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Bubble pops: Australian renewables investment down 80% as RET subsidy ends

After billions of dollars of “gifts” to the renewables industry, and a doubling of the wholesale electricity price, wind and solar power are still so inefficient and uneconomic that investors can’t make a profit without getting more free money. After the wild bonanza of the last two years the RET scheme has completed the large scale targets that were set so long ago, and that’s it, ppft.

What was 4,300 MW of new projects per quarter is now just 800MW: 83% less

From the Clean Energy Council

After a record breaking two years of investment in large-scale wind and solar projects, the pace of projects reaching financial close has slowed dramatically over the past two quarters. The Clean Energy Regulator announced this month that the large-scale 2020 Renewable Energy Target (RET) has now been met. What happens next is unclear.

Quarterly investment commitments in new renewable energy projects reached a high of over 4500 MW in late 2018, but has since collapsed to less than 800MW in each of the first two quarters of 2019.

Australian Renewables Investments, 2019, graph.

All bad things are associated with Tony Abbott

This was the first line in the Clean Energy Council announcement:

New investment in renewable energy projects such as solar and wind farms has plunged to levels not seen since Tony Abbott was Prime Minister…

And it’s probably still his fault, somehow.

Unprecedented subsidy brings unprecedented investment

The 2020 large-scale RET was a highly successful policy which drove unprecedented levels of investment in new utility-scale generation over the past two years. Some 15,700 MW of new capacity has been financially committed over the past two years, with that generation either under construction or recently commissioned. This new generation was predominantly in the form of wind and solar, which has been supported more recently by investment in energy storage. With the absence of policy certainty beyond the 2020 RET and a range of regulatory barriers to overcome, investment commitments in new generation have fallen dramatically this year

Financial close is a leading indicator for the level of new generation likely to come online in the future, noting a construction lag of between 6-24 months between financial close and full commissioning. As illustrated in Figure 2 below, the level of new investment committed in the first half of 2019 has fallen to 2016 levels, when then-Prime Minister Tony Abbott attempted to remove the RET and froze the industry during a lengthy review period. And with the rate of new investment now slowing, the forward outlook for wholesale energy prices has started to rise again.

The RET is more a forced payment — money is taken from consumers, secretly snuck out of their electricity bills — and gifted to the renewables industry.

It’s been relentlessly rising for nearly 20 years.

Despite that, the unreliables industry never stopped asking for  “certainty”.

RET Scheme Australia.

,…

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Rating: 9.6/10 (75 votes cast)
Bubble pops: Australian renewables investment down 80% as RET subsidy ends, 9.6 out of 10 based on 75 ratings

324 comments to Bubble pops: Australian renewables investment down 80% as RET subsidy ends

  • #
    David Wojick

    Have the Morrison people said anything about raising, or not raising, the RET? Looks like a great place to stop.

    340

    • #
      el gordo

      The regulator reckons we have reached our 2020 target early, so the government won’t be raising the RET.

      “It is now certain Australia will generate enough renewable energy to meet the 2020 Large-scale Renewable Energy Target,” Clean Energy Regulator chair David Parker said.

      60

    • #
      Graham Richards

      Would someone please show our PM where to find reverse gear! His credibility as a driver will increase at an astounding pace!

      230

      • #
      • #
        Ted O'Brien.

        I’m just hoping that his attack on plastics in the ocean is a red herring.

        50

        • #
          Kalm Keith

          Ted, none of the big supermarkets would complain.

          The Last big hoo haa gave them the excuse to charge for the new “permanent” plastic bags that they could now sell.

          Profit margins increased with a bit of help from global warming crowd.

          Big business triumphs over Little minds.

          KK

          50

          • #
            Greg in NZ

            Plastic bags, you say, Keith…

            Our resident alarmist academic joker, Professor Jim-jam Renwick from Vic Uni, was interviewed by sceptic Sean Plunket on the radio today. I had to grab pen & paper quickly to write this down: “Plastic bags have nothing to do with climate change”. Whoah, but wait, it gets better.

            “If you turned all the lights off in NZ [shut all power generation off] it wouldn’t even make a difference [to the planet's imaginary CO₂ emergency crisis]“. The man is an educated fool, an academic charlatan, a mouthpiece for the elite pond scum. When asked about water vapour versus carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, he went into complete 180˚ back-to-front jibber-jabber UN-speak high-priest zombie mode. The radio host didn’t believe a word of it. Not sure if the audio is avaliable but here’s a link to the show:

            https://www.magic.co.nz/home/shows/talk/magic-afternoons.html

            I’ve still got a stash of illegal plastic bags I began saving a few years back: guess I’ll be hitting Peak Bag soon…

            60

        • #
          GD

          I’m just hoping that his attack on plastics in the ocean is a red herring.

          I reckon it’s just a pacifier for the moderately concerned, quiet Australians. If ScoMo keeps them happy, he’ll be back for another term.

          It won’t please the rabid Green blob because they want complete de-industrialisation of Australia. Perhaps ScoMo isn’t yet ready or wanting to do a Trump/Abbott and go to war with them. Perhaps he’s playing a long game.

          Campbell Newman went too hard, too soon. Tony Abbott tried to go hard and at the same time appease the loonies. Neither approach worked.

          20

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        A temporary, tactical retreat?

        https://www.smh.com.au/environment/climate-change/the-greta-thunberg-circus-has-become-a-complete-farce-20190926-p52v38.html

        “It’s a measure of where we’ve come to in public debate that I have thought more than twice about writing this piece. The days of civilised debate, of accepting different opinions seem to be disappearing.

        “None of us likes being yelled at or chastised for our views. The pleasure of exchanging opinions, exploring them and in the process better understanding or modifying our own is one of the hallmarks of a free society.

        “The Greta Thunberg circus has become a complete farce. Travelling across oceans in emissions-free boats (excluding the making thereof) and doing one’s ablutions into a bucket lined with a biodegradable bag that then gets ditched into the ocean is first-world fake melodrama at its best.

        “If Thunberg wished to address any meeting worldwide on whatever issue she wanted without spewing carbon emissions from either jet or ocean liner travel she could easily do so: The New York Times reports that internationally famous choreographer Jerome Bell has decided to refuse air travel and now works internationally via Skype.

        “It’s a personal choice but I don’t think telling people they’ll never be forgiven, berating them with “how dare you”, does much to bring people on board. Usually it has the opposite effect. It’s just another sad example of serious and complex political issues being reduced to “I’m right and you’re an idiot”. That kind of discourse just pollutes the town square. It’s fractious and shuts others out. It is toxic to democratic debate.
        The whole trip, the hype and the expense was one big media circus. One can’t help but think it’s more to promote the person than the issue. Given the over-dramatisation of global warming by some, including Thunberg, we now have a generation of children worried about being burnt to a crisp.

        “Out of all the 16-year-olds in the world, why is it that just one features in the media worldwide? There are other kids who care as much, are just as articulate, just as concerned. If you think the world focussing on this one young girl was just some happy accident you are plugged into a faulty socket.

        110

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      This is a puff piece designed to put pressure on the Commonwealth government to stump up
      Lots more money,
      For the wonky ‘clean’ ( ? ) energy regulator to waste on more unreliable & expensive
      Wind towers and solar panels.
      With any luck the government will tell him to p#ss off.
      After all they want more budget surpluses !

      90

    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      David, I haven’t seen any comment that tells me that others see what I see, but there’s a lot unmentioned in comment to date.

      The Morrison government is a coalition of the Liberal Party (nominal conservatives) and the National Party, formerly called the Country party. The Nats are seen as in some respects more conservative, in other respects as socialists. They do not nominate in urban areas.

      Nobody ever pointed it out, but I am sure that it was the Nationals in the coalition who kept the Liberals from embracing the AGW scam, ever since Barnaby Joyce was elected to the senate about 2005. Prior to that time the Nationals were going down the gurgler. Trump has a marvellous saying for it, “They are nice people, but they are stupid”. Barnaby Joyce, who was not a career politician, was at the time of his election the only working business accountant in the parliament. He could see what was being done, and was able to show the numbers to sway the Liberals at the time.

      He also saved the Nationals from the annihilation that was looming for them at the 2010 federal election, though I am sure that a lot of people do not know that.

      There has been an awful lot of upheaval in the Liberal party, all over the AGW issue, even if they don’t understand that, and mostly, I am sure, this has persisted because the Nats stood against AGW. So where to now?

      Barnaby Joyce got to be leader of the Nationals and Deputy Prime Minister. I feel sure that he was probably the most hated man in creation for the AGWarmists in the Liberal party. Eventually his dedication to our service broke him and his family. He flamed out in spectacular fashion. Which brought new leadership for the Nationals, under the AGW cloud.

      In NSW we have a coalition government which has been doing very strange things. AGW is actively promoted by Liberal ministers, and the Nationals are promoting Greens policies. I can only put it down to Stockholm Syndrome. How much longer this can go on I don’t know, but it’s insane.

      I think an election is coming up in Queensland. Two elections ago the ALP was reduced to a Tarago load in the parliament. Just eight members. But, by maintaining a barrage of personal vilification against the liberal Premier they regained government at the next election. They have governed for communism since the last election, so shouldn’t win again this time, but look what we have seen already.

      The ALP went into the recent federal election with hubris untrammelled. Clearly they believed that they had the numbers to win government and complete their grand Marxist plan. Their policy platform was 1. Set young people against old people, 2. Burgle savings, 3. Shut our factories with high energy costs, 4. Declare that they were not able to keep the accounts, 5. Tell dissidents if you don’t like us, vote for somebody else.

      I find it a matter for huge concern that nearly half the people still voted for them. Where did they get these numbers to support such policies?

      I am quite sure that they got them through brainwashing in our education system, and calculated on that basis.

      160

      • #
        Kalm Keith

        Good piece Ted.

        Highly appropriate to be reminded of the “Stockholm Syndrome”.

        They’ll spend as much of our money as is necessary to make them appear votable. We or our kids can always pay it off later.

        KK

        40

        • #
          Ted O'Brien.

          Keith, they really ad truly believe that governments don’t have to pay their bills. They believe that if they are a dollar short, they can print it.

          30

      • #
        theRealUniverse

        ‘I think an election is coming up in Queensland.’ yes and a certain minister who did NOT declare her rental investment (covered up) she got away with it..instead of the sack as she should have been. They are still there..will the voters see through it? going on the Federal results , maybe?

        40

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        The people who set up Australia clearly realized that to maintain any form of sham “legitimacy” for govt, people had to be forced to vote. Most Austrtalians can smell BS from miles away, so even though people are foced to vote in one bad bunch after another, they feel vested in the descision, which is seriously messed up, but then people are often quite not-so-smart herd animals…which is why Stockholm Syndrome is correct and why at time we cant get out of our own way….and which is why when people feel thehave no choice , rather than stoppig and saying “this is dumb and I ant doin it no more”, will whither under the hard stares of those who dont seem to have backbones either….

        We now have a domesticated herd who happily bleat platitudes, buyt dont seem to mind too much when one of their number is taken by the “wolves”.

        People are also brow beaten by govt into compliance, and then those who fear rejection by being different, force anyone with an ounce of independance, into line if they can.

        This then gives credence to the phrase “You get the govt you deserve”.

        We need a few rebels and “anarchists” who stir the pot – some of the sheeple will wake up and join the enlightened, but many wont.

        “Sensible people will see trouble coming and avoid it, but an unthinking person will walk right into it and regret it later.”
        ( Prov 22:3 )

        40

      • #
        glen Michel

        As HL Mencken puts it like the purpose of government is to keep the populace alarmed and then deliver them from the threat. Elites- the movers and shakers behind the scenes that influence the wider polity have their agenda, but most politicians are oblivious. Sounds like conspiracy eh!

        30

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    Well, this is good news.

    Trouble is we still have a dysfunctional electricity generation and distribution system and the cleanup that is coming from rooftop, solar farming and wind turbines is a storm gathering on the horizon.

    The base of our Kooragang wind turbine is still in the ground as a reminder of the “ecological” reality of renewables.

    A money making Kon job.

    KK

    230

    • #

      The MSM etc still talks about maximum theoretical output, but how much would really have to be installed if 24/7/365 actual output were to be achieved with renewables’, and at what cost?

      160

      • #
        glen Michel

        I seem to recall that last year Alan Kohler called for subsidies to be removed.Whatever his reasonings were at time – I can only think that he thought renewables could stand up in the free market.I will await his revised assessment.

        90

        • #
          glen Michel

          I also read a recent article which had the renewable sector complaining about poor infrastructure leading to poor access to the grid. Nothing new there of course for people who have got their heads around this grand boondoggle. Even so, some people are so glassy- eyed about saving the planet that when you tell them the plain and obvious truth behin d this, they don’t believe you. For heavens sake don’t give them any more Angus.

          130

          • #
            Graeme#4

            There was a recent article in The Australian on this, with lots of interesting comments. Seems the AEMO’s requirements will now mean that the new renewables could lose up to 25% of their profit margin, and may make some of them unprofitable. Last night Trevor St Baker had some scathing words to say about Renewable companies that didn’t manage to plan correctly, and seemed to assume that the governments would pay for extra transmission services.

            130

          • #
            Lance

            The claim of “poor infrastructure leading to poor access to the grid” is a thief’s way of saying “why don’t the little people pay for the transmission lines that will make my boondoggle profitable?”

            Fact is, Wind and Solar purveyors ought to pay for their own transmission lines and substations. Those things are “part and parcel” of supplying power. The Ratepayers/Taxpayers have already paid for the system components and the parasites want them to pay again to keep the easy money flowing into their pockets.

            It is past time for the populace to ask “if this crappy energy is so cheap, why are we paying so much?”

            The fact is that the populace are being fleeced by their own government and investment cartels. Nobody is doing the people any favours. Like the song says “@ss, Gas, Cash, or Grass, Nobody rides for free”.

            120

            • #

              If the renewable providor chooses to site their generation in an out of the way place then expecting the govt to fund the extra transmission lines alone is a bit rich. With the Kidston development in North QLD our dear Labor State govt is doing just that…

              Agree that we have to stop talking about “200MW” solar farms. That is the maximum output, but in reality the actual output over a 24 hour period is less than 60MW and its concentrated only in 6-8 hours during the day (if its a sunny day).

              New renewable generation needs to banned, unless they have storage and backup installed to match and enable 24/7 delivery. All or nothing power supply without storage or back up is just stupid and can only be tolerated at small percentages in the grid. Surprise Surprise, when that is factored in nearly all of these schemes would be rendered uneconomic…

              80

        • #

          A windmill is an awkward thing,
          like some bestiary-2-headed beast
          stomping the land with back to front feet…

          https://www.etsy.com/ca/listing/645165900/medieval-bestiary-art-print-aberdeen 00

          …those 200-metre-long unwieldy metre arms that whirl
          too fast if the wind ain’t Goldilocks’ right
          or the breeze don’t blow enough, -
          no wonder subsidies are needed to
          keep ‘em on life-support
          for when the wind don’t blow or
          blows too much or …

          40

      • #
        daw

        I am as bemused as you Bemused. The CEC and others just don’t don’t get the concept of ‘varying electricity demand’ and the need to match supply with demand.
        There are none so blind as those that will not see!

        60

        • #
          Bill in Oz

          It is the
          Unclean Energy Council !
          And so very keen
          To make us pay for it’s
          Dopey unclean
          inefficient, expensive and ineffective
          Windy & sunny electrons !
          Close it down !
          Defund it it !
          Let it wither & die !

          90

      • #
        theRealUniverse

        ‘but how much would really have to be installed if 24/7/365 actual output were to be achieved with renewables’’ astronomical numbers.

        00

    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      I haven’t been to Kooragang for many years, and wondered if it was still there.

      10

      • #
        Kalm Keith

        Yes, I think they sold it to someone in Tasmania.

        The steel column appears to have been cut off at the base about 6″ above the concrete.

        The concrete is still there, left as a donation to the city.

        From an engineering perspective these things are a staggering waste of materials compared with coal fired generators.

        The only purpose served by this one was the advertising value, it could be seen as a beginning of the green revolution.

        KK

        30

      • #
        beowulf

        We can only hope the rest meet the same fate very soon, but that the owners are also forced to remediate their sites completely, including the concrete bases. The Kooragang fan should have been saved and mounted in a museum as a testament to monumental stupidity and greed.

        It was turned off at 17 years of age by which time its repair bill made it totally uneconomic even with CSIRO funding. Some genius wanted it to be donated to a charity. Just what every charity needs — a defunct bird-mincer. I wonder how many it killed in 17 years given its proximity to the Lower Hunter wetlands? Who cares eh — it’s free green energy.

        30

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          beowulf:
          I don’t know how many birds it killed, but every time I went past it it wasn’t turning except once (and I decided at that speed it was probably drawing electricity not generating.)

