JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Weekend Unthreaded

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Weekend Unthreaded, 8.6 out of 10 based on 25 ratings

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310 comments to Weekend Unthreaded

  • #
    john

    The defenition of insanity….

    Offshore wind turbines to save Florida from hurrucanes…

    https://www.google.com/amp/amp.wptv.com/2604771776/could-wind-turbines-protect-florida-from-hurricanes-.html

    141

    • #
      • #
        DAW

        Not to mention the misspelling of HurrUcanes John (lol). Your forgiven. I often wish people would proof read their typing before posting as I have to stop and re-read a sentence to try and pickup the thread of what they mean.
        How many MWh are there in a hurricane?
        Oh my gosh it is mind boggling to try and guesstimate such a figure.

        30

        • #
          sophocles

          I see you didn’t successfully proof read your own typing DAW ;-)
          your forgiven should be “you’re forgiven.”
          (`Your’ is the possessive ie, the owning ‘you’ as in “that is your mistake not mine”
          “You’re” is correct here, an abbreviation of “you are,” thus: “you are forgiven” —> “you’re forgiven”
          and is pronounced as you-err, emphasis is on the ‘you’ and the ‘are’ is slurred, deemphasizing it, but NOT to the extent of ‘yor.’)

          Grammatical mistakes can throw off reading comprehension as well as spelling mistakes, and in some cases are even worse.

          We are our own worst proof readers. We see what we thought we wrote or what we meant to write, not necessarily what we actually wrote. I’m just as guilty of this. I hate leaving mistakes in—it’s embarrassing, so I cringe when I spot mistakes which escape my proof-reading. I’ve sometimes posted a following “Errata” correcting (some of my) bad mistakes.

          40

          • #
            john

            I’m glad to be in good company!

            “I didn’t fail the test, I just found 100 ways to do it wrong.”
            Benjamin Franklin

            20

          • #
            Ted O'Brien.

            Wait till (or should that be ’til?) your eyes get old, and proof reading needs big print!

            U is next to I. Easy for typo.

            20

            • #
              sophocles

              Edison made the QWERTY keyboard layout to slow typists down so the early typewriter mechanisms could keep up and not tangle the characters. I think he succeeded too well. Whatever, we’ve been stuck with it for nearly two centuries.

              I explored the Dvorak layout years ago and love it, it’s so good it wrecked my typing. :-)
              I have to swap between the Dvorak and Edison keyboards bewteen (<—Edison keyboard mistake!) home and work, so my typing has plenty of room for error at the start of each day. I gave up modifying the computers at work because the techs couldn't type and didn't like being told to bring their own keyboards with them. I use it at home because that's MY computer keyboard.

              Big print is easy on a computer: Ctrl + until it's readable and leave it to other users to use Ctrl – to take it back to their preferred size(s). But then, nobody, NOBODY, futzes with MY computer! :-) 'cept me.

              30

              • #
                John

                er…no sophocles, Sholes invented the QWERTY layout.
                https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QWERTY

                00

              • #
                Phantor 48

                explored the Dvorak layout years ago and love it

                I took typing in high school and became a touch typist. Some years ago, I “unlearned” QWERTY and taught myself Dvorak in its place. I still use a QWERTY keyboard, but since I type by touch, it doesn’t really matter what the key caps actually say. On our Mac (and I think the Windows world does something similar), I have a little menu up in the menu bar that controls the keyboard configuration. In my user profile I have it set to Dvorak; my wife has hers set to QWERTY; and it is easy to switch either profile if someone of the “other persuasion” is using it. I used to do the same at work, so I never had to leave using Dvorak.

                It’s something a person might want to consider if they are experiencing carpal tunnel issues. It’s nice having the vowels and common consonants on the home row, as opposed to such oft-used characters as “J”, “K” and “;”.

                00

              • #
                sophocles

                I stand corrected.
                Thank you.

                00

              • #
                sophocles

                John:
                Above thanks is for you. I read it somewhere that Qwerty was from Edison in my youth and never questioned it. It was another twenty years before I started learning to touch type on my first computer sometime in the 1980s. I sort of fell over the Dvorak layout in the late 1980s when I was still wrestling with touch typing and Qwerty. I’ve never checked.

                ==============
                Phantor 48:

                That menu to swap keyboard layouts for your machine is a nice idea, where other touch typists feature.

                I don’t have to worry about any other users at home, so I don’t. I swapped the keytops around to the Dvorak layout donkey’s years ago when I first started swapping between Dvorak at home and Qwerty at work (when I let work have their computer back again in late 1997). I have four (now, it used to be eight) desktop machines all interconnected on a small private network and a recently acquired laptop. All machines use the Dvorak mappping but I’ve left the laptop keyboard alone so it’s still Qwerty even though its mapped as Dvorak.

                If any visitor wants to use one, I can change the keyboard to a Qwerty layout to avoid any confusion there and select a different boot entry to pass the kernel a boot parameter to load the qwerty keyboard mapping file at boot. But, they have to work out how to use the machine after that: one of my machines uses OpenBSD and the rest including the laptop are Linux. :-)

                I touch type too, and I’ve not needed to peek on either layout for a long time, now. The keyboard is switched between all the desktops along with the monitor and mouse. I didn’t bother changing keytops around on the laptop. It doesn’t really matter, as I have about 10 identical keyboards (apart from the laptop’s one) in the cupboard which are still set to Qwerty. They’re my source of spare key tops. The letters do wear off eventually.

                Heh: I’ve just looked at my current keyboard and it’s got a big bare patch where all the commonly used keys are. The ‘E’ key is wiped completely clean. The ‘L,’ ‘S,’ ‘O’ and ‘A’ keys are all following suit and fading. Hey, that’s quite amusing. It’s taken about 10 years so I can’t complain.

                00

            • #
              john

              They made the keyboard too small for my fingers on my I phone. Combine that with half century+ eyes and the result is truly a Picasso!

              Like a masterful painting, you have to use your imagination to interpret what the “artist” intended.

              I’m gonna frame and sign my posts! I’m gonna be rich!

              john

              00

              • #
                sophocles

                I bought a smart phone a couple of years ago and wasn’t at all a smart purchase but pretty stupid. I’m only 172 cm tall but my hands are somewhere between size XXL and XXXL so the smart phone’s touch screen and I hit off badly right from the start and it all went downhill from there on.

                I went back to a basic phone without all the bells and whistles because that was all I needed. It handles the occasional text (slowly). One day, I’ll load a SIP phone onto my computer and have my telephone that way, but at present overpricing it will be a long time, if ever. Prepay is plenty.

                Good luck with your artwork John. On the Internet, anything can happen :-)

                00

        • #
          ROM

          .
          Daw @ #1.1.1

          How many MWh are there in a hurricane?

          Interesting question!

          Chris Landsea who is the NOAA’s hurricane expert and who has repeatedly shot down the global / warming climate change activists who claimed Hurricanes / Typhoons / Cyclones, same thing, are all increasing in frequency and strength with data that shows not much has changed over the last few decades , gives an answer to that question in one of the NOAA’s “Frequently Asked Questions;”

          He has the maths and data in his answer which you can check out for yourself.

          Subject: D7) How much energy does a hurricane release?

          Hurricanes can be thought of, to a first approximation, as a heat engine; obtaining its heat input from the warm, humid air over the tropical ocean, and releasing this heat through the condensation of water vapor into water droplets in deep thunderstorms of the eyewall and rainbands, then giving off a cold exhaust in the upper levels of the troposphere (~12 km/8 mi up).
          One can look at the energetics of a hurricane in two ways:
          the total amount of energy released by the condensation of water droplets or …
          the amount of kinetic energy generated to maintain the strong swirling winds of the hurricane (Emanuel 1999).
          It turns out that the vast majority of the heat released in the condensation process is used to cause rising motions in the thunderstorms and only a small portion drives the storm’s horizontal winds.

          Method 1
          &
          Method 2

          Landsea’s Short answer as derived from the equations he presents;

          This is equivalent to about half the world-wide electrical generating capacity – also an amazing amount of energy being produced!”

          For comparisons; Global installed eletricity generating capacity;[ 2016 ] = 6473 gigawatts

          Australia’s installed electricity [ the bit that the politicians haven't literally blown up as yet ] capacity is 67 gigawatts or a bit over 1% of the global total installed electrical generating capacity.

          For Australians; What Chris Landsea is saying through his calculations as seen on the above link is that the average hurricane/ typhoon / cyclone during in its brief life generates or releases an amount of energy that is equal to around 45 times Australia’s total installed electrical generating capacity .

          20

          • #
            ROM

            Earth’s Strongest, Most Massive Storm Ever
            .

            [ allowing for the hubris of today's generations. History probably would have otherwise re this statement from Scientific American ]
            ————————–
            Quoted ;
            .
            On Oct. 12, 1979, Super Typhoon Tip’s central pressure dropped to 870 mb (25.69 inches Hg), the lowest sea-level pressure ever observed on Earth, according to NOAA. Peak wind gusts reached 190 mph (306 kph) while the storm churned over the western Pacific.
            Besides having unsurpassed intensity, Super Typhoon Tip is also remembered for its massive size.
            Tip’s diameter of circulation spanned approximately 1,380 miles (2,220 km), setting a record for the largest storm on Earth. The storm’s huge diameter was exactly the same as the distance from New York City to Dallas.

            [ end of quote ]

            10

            • #
              ROM

              I goofed rather badly re Chris Landseas in not quoting the results of both methods used by Chris Landsea in his calculations on two different aspects of the amount of energy released in the average hurricane / typhoon / cyclone.
              .
              Method 1; Total energy released through cloud/rain formation:

              Answer; This [ number ] is equivalent to 200 times the world-wide electrical generating capacity – an incredible amount of energy produced!
              .
              Merhod 2; – Total kinetic energy (wind energy) generated:

              Answer ; This is equivalent to about half the world-wide electrical generating capacity – also an amazing amount of energy being produced!

              10

    • #
      Roy Hogue

      Is it allowed to hope a hurricane will blow them all over and they’ll sink right out of sight forever? :-)

      Maybe we could set up a business with submarine tours of the wreckage and salvage something useful out of those monstrosities. Florida can always use another tourist attraction. And submarine tours are very popular at Waikiki so why not Florida too? And I’ll bet that a sunken windmill will make at least as good a manufactured reef for the fish as a sunken ship. They’re an eyesore above the waterline but below might be a better deal.

      Naw. That would be honest justice and you know we can’t ever get that. right?

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      • #
        john

        A friend of mine owns a fishing boat. It’s a 45’ dragger used for ground fishing. Here in New England (I hate the term btw), the fishermen have it bad enough with horse crap, useless regulatory burdens and trying to avoid wreckage on the sea floor.

        President Trump needs to talk directly to the fishermen and women, not the NMFS snowflakes and abolish the inevitable fiasco and problems offshore wind will cause. Same goes for onshore wind.

        100

        • #
          Roy Hogue

          I don’t think Trump understands the technical details he would need to understand before he could do anything about renewables. And in any case the matter is almost completely a state issue in which the federal government generally cannot interfere.

          If one can argue that the grid crosses state lines and therefore comes under the interstate commerce regulatory power of the government, then he could propose legislation or might have existing power (I’m not sure he has) to do something. But as I said, I don’t see evidence that he understands the technical aspects well enough to figure out that it’s a bad idea to build all those wind turbines.

          He doesn’t believe climate change is a problem…maybe. But again, I can’t see solid evidence.

          20

        • #
          Roy Hogue

          Wreckage on the sea floor began as soon as the first human built his first boat. I can’t see how that will stop any time soon. Boats sink for the same reason airplanes crash — just because they can. ;-)

          And if not that then (and in spite of laws against it) sailers may toss anything overboard. It’s too easy to be out of sight of anyone else and there goes any threat of being caught.

