JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


Handbooks


Advertising


Australian Speakers Agency



GoldNerds

The nerds have the numbers on precious metals investments on the ASX



The Skeptics Handbook

Think it has been debunked? See here.

The Skeptics Handbook II

Climate Money Paper



Archives

Books

Mysterious, amazingly low oxygen levels, a pulse oximeter may give the first warning of coronavirus

Pulse Oximeter

A pulse Oximeter     | Image Thinkpaul: Wikimedia

A cheap device might keep people off ventilators and be the first warning of trouble

In coronavirus blood oxygen levels can silently drop to unheard of levels. People may be unaware they even have coronavirus as oxygen levels fall to the point, medicos are rewriting the record books. This is a hypoxia crisis — it’s a defining feature of the disease. In the UK, the demand for oxygen at hospitals is so great that the NHS is running out, rationing it, and asking docs to lower their blood oxygen targets.

People are monitoring their “blood oxy sats” at home so they get an early warning that they need more serious medical help. Normal blood oxygen levels are 95-100% saturated. Doctors used to get uppity at levels below 92%, and hospital alarms often go off if children with asthma fall below 90%. At 88% doctors are putting people on continuous oxygen therapy. Levels below 80% are considered dangerous enough to start causing organ damage. But medical staff are finding conscious covid patients with levels so low they are unheard of — an unbelieveable 50 percent. I read somewhere an ambulance medic found someone with a reading of 35%.

Dr Levitan, an emergency doctor in New York recommended a week ago that a pulse oximeter at home would save lives and prevent patients from ultimately needing the highly invasive, expensive ventilator treatment which was so dangerous and such a drain on hospitals.

Oximeters are cheap devices, bound to be disappearing off chemist shelves and from Ebay and Amazon right now, but if you are high risk, or in a high risk area, it might be worth trying to track one down.

The Infection That’s Silently Killing Coronavirus Patients

Richard Levitan in a New York Times op-ed

…almost all the E.R. patients had Covid pneumonia.

Apparently, some of those asymptomatic cases are already suffering from pnumonia. This wasn’t the point of the article, but the message implied in here is that there may be walking cases of Covid who think they are fine, but they are already suffering lung damage.

Even patients without respiratory complaints had Covid pneumonia. The patient stabbed in the shoulder, whom we X-rayed because we worried he had a collapsed lung, actually had Covid pneumonia. In patients on whom we did CT scans because they were injured in falls, we coincidentally found Covid pneumonia. Elderly patients who had passed out for unknown reasons and a number of diabetic patients were found to have it.

And here is what really surprised us: These patients did not report any sensation of breathing problems, even though their chest X-rays showed diffuse pneumonia and their oxygen was below normal. How could this be?

Normally people with low oxygen levels are struggling to breathe, gasping, working their intercostal chest muscles between their ribs. They are in distress. But with Covid patients they may feel OK, and be able to talk on the phone. By the time they get to the hospital they already have fairly serious case of pneumonia and the chest x-rays show it. About 20% of these patients will go on the the more serious “wet lung” type of pnumonia which needs a ventilator. The hope is that people who get treatment early may be able to avoid the ventilator stage.

…when Covid pneumonia first strikes, patients don’t feel short of breath, even as their oxygen levels fall. And by the time they do, they have alarmingly low oxygen levels and moderate-to-severe pneumonia (as seen on chest X-rays).

 He recommends all people who have tested positive for coronavirus, or have respiratory symptoms use an oximeter for two weeks.

Pulse oximeters helped save the lives of two emergency physicians I know, alerting them early on to the need for treatment. When they noticed their oxygen levels declining, both went to the hospital and recovered (though one waited longer and required more treatment). Detection of hypoxia, early treatment and close monitoring apparently also worked for Boris Johnson, the British prime minister.

 Teams are currently working on all kinds of ways to monitor blood oxygen levels, including with Raspberry Pi’s.

Not all medicos think this is a good idea, but for a smart audience who can weigh up the pros and cons and give themselves a bit of training, it’s a cheap bit of insurance. I’ve got one and have used it for years.

 What’s A Pulse Oximeter? Is It A Good Idea To Buy One?

Laurel Walmsley

 …a pulse oximeter might signal that you’re in trouble before you realize it. That’s what Levitan saw when he spent 10 days working in the ER at Bellevue Hospital in New York City earlier this month: Many COVID patients were already very sick with COVID pneumonia by the time they arrived. They were breathing rapidly, their blood oxygen levels dangerously low. Like mountain climbers, the patients had grown accustomed to gradually decreasing levels of oxygen and didn’t realize they were in distress.

Many of them said they only recently started feeling short of breath though they had experienced symptoms of COVID-19 for days. By the time the patients went to the hospital, says Levitan, the virus had already damaged their lungs, and many were in critical condition. He saw COVID pneumonia patients with oxygen saturation levels as low as 50 percent.

NPR goes on to discuss reasons to get one, as well as reasons not to — with warnings and instructions. Read the NPR article and other links, but most of the warnings about using them probably don’t apply to the well educated person. The warnings about untrained users sound like anti-mask messages did — contradictory and patronising. Bright lights can skew the readings, as can nail polish or pre existing conditions like anemia, asthma or lung disease, so using one when you are healthy is good practice to get the “normal” trendline.

Like masks and PPE, pulse oximeters are suddenly going to become hot property, and thus, mass produced.

Curiously, sales of pulse oximeters dramatically rose in the US on Jan 20th when the first case of coronavirus was recorded in the US, but it seems to me more likely to be a sign of our friendly CCP agents at work — posting meters to China without mentioning to the people around them that they might be useful to have at home.

Note to commenters: Since lives and livelihoods are both at stake, good manners and grace will go a long way. Sometime the worst scaremongers are the ones complaining about other scaremongers.

h/t Mum.

Things worth knowing about Coronavirus:

VN:F [1.9.22_1171]
Rating: 9.6/10 (50 votes cast)
Mysterious, amazingly low oxygen levels, a pulse oximeter may give the first warning of coronavirus, 9.6 out of 10 based on 50 ratings

129 comments to Mysterious, amazingly low oxygen levels, a pulse oximeter may give the first warning of coronavirus

  • #
    Peter C

    A Pulse Oximeter is likely a great device for assessing lung involvement. I don’t ascribe to the view that asymptomatic people need to use one. If I had mild coronavirus and was sequestered at home I would use one to monitor progress (if I had one).

    Normally people with low oxygen levels are struggling to breathe, gasping, working their intercostal chest muscles between their ribs. They are in distress. But with Covid patients they may feel OK, and be able to talk on the phone. By the time they get to the hospital they already have fairly serious case of pneumonia and the chest x-rays show it. About 20% of these patients will go on the the more serious “wet lung” type of pnumonia which needs a ventilator. The hope is, that people who get treatment early may be able to avoid the ventilator stage.
    …when Covid pneumonia first strikes, patients don’t feel short of breath, even as their oxygen levels fall. And by the time they do, they have alarmingly low oxygen levels and moderate-to-severe pneumonia (as seen on chest X-rays).