          40

  • #
    Latus Dextro

    So, who’s going to pay for the safe clean disposal and replacement of all this toxic, expensive, uneconomic virtue signalling nameplate junk in 15 – 20 years? Stop the subsidy boondoggle and the “investment” ceases. EV’s are a prime example. None of the politicians or bureaucrats will be around then to be held to account. They’ll be long gone or have scuttled for the hills.
    And given the de-population, de-industrialisation, societal dismantling and destitution advocated by the Greens this emblematic extravaganza has only one destiny. As it fails, wears out and becomes hopelessly inefficient, it will become a stark enduring testament to the extraordinary levels of impoverishing wastefulness and politically sanctioned thievery that were propelled by remote eco-Marxist bureaucrats of the UNEP/IPCC/UNFCCC, and quite likely, an enduring admonition for generations to come.

    210

    • #
      James Murphy

      I wouldn’t worry, we are all supposed to be dead in 12 years.

      300

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      The price of freedom is eternal vigilance.

      Sadly the only vigilance exercised has been by those fleecing us in their endeavour not to get caught.

      Australia was a country that people fought for, worked for and had hope for but now we are so poorly served by politics that easy measures are implimented to get to the next election safely. Accordingly, the reserve bank will “prime” what’s left of the economy with another interest rate reduction this month and that will be followed by a further reduction in value of the Australian Dollar: all fixed.

      ScoMo444 signed the cheque for MalEx444, enough said.

      KK

      180

    • #
      David-of-Cooyal-in-Oz

      This may be a sign of hope. Morrison’s speech to the UN is a bit softer than I’d have hoped, but may be as much as could be expected, or acceptable at that forum. Certainly a contrast that Greta.

      https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-26/morrison-un-speech-to-slam-australias-climate-change-critics/11549154

      I just hope someone is educating him about the big scam as well.
      Cheers
      Dave B

      80

      • #
        glen Michel

        About the corruption and debasement of science.I’m still waiting for the breakthrough moment that reveals this mendacity.

        61

      • #
        John in Oz

        I just hope someone is educating him about the big scam as well.

        I’m not sure our politicians ever read anything that might make them give up on this farce. Any communication to them will have to go through the minders and gate-keepers so they may be merely listening to their ‘advisors’.

        How many of them have seen the quotes attributed to UN/IPCC hierarchy whereby they are saying they wish to destroy capitalism and re-distribute the world’s finances (with a little ‘management’ taken along the way?

        If they have seen these quotes and listened to the anti-CAGW scientists then they are complicit with the rest of the doom-sayers and deserve the tar and feathers that are (hopefully) coming.

        90

        • #
          Sceptical Sam

          I’m sure Tony Abbott has given him a full and frank briefing.

          They know the truth. They’re calculating how long it takes to turn the Titanic in an ocean full of icebergs.

          30

      • #
        robert rosicka

        It’s about time the Libs grew a pair and appointed Craig Kelly as a minister for the environment or create a climate change portfolio.
        Even the ABC won’t fact check him anymore because he speaks with knowledge of the science not rhetoric or emotion .
        No good when the other ministers and PM keep spouting we accept the science without knowing what the science says .

        70

        • #
          theRealUniverse

          ABC today had another ‘science’ wizz bang science pommie (nothing against the brits) but he sounded typical BBC (accent) science type I didnt catch his name. Raving on about how we can sequester CO2 and save it going into the sky. Other topic was on ‘communicating with alien civilizations’ but I missed the beginning. Some science is away with the fairies. Ask the aliens if they want to invade us..200 lyr away..thats a 400 year long return phone call ‘hello do you speak english?’ (probably on 5G).
          I dont know where they get these people.

          On the climate is is so obvious that the ABC is pushing as hard as they can the ‘Climate Agenda’. Last dying cries?

          40

          • #
            Kalm Keith

            “Last dying cries?”

            Don’t tease.

            50

          • #
            Latus Dextro

            Last dying cries?

            Damned right. A perfect storm is well on the way.
            The massive global rise of popular nationalism and the grand solar minimum, the rejection of open borders, decimation of culture, customs and tradition, and for example, the Leftist theatrics of Greta and the hijab virtue signalling PM of NZ, the vacant hysterics of the Squad, the late term infanticidal maniacs, the whole sordid Leftist melange of murderous chaos and projection, their hypocrisy is on full display, the sick ideological revolution is clearly unravelling when they stoop to the like of the handled Stepford troll, Greta, or to censorship, hate speech, banning people like Stefan Molyneux or Lauren Southern, scared to death that their brittle fragile narrative will be exposed for the wanton fraud it so clearly is and represents.
            The silent majority of people are sick of the insanity. As Orwell suggested, the proles will save the day. It definitely won’t be the frappe sippers at the Con or their tertiary friends latched onto the spigot of infinite funding for policy-based scientivism, or the adherents of ethno-nationalism and super-diversity in a silly little country that advocates for remoaners yet can’t even manage a common currency or open borders and free trade with its cultural twin.
            What a pantomime, what a farce, what a failure.

            70

    • #
      Mal

      The Parasites Climate agreement spawned the renewables
      clean energy parasites.
      Like all parasites, the will keep sucking the life out of the host until it destroys it.

      110

    • #
      theRealUniverse

      What part of ‘(un)renewable energy’ cant replace good old, coal, hydro, nuclear , depending where you live, energy, dont they understand. It just doesnt work. Targets are meaningless, invented numbers.
      “if we get to our RET then we will save xx amount of CO2″ total baloney. None of this stuff is replacing the main generators, and when it does as in demolishing perfectly good coal power stations, the capacity drops.
      Absolute lunacy!

      100

  • #
    Richard Ilfeld

    Can’t one expect that the voices that have been preaching about the competitiveness of renewables & their glorious future will step up to provide plenty of investment capital?
    Or are they only able to spend other people’s money. We know the answer.

    160

  • #
    Kalm Keith

    From previous.

    Sounds like ” the Market ” has been modified enough to put responsibility where it truly belongs for dealing with the problems of renewables.

    These had previously been hidden in the system by deliberate political activity which had both residential and industrial consumers paying for the structural changes in poles and wires: gold plating.

    Political electricity was always designed to rip us off and to make it appear that all was well the pollies have closed down industry rather than build properly engineered electricity generation plant.

    Sounds like someone has made a start on dismantling this disgusting imposition on the community and not before time.

    KK

    http://joannenova.com.au/2019/09/midweek-unthreaded-84/#comment-2194970

    60

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      The ACT govt is basically moving to phase out gas usage for heating and well … anything ….

      Now factor in a broken and stupidly expensive 3rd-world electricity “supply” if you can call it that and you have a whole state in worse state that SA…and thats saying something…..

      Having said that, I cant imagine the public service grand poobahs and pollies going without heat…maybe the ACT citizens might freeze to death in thier houses but …meh….they are worker ants so they probably dont care….

      As long as the ACT Politburo members are warm and have thier lake burley griffin dachas heated…all good….

      30

  • #
    pattoh

    I cynic would say:-
    “Hell, why invest in big expensive white elephants which cost lots of money, disrupt the economy & don’t deliver!”

    The coming negative interest rate regime on EVERY THING will destroy savings pools – dis-incentivise “Time Preference Savings” at the base of the global fractional reserve finance.

    As we are all happy little iSpy entrained lemmings; we will continue to drink the Kool-Aid, trust our Government, listen to our erudite Movie Stars & Popstars, wave our placards at TWO MINUTE HATE(s) &
    with negative interest rate credit QE – utterly baseless money :-
    BUY, BUY, BUY all those things which our consumerism* addicted hearts desire!

    Hey, who needs a Global Carbon Credit currency when the reset after the coming callapse will be based around whatever the BIS & IMF cook up.

    Who ever controls that will be the owner of ALL things & Slave master to all.

    * Consumerism – buying things you don’t need with money you dont have to impress people who don’t care……….

    90

  • #
    el gordo

    Canberra is in tandem with Beijing.

    ‘China will end subsidies for new onshore wind power projects at the start of 2021, with renewable projects set to compete on an equal footing with coal- and gas-fired electricity, the country’s state planning agency said on Friday.’ Reuters

    90

  • #
    Robber

    Don’t forget we still have the small-scale RET and State government incentives for even more rooftop solar.
    And despite midday wholesale electricity prices often dropping to near zero because of the glut of solar, rooftop solar owners are still receiving 11 cents/kWhr. Yet when the sun goes down, wholesale prices often jump to 15-20 cents/kWhr to meet demand that must be supplied by reliable coal and gas generators that must stand idle when the wind blows and the sun shines.
    If intermittents were effective in supplying the grid with electricity, no targets would be required.

    130

    • #
      Kalm Keith

      So, state government virtue signalling still has to be dealt with. Buying votes with tax money should stop.

      61

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      And here in South Australia
      The cash strapped Liberal government
      Is wasting $100 million dollars on bloody batteries subsidies.
      Just more money for Tesla
      To help it avoid going bust !
      But that fate is inevitable.

      50

  • #
    Ross

    Is this a surprise to the Govt. and investors? You only had to go back 10 or so years and look at what happened in Spain when they suddenly realised their subsidies for solar were unsustainable. The same thing has repeated regularly elsewhere when the subsidies are removed.
    In Germany the first wind farms are now 20 years old and subsidies are now going on these (the deal “only” lasted for 20 yrs). The owners have their hands out for more subsidies to pay for upgrading technology or complete replacement. So after 20 yrs they could not make a real business out of it(or so they say).

    91

  • #
    Antoine D'Arche

    as Tony from Oz so often reminds us, nameplate is meaningless with solar and wind.
    So it’s actually fallen from 860-1075MW down to 160-200MW.
    None of which is worth even a single coal plant.

    140

  • #
    Terry

    But, but, but…they’re cheaper! How can this be?

    50

  • #
  • #

    [...] Nova on the breaking bubble of RE investment in Australia. Also on cherry-picking data by NASA and [...]

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  • #
    PeterS

    Let me get this straight. The RETS is coming to and end yet the power companies are still investing more and more in renewables by increasing our power bills by sleight of hand. If that’s the case PM Morrison has to step in and do something to put a stop to this madness. Given he has been boasting at the UN about how we are meeting our emissions targets to fight climate change I won’t hold my breadth. He is looking more and more like Turnbull – a fake and a hypocrite.

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  • #
    theRealUniverse

    Just saw this opinion on Sputnik from John Gaunt on ‘Greta’
    Good analysis
    https://sputniknews.com/columnists/201909251076890517-who-is-controlling-greta/

    (Sputnik often publishes stupid reports on ‘climate change’ and isnt exactly the paragon of disbelief.) I mainly peruse it see whats going on..

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  • #
    Peter Fitzroy

    The AER has just released a couple of papers which when read, castigate the distribution network operators for not doing enough to transition the network from the old model to one which will cope with roof-top and renewables. What they say is that inaction means that there is now a problem with grid congestion. At the same time renewable pricing is now matching that of coal.

    So in a world where the price has gone through the roof in terms of the charges paid to distributors to do their job, instead of investing in improvements, they have been paying record dividends to their shareholders.

    All this against the background target of the RET which achieved its aim of 20% by 2020, which in a sane world, would have meant that transmission utilities should have reacted to that by investing in improvements

    Do we castigate the utilities for making record profits, no. Why, because the investment returns to super funds, and other large investors can not be beat.

    Instead we yell “Burn the Witches*”

    (*Witches = renewables)

    019

    • #
      Bill in Oz

      Dear me Peter
      What a big problem !
      NOT !
      But will you step in and spend your huge fortune
      Subsidising the cost of
      transitioning the network from the old model to the
      New grossly expensive super duper one ?
      ‘No!’
      I hear you think !
      Why what hypocrite you are Fitz !
      Put YOUR money where your mouth is !

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      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Bill, the cost of transition is no different to the network operators than the cost of build new links to supply growth and changes to industry and population distribution, and they have had 10 years to make these changes, but they have done nothing. Well when I say nothing, what I mean is that shareholder returns have been prioritised. I’m guessing that you have an interest in maintaining those returns, but lets burn some witches

        020

        • #
          Lance

          Peter, your argument is ignorant, asinine, and puerile.

          The Rate Payers and Tax Payers have already PAID for the transmission and distribution networks needed for their interests.

          You don’t seem to understand that a Utility does NOT plan for “freebies and subsidies” to make unreliable power profitable for special interests. Transmission lines and distribution cost somewhere near USD 1 Million per kM. Just because some @sshat decides to build a wind tower or solar farm on some economically beneficial (to them) location, you seem to advocate that the cost of building hundreds of kM of poles and wires is somehow equivalent to funding stable, dispatchable, reliable, power. Nothing could be further from the truth.

          Wind and Solar ONLY benefit to a utility is to reduce the fuel cost while they actually produce power. That is the sum total benefit of your unreliable power.

          At the same time, the Utility has to lose money, maintain lines and substations, and generate the reactive power needed to support line voltage, and bear the responsibility of frequency control, all at Zero Cost to the Unreliable, Non DIspatchable, Un Helpful, solar and wind cartels.

          Evidently, Economics is not your forte. Neither is grid operation and maintenance.

          Your viewpoint is juvenile, uninformed, biased, ignorant, and parasitic.

          If you want to generate power that is useful, then it might make sense to extend transmission lines to those sources. Unreliable, non dispatchable, generation that cannot provide reactive power or assist with frequency control is F*king useless crap. They ought to be paying the Utility to “take” their useless energy.

          [Lance, this is written with too much heat. Please rewrite with less of the nasty language.]ED

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        • #
          Bill in Oz

          New links to reliable base load power
          Is an efficient use of money for consumers
          New links to solar which does not work when the sun doesn’t shine is a waste of money
          New links to wind turbines which only generate when the wind blows is also a waste of money.

          If you are so keen Fitz
          Spend your fortune on it !
          Put your money where your ever open mouth is for once !

          70

        • #
          Lance

          Peter, your position is detached from reality.

          The Rate Payers and Tax Payers have already PAID for the transmission and distribution networks needed for their interests.

          A Utility does NOT plan for “freebies and subsidies” to make unreliable power profitable for special interests. Transmission lines and distribution cost somewhere near USD 1 Million per kM. Just because some @sshat decides to build a wind tower or solar farm on some economically beneficial (to them) location, you seem to advocate that the cost of building hundreds of kM of poles and wires is somehow equivalent to funding stable, dispatchable, reliable, power. Nothing could be further from the truth.

          Wind and Solar ONLY benefit to a utility is to reduce the fuel cost while they actually produce power. That is the sum total benefit of their unreliable power. stressing they existing system for politically mandated preference.

          At the same time, the Utility has to lose money ramping their otherwise efficient system, maintain lines and substations, and generate the reactive power needed to support line voltage, and bear the responsibility of frequency control, all at Zero Cost to the Unreliable, Non DIspatchable, Un Helpful, solar and wind cartels.

          Evidently, Economics is not your forte. Neither is grid operation and maintenance.

          If you want to generate power that is useful, then it might make sense to extend transmission lines to those sources. Unreliable, non dispatchable, generation that cannot provide reactive power or assist with frequency control is provably useless crap. They ought to be paying the Utility to “take” their useless energy rather than whining about how little free preference they are provided.

          Lets suppose we plan a bar b que. I buy the food, prepare it, serve it, and clean up. Then some fellow comes along and says “But Wait. I ate for free, did nothing, And now you owe me for my time spent at the Barby”. That is essentially your argument.

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          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            Lance
            Firstly: thanks for not reading my links.
            Secondly: In Australia, the Electricity industry is broken into 3 sections – Generators, Distributors, and Retail. Some companies have assets in all three, but functionally they are independent, and the AER regulates prices, as well as opex and capex (the last two are based around the financial plans for the 3 year outlook)
            Thirdly: as stated, they had 10 years to do this.
            Fourthly: Grid Scale batteries (owned by the renewable crowd) do a fantastic job of frequency control.
            Fithly: The aim of the AER is to keep generated rooftop solar on the premise, by encouraging the installation of batteries.

            Lasty: Do not insult my intelligence first up, unless you are prepared to do it to my face – this blog is not the place

            015

            • #
              AndyG55

              “Do not insult my intelligence first up”

              We leave that totally up to you PF !

              And you do it constantly.

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            • #
              AndyG55

              “by encouraging the installation of batteries.”

              Which have limited capacity and push the cost of wind and solar to way more than coal or gas. Charge then using coal fired electricity, hey PF.

              Economic IDIOCY, the PF way !

              To have ZERO EFFECT on a NON-PROBLEM.

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              • #
                Bobl

                They are also a large reason why renewable life cycle CO2 emissions are more than coal. Peter of course continues to fail to acknowledge the fact that his favoured energy tech doesn’t even solve the problem it’s supposed to. Renewables bring forward emission and increase emission compared with coal. Over 60% of renewable generation is consumed by the renewable energy sector itself and the assets displace CO2 sinks making renewables an extremely CO2 intensive industry. They are useless for generation and don’t solve the problem of CO2 emission anyway.

                10

            • #
              Lance

              That’s pretty funny, Peter.

              Parsing responsibility in a shell game.

              Your Unreliables have had 10 years to pay their share of the cost and haven’t done it.

              Batteries do absolutely nothing for frequency control. Or didn’t you know that?

              Grid scale power is ALL about voltage, frequency, and reactive power control.

              Explain how batteries relate to frequency. I’ll wait for that, because you can’t do it.
              Your link is propaganda and explains nothing.