          Back when my son was in 4th grade his class studied marine biology and the highlight of that semester was a trip to Anacapa Island to visit the tide pools, which are magnificent at low tide. They needed parent chaperones to go along and I could take the time off so I volunteered.

          We had to land on a small beach only exposed at low tide in a little dingy with an even smaller outboard motor run by the deckhand who looked to be a young kid himself. It felt a bit shaky but he knew what he was doing and we all made it.

          So the point? Sticking out of that little bit of rocky beach was the remains of an engine from something that had run afoul of Anacapa Island. It was slowly being eaten by the sea but it was till there and to my surprise the exposed bronze bearings were shiny and bright. Apparently sea water is a metal polish though I’ve no idea what the chemical reaction is. But the junk is everywhere you go.

          40

          • #
            Roy Hogue

            After landing on the beach we stepped through the split in the island to the tide pools on the western side and had a great afternoon. When we went back to the beach to be picked up the waves were crashing on that beach and the deckhand told us the wind had come up and there were 10 foot swells in he channel. We hurried as much as we dared getting back aboard the chartered boat, made sure all the kids were inside the cabin and started for the harbor some 20 miles distant.

            I nad another father stationed ourselves at the rear of the cabin to make sure no one tried to get out on deck. Before very long we were looking up at the tops of waves. As I remember, the skipper estimated them at 14 feet. There we were in a 30 or 40 foot fishing boat in what I would have called a storm and wondering if it had been wise to try to go boating that day. I can still feel the deck heaving under me and see those waves above me. The sea, like the air, is very unforgiving of mistakes, carlessnes or incapacity. But the boat and her skipper were both seaworthy and we got home safe and sound. But I wouldn’t want to repeat that trip back to the harbor.

            And speaking of mistakes, etc., I do wonder how those aquatic windmills will withstand exposure to salt water.

            50

          • #
            Hanrahan

            And then there’s the waters off Guadalcanal:

            Ironbottom Sound” (alternatively Iron Bottom Sound or Ironbottomed Sound or Iron Bottom Bay) is the name given by Allied sailors to the stretch of water at the southern end of The Slot between Guadalcanal, Savo Island, and Florida Island of the Solomon Islands, because of the dozens of ships and planes that sank there during the Battle of Guadalcanal in 1942–43. Before the war, it was called Savo Sound. Every year on the battle’s anniversary, a U.S. ship cruises into the waters and drops a wreath to commemorate those who lost their lives.[citation needed] For many Navy sailors, and those who served in the area during that time, the waters in this area are considered sacred, and strict silence is observed as ships cruise through

            00

      • #
        sophocles

        They could form the foundations of new coral reefs :-) … an unexpected consequence of the effort to save corals from climate change.

        60

        • #
          Hanrahan

          A world renown dive is out of Townsville, the wreck of the SS Yongala lost with all hands in a cyclone. The wreck is a lonely feature in an expanse of mud and home for a variety of life. It is much more accessible than the GBR itself.

          10

    • #
      PeterS

      Yes those who suggest building massive wind farms to fight against Hurricanes are insane, no doubt about that. The cost of building and maintaining them would be of hurricane proportions. Setting off a few nukes might be better and would be much cheaper :-)

      70

      • #
        Yonniestone

        Not true a really big turbine would blow the hurricane away……..or just point Rosie O’Donnell at it and tell her to talk about Trump.

        112

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        • #
          Annie

          I heard yesterday about someone who said that he thought the president is doing a good job, upon which he set off a good demonstration of ‘Trump Derangement Syndrome’! In a public place!

          30

          • #
            PeterS

            I know of one person who hated Trump from the start. Just recently though he admitted Trump has done some good things, in particular with North Korea. Things are turning and if it continues any who still hates Trump with a vengeance, as do the likes of Clinton and Obama as well as much of the MSM will be left on a limb on full display to be the fools they always were.

            40

          • #
            sophocles

            Trump Derangement Syndrome … how tedious :-)

            10

    • #
      yarpos

      Oh well I guess you can just add it to the list, like building nuclear power plants in known earthquake/tsunami zones, or putting giant lithium batteries in a bushfire prone area, or having a pellet buring power plant 6000kms from a major fuel source.

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      • #
        PeterS

        Australia is well up on the stupid list. How about building diesel powered subs yet we have to import the fuel and we currently have about 7 weeks of reserves, if that?

        80

        • #
          OroginalSteve

          Yes, makes you wonder if pollies are opting to make this country deliberately vulnerable….sorry, but it has to be said….

          100

          • #
            J PAK

            New World Economic Order needs to eradicate any tall poppies who can go it alone. Poor old Gadaffi wanted a gold backed African currency so he had to dealt with. Au has 200 years of gas in the ground if we converted every existing vehicle to gas but the Turnbull variety don’t want the plebs to have cheap abundant vehicle fuel.

            70

          • #
            PeterS

            That keeps crossing my mind. It’s either that or they are plain dumb. Either way the voters must take a big share of the blame if they don’t react by the time of the next federal election. The internet is flooded with enough information to convince everyone of the truth except the most ardent follower of the CAGW scam. Also, we now have Trump who released the most significant news wrt climate change since this scam started, namely that he has ordered action to bolster coal and nuclear plants. This is major and if Australian voters and politicians ignore it then Australia must be asleep.

            70

        • #
          Hanrahan

          Where do you find the money and skilled crew for nuclear subs?

          00

    • #
      Latus Dextro

      The definition of insanity….

      …if I might offer another,
      the donation of $130M taxpayer dollars by the Australian government to the Clinton Foundation.
      I’m late to this particular party, and only learned this today.
      En-effing-believable.
      The dying gasp of the globalist cult. As sickening as it is deranged.

      80

  • #
    • #
      spetzer86

      In fairness, they’re already chopping down US forests to power Drax. Seems like a few Scottish trees should be “chipped” in as well.

      120

  • #
    • #
      PeterS

      I’ll repeat my question I posted in the previous thread just in case he or his other parasites reads this site.

      PM Turnbull, when are you going to follow his direction and bolster our coal fired power stations, or are you a coward and a fake?

      261

      • #
        el gordo

        I thank the honourable member for his question and I’m mindful of the fact that the tide is apparently turning on energy. Or as Mark Twain saw it: ‘Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.’

        90

        • #
          PeterS

          Actually the tide has turned all over the world except here in Australia. We are pretty much the only country who has both major parties with the same policy to destroy the base load power generation systems and replace them with renewables ASAP. We all know that China is building massive amounts of coal fired power stations in lots of places in the world, plus some nuclear ones to boot. Trump has ratcheted up the new policy in the US since he was elected to support coal and nuclear energy and denounce renewables as a waste of time. Europe still relies a lot on nuclear and they know they can’t do without it, except in a couple or so cases where coal fired power stations are being planned. Japan is building over 40 new coal fired power stations. India ….. and so on. So the real story is Australia is pretty much in the minority if not alone on focusing so much on renewables in toto. The tide has long gone turned and we are missing it alone.

          172

          • #
            nc

            Add Canada, we have an imature ex drama teacher wanting to implement a carbon tax. He is digging for a peace prize and eventually head the UN, using the Canadian tax payer to get there.

            40

        • #
          Ian

          True. That’s why I disagree with the majority of elderly, closed mind, mentally straight jacketed, Conservatives that yearn for a return to the 1950s and the return of horse drawn carriages, who spurn facts and rely on prejudice to form their opinions.

          220

          • #
            Kinky Keith

            Bizarre.

            How much?

            80

          • #
            PeterS

            So what’s your point? Listen to the young snowflakes who think they know all the answers but don’t really have a clue and have about as much intelligence as a rodent and as much critical thinking ability as a driverless car?

            152

          • #

            These people who accuse us St George supporters of living in the past…they wouldn’t have dared say that to me in 1956.

            But seriously, I am a bit of a non-agile conservative. I’ve even got horses munching my grass which are used for drawing my neighbour’s buggy!

            And I do yearn for 2018, way back when coal was still powering the nation, despite lack of modernisation due to the prejudice of agile fact-spurners. Ah, 2018…it seems like only this morning!

            100

          • #
            yarpos

            marvellous how the small l liberal arguments go straight to the demonising and name calling while amusingly talking about facts

            92

          • #
            James Murphy

            Ian – I wonder if you realise how utterly boring and ignorant you sound, regurgitating the same tired keywords and phrases. You’re about as open minded, and independent of thought as a drone in a beehive. Such statements only convince others that you are a good foot-soldier, and will say whatever you’re told to say, they don’t convince or persuade the very people you are trying to persuade.

            Good luck though, maybe one day you will overcome your cowardice and express opinions which are truly your own.

            101

            • #
              Ian

              Actually I didn’t refer to any particular person or persons here but obviously those that did respond recognised themselves immediately.

              Perhaps they could take Mark Twain’s advice ‘Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it is time to pause and reflect.’

              16

            • #
              Ian

              I am well aware my comments wouldn’t influence die hard Conservatives as they have been brainwashed to reject anything with which they do not agree. This is perfectly exemplified in your reply

              19

              • #
                el gordo

                I’m a Marxist and hang out here for relief from the pseudo Marxists who abound everywhere, you are typical of the political culture.

                ‘It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt.’

                Mark Twain

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              • #
                OriginalSteve

                I shouldnt feed trolls but i cant resist – Conservatives generally become conservative after a lot of analysis of facts. I find “progressives” possess the mental structural rigour of a house of playing cards.

                Leftists always say never trust anyone ovet 30 years of age – yes, thats because after 30, the leftist intellectual man- children all of a sudden realise to have a solid society you need conservatism and structural integrity and defect into conservatism, leaving only the mentally stunted in the ranks of leftism after the age of 30.

                Idiots.

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              • #
                Ian

                “I shouldnt feed trolls but i cant resist – Conservatives generally become conservative after a lot of analysis of facts. I find “progressives” possess the mental structural rigour of a house of playing cards.

                Leftists always say never trust anyone ovet 30 years of age – ”

                At 78 I suspect I’m older than most posting here but as yet I haven’t become ossified. I only seem a leftist to those such as yourself who appear to reject anything that originated after 1960. Colonel Blimps sum you up so perfectly.

                16

              • #
                Kinky Keith

                Steve

                He sure fooled me, he has the intellect and mental bearing of a 25 year old graduate of the university of Skeptical Science.

                Now claims to be 78?

                Bizarro.

                81

              • #
                Ian

                “He sure fooled me, he has the intellect and mental bearing of a 25 year old graduate of the university of Skeptical Science”

                Can you explain what “mental bearing ” means? Of course you can’t as there is no such thing. And are you a graduate of anything? Anything at all?

                I doubt it wouldn’t take a 25 year old graduate to fool you. Someone 20 years younger than that could manage it without even trying.

                17

              • #
                sophocles

                So what is your point?
                Do you have one?

                61

              • #
                Ian

                So what is your point?
                Do you have one?

                I have no idea as to which point you are referring so I’m not able to assist

                22

              • #

                Ian:
                Your comments are
                fact-free with no attempt
                to persuade others
                to agree with your views
                using data, facts and logic.

                You do like character attacks,
                so you have little hope of
                getting agreement with your
                opinions … whatever they are.

                Liberals argue with character attacks.
                Many wear T-shirts that say
                “I’m stupid”, if they have a job
                and can afford one.

                80

              • #
                shortie of greenbank

                Conservatives and liberals are fine it is when either leave the reservation for ideology, the extremes of the left and right per say, that discourse generally shuts down.

                The problem with government institutions is that from the 60s there has been a hard shift to the left well into ideology. Much of this issue has been covered by Jonathan Haidt in the decay of learning institutions and the resultant spread outside into other areas into daily life.

                In fact many ‘classic English liberals’ (generally termed centre-left) are now termed ‘alt-right’ by the ‘new’ left that has arisen. So I probably would not personally say any particular ‘liberal’ is at fault but rather over saturation of one spectrum of political discourse consumed liberalism leaving socialist loving lumps of trash behind usually termed neo-Marxists or something similar.