    Are Coronavirus patients different form other patients who are short of breath? Richard Levitan is a journo, not a doctor. He is quoting someone. Probably coronavirus patients respond that same as other patients who get reduced oxygen levels.

    So I would say, if you don’t think you have corona virus then do not bother with a pulse oximeter. If you have positive test then try and get one. That would be a very few people in Australia at present.

    67

    • #
      Bulldust

      I would highly recommend keeping up to date with MedCram. The good doctor keeps the world up to date with most of the latest intelligence relating to the CCP virus:

      https://www.youtube.com/user/MEDCRAMvideos/videos

      In the last few episodes he has shifted the focus to “oxidative stress” as being one of the main issues. Long story short, biochemical interference by the virus (attaching to ACE-2 receptors in the blood vessel linings) effectively causes hypoxia and oxidative stress. Oxygen is normally converted to water in the body, but goes through free radical species before getting to H2O. The virus interferes with that progression, causing a ramp up of radicals in the body. There’s also the blood clotting problems and lung damage. All round this is a nasty virus. I probably butchered some of the explanations … watch MedCram :)

      180

    • #
      StephenP

      My brother, a GP, bought me one as a birthday present a few years ago when I had chest problems. There are a few things I would comment on:
      Don’t use it too often as the AAA batteries run down for a pastime.
      Don’t use it with cold hands as you get odd results or no result.
      Occasionally you get odd results, mainly with the pulse rate which can read too high, but reads properly when you try again a minute or so later.
      I find it useful mainly after HI exercise to see how quickly my pulse rate and oxygen saturation return to normal.
      I don’t know how easy it would be to get hold of one quickly if you waited until you had symptoms of CV19. As they are not very expensive it might form part of a home medical kit, rather like a thermometer.

      110

    • #
      Plain Jane

      Peter C. It can take a couple of weeks to get a pulse oximeter on ebay and then mailed in. Once you get Covid it is not responsible to then go to the shop to buy one at the chemist, assuming they still have them, you should be at home isolating, not going to the chemist shop and infecting other people. So when you find out you are sick it is too late to get one. So if you have one at home already, you are prepared. If you live in the middle of nowhere one tends to be prepared and stocked up anyway. If you live next door to a medical centre you might be OK, but then you should not be inflicting your sick self on others. Since with Cov-19 it is possible the only major symptom you might have is dropping 02 levels, and you might be totally unaware of it, then it would be a really really handy thing to have.

      50

    • #
      Leo G

      A Pulse Oximeter is likely a great device for assessing lung involvement.

      I doubt that it is suitable for assessing lung involvement.
      I help care for my parents (one 97, the other 92) both who have heart conditions, the younger having a 3-wire pacemaker as treatment for congestive heart failure. We have used an oximeter at home for the last 5 years and find it useful, but with some reservations.
      The main issue is that it measures capillary oxigenation in fingers (or toes) and readings are significantly affected by differential effects on peripheral circulation. You can get markedly different readings on different fingers at times and for quite long periods after events that affect breathing rythms, such as bouts of sneezing, choking on food or liquid, or coughing.
      It appears that peripheral circulation in older people varies as a response to even mild respiratory distress and does not imply that the oxigenation to major organs is affected to anything close to the extent measured by the oximeter.

      90

      • #

        It doesn’t matter whether it measures the lungs as the capillary O2 is a correlate.

        52

        • #
          Kalm Keith

          Yes true, and it also explains the variations and irregularities seen by Leo. Just have to accept that while the extremities might be affected, the core organs probably don’t notice.

          20

        • #
          Geoffrey Williams

          Appologies red thumb error . .
          GeoffW

          10

    • #
      Yonniestone

      But with Covid patients they may feel OK, and be able to talk on the phone.

      Peter this was the case when I got pneumonia and ended up with a fully collapsed lung, I actually walked from my doctors around the corner to x-ray then to emergency with the lung gone, I wasn’t out of breath as such just very weak and I was told later my blood oxygen levels were close to dying so if I’d gone to sleep that night I wouldn’t wake up again.

      Every case is different of course, I wasn’t put on a ventilator but had oxygen an IV and plenty of drugs (medical workers are angels amongst us) after recovering I’ve been more susceptible to flu’s and x-rays showed the lung is scarred, some of the poor people that survive a bad dose of CV-19 will have conditions that will affect them for life.

      50

  • #
    Ian1946

    If the wu flu affects oxygen levels could this be the reason why smokers are at a greater risk.

    61

    • #

      Um well er.
      “Conclusions and relevance: Our cross sectional study in both COVID-19 out- and inpatients strongly suggests that daily smokers have a very much lower probability of developing symptomatic or severe SARS-CoV-2 infection as compared to the general population.”
      https://www.qeios.com/read/WPP19W.3

      112

      • #

        A gutless red thumber to annoy. Yipee.
        “MORE evidence smoking may cut the risk of coronavirus: Review of 28 studies shows number of smokers among hospitalised patients is ‘lower than expected’ as expert admits the mounting findings are ‘weird’”
        https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-8264635/More-proof-smokers-risk-catching-coronavirus-expert-admits-weird.html

        101

        • #

          I would observe that many older patients gave up smoking 20 years ago but there is a younger cohort where it became fashionable. So perhaps the young are not getting symptoms so no need to present whilst the older ones have got the effects of smoking out of their system.

          Or they could be lying in case they believed the hospital might not treat them

          70

          • #

            Seems most of the studies did require paperwork from the patient or at least answers. Wonder how that goes if they are too sick or dead.

            30

        • #
          Kalm Keith

          Silligy.
          Do smokers last long enough to get CV19.
          Maybe that’s why they seem to be “unaffected” by it?

          33

          • #

            I dunno. Am wondering if smokers somehow get used to breathing harder but can’t smoke in the hospital so begin to get a head start. However the vitamin things i found in comments below and perhaps average weight being lower could affect things.

            30

        • #
          Bill In Oz

          Maybe Nicotine poisons this CCP virus ?
          It’s certainly poisonous to lots of things.
          It’s used an insectocide in some farming systems.

          73

          • #
            bobl

            Finally Bill a point to agree on, early on, (Feb?) I read an article that suggested that nicotine and glycol in tobacco smoke was probably more toxic to the virus than to human cells. This same principle is at play in chemotherapy, lets give the person a toxin that’s more toxic to cancer cells that normal cells.

            I use the same principle in my home remedies vapourised tea tree oil and Eucalyptus is classified as aromatherapy, but rather like everything, if you take a substance in the air, no matter how dilute, and push it through a filter then the substance concentrates in the filter. So it is for lungs. Put tea tree and Eucalyptus in the air and breathe it in as in “Aromatherapy” then some of the tea tree concentrates in the filter (lung tissue) this is not very toxic to complex lung cells but devastating to viruses, bacteria and fungi. Because of Tea Tree oil toxicity, I put no more that a few drops in the vapouriser with the Eucalyptus. If it gives you a headache you’ve used way too much.

            Warning, I cannot recommend that anyone use my home remedies, they are unresearched and have no peer reviewed studies at all – the sample size is ONE. Tea tree oil can be toxic and trigger allergies. They should however be researched. In my opinion, (and it’s just a opinion) such a combination in the right doses in an inhaler would do a lot to manage COVID.