              You blaze away but have nothing to show for it.

              This blog is the perfect place for you to explain with details how intermittent, non dispatchable, unreliable, generators, can approach grid reliability, voltage stability, frequency stability, and reactive power requirements.

              Lastly, do not enter into a discussion you are not able to win. Unless you have a great deal of grid scale power engineering experience, I’m afraid you will simply humiliate yourself.

              Blowhards are a dime a dozen. Bring the meat and answer the direct questions, or go home and cry.

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              • #
                AndyG55

                ” answer the direct questions, “

                Not a chance of that from PF !

                He’ll cut and paste another irrelevant propaganda link, or some other AGW nonsense…

                .. because he doesn’t know any better.

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              • #
                theRealUniverse

                Turbines , steam (coal ,gas, nuclear) and water (hydro) can be load controlled at 3000rpm (50Hz) very precisely. Intermittents cant. Complex control is needed to get stable output from variable wind and expensive invertors needed to convert the DC to 50Hz (solar). The whole thing is idiotic.

                50

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                read the links

                15

              • #
                AndyG55

                Poor PF, I suggest YOU read the links first.

                You have proven time and time again that your knowledge and comprehension of basically anything is rudimentary at best.

                Here is the ACTUAL DATA from Germany showing just how pathetic wind power is.

                Solar as well.

                Wind: Below 50% of nameplate 95% of the time.
                and Below 20% of nameplate 60% of the time

                Solar:
                ZERO % of nameplate more than 50% of the time
                and below 20% of nameplate about 80% of the time

                These are TOYS, PF !!!

                Not fit for purpose.

                All your link are proving is that wind and solar are causing massive disruption to the grid, and that they expect “somebody else” to fix their problem

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              • #
                sophocles

                Because you don’t follow links either Peter, here is one more for you (not) to read.
                If you do read it, and think about it, you will realise:
                - `decarbonizing’ western economies is not necessary
                - it’s economically destructive
                - burning coal with smokestack scrubbers and precipitators is all that is necessary for reliable clean electric power
                - the grid does not need pointless re-engineering
                - windmills and photo-cells are totally unnecessary
                - the UN is a blight on human civilization
                - etc etc etc.

                … because it doesn’t matter at all how much CO2 mankind emits. The plants will just love us for it.
                They mostly evolved when atmospheric CO2 was 900 – 1500 ppmv. As Professor William Happer says: “the planet is in a CO2 drought.”

                Here’s your link:
                https://principia-scientific.org/outstanding-new-website-global-warming-solved/ (2014)

                30

            • #
              AndyG55

              “” answer the direct questions, “

              PF, there is nothing in your links that answers the direct question

              You are ducking and weaving just like you always do,

              … because you KNOW that you know absolutely S*A about it.

              40

        • #
          Lance

          The cost to build transmission and distribution is not insignificant. At USD 1 Million per km.

          Substations are incredibly costly. As are secondary distribution and substations.

          Apparently, you think all those costs are null. Either they are, or they aren’t.

          The entire output of the “Tesla Lithium Ion Gigafactory” on an annual basis is less than 3 minutes of US demand. For AU, that would be something like an Hour.

          Let’s put this in perspective. On average, there are 7 days in any given year where there is no wind, no solar. So, that is equivalent to the next 10 Thousand Years of “Gigafactory” battery capacity. Just for 7 days. Just for the US. Ok. for AU, simply the next 50 years of production.

          So tell me. The grid needs 200 MW of reactive power at 1800 hrs tomorrow or the grid will go black. How many batteries is that? How many years must one wait for that capacity? Oh. The grid needs 500 MW of reactive power at exactly 1345 Hrs for 15 minutes. Who provides that? At 1400 Hrs, the grid needs 150 MW of reactive power. Who provides that?

          Tell us.

          60

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            Firstly infrastructure of the electrical type lasts for ages, cost is therefore relatively cheap given the 50+ years life expectancy, I’ve managed assets in western NSW which are almost 100 years old, and according to the inspection reports, are as good as new.

            AS to your 7 day claim, do you have link? IS that for the whole grid simultaneously, because that is not true on the australian grid, and we have hydro, as does the US as well as nuclear.

            As to dismissing anything which does not agree with your viewpoint, so what. The facts are the facts.

            for example if you distributed buggy whips, and refused to change when automobiles came along, where would you be today. The 20% renewable target was/is a government policy, it was always going to be the case. To not incorporate the necessary changes into your operating budget for next 10 years can only be described as negligent.

            And all utility costs are in the power bill – which is my point. They have being paying shareholders at around 10% return year on year, a sweet deal if I ever saw one.

            08

            • #
              Peter Fitzroy

              Oh and I forgot, I also managed a frequency injector as part of my planing duties. in the this case the frequency injector was an application running on a 20 year old Window NT OS, Both the OS and the application were virtualized and running on the local cloud. The injector software managed all of the real injectors on the grid. To say that you could not do that with grid scale batteries is not true.
              Note NT is still used in a lot of embedded units as it is reliable, and the units themselves are isolated from the general access sections of the internet.

              17

              • #
                Lance

                Frequency injector? WTF is that?

                You do NOT inject frequency. You maintain it. What planet are you on?

                You inject reactive power to meet voltage requirements when the mains voltage is dropping due to inductive reactance. And it has to be injected near the demand, not some infinite distance away.

                Fitz, you have Zero idea what you are speaking about.

                Get an education and then try again.

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            • #
              AndyG55

              “Firstly infrastructure of the electrical type lasts for ages”

              But batteries do NOT.

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              • #
                Bobl

                Not really, poles about 50 years, wires 55-70 but as little as 40 in salt laden regions. Poles can die in 20-30 years if the operating environment is poor (wet)

                The same is true of generation, while coal plants last 50-60 years because they are indoors in a controlled environment, wind turbines and solar panels last only a quarter of that largely because they are exposed to the elements. In the 60 year life of a coal plant, wind and solar plants would need the be renewed 3-4 times. Remember this when comparing costs, take the cost of the renewable plant and multiply it by 4 before you compare it to a fossil fuel generator.

                20

            • #
              el gordo

              ‘To not incorporate the necessary changes into your operating budget for next 10 years can only be described as negligent.’

              Personally I don’t believe the rumour that you are a paid troll with the renewable industry.

              The negligence began with accusations that CO2 is causing global warming, arrogance and ignorance is not a pretty sight.

              30

            • #
              AndyG55

              “To not incorporate the necessary changes into your operating budget for next 10 years can only be described as negligent.”

              Negligence would be wasting a whole heap of money trying to cater for erratic, unreliable power supplies that can only exist with massive subsidies.

              And for absolutely no reason when there are plenty of option for increased supply that are reliable, on demand, and cost less to implement.

              There is NO REASON for wind and solar, except the deceitful lies that are the whole part of the anti-CO2, anti-capitalism agenda. ?

              00

            • #
              tom0mason

              “Firstly infrastructure of the electrical type lasts for ages, cost is therefore relatively cheap given the 50+ years life expectancy, I’ve managed assets in western NSW which are almost 100 years old, and according to the inspection reports, are as good as new.”

              Piffle and nonsense!
              The infrastructure will require continual maintenance, however the big problem is that as the necessary infrastructure for allowing unreliable generation on the grid is vastly more complex, therefore it is more costly to maintain, and as complexity rises then keeping it reliable become increasingly more expensive. No amount of optimism or imagined lifetimes for installed systems can get away from the fact that equipment will require maintenance, more equipment and the more complex the equipment the more costly the maintenance. And yes I too have been a member of a team that managed, maintained, operated and wrote the reports for very high power equipment old equipment (over 70 years old at the time). Equipment where devices and parts were unavailable from OEM as they had long since ceased to be, and bespoke parts were eating up the budget fast as accrued costs for maintenance where approaching the $million/year.

              A properly run grid with just coal, gas, nuclear, and hydro as the generation sources, and the required infrastructure becomes more flexible, simpler, cheaper, and the supply is so much easier to keep stable in both frequency and voltage.
              A win-win on all rounds.

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              • #
                Kalm Keith

                Well said Tomo.

                10

              • #

                tomomason mentions this (my bolding here)

                A properly run grid with just coal, gas, nuclear, and hydro as the generation sources, and the required infrastructure becomes more flexible, simpler, cheaper, and the supply is so much easier to keep stable in both frequency and voltage.

                We have a total Nameplate for wind power of 6702MW. There are 55 wind plants and (around) 3200 Individual generators on top of huge poles. (THIRTY TWO HUNDRED of them)

                We have a total Nameplate for solar power plants of 3427MW. There are 43 solar plants, countless millions of panels, and countless baby inverters.

                Imagine how difficult, and how enormously costly it is to maintain all of that, and to try and keep it stable.

                There are 15 coal fired power plants and just 48 Units in total. Their Nameplate is 23000MW, so wind and solar plant Nameplate multiplied by 2.27.

                However, when it comes to generated power delivered to the grid, coal fired power is wind plus solar multiplied by 7.

                At any one time there might be a quarter of all those coal fired Units off line. (On average there is always 70% of wind power off line, so 2250 of those 3200 wind turbines with their blades stationary)

                It’s easier to look after 48 Units than 3200 of them.

                Tony.

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          • #
            theRealUniverse

            So true Lance anybody disagreeing is a fool..no batteries cannot provide base power.

            20

    • #
      MudCrab

      Witches are renewable. No matter how many we burn we are yet to reach Peak Witch.

      If Drax (sp?) in the UK was converted away from wood and over to witches the world would be cleaner and the price of electricity in the UK would drop. WIN/WIN.

      (okay, we may need to edit the text books to remove reference to the Medieval Witch Hanging Period, but we have GreenWashed the past before. Shouldn’t be hard to do again.)

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    • #
      robert rosicka

      Why should we pay for transmission line upgrades for solar and wind when it should be on them to cover the cost and on going maintenance of the necessary infrastructure.

      90

      • #
        PeterS

        Because Australia must meet its emission reduction target according to our PM. He is a hypocrite.

        40

        • #
          • #
            PeterS

            Why wouldn’t he? He’s doing a great job fighting climate change as reported during his speech at the UN, and we are. Too bad it’s slowly destroying our economy. Goes to show where his priorities truly are. More important to meet our emissions reduction targets than to stop power prices from rising and instead make them come down significantly. He’s now officially a firm believer in fighting the so called climate emergency.

            20

            • #
              theRealUniverse

              Just heard on Aunty (fake) news today midday, some Dick head industry ‘expert’ saying that industry will be doing the renewable thing anyway independent of what politicians do. And ‘they are slowly coming on board with industry’ Yes right.
              You can tell hes just a big mouth for the ‘Big Green’ Renewables industry.

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              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                Better not look at the business pages in the Australian/AFR/SMH/Guardian then – all are carrying the business story of how BHP in Rio Tinto are getting green to the tune of 400 million each. Reminds me of a great quote by writer Kim Stanley Robinson “If they act green, and commit to green policies, then they are green”

                06

              • #
                theRealUniverse

                ‘how BHP in Rio Tinto are getting green to the tune of 400 million each’..follow the green money..why not, if you a rich multinational cooperate bulldog. They dont care, lets put the share price up.

                10

              • #
                Peter Fitzroy

                yep – this is a case of “walk like a duck, quack like a duck…” if you ape the green agenda, then you are green, no matter what is the motivation.

                16

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        did you read my links – they. are. talking. about. rooftop. solar. They want better incentives for batteries on premise, and by they I mean AER.

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        • #
          AndyG55

          “They want better incentives “

          LOL… So “someone else” has to pay, not them.

          Makes roof top solar so un-viable, doesn’t it PF !!

          If you want these things, then PAY FOR THEM YOURSELF. !!!

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          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            Andy – this is capitalism, someone always has to pay, be it directly or indirectly. The point of subsidies, rebates etc is to drive the economy in a particular direction. You are correct we all have to pay, but unless we have a politics which says “no renewables, no subsidies for renewables, no importation of renewable energy” then we are stuck with the policy we have.

            15

            • #
              AndyG55

              Then subsidies are not needed for wind and solar because no rational person what erratic, unreliable electricity supply.

              If these clown want to feed into the grid, they should NOT expect the grid to pay to accommodate them.

              It wouldn’t take a no renewables policy, as we already see, all it takes is the removal of the free pass and subsidies. and feed in mandate

              You and everyone else know they could never exist on a level playing field.

              All it would take is to say that anyone wanting to supply to the grid should be able to supply consistent, on demand electricity, and wind and solar would just disappear, leaving just their toxic rotting carcasses.

              30

            • #
              AndyG55

              “drive the economy in a particular direction”

              What reason is there for driving the economy off a cliff with erratic , unstable expensive electricity?

              We know there is no scientific foundation for doing it, because the life cycle of wind and solar is FAR more polluting of toxic materials than coal fired power.

              Even you are not stupid enough not to see that the whole push for renewables is a dumb, idiotic and totally irrational farce.

              20

            • #
              Tel

              Someone always has to pay under Socialism as well … the nature of the currency might be slightly different but they end up paying one way or another.

              40

            • #
              Mary E

              Peter – no matter the system – capitalism, socialism, communism, etc., etc., someone always has to pay. Usually those least able to, no matter the system.

              If there is a cost of any kind, someone will have to pay it.

              Renewables aren’t. Free electricity isn’t. Unless you like rubbing wool blankets with cats – but harnessing that bit of spark will cost you in the end as well – cats have claws and little patience for human nonsense.

              10

    • #
      el gordo

      ‘At the same time renewable pricing is now matching that of coal.’

      Do you have a graph to support that proposition?

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      • #
        PeterS

        No matter. Our PM has officially announced his commitment to keep reducing our emissions to fight climate change. Of course the most appropriate way to do that is to start building nuclear power plants but instead he’s announced a commitment to build Snowy 2.0. Stupid is as stupid does.

        40

        • #
          el gordo

          Have you got the latest figures on the building costs for one nuclear power station?

          10

          • #
            AndyG55

            And the supply from one nuclear plant ?

            close to 100% 24/365.25, and ON DEMAND. RELIABILITY !!!!!

            Not less than 50% of nameplate 80% of the time like erratic unreliable wind non-power.

            40

          • #
            PeterS

            About 50 nuclear power reactors are currently being constructed in 15 countries, notably China, India, Russia and the United Arab Emirates. I don’t see why we can’t build them if we want clean power. Then again if it costs too much to build them here because of labour and other costs then how come we are building those useless subs here? I don’t care if we never build a nuclear reactor but if we continue to have leaders in both governments and business who clamour to reduce our emissions then let’s do it the only way that works – nuclear. Otherwise, let’s dispense with the hypocrisy and start building coal fired plants. This country has been and still is run but stupid and dangerous people hell bent on sending us over the cliff.

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            • #
              el gordo

              ‘The cost of building the UK’s first new nuclear power plant in a generation has risen by up to £2.9bn and the total bill could be more than £22bn.

              ‘EDF Energy said the construction cost for Hinkley Point C in Somerset had climbed by between £1.9bn to £2.9bn from the company’s last estimates and is running the risk of further delays.’

              Guardian
              —————-
              ‘This country has been and still is run but stupid and dangerous people hell bent on sending us over the cliff.’

              Its alright the ACT is going to legalise an exotic weed, which should have an impact.

              10

              • #
                ivan

                Most of that cost is because of the stupid additional regulations imposed from the anti nuclear lobby that started with the old bags demonstrating at Greenham Common airforce base in the early 80s and it has been added to since then to the detriment of all nuclear power plant building.

                10

            • #
              el gordo

              Perhaps the research on Terrestrial’s Integral Molten Salt Reactor will provide cheaper startups.

              The South African ‘pebble’ has been sidelined.

              00

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        • #
          AndyG55

          Good links

          “In reality, these resources still power most of the planet, while renewable resources like solar and wind only contribute some two to three percent of global energy capacity”

          Yes, we know that despite the billions spent, wind and solar contribute VERY LITTLE

          Then they say.,…

          In terms of environmental impact, solar power is a much more optimal resource than fossil fuels...

          This is a manifest LIE, mis-information.. The building of Wind Turbines requires so of the most toxic WASTE on the planet. The wind turbines themselves will be TOXIC WASTE when decommissioned.

          AEMO seem to think wind and solar will keep growing.

          Well, subsidies have gone.. so NO, they won’t

          Harping on about useless CCS, which is a total nonsense.

          And who is going to pay for these mythical “batteries” that themselves require high loads of toxins to produce.

          This is a FAIRY-TALE wish list of empty and idiotic prophesies.

          Someone is putting your leg again, PF and gullible you falls for it every time.

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          • #
            AndyG55

            Got mixed up, but it applies to both wind turbines and solar panels

            The building of wind turbines and solar panels requires so of the most toxic WASTE on the planet.

            The wind turbines and solar panels themselves will produce huge quantities of TOXIC WASTE when decommissioned.

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          • #
            tom0mason

            But Andy you have to appreciate that the 2-3% generation capacity is the level where the new elites wish all the rest of us to stay.
            We all get to make do on solar and wind (and the massive maintenance headache), while those elites have privately owned generators in the grounds of their many grand mansions, and their private jet(s) and chauffeur(s) gets them to their many important ‘working breakfast/lunch/dinners’.