                In reality they just don’t want to pay the hundred k plus they owe for their gender studies course… ;)

                70

              • #
                Annie

                Ha ha ha ha ha! Thanks for the laugh! Who’s the brain-washed one? I’ve never been one to go along with the crowd so I find your comment totally hilarious Ian. :)

                31

              • #
                sophocles

                Ian said:

                I have no idea as to which point you are referring so I’m not able to assist

                ah: free range comments.

                30

              • #
                el gordo

                ‘Do you have one?’

                Yes sir, should we put any faith in Scafetta? I was attending a recent lecture by Willis at wuwt and he gave me a serve when I mentioned Scafetta, apparently his cycles are not worthy.

                This graph is about five years old but you can see his sinewave is operating perfectly, thanks to the strong El Nino of 2016

                http://c3headlines.typepad.com/.a/6a010536b58035970c0167644feb78970b-popup

                01

              • #
                OriginalSteve

                Ian, well then at 78 I would suggest youre clearly old enough to know better.

                Its a bit like people who have access to all the scientific data coming up with a nonsense answer ( i.e. global warming is a run-away man made cataclysm ) despite the data to say otherwise.

                The only reason you propagate a false answer is either complete ignorance caused by lack of scientific rigour, or a desire to promote deliberate misinformation.

                31

          • #
            Hanrahan

            But I’m comfortable here, reading the opinions of people with more knowledge than I and in so doing expanding my own.

            I will just have to note your disapproval and ignore it.

            50

          • #

            Ian sez:
            “That’s why I disagree with the majority of elderly, closed mind, mentally straight jacketed, Conservatives that yearn for a return to the 1950s and the return of horse drawn carriages, who spurn facts and rely on prejudice to form their opinions.”

            My comment to Ian:
            There is nothing posting a fact-free
            character attack comment
            complaining about conservatives
            “who spurn facts”.
            You are quite a comedian.
            .
            My climate change blog
            is at the URL below:
            Please stay away Ian,
            you might learn something !
            .
            http://www.elOnionBloggle.Blogspot.com

            50

      • #
        Ian

        PM Turnbull however did manage to get Australia exempted from the 25% tariffs slapped on steel and aluminium imports from Canada, Mexico and the EU. Australia and Argentina were the only two countries together this exemption. Naturally the Australian press don’t acknowledge this and I doubt if commenters here even knew of this. Of course if they had they’d have said Turnbull should have striven to ensure the tariff was applied or who cares anyway.

        08

        • #
          Kinky Keith

          Why don’t you just admit who you are working for.

          110

          • #
            Dave

            I think it’s Ian Frydenberg?

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            Ian

            I’m not working for anyone. I’m presenting a fact about Turnbull’s ability to get Australia exempt from Trump’s tariffs on steel and aluminium exports from Australia to the US.

            And to go back to your comment “who are you working for?” Myself only.

            As is apparent from my user name I’m a longstanding subscriber to this site. Re-reading that sentence I’d best clarify what I mean. When I subscribed there was no one else with that user name even though Ian isn’t an uncommon name. I have not visited for quite some time and am shocked at the change in emphasis. It used to be largely discussions of the scientific basis of various reports in the MSM and elsewhere on global warming, later to become climate change. Now however if is a site for denigrating any politician that does not adhere to hard right Conservative thinking and rejecting anything that doesnot call Climate Change a scam.

            Climate change isn’t a scam, it has been and is happening all the time. CO2 at the atmospheric concentrations on earth is not a pollutant as the alamists claim but it is lethal to humans at concentration of around 10%. It is a greenhouses gas as is easily seen from the temperature on Venus where atmospheric CO2 concentration is 96.5%. The burning of fossil fuels by humans is contributing to the increases in CO2 concentration and this is contributing to global warming. I think those facts are accepted by most on both sides of the argument

            The difficulty I have with the alarmist views is on how much global warming is attributable to humans. Alarmist say all of it. I don’t accept that I haven’t seen any empirical data that enables quantitation of the human effect on global warming. Figures presented by alarmists are from computer modelling which is not infallible for two reasons. One and the most important in my view, is there are almost certainly factors affecting the climate of which we are currently unaware but should be include in the input to the models . Second the calculations made to generate the outputs from the models are made by humans and humans are not infallible

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              el gordo

              ‘It is a greenhouses gas as is easily seen from the temperature on Venus where atmospheric CO2 concentration is 96.5%. The burning of fossil fuels by humans is contributing to the increases in CO2 concentration and this is contributing to global warming. I think those facts are accepted by most on both sides of the argument.’

              Not me sir, the hiatus proves CO2 does not cause global warming and Venus has a problem with gravity, a different planet, apples and oranges.

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                Ian

                “Temperature grows proportionally with pressure, the Venetian high temperature has nothing to do with CO2 and everything to do with pressure” “Temperature grows”?? Do you mean temperature increases?

                Even if you were correct, and you are not, in saying the high surface temperature Venus of is due entirely to the pressure of the atmosphere, as the Venusian atmosphere is 96.5% CO2 and 3.5% nitrogen what do you think might be causing the high pressure? Clearly it is the CO2 you claim has nothing to do with the high temperature.

                But you are also wrong on other counts as well. Yes pressure does have an effect on temperature but if it were the only factor why is the ocean colder at greater depths than at the surface? By your logic it should be hotter but you and I know it isn’t.

                I’m not sure you know how CO2 works as a greenhouses but essentially it absorbs infrared energy emanating the surface rather than absorbing energy from the incoming sunlight. As Venus is a lot closer to the sun than earth so more sunlight hits the planet so more is radiated from the surface this is trapped by the CO2 and the planet warms.

                I guess we could discuss the ideal gas laws of Lussac and Charles and Boyle and Wein and why they don’rt apply to real gases but it’s been ages since i studied them to any extent so I’d much rather not

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                sophocles

                Clearly it is the CO2 you claim has nothing to do with the high temperature.

                Wrong. Venus orbits the Sun at an average distance of 108.000.000km (62.200,000miles.) against the Earth’s average orbital distance of 149,000,000 km (or 93,000,000 miles). TSI at the top of atmosphere for Earth is about 1361 watts/sq.m, whereas it is over 2600 watts/sq. m for Venus. As EM radiation follows an inverse square law, even you can see that of course Venus is hotter than earth and it doesn’t matter what it’s atmosphere is made of.

                Venus’ atmospheric pressure is given as 93 bar that’s about 93 earth atmospheres of pressure. That’s a very dense atmosphere at only 108,000,000 km from the sun. A rough and ready calculation shows Venus absorbs approx 2600 w/sq m then it’s temperature is going to be at least 580 ° K. It’s actually over 730 ° K, and swathed in dense blocking clouds, so something else is contributing the extra 150 °K.
                It’s got to be pressure. The potential and kinetic energy available in a gravity well about 0.8G with a pressure of 93 atmospheres is a lot.

                Nikolov & Zeller’s The Unified Theory of Climate. is an informative read. You will see that atmospheric composition is irrelevant.

                You can work through some of the equations to verify them if you wish.

                I’m not sure you know how CO2 works as a greenhouses but essentially it absorbs infrared energy emanating the surface rather than absorbing energy from the incoming sunlight. As Venus is a lot closer to the sun than earth so more sunlight hits the planet so more is radiated from the surface this is trapped by the CO2 and the planet warms.

                I can see that you don’t know. What a quaint collection of quaint ideas. Venus is wholly shrouded in (dense) cloud. How is the sunlight going to reach the surface for energy to radiate from it? How does CO2 absorb only energy from the surface? How does it know it’s surface energy? In Venus’s atmosphere, with its dense clouds, heating happens all the way down from the top. Venus doesn’t have any oceans nor much free water at all. So the cotton wool gets hot and reradiates everywhere. The top of atmosphere will be hottest, because that little property of warm/hot gasses rising still applies.

                CO2 behaves like any other gas in the Earth’s atmosphere to the Solar insolation. It warms. And like any warm gas, it rises
                and transfers its heat through Brownian motion to other atmospheric molecules. Warm gases rise. Always. How else do Hot Air Balloons work? Not from IR pressure! CO2 absorbs a little more energy in IR than most other gases so it becomes a little warmer and transfers this heat as it rises. Therefore CO2 has a slight cooling effect compared with other gases.
                You will see from the paper below, that all atmospheric gases warm under direct solar insolation.

                See Allmendinger’s experiment and analysis in his paper A Novel Investigation about the Thermal Behaviour of Gases Under the Influence of Irradiation – Further Argument Against the Green House Theory.

                Your ideas, Ian are somewhat dated, and you seem to have swallowed the pseudo-scientific propaganda about CO2. You need to bring yourself up to date with recent research. You could also think through how a trace gas with a concentration of only 0.04 % of the atmosphere could behave with such magical properties. There is no such thing as magic and CO2 is not magical. You really need to put things into proportion and this article may just help you.

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                el gordo

                Ian the pressure is caused by the gravity, which is 90% of earth and of course the atmospheric mass is 93 times the mass of the earth.

                Do not believe the yarn that Venus is a typical example of a runaway greenhouse.

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                el gordo

                ‘…why is the ocean colder at greater depths than at the surface?’

                We are dealing with a very salty liquid as opposed to a CO2 laden atmosphere, chalk and cheese.

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              el gordo

              Temperature grows proportionally with pressure, the Venetian high temperature has nothing to do with CO2 and everything to do with pressure.

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                sophocles

                (this is aimed at El Gordo’s comment “ why is the ocean colder at greater depths…. as well as this one)

                Oceans may be chalk and cheese but the same rules apply: warm/hot water rises, cooler water sinks. Look at the ocean turnover

                Temperature of a gas rises as it’s compressed, quite right. We see that with air compressors of all sorts, best illustrated with ye olde bicycle tyre pump. It gets quite hot pumping up a tyre.

                Atmospheric circulation on Venus would probably be something like ocean circulation on Earth, but a lot faster. It’s day is c. 245 terrestrial days long, so one side of the atmosphere gets fried with twice the incident solar radiation as Earth’s while the other side radiates heat to space, cooling off. The cooling gas would sink just like water does here, to be sucked up back on the hot side. At 93 atmospheres pressure, Venus’s atmosphere and Earth’s oceans may have a lot in common for circulation.

                The winds must be ferocious—a planet wide upside down hurricane … look at how many attempts the Russians made to get a lander down onto the surface.

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                Kinky Keith

                Thanks Sophocles, great outline.

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                el gordo

                Thanks Sophocles.

                Looking a little deeper, terraforming Venus will require a lot of hydrogen.

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              • #
                sophocles

                Terraforming Venus? Ha! Who would want to try?

                But, as the question has been raised: look into the structure of the solar wind.
                It has an awful lot of hydrogen parts in it :-)
                … just needs oxygen …

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              MuzoftheRiverina

              Ian, the human contribution to CO2 concentration in the atmosphere is reportedly something less than 3%, 3% of 400ppm is 12ppm.

              One has to ask how 350.org thinks they are going to reach their target of 350ppm. If we were to remove humanity from the equation, where are they going to find the other 38ppm that they require to reach their requirements.

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                Ian

                Thanks I hadn’t seen that. But do you know how the figure of 12ppm was arrived at?

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                PeterS

                Ian, more to the point Venus’ atmosphere is some 97% CO2 yet ours is 0.04%. It’s chalk and cheese regardless of how much or how little CO2 impacts on global warming. The reality is whatever the impact the net effect is not even measurable on global temperatures even if we managed to increase CO2 concentrations from 0.04% to 0.1%, which would take centuries to accomplish. Yet you ignore the elephant in the room – the fact that Venus has a much denser atmosphere and is much closer to the sun, not to mention the fact Venus is covered with volcanoes, and even if they are all now extinct, which is still unclear, at some stage they were very active and would have contribute a lot to the heating of the dense atmosphere too.

