s our responsibility to do all we can to reduce emissions steeper and sooner
        5 Feb 2020
        (follow-up) It’s not going to be easy, but while the Federal Governments continue to fail us, we will be getting on with the job of responding to the climate emergency…
        https://twitter.com/CloverMoore/status/1225311668919341056

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          Kalm Keith

          Didn’t she, used to be, the Mayor of old Sydney town?

          How come she’s working for the United Nations.

          KK

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          PeterS

          Well if they want to continue reducing our emissions then we need to vote for a party that supports nuclear because frankly it’s the only way to achieve it in a reasonable amount of time. Just relaying on renewables to reach 50% let alone 0% emissions is impossible without destroying what’s left of our industries, including agriculture.

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            pat

            thought the “climate election” was lost! think again, as you note the fibs:

            10 Feb: Australian: Politics Now: Crossbenchers support Zali Steggall climate bill
            By Various
            Crossbench MPs have come out in support of Independent Zali Steggall’s planned climate action bill…
            “I have long advocated for effective action on climate change and believe that dealing with it should be the first priority for the Federal Parliament,” Independent MP Andrew Wilkie said when announcing his support for the bill.
            “Indeed the Parliament must stop treating climate change as a political plaything and start representing the community, starting with a credible plan to achieve zero net carbon emissions and 100% renewable energy.”
            “Frankly people are already suffering and dying from climate change and any politician and political party that fails to advocate the strongest possible response is complicit.” Mr Wilkie said.

            Fellow independent Helen Haines said of the bill: “This is our opportunity, this is an opportunity for rural and regional Australia”.
            “This is a chance for us to enhance the work that’s already happening with solar with wind and potentially with hydrogen.”
            Centre Alliance MP Rebekha Sharkie also appeared with independent MPs pledging their support…

            Zimmerman speaks for net zero emissions
            Liberal MP Trent Zimmerman has said his government “needs to seriously consider” committing to net zero carbon emissions by 2050.
            The North Sydney MP’s also agreed with comments from fellow moderate Liberal Dave Sharma who said he doesn’t think the government should use taxpayer funds to underwrite new coal-fired power stations after the government commissioned a feasibility study into a proposed coal-fired power station in Queensland.
            “We are doing a feasibility study. We have made no commitment,” Mr Zimmerman said on Sky News.
            “We have no commitment to fund a coal fired power station and I don’t think we should.”
            “From my perspective, it’s not the business of the Commonwealth government to be building or funding coal fired power stations.
            “I don’t think we should be funding coal fired power stations it’s not the job of the Commonwealth government. It’s up to the private sector. It’s up to the Queensland Government who has responsibility for doing the type of planning.” he said.

            Regarding a commitment to net zero carbon emissions by 2050, he said:
            “I think it’s something that we need to seriously consider,” Mr Zimmerman said in relation to reports his government is weighing up joining more than 80 other countries and commit to net zero carbon emissions at a UN climate summit in Glasgow in November.
            “I think that is an opportunity for us to outline our strategies and our targets beyond 2030.”
            “We need to do the due diligence and we need to work out how we get there. I think it’s very easy to say yes,” he said.

            ‘Taxpayers shouldn’t fund new power stations’
            Liberal MP Dave Sharma has said he doesn’t think the government should use taxpayer funds to underwrite new coal-fired power stations
            However the MP for the inner Sydney seat of Wentworth said there was a case for using public funds to extend the life of existing coal-fired power assets, and that private investment could still fund new coal-fired power stations.
            “I can’t see us being in a position where the government is underwriting a new coal fired power station,” Mr Sharma told Sky News.
            “Certainly there’s a case to be made and I support it for extending the life of existing coal fired power assets, and if the private sector wants to come in and do this well this is a different proposition, but I don’t think the government should be in the position of doing this.” he said.
            Mr Sharma also noted the issue was contentions within the National Party with many politicians holding a different view on subsidisation of the industry after the government commissioned a feasibility study into a proposed coal-fired power generator near Collinsville in Queensland.
            “I respect the right of any member of parliament to represent the views of their constituency that’s what they’re here for that’s their job,”
            “I’m not discouraged by this debate I’m not discouraged by differences of views.
            “I certainly expect the same level of respect and I certainly don’t hesitate on putting forward the views of my electorate and my constituency as well.” Mr Sharma said.