            Strangely Trump was NOT so stupid when he suggested using disinfectants inside the body, there is actually a way to do that, smoking nicotine and glycol is probably one of them as is tea tree and Eucalyptus “Aromatherapy”. Eucalyptus alone is a mild antiseptic and you can buy over the counter inhalers containing it. They’re not allowed to say it’s a treatment but on principle I’d say inhaling an antiseptic probably kills microbes in the lungs.

            I’d suggest an over the counter chloroquine inhaler might be of some use too, turn off those ACE-2 receptors in the lungs.

            80

      • #
        Bill In Oz

        Ummm A french hospital..
        Well French cigarettes are made differently
        To the standard cigarettes in English speaking countries..
        And I remember reading years ago
        That this has an effect on the cancer rate for smokers in France.
        Lessoned.
        And the types of cancers they get..
        So from that perhaps Gaulois cigarettes are to be preferred ?

        33

      • #

        May have figured it out here. Vitamin A can work against vitamin D.
        “We showed previously that vitamin A deficiency per se causes emphysema. Benzo(a)pyrene, a constituent in cigarette smoke, induces vitamin A depletion when administered to rats; therefore, we tested the hypothesis that cigarette smoke induces vitamin A depletion, which is associated with the development of emphysema.”
        https://academic.oup.com/jn/article/133/8/2629/4688012

        21

        • #

          “Abstract
          Vitamin A is known to protect against infections, but it is not established how vitamin A metabolites stimulate the immune system. We have investigated the effects of physiological levels of retinoic acid on the function of normal human T- and B-cells. Surprisingly, we found that the proliferation of B-cells was inhibited by retinoids, and that this was due to rapid inhibition of the cell cycle machinery regulating G(1)-to-S transition. In contrast, the proliferation of T-cells was enhanced by physiological levels of retinoic acid, and the effect was due to induction of IL-2 (interleukin 2).”
          https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15506942

          “Epidermal retinyl esters are considered as the storage form of vitamin A”
          “retinyl esters strongly absorb radiation in the UVB range,”
          “The energy absorbed by retinyl esters is no longer available to damage other chromophores such as DNA”
          https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0022202X15304954

          And at this complexity i don’t understand what i am reading at all!
          “Upregulation of Angiotensin-Converting Enzyme 2 by All-trans Retinoic Acid in Spontaneously Hypertensive Rats”
          https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/01.HYP.0000146400.57221.74

          30

          • #
            sophocles

            Hmmm. … Hypertensive Rats … find out what they’re worrying about and fix it. :-D

            Can’t have superstressed rodents, they’ll give rebar a bad name.

            21

  • #
    thingadonta

    I’m waiting for the iPhone oxygen level app. As well as the anti virus screen protector. By the way, I read cases with oxygen levels in the 20s and 30s with the patient with Covid19 talking , which means they should be dead.

    52

    • #
      Spetzer86

      Maybe you should switch to Android. Some Samsung phones will take an O2 reading and heart rate. The sensor is next to the fingerprint reader.

      30

    • #
      Eric Youle

      Hi

      Ive been using the O2 saturation app on my iPone for a year or more – using daily now
      It can seem a bit eratic but probably gives a fair indication.

      00

  • #
    AndrewWA

    This aspect was very well covered by this YouTube from Dr Cameron Kyle-Sidell – a physician trained in emergency medicine and critical care, and he practices at Maimonides in Brooklyn, New York.

    This Doctor is impressive in his willingness to share.
    There are a number of YouTubes available.

    80

  • #
    Bulldust

    Somewhat related – give up your privacy to regain your freedoms:

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-05-03/brendan-murphy-chief-medical-officer-coronavirus-update/12210198

    You will be allowed to go back to work, restaurants and pubs… all you have to do is give up your privacy. I used to think of Australia as Little America, but I fear we are becoming Little China.

    187

    • #
      WXcycles

      And the app does not prevent COVID19 infection transmissions, all it does is detect long after the fact that people were not socially distancing and thus gave any virus present the opportunity to spread to others. So let’s say that occurs and a person carks due to it a month later. It seems data from a tracked device could attribute blame and legal responsibility to a random individual. In the not to distant future they could be held accountable (fine-able or else prosecuted) for not lawfully socially-isolating, or being where they should be, as lawfully required (in a curfew for example, or shopping out of hours, visiting a friend, buying booze, etc). Thus it would serve as both a monitor and auto enforcement tool. You may not have the virus, you may not have transmitted it, or received it, but if the tracking system on a device becomes mandatory, as is carrying a working device at all times, you could have a fine imposed automatically. You may need to “show cause” as to why you should not be fined for you’re devices battery being flat and untraceable while you were out an about. We have seen the abuses of power of the British police, which no reasonable person would have thought would be occurring, but they really are that pig-headed and antagonistic. Or maybe our social score takes a hit instead and 1% more is added to our income taxes for 6 months as a deterrent? Either way, this technology technology is insidious and police can not be trusted with their mundane powers to harass people unfairly, who are really doing nothing wrong.

      The powers that be need to focus on testing for COVID-19 to detect existing cases and tracking only those with any mandatory tracking sensors and path loggers, the rest of the wholesale tracking of the population should be rejected. People doing it voluntarily are setting themselves up for a fall, as where it leads society to is totally unacceptable, IMO.

      90

      • #
        bobl

        This is completely unnecessary. I would write the app like this.

        Same basic principle, log all bluetooth MAC addresses encountered ( or a unique app ID if you like) – Keep that list for 4 weeks on the users phone.

        When a user presents with covid they are ASKED for access to their phone, just their bluetooth ID or unique App ID is retrieved and then that is broadcast to all users of the app, the app then compares the ID from the infected users with the list of encountered devices (over the 4 weeks – kept locally) and notifies if it has encountered the infected persons phone.

        It then up to that user to present for testing.

        No external data storage, full privacy, messaging from the government is one way only, it could even send infected person device IDs by SMS using the emergency broadcast system.

        This is a perfectly workable scheme which protects privacy – I would use an app that worked this way.

        My question is WHY DOESN’T IT WORK THIS WAY, is it government overreach or government incompetence that leads to the privacy breach?

        71

        • #
          bobl

          A red thumb, for more privacy, I wonder why?

          42

          • #
            Another Ian

            You flushed a lurking globalist

            20

            • #
              bobl

              Must’ve Ian. I don’t think I’ve ever met a person that WANTS to give over their personal information to the government. Google, Facebook, Microsoft… yes plenty, but not the government.

              I’m very careful with these companies too, and I keep advising my children, nieces and nephews to be very careful what they post on online services. I always tell them, don’t put anything on those services that you wouldn’t want plastered over a billboard on Highway 1

              100

              • #
                GreatAuntJanet

                Unfortunately there are heaps of those kinds of people forcefully commenting in the Australian today. I presume they have been paid to do so.

                20

          • #
            Bill In Oz

            WAsn’t me Bob.
            But why are you complaining ?
            That’s just one.
            I regularly get three reds at a time.