            30

        • #
          el gordo

          Hmmm … I’m only 13 and lack comprehension.

          Best bet for the renewable industry is to refocus on the outback, satellite cities in mock Martian environments for the tourism trade.

          30

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            El gordo – I’m posting the AER’s outlook, and responded to your question about pricing. In that context, I do not understand your comment. I repeat, what the regulator wants is to keep rooftop solar on the premise (or house/block of flats/school/factory/etc) rather than export it to the grid. Doing that would, in a single step, negate the need to spend up big to control the energy fluctuations which are plaguing the grid do to inataction on the part of the utilities.

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            • #
              AndyG55

              But unless massively subsidised for batteries and the protective bunkers required.

              It isn’t going to happen., !

              And NO, it would not negate the need to control the large swings in frequency due to the idiotic imposition of erratic, unreliable supplies onto the grid.

              Let the erratic suppliers pay to fix the problem they are creating if they want to play with the big boys.

              20

            • #
              el gordo

              Okay thanks for clarifying, I don’t have a problem with that.

              10

        • #
          Mary E

          Those are industry shill sites, of course they tout “lower” prices. It’s part of the money game, hide the pea (cost) and shuffle the shells around, hope no one catches on. When everything is added in – the cost to plan, build, install, connect, monitor, etc., and to repair and maintain, then add in the monies for subsidies and tax incentives and whatever else they get, for both traditional and renewable energy plants, renewables are not less costly. None of the savings get passed on, either – the margin is supposed to go to maintaining current and building new, or so many adherents claim, but it tends to end up in the pockets of shareholders and CEOs. They aren’t investing in the power plants out of the goodness of their hearts, no, there is profit expected.

          10

    • #
      AndyG55

      So, change the network at great expense,

      Push up prices for those who can least afford it

      Make a system that is unstable and unreliable

      For NO REASON except to cater to a new religion.

      NOPE.

      Let the new religion pay its own way.

      130

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Read. My .Links

        19

        • #
          AndyG55

          I did..

          Did you ???

          Solar and wind are causing congestion that didn’t exist before

          THEY should pay to fix the problem, Wouldn’t you agree.

          Or should “someone else” pay for the problem they caused.

          You truly are a socialist FOOL, aren’t you PF.

          110

          • #
            tom0mason

            AndyG55,

            A simple solution (along with removing all subsidies) — require all supplier, including solar and wind suppliers, to be contracted in to supply to the grid with an ‘on demand’ only requirement.
            In other words give all supplier a flat playing field, all generators are contracted to supply only as the demand requires them and on a lowest cost first preference ordered basis. If any supplier fails to supply when they have agree to, then penalties apply (full cost of covering the deficit, plus 10% to 25% admin fee depending on how often the contract has been broken).

            This automatically lowers cost to the consumer, is simpler to manage, and unreliable suppliers are driven off the grid system (and they would naturally and usefully ‘go bust’, thus lowing real pollution and reckless and destructive land misuse).
            Win-win for the customers/consumers and for grid stability.

            20

            • #
              AndyG55

              Agree totally.

              Said exactly the same thing in another comment somewhere. :-)

              30

            • #
              Peter Fitzroy

              Which is the model I support, Libertarian capitalism. Everyone is in the market, and the market must price everything.

              03

              • #
                AndyG55

                So wind and solar are totally out of the picture then, PF

                The cost of their massively TOXIC manufacture and impossibility of safe disposal means they should NEVER be considered by any sane or responsible person. The cost is HORRENDOUSLY HIGH when looked at from a pollution point of view, not to mention the massive strain and cost their erratic and unreliable supply adds to the grid.. As you keep reminding us.

                The two main by-products of COAL fired power are much needed and totally beneficial CO2 RELEASED into the atmosphere,. ALL LIFE ON EARTH absolutely requires CO2, correct, PF. We should be PAYING the coal fired power stations for what the release FOR FREE.

                The other main by-product is ash, which is used in many building products.
                Cement, plaster, roads and numerous other items are made using it.
                It is all around you, PF.
                It HELPS BUILD the human environment, something wind and solar can never do.

                30

              • #
                el gordo

                As a utopian socialists I reject libertarian capitalism and laissez faire economics.

                10

        • #
          OriginalSteve

          https://www.news.com.au/technology/innovation/motoring/motoring-news/police-tesla-goes-flat-during-pursuit/news-story/255842026a532a06ffaa90de53ddc66e

          Epic Fail……your version of where we shoud go with our future?

          No thanks.

          “Police driving a Tesla patrol car in California had to abandon pursuit of a suspect when the electric car ran out of charge.

          “But officers say the drama was a result of human error as opposed to a problem with the car.

          “The Tesla Model S is built in Fremont, California, and the local police department is using an example on a trial basis.
          Fremont Police officer Jesse Hartman made headlines around the US when his Tesla Model S showed a low battery warning in the line of duty.

          “On radio messages released following the chase, Hartman tells dispatchers: “I’ve just realised I’m down to six miles of battery … I have to find a charging station for the Tesla so I can make it back.”

          “Another officer in a conventional car took over the pursuit.

          “Police said the Tesla’s battery went flat because an officer on a previous shift forgot to plug it in.

          “California’s Mercury News, breaking the story, said the Tesla is part of a trial to see whether electric cars can replace petrol and diesel-powered vehicles on government fleets.

          “to see whether electric cars can replace petrol and diesel-powered vehicles on government fleets…”

          I’d suggest….no….most cars can have long range tanks fitted.

          40

        • #
          Geoff Sherrington

          PF,
          Read my links?
          I might, but you can save me some time.
          Do your links to electricity costs include, or exclude, the cost of backup electricity for when there is no wind or sun or frequency controlled input?
          Most economic analyses I have read exclude backup costs.
          They are a waste of time.
          So, PF, are there any papers on your list that include backup costs?
          Geoff S

          30

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            the links back up the statement of 20% renewables. What is your point? we have hydro for backup, or are you unaware/

            04

            • #
              AndyG55

              20%..

              Hey PF, did you know that that is the amount of time German wind power is above 30% of name plate.. ie 80% of the time it is B below 30% of nameplate

              Even by your low standards, that is pretty darn “ordinary” ..

              .. a FAILURE TO DELIVER, so to speak.

              Oh and not much hydro at the moment, PF just the little Snowy Mts scheme.

              Basically ALL the backup or the UNRELIABILITY of wind and solar comes from COAL and GAS.

              30

          • #
            Kalm Keith

            Geoff, perhaps he lives in West Papua and isn’t aware that we have severe drought here.

            00

    • #
      AndyG55

      With subsidies gone, investment companies will move their funds elsewhere.

      No money to be made there anymore.

      Poor PF !!

      40

  • #
    theRealUniverse

    This site server is very slow..anybody else finding this? Jo are you running on steam in WA?

    31

  • #
    MudCrab

    We could always do what Sweden has done.

    Declare wood a renewable and harvest the forests.

    https://notrickszone.com/2019/09/19/sweden-gretas-home-is-rapidly-increasing-its-co2-emissions-with-worse-than-coal-biomass-burning/

    Seriously Sweden, HOW DARE YOU!?

    120

    • #
      PeterS

      Since when was it about real science? Never of course. It’s all about virtue signalling as has been said over and over. Then there are the hundreds of new coal fired power stations being built by China, India, Japan, etc.. No mention of that and the fact no matter what the West does in reducing their emissions it will achieve nothing except running the risk of economic ruin. It really is time to call those promoting the reduction of ONLY our emissions for what they are; hypocrites. That includes our PM.

      70

      • #
        Lionell Griffith

        No mention of that and the fact no matter what the West does in reducing their emissions it will achieve nothing except running the risk of economic ruin.

        That is not a bug, economic ruin of the west is the goal! Sadly, the program is working.

        Keep in mind, what you call success depends upon the goal.

        30

        • #
          PeterS

          That’s how our PM appeared during his speech at the UN. He explained how Australia is the leader in the world in fighting climate change by reducing our emissions with the goal to meet if not better our emissions reduction targets. That’s his idea of success. I call it hypocrisy at best.

          10

          • #
            Lionell Griffith

            You are praising your PM too highly. It is pure malevolent destruction of technological civilization that is the goal.

            20

          • #
            Greg in NZ

            No, no, no, Peter, that was Jacindarella’s speech, word for word:

            She said NZ was the #1 country tackling (invisible non-existent) hot air.
            She said NZ was ‘determined’ to be the most sustainable food producer in the world.
            She said NZ had the best kangaroo steaks on the planet. EVAH!
            She said NZ had the most gullible sheep of any colony anywhere, anytime, anyhoo…

            But I digress. Methinks they shared the same script, y’know, saving paper and trees and ooh look, is that more hors d’oeuvre?

            20

      • #
        Zane

        Also never mentioned that the new efficient coal plants in China replace filthy old polluting Mao-era coal boilers that spew out particulates. So a net win for the environment and economics.

        40

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      So what?
      How do you think that Denmark’s “coal” burning generators get such impressive emission “reductions”?
      Drax has only converted 5 of its 6 units to burning old growth forest pellets from the USA. That means its CO2 emissions have only increased by 27 -32%. And their wish to convert the last to (lower emissions) gas has been rejected.
      Germany imports wood pellets from Finland and Slovakia (and possibly Columbia and Australia**). I haven’t been able to get any reference to their power stations burning wood from Russia, so I guess that the million tones from there go elsewhere in Europe. Germany does burn household rubbish to supply heat for district (hot water) systems. A novel way to deal with plastic waste. Germany gets a lot of natural gas from Russia also, and some share of the 500,000 tonnes of packaged wood pellets exported by them every year (and growing).
      Russia gas is supplying other countries in Europe even the UK, and presumably a few bags of wood pellets go to London as well, judging from the complaints about air quality there.

      **20,000 tons a year a few years ago but I didn’t save the reference .

      50

      • #
        theRealUniverse

        Some fools great CO2 cycle calculation went wrong. – Burn wood -> produce CO2 -> grow wood -> sink CO2 .. Oh my how convenient.
        Dont worry about the ‘time’ to grow it and a few other factors..

        40

    • #
      theRealUniverse

      They are still running for the hills to avoid Svante Arhenious’s asertion that CO2 could heat the atmosphere.

      10

      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Ah! Good old Svante Arrhenius and his claim that 50,000 p.p.m. of CO2 would end an Ice Age. That got shot down in 1901 by Angström and probably more before that (Svante wasn’t all that popular).
        Then there was his statement that oil would run out in the present lifetime (well, he was no orphan on that, nor in being wrong).
        And there was his experiments passing electricity through Swedish school children to boost their intelligence. Hmmm, I wonder…

        50

        • #
          Greg in NZ

          Uh-oh, Greta & Beata’s actor/manager/father’s name is… Svante.

          His “experiments passing electricity through Swedish school children” resulted in today’s generation of little Frankenstein’s monsters?

          10

        • #
          Greg in NZ

          Uh-oh, Greta & Beata’s actor/manager/father’s name is… Svante.

          His “experiments passing electricity through Swedish school children” resulted in today’s generation of little Frankenstein’s monsters?

          00

    • #
      RickWill

      Managed forests is the only renewable energy source for electrictyand heat production. It costs twice as much as coal generation but is renewable

      20

    • #
      tom0mason

      And the only differences between coal and wood is the natural processes they’ve undergone and the age of the fuel. Of course coal is the far more calorific and so is a much better fuel.

      30

  • #

    And Torrens Island is getting 12 Big Multifuel Donks for a 210Mw quick-start capability, rough-order cost $AUD300m. That’s 12 x 18 cylinder reciprocating Wartsila 50DF engines, two banks of 9 in a V formation each, putting out 17.5Mw per donk. The engines are able to be run on gas, light or heavy fuel oil, and can change between any of these fuels while running. Just about to enter commissioning testing.

    120

    • #
      robert rosicka

      Our tech is going backwards Wayne , it was only going to cost about 14 million to keep port Augusta power station going but how much has been wasted since shoring up supplies ?

      100

    • #
      el gordo

      Its sounds like a nasty case of millenarian fever.

      30

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      I think that they are dual fuel types, start up on oil and when warmed up switch to natural gas.
      They have the advantage over OCGTs – the ‘Peaker gas’ so beloved by renewables freaks as an answer to intermittency – of being more reliable and not emitting any more CO2.

      30

  • #
    PeterS

    Now that PM Morrison has announced at the UN how good we are at reducing our emissions to fight climate change, we should next expect to hear from him an announcement we will start building nuclear power pl;ants. Not really. He instead mentioned proudly his intentions to build Snowy 2.0. What a hypocrite.

    50

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    This appears to be working out in this latest statement – overhauling the grid to be renewables domainated:

    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-26/energy-market-commission-wants-off-peak-power-bills-cut/11549410

    “”Customers should be charged less when demand for electricity is low, and be updated in real time of when they can take advantage of cheap power, the Federal Government’s energy advisor says.

    “It has also warned time is running out for Australia’s energy grid to be revolutionised to pass on better returns to customers generating their own power, and that solar panels are now so popular the grid has hit capacity.

    “Australian Energy Market Commission’s (AEMC) new report, which investigated how the energy grid could handle an influx of renewables, says Australia is at risk of being locked into an outdated and inefficient system unless change is made.

    “It says that leaves energy providers and governments with a stark choice: spend billions of dollars on poles and wires to keep the current grid going, or engage in a complete re-think of the way the grid works.

    If you want to see the overall plan the Elite have for the grid ( think – co dependency = energy slavery):

    https://www.technocracy.news/flashback-technocracy-smart-grid-green-economy/

    “”According to the United Nations Governing Council of the UN Environmental Programme (UNEP), “our dominant economic model may thus be termed a ‘brown economy’.” UNEP’s clearly stated goal is to overturn the “brown economy” and replace it with a “green economy”:

    ““A green economy implies the decoupling of resource use and environmental impacts from economic growth… These investments, both public and private, provide the mechanism for the reconfiguration of businesses, infrastructure and institutions, and for the adoption of sustainable consumption and production processes.” [p. 2]

    “Sustainable consumption? Reconfiguring businesses, infrastructure and institutions? What do these words mean? They do not mean merely reshuffling the existing order, but rather replacing it with a completely new economic system, one that has never before been seen or used in the history of the world.

    “This paper will demonstrate that the current crisis of capitalism is being used to implement a radical new economic system that will completely supplant it. This is not some new idea created in the bowels of the United Nations: It is a revitalized implementation of Technocracy that was thoroughly repudiated by the American public in 1933, in the middle of the Great Depression.

    “The Technocrats have resurfaced, and they do not intend to fail a second time. Whether they succeed this time will depend upon the intended servants of Technocracy, the citizens of the world.

    “Indeed, the dark horse of the New World Order is not Communism, Socialism or Fascism. It is Technocracy.

    30

    • #
      Greg in NZ

      Thought that word sounded familiar – no, not the demons which surround witches/warlocks/diplomats/activists/Greta – familiar! Or similar. So I searched my file titled ©©©rap and how about that!

      BETWEEN TWO AGES 
      America’s Role in the Technetronic Era
      Zbigniew Brzezinski, 1970, Viking Press, NY

      These crooks always have the most unpronounceable names. As he who supplied Øsama with all sorts of freedom-fighting tools wrote in his intro: “the Research Institute on Communist Affairs of Columbia University provided me with invaluable research assistance and with a congenial and stimulating setting”. I’m sure they did, Zbiggie, I’m sure they did.

      00

  • #

    Antoine D’Arche mentions further up the Comment list at Comment Number 10 that it’s not Nameplate which is important, but the actual power being generated and delivered, and yesterday (25Sep2019) is the perfect case in point.

    And here it could be misconstrued by ‘some’ that because it was a really low power generation day for wind and solar plant power, then just perhaps I might be cherry picking, but hey, when you have days like these, then what do you do? (and this day was not a single outlying event, as there are plenty of them across the year)

    Wind Plant power has a total Nameplate of 6702MW.
    Solar Plant power has a total Nameplate of 3427MW.

    So, all up, that’s a total Nameplate of 10129MW, and that’s a lot by any measurement, almost four times the Nameplate of the single coal fired power plant, Bayswater. (3.84 times)

    Total power generated by wind power across the full 24 hour day was at an equivalent Nameplate of 690MW. (at a Capacity Factor of 10.3%)

    Total power generated by solar plants across the full 24 hour was at an equivalent Nameplate of 470MW. (at a Capacity Factor of 13.7%)

    So, adding together the total generated power across this 24 hours from wind and solar, it came in at an equivalent of 1160MW.

    So, EVERY wind plant and EVERY solar plant in the whole Country serviced by this vast single grid, and they generated and delivered the same power in 24 hours as TWO UNITS at that same Bayswater plant. (Unit One and Unit Two) During the day, those two Units at Bayswater ramped up and down twice, so they were not delivering their maximum across the whole day, but enough power as was being required to be delivered from them.

    Perhaps of more consequence is that at the time of Maximum power consumption for the Country, peak power for the day, at 6.40PM, the total power being delivered from EVERY wind plant and EVERY solar power plant came in at 300MW, and at that time, the grid was consuming 25600MW, so wind and solar were providing 1.17% of what was needed absolutely to keep the whole Country operating.