            ***‘Committed to net zero target for the world’
            Trade Minister Simon Birmingham says Australia is already committed to a net zero carbon emissions target “for the world” by 2050, and that the Morrison Government is able to “update” its commitments beyond 2030.
            Reports have emerged this morning that the Morrison Government is considering a UK-style net zero target by 2050, and will make a decision by the Glasgow climate change summit at the end of the year.
            Senator Birmingham on Monday said that the government is already working towards a net zero target and will “meet and beat” the 2030 targets.
            “In signing onto the Paris Agreement, Australia has committed to a net zero target for the world by the second half of this century,” he told Sky News.
            “And we have to work towards that, and we do that in the bite-size pieces that we can achieve to 2030. My expectations is that we not just meet but beat those commitments.
            “That’s why we outline these plans. They enable us to update commitments, and then indeed to look further into the future as what those commitments can be beyond 2030.”

            Birmingham lashes Canavan on renewables
            Trade Minister Simon Birmingham has slapped down his former cabinet colleague Matt Canvan for calling renewables the “dole bludgers” of the energy sector.
            Senator Birmingham – the government’s leading Liberal moderate – said on Monday that renewables were competitive, popular with Australians and a key part of the Morrison government’s climate action policies.
            “No, renewables are a crucial part of our new technology mix,” he told Sky News.
            “They are highly competitive in many parts of the world and Australians have chosen to vote with their feet in terms of endorsing the placement of solar panels on their rooftops.
            “More generally, large opportunities for renewables to fuel new technologies like hydrogen in the future.
            “He can comment for himself, I’ve got no doubt. The government’s policies are to take a technology-neutral approach that focuses on how we achieve emission reductions.”…

            Steggall – Lock zero emissions in
            Ms Steggall said: “It’s time the federal government got in step with the rest of Australia.
            “I do have a question for the Prime Minister, what is the cost of climate impacts? Because we’re seeing huge amounts wiped off at the moment in terms of our tourism, in terms of the economy when it comes to the bushfires and the impacts.
            “We’ve had businesses shut because of air pollution. We have drought ravaging regional Australia. So let’s get real about the question that needs to be asked here.
            What is the cost of climate impacts to Australia?” she said…
            https://www.theaustralian.com.au/nation/politics/nationals-turmoil-overshadows-joko-widodo-visit/news-story/630f120e8a6f90049daef739072882df

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              pat

              10 Feb: Canberra Times: The world won’t reach zero emissions by 2050 if Australia doesn’t: Ross Garnaut
              by Doug Dingwall
              The author of the landmark 2008 climate change review has expressed support for the carbon reduction target set in independent MP Zali Steggall’s climate change bill.
              Australia would transform itself from a “laggard” to a full participant in the global effort to minimise temperature rises if it committed to zero emissions by 2050, Professor Garnaut said.
              “We can be quite sure that the world won’t get to zero by 2050 if Australia doesn’t get there,” he said.
              “At the moment we’re a laggard and so we’re making it less likely that the world will get there.
              “Australians should not underestimate the effect it would have on the global effort from moving from being a laggard to being a full or leading participant in the global effort.
              “We are not a country without influence in international affairs.”

              In a comment piece written exclusively for Australian Community Media, Professor Garnaut said Australia would have to finish faster and earlier if it started slowly on reaching the target by 2050…
              The reduction in emissions to zero by that year could minimise global temperature rises to 1.75 per cent above pre-industrial levels.
              “If the world doesn’t get to zero by 2050, then the temperature increase is going to be bigger than that,” Professor Garnaut said…
              https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6621463/the-world-wont-reach-zero-emissions-by-2050-if-australia-doesnt-ross-garnaut/

              ?????

              10 Feb: Canberra Times: It’s time to get serious on zero emissions nationally by 2050
              by Ross Garnaut
              (Ross Garnaut is Professor of Economics at the University of Melbourne and the author of Superpower: Australia’s Low Carbon Opportunity)
              This has been a hard summer of heat, smoke, dust, dry river beds and empty dams. It has increased Australians’ awareness of our vulnerability to climate change.
              Climate change makes the normal variability of Australian weather happen around rising temperatures and, in the southern latitudes, falling average rainfall. Bad bushfire summers are worse than bad seasons used to be. Bad years in the Murray Darling are worse than they used to be. The science has been telling us since and before my 2008 Climate Change Review that bad seasons will keep on getting worse until the world has zero net emissions. The science has been right…

              Does it matter what Australia does, if we account for only about 1.25 percent of global emissions? It matters morally that we do our full share, as Pope Francis makes clear in his authoritative letter. It matters because we always want to pull our weight on the great issues affecting our security…

              Australia is the best placed of all countries to prosper in a zero carbon world economy – just as we are the most vulnerable to global climate policy failure.
              https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6621405/why-zero-emissions-by-2050-is-achievable/

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              • #
                el gordo

                The power of one, MP Llew O’Brien quits party.