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                sophocles

                PeterS said:

                if we managed to increase CO2 concentrations from 0.04% to 0.1%, which would take centuries to accomplish.

                Not likely. If ever. The oceans form a buffered solution so any surplus CO2 upsetting the alkalinity is promptly precipitated as Calcium Carbonate. What do you think all the limestone, which went into those beautifully monumental white buildings strewn all over the Washington DC landscape in the USA and almost every other major city in the world, is made of? Go on! Guess!

                If you thought CO2, you’re correct and can go to the top of the class.

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              Latus Dextro

              Ian wrote: “Climate change isn’t a scam, it has been and is happening all the time.”

              I refer you to the UNFCCC definition. It may help you reconsider your blithe use and understanding of the term “climate change.”

              (UNFCCC), in its Article 1, defines “climate change” as: “a change of climate which is attributed directly or indirectly to human activity that alters the composition of the global atmosphere and which is in addition to natural climate variability observed over comparable time periods”. The UNFCCC thus makes a distinction between “climate change” attributable to human activities altering the atmospheric composition, and “climate variability” attributable to natural causes

              Thus, prior to the presence of Homo sapiens there was by UNFCCC definition an absence of “climate change.” Further, by this definition UNFCCC “climate change” reveals itself as a zero sum ideology, thereby providing an unending justification to impose.

              The secular globalist and their corporate cronies use climate change dogma as a Trojan horse for their ideology. This ideology is pervasive throughout the UN, but may be more clearly seen at the UNEP (divestment), ECOSOC (‘accredited NGO’s that form “civil society”), the UN WHO, and UNFCCC. It remains a key rationale for the whole “sustainability” ideology.

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                Geoff Sherrington

                LS,
                Add to that the observation that no researcher has yet provided a method to distinguish between thee natural and alleged man-made effects of climate change.
                Therefore, the IPCC definition is invalid for any serious contemplation of Science.
                Geoff

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              Ian

              `sophocles

              ” Venus is wholly shrouded in (dense) cloud. How is the sunlight going to reach the surface for energy to radiate from it? How does CO2 absorb only energy from the surface? How does it know it’s surface energy? In Venus’s atmosphere, with its dense clouds, heating happens all the way down from the top. Venus doesn’t have any oceans nor much free water at all. So the cotton wool gets hot and reradiates everywhere. The top of atmosphere will be hottest, because that little property of warm/hot gasses rising still applies.”

              I’m not sure from where you got this mish-mash. Answering your points one at a time

              “Venus is wholly shrouded in (dense) cloud. How is the sunlight going to reach the surface for energy to radiate from it?”

              The wavelengths of visible light from the sun are in the 400nm to 800 nm range with a peak emission at 500nm. The Venusian atmosphere is 96.5% CO2 which, due to its molecular structure does not absorb light energy at those wavelengths very well so most entering the atmosphere reaches the ground.

              How does CO2 absorb only energy from the surface?

              Energy from the sun is absorbed at the surface and re-emitted at a much longer wavelength than incoming energy from the sun. Because of its molecular structure CO2 efficiently absorbs this long wavelength energy.

              How does it know it’s surface energy?

              CO2 doesn’t “know” anything. Its molecular structure is such that it absorbs energy at particular wavelengths. These are in the infra red at about 15000 nm which is the wavelength of the re-emitted energy from the surface

              In Venus’s atmosphere, with its dense clouds, heating happens all the way down from the top.

              That is totally fallacious. As mentioned above incident light from the sun is poorly absorbed by CO2, the majors component of the Venusian atmosphere . Thus the atmosphere does not get heated from the top down but from the bottom up. The same happens here on earth which is why the outside temperature of the atmosphere at say airplane cruising altitude of 10, 000 metres is much colder than at ground level

              As mentioned several times the dense clouds in the Venusian atmosphere are not too good at absorbing sunlight but are very good at reflecting it which is why only about 10% of incident sunlight reaches the surface of Venus.

              “because that little property of warm/hot gasses rising still applies.”

              This is a complete contradiction to your statement that the atmosphere warms from the top down and is equally incorrectt

              Temperature decreases not increases with altitude see the airplane example above

              The rising air expands as it rises due to the decrease in atmospheric pressure, This expansion results in loss of energy which is why the temperature drops.

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                PeterS

                The thick atmosphere makes the surface of Venus hotter because much less heat escapes back into space than it otherwise would if the atmosphere was much thinner. It’s simple Physics. No need to make it more complex than that. The extreme concentration of CO2 of about 97% does help but a similar effect would happen if instead of CO2 it was water vapour, methane or a number of other gases. Here on earth the concentration of CO2 is 0.04%, which is virtually non-existent in comparison to Venus, and it will remain so for the foreseeable future if not forever. Hence earth’s CO2 increases of late has no measurable impact on the global temperatures simply because the amount of increase is in effect zero compared to the proportion of CO2 on Venus. It would be like adding one grain of salt to a glass of water and expect it to taste like sea water. So give it up. You are only giving part of the picture and not the whole truth. The whole truth blows your conclusion completely out of the water.

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                sophocles

                Ian:
                1. There is (almost) no water on Venus. Therefore the clouds are not similar to earth’s which are made from water droplets, there are no oceans or other bodies of water to moderate temperature. The atmosphere is Venus’s “ocean.”
                2. the clouds are made mostly from dust with the occasional molecule or two of sulphuric acid.
                – the first Russian landers literally dissolved on their way down.
                3. The surface of Venus cannot be seen from planet earth, no matter how powerful a telescope is used.
                – the surface was mapped by radar by the Magellan space craft—very long wavelength wrt light. So light (UV, visible and IR) has big problems making it to the surface and even bigger problems making it back out. Basically: it doesn’t.
                4. the Venusian length of day is 243.025 Earth days
                5. the Venusian length of year 224.65 Earth days, or 1.92 Venusian Days.
                6. CO2 behaves in an atmosphere like any other free gas. It warms under solar insolation. In Venus’s case, it heats.
                7. Hot gas expands so the sun side of Venus’s atmosphere, the top layer, expands in all directions. Gravity even at 80% of Earth’s is strong enough to keep it close. The hot gas races away from the sunside to the “dark side” (Venus appears to us as a very thin—very thin indeed, crescent in visible light), radiating its heat into space as soon as it is out of sight of the sun.
                8. the cooling atmosphere sinks towards the surface and is sucked back to the hot side by the lower pressure area under the hot gas exiting stage Everywhere for the cold side. It carries some heat down with it. Hence “top down.”
                9. the atmospheric winds are enormously powerful. Yes, some of the gas racing back to the sunside keeps the surface at a more or less constant temperature and sweeps up the dust again.
                10. Repeat ad infinitum. (forever).

                Venus’s atmosphere behaves similarly to earth’s oceans, if you look for an earthly analogy. It circulates and under twice the energy input to it as Earth receives, it circulates violently.

                Go read the Allmendinger paper about the behaviour of gases under solar radiation. But: bear in mind it’s about behaviour on a much cooler planet: planet Earth. Venus’s atmosphere has layers of circulation with the top (hot) layers heading to the colder back of the planet and the cooled layers heading back to the sunside. Mixed into that are lightning storms which put Earth’s piddly little efforts to shame (charge has to be equalised and the solar wind is nothing but moving charge).

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                sophocles

                Errata:
                I said:
                2. the clouds are made mostly from dust with the occasional molecule or two of sulphuric acid.
                – the first Russian landers literally dissolved on their way down.

                Sorry, meant to correct it but didn’t, that should be:

                some of the clouds are mostly sulphuric acid

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                Geoff Sherrington

                Ian says “The wavelengths of visible light from the sun are in the 400nm to 800 nm range with a peak emission at 500nm. The Venusian atmosphere is 96.5% CO2 which, due to its molecular structure does not absorb light energy at those wavelengths very well so most entering the atmosphere reaches the ground”

                Ian, if that was the case, the human eye (or a camera that mimics it) would be able to have a clear view of the surface, since you claim that visible light is hardly absorbed. Given that some is reflected, it should make its way back out of the atmosphere, to provide a view of the solid surface.
                If you look at satellite images of Venus taken with ‘natural’ light you will see a faintly blue cotton wool bundle of cloudy material, with no sign of the surface. The visible range of wavelengths seems pretty fully absorbed during its 2-way trip.

                So, at least that part of your series of assertions is easily debunked, without possible argument.
                Geoff.

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                PeterS

                Another way of looking at it is if Venus had the same atmosphere as earth’s with all other things being equal apart from the distance to the sun then according to the Stephen-Boltzman Law and the fact that Venus receives 2.6 W/sq.m of radiation (compared to 1.4 for earth) and assuming the average temperature on earth is 15 C then the average temperature on Venus would be of the order of 65 C. Factors that would alter that result include a different axial tilt, rotation, oceans on earth, etc. but the point being made is the proximity to the sun is the main factor causing the high temperatures on Venus. The relatively higher density of the atmosphere on Venus only helps to make it even hotter. So trying to blame the very high temperatures on just CO2 is deviously false as you leave out so many significant factors. Then there is the massive difference in CO2 concentrations; 97% versus 0.04% so one might as well say 97% versus 0%.

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            PeterS

            Let’s all not be too harsh on Ian. It’s actually a good thing for people like him to be here. Debate is good and it helps to sharpen our skills to prove even with more clarity why people like Ian are wrong.

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              el gordo

              We agree and if this blog could attract a few more contrarians of Ian’s calibre then this place would be really jumping.

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          el gordo

          Comrade Ian, relax, the trade war has just begun.

          Turnbull stood up to the gas merchants in Western Australia, to his credit, but he is botching everything else.

          Do you think we should abandon the American Alliance?

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            PeterS

            As has been said many times before even a broken clock is right twice a day. The trouble with Trumbull though he’s on a Venus time-zone where the days are 243 earth days.

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              Ian

              The trouble with you is that you rely on prejudice and ignore inconvenient truths such as those in comments above and below yours

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                Ian Hill

                No provision to reply above so I’ll reply here:

                From Ian:

                As Venus is a lot closer to the sun than earth so more sunlight hits the planet so more is radiated from the surface this is trapped by the CO2 and the planet warms.

                Venus is a lot closer to the Sun than Earth. No other explanation is needed!

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                Ian

                “Venus is a lot closer to the Sun than Earth. No other explanation is needed!”

                You must be joking. Have you read some of the comments here?

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                PeterS

                Yes Ian we have read other comments and yours are nothing more than pseudo-science. So now you dispute the fact that Venus is closer to the sun and is the major reason why it’s so hot. The reason it’s hotter than Mercury is because Venus has a very dense atmosphere while Mercury has an extremely thin one. If Venus also had Mercury’s atmosphere the surface would be much colder than Mercury’s assuming the massive numbers of volcanoes on Venus are no longer active.

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                Ian Hill

                I read the report on this site several years ago which stated that the temperature high in Venus’ atmosphere where the pressure is the same as Earth’s at sea level is the same as Earth’s, ie 15C. That was good enough for me. I conclude it doesn’t matter what their air is made of.

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            Ian

            He also got the producers on the Eastern seaboard to provide gas for domestic use too avoid a shortfall

            “Prime Minister Malcolm Turnbull said his government has reached a deal with Santos, Shell and Origin Energy that will see them provide enough gas to avoid a forecast shortfall of up to 107 petajoules, predicted by the Australian Energy Market Operator (AEMO) on Tuesday”

            (https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/2017/09/27/turnbull-government-strikes-deal-with-gas-companies-to-cover-east-coast-shortfall_a_23224138/?guccounter=1.)

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              Kinky Keith

              After HE caused the initial problem i.e.the need for gas?

              He fixes things alright but not in a way that is helpful for the nation.