    Imagine now the total cost of those wind plants (55 wind plants in all) and those solar power plants (43 solar plants in all) and they deliver less power than HALF of ONE coal fired power plant.

    The total amount of what these things cost (wind and solar plants) is perhaps worrisome, but far and away the single most important thing is that they don’t deliver power, and that they don’t go anywhere even close to delivering what we are told by everyone who supports wind and solar power.

    You just cannot argue against something like this.

    Tony.

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    • #

      Tony, you’re stealing our childhood!

      60

    • #
      Zane

      AGL is building a $850 million 123 turbine windfarm at Coopers Gap NW of Brisbane. It’s being funded by the Powering Australia Renewables Fund (which AGL set up) and a bunch of banks, including Westpac and some international names from Europe and Japan. Lots of juicy earthworks contracts. Good times for contractors.

      40

    • #
      theRealUniverse

      So great to have REAL numbers Tony. Noone in Canberra or state capitals would recognise a real number if they saw it.
      So on that 13% CF, about 87% more windbines and solar arrays need to be built to cope with the real world..oh dear.

      40

    • #
      Peter Fitzroy

      The whole country! Sorry to be pedantic to the pedant in chief, but unless I was asleep, when was WA and NT integrated into the grid?

      17

    • #

      See what Fitzroy has done here, what he always does.

      There was no argument for the data I gave.

      So what he did is what he always does, change the subject totally off what it was about to something meaningless and unrelated, and then concentrate on his changed talking point, knowing that someone will come in and bite, and then he can add his usual numerous responses, so no one concentrates on the original intent of the comment first posted. Others then see his response and those who have come in to respond to him, and just go somewhere else.

      Fitzroy is not doing it at any of his responses to make valid points. He’s just doing it to distract others away, and that’s how he gets his laughs.

      He makes it all up, and then attributes HIS lies ….. about us….. back on us.

      He’ll respond to this, but that’s it from me, other than to say, ‘Don’t feed him.’

      Tony.

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      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        all of the country! Comment number 21.

        Show me how I made that up. Or is it how how you as a little child could identify refuge rainforest, and how it burnt?

        You are the worst type of commentator, you will exorate any tiny error from any gainsayer, but when confronted with your own errors wander off into hand waving

        Be honest, you might have a chance, like el gordo, but unlike AndyG55. Of course if you want to be in the same gutter as AndyG, ignore me.

        17

        • #
          AndyG55

          Ignoring you, sorry, I just don’t want to join you in your AGW sewer, PF

          I’m still waiting for you to tell me what has changed with the global climate in the last 40 years that can be scientifically put down to human influence

          Or you could produce some empirical evidence for warming by atmospheric CO2.

          You are the IGNORANT one.

          The one with NO EVIDENCE.

          The one that yabbers on about things you obviously know absolutely NOTHING about.

          You duck and weave when pinned on a question , slithering like a slimy eel in your efforts to escape

          Or you go into your headless chook distraction routine, just like you have in the above post.

          You are nothing but a mindless troll, thinking he is smarter than everyone else.

          But guess what, little-PF, you are just a naughty little boy languishing at the bottom of the class, with NOTHING to offer to rational discussion.

          40

      • #
        Antoine D'Arche

        I suspect he’s paid or contracted to do what he does. Pretty standard “counterinsurgency” tactics, transparent, sometimes effective tactically but ultimately of zero value strategically. Why? Because he scores very few recruits. Very few people are ever actually turned, swayed by his/ her arguments, because he’s fishing in a largely empty pond. Also he lacks a sophisticated approach.
        So he might win a battle or two, but like the AGW lobby will never win the war.

        60

    • #
      Latus Dextro

      Antoine D’Arche mentions further up the Comment list at Comment Number 10 that it’s not Nameplate which is important, but the actual power being generated and delivered

      Comment #3.
      So, who’s going to pay for the safe clean disposal and replacement of all this toxic, expensive, uneconomic virtue signalling nameplate junk in 15 – 20 years?

      70

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        whooo is going to pay for all your plastic waste? who is going to pay for the toxic fly ash remediation? Who is going to pay for the extra admissions to hospital from PA 15 particulates?

        What a stupid comment. Have an award

        16

        • #
          Bill in Oz

          Why are you still here Fitz ?
          You need to go keep track on your fortune invested in solar & wind transmission lines !
          Go on spend your time on that
          And stop wasting ours here.

          20

          • #
            Peter Fitzroy

            Hunh – I point out the hypocrisy of blaming renewables against ROI of 10%.
            Mind you, as a participant in the Boyz from Oz, Rolling coal tour, your might make an impact /no you will not

            15

            • #
              AndyG55

              Poor PF, creating another fantasy meme in his lonely empty little mind

              So sadly pathetic .

              41

            • #
              Bill in Oz

              Renewable suck Peter
              Expensive, unreliable & pointless !
              They exist only because of massive subsidies !
              But you are welcome to waste your private fortune in them.
              I suspect the rest of us have more commonsense

              30

        • #
          AndyG55

          You already have all the rewards for STUPID, PF

          You wear them like a badge.

          That ash is used for many building products, PF It is all around you.

          It is in your walls. It is in the cement.

          It is used in agriculture, it is used instead of salt on snow roads.

          It is used in running tracks and on road surfaces

          It is used as fill for mine sites

          Did you know that around 50 millions tons of coal ash are used annually in the US?

          ——-

          Now lets compare that to solar panels and wind turbines.

          The manufacture of both requires copious quantities of HIGHLY TOXIC solvents which now pollute vast areas of China and can NEVER be remediated.

          Solar panels are full of highly toxic chemicals that CANNOT be disposed of or broken up
          As bad as asbestos, they cannot be disposed of except by highly complex and expensive procedures.

          Wind turbines are also almost impossible to dispose of. Massive lumps of concrete left in the ground slowing making the ground more and more alkaline. The blades have to be cut up with special saws, while wearing heavy protective gear, and because of their composite material mature, the cannot be un-manufactured nor can they cannot be put in land fill.

          In a few years time the lack of forethought of the green agenda is going to leave the world with a MASSIVE TOXIS PILE OF non compostable rubbish.

          But you DON’T CARE about that, do you PF

          DISGUSTING !!!!

          30

        • #
          AndyG55

          “Who is going to pay for the extra admissions to hospital from PA 15 particulates?”

          Yet another fantasy from PF. Name someone, fool. !!

          The toxins from solar panels are FAR more dangerous. !

          40

    • #
      rk

      Tony, very well argued but a far more important point which is never mentioned is that when we get really severe weather again and I am talking big storms above 40,000′ in height, they have the power to totally destroy any wind and solar installations in their path. To think that you would put a power source that you want to rely on, high up on ridges, exposed to extreme turbulence, lightning and hail and think it won’t get damaged is to deny the real world of severe weather. YOU CANNOT FEATHER WIND TURBINE BLADES in severe storms because the turbulence extends down in downbursts as well as 180 degrees the other way and NO WIND TURBINE CAN BE DESIGNED AGAINST VERTICAL STRESS.

      100

      • #
        theRealUniverse

        YOU CANNOT FEATHER WIND TURBINE BLADES good points. I hadnt seen any reference to that much, but yep they wont last long, I wouldnt wanna be too close.

        40

      • #
        Peter Fitzroy

        Gosh, and turbine manufacturers are unaware? another stupid comment

        06

        • #
          AndyG55

          Yes, PF, you have made another stupid comment.

          No need to advertise.

          Nothing else can be expected from you.

          Yes the wind turbine engineers know, but that doesn’t change the facts of shear, twisting and other forces on the blades.

          Engineering can be added to the VERY LONG LIST of things you know NOTHING about !!

          40

        • #
          rk

          Peter,
          Many months ago you demonstrated your lack of knowledge of electrical energy when talking about exporting electrons great distances and I pointed you to the drift velocity of electrons. Now, with wind turbines you make the same mistake. When the wind exceeds 55 m.p.h.they must be shut down which causes the blades to be driven parallel to the airflow, but when thunderstorms move through, the down bursts out of large storms flow vertically downwards which would hit all three blades sitting 90 degrees to that flow, placing huge forces on the blades and the gear box.
          In frontal thunderstorms the inflow wind gets taken over by the wind direction of the front and the wind veers 180 degrees in seconds, again placing enormous stress on the whole tower and blades. THEY CANNOT BE DESIGNED AGAINST THAT VERTICAL STRESS. Further more, the blades cannot be kept in balance after some time has elapsed when they should be. All aircraft propellers have to be overhauled and inspected every 2000 hours, but wind turbines aren’t. Are you aware that gear boxes fail around the world on average at about 5 years requiring replacement? Information not normally reported by manufacturers.
          Your comments above show that like your knowledge of electrical energy, you don’t know much about wind turbines or thunderstorms

          10

          • #
            AndyG55

            Not only that, But if in the feathered position, a sudden change of wind direct means the wind could hit the blades side on, causing massive twisting and rotation shear forces.

            As you say, PF seems to be totally oblivious to most facets of science, physics, electrical and structural engineering….economics…. basically everything.

            10

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    O/T but cant just resist poking the bear…..

    Citizen!! – you need to chnage that wash cycle – here let me do it for you!!…says Big Gov….

    Far fetched? Well, with IoT enabled appliances, 5G and a falsely declared “Climate Emergency” allowing all sorts of snooping and “emergency powers” to intrude further in peoples lives so they are micro-managed climate serfs….can Big Gov resist meddling?

    https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/6407302/delicate-laundry-cycle-releases-microfibre/?cs=14232

    “Wrongly using a delicate cycle for everyday laundry is causing hundreds of thousands of extra microfibres to be released into our water systems and end up in the sea, scientists have found.

    “Although regular washing cycles cause clothes to be bashed together and create more friction between garments, they use less water than gentler programmes which agitate the garments less, they said.

    “Researchers at Newcastle University found that it is the volume of water used, rather than the spinning action in the drum, which is the key factor in plucking the tiny plastic particles from man-made material.

    “Millions of plastic microfibres are shed every time we wash clothes that contain materials such as nylon, polyester and acrylic.

    30

    • #
      theRealUniverse

      And they spend thousands researching this stuff. Maybe partly true BUT does it actually do anything. Sounds another good one for Junk Science.

      20

  • #
    pat

    some of the things the Govt should be telling the public:

    VIDEO: 11min45sec: 25 Sept: Sky: Bolt Report: ‘Lies are being pedalled’ to our children on climate change
    Liberal MP Craig Kelly believes children are being “completely brainwashed” and are saying “the exact opposite of the truth” in relation to climate change…
    “We’ve really got to take a hold of this as government and we’ve got to get out there and get on the front foot and tell the truth,” he said. “The truth rebuts every single one of these alarmist lies.”
    https://www.skynews.com.au/details/_6089315054001

    50

    • #
      Serp

      The writing of “pedalled” where “peddled” was intended is becoming the norm in our illiterated New Dark Age.

      50

    • #
      Serp

      Craig Kelly, is he the sole articulate representative of common sense in all the Australian parliaments, state and federal?

      More members should be speaking out against this “climate crisis” affront to our everyday lived experience.

      “Silence means consent” was the slogan back in the sixties –that is, there’s an onus to speak up in contradiction of the lies broadcast by enemies of our well being.

      I find it totally baffling that even the most absurd of the alarmists’ suite of claims, rapid sea level rise, goes unquestioned; surely once that thread is pulled the rest of the fabric will unravel.

      20

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    RicDre

    Off topic, but important:

    Peter Ridd’s Go Fund Me has crossed the $600,000 mark: $600,158

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    pat

    must-watch video:

    TWEET: Russia Today
    #Climate worshippers? Pro-climate activism take religious forms
    ***VIDEO: 4min59sec: Murad Gazdiev/RT
    25 Sept 2019
    https://twitter.com/RT_com/status/1176873995620114432

    25 Sept: RT: Greta Thunberg wants you afraid, and big business will make a killing off it
    By Graham Dockery
    Do the climate change sermons of Greta Thunberg fill you with anxiety and dread? If so, then that’s the point. Thunberg and the modern eco-cultists all sing from the same hymn sheet, and fear is their most effective tactic…
    But the fearmongering is deliberate. If Thunberg is a preacher, then her bible may be a 2016 paper (LINK) by climate activist and The Climate Mobilization founder Margaret Klein Salamon entitled ‘Leading the Public Into Emergency Mode: Introducing the Climate Emergency Movement.’ In a revised version, published this May, Salamon notes with pride that the paper’s language has been “adopted by several new climate groups – Extinction Rebellion, School Strikers, Sunrise Movement, and more.”…

    Clearing the way for big business…
    In the US, The Sunrise Movement’s ‘Green New Deal’ has been eagerly adopted by 104 members of Congress, and three of the four frontrunners for the Democratic nomination next year. As well as promising to cut carbon emissions to zero by 2050, the legislation would give government unprecedented control over healthcare, wealth redistribution, transport, food production and housing.
    The Climate Mobilization’s call to action has also managed to unite leftists and anti-capitalists with the global elite. Famed for ‘shutting down’ London in April, Extinction Rebellion’s call for “net zero” atmospheric carbon is shared by The World Bank, and a host of neoliberal think-tanks and financiers. Except while the Extinction Rebellion marchers may have taken to the streets in fear of the apocalypse, the financial titans support this movement with a view to getting their grubby hands into public coffers…

    Formed by French President Emanuel Macron and investment corporation BlackRock capital last year, the Climate Finance Partnership sees government-funded carbon reduction as a “flagship blended capital investment vehicle.” Salivating at potential profits in the world’s “developing and emerging markets,” the partnership calls for the “unlocking” of pension funds and government money to finance green industry in the developing world. Only instead of calling our planet’s situation a “climate emergency,” they call it “the climate opportunity (LINK).”

    The Blended Finance Action Taskforce – comprised of 50 financial giants including HSBC, JP Morgan Chase and Citi – is even more explicit, calling for a “layer of government and philanthropic capital,” as there are “profits to be had” in “climate-related sectors…across three regions including Latin America, Asia, and Africa.”
    Put simply, financial giants want your pensions and your taxes to support their investments half a world away. Greta Thunberg and The Climate Emergency Movement are paralyzing you with fear, and knowingly or unknowingly aiding the interests of the world’s mega-rich.

    The same activists who call for collective guilt and punitive taxes on the western taxpayer are enabling a new breed of green capitalism, one that will make a select few fabulously rich, while the rest of us choke down meatless hamburgers and pay our politicians to tax us into oblivion.
    We should be afraid of our changing climate, but we should also be afraid of zealots with good intentions.
    https://www.rt.com/news/469534-greta-thunberg-fear-business/

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      pat

      RT/Dockery piece links to:

      8 Nov 2018: Atlantic Council: The climate finance partnership: Mobilizing institutional capital to address the climate opportunity
      by John E. Morton
      (John E. Morton is a senior fellow with the Atlantic Council Global Energy Center)
      A detailed analysis by the World Bank found that while $100 trillion is held by pension funds and other institutional investors, these same investors allocated less than $2 trillion over a 25 year period into infrastructure investment in emerging markets. And the fraction of that investment that could be considered green, clean, or climate-friendly was negligible.
      So, what can be done? Whether you choose to look through the lens of unprecedented challenge or unprecedented opportunity, there is violent agreement that institutional capital needs to be “unlocked” (a favorite word on the climate conference circuit) and mobilized quickly and at scale.

      Blended finance, or the strategic deployment of public or other concessional capital to de-risk institutional capital investment, offers one compelling answer. Recently, the Blended Finance Task Force, a broad-based interdisciplinary effort, finalized a comprehensive report (LINK) identifying key barriers to large-scale institutional capital mobilization toward the Sustainable Development Goals, and then subsequently designed a detailed Action Program (LINK) to address these barriers…READ ALL
      https://www.atlanticcouncil.org/blogs/energysource/the-climate-finance-partnership-mobilizing-institutional-capital-to-address-the-climate-opportunity/

      the Obama-friendly Atlantic Council:

      Wikipedia: Atlantic Council: In February 2009, James L. Jones, then-chairman of the Atlantic Council, stepped down in order to serve as President Obama’s new National Security Advisor and was succeeded by Senator Chuck Hagel. In addition, other Council members also left to serve the administration: Susan Rice as ambassador to the UN, Richard Holbrooke as the Special Representative to Afghanistan and Pakistan, General Eric K. Shinseki as the Secretary of Veterans Affairs, and Anne-Marie Slaughter as Director of Policy Planning at the State Department…

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      Greg in NZ

      re: your first RT link concerning Klein Salamon’s chosen ponzi scam, these other headlines/links – for some unknown reason – caught my attention:

      • Miss Africa 2018 catches fire moments after winning crown (VIDEOS)

      • Documentary about dark-skinned ‘first Swedes’ sparks horror on Twitter

      • ‘I’ve always had big breasts’: Lawmaker’s plunging neckline stirs Brazilian parliament (PHOTOS)

      Da da da, Comrade!