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              • #
                Robber

                Can anyone present a workable scenario for Australia continuing to exist with zero emissions?

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              • #
                hatband

                Can anyone present a workable scenario for Australia continuing to exist with zero emissions?

                Sure.
                It’ll be a Black Market economy, culturally criminal,
                where everything will be permitted, for a price, and the rewards for Service suppliers will be commensurate
                with the risk involved in staying one step ahead of the Government enforcement squads.

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            • #
              PeterS

              I’m coming to the conclusion Morrison is a phoney or at least a chameleon who is willing to do and say anything to help him win the next election. Otherwise, why would he still be committed to the Paris Agreement and keep beating his chest and exclaiming how good he is for meeting and beating the emission target? Also why remain committed building the wasteful Snowy 2.0? My guess is he will come out with a lower emission target without worrying about the consequences of reaching it using just renewables. Perhaps he thinks it won’t be his problem down the road as the retires. Perhaps he will surprise us all and he will much later come out with a plan to go nuclear to make the target easily achievable with he least amount of pain. One thing is for sure. Emission reductions are here to stay and more are to come.

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              Kalm Keith

              It’s amazing what well funded pressure groups can do to distort rational, fundamental science and ethical behaviour.

              Get elected, at any cost.

              KK

              10

              • #
                PeterS

                Happens all the time. If only more people were willing to spend the time and effort to do their own research. Alas that’s not the case.

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    Jo’s “On Cue” post has been reprinted on CFACT:
    https://www.cfact.org/2020/02/09/on-cue-after-droughts-and-fires-then-come-the-floods/

    But the 100+ comments are atrocious, as usual, pure troll junk having nothing to do with the article. This is why I comment here, not there, even though I publish my articles there. Boy am I thankful for Jo’s blog!

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    pat

    VIDEO: 50sec Trailer: 9 Feb: 9Now: 60 Minutes: US climatologist flags ‘unimaginable climate crisis’ after Australia’s ‘summer of fire’
    By Sammi Taylor
    Professor Michael E. Mann, a renowned climatologist from Pennsylvania State University, says this bushfire season in Australia is not only catastrophic – it’s unprecedented.
    But alarmingly, Prof Mann predicts that future fire seasons will be even worse.
    “(Fires) will become more intense, they become faster spreading, they become more extensive,” he said.

    He made his comments to 60 Minutes reporter Tara Brown after observing what he described as the most profound bout of extreme weather Australia has ever experienced.
    “When you turn the entire continent or large parts of it into a tinderbox, there’s really no amount of fire suppression or backburning that’s going to get you out of the problem,” he says.
    “People ask me, is this a new normal for Australia? It’s worse than that.”

    Prof Mann tells 60 Minutes that numerous warnings – including a damning 2009 prediction of a “doomsday year” that would occur in 2020 – have been ignored.
    Continued climate inaction from the Australian government should be of urgent concern, he says.
    Things are worse than was predicted just a decade ago,” he says.
    “We’ve already seen what one degree warming does to Australia, imagine four degrees of warming.”

    This Sunday, 60 Minutes brings together a fire “council of war” – including Professor Mann, former Victorian Fire Commissioner Craig Lapsley, retired Army Major General Peter Dunn and the federal Member for New England, Barnaby Joyce.
    It comes after the country has suffered through a truly tragic summer, with record high temperatures and a once-unimaginable number of mega-blazes burning across Australia…
    https://9now.nine.com.au/60-minutes/us-climatologist-flags-unimaginable-climate-crisis/c09eec79-30de-4972-97be-c9c4cda0401b

    TWEET: Ryan Fitzgerald
    Wow @60Mins is very powerful tonight. Barnaby Joyce representing the deniers. It’s just so draining to watch fact after fact being presented to them and the refusal to listen. So extremely frustrating
    9 Feb 2020
    https://twitter.com/FitzySA/status/1226447885828378625

    TWEET: Queen Victoria
    Andrew Bolt admits skeptics can’t ‘go on like this’ and have to change their views based on facts because of the bushfires. Was not expecting to see this today. Was not expecting to see it ever!
    PIC Bolt column?
    9 Feb 2020

    from replies: debbiep
    Be very skeptical. It could be a game plan to try & win back some readership or viewers. As they see their gobbly gook isn’t working. Personally I won’t give it the attention Bolt is seeking. They would/will play both sides to gain back audiences .
    9 Feb 2020

    cbrGeek:
    Nothing different to what he was parroting two weeks or two months ago about the “benefits” of global warming.
    10 Feb 2020