            13

            • #
              bobl

              I usually count them +10 on climate, they’re usually drive by downvoting every comment, but this was so innocuous, just about how to recode the COVIDSafe app for privacy. I can’t see the reason for a red thumb. Whoever gave it, if you have a reason, I’d really like to hear it?

              61

              • #
                Another Ian

                “Whoever gave it, if you have a reason, I’d really like to hear it?”

                If you get one can we have an IQ report please?

                21

          • #
            Bulldust

            While you’re at it flush out the 7 reds on me … like I give a flying *%^%&, but still. It bemuses me that 7 CCP sycophants down-voted me.

            21

  • #
    Slithers

    Hi Jo and readers,
    Could it be that these people with low Blood Oxygen Sat’s are having the 2ndary effect of damaged blood Corpuscles and potential clotting because the virus has found somewhere other than the lungs to replicate. The pneumonia being seen as late stage of a slow infection that is well advanced in another organ hence poor oxygen transport due to damaged blood corpuscles. The thyroid gland has similar cells with ACE2 linings. Is there any data at all about TSH levels in COVID-19 suffers?
    Perhaps these patients with low oxygen sat’s have good immune systems that are winning the battle to take over their lungs, but having massive dammage to their blood corpusels?

    90

  • #
    BK Tony

    Interesting Jo, we were in NZ March 1st to 19th. I had flu like symptoms for a week and went to a clinic in Wellington.
    I had a blood oxygen level of 92% and was wheezy. The doctor put me on large doses of ventalin and a short course of prednisone and ordered a chest X-ray which they did at the clinic.
    Went on our way pending a radiologists report. The doctor later contacted me to say I had pneumonia in my lower left lung. She prescribed doxycycline and I came good.
    Four weeks isolating in Mandurah and I’m still well. I wonder …..?

    140

  • #
    Peter C

    I wonder …..?

    Yes. Are you immune now? As testing gets more widespread you might like to get a test!

    50

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    Thanks Jo !
    It’s been a long slow road to gain some understanding
    Of this novel CCP virus and it’s disease.
    Yes, it causes HYPOXIA !
    But in all the stress of the day to day emergency
    It does not seem to be focussed on.

    And you have posted about this before.
    About 3 weeks ago.
    Could you include a link to that previous
    “Hold the Ventilators” post
    On this post ?

    22

    • #

      Added links to the post at the bottom.
      Yes, this is half of the hypoxia, but there may be more to it than that as well. More info soon.

      83

      • #
        sophocles

        … this has turned out to be a really sneaky virus.

        30

        • #
          WXcycles

          Is there’s any other ‘natural’ virus which produces similar ranges of symptoms? Seems like this virus is doing things no one’s seen with this diversity or combination of effects before. It’s just a little too contagious, a little too subtle, a little too sneaky, a bit too persistent, and a bit too insidiously and permanently damaging, in an ideally undetectable way until it’ too late, and also much too costly to ignore for long.

          If it’s not designer code it’s a heck of a fluke of nature, but how did an emerging bat virus it end up in seafood? Maybe it jumped species into a mullet?

          83

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    A question :
    This CCP virus causes hypoxia – low oxygen levels in the blood and organs.
    Lack of oxygen kills eventually.
    Providing extra oxygen helps it’s victims recover.
    So does this mean that this CCP virus
    ‘Thrives’ best in a low oxygen environment ?

    And is this ‘feature’ something that is also present
    In the original bat viruses of Southern China
    Or was it somehow genetically selected for
    At the Wuhan Virology Lab ?

    33

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      I’m not a virologist. But I did a litle looking around online.
      But it turns out that many viruses are destroyed by high levels of Oxygen :
      “The herpes virus cannot exist in an elevated oxygen environment. Dr. Otto Warburg won the Nobel Prize for proving that viruses cannot proliferate, cannot exist in the presence of sufficient oxygen. This is a now an accepted fact. There has been many, many studies showing the destruction of viruses by the introduction of increased oxygenation whether it is in the form of ozone, hydrogen peroxide, hyperbaric oxygen, etc.”
      https://stegib52.wordpress.com/tag/viruses/

      So for this CCP Corona virus to thrive,
      Like other viruses, it must create an environment which is low in Oxygen.
      The CCP Corona 19 virus does this by reducing the capacity of red blood cells
      To bind with oxygen.
      This reduction of oxygen in the blood starves the body of oxygen.
      But the release of the toxic Iron ions in the red blood cells
      Throughout the vascular system also causes damage to arteries
      The heart and other major organs.

      Thus oxygen is toxic to the CCP Corona 19 virus.
      Provision of it to patients suffering from CCP COVID 19
      Is the key to regaining health.
      Ask Boris Johnson !

      [edited to remain on topic and remove the red flag you inadvertently put up .]AD

      51

  • #
    BK Tony

    [ Yes pneunomovax every 5 yrs, have a history of bronchial issues.
    Out at Bruce rock now feeding the world, not sure any testing here .

    40

  • #
    David Ashton

    As I understand it, NHS Hospitals are not “running out” of oxygen, the problem is that the pipe work and probably the heat exchangers (the oxygen is delivered and stored as liquid), cannot deliver the volumes being demanded by the bedside units. The hospitals were built with oxygen supply to all wards and beds, but the pipework was not designed to enable the oxygen to be delivered to all beds simultaneously at a high flow rate. The so called “rationing” is reducing the flow to patients who can cope with the lower rate. Still not a good situation.

    60

  • #
    Anton

    This might explain the mystery of why people were photographed dead in the street of it, if they went out to shops and were overcome by hypoxia.

    100

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Interesting that people with low oxygen levels in the bloodstream aren’t aware of it initially.

    While I don’t want to comment on the “CV19 illness” as such, this low oxygen experience does prompt a look at some basics that might be of use.

    The breathing response is extraordinarily complex and all I can do is look at the extremes of function.

    Breathing is effectively “controlled” by the brain and that is done by monitoring levels of CO2 in the bloodstream.

    High CO2 levels would prompt increased activity to clear that excess waste product.

    Low levels of CO2 would reduce the breathing impulse.

    Oxygen levels are Not directly monitored by the brain, ANS.

    One of the interesting things is that the neurological monitoring is set to operate within a range of CO2 bloodstream levels.

    Further, there is a lower limit of CO2 below which the detection function cannot operate, and as mentioned previously, you just stop breathing.

    At the end of of life some people are able to determine when they are ready to “go”.

    When ready they lapse into a breathing pattern which effectively overoxygenates their system creating alkylosis and reduced CO2 levels in the bloodstream.

    At the lowest level of operation of this automatic system the CO2 levels are too low to detect and Breathing Stops.

    This is the opposite of younger, healthier people who may be singing which creates more CO2, or others trying to relieve anxiety by rebreathing into a paper bag. In both cases the activity increases CO2 levels.

    Maybe not directly related to the CV19 thing but interesting background.

    In past discussions RW and Roy have mentioned interesting aspects of CO2 / breathing associated with flying at altitude effectively in an unpressurised cabin and deep sea diving.