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    Alice Thermopolis

    Solar investors choke on $1b hit from grid congestion

    Angela Macdonald-Smith AFR Senior Resources Writer
    Sep 24, 2019 — 2.56pm

    Renewable energy investors including Macquarie and BlackRock have banded together to push for changes in the way transmission losses on the country’s choked power grid are allocated after seeing about $1 billion wiped off the value of wind and solar assets across the sector in the past 2-3 years.

    The 20-strong group, which includes AGL Energy’s PARF renewable fund with QIC, is urging immediate modifications in the system to avoid derailing about 10 gigawatts of wind and solar generation projects that they have in the development pipeline.

    The concerted action comes as the group instigator, London-listed major John Laing Group, in August took a £66 million ($121 million) write-down on three Australian renewable energy projects as unprecedented congestion on the power grid eroded plant profitability. It also froze future investment in the sector.

    “The market in Australia that we are looking at as it currently stands is presenting some significant challenges for continued investment and at this stage we are on hold for new investment for wind and solar here,” Justin Bailey, regional managing director for John Laing in Asia Pacific, told The Australian Financial Review from the Middle East.

    “We are on hold whilst we reassess our approach to risk and return in the sector.”

    Classic case of the merde finally hitting the fan (or in this case, turbine).

    The escalating uncertainty may “increase the cost of capital associated with future projects which will ultimately be passed on to customers through higher wholesale prices. The current MLF framework is therefore increasing the long-term cost to consumers through the future investment required to fund the 54 gigawatts of new capacity needed in the national electricity market by 2040.”

    Hey, wasn’t RE meant to deliver cheaper power to consumers?

    Interesting week ahead: AEMC will publish a draft determination on MLF issue today ahead of a final ruling on December 19.

    Is the RE party over, OR….?

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      Serp

      Simply through greed the institutions have over invested and are squealing as they face insufficient returns on a technology which only lasts about fifteen years after which, when these massive installations have reached end of life, the outcry from whoever’s been left holding the bag will dwarf today’s ruckus.

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  • #
    Roy Hogue

    People are the same everywhere. Generally they perform to the incentive you give them. If government makes it more advantageous to do a certain thing by subsidizing it then they do that certain thing. Take away the advantage of the subsidy and there’s no more advantage and they don’t do what you want them to do.

    You can also be certain that the advantage people look for is personal not, say, to benefit the planet 100 years from now.

    I’ve been watching this happen for much of my life and it always happens the same way, every time. You would think someone would notice and say no to subsidizing something and break the chain at its weakest link of all, before it gets started.

    But that doesn’t happen and I reckon that’s also a matter of what the incentive is…

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    Zane

    Another body that seems to have given up is the World Coal Association. Their website moans about the need to capture and store carbon emissions. Their journal seemed to have its last issue in 2014 and most stuff that is downloadable dates from 2015. Meanwhile shares of US coal giant Peabody are trading at new lows and it has a market capitalisation of only US$1.5 billion. Peabody produces 187 million tons of coal annually at various mines in the US & Australia. Australian coal stocks are also generally heading south.

    However, Southeast Asia is expanding its coal-fired power generation by 50%. Because its the cheapest way to make electricity. So there!

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    • #
      Latus Dextro

      A 2018 report from the International Energy Agency (IEA) indicates that global coal consumption is on the rise and was up 1% compared to 2017. Despite awareness of global warming due to greenhouse gas emissions, some major economies lack the resources to substitute their coal-based electricity with less carbon-intensive energies. According to the energy consulting company Enerdata, the share of coal in the power mix has almost remained steady for the past 20 years at approximately 40%. However, the Sierra Club reports a 20% drop in newly completed coal plants worldwide (53% in the past three years). [Like hell. Most unlikely.] It is likely that as the cost of cleaner and renewable energy sources such as wind and solar continue to drop, these energy sources will outpace coal making it a thing of the past. Investopedia

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    • #
      Greg in NZ

      “A heavy fall of snow, heaviest during Thu afternoon.
      “Temperatures will be well below freezing (max -10°C on Sat night, min -15°C on Thu afternoon).”

      https://www.snow-forecast.com/resorts/Mount-Cook/6day/top (NZ’s highest peak, Cloud Piercer / Aoraki)

      Snowing till the glorious world of next Tuesday, with Monday’s -36˚C wind chill the warmest EVAH in recorded history! Oh right, reality, of course…

      [-36˚C is -32˚F for our patriotic cousins across the Pacific still living in the Land of ˚F]

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      • #
        Latus Dextro

        Snow all across the hills today in West Otago. Farmers complaining that Spring growth is zip. Worried.
        The Grand Solar Minimum starts to make its presence felt.

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        • #
          theRealUniverse

          Meaning its normal times in Central..;)

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          • #
            Greg in NZ

            It snowed on The Remarks, Christmas Day, 2002. Even snowed on my birthday in February (high summer) a few years later. Meh, when you’re living at 45˚ South ya gots to expect a little cool snap now and then. Today, up north at 37˚ South, felt like it was about to snow any minute, brrrrrrr!

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  • #
    Zane

    Indonesia is moving ahead and building new ultra-supercritical coal plants to solve its electricity needs. Australia? Billions spent on useless wind farms.

    The OECD will one day have to change its terminology. Developing countries will become newly industrialised states, while places like Australia will be referred to as ” once were developed pre introduction of green policies “.

    Case in point, Thailand. Now supplies 25% of all motor vehicle sales in Australia. All those popular tradie pickups, aside from the Amarok, are built in Siam. Ford Ranger, Isuzu D-Max, Nissan Navara, Mitsubishi Triton, Mazda BT-50 (made in the same factory in Rayong as the Ranger), Hilux, Colorado… SE Asia is moving into the future. Samsung phones and tablets? Vietnam. Clothes? Cambodia and Bangladesh. Sneakers and shoes? China. There’s a town in Guangdong province that makes 300 million pairs of jeans a year.

    You can bet none of that is being powered by solar panels or windmills.

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    • #
      Greg in NZ

      The big Mac I bought 10 years ago (cranked up with extra GHz and MHz and RAM and GB and MB and vid cards, etc. for editing HD video) came from Singapore. And I thought Steve Jobs was American/Syrian, not Malayan/Chinese. Globalism eh, who knew!

      30

      • #
        Zane

        Jobs’s biological father was a Syrian graduate student in the US, true. Thailand and I am guessing Malaysia now have greater ” economic complexity ” than Australia, which means they are not only catching up, but overtaking. Of course those two countries have huge corruption and Thai education is Mickey Mouse. Last time I was in Malaysia it made news when two Singaporeans were racing their brandnew Lamborghini Aventadors at high speed on the motorway between Sing and KL. One guy flipped and the other plowed into him and both cars caught alight and exploded. The drivers survived. I recall thinking that must be the first time two Lambos were totalled in the same accident. An insurance guy somewhere must be scratching his head. Crazy rich Asians.

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  • #
    pat

    “kids”? not very PC, ABC. and one, Lisa Neubauer, is TWENTY-THREE YEARS OLD! note all the repeat broadcasts:

    VIDEO: 20sec: 26 Sept: ABC: Climate Kids
    (Climate Kids airs on Foreign Correspondent on ABC TV at 8pm AEST Tuesday 1st October & Friday 4th October 1.30pm. Also on ABC News Channel on Wednesday 2nd October at 5.30am, Saturday 6th at 9.30pm & Sunday 7th October at 5.30pm & iview)
    Foreign Correspondent’s Barbara Miller gets special access to three activists in three continents as they mobilize the public to pressure politicians to take urgent action on global warming. She follows them as they prepare for a United Nations Climate Action Summit in New York by staging climate strikes across the globe…

    Berlin
    ***Twenty-three-year-old Luisa Neubauer is one of the faces of Europe’s ‘school strike for climate’ movement. A year ago, she was studying geography at university. Now she’s working full-time as a climate activist. “We are rushing towards…an ecological crisis”, Luisa warns. “We need a government to provide a plan on how to reach the 1.5 Paris agreed target and then show that they are willing to act on it.”
    It’s a grueling schedule. Luisa juggles the logistical demands of organizing and fronting regular demonstrations across Germany – called ‘Fridays for Future’ – along with constant media appearances and travel. “Every minute that I’m not on my phone is a minute I have to spend on it some other time” says the exhausted media star.
    While Greta Thunberg inspired her, Luisa says she plays a different role. “What Greta does is extraordinary. It is also unique… What we do is build a movement, so we bring together tens thousands of young people…which I think is a different job description.”…

    UN Meeting
    On a high from the success of the global strikes, the activists meet in New York for the very first time. They also come face to face with the enormity of the challenge: how to transform a world economy hooked on carbon…READ ON
    https://www.abc.net.au/news/2019-09-26/climate-kids/11549798

    Wikipedia: (Luisa Neubauer) supports the implementation of Agenda 2030 in Germany and a climate policy that is compatible with the Paris Agreement…is a member of Alliance 90/The Greens and the Green Youth.

    25 Sept: GatewayPundit: SURPRISE! The Official Escort for 16-Year-Old Global Warming ‘Expert’ Greta Thunberg Is a Leftist Hack Funded by George Soros Org.
    by Jim Hoft
    If you check out her photos young Greta is being escorted around the country by her handler – far left activist Luisa-Marie Neubauer…
    She’s a member of “ONE Foundation” managed by BONO, Bill Gates and George Soros…
    Luisa-Marie Neubauer is a 23-year-old German climate protection activist. In Germany, she is one of the main organizers of the School strike for climate movement… Neubauer is a member of Alliance 90/The Greens and the Green Youth…
    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/09/surprise-the-official-escort-for-16-year-old-global-warming-expert-greta-thunberg-is-a-leftist-hack-funded-by-george-soros/

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    • #
      pat

      Rahmstorf corrects Rockstrom – lol:

      TWEET: Johan Rockstrom, Director @PIK_climate, @sthlmresilience, Professor Earth Science internationally recognised scientist on global sustainability, including #PlanetaryBoundaries

      Greta Thunberg and Luise Neumann digging deep into @PIK_Climate science after #FridaysForFutures demos in Berlin today @GretaThunberg
      PIC

      REPLY: Stefan Rahmstorf
      Luisa Neubauer that is.
      29 Mar 2019
      https://twitter.com/rahmstorf/status/1111703344744198144

      TWEET: Stefan Rahmstorf, Head of Earth System Analysis at the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research; professor of Physics of the Oceans at Potsdam University
      Berlin. #FridaysForFuture Luisa Neubauer speaking now. Greta Thunberg later. Both will visit us at the Potsdam Institute this afternoon.
      PIC
      29 Mar 2019
      https://twitter.com/rahmstorf/status/1111563942797688832

      24 May: CleanEnergyWire: Fridays For Future: Students protest for climate action ahead of EU election
      In March 2019, German activist Luisa Neubauer joined student organisers from across the continent, including Thunberg, for a rally at Berlin’s Brandenburg Gate and announced that the movement would focus on the European elections…
      “The government is not doing enough to keep up with the Paris accord,” Stefan Rahmstorf, Head of Earth System Analysis at the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research spoke to the crowd…

      27 May: France24: France24: AFP: From Greta to Luisa, youths spearhead climate movement
      PIC: German activists Luisa Marie Neubauer (L), Jakob Blasel (R) and Swedish activist Greta Thunberg have pushed climate change issues to the fore AFP
      They’re the faces of the climate alert that propelled Green parties to strong gains in EU elections: Greta, Luisa and Leah lead a generation of youths that have put the planet atop the political agenda.
      Without these youngsters, some of whom are still not old enough to vote, Europe’s Green parties might have still posted strong scores, as the climate has become one of voters’ main concerns.

      But their ubiquitous activism — in the streets, on social networks, and in the media — has had an undeniable effect mobilising voters…
      One of them is Luisa Neubauer, a 23-year-old university student who has been dubbed “the German Greta”.
      The pair have met on several occasions in recent months, including in December in Poland at the Cop24 summit and in Hamburg in March for a climate march…
      Green parties posted strong gains across Europe, in particular in Germany where they took 20.5 percent of votes…
      “The European elections show that we’re not only bringing the climate crisis to the streets but also to the ballot boxes,” Luisa Neubauer wrote on Twitter…
      https://www.france24.com/en/20190527-greta-luisa-youths-spearhead-climate-movement

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      • #
        Greg in NZ

        Sweden and Germany allies? But – ball bearings!

        Iron ore mines. Trains & troop transport. Non-belligerent free trade. Baltutlämningen.

        I’ve met a few Lisas before – best avoid them, at all costs.

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    pat

    confirming Luisa-Marie Neubauer’s connection to the One Foundation/Campaign:

    LinkedIn: Luisa-Marie Neubauer, Speaker, writer and climate advocate.
    London, United Kingdom·
    Geography and Political Science at University College London (2017-present) and (Georg-August-Universität) Göttingen (2015-2018), Germany. Part of the ***Boell Foundation scholarship programme. Youth Ambassador for the non-governmental organization ONE and guest author at Huffington Post…

    Digital Organiser Germany, 350.org
    2018 – Nov 2018·less than a year

    Freelance Writer, Greenpeace Magazine
    Nov 2014 – 2015
    https://uk.linkedin.com/in/luisa-m-neubauer/en

    ***reminder:

    Heinrich Boll Foundation is affiliated with the Green Party in Germany…part of the global Green political movement that has developed since the 1980s. It describes itself as an agency for green visions and projects, a think tank for policy reforms, and an international network…published the Coal Atlas that focuses on the environmental and health impacts of coal mining and use. In addition, there are specific programmes for journalists, as well as sur-place-scholarship programmes in Russia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, and Georgia and in Central America and the Caribbean. Scholarships are available for all academic disciplines, with around 1000 scholarships per year. (Wikipedia)

    ONE: Bono, Lead singer, U2 Co-founder, ONE and (RED)
    More Members of the Board of Directors
    David Cameron, former PM (UK)

    Kevin Sheekey, Global Head of Government Relations and Communications, Bloomberg L.P. Chairman, Bloomberg Government

    Lawrence Summers, Former (Obama) Secretary of the Treasury of the United States

    ***Morton H. Halperin, Senior Advisor, Open Society Foundations
    He was a Senior Fellow at the Center for American Progress from June 2003 to December 2009 and was a Senior Fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations from January 2001 to June 2003 and from March 1996 to December 1998 ETC…

    Sheryl Sandberg, Chief Operating Officer, Facebook
    https://www.one.org/international/person/bono/

    reminder:

    Sept 2010: Daily Mail: Bono’s ONE foundation under fire for giving little over 1% of funds to charity
    By Daily Mail Reporter
    The non-profit organisation set up by the U2 frontman received almost £9.6million in donations in 2008 but handed out only £118,000 to good causes (1.2 per cent).
    The figures published by the New York Post also show that £5.1million went towards paying salaries…

    ONE spokesman Oliver Buston has now defended the way the organisation is run, insisting the money is used for promoting its campaign and raising awareness rather than being given straight to those who need help.
    He said: ‘We don’t provide programmes on the ground. We’re an advocacy and campaigning organisation.’
    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1314543/Bonos-ONE-foundation-giving-tiny-percentage-funds-charity.html

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    • #
      Kalm Keith

      ‘We don’t provide programmes on the ground. We’re an advocacy and campaigning organisation.’

      So when Bono goes on holidays he’s undoubtedly promoting and advocating for the cause.

      Do these “foundations” cross hire and pay appearance money and costs with each other.

      And it’s all tax free? Charity? Foundational.

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      • #
        Greg in NZ

        My grandmother used to drink advocaat on special occasions: did that make her a climate advocate/minder/saint too?

        http://www.bythedutch.com/advocaat/

        “As the name of the drink, it is short for advocatenborrel, or ‘lawyer’s drink,’ where ‘borrel’ is Dutch for a small alcoholic beverage consumed slowly during a social gathering. Named as a good lubricant for the throat, this drink is considered especially useful for a lawyer who must speak in public”.

        Nah, she wasn’t no lawyer, she was a coal miner’s wife from Newcastle upon Tyne, but she sang in her church every Sunday… hic!

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  • #
    pat

    White House: Transcript: Remarks by President Trump to the 74th Session of the United Nations General Assembly – September 24, 2019
    Freedom and democracy must be constantly guarded and protected, both abroad and from within. We must always be skeptical of those who want conformity and control. Even in free nations, we see alarming signs and new challenges to liberty.

    A small number of social media platforms are acquiring immense power over what we can see and over what we are allowed to say. A permanent political class is openly disdainful, dismissive, and defiant of the will of the people. A faceless bureaucracy operates in secret and weakens democratic rule. Media and academic institutions push flat-out assaults on our histories, traditions, and values.

    In the United States, my administration has made clear to social media companies that we will uphold the right of free speech. A free society cannot allow social media giants to silence the voices of the people, and a free people must never, ever be enlisted in the cause of silencing, coercing, canceling, or blacklisting their own neighbors…
    https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-president-trump-74th-session-united-nations-general-assembly/

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    pat

    the BIGGIE today, but Seth’s AP link says “Page not found” – destroyed by CAGW overload?