    (scroll down for excerpts from Bolt’s column in reply frrom rog)
    https://twitter.com/Vic_Rollison/status/1226596413850542081

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      pat

      sign in or log in – I’m doing neither:

      VIDEO: 4m38s: 9Now: 60 Minutes: Can Australia ditch coal for a renewable future?
      The 60 Minutes War Room, including Former Victorian Fire Commissioner Craig Lapsley, Major General Peter Dunn, US Climatologist Michael E. Mann and Australian politician Barnaby Joyce, debate Australia’s reliance on coal exports and if the key to the country’s future could be renewable energy
      https://www.9now.com.au/60-minutes/2020/clip-ck6esvt5h001m0hp7w4wsaejd

      TWEET: 60 Minutes Australia
      “Let’s be a nation of leaders. Let’s be the leaders of the globe.” Former Victorian Fire Commissioner Craig Lapsley tells #60Mins that now is the time to act…

      from replies:
      Tony Windsor, Independent, New England
      “ Let’s be a nation of leaders”…spot on but what about Dumbo sitting next to you!

      ken cha_OzVeteransVote
      @coolrunning2009
      #AustraliaOnFire
      @60mins showed how ill prepared @BarnabyJoyceLNP was & during brain snap he stated “if you say climate change needs action, we’d [#coalition] never get elected” which showed, it’s not about science, it’s just political expediency
      @MichaelEMann & panel did well pic.twitter.com/eYlhJcj5f5
      9 Feb 2020
      https://www.trendsmap.com/twitter/tweet/1226450982613078016

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    pat

    thankfully, I never watch this program. many more excerpts at the link:

    10 Feb: Daily Mail: Barnaby Joyce lets fly during heated debate over coal and bushfires as climate expert tells him Australia faces ‘unimaginable’ blaze seasons ‘far worse’ than current horror season
    •The heated discussion took place on a 60 Minutes panel with former fire chiefs
    •Joyce said fires aren’t going to be put out by ‘having a debate in Canberra’
    •US climatologist Professor Michael Mann said the government needs to do more
    •He said Coalition ignored the connection between climate change and bushfires
    •Mann said there’s politicians ‘sabotaging climate action for the entire planet’
    By Alana Mazzoni
    But when asked if he accepted that the fires have been driven by global warming, Joyce admitted climate change had played a role.
    ‘I can absolutely accept that we’ve had a massive change in the climate. That is not my argument. My argument is one of immediate efficacy,’ he said.
    ‘We’re going to put back into our fire breaks, we’re going to make sure we build central watering points so that no [fire] truck has to travel more than 20km.
    ‘These are the things that I want to concentrate on.’ …
    Mr Joyce argued Australia has complied with international agreements.
    ‘No that’s not true,’ Prof Mann responded…
    Mr Joyce then went on to spruik the importance of exporting coal, and noted it’s one of Australia’s biggest exports next to iron ore.
    ‘Therefore the money that comes from that – whether you like it or not – supports our hospitals, our schools, our defence force,’ he said.
    ‘[We aren't going to] say to the Australian people “we’re going to get rid of that income stream and you’ve got to accept that this money is not going to turn up”.
    ‘And I’ll tell you what happens in politics if you do that – you lose the election.’…

    Prof Mann said there are a number of politicians around the world who are ‘basically sabotaging climate action for the entire planet’.
    ‘You can count [these countries] on the fingers of your hand. It’s Saudi Arabia, it’s Russia, it’s the United States and Brazil. Does Australia want to be part of that family?’
    But Joyce said Australians will lose their ‘dignity’ if Australia’s economy becomes weakened if it stops exporting coal.
    ‘If you want to sell this program, you have to say to [the Australian people] how you’re going to make their lives more affordable and put dignity back into their lives,’ he said.