    KK

    80

    • #
      Another Ian

      Feedback from a medico friend

      “Pulse oximeters are brilliant pieces of equipment and most people at 85% appear blue in the face/lips. Anyone below 70% is in a life threatening situation”

      70

      • #
        Another Ian

        So according to that anyone less than 85% ought to look like an ancient Briton in full woad?

        21

  • #
    John R Walker

    Bought myself a pulse-oximeter weeks ago when it first became obvious hypoxia (hypoxaemia/hypoxemia to be more precise) is the main functional effect of Covid-19 infections. It came from China like the virus!

    90

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      John, I was thinking about buying one to try an experiment.

      Was going to try out the two contrasting breathing patterns mentioned above to see if there was any effect.

      Singing style.
      Rapid air intake and long slow exhalation. Rapid intake etc.

      And

      No name.
      Long slow inhalation, rapid expulsion, long slow inhalation. etc.

      I wonder if those extremes create a detectable difference in oxygen levels?

      KK

      51

  • #

    I suspect that a China virus infection also affects the blood pressure and heart rate. When O2 saturation drops, for example during exercise, the heart rate, breathing and blood pressure will increase to compensate. A significant spike in blood pressure would also explain heart attacks and strokes in people with otherwise asymptomatic infections and why hypertension is a significant risk factor even in the case of an asymptomatic infection. A spike in blood pressure could also be an indicator of the onset of an infection.

    40

  • #
    Klem

    When are you people going to admit that this was just another regular flu season?

    It doesn’t matter that the MSM continues to terrify you on a daily basis, the numbers are gradually showing that the cvd-19 mortality rate is nothing unusual.

    Stand up and face it.

    [ Klem was this comment made to provoke a reaction ? If that was your wish you've succeeded.] AD

    [Klem, it's almost like you haven't read the last 60 posts.... - jo]

    412

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Such a curious comment Klem.
      It would seem that it is you who is in denial.
      Bolstered by your ideology that the MSM always wishes to deceive.
      These are the facts :
      This is no flu
      And the infectiousness & number of deaths are extraordinary.
      It is a Chinese Communist Party gift to the world.

      58

      • #
        Klem

        Never doubt the ABC.

        Wow, that’s one heck of an argument you put forth there Bill.

        Thanks for straightening me out.

        [ Your comments are standing out as trying to provoke rather than trying to contribute or debate .]AD

        35

      • #
        TedM

        Bill you are just too kind. I would have said an incredibly stupid, and factually incorrect statement.

        33

    • #
      joseph

      This article by Robert F. Kennedy contained some information on the flu I hadn’t come across before . . . . .

      https://nexusnewsfeed.com/article/geopolitics/flu-misinformation-and-coronavirus-fears

      In 2005, the British Medical Journal (BMJ) Editor, Dr. Peter Doshi, published a comprehensive rebuke of CDC’s annual ritual of exaggerating flu mortalities entitled “Dissecting CDC’s Deception: Are US Flu Death Figures More PR Than Science?” Doshi accuses the CDC of purposefully inflating flu deaths to frighten the public into purchasing vaccines. To illustrate CDC’s chicanery, Doshi observed that CDC’s announced number of reported pneumonia and influenza deaths in 2001 at 62,034. Yet less than half of one percent of those were actually attributed to influenza. Furthermore, of the mere 257 cases that could reasonably be blamed on the flu in CDC’s mortality data, only 7 percent were laboratory confirmed cases of influenza. That’s 18 lab confirmed influenza cases out of 62,034 “pneumonia and influenza” deaths—or just 0.03 percent, according to HHS’s own National Center for Health Statistics (NCHS).

      Subtracting pneumonia, the true number of influenza-associated deaths from 1979 to 2002 averaged 1,348, according to the NCHS data. CNN routinely reports figures forty times this number.

      Dr. Doshi charges the CDC with deliberately lying about annual flu deaths to “[work] in manufacturers’ interest by conducting campaigns to increase flu vaccination”. He warns that “by arbitrarily linking flu with pneumonia, current data are statistically biased.”

      50

    • #
      sophocles

      No Klem it’s not “yet another regular flu season.”
      It might have been for the Northern Hemisphere because it was their flu season.

      You may not have noticed but most people commenting on this blog are from the Southern Hemisphere.
      That’s where Australia is, in the Southern Hemisphere.
      The flu season has not been this year, not yet.
      The flu season will not happen this year for another three months.
      So it is definitely a highly irregular one.
      Besides, Covd-19 is not a regular flu virus.

      It’s not a flu virus at all.

      Silly boy.

      [I republished his comment. But ask people not to drop in with rude, triumphal, evidence-and-reasoning-free statements which ignore the last 60 posts and 5,000 comments. - Jo]

      22

      • #
        sophocles

        This was to a poster Klem. But his comments seem to have to gone into file #13…
        Good place for them.

        10

      • #
        MP

        Hi I wish to apologise for my comment the other day, I did not read your comment correctly.
        In my defence, I was replying to the first comment and by the time I had hit reload 20 times you had re-posted with the link, none the less I was wrong.

        [I have returned to the desk, and published Klem, and others. I asked the mods last night to raise the bar for manners and polite comments, and AD was trying to do that. I didn't give detailed enough instructions. No censorship of views here as long as they are expressed politely, and are not repetitive comments that ignore all the replies ad infinitum. - jo]

        11

    • #
      Klem

      Hi jo, I haven’t visited this site for at least a year. I used to be a regular commenter during the climate wars, but when I visited recently I was astonished to see so many people showing deep fear of cvd-19. I live in the N hemisphere, during the pandemic we’ve seen daily MSM fearmongering, and fudging of infection and mortality data everywhere. It’s not surprising since this pandemic, like the great climate deception, is loaded with politics. (Same crap, different day) So I made a comment above, one that would not have been noticed during the climate days but caused a surprising disturbance now. My comment was almost removed, i was almosted silenced. That is most disturbing. Cheers

      31

      • #

        Same site as always. Just looking at the data, making predictions and getting them right.

        Have you got an open mind?

        Stick around, and trip through medical papers. You might find the CCPvirus is darker and more complex than you thought.

        21

      • #
        Kalm Keith

        Well put Klem.

        So much to say, and my views are already spread through past posts, but in summary;

        1. I don’t think that anyone would disagree with Jo that CV19 is a very ugly, dangerous problem.

        2. Government has a responsibility to protect us from this pandemic, if that’s what this is.

        Their level of integrity and skill demonstrated in handling this might be summarized in a few words;

        “Princess” and Border Farce.

        3. Confirmation Bias.
        This is the world’s first “Internet Disease” and it has been the subject of observation, speculation, verbalisation and the usual Media Driven hyperventilating that totally excludes rational thought and demands acceptance. What you are shown is what you believe. Don’t look any further.

        4. Even after government efforts, this virus has only led to 100 deaths so far in Australia and tragic as those deaths are it suggests that this is a Multifactorial problem.

        Some politicians here in Australia and their spokespersons here on the blog might try to convince us that our low death rate compared with Italy and New York are due to their Strong Rapid politically Cool “Decisive Action”™.