              KK

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                shannon

                Agree KK…..
                Turnbull only made the deal …because he needed the xra gas to “top up” the energy
                supply and avoid the nasty blackouts..ie this Winter.
                Any person observing the “Generation and Demand” evidence on the AEMO site, will notice the increased use of gas in the energy mix….
                Malcolm isnt thinking “individual” …hes only trying to save his own rear as an Election gathers pace….

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                Kinky Keith

                Yes Shannon, he and the rest of the Golden Sacks stooges acting via the laba governments in Vic and SA managed stage 1 quite well so that standard reliable coal fired electricity generators were barely managing the load.

                This gave the excuse to bring in emergency gas generation AT HUGE EXPENSE. The instant requirement for extra gas probably sent the price of that up.

                I wonder if any “friends” went long on gas just before the announcement.

                No interest in running the country at all, just taking care of business with friends.

                KK

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                Ian

                How did Turnbull cause the need for gas? Did set up the RET? No Did he set up the emissions target/ No Did he get Australia into the Paris Treaty? No Did he blow up power stations? No Did he stop the exploration for gas in Victoria? In NSW? No to both. Did he write the contracts for the companies exporting LNG? No . Does he give subsidies to the renewables? Yes. Why? To meet Australia’s RET. Why do we have an RET? Abbott set i tup when he lead us into the Paris thingummy

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                el gordo

                Ian this may come as a shock but its my melancholy duty to inform you that Labor and Liberals have morphed into a pseudo Marxist dictatorship.

                Democracy is faultering because of Turnbull, I want a coup and I want it now.

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                PeterS

                And we want a coup of Trump proportions although I understand it’s unlikely to happen given how aloof, asleep and/or stupid so many Australians are.

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                yarpos

                Any system that continually needs heroes to ride in and “fix” things is fundamentally broken. We are supposed to be a fairly mature first world country, but we do not behave that way.

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              PeterS

              That is true yarpos, which is why as history has proven over and over we will go through yet another crash and burn sooner or later. Trump is doing a good job to stall things but he’s not God and he won’t be President forever. So things will resume their normal trajectory and spiral downwards. Unfortunately that’s reality.

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          Hanrahan

          We were never going to be hit with those tariffs, we do not import cheap Asian steel and reexport it under NAFTA trade rules nor do we manipulate our currency as Germany and China do.

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            Kinky Keith

            “We were never going to be hit with those tariffs”.

            And that’s a fact.

            What’s happening here is that the member for golden sacks has shown no real inclination to get to work, use his obvious intelligence and “make Australia great again”.

            Anybody in any doubt about what is happening should look for illumination in some of the summaries of the life and times of his alma mater.

            I have looked at a brief emailed summary of The Organisation and it is very interesting but not pleasant.

            KK

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    PeterS

    Thatcher’s Last Stand Against Socialism

    Trump is now the new Thatcher. Unfortunately we don’t have anyone like him or her in Australia with the same sort of energy, conviction and “in your face” attitude to turn this nation around away from self-destruction. No one is perfect so I don’t believe that Trump (and Thatcher at the time) has everything right but they are orders of magnitude better than the other side of politics. The proof is in the pudding so to speak. Those who reject that proof are fools of the extraordinary kind, of which we have far too many in the public supporting either LNP or ALP+Greens. It’s time for a real change but it appears Australia is not ready or willing for that. The US did support such a change by voting in Trump as POTUS. Sad that we don’t have the same conviction to make the major change we so desperately need, thanks to voters who by and large are asleep, at least for now. As I said before I will reserve my final judgement after the next federal election. If as I sincerely hope the public turn against both major parties so hard and at least to give ACP and ON a very strong balance of power in at least the Senate then my hopes of a better future will turn into reality. Otherwise, forget it.

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      yarpos

      Comparing apples and oranges really. In the US system the people has a say in who the dear leader is, and once in they have some reasonable sureity of serving their term. Here we have neither. There are so many people that need to be appeased to gain leadership (or more importantly retain it) that we are unlikely to see a strong leader appear and stay for any length of time.

      Like others here I think we will need some form of collapse (power, economy , society take your pick) for a strong leader to be seen as desirable.

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        PeterS

        You are splitting hairs. Even in democracies such as ours and the UK voters by and large vote for the leader albeit indirectly. As for the need of a collapse, I believe I was the one who orientated the crash and burn scenario here, or at least repeatedly stated it many times for as long as I can remember. I’m not trying o boast about it – just setting the record straight. I’m a realist who studies history and science in an unbiased and objective way as much as humanly possible. I have also said be careful what we wish for. When we have the crash and burn scenario, the leader that comes up through the ashes could either be very good or very evil. It’s a risk we have to endure since I can’t see any other way given how aloof much of Australia is at the moment. I still have a ray of hope so let’s wait and see how the next federal election plays out. We might be pleasantly surprised. Probably not but time will tell. Be patient.

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          James

          I agree that we/ you (I no longer reside in Australia) vote for a leader in Australia, from a choice of 2 leaders. However the deep state and political actors can change the leader post election much easier than the United States. Moncton predicted that Abbot would get removed, although Abbot did some very silly things (knighthoods). Also with the American system a complete outsider can run and win. The Democrats had to rig their primary to ensure Sanders did not win, he is somewhat an outsider!

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        el gordo

        ‘… for a strong leader to be seen as desirable.’

        Premier Xi is my nomination.

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          PeterS

          That is one scenario and I feel it’s the strongest one. In fact it’s inevitable if China keeps growing and after Trump the US returns to a major decline, which I feel is also inevitable for a number of reasons.

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            el gordo

            As the US drifts into isolationism and Beijing expands, it does appear inevitable.

            What is urgently required is a strong centre right government to haggle with Beijing.

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              yarpos

              So what do we call Xi? the leader of the unfree world? or just Sir

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                OroginalSteve

                Peace in our time, huh?

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                el gordo

                Quickly moving ahead, Federal Parliament is dissolved and replaced by an ineffectual governor, a satrap no less.

                For practical purposes Beijing would retain the states and local councils, but to avoid this outcome Australia needs a strong centre right government.

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                yarpos

                will we get a new name when we achieve Chinese province status?

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                el gordo

                Oz Autonomous Region would be acceptable, with the status of a quarry and tourist resort, but the locals will still call it Australia.

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            Hanrahan

            I’m old enough to remember that the post-war Japan was going to take over the world with their industry and intelligence. It didn’t, and I doubt China will manage it but they are certainly trying. They are now as hegemonistic as England and Spain were. We need the US to delay their Roman style collapse at for least 50 years. Go Trump!

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              PeterS

              I too doubt very much they will “take over the world”. However they could still very easily take over Australia when we are at our weakest moment thanks to voter apathy. As for the collapse of the US to be delayed, that’s wishful thinking. I suspect after Trump’s era the US will very rapidly collapse. It probably will resume the decline very soon even if Trump is still President for the next term. The trouble is Trump came in too late. He should have been President instead of Obama from the start, if not sooner. Trump is certainly making some progress but the problem is systemic and one man can’t change the whole system in 8 years eve if he managed to drain the swamp, which he really can’t as it’s too large, and it will only fill up again just as fast after he is gone.

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              el gordo

              With their Belt and Road strategy they will build a new world order based on commerce, thankfully they come in peace.

              Marx mentioned that capitalism can only survive if it finds new markets, Donald is taking the US into isolationism.

              On the other hand Beijing is going to uplift the poor and downtrodden, and develop a greater middle class throughout the world. The yuan will be king one day.

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                Kinky Keith

                Sounds nice but I don’t think that the Tibetans, for one, would agree.

                More recently there has been the Spratly Islands “anexure” and who knows what is going on in Africa?

                Why use the phrase “on the other hand” in relation to Trumps dealings in the U.S.

                Must admit I don’t follow the news too closely now but hasn’t Trump started off pretty well in terms of job creation for those who voted for him?

                But all of that isn’t to say that we might be better off being run by China than the current mess we call government here.

                We aren’t looking good at the moment and the future looks worse.

                I believe that many older people are now looking at our future and asking what all the hard work and discipline and thrift was for when much of it was filched by market manipulators typified by the Alma Mater of our current President.

                The quantities of tax dollars that have been redirected to higher use without any formal approval from the taxpayers is astounding.
                There is apparently no accountability here.

                Do we have laws in this country.

                Is our country actually functioning in the way we think it should?

                KK

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                el gordo

                ‘Is our country actually functioning in the way we think it should?’

                The Royal Commission is weeding out corrupt practice in the Financial Services, this is a victory for the people over the big end of town.

                Its part of Beijing’s strategy to quickly get hold of energy wherever they go, in Australia they initially picked up the poles and wires. They have the capacity to do a lot more, but are restrained because of strategic considerations on our part.

                Africa is a big picture item and in Ethiopia they are building dams for electricity and water, eliminating starvation forever.

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              yarpos

              remember sitting at a table with an engineer from Panasonic in the early 1980s, he was very adamant about how Japanese technology was going to leap over the world. They have indeed done very well , but perhaps not taken over the world as he thought.

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              Kinky Keith

              I like that idea.

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      Latus Dextro

      Trump is now the new Thatcher.

      Trump like Thatcher was exactly the right person for the job at the right time. Both exhibit a shared key quality, no respect for bureaucratic diktat. One of the first things Thatcher did was decapitate the Civil Service and install her people. Trump understands this well. Thatcher also took on the Left after the decade of extreme Left unionism ending in the so called ‘winter of discontent’. Trump has the Left in drag, complexed by corporate cronyism and secular globalism, abetted by the MSM and academia. He fights in a cultural war that Thatcher could only glimpse.

      The clearest distinction between the two lies in the obvious, it was Thatcher that did so much to launch the global warming polemic, supported the creation the IPCC, funded the UK Met Office Hadley Centre which linked up with the UEA CRU.
      Her volte-face moment came in 2003 when she came out with, “Hot Air and Global Warming”, an almost complete retraction.

      By then it was too late as the UN ideologues had seized upon the useful idiots.

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    Yonniestone

    For the Mod Squad, THE WEEK IN PICTURES: PRIVACY UPDATE EDITION

    My pick, Elk City bird sanctuary.

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    TedM

    I see at 0800 hrs South Australian time the state of the art wind/solar energy production system is producing 0MW. Gas is producing 824MW, the balance of 478MW being imported.

    The renewables dream is actually a disposables nightmare. On wonders if they will ever wake up from the delusion.

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      yarpos

      You will look at it and comment then, the renewable fanboys will look at it when its pumping GW and exporting. They will then talk about propping up Victoria rather than the reality that they are exporting a problem/contagion. Until something breaks properly, its all a bit circular.

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        Rob Leviston

        It may very well be circular, but it highlights the issue, that renewables ( I hate that term), are very intermittent in their delivery, and can NEVER be relied upon as a meaningful power source.
        Once again, I will link to TonyFromOz’s excellent new series on Australia’s power delivery system, that highlights the percentages from each power source! Excellent precis and reading.
        https://papundits.wordpress.com/2018/06/03/australian-daily-electrical-power-generation-data-saturday-2nd-june-2018/#respond

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          yarpos

          True , at the moment the entire wind fleet on the east coast is pumping out a massive 200MW. I just get weary of talking about it. I have a car club run/lunch on Wednesday and I gaurantee there will be some clueless nong banging on about how great renewables are.

          Despite the apparently ageist and generalising comment from Ian up thread many of these will beretired folk that have drunk the kool aid.

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            But Australia is assured it need not worry about a shortfall of intermittent energy because we can rely on Turnbull’s proposed Snowy 2 with it’s 2,000 MW of pumped storage available to match the +/- 24,000 MW demand when intermittent energy is as usual intermittent.
            But we are assured that Turnbull’s 2,000 MW pumped storage “battery” will last for SEVEN days at full power before it runs out of water.
            It will cost SIX billion to buy from NSW and VIC, FOUR to FIVE billion to build and +/- THREE billion to connect, a mere 13.5 billion for the equivalent of a 500 MW fossil fuel power plant available 24/7/365 for +/- ONE billion.
            But it’s required to satisfy Turnbull’s Paris commitment to save the world from catastrophic, man-made CO2 driven climate change which according to Finkel’s report is irrelevant.
            Madness, stupidity and self interest reigns supreme in Canberra today.