    His remarks angered retired Army General Major General Peter Dunn, who then went toe-to-toe with the former deputy prime minister…

    Prof Mann said the effects of climate change are ‘actually worse than we predicted’…

    Former Victorian Fire Commissioner Craig Lapsley advised climate change deniers to ‘go to the science’…
    Maj Gen Dunn, who lives in bushfire-ravaged Conjola on the NSW south coast, echoed Prof Munn’s sentiments.
    ‘What happened here? It was like a nuclear explosion. It was terrifying. It’s a monster,’ he said…
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-7983497/Climate-expert-predicts-unimaginable-fire-crises-future-seasons-summer-hell.html

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      Chad

      As prediced, not much of a debate…3 CAGW converts , vs one uninformed Politician !
      Lots of posturing, not much real discussion or answers
      Why didnt they have Lomborg on ..or jo….someone with some facts !

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    pat

    on Sky, News Political Editor Andrew Clennell is saying Angus Taylor plan to keep Liddell Power plant open til 2026 is in trouble. some draft report says $300m needed and AGL doesn’t want to pay it.

    concerns also that keeping it open might create problems for the grid or something to that effect.

    really & truly, today’s news is looking like the final push for the CAGW mob.

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    pat

    Sky’s Kieran Gilbert, just following up with segment, featuring Malcolm Turnbull, rejecting call for more coal fired plants. insults as usual.

    Joel Fitzgibbon, Labor, now on to discuss Liddell news with Gilbert. Joel’s not surprised. it’s not possible to keep the old girl going until 2026. and it would not be efficient/reliable etc.

    even with Govt subsidy, Gilbert says, task force says it still would not be reliable/efficient etc etc.

    Fitzgibbon doesn’t even support the few million being allocated towards a feasibility study for a new coal-fired plant.

    it’s clear, Gilbert/Sky/Turnbull/Labor are fully on board with the anti-coal CAGW program.

    Gilbert is sickening.

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    pat

    just saw comment on former Pickering Post that Sky as been full-on CAGW all day. I just turned it on at 1pm Qld time and caught what was obviously a staged segment re Liddell.

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    • #
      el gordo

      What do you make of it? If we lose Sky, the game is up for us.

      There is seething revolution brewing, Barnaby is going for another tilt at McCormack.

      Michael McCormack, Scott Morrison humiliated as Llew O’Brien gets deputy speaker job.

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      • #
        hatband

        Joyce was in the same position when he was Leader that McCormack is in now, to wit, the LNP MPs holding on to Hinkler, Flynn, Capricornia, and Dawson, all strong Labor areas in State politics, haven’t been rewarded as they perhaps should, since they saved the Government in 2016 and again last year.

        As others noted at the time, the issue is life and death for Joyce.
        So, how’s he going to solve it?
        If Morrison is going to increase the Ministry to accommodate a few more Nationals once Joyce gets his job back, why can’t he do it now and get McCormack off the hook?

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    pat

    what next?

    9 Feb: UK Independent: ‘Hemisphere-wide implications’: Nasa warns temperatures in Europe could plunge if Arctic warming causes major ocean current to reverse
    Massive buildup of freshwater could be released into Atlantic, disrupting currents that keep western Europe warm
    by Harry Cockburn
    A major ocean current in the Arctic could reverse amid warming temperatures, a change which would bring significantly colder weather to western Europe, scientists at Nasa have warned.

    The circular current, called the Beaufort Gyre, moves in a clockwise direction around the western Arctic Ocean, north of Canada and Alaska, where it naturally collects freshwater from glacial melt, river run-off and precipitation.
    This freshwater protects sea ice from salty water which would melt it faster, and helps keep the north of the planet cool.

    Since the 1990s, the gyre has accumulated a large volume of freshwater – 1,920 cubic miles (8,000 cubic km) – or almost twice the volume of Lake Michigan in the US.

    The new study, published in Nature Communications (LINK), found the cause of this gain in freshwater concentration is the loss of sea ice in summer and autumn…
    https://www.independent.co.uk/environment/climate-crisis-temperature-europe-arctic-warming-nasa-a9325011.html

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    pat

    UK Spectator pretty much all-in, but for a few details!

    8 Feb: UK Spectator Leader: Boris must have the courage to spell out the true cost of ‘net zero’
    The Climate Change Committee, which drew up the net zero plan, spells out what it would mean. New homes should stop being connected to the gas grid within five years, tree planting must treble, farmers should give one field in five back to nature. And the cost? The Committee is, again, admirably candid: between 1 per cent and 2 per cent of economic output, which works out as £20 billion to £40 billion a year. This is the equivalent of an HS2 every three to five years. But while high-speed rail has been subject to several feasibility reviews to ensure the right plans are in place, the ‘net zero’ target has not been fully scrutinised.