        Rough interpretation; we deserve your vote at the next election.

        p.s. If these CV19 deaths here really are of concern then it is obvious that other social issues which have produced many more deaths in the same period also need immediate action.
        The two previously mentioned being suicides and road deaths.

        I won’t go near smoking or drug deaths at the moment.

        In conclusion, what I read in Klem’s comment was a suggestion that people step back, take a breath, collect and examine the real facts and act appropriately.

        For myself I do believe that appropriate action has been needed, my concern has always been that those taking the action have just decided to smash the bloody virus.

        Not terribly smart, but great politics.

        KK

        10

  • #

    Bought one last week.

    61

  • #
    jkb

    … it attacks hemoglobin, the protein that carries oxygen in the blood, which translates to less oxygen available for the body.

    https://www.jpost.com/health-science/italian-scientist-says-she-discovered-main-mechanism-behind-covid-19-626737

    20

    • #
      FarmerDoug2

      So what does the “oximeter” look at ?
      If, as I suspect, it looks at colour of hemoglobin, and there is less hemoglobin…

      10

      • #
        RickWill

        The original variety that are applied to extremities like finger, toes or earlobe are based on the differential absorption of two infrared beams. The light actually passes through from the LEDs to a photo detector on the other side.

        The more recent variety can be placed on any body part and rely on the differential relflectance of the two beams. The wristbands use the reflectance. The wrist is a bit thick to get light pulses through it.

        https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pulse_oximetry

        50

  • #
    StephenP

    We did an experiment that illustrated this on ourselves at university in the 1960s.
    Firstly we rebreathed air and the increased CO2 caused us to breathe deeper and deeper until we couldn’t stand it any more and removed the mask.
    Secondly we had to work in pairs, as we rebreathed the air but it was passed through a substance that absorbed CO2, I think it was chloride of lime. Anyway, because there was no CO2 to stimulate the breathing reflex we were unaware of the reduction in O2 and continued to breathe what eventually was almost pure nitrogen. As a result we almost passed out and relied on our partner to remove the mask as we’re totally unaware of what was happening.
    Would H & S allow this now?

    80

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Interesting.
      Also the effect of pressure.
      RW described practicing submarine escape drills where because of the water pressure outside of the locked escape compartment it was necessary to load the air with high levels of CO2.
      At low pressure, top of Mount Everest, the opposite is the case and oxygen supplements can be taken without the dangers present at sea level.

      KK

      20

      • #
        StephenP

        I have a further thought.
        It would have been interesting to have had a pulse oximeter for the experiments.

        20

  • #
    TedM

    Christopher Monckton gives a data analysis of yet to be peer reviewed paper on 17,000 hospitalised covid19 UK patients.

    31

  • #
    dinn, rob

    then there was this, actually, but of course you knew that already, just did
    t want to ah say ah…
    https://balance10.blogspot.com/2020/05/they-dont-genetically-engineer-viruses.html

    10

  • #
    Gaz

    I bought a pulse oximeter when preparing for a trip across Tibet – altitudes to 6000m and some accommodation at 5200m. Personally I found I didn’t notice changes to breathing and endurance until around 72% and only got in minor problems when working hard at below 68%. I also tested others in our group and it was quite easy to pick who would get altitude sickness by their lower oxygen levels under the same conditions. My wife woke up one night at 5000m with breathing difficulties but these were overcome by deep rapid breathing for a few minutes.
    BTW where are quite cheap fitness watches now which measure blood oxygen along with pulse rate etc.
    Maybe change in blood oxygen with exercise may be an indicator of a lung issue which could be Covid-19

    30

  • #
    Gaz

    I bought a pulse oximeter when preparing for a trip across Tibet – altitudes to 6000m and some accommodation at 5200m. Personally I found I didn’t notice changes to breathing and endurance until around 72% and only got in minor problems when working hard at below 68%. I also tested others in our group and it was quite easy to pick who would get altitude sickness by their lower oxygen levels under the same conditions. My wife woke up one night at 5000m with breathing difficulties but these were overcome by deep rapid breathing for a few minutes.
    BTW where are quite cheap fitness watches now which measure blood oxygen along with pulse rate etc.
    Maybe change in blood oxygen with exercise may be an indicator of a lung issue which could be Covid-19

    30

  • #
    Curious George

    A disease attacks lungs – and blood oxygen levels go down?

    22

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      Good one.

      11

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      Best to establish the chain of events..
      I suspect that
      1: the virus damages the red blood cells
      2: This lowers the blood’s ability to carry dissolved oxygen
      3: The toxic Iron ions released from the blood haemoglobin in this process damage organs of the body
      4: Organs damaged include the lungs, arteries, heart, brain etc
      5 Damaged lungs reduce the ability of the alveoli to do their job
      Of ensuring oxygen is dissolved into the blood and CO2 is removed..

      So there is a cascade of damage happening…
      Now there is my hypothesis..

      21

  • #
    Steve of Cornubia

    We often hear canny detectives, when trying to determine who should be suspect, “Did they have a motive?”

    Well, in the case of the CCP’s early cover-up of Covid 19′s danger, one motive has been suggested by American intelligence: to buy time for them to gather medical supplies from around the world, ahead of the pandemic they knew would occur.

    At the very same time as they were telling the world (through their bought-and-paid-for mouthpiece the WHO) that there was nothing to worry about, they were scouring the world for PPE and allegedly reducing/preventing export of the same from China.

    Basically, it was self-interest and, by the time the rest of us caught on, it was too late and PPE shortages were inevitable.

    90

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    Victoria has had a major infection spike
    With 19 new cases discovered over night associated
    With a meat processing plant in the Western suburbs of Melbourne.

    The state government is refusing to say which meat processing plant.
    However turns out it is Cedar Meats on Geelong Rd Brooklyn.
    (According to the Weekly Times and the Australian )
    This meat works provides sheep and goat meats for overseas markets.
    The plant has also high percentage of employees who are migrants.
    And so the likelihood of employees not being aware or understanding
    The Rules needed to stop this pandemic, becomes much higher.

    31

    • #
      Bill In Oz

      No idea Steve why this wound up being a reply to your comment.

      21

    • #
      Gaz

      [ Off topic ]

      02

    • #
      Gaz

      I wonder whether Ramadan plays a part

      11

    • #
      JanEarth

      Bill

      A google search will find numerous outbreaks of CCP virus associated with meat works.

      There must be a reason this is happening… I suspect it has to do with blood. Perhaps the virus is able to use fresh blood to replicate ? Maybe something else but there is a correlation which could be examined.

      41

      • #
        Bill In Oz

        Yes I know Jan.
        But I suggest the main reason is the migrant character of the employees in meat works.
        Many westerners ‘disdain’ such work..Because it involves killing livestock.
        And so such work has become a reasonably well paid ‘entry’ occupation for migrants
        In Australia, Canada and in the USA.

        So then there are have the issue of different cultural values
        And levels of education about disease and especially a new infectious disease.
        Another problem that most of these employees are casual.
        So no work = No pay
        And no sick pay either.
        So there are incentives to ignore any mild sickness symptoms.