    ‘We’re all in big trouble’: Climate panel sees a dire future
    AP – 25 Sept 2019

    PAGE NOT FOUND
    https://www.apnews.com/7fd1d533c53d46629c842d201145ab73

    25 Sept: Phys.org: ‘We’re all in big trouble’: Climate panel sees a dire future
    by Seth Borenstein
    Earth is in more hot water than ever before, and so are we, an expert United Nations climate panel warned in a grim new report Wednesday.
    Sea levels are rising at an ever-faster rate as ice and snow shrink, and oceans are getting more acidic and losing oxygen, the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change said in a report issued as world leaders met at the United Nations.
    It warned that if steps aren’t taken to reduce emissions and slow global warming, seas will rise 3 feet by the end of the century, with many fewer fish, less snow and ice, stronger and wetter hurricanes and other, nastier weather systems.
    “The oceans and the icy parts of the world are in big trouble, and that means we’re all in big trouble, too,” said one of the report’s lead authors, Michael Oppenheimer, professor of geosciences and international affairs at Princeton University. “The changes are accelerating.”

    The dire effects will be felt on both land and sea, harming people, plants, animals, food, societies, infrastructure and the global economy. In fact, the international team of scientists projected for the first time that some island nations will probably become uninhabitable…

    The new report projects that, under the business-as-usual scenario for carbon emissions, seas by the end of the century will rise between 2 feet (61 centimeters) and 43 inches (110 centimeters), with a most likely rise of 33 inches (84 centimeters). This is slightly less than the traditional 1 meter (39 inches) that scientists often use…

    The Nobel Prize-winning IPCC requires that its reports be unanimously approved…
    “Like many of the past reports, this one is conservative in the projections, especially in how much ice can be lost in Greenland and Antarctica,” said NASA oceanographer Josh Willis, who studies Greenland ice melt and wasn’t part of the report.
    Willis said people should be prepared for a rise in sea levels to be twice these IPCC projections.
    The world’s warm water coral reefs will go extinct in some places and be dramatically different in others, the report said.
    “We are already seeing the demise of the warm water coral reefs,” Portner said. “That is one of the strongest warning signals that we have available.”
    Outside scientists praised the work but were disturbed by it.

    “It is alarming to read such a thorough cataloging of all of the serious changes in the planet that we’re driving,” said Texas A&M University climate scientist Andrew Dessler. “What’s particularly disturbing as a scientist is that virtually all of these changes were predicted years or decades ago.”…
    The report’s authors emphasized that it doesn’t doom Earth to this gloomy future.
    “We indicate we have a choice. Whether we go into a grim future depends on the decisions that are being made,” Portner said
    https://phys.org/news/2019-09-big-climate-panel-dire-future.html

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  • #
    Kalm Keith

    It’s very hard, nigh on impossible, in the modern world to “insult somebody’s intelligence” when after thorough assessment there appears to be none.

    The inverse could also be true especially when, as on the Conservation, some comments deemed unhelpful are deleted.

    Read the attached link and make up your own mynde.

    Link.

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  • #
    TdeF

    “RET subsidy ends”

    NO. Not at all. It continues until 2030! The growth in the total payout is now fixed, but the people who buy and onsell dirty brown electrons still have to pay for them. And we pay double.

    “Commencing in 2010, the RET was expanded to ensure at least 20 per cent of Australia’s electricity comes from renewable sources by 2020. To achieve this, annual targets were increased to peak at 45,000 GWh in 2020. ”

    “The annual targets under the LRET were amended to rise to 41,000 GWh in 2020 and the uncapped SRES was forecast to deliver at least 4,000 GWh by 2020.”

    “The renewable energy sector would benefit from a $22 billion cross-subsidy from 2014 until the end of the scheme, on top of the $9.4 billion cross-subsidy received from 2001 to 2013.”. That’s $31.4Billion more electricity retailers had to pay to buy brown electrons.
    Then they marked it up.

    However in 2015 ” The changes include:

    • Reducing the profile of annual targets under the Large scale Renewable Energy Target (LRET) so that the 2020 target becomes 33,000 GWh of renewable electricity. ”

    And in 2020 it will reach 33,000GWh.

    For much of the late teens, we have paid $80 per MwHr so $80,000 per Gwhr so the cost to retailers has been 33,000×80,000 or $2.64 billion a year. They have charged the public between this and say $5.28Billion.

    And for this we did not receive anything. Others received the cash and they now own free windmills, free solar panels and in fact are being paid for their output because they own them.

    It is the greatest legislated theft in Australian history and we, the victims, received nothing. For that money, wind should be free. So should solar, but we have to pay again for windmills owned by corporations, community groups, even the City of Canberra who had an embarassing $37Million in cashable RETS in their accounts. Money from everyone else in Australia to make them richer.

    Is it good for the environment? No. Even Dr. Brown agrees. It is a disaster.

    Is it good for electricity, making it cheaper and more reliable and eco friendly? No, it is fake. Like electric cars which output more CO2 than normal cars.

    So for the next 11 years, we will continue to pay the world’s highest electricity prices. For nothing.

    Yes, they have stopped building new windmills because the growth in the river of money has stopped, not the river.

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      TdeF

      For more information

      “1.3 The REE Act places a legal obligation on liable entities to collectively purchase and surrender sufficient large-scale generation certificates (each worth one MWh) to meet these annual targets. The task of meeting the targets is shared across all liable entities in proportion to their purchases of RET-liable wholesale electricity.

      1.4 The revenue from the sale of these certificates to liable entities helps make new renewable energy projects viable. Liable entities pass on the costs of purchasing these certificates to households and businesses through higher electricity bills.

      1.5 The Government has decided to amend the target profile to be based on a 2020 target of 33,000 GWh rather than 41,000 GWh to better reflect electricity market conditions, while continuing to support the uptake of large-scale renewable electricity. ”

      And when the Labor/Green government gets into power, it will all start again. This is a 20% target. They will demand 50%. Say 2.5*$5Billion or $12.5Billion a year in cash giveaways from your electricity bills. While the government ‘balances the budget’ because we are paying for the RET and the NBN because the government doesn’t want questions in parliament and you have no say in the matter.

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        TdeF

        Lastly, the RET large scale certificates have been dropping recently as the buyers game the system, delaying sales as long as possible. This finally has forced desperate vendors of free electricity (who need holidays and cars and wages and buckets of cash for nothing) to sell at a lower price. The fine for not presenting certificates is $60, so there is no point paying above $60 let alone $80 but as they doubled the costs and passed it onto you, who cared?

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          Kalm Keith

          And what must be kept uppermost in mind is that this “structure” was created by our politicians.

          Perhaps we should hold current politicians accountable and request that they create the system that originally worked: government run non profit electricity generation and distribution.

          As with so many government “responsibilities” it has been privatised so that mates can benefit.

          Both sides of politics are at fault here.

          KK

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          • #
            TdeF

            There was nothing wrong with privatization. This is an entirely new concept, government legislated and mandated robbery. The Unions lost control of the power stations and this is their revenge. To save the planet, of course.

            Even Gillard’s Pink Batts was ridiculous, lethal and very expensive and achieved nothing (not that anyone cared). Like her Education Revolution, school halls.

            This is hidden, massive and eternal. The same thing has happened with the NBN after Labor lost control of the telephones with the privatization of Telstra. This was an idea by Stepen Conroy on the back of a beer coaster. Federal control of all communications, like China. $100Bn later we will the world’s worst and most expensive failure in the internet, while other countries are bypassing landlines and using 5G and Satellites.

            It’s a wonder there is no government airline after the loss of TAA, funded by hidden taxes on flying with anyone else.

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      RickWill

      The price of LGCs is collapsing as the target is met. That means subsidies are reducing. It is getting harder to make money from grid scale intermittents.

      40

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        TdeF

        No, it was paying above the (fixed and legislated) $60 fine per MwHr, which does not make sense. Surely it is better to pay the fine than $80 on the market, but when you consider they simply doubled it, paying too much actually made more profits. No one cared.

        Now that the government is looking to reduce the cost of electricity, the retail traders are using something like an 18month window to defer purchases of LGCs and so when demand for cash from windmills exceeds supply of LGCs prices fall. Simple. The total amount of money is still around $5Bn. It is a fake government controlled market and we get nothing for the money. Nothing is a free market if the purchaser has to buy or be fined. It is a government lie that there is a free market. And the government is careful not to touch the money and administer it, so that it is not a (carbon) tax. Just a ripoff.

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        • #
          TdeF

          And there are no ‘subsidies’. There is only theft from our electricity bills and it continues. The LGC price is only an indication of constant demand and perhaps an oversupply as more windmills come on line and a bit of haggling. There is no point building more windmills as the total power pool is fixed at 20% of total power mandated as wind/solar.

          Now as the windmills are paid off (Hepburn Wind’s two windmills were paid off two years ago), it is all just money for jam. The LGC money is IN ADDITION TO the payment for electricity itself. And for nothing, nothing at all.

          20

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          RickWill

          LGCs trading at $40/MWh now. 2020 futures down to $20/MWh. Without the subsidy the itermittents have to curtail rather than taking negative price. Coal can ride through negative prices in the knowledge they can force price high when sun and wind are low.

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    TdeF

    I assume also that the Morrison government is asking questions as to why the buyers of brown electrons do not even bother to haggle and that is forcing them to game the system. It has been the biggest ripoff in our history and has made most manufacturing businesses unprofitable. All the smelters (aluminium, lead, steel,..) are now massively subsidized silent by Federal and State governments, to pretend to make metal. The refiners are gone. Even the recyclers have closed so we are dumping our rubbish in the Phillipines and India and anywhere with a beach. All in the name of a Green world without plastic straws and bags and free energy.

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    pat

    more than 200 attendees, mostly bishops, priests, etc (many from the Amazon region) but also 12 special invitees, including (no surprise):

    21 Sept: Vatican Press Releae: Special Assembly for the Panamazzonica Region (6-27 October 2019)
    AMAZON: NEW WALKS FOR THE CHURCH AND FOR AN INTEGRAL ECOLOGY
    List of Participants INCLUDING
    LIST OF SPECIAL INVITEDS
    ***9. Prof. Jeffrey D. Sachs, Professor of Sustainable Development at the Center for Sustainable Development of Columbia University (United States of America)
    ***10. Prof Hans J. Schellnhuber, Professor of Atmospheric Physics and Emeritus Director of the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research (Germany)
    http://press.vatican.va/content/salastampa/it/bollettino/pubblico/2019/09/21/0723/01479.html

    Preparatory Document for the Synod for the Amazon
    Amazonia: New Paths for the Church and for an Integral Ecology
    New paths for evangelization must be designed for and with the People of God who live in this region: inhabitants of communities and rural areas, of cities and large metropolises, people who live on river banks, migrants and displaced persons, and especially for and with indigenous peoples.
    In the Amazon rainforest, which is of vital importance for the planet, a deep crisis has been triggered by prolonged human intervention, in which a “culture of waste” (LS 16) and an extractivist mentality prevail…

    The Amazon Basin encompasses one of our planet’s largest reserves of biodiversity (30 to 50% of the world’s flora and fauna) and freshwater (20% of the world’s fresh water). It constitutes more than a third of the planet’s primary forests and – although the oceans are the largest carbon sinks – the Amazon’s work of carbon sequestration is quite significant…

    Nonetheless, the wealth of the Amazonian rainforest and rivers is being threatened by expansive economic interests, which assert themselves in various parts of the territory. Such interests lead, among other things, to the intensification of indiscriminate logging in the rainforest, as well as the contamination of rivers, lakes, and tributaries (due to the indiscriminate use of agro-toxins, oil spills, legal and illegal mining, and byproducts from the production of narcotics)…

    II. DISCERNMENT. TOWARDS A PASTORAL AND ECOLOGICAL CONVERSION…READ ON
    http://www.synod.va/content/synod/it/attualita/synod-for-the-amazon–preparatory-document–amazonia–new-paths-.html

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    TdeF

    In short, it is still costing us $5Billion in cash a year to live as we did with 80-90% of the same power supplies we already had and a 900% increase in power bills. For this $50-$100Billion, we received nothing. Now we do not own power stations and have to pay the world’s highest power bills for substantially the same thing. Plus incredibly high bills when the system runs out because of the Unreliables. No one is better off, except the owners of windmills and solar panels paid by us.

    And this $5Billion a year in cash to businessmen for nothing will continue until 2030, when it will probably jump up to stop the rapid sea rise we have all seen in the last 50 years.

    90

  • #
    TdeF

    Then you might think that such great ‘windfall’ profits on windmills for which we paid will be taxed and at least some of our cash will come back as government income. No.

    As I noted in the accounts of private Hepburn Wind, the ‘owners’ of the windmills get to depreciate (our) windmills and pay no tax. So it is all cash, cash, cash. To them.
    Soon we will be seeing our first windmill millionaires. By 2030, there should be thousands of them.

    Then there is the land. In any business, land is often your biggest expense, but these windmills are often going up on public land, in parks, on ridges, even offshore. Vast amounts of public land. Who pays? What a great business. The public gives you the cash for the windmills, the erection, the land, the distribution infrastructure and you charge for the endless output of your windmills and pay no tax on the vast legally guaranteed income. And there’s every hope that in 2030 when it is all just a tax free river of money with no costs or debts, the whole thing will double again, even 2.5x the income.

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    pat

    24 Sept: EasternDailyPress: East Anglia’s coast ‘will be home to Labour’s new generation of state-owned wind farms’
    by Sarah Chambers
    The coast of East Anglia will undoubtedly become home to a large proportion of the 37 wind farms the Labour Party has pledged to build if it enters government, an expert predicts…
    If its plans go ahead, the east coast will be a prime site to locate a good proportion of the wind farms proposed, said Simon Gray, chief executive of East of England Energy Group (EEEGR)…

    The ‘people’s power’ plan would deliver 52 gigawatts of offshore wind by 2030 – ***equivalent to 38 coal power stations – and the new wind farms would provide electricity for 57 million households, Labour said.
    The party said the proposals would create at least 67,000 new jobs in the offshore wind sector – particularly in Scotland, Yorkshire & Humber, North-East England – and East Anglia…

    Firstly, it lies very close to the UK’s largest population centres of London, the south-east and the land-locked Midlands, making it the cheapest point for the infrastructure required to deliver energy to the largest number of households.
    On a construction and operational level, the shallow clay seabed of the southern North Sea is ideal for turbine installation, and the relatively benign sea and weather conditions are well-suited to them, in contrast to other areas of coastline, he said…READ ON
    https://www.edp24.co.uk/business/labour-spells-out-plans-to-build-37-new-wind-farms-51-state-owned-1-6287791

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    Rob JM

    Thought of a useful meme

    Spock on climate science objectivity
    “Jim, 97% of climate scientists think they’re loosing the planet, of course they are emotionally compromised!”

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      Greg in NZ

      “Spock, my Greta-Emitter is saying you have a few loose screws. This could be just your Vulcan Jeans ripping (and who trusts their Greta anyway) but please, I’m trying to think of something. The Climate Scientist Aliens are losing the planet – we need to strike while they’re emotionally compromised”.

      “It is curious how often you humans manage to obtain that which you do not want, Jim”.

      “Precisely!”

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    Phillip Bratby

    This s exactly as happened in the UK when subsidies stopped.

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    Travis T. Jones

    Is this a moment when realities collide?

    SA parliament declares climate emergency

    “Moved by Greens MP Mark Parnell, the motion also recognises that [doomsday global warming] is already costing lives and destroying vital ecosystems around the world.

    Scott Morrison has warned against creating “needless anxiety” in children about [global warming].

    And I think it’s important that we give them that confidence that they will not only have a wonderful country and pristine environment to live in but they’ll also have an economy they can live in as well.”

    https://7news.com.au/politics/sa-parliament-declares-climate-emergency-c-472359

    Youth climate activist Greta Thunberg lambasted world leaders in her address to the UN summit this week … “People are suffering. People are dying. Entire ecosystems are collapsing. We are at the beginning of a mass extinction …”

    >> Someone is telling porkie pies.

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      AndyG55

      “is already costing lives and destroying vital ecosystems around the world.”

      Who has died apart from the millions left cooking using dung in third world counties?

      What ecosystem has been destroyed that can be linked to fraction of a degree of warming by solar input over the last 100 years ???

      There is no evidence of any human caused change in the global climate, anywhere… period. !!

      It really is one great big huge CON-JOB !!

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    Another Ian

    Very O/T but if true then even the ABC’s bubble might pop

    “Transcript Release: Hillary’s Emails, Nellie Ohr, Obama Admin Corruption And Money Laundering Confirmed”

    https://lauraloomer.us/2019/09/25/transcript-release-hillarys-emails-nellie-ohr-obama-admin-corruption-and-money-laundering-confirmed/

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    theRealUniverse

    Search Climate and the Money Trail , by economist william engdahl, link wont post.
    All about our friend Greta and her ‘providers’ ie Goldman Sachs etc.

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    pat

    btw when it came time to renew my electricity plan this week, the big discounts in the 20s had been replaced by a single-digit discount!