    If the Prime Minister intends to position Britain as a global leader in a ‘net zero’ project, using the chairmanship of the COP26 to rally others, then he ought to have the courage to spell out the implications. Does he agree with cost estimates? He won’t say. If he’s serious about the 2035 electric car target, how does he plan to equip Britain with enough charging points? Are there plans in place to build an energy grid large enough to power the nation’s electric cars? There is no answer.

    Perhaps this is because, as Emmanuel Macron has found, the answers do not always go down very well…

    Polls show significant support for ambitious environmental targets. The public is ready for a serious conversation about exactly what’s needed to achieve them; the Prime Minister must join the debate.
    https://www.spectator.co.uk/2020/02/boris-must-have-the-courage-to-spell-out-the-true-cost-of-net-zero/amp/

    behind paywall:

    8 Feb: UK Telegraph: Gas boilers could be banned from all homes to ensure the UK meets carbon neutral target by 2050
    Government to publish White Paper setting out ‘bigger decisions’ that UK has to make to meet the target
    By Christopher Hope, Chief Political Correspondent
    The Government will publish a White Paper later this year which will set out the “bigger decisions” that the UK has to make to meet the target.
    Lord Duncan of Springbank, the Climate Change minister, said that the White Paper will consider whether the Government should ban gas central heating altogether from all homes

    It is not clear if homeowners will have to pay for this new strategy – which is planned to be introduced incrementally over the next decade – and whether there are enough plumbers to carry out the work.

    It comes after Ofgem, the gas regulator, said last week that Britain will have to change “the way homes and businesses are heated” to ensure the UK can hit its target….
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2020/02/08/homeowners-could-forced-replace-gas-boilers-ensure-uk-meets/

    9 Feb: UK Times: End of the energy start-up frenzy as 86 licences revoked
    A total of 86 energy supply licences have been revoked since last summer while not a single new licence has been granted, Ofgem has revealed…
    Ofgem, the regulator, has spent years trying to encourage new suppliers to break the stranglehold of the big six — British Gas, EDF, Eon, Npower, Scottish Power and SSE — which once supplied more than 98% of households.
    This liberal regime led to a flood of licences awarded to new suppliers. However, The Sunday Times revealed that some were set up from residential addresses and had few, if any, customers. There was also a spate of collapses of small suppliers that could not afford to compete in the market…

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    pat

    7 Feb: BBC: What happens to all the old wind turbines?
    By Padraig Belton
    Welcome to the wind turbine graveyard. It stretches a hundred metres from a bend in the North Platte River in Casper, Wyoming.
    Between last September and this March, it will become the final resting place for 1,000 fibreglass turbine blades…
    Turbines from the first great 1990s wave of wind power are reaching the end of their life expectancy today. About two gigawatts worth of turbines will be refitted in 2019 and 2020. And disposing of them in an environmentally-friendly way is a growing problem…READ ON FOR OPTIONS
    https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-51325101

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    pat

    5 Feb: CambridgeshireLiveUK: ‘The only solution for climate change is letting the human race become extinct’
    Anglia Ruskin professor Patricia MacCormack has written a controversial book on how our extinction could save the planet
    By Alistair Ryder
    ***PIC: Patricia MacCormack

    Patricia MacCormack, a professor of continental philosophy at Anglia Ruskin University, has just released her new book The Ahuman Manifesto, which will officially be launched in Cambridge today (Wednesday, February 5).
    The book argues that due to the damage done to other living creatures on Earth, we should start gradually phasing out reproduction. But rather than offering a bleak look at the future of humanity, it has generated discussion due to its joyful and optimistic tone, as it sets out a positive view for the future of Earth – without mankind.

    It also touches on several hot-button topics, from religion and veganism to the concept of identity politics, tying these into how the creation of a hierarchal world among humans has left us blind to the destruction we are causing to our habitat and other forms of life.
    Speaking to CambridgeshireLive, Professor MacCormack outlined how she came to this point of view, and how these ideas are not as provocative as they may initially sound…READ ON
    https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/cambridge-professor-thinks-should-human-17684215

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    pat

    an Oscar for Obama’s company’s “first release” no less:

    9 Feb: US24News: Oscars Go COMMUNIST: Winning Producer Quotes KARL MARX…And Obama Praises Her
    by Lynn Foster
    “The Communist Manifesto” got a shoutout during the 2020 Oscars.
    Julia Reichert, the co-director of best documentary winner “American Factory,” which was produced by former President Barack Obama’s new film company, apparently quoted from Karl Marx and Friedrich Engels’ infamous book during her acceptance speech on Sunday night.
    “Working people have it harder and harder these days — and we believe that things will get better when workers of the world unite,” Reichert said.
    The quote was a riff on the last lines of the 1848 political document, which are frequently translated from German as “Workers of the world, unite. You have nothing to lose but your chains!”
    The quote was also famously one of the official mottos of the Soviet Union before its fall…