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      PeterS

      Imagine the same pattern with coal fired power stations. There would be riots in the streets for sure, perhaps even a civil war. Yet both major parties are headstrong on the policy to let go of our coal fired power stations and continue their support for renewables. Sure it can be done if batteries were included but the cost would be astronomical. We simply do not have the trillions to achieve even 50% renewables let alone 100%, and at the same time guarantee base load effectiveness as reliable as coal (or nuclear for that matter).

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    David Maddison

    In 2012 I did a bushwalk in Victoriastan in the Rubicon Valley Historic Area. At the time I didn’t know much of the history of the area but it is home of a very old hydroelectric scheme, still running today, that produces about 13MW. It was built in the 1920′s and was very advanced for the time.

    Today it is owned by AGL but I suspect their only purpose in owning it is to harvest renewable energy credits and they probably bought if from the SEC for next to nothing.

    I repeated the walk last Friday as well. I find it fascinating that the water flows down the kilometers of aquaducts almost silently and also when you put your ear up to the penstock (pipeline) which goes into the Rubicon A power station (a length of 1305 metres with a drop of 443m) you hear no noise despite the fact that enough water is flowing down the penstock to produce 9.2MW.

    Here are some links:

    https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubicon_Hydroelectric_Scheme

    I also wrote an article about the scheme in 2013:

    http://www.siliconchip.com.au/Issue/2013/February/The+Historic+Rubicon+Hydroelectric+Scheme?res=nonflash

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      RicDre

      You remind me of the tour of the Hoover Dam on the Colorado river in the US I took many years ago. When you were in the heart of the dam, you hear and feel a low frequency vibration which seemed to permeate the entire structure. I don’t know if that was from the flowing water, the turbine generators or both, but it was rather awe inspiring.

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      David Maddison

      I forgot that I made a slide show of the walk I did in 2012.

      https://youtu.be/JzFHeBHSEGw

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    Another Ian

    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2018/06/02/former-doj-fbi-and-intelligence-officials-positioning-for-devastating-ig-report/#more-150040

    “What we are now witnessing is something far beyond Prava and Baghdad Bob. What we now see is an even more severe distortion of media; an alternate reality created as if the Stasi and Tokyo Rose joined forces to take control of U.S. broadcasts.”

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    David Maddison

    Australian total government debt now $797.3 billion and rising by about $2500 per second.

    Watch in real time at:

    http://www.australiandebtclock.com.au/

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      RicDre

      Look at the bright side, at last Australia’s national debt is still under 1 trillion AU dollars. The US National Debt is well on its way to 22 trillion US Dollars.

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      • #

        There’s something interesting about that National Debt figure for both Countries, the U.S. and Australia

        The ratio between their respective populations is (around) 14.

        The ratio between National Debts is 27, almost double.

        Tony.

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        Kinky Keith

        Yes, interesting that U.S. Has three times the debt per head then we do.

        Still AUD$35000 is a lot of debt for each Australian.

        Politics is a vicious game.

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      PeterS

      As a % of GDP we fair a lot better than many other countries, including the US. Japan takes the prize of 224% of GDP. US is 77% and we are 47%. Greece gets second prize at 180%. So we have a lot of spending to do to catch up. I’m sure ALP+Greens will excel in that goal. When we do we can join the coming world-wide crash and burn in style.

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        TdeF

        This is not comparing apples with apples. The Japanese debt is mainly debt by the Government of Japan to the people of Japan through bonds, debt by the people to the people. We have the future fund for public servants, which is a debt by the government to the people but does not count. The Japanese overseas debt is small.

        Our bonds are owned overseas and our debt is funded through interest bearing bonds, which means other people own our country and we have to pay them interest. That is one of the reasons the RET stinks. It is not even a tax, not a payment by the people to the people, but a cash grab from our electricity bills to opportunists. Half stays in the country, marked up by middle men like AGL. The other half flees, never to be seen again.

        Consider the Hepburn Springs private Windmill. Paid off ten years early with our money, run at a loss without our money and they now own it outright and still receive $700,000 a year in a gift called a subsidy. Why?

        It is profitable only because of ‘subsidies’, so we are gifting cash to people losing money because Windmill electrons are good for us?

        We paid for a windmill for someone else to own. We pay for the operation and we give them extra cash for being good enough to operate a windmill. Why are they still being given our money? They have no debts and cannot they make a profit with the world’s highest electricity prices?

        Where is this cheap power? Why should they still be receiving our cash? Why can’t they make a profit with no debts?

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          PeterS

          True but again I was keeping things as simple as possible so most people can understand the big picture. If you really want to get into the details we also need to take in to account the aging population, demographics, long and short term interest rates, private debt, exchange traded and OTC derivatives debt (which by the way the last time I looked is in the 100′s of trillions) and numerous other factors. The bottom line though is too much debt is not good in anyone’s language. Of course the question that’s hard to answer is what is too much debt before there is a run for the exits in the particular area in question? Typically we only ever find out after the crash, never before. The GFC is a classic example. Anyone who can predict when the next crash will happen and in what area is either telling fibs or a fool. Some have called previous ones to the actually day but if enough people predict it someone will get it right, just like a broken clock is right twice a day.

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          TdeF

          The GFC was a fr*ud committed by people selling f*ke mortgages. The people doing this knew all about it and the sales were in trillions. The return was higher than long term deposits and higher than Government bonds and higher than blue chip shares and like shares and real estate carried the real possiblity of capital gains too, like the stock exchange. Money was flooding into American dollars and merchant bankers needed to place it, so they signed anyone and everyone to mortgages they could not afford. Fanny May (Federal National Mortgage Association) and Freddie Mac (Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corporation) looked like Government backed mortgage organization. They weren’t.

          As one judge said openly, the biggest profiteers were Goldmann Sachs. Now we have a Prime Minister who was a partner of Goldmann Sachs and head of Goldmann Sachs Australia. Is it any wonder billions are flooding overseas for carbon indulgences and people in Australia are making more billions marking up low quality, unreliable, inaequate wind electricity? It’s the Global Carbon Con and there are people on the inside of government pushing this.

          Wind and the RET makes it far more profitable to blow up your cheap (in AGL’s case free) working coal power station at Liddell. Ask AGL’s Andy Vesey. He can’t wait and won’t wait to blow it up. Mountains of gold from the air and the world’s highest electricity prices, but not for coal. In what sort of free market does the cheapest, biggest, most reliable provider get blown up?
          Meanwhile our Faux PM says it is all business and interfering is socialism, when this appalling situation is government legislated.

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          yarpos

          These are facts that support Lily D’Ambrosio (VIC Energy Minister) when she says renewables will put downward pressure on energy prices.

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            Graeme No.3

            I think you left off the sarc/ tag.

            Or she is referring to the wholesale BID prices by the wind producers which are indeed lower, but then they never expect to have to deliver at that bid price because the actual price for one lot of electricity will be paid for at the highest bid price.
            i.e. if a wind farm bids minus $2,000 per MWh for a small amount, say 100MW in the time period, and coal fired bids $55 for 850MW and a gas burner bids $104 for 50 MW then all is purchased at $105. On top of that the wind producer gets a (free) RET Certificate and sells it for around $85 per MWh.
            All the low bid price does is guarantee that the wind producer is first in line at the trough.
            The real problem for the wind producers will come when there is enough capacity to supply 100% of some time periods. They will be fighting to get on the gravy train and once they have covered the amount contacted for in the time period they will only get their low bid price (plus RET subsidy). This will drive gas out of the market followed by coal fired, so eventually there will be massive blackouts. Only then will the general population wake up to the mess and the result won’t be pretty for the major parties. That’s why I have been saying that Turnbull is leading the last Liberal Federal government (they may be a minor player in coalitions in future much as we will be like Greece, Italy or Spain).

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        ROM

        From memory the USA’s annual trade deficit is around US$700 million.

        America’s trading partners are screaming at Trump for putting tariffs on a very large range of imported items to give American industry a chance to rebuild without having to also compete with heavily subsidised goods from other less principled nations.

        There is good and bad around the subject of tarriffs but if and when America’s trading figures again reach a moderately balanced condition between the values of imports as against exports no doubt Trump will be open to some horse trading so as to speak.

        I certainly can understand the american thinking here as it has become obvious that there are a lot of nations including America’s so called friends as well as its hard line political and export competitiors who have taken every advantage of America’s openensss but make damn sure there are all sorts of hidden and regulatory obstructions to anything more than a modest token amount in America’s trade with them.

        China who may number two in size in the world economy but is a long way behind in technology and its national administration structures and its statistics and record keeping.
        It is supected that most of the Chinese statistics on the economy and military and business might be as much as 30% overstated in their public statistics numbers which puts them a long way back from even the americans who have just reached an unemployment rate in their massive economy of 3.8%., an 18 year low.
        Even the black americans unemployment rate has dropped to a record low of 5.9%.
        .Wages are up by an annual 2.7% .
        The Europeans witha population of close to 500 million versus the Americans 345 millions and very advanced economies should be a real competitive problem for the Americans .
        Instead the Europeans are just a limp wristed mob of highly over regulated EU whingers with only the Brits having cojones of any size when it comes to trouble in their back yard.
        The rest of the Europeans expect and demand the Americans come in and bail them out every time there is a ruckus in the European’s back yard.

        And then the europeans demand that the Americans pay all the costs of any such sorting of the european’s back yard problems.

        And the EU, America’s potential competitor is coming unstitched in a fairly spectacular way.
        What with Brexit, now the Italians have got a eurosceptic prime minister and a his equally sceptical of the EU coalition of right wing parties none of whom are friends of Germany, the central power house of the EU..
        Poland is threatening to do its own thing with energy and a number of other items despite the EU dictates as is Greece with its deflated economy.
        And the Turks are happily shooting anybody who thinks they have some rights to the lands that the turks are busily trying to evict them from.

        And finally there is that old German saying “Clogs to Clogs in Three generations” syndrome appearing amongst the ruling families of the most dictatorial outfits of our current global political order.

        The first generation builds.
        The second generation consolidates
        The third generation pisses the lot up against the wall.

        North Korea;
        . Grand dad aka Kim Il-sung, created North Korea after the Japanese had collapsed and WW2 ended, with the help of Stalin’s USSR and the Mao Zedong of the Chinese Communist party.
        In Korea, a Japanese controlled formerly independent nation, the russians rolled down to the 32 parallel and the americans also halted at the 32 parallel as was agreed by Rooseveldt and Stalin at the Yalta conference in Feb 1945.
        And so we have North and South Korea.

        Dad as in Kim Jong Il consolidated the power of the Kim family over North Korea.

        Now we have Kim Jong Un, schooled in a plush private school in Switzerland, young , maybe less than 30 years old when he took over as the power in North Korea.
        The Third generation who has no memory of what North Korea was like when his grand father brutally gained power or what North Korea was like when his father gained power or what the Korean war of 1952 meant for the Koreas and the East Asians.

        So why should he just follow along in his daddy’s and his grandfather’s footsteps and not attempt to cut his own path, a path which will be very different to that of the two generations of the ruling Kim family before him.
        None of the so called political commenters have ever even seemed to have considered this long known generational changes and trends and the possible effects it might have on the direction that Kim jnr will take NK in the near future..