    26 Sept: Houston Courant: The Green New Deal Puts Texans in the Red
    by Jason Isaac
    (The Honorable Jason Isaac is Senior Manager and Distinguished Fellow of Life:Powered, a national initiative to raise America’s energy IQ. He previously served four terms in the Texas House of Representatives)
    Hope you have an extra $12,000 in your checking account.
    That’s how much the Green New Deal could increase the average Texas households’ annual electricity bills, according to new research unveiled by the Texas Public Policy Foundation (TPPF) (LINK). An in-depth analysis of Texas electric utility data shows that transitioning Texas to 100% wind and solar electricity generation by 2030 would cause yearly costs to increase nearly tenfold.

    TPPF researchers found that if the Green New Deal’s renewable energy directive was fully implemented by 2030, the annual cost of powering Texas would rise from $13 billion today to a whopping $120 billion…

    Getting renewables from 8% to 100% of our electric generation nationwide isn’t a problem of politics, but of scale and physics. Even a partial switch to renewables would be prohibitively expensive. Transitioning Texas to just 50% wind and solar by 2030—a relatively modest increase, given that we are the number one state for renewable generation—would cause annual costs to rise by 250%.
    And those numbers don’t take into account a large-scale rollout of electric vehicles, which would increase electricity demand and further increase costs to consumers and businesses…READ ON
    https://www.houstoncourant.com/houston-voices/2019/the-green-new-deal-puts-texans-in-the-red

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    pat

    all over the FakeNewsMSM:

    25 Sept: BBC: Climate change: UN panel signals red alert on ‘Blue Planet’
    By Matt McGrath
    According to a UN panel of scientists (LINK), waters are rising, the ice is melting, and species are moving habitat due to human activities…
    So what have they found and how bad is it?
    In a nutshell, the waters are getting warmer, the world’s ice is melting rapidly, and these have implications for almost every living thing on the planet…
    The scientists are “virtually certain” that the global ocean has now warmed without pause since 1970…READ ON
    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-49817804

    26 Sept: BBC: Royal naming for Sir David Attenborough polar ship
    By Jonathan Amos
    The Duke and Duchess of Cambridge will officially name the UK’s new polar research ship after Sir David Attenborough on Thursday…
    This is the vessel an online poll had cheekily suggested be called “Boaty McBoatface” before ministers stepped in to end the joke.
    That humorous moniker was given instead to the long-range robotic yellow submarines that will in future operate from the Attenborough…
    Its entry into service comes not a moment too soon.
    Wednesday witnessed the publication of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change’s (IPCC) special report on Earth’s oceans and frozen regions.
    Already sea levels are rising globally by about 5mm per year (taken over the past five years), with ice losses at the poles now considered to be the major driver of this trend…READ ON
    https://www.bbc.com/news/science-environment-49829315

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    pat

    26 Sept: Reuters: China sea levels, temperatures rising amid climate change: government study
    by David Stanway
    SHANGHAI – Coastal sea levels around China were 48 millimeters higher last year than the 1993-2011 average, with winter ice floes shrinking and temperatures on the rise, the Ministry of Natural Resources said on Thursday…
    Government data also showed declining water pressure and falling wind speeds over the 1980-2018 period…READ ON
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-climate-change-china-sealevel/china-sea-levels-temperatures-rising-amid-climate-change-government-study-idUSKBN1WB0NO

    26 Sept: CNBC: Tesla police car nearly runs out of power during chase in California
    NBC News by Phil Helsel
    A San Francisco-area police department says it still has full faith in a pilot program to use a Tesla electric patrol car, even though the vehicle reportedly ran low on power last week during a pursuit…
    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/09/26/tesla-police-car-nearly-runs-out-of-power-during-chase-in-california.html

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    pat

    a speech in June!

    25 Sept: UK Telegraph: Australian defence chief warns climate change could ‘stretch army capability’ in private speech
    By Giovanni Torre, Perth
    Australia’s military capability could be seriously tested by climate change, according to a speech prepared for Australian Defence Force Chief Angus Campbell.
    Details of the speech emerged as Prime Minister Scott Morrison skipped the United Nations Climate Summit, and Sir David Attenborough sharply criticised Australia’s climate and energy policies.
    ***The text of the speech states that responses to climate disasters have already required more Australian personnel than the war in Afghanistan…

    The speech, which was prepared for General Campbell to deliver at an invitation-only event in regional New South Wales for senior public servants in June, was obtained under Freedom of Information laws…
    The speech states that Australia is in “the most natural disaster-prone region in the world” and that “climate change is predicted to make disasters more extreme and more common”…

    Australian policy “could impact (Australia’s) ability to influence (Pacific island nations) choices for support in the region”, according to the text, which goes on to suggest they would turn elsewhere for support, possibly to China…

    Dr Christian Parenti warned in his 2011 book Tropic of Chaos that tens of millions of people could be displaced by climate change.
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/09/25/australian-defence-chief-warns-climate-change-could-stretch/

    MSM clearly has no intention of easing the unfounded eco-anxiety of the climate children.

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    pat

    maximum media coverage:

    25 Sept: BBC: Mont Blanc: Glacier in danger of collapse, experts warn
    Italian authorities have closed roads and evacuated mountain huts after experts warned that part of a glacier on Mont Blanc could collapse.
    About 250,000 cubic metres of ice are in danger of breaking away from the Planpincieux glacier on the Grandes Jorasses peak, officials said.
    The mayor of the nearby town of Courmayeur said global warming was changing the mountain…

    On Tuesday, Courmayeur Mayor Stefano Miserocchi signed an order closing roads in the Val Ferret on the Italian side of Mont Blanc, after experts warned that a section of the glacier was sliding at speeds of 50-60cm (16-23in) per day.
    He said there was no threat to residential areas or tourist facilities but mountain huts in the Rochefort area were being evacuated as a precaution.
    Experts from the Valle d’Aosta regional government and the Fondazione Montagna Sicura (Safe Mountain Foundation) say it is impossible to predict exactly when the mass of ice might collapse…
    Scientists say it has lost at least 80% of its volume just since 2006, a trend accelerated by rising global temperatures…
    https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-49820542

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    pat

    Trump’s climate stance could come back to bite him
    by James Politi
    Financial Times – 25 Sept 2019

    Carbon Brief: Politi notes that 110 Democratic lawmakers have said they could not support the deal unless it includes “binding climate standards” and decision for the US to remain part of the Paris Agreement. The second area identified by Politi is with the EU: “Trade relations between Washington and Brussels are at such a low point that the notion of any broad agreement seems like a fantasy – and should the atmosphere improve, climate issues seem destined to impede any major progress.”

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    pat

    Peter Gleeson on Sky’s Front Page right now mentioning so-called Trump impeachment. Gleeson can’t believe Trump’s supporters still back him. they are rusted on. what is needed for their support to end etc. asks some NewsCorp “journo” who says this is a win for the Dems, especially Elizabeth Warrant, and that there is support for impeachment on both sides in the House.

    26 Sept: American Thinker: Mitt Romney adviser sits on Burisma board of directors
    By Thomas Lifson
    Well, this is certainly an odd coincidence! In fact, when you dig in, you find an amazing series of coincidences. If you believe in coincidences when the CIA is involved, that is.

    Mitt Romney’s national security advisor in his 2012 campaign — a career CIA spook who rose to its top levels — sits on the board of directors of Burisma, the Ukrainian gas company that formerly paid Hunter Biden $50k a month despite his complete lack of credentials or qualifications.

    And it also an odd coincidence that Mitt has as CNN puts it “been a lone Republican voice expressing concern about President Donald Trump’s July phone call with Volodymyr Zelensky in which Trump asked Ukraine’s President to investigate former Vice President Joe Biden and his family.”…
    https://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2019/09/mitt_romney_adviser_sits_on_burisma_board_of_directors.html

    heard someone who had seen it say it looks just like a FusionGPS document; at least one reply says the same:

    TWEET: Byron York: Whistleblower complaint, just released, is a very professional product
    LINK
    26 Sept 2019
    https://twitter.com/ByronYork/status/1177207450719662080?s=20

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      pat

      TWEET: Kathryn Watson, White House reporter for CBS
      @MittRomney @ The Atlantic Festival on why he’s the only GOPer voicing concern over Trump’s call:

      “I think it’s very natural for people to look at circumstances and see them in the light that’s most amenable to their maintaining power, and doing things to preserve that power”
      https://twitter.com/kathrynw5/status/1176912657825353728?s=20

      26 Sept: BBC: Prince Harry criticises climate change deniers
      The Duke of Sussex has criticised climate change deniers, saying: “No-one can deny science.”
      There was “a race against time” to halt global warming, he said, adding: “The world’s children are striking.”…

      “This last week, led by Greta, the world’s children are striking,” the prince said.
      “It’s a race against time and one in which we are losing. Everyone knows it, there’s no excuse for not knowing that.”
      He went on to say there had been scientific evidence of climate change for at least 30 years.
      “And it’s only getting stronger and stronger,” he added…

      The royal couple also met faith leaders at South Africa’s oldest mosque and visited a charity that provides mental health support to young people.
      The duchess told girls in a deprived part of the country she was visiting South Africa not only as a member of the Royal Family, but also “as a woman of colour and as your sister”.
      https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-49836292

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      pat

      Excerpts from Thomas Lifson’s American Thinker article: Back on October 6, 2011 presidential candidate Mitt Romney proudly announced that Joseph Cofer Black (listed as “Cofer Black”) was among the people chosen as “special advisers”…
      Mr. Black brought to this role his extensive background at the CIA, which he joined in 1974 and trained for covert operations. He rose rapidly through the ranks, becoming Director of the National Counterterrorism Center from 1999-2002…
      And in yet another amazing coincidence, Black was succeeded in his job as Director of the National Counterterrorism Center by John Brennan.
      Cofer Black left the CIA in 2006 (does anyone ever completely leave the CIA after being a spook?) to join Blackwater, the huge contractor for services related to military and intelligence action…
      Fast forward to February 2017 (2016 Wikipedia?), when Black joined the board of directors of Burisma, 6 months after the departure of Hunter Biden…

      Burisma equals natural gas…definitely not COAL! lol:

      Wikipedia: Burisma is the largest private ***natural gas producer in Ukraine…In February 2016, Joseph Cofer Black, the Director of the American CIA’s Counterterrorist Center (CTC) (1999–2002) in the George W. Bush administration and Ambassador at Large for counter-terrorism (2002–2004) joined Burisma’s Board of Directors…

      when Romney was hated by FakeNewsMSM:

      13 Jul 2011: Daily Beast: Meet Mitt Romney’s Trusted Envoy to the Dark Side, Cofer Black
      The campaign’s intel guy delivers briefings from former CIA agents and foreign spies
      by Eli Lake
      Every president needs one: a trusted envoy to the murky world of the U.S. intelligence community who is also treated like a close political aide. For President Obama that person is John Brennan, a career CIA officer who is so powerful that many senior spies complain that Brennan is the de facto CIA chief…

      If Mitt Romney wins the presidency, his trusted man inside the intel community will almost certainly be Cofer Black, a retired CIA officer best known for running the agency’s counterterrorism center on 9/11.
      Black is already performing that role for candidate Romney. Last January, before a meeting with Jordan’s King Abdullah II in Amman, Romney received a special intelligence briefing. According to one source familiar with the gathering, Black arranged for the former Massachusetts governor to receive the kind of detailed country analysis an important senator or senior defense official would normally get from the CIA’s station chief in Amman. The briefing, however, was not from the current station chief but rather from a group of retired CIA officers now working for the Hashemite Kingdom…

      Black has known Romney since 2007, when the candidate was running for president the first time, and has been an important adviser ever since…
      https://www.thedailybeast.com/meet-mitt-romneys-trusted-envoy-to-the-dark-side-cofer-black

      3 Jan 2017: The Hill: Chuck Schumer: Trump ‘really dumb’ for attacking intelligence agencies
      By Mallory Shelbourne
      New Senate Minority Leader Charles Schumer (D-N.Y.) said Tuesday that President-elect Donald Trump is “being really dumb” by taking on the intelligence community and its assessments on Russia’s cyber activities.
      “Let me tell you, you take on the intelligence community, they have six ways from Sunday at getting back at you,” Schumer told MSNBC’s Rachel Maddow…
      https://thehill.com/homenews/administration/312605-schumer-trump-being-really-dumb-by-going-after-intelligence-community

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    pat

    26 Sept: GatewayPundit: BREAKING — READ HERE: Whistleblower Complaint Against President Trump Released – Anti-Trump Official Accuses Trump of Wrongdoing — FULL REPORT HERE
    by Jim Hoft
    The alleged whistleblower complaint against President Trump was declassified according to House Intelligence Committee Member Rep. Chris Stewart (R-UT).
    Stewart announced the declassification during an appearance on the Ingraham Angle on Fox News Wednesday night. Stewart tweeted about the release when he was off the air, “BREAKING NEWS: The whistleblower complaint has been declassified. I encourage you all to read it.”…

    Stewart dismissively said the complaint read like it was a Fusion GPS product…
    https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2019/09/breaking-whistleblower-complaint-against-president-trump-released-anti-trump-official-accuses-trump-admin-of-wrongdoing/

    reminder:

    10 Dec 2017: WashingtonTimes: Fusion GPS tried to tie Trump to Clinton’s pedophile pal Epstein as part of smear campaign
    by Rowan Scarborough
    Fusion GPS, the opposition research firm whose Democrat-financed Russia dossier fueled an FBI investigation into Donald Trump, pitched other stories about the Republican presidential candidate to Washington reporters, including an attempt to tie him to a convicted pedophile who was once buddies with former President Bill Clinton…

    Ken Silverstein, the reporter who ultimately wrote an Epstein-Trump report, confirmed to The Times that Fusion had sourced the story. Mr. Silverstein, founder and editor of WashingtonBabylon.com who wrote the story for Vice.com, defended Mr. Simpson as a solid source of information that must first be confirmed.
    For years, Fusion GPS has been an influential hidden hand in Washington, with entree into the city’s most powerful news bureaus.

    Behind the scenes, the private intelligence firm run by former Wall Street Journal reporters was particularly active last year working to defeat Mr. Trump. Fusion leader Mr. Simpson, who railed against sleazy opposition research as a reporter, harbored a strong desire to bring down the builder of hotels with, well, opposition research.
    Fusion representatives met with New York Times reporters during the Democratic National Convention in July 2016.

    Ironically, it appears The Times was the first to out Fusion on Jan. 11 as the source of the scandalous dossier that BuzzFeed posted the previous day…
    “The New York Times, I know they work with Fusion,” said Mr. Silverstein, an investigative reporter who skewers the left and right. “Fusion works with a lot of big media organizations. That would give them influence in Washington.”…
    “Fusion has filed a ton of [Freedom of Information Act] requests on Trump, especially in New York,” said the journalist source who asked not to be named and has had contact with the firm…

    Mr. Silverstein, who wrote the Vice.Com story, was asked by The Washington Times if Fusion pushed the Epstein-Trump story.
    “Since you asked, yes, they helped me with that,” Mr. Silverstein said. “But as you can see, I could not make a strong case for Trump being super close to Epstein, so they could hardly have been thrilled with that story. [In my humble opinion], that was the best story written about Trump’s ties to Epstein, but I failed to nail him. Trump’s ties were mild compared to Bill Clinton‘s.

    “I said Fusion could not have been happy with the Epstein story,” he added. “What I mean is that I never proved a really sleazy connection, so frankly I was disappointed too, I thought there was more (and still wonder)…
    https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/dec/10/glenn-simpsons-fusion-gps-ran-donald-trump-smear-c/

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    Curious George

    “The 2020 large-scale RET was a highly successful policy which drove unprecedented levels of investment in new utility-scale generation over the past two years.”

    Unfortunately, good times are gone. We are back to small-scale robbery.

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  • #
    hunter

    Now graph the relationship between the subsidy for so-called renewables and the price of electricity.

    20

  • #
    Chad

    Hmm ?
    Proof of CO2 Greenhouse effect ?…..or just more spin.?
    Gents, i need some feedback and help making sense of this claim of Linkage between CO2 and atmospheric warming.
    Seems a bit sus’ that all the work was done 9 years ago, but only now gets raised in debate ?
    https://phys.org/news/2015-02-carbon-dioxide-greenhouse-effect.html

    … I asked this earlier, but i thing think it was lost in the progress of discussion , but it seems odd that this papaer has not been cited by anybody previously..

    20

    • #
      el gordo

      ‘They found that CO2 -attributed radiative forcing dipped in the spring as flourishing photosynthetic activity pulled more of the greenhouse gas from the air.’

      That sentence is true.

      20

    • #
      el gordo

      Or more correctly: ‘They found that CO2 levels dipped in the spring as flourishing photosynthetic activity pulled more of the greenhouse gas from the air.’

      There, fixed it.

      20

      • #
        Chad

        I was more concerned with the validity of this point…

        They found that CO2 was responsible for a significant uptick in radiative forcing at both locations, about two-tenths of a Watt per square meter per decade. They linked this trend to the 22 parts-per-million increase in atmospheric CO2 between 2000 and 2010

        20

    • #
      AndyG55

      Tallbloke had much fun ripping that study apart.

      Have to head off now, I’ll leave you to hunt for the link. ;-)

      10

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