    Netflix’s “American Factory” comes from Higher Ground, the production company of the former president and his wife Michelle Obama. It tells the story of a Chinese company occupying a shuttered General Motors plant in Moraine, Ohio.
    “Congrats to Julia and Steven [Bognar], the filmmakers behind American Factory for telling such a complex, moving story about the very human consequences of wrenching economic change,” Barack Obama tweeted following the win.
    “Glad to see two talented and downright good people take home the Oscar for Higher Ground’s first release.”…

    But there’s also a dark secret behind the “documentary”. According to Breitbart, Former President Obama played a direct role in the hardships of the workers featured in American Factory.

    But the so-called “documentary” doesn’t even mention this!
    Rep. Mike Turner (R-OH), the former mayor of nearby Dayton, Ohio, wrote last year, the movie leaves out President Obama’s own role in making life worse for the GM workers who lost their jobs…READ ON
    https://us24news.com/blog/2020/02/10/oscars-go-communist-winning-producer-quotes-karl-marx-and-obama-praises-her/

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    pat

    AGL wind and solar ads playing in the breaks in Andrew Bolt’s Sky program.

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    pat

    AUDIO: 7m02s: 10 Feb: 2GB: Graham Richardson slams Malcolm Turnbull’s ‘dangerous’ views on coal
    Ben Fordham Show
    The former prime minister told media today there is “no economic reason” to invest in coal infrastructure, and to advocate otherwise is “nuts”.
    But Mr Richardson tells Ben Fordham the Liberal Party will no longer listen to Mr Turnbull.
    “The last time they did that they followed him into hell, they won’t follow him again.
    “For those people who say [coal doesn’t have a future] I think that their views are dangerous.
    “If we were to abolish coal… we will condemn ourselves to poverty and I can’t understand why we would want to do that.”
    https://www.2gb.com/graham-richardson-slams-malcolm-turnbulls-dangerous-views-on-coal/

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    pat

    Security experts warn of military threat from Chinese marine …
    The Australian – 20 hours ago
    Strategic experts have expressed alarm at a CSIRO partnership with a top Chinese marine science institute that undertakes military-related …
    It is headed by CSIRO chief research scientist Cai Wenju, who is also a professor at the Qingdao laboratory, which leads China’s “Transparent Ocean”…
    Cost of new subs blows out to $225bn|Australia…

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    el gordo

    Antarctic Peninsula shows cooling trend since turn of the century.

    https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0048969716327152

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    pat

    former editor of SMH, Amanda Wilson, on Chris Kenny on Media (Sky) tonite said words to the effect Barnaby Joyce was never going to be able to compete with the world’s most famous climate scientist on 60 Minutes. said she goes along with the bushfires being the “unprecedented” because the Australian Academy of Science said so. Kenny tried to convince her she should look at the data, but that didn’t impress her:

    3 Feb: Australian Academy of Science: The Australian bushfires—why they are unprecedented
    VIDEO: 3m34s: At least a billion animals killed in bushfires (Prof Chris Dickman, etc)
    In a statement on the Australian bushfires (LINK) published on 10 January 2020, the President of the Australian Academy of Science, Professor John Shine, stated that ‘the scale of these bushfires is unprecedented anywhere in the world’…

    In terms of hectares burnt the Australian fires are the largest to affect any of the megadiverse countries—that is, larger than the 2019 Amazon and 2019 Californian fires.

    Fires of greater geographical extent have occurred in Australia in the past (e.g. fires in central Australia in 1974-75 covered over 100 million hectares). However, these fires burned largely the grasslands of inland Australia. Unlike forest fires these grassland fires are less intense and the ecosystems can more rapidly recover. Also, there is far lower economic impacts or loss of life because these fires occur in vast remote landscapes.

    Australian Academy of Science Fellow Professor Chris Dickman has estimated (LINK) that Australia has lost at least a billion birds, mammals and reptiles this bushfire season. This figure does not include insects, bats, fish and frogs…

    The combination of a number of other factors also make this fire unprecedented in Australia’s history. These include:
    •the intensity of the fires early in Australia’s fire season
    •current dry, warm and windy conditions
    •unusual fire behaviour
    •the indirect and direct impact on Australia’s environment, including greenhouse gas emissions and severe air pollution across population centres.
    https://www.science.org.au/news-and-events/news-and-media-releases/australian-bushfires-why-they-are-unprecedented

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    pat

    Pete Buttigieg was on something like six Sunday TV talk shows yesterday; White House officials were on none.