        The USSR lasted just 75 years or about three [ non voting ] generations from 1917 to 1991 before it disintergrated as its economy and political system collapsed,

        The Chinese communists revolution of 1948 is now some 70 years of age with the new ruler granting himself life time rights to power, a very similar situation as existed in the USSR.
        Without a regular and somewhat chaotic turnover of the leadership as occurs when the citizens are allowed an honest vote , invariably stagnation will set in after a decade or so of the same tired old faces and tired old ideologies

        So China with a now a General Secretary leader of the communist party apparently for life, an economy with an enormous debt structure in its black economy which the Chinese no longer know how to fix, increasing frictions on its 22,000 kms of land borders with the 14 nations on those borders plus picking fights at sea with other local regional powers, plus now having tariffs placed on many of its exports, formerly almost unlimited, to America, plus creating immense political problems for itself in the next couple of decades as small nations who took the current big attractive hand outs from the chinese in the forms of roads built and rail and constructions built suddenly find out that the Chinese are going to be hard bankers when it comes the time for repayment or compensatory allocations of rights to ports and rail lines and mineral deposits at cut rates and etc.

        China is anything but a monolithic political entity whose rise to world domination is invincible.

        For like the Third law of physics, that Third law also applies to politics.
        When a nation or a political entity be it a party, movement or otherwise begins to try and dominate, invariably an equal and opposite in ideology and political and economical and militarily entity or a group of such will arise to challenge the original entity in every facet it is involved in.
        And so it is begining to occur as China begins to try and sling its weight around across the expanse of the globe.

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      Hanrahan

      I’m a mechy/techy type entering the world of economics with great trepidation but I reckon that there must be a bing bang coming but smarter people than I dare not give a time. Will it be the least worst country wins?

      We know China holds a lot of US paper but they are not rock solid, their monetary system is based on debt the same as everyone else’s and the banks are keeping massive bad debts on their books and not being outed. The oil rich Arabs don’t have net debt but their assets are largely in Europe, Britain and the US. They will not be immune.

      Could it be that when a form of debt forgiveness happens Australia will be among the least worst? I don’t know, just asking. The only impossibility I know of is that all debt obligations will be met.

      A question: If for every debtor there is a smug rich B on the other side of the deal, who is the ultimate creditor, the Rothschilds and others of the 0.01%? It isn’t isn’t any sovereign nation.

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    David Maddison

    Where do the useful idiots of the Left come from?

    An undated interview with Yuri Bezmenov. He died in 1993 so it must have been in that year or before. This is a very important interview to listen to in order to understand what is going on in the world today. (22.5 mins.)

    https://youtu.be/_bdS2PjNAvg

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      Greg Cavanagh

      3:40 The leftists are only useful to destabilise the country, when the job is completed they are not needed any more.

      3:50 When they get this illusion, when they see this Marxist Leninist come into power, obviously they get offended, they thought they would be the ones to come into power, that will never happen.

      He states clearly what we’ve been saying for years.

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      Greg Cavanagh

      This girl has the other half, a great vid.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qpg6P1PNWR8

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      Hanrahan

      The narrator said “Ironically that was taped in 1984.”

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      tom0mason

      David Maddison,

      To live by blind faith is only one removed from a living by pusillanimous indoctrination.
      And that is where all these lefties are lost.

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    Bulldust

    Some of you may remember I wanted to post a piece on the media and free speech etc some months ago. It’s a long weekend and I have time on my hands so here goes. Bear in mind that this was written over half a year ago and things have moved on (almost entirely for the worse) since then. Some numbers are outdated. I shall paste the piece in a number of sizeable chunks, and there will be delays as I check it comes across OK. If there is sufficient interest I will write a follow up to update this piece. Plenty to write about as free speech dies in the UK, people being refused entry and a certain individual being locked up in the last week.

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      Bulldust

      The cancer killing western culture
      Forgive me for going well off topic for this web site, but that is why I chose to post on the unthreaded day. I think it is helpful to preface this piece by stating my political position up front. I would consider myself a classical liberal (in the political sense of the definition, not the Aussie political party of the same name… a couple of them these days). That is, I value individual rights, think everyone should have equal rights as citizens, governments should only involve themselves where the market does not work, or is broken. Free speech is the fundamental value that underlies classical liberalism. It is that which is the topic of today’s post.

      New Media and censorship
      Some may recall I posted some time ago about online media taking over from the olde world media, or MSM (Main-Stream Media). Needless to say this hasn’t gone unnoticed, and you will have noticed the MSM promulgating the “fake news” narrative since the Trump election last year. It is ironic because the MSM is as guilty, if not more so, than the new media sources of creating said fake news. CNN has been particularly egregious on that front. See for example (note the 80-fold like to dislike rate on the video):

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c36oCX0ZI7I

      Needless to say the MSM is not sitting idly by as these new media upstarts show them up. Hence pressure has come to bear on large organisations such as Youtube (owned by Google, whose exchange-listed parent is Alphabet), and they have demonetised creators such as Black Pigeon Speaks (a Canadian living in Japan from what I gather), meaning they don’t tend to have advertisements on their videos on the Youtube platform. That’s fair, many say, Youtube/Google/Alphabet is a private company and it can do what it likes on its own platform, right? I won’t pick up that thread here, but as we are already seeing people starting to talk of regulating near-monopoly companies such as Google or Youtube as utilities. But let’s put that one aside for another time.

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        Bulldust

        Ooops – will continue from $12

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        Weekend ‘Oz,’ page one. Australian National University has decided to cancel its Western Civilization Degree on the grounds it’ s pushing a racist and radically conservative agenda…

        Let’s turn back the clock to hour-glass and candle-light times…obliterate the past, the Magna-carta that led to citizens’ rights, even votes for women, and let’s turn back the clock to western innovation arising from steam (coal) technology that rescued serfs from slavery. Best prefer other histories, hunter-gathering societies and Islamic states, for these are less racist, have more to commend them, (in progressivists’ opinions.)

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    Bulldust

    Some Youtube creators are massive. Pewdiepie, for example, has over 56 million (yes, million) subscribers:

    https://www.youtube.com/user/PewDiePie

    The MSM would kill for a tenth of his reach. Pewdiepie mostly makes videos about video games and the like, aimed at a youngish audience. Not my cup of tea, but he is entirely harmless. He got a lot of money from Youtube ads, and partnerships with Google and Disney. The guy made millions per year, and from some accounts donated a lot to charity. Clearly he was too big for the MSM and had to be taken down.

    The Wall Street Journal, of all publications, ran a hit piece in which they looked through hundreds of his videos to find a few off colour jokes about Nazism and next thing he knew, millions in contracts were torn up:

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2017/02/17/pewdiepies-misguided-war-on-the-media-sounds-familiar/#53894ebd19c7

    This was the first major broadside in the war for free speech. To be clear, Pewdiepie hadn’t done or said anything even potentially offensive other than in jest, i.e. poking fun at Nazis. But out of context it was enough to scare Disney and Google so they tore up their deals with him.
    Next up came the Youtube Adpocalypse. Advertisers responding to the trumped up stories about adverts appearing next to “inappropriate” content starting pulling their money out. This led to a severe over-reaction from Youtube called the Adpocalypse (see Phil DeFranco’s description – 5.6 million subscribers):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VN3Sy7tajtw

    Phil tends to be a bit of a fence-sitter and underestimated what was to come in the next few months. Bear in mind that while this was going on Youtube was working on collaborations with MSM TV companies to deliver Youtube Red:

    https://www.youtube.com/red

    Essentially Youtube wanted to become a new streaming service competing with the likes of Netflix and Amazon Prime. Hence, people surmised, Youtube was trying to sanitise the edgy content which doesn’t tow the kiddie-friendly PC line by demonetising, hiding, and even killing off channels. Again, private company, so they can do whatever they want, right?

    By the way, if you want to get a taste for the “balance” at Youtube, then look no further than the NGOs they are going to use to advise which videos need to be Memory Holed (Joseph Paul Watson):

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNwWoPD1c9k

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      Bulldust

      Non-progressives on Youtube
      There is a whole spectrum of content creators on Youtube which I find myself enjoying, which range from the serious, such as:

      • David Rubin – The Rubin Report (497k subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/RubinReport
      • Prof Jordan Peterson (400k subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/JordanPetersonVideos
      • Sargon of Akkad (693k subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/SargonofAkkad100

      David Rubin does excellent free-flowing interviews with anyone from the entire political spectrum (oddly it tends to be centrists and conservatives which talk to him more so than progressives). Jordan Peterson will give you a huge mental workout on psychology – he is famous for his stand rejecting made-up personal pronouns for the 70-odd genders people subscribe to these days (check out the gender drop-down list on Facebook if you don’t believe me). Sargon of Akkad does very incisive videos on a variety of political topics, but also anti-SJW (Social justice Warriors – more on this below) stuff from time to time.

      Then there are a variety of creators like the aforementioned Black Pigeon Speaks who are provocative, but can be entertaining or informative, such as:

      • Dave Cullen – Computing Forever (250k subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/LACK78
      • Black Pigeon Speaks (218k subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/TokyoAtomic
      • No Bullshit (no relation) (193k subs) https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCZNk7Jjb2t8EuBdgn4Zj1cw
      • Lauren Southern (322k subs) https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCla6APLHX6W3FeNLc8PYuvg
      • Paul Joseph Watson (1.01million subs) https://www.youtube.com/user/PrisonPlanetLive
      • too many more to mention.

      Some like Paul Joseph Watson are deliberately provocative and others such as Dave Cullen are of a much cooler temperament. Most share the distaste for the MSM and the associated fake news narratives and call it out, frequently. Consequently most of these channels have been demonetised, either mostly or fully by Youtube. Given Google’s increasingly left-leaning disposition these dissenting opinions must be discouraged, of course. Dave Cullen summarises the current situation very well here:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0anZBaPih4g

      Youtube will continue to push the dissenting (i.e. non-progressive) opinions down the memory hole, and I imagine it will end up with putting all these commentators into “limited state” in which they will not be found unless you know what to look for and directly subscribe to the feeds. The last step will be outright censorship.

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        TdeF

        Excellent summary. Thank you.

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          Bulldust

          Thanks – It was really starting to annoy me how the MSM was completely contorting the picture with respect to some of these Youtube commentators I have come to respect. I felt a need to write it all down so I pretty much brain dumped it one weekend last year.

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        yarpos

        not sure where you are getting sub numbers from, they are all much higher. Peterson especially who is well over a million.

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      Bulldust

      The Postmodernism cancer
      To fully understand the cancer that is postmodernism you have to dive deeply into philosophy. Jordan Peterson explains it briefly in an interview with Joe Rogan (note the irony that this video has ads, despite Peterson’s Youtube channel being heavily demonetised):

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0anZBaPih4g

      The TL: DNR version? There are infinite ways to view and therefore interpret reality, hence all reality is subjective. Needless to say this leads to the perspective that there is no objective truth. It then becomes easy to see how this leads to there being 70-odd genders because gender is subjective to people who subscribe to this ideology, but I digress,

      Another manifestation of the postmodern disease is the reification of Marxism, but not in the traditional class versus class conflict, but rather as one identity group against another. This requires a hierarchy to establish the oppressor and the oppressed. Anyone reading this will intuitively know that heterosexual white middle-aged males will be the oppressors in this scenario and other identity groups will rank higher in terms of needing protection from this patriarchy.