        All in all a catastrophic combination I suggest.

        32

      • #
        Raving

        The reasons are …

        - essential service
        - chilled air, working in a refrigerator
        - workers standing close together

        Perfect environment for transmission

        20

  • #
    RickWill

    A prerequisite of visiting high altitude mines in Chile is an oxygen uptake test and medical test certificate before departure. All arrivals at the site have their blood level tested.

    My first experience with a finger oximeter was a visit to one of those sites. They did not allow you out of the site clinic until the oximeter displayed 99%. My initial level was 95% and took a few minutes od deep breathing to get up to 99%. I was not aware that my blood oxygen was low. It takes a bit of thought to take deeper breaths than normal at low altitude and having an oximeter is a quick way to assess the level of breathing required.

    The requirement to ensure good blood oxygen levels at the high altitude mines was reinforced when the President of Falconbridge died as he stepped off a small plane at the start of a mine list:
    https://www.mininghalloffame.ca/franklin-gt-pickard

    40

  • #
    TattyMane

    I’m not sure if anyone else has mentioned this, but my phone – a Samsung S9 – has a built in oxygen saturation meter. It’s part of the Samsung Health app.

    30

  • #

    A more technical description of how the Pulse oximeter works.
    Two wavelengths of light being sent through your finger.
    https://medicine.uiowa.edu/iowaprotocols/pulse-oximetry-basic-principles-and-interpretation

    30

  • #
    Phil

    Found this article earlier, https://web.archive.org/web/20200405061401/https://medium.com/@agaiziunas/covid-19-had-us-all-fooled-but-now-we-might-have-finally-found-its-secret-91182386efcb

    Seems to explain why hypoxia develops in patients, (through attacking hemoglobin), the signature lung damage seen on CT scans, and why anti-malarials might be a good treatment

    Apologies if already posted by someone else

    41

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    Speaking of smartphone apps…they appear to be working hard to convince everyone to put themselves “on the leash”…. allegedly ( ahem ) “for the good of the country”…

    https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/i-m-a-privacy-expert-and-i-ve-downloaded-the-covidsafe-app-20200503-p54pc6.html

    “Our government has long tended to put national security ahead of privacy and has a poor track record of technology deployments. Some fear the app could be tracking us and they reject assurances from Canberra that surveillance is not the intent. Critics claim the very idea of the app is unproven and its software not properly tested.

    “The loudest objection is also the simplest: “I do not trust the government and I will not trust their app.”

    Yup…that sums it up. Perfectly.

    Interestingly, on a related matter, I’ve noticed within workplaces now there is now a push to get everyone all “happy happy lets be a team & collaborate” using collaboration apps… problem is it means using apps that effectively record every single instant message, email, phone call etc within the workplace.

    Now while its possibly a condition of employment to do such things, there appears to be a marked lack of tolerance for dissenters, or even those who dare express doubt about such a thing.

    There was the flowery language to start with, but the mask slipped today, and I saw the real agenda. Disturbing.

    As a Libertarian, I consider there is so much wrong with this. However its part of what appears to be a general push to agressively strip people of as many privacy as possible as fast as possible.

    40

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    Photo in article shows lesions, but also blueish coloured fingernails, which would suggest low oxygen levels?

    The rashes could be the virus working its way out of the body.

    https://www.msn.com/en-au/news/australia/the-covid-19-symptom-leaving-doctors-baffled/ar-BB13yb35?li=AAgfYrC&ocid=mailsignout

    “Doctors say they are puzzled by a wide variety of rashes in patients suffering from COVID-19.

    “Five separate types of rashes have so far been identified, including Covid toe, with the rashes more likely to appear in young people and last several days.
    …………
    “”I’ve got clinics filled with people coming in with new toe lesions. And it’s not people who had chilblains before, they’ve never had anything like this.”

    20

  • #
    WXcycles

    Comparison of recovering countries:

    New Cases | Country | Active cases | % New v Active | % Died
    20 … Australia … 889 … 2.2 … 1.40
    2 … New Zealand … 201 … 1.0 … 1.34
    0 … Taiwan … 94 … 0.0 … 1.39
    13 … S. Korea … 1,360 … 1.0 … 2.32
    39 … Austria … 1,771 … 2.2 … 3.83
    88 … Switzerland … 3,643 … 2.4 … 5.89

    Almost all of the residual new cases are in Victoria and New South Wales (Melbourne and Sydney). Get rid of it in those two cities and all of Australia should be clear of community-spread by about the end of the third week of May. There’s still a very small number of active cases spreading it. At this point I’d put all of this small number of known residual cases into a secure isolation until they clear of COVID-19 so that the rest of Australia can reopen sooner. And pour a larger amount of resources into investigating every new case that pops up, isolate them too, and find where they got it from. It’s almost all in just a few suburbs of Sydney and Melbourne now. If those cities reopen without cleaning up this small remainder they’ll be back to an area closures within a month. And we can’t reopen regular domestic flights and border crossings until that trickle of remaining new cases is eliminated.

    50

  • #
    DOC

    The answers all lie in the oxyhaemoglobin dissociation curve with changing levels of oxygen
    concentrations breathed.

    10

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    Just in case anyone tries it to force people to use the govts new snitch app to stay employed or for denying entry to any premises :

    https://www.legislation.gov.au/Details/F2020L00480

    “9 Coercing the use of COVIDSafe

    (1) A person must not require that another person:

    (a) download COVIDSafe to a mobile telecommunications device; or

    (b) have COVIDSafe in operation on a mobile telecommunications device; or

    (c) consent to uploading COVID app data from a mobile telecommunications device to the National COVIDSafe Data Store.

    (2) A person must not:

    (a) refuse to enter into, or continue, a contract or arrangement with another person (including a contract of employment); or

    (b) take adverse action (within the meaning of the Fair Work Act 2009) against another person; or

    (c) refuse to allow another person to enter premises; or

    (d) refuse to allow another person to participate in an activity; or

    (e) refuse to receive goods or services from another person; or

    (f) refuse to provide goods or services to another person;
    on the ground that, or on grounds that include the ground that, the other person:

    (g) has not downloaded COVIDSafe to a mobile telecommunications device; or

    (h) does not have COVIDSafe in operation on a mobile telecommunications device; or

    (i) has not consented to uploading COVID app data from a mobile telecommunications device to the National COVIDSafe Data Store.

    40

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      From “Atlas Shrugged” :

      ““Did you really think we want those laws observed?” said Dr. Ferris. “We want them to be broken. You’d better get it straight that it’s not a bunch of boy scouts you’re up against… We’re after power and we mean it… There’s no way to rule innocent men. The only power any government has is the power to crack down on criminals.

      “Well, when there aren’t enough criminals one makes them. One declares so many things to be a crime that it becomes impossible for men to live without breaking laws. Who wants a nation of law-abiding citizens? What’s there in that for anyone?

      “But just pass the kind of laws that can neither be observed nor enforced or objectively interpreted – and you create a nation of law-breakers – and then you cash in on guilt.

      “Now that’s the system, Mr. Reardon, that’s the game, and once you understand it, you’ll be much easier to deal with.”