    9 Feb: Las Vegas Review Journal: Nevada Democratic Party’s hiring of Buttigieg ex-staffer raises concerns
    By Rory Appleton
    The hiring of a top presidential candidate’s staff member to a position within the Nevada Democratic Party has increased scrutiny of the party as it works to put together a contingency plan for its Feb. 22 caucuses.

    Dozens of Twitter users — most identified as supporters of Sen. Bernie Sanders — on Sunday accused the Democratic Party of corruption and hurled insults at Emily Goldman, who was hired as the party’s Voter Protection Director in January. Many called for Goldman and Democratic National Committee Chairman Tom Perez to be fired…READ ON
    https://www.reviewjournal.com/news/politics-and-government/nevada-democratic-partys-hiring-of-buttigieg-ex-staffer-raises-concerns-1954425/

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    pat

    apparently, Ita Buttrose will meet the PM in Canberra tomorrow to beg for more money for theirABC because they had to spend the money they had in order to cover the bushfires & other emergencies!

    excerpts found, in no particular order:

    Mathias Cormann, Malcolm Turnbull and the resignation that never came
    The Australian – 10 Feb 2020
    Diary is told Buttrose will summon all her considerable diplomatic and … We hear she’ll (Buttrose) tell the PM that at a time when the ABC is cutting 200 jobs and other costs, it has dug deep into its reserves during the bushfires (and now floods) to fulfil its role as the nation’s emergency broadcaster.
    So Ita will ask ScoMo for “adequate” funds, given the ABC’s claim that the extra cost of covering the fires came out of its normal base funding…
    A spokesman for (Communications Minister Paul) Fletcher told Diary at the weekend that it was “open” to the ABC to outline “any specific additional costs” it has ­incurred as the emergency broadcaster…

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    pat

    10 Feb: SMH: $100 million a year to keep half of Liddell coal-fired power plant alive
    by Peter Hannam; With reporting by Mike Foley
    Extending the life of just half of the Liddell coal-fired power station would cost as much as $100 million a year and, even then, technical issues would cloud the reliability of the ageing plant.
    The final report of a joint federal and NSW state government taskforce reviewing the viability of AGL’s 1660 megawatt generator in the Hunter Valley may be released shortly…

    However, multiple sources have told the Herald and The Age it would cost at least $300 million to keep just two of the four generating units running three years beyond its planned closure date in 2023. With AGL unwilling to come up with the funds, the bill would end up with taxpayers, they said…

    Measures to extend the life of Liddell were notably absent from the recent $3 billion deal between the Morrison and Berejiklian governments to boost electricity grid investments while lifting gas supplies in the NSW market.
    Insiders said AGL and the NSW government were “on a unity ticket” in opposing the further extension of the plant’s life, not least because of the risk to workers of mechanical failure at the ailing plant but also because cheaper forms of electricity are available.

    The plant’s reliability would also most likely worsen, meaning power supplies couldn’t be counted on when most needed, they said…READ ON
    https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/100-million-a-year-to-keep-half-of-liddell-coal-fired-power-plant-alive-20200210-p53zgj.html

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    hatband

    Have a geek at the rainfall map for the Brisbane River Catchment over the last 24 hours.
    And it’s still raining.
    Get ready for the Premier Paddlepop Flood of 2020, brought to you by, er, climate change.
    http://www.bom.gov.au/qld/flood/brisbane.shtml

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    https://www.forbes.com/sites/rogerpielke/2020/02/09/a-climate-blacklist-that-works-it-should-make-her-unhirable-in-academia/#d2e51cc63682

    That Google uses it to denigrate skeptics does not surprise me. I pointed out a long time ago that they use the DeSmogBlog blacklist the same way.

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    The Saltbush Club has kindly posted a stand alone copy of my Heartland article explaining why 100% renewables is impossible:
    https://saltbushclub.com/2020/02/10/100-percent-renewables-impossible/

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      Robber

      Had my connection blocked to the Saltbush Club on Google and Bing?
      Jo, can you publish David’s article here?

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    Ringo

    Hi All,
    Does anyone have a rough idea what percentage of fossil fuels have been extracted (burnt) from the total in the earth?
    Thx

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