      40

  • #
    Ossqss

    FYI, several smartphones have a heart rate and SpO2 sensor built into them. My Samsung Note has one right below the camera.

    10

  • #
    Ossqss

    IIRC, when the virus binds to receptors in the body, the chain reaction that follows disassociates iron from the blood cells and inhibits the transfer of Oxygen to the body from the lungs.

    30

  • #
    Roy Hogue

    So here i am sitting here with my puls ozimeterr on my finger and the spO2 is 88, Does that mean I caught the virus or does it mean my body sin’t standard issue

    My spO2 has alarmed doctors ad nurses 2002 and I don’t know of a single thing it has done to hurt me. At just 5,000 feet above sea level you cannot possibly have that ideal 98% spo2. There are 10 and 12,000 foot mountains within easy dive

    i have flown unpressurized airplanes as high as 10,400, I have been to the top of Pike’s peak {13,442 feet} and took no harm.

    How do I ue my spO2 ro tell if i may have XC10/

    10

  • #

    This link HAS been posted several times in the comments above, but I’ll post it again for emphasis. It’s amazing how much suppression of information is happening with this epidemic. COVID-19 binds to and destroys the functionality of hemoglobin, also releasing the iron to cause a further cascade of oxidative damage.

    You’d think this news would have spread widely and been seen by all medical staff. But apparently not, since the article above interprets falling blood oxygen saturation as due to blood clots in the lungs. When in fact both the falling oxygen levels and blood clots are consequences of the hemoglobin destruction and damage by released iron.

    20200412
    https://www.iceagenow.info/covid-19-had-us-all-fooled-but-we-might-have-found-its-secret/
    Covid-19 had us all fooled, but we might have found its secret
    http://web.archive.org/web/20200405061401/https://medium.com/@agaiziunas/covid-19-had-us-all-fooled-but-now-we-might-have-finally-found-its-secret-91182386efcb

    Extract:
    “COVID-19 causes prolonged and progressive hypoxia (starving your body of oxygen) by binding to the heme groups in hemoglobin in your red blood cells. People are simply desaturating (losing o2 in their blood), and that’s what eventually leads to organ failures that kill them, not any form of ARDS or pneumonia. All the damage to the lungs you see in CT scans are from the release of oxidative iron from the hemes, this overwhelms the natural defenses against pulmonary oxidative stress and causes that nice, always-bilateral ground glass opacity in the lungs. Patients returning for re-hospitalization days or weeks after recovery suffering from apparent delayed post-hypoxic leukoencephalopathy strengthen the notion COVID-19 patients are suffering from hypoxia despite no signs of respiratory ‘tire out’ or fatigue.”

    There are quite a few other details about COVID-19, its origins and cures, that are not getting the public exposure they deserve.
    My links collection: http://everist.org/archives/links/__Coronavirus_info.txt

    00

  • #
    MP

    and it ended up in the wrong place??????

    20

  • #
    MP

    I can fully understand the dilution part, I was hopping you would delete all my replies to myself.
    I would of had the conversation with Klem, maybe I would learn something. I am extremely concerned with our current trajectory and peoples response to these concerns. They are protesting with guns in the states, this must be avoided, but at the same time it must be defended. The conversation needs to be had.
    Their are a lot of people out there with the same concerns I have “Globalists”.
    Have you had a look at this yet (below) you have to sign up, email, from the world economic forum, event201.
    https://intelligence.weforum.org/topics/a1G0X000006O6EHUA0?tab=publications

    Slice away

    31

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    This is another way of getting to the WEF.ch web site Ive been talking about.

    It pretty much covers the globalist play book for how things are to be done.

    Cov19 isn’t so much a disease, as a catalyst to pursue the globalist agenda by steamrolling civil liberties, under the guise of “war time” powers.

    No other way could the globalists move their agenda forward so fast unless civil liberties were suspended.

    If people think the covid tracking app is just an anomaly, how long before leaving the house with out a mobile phone ( as it is in china I believe ) is illegal.
    Now why would that be?

    The language from govt is like treating us like poorly behaved children. There is much wrong with that. It reflects the globalist “I know whats good for you” mindset.

    It bothers me people don’t look further down the track and question where all this is leading.

    Cov19 is a tool, nothing more. Yes medically bad, but that IMHO is not its main purpose. See above….

    81

  • #
    joseph

    MP, I haven’t done a deep dive into the site yet but the video I linked earlier revealed quite a bit. Enough to convince me that you could derive a lot from a little time spent in there. How many layers did you get through? :-)

    20

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    The problem is Steve
    Is that we have this myth of all humans acting
    Rationally & in a well informed way appreciating the science involved.
    But unfortunately 99% of humans do not act that way.
    Most of us do not act rationally.
    Most of us do not want to become well informed
    And science ?
    Most do not even know what iScience means.
    Most humans act while ignoring all these things.
    Driven by genetic programming
    And emotion.

    As someone once said
    : “No one ever lost money by underestimating human intelligence”

    14

  • #
    Another Ian

    O S

    “If people think the covid tracking app is just an anomaly, how long before leaving the house with out a mobile phone ( as it is in china I believe ) is illegal.”

    Now, if that comes in, do I just have to carry a mobile phone in an area of no coverage or do “the great anonymous they” intend to provide coverage too?

    30

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    But Steve, this CCP virus has lead to the re-assertion of
    National sovereignty all over the world.
    The quarantine measures are just an indication of it.
    Labor Senator Kennealy’s assertion of the need for migration controls
    Is an indication of it.
    The Failure of the WHO and the national responses
    Are indications of it.
    The globalists are stuffed
    And they know it.
    :-)

    01

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    I’d say these days, no coverage is a luxury……enjoy it.

    That said, sat phones can be run for $40/month on iridium

    10

  • #
    WXcycles

    Optus sent me a text message yesterday, it claimed to be a message from the Federal Govt, but I very strongly suspect is wasn’t, given the message heading said it was from Optus. It was Optus requesting that I download the corona virus App, and included a link to it. So even the Telcos are now sending fake .gov texts and pushing it on users of their network.

    Apparently they think I don’t know how to make my own decisions. They’re trying to convert it from voluntary to the ‘politically correct’ version of pushy “voluntary”. Get stuffed Optus, I don’t even use your Optus “Yes” program, it’s nothing but a data gathering ruse.

    30

  • #
    Bill In Oz

    WXC, I was forced recently from Virgin to Optus.
    Not happy to get such messages either.

    But the Ap and it’s backers
    seem to ignore that anyone with a phone which is pre 2016
    Cannot download the thing anyway.
    What percentage of us Australians are using pre 2016 mobiles >

    00

  • #
    MP

    Late in the reply Joseph so you may not see this.
    That thing is massive, but a lot go back to the same topics. What I can see is it covers every aspect of our society and you can look at it two ways due to the wording, I look at the COVID-19 folder thats not a folder as a blanket and under the blanket of COVID-19 is everything else, this is supposed to be the result of the Event201 at the WEF, but it is obvious this was in play long before then.
    As they say, its been in the planning for 50 years.

    00