      This is the foundation of the SJW (Social Justice Warrior) types. Until a year or so ago I had no idea what social justice was. I came across the term in videos by the likes of Sargon and remember him mentioning the long SJW march through the institutions. I remember going through university in both Leeds (UK) and Arizona, but that was over 20 years ago, and my, how things have changed.
      A quick search for social justice in Australia leads to lots of links, such as:

      https://www.uq.edu.au/study/course.html?course_code=CRIM2099
      https://courses.mq.edu.au/2018/domestic/undergraduate/bachelor-of-arts-social-justice
      http://www.law.unsw.edu.au/areas-of-study/human-rights-social-justice
      http://www.law.uwa.edu.au/students/legal-qualifying-degree/internships/legal-internships/social-justice-internship
      http://humanities.curtin.edu.au/research/our-research-priorities/social-justice/

      Yep, it is well and truly entrenched. I won’t spend a lot of time on the subject matter, but rest assured, it is a political ideology being indoctrinated in the youth. From this well of poison spring a number of injustices (ironically). On the mild end of the spectrum (boy do they love their spectra) you see such manifestations such as gender and racial quotas for employment (we have this where I work) all the way through to the political violence of such identity groups such as BLM (Black Lives Matter). So, an ideology which preaches justice for the oppressed contorts itself into injustice and violence. Well worth the price of tuition…

      Australian examples of social justice are the limitations on free speech (Section 18C), people banging on about the gender pay gap (paying people different wages for the same work in Australia is illegal), and the lunacy of the Human Rights Commission regarding campus rape culture (police stats show women are far safer on campus than off). By the way, did you know a prominent Australian bank pays female employees more superannuation than males? This is to correct for the fact that males tend to retire with higher superannuation balances. Sounds like justice to me…

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      Bulldust

      In the belly of the beast
      When something is as big as postmodernism it will not be stamped out overnight. I do think, however, that some critical turning points are being reached. Politicians such as Hillary Clinton labelling her opponents as “deplorables”, the MSM outright lying about reality and providing a cloak of invisibility to the terrorism emanating from the hard left (and other “oppressed” groups) are pushing people to the alternative media such as those listed previously.

      A major incident was Google’s sacking of James Damore. An MIT and Harvard graduate of mathematical biology (in a nutshell, he studies the statistics of population groups) and self professed Google fanboi, he had the misguided idea that, on average, men and women have differing interests that lead them to different employment decisions. I know, heretical… The ‘hate facts’ that almost 100% of garbage people (can’t say garbage men, right?) and bricklayers (phew, that’s gender neutral) are men, and most nurses are female … well these are all manifestations of the hetero white patriarchy, obviously…

      Clearly Damore had to be fired and the excuse was he was promoting “harmful gender stereotypes.” Damore was in the belly of the beast that is Google, caused an irritation and was promptly discharged. I would hasten to add, don’t go to the MSM to try and figure out what was in Damore’s paper. To find his ten pager on the net search for “Google’s Ideological Echo Chamber” or similar text and Damore’s name if necessary. If Jo wants I can forward a copy and she could host a copy. For what its worth several specialists in relevant fields have said Damore was pretty much spot on with his analysis and references to academic papers. But, please, read it for yourself.

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      Bulldust

      How will this end?
      People who use twitter (I don’t) have seen how well censorship (shadow bans and the like) have worked out for them. Twitter is suffering financially as a result and people have sought out alternatives. Recently Patreon (a platform for supporting content creators monetarily) removed Lauren Southern for exposing NGOs (including what I thought of as the reputable Medecins Sans Frontieres aka Doctors Without Borders) as facilitating the movement of (mostly) northern Africans from “refugee” vessels just off the coast of Libya to Italy. And now Google showed it’s true colours by firing Damore, and increasing demonetising efforts against non-progressive videos.

      Once the truth gets into general circulation it is going to hurt these companies and NGOs. People will stop funding them and switch their allegiances. Dave Cullen and others have suggested alternatives to get away from Google, for example:

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBu6p5vFMy4

      It pains me to say it, but on the political front I believe that things are going to get worse before they get better. The more the postmodernist SJWs drive their “progressive” (actually it is regressive with respect to classical liberal values) agenda, the more they will push people away to the right, and thus society will become increasingly polarised. It is far better in Australia than many other western nations, but don’t think for a second we’re that far behind.

      The POTUS is between a rock and a hard place on this issue. He decried the violence on all sides (repeatedly) and got shouted down by the MSM as ‘legitimising the white supremacists.’ If Trump intervenes to dispel violence he will be accused of being an authoritarian. The MSM will damn him regardless, unless he starts singing to their tune word for word, and that ain’t going to happen.

      I can see the situation deteriorating, but don’t take it from me, take it from left-of-centre roaming reporter Tim Pool (left enough to still be monetised):

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k41i7VR55z4

      He tends to be a bit of a fence sitter like DeFranco, but even he has had enough of the violence, and will call it out regardless of which side is perpetrating it. I wonder if he will be demonetised soon.

      So what to do? Keep speaking the truth fearlessly. Don’t be violent. Hopefully enough people can be red-pilled by the facts that conversations will drift back to the sensible centre. The alternative is to keep shouting at each other from the extreme ends of the political and philosophical spectra and watch the system decay into violence. I know which option I prefer.

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        Bulldust

        That’s all for now. As I said, if there is sufficient interest, and this doesn’t get booted for being too long, I will be happy to do an update at a later stage. On a positive note I see Jordan Peterson has become quite the celeb, reaching well over a million subscribers on his Youtube channel. Entirely deserved, and it demonstrates the hunger for common sense in a society drowning in postmodernist sewage.

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          Yonniestone

          Very good references there, I agree the non violence option is always the best and believe that people trying to get on with their lives would agree also but therein lies the main cause that’s led to this situation which is apathy brought about by the people not wanting to rock the boat and loose what assets they have, the use of debt burden has been an obvious tool used by all sides of politics and media, it’ll come to the point of deciding to loose what you have to fight for a future with the same freedoms you enjoyed or loose it to the totalitarian rule that will eventually take hold.

          But how many know these choices exist?

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        PeterS

        How will this end? In tears clearly.

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    Bulldust

    Ooops – will continue from number 12

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    mareeS

    We are cold here in Newcastle. The cat is snuggled up on her rug next to the gas heater, husband is snoring on the lounge nearby, immvirtuouslymshoweredmand out of my PJ’s.mbut heck, it is cold. And Outsiders has just come on.

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    • #

      Cold!

      Similar here in Rockhampton.

      Saturday morning 3.5C, and this morning, (Sunday) 4C. I haven’t been in that cold since my days at Wagga Wagga back in the late 80s early 90s. The lowest June Temp on record was back in 1949, and that was 1.0C, and they have only been keeping records here since 1940.

      What is also different is that it’s down below 10C before 8PM also the last few days. Days are nice though, in the low 20′s and by 9AM it’s usually 15C.

      Tony.

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        el gordo

        Its a regional cooling signal and is caused by blocking highs situated too far south for this time of year. In addition the cold air outbreak, sharpened by East Coast Lows, will drive temperatures down on the Queensland coast.

        It may just seem like unusual weather, but in fact its climate change.

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        • #
          Annie

          We’ve had -2C the last few mornings…only 11C now at lunchtime (but 16C yesterday during the day)….all a shock to the system after 44C in Dubai!

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        toorightmate

        You are experiencing cool weather Tony.
        When it’s hot, you are experiencing climate change.
        If the climate changes much more those statues of bulls on the Bruce Highway may have to be moved to Hobart!!!

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        • #

          If the climate changes much more those statues of bulls on the Bruce Highway may have to be moved to Hobart!!!

          That was novelty I noticed when we first arrived here eight years ago, all those statues of bulls around town.

          At the time, I think I noticed around ten of them, but in the intervening years I have found another half dozen or so more of them.

          We have just finished with ‘Beef Week’ here in Rocky, and when you hear that, you think minor, but this is huge here, and is bigger than some of the shows that most cites have.

          They even had three life sized statues in our local shopping mall advertising it, and more little statues popped up all around town as well.

          You could tell the cow cockies as they shopped in that Mall, with both Dad and Mum with large hats, and sometimes their children as well, all window shopping with astonished looks on their faces, not knowing where to look, considering that Mall probably had more shops in it than their local town centre where they came from would have.

          As to those fixed statues all across the city, they had to spotlight most of them, as their, umm, appendages would sometimes disappear, and some of them even have those appendages bolted on now.

          Tony.

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          • #
            Dennis

            When I was driving through one Beef Week I was amused to see an advertisement for a Bull Artist attending.

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          PeterS

          Now I get it. The alarmists treat every hot day as due to man-made climate change and every cold day as due to natural weather. So by ignoring the weather they use only the climate change days and plot their charts accordingly to show record high temperatures year after year. I suppose if this continue any longer we will see average global temperature charts climbing over say 50 C while half the world is covered in snow or ice and the other half experiencing normal temperatures. The icing on the cake would be if we enter a mini-ice age. Then they have to switch tact again and blame it on man-made global cooling. The problem for them though is they will have to have a huge step down in the temperature charts. No problem – just adjust all the historical data and call is homogenisation 2.0.

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        Another Ian

        Tony

        If that 1940 record is the airport check and see if there isn’t one for the post office that goes back further.

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        Dennis

        In northern WA this morning it was 14C and now 30C however it is a bit cooler today than the past week.

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      RicDre

      Here in northern Ohio in the US, I have been waiting for the rain that was predicted to arrive on Friday to actually get here (no rain yet as of noon on Sunday). Its a good thing the Climate models are not based on the Weather models given the “accuracy” of the weather models.

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        RicDre

        Wow, all I had to do was complain about the lack of rain and it started raining! And the local weather radars show nothing at all going on. It a Miracle! Hopefully this will green up the lawn which was right on the edge of starting to turn brown (plants do not live by CO2 alone).

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      Greg in NZ

      “Record number of skiers at Whakapapa on opening weekend” screamed today’s headline from the Old Lady of NZ churnalism. “More than 2000 were at Happy Valley on June 1, when the company offered free lift passes, skiing and snowboarding.” Yep, that’ll do it every time! “MetService is predicting a colder winter this year, and another 50cm of snow is expected to fall in the coming week.” Wait, a what? A “colder winter this year”. What happened to settled science?

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      • #
        sophocles

        Nothing happened to settled science, that’s all Natural Variation which has nothing to do with settled science. You should know that.

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          sophocles

          It’s when we get the fourth or fifth “Cold Winter” in a row that the Metservice, and maybe even NIWA, might start to think things are not going according to plan but just a little bit awry. You know it will be Interesting Indeed when Granny Herald notices …but that won’t be this year.

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  • #
    el gordo

    The Coalition ginger group is flexing its muscle.

    ‘Former prime minister Tony Abbott has warned of a campaign of disruption that could jeopardise Coalition’s election prospects should his conservative ally and fellow NSW Liberal MP Craig Kelly be rolled for preselection.’

    Fin Review

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      PeterS

      Don’t they have enough on their plate to jeopardise their election prospects? I’ve never seen a party so hell bent on losing the next election. In the past governments tend to lose due to a lack of enthusiasm and/or insight. This time the government is going out of their way to lose the next election in so many different ways.

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        Peter C

        see #28

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        Graeme No.3

        Lord Waffles has been campaigning in Mayo electrorate, supposedly in favour of Georgina Downer (Lib.) and offering $10 million to the local Mt. Barker Council to partially pay for a new swimming pool complex.
        The local reaction of a few (by no means left wingers) has been “we got ignored by the State and Federal Liberal (and Labor) for 20+ years when we were a safe Liberal seat, but since Rebekha Sharkey appeared we have started getting something spent in the electorate. Better keep Sharkey as our member”.
        I think we can call it the Waffles effect.

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        RicDre

        “Don’t they have enough on their plate to jeopardise their election prospects?”

        I often wonder the same thing about the US Republican Party. They finally get a strong leader and the RINOs (Republican In Name Only) are doing everything they can think of to undermine him. Death Wish would seem to cover the US Republican Party’s current operations.

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    Mark M

    Major study on climate change canceled due to too much ice climate change

    https://www.iceagenow.info/major-study-on-climate-change-canceled-due-to-too-much-ice/

    Straight out of a comic book …

    “Here is a link about the ridiculous approach of the warmists: their expedition failed due to too much ice around Newfoundland, and they suggested it was because ‘warming of the Arctic’ …

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    pat

    2 Jun: Seattle Times: Bill would let taxpayers aid countries hit by climate change
    BOSTON (AP) — A state lawmaker wants to let Massachusetts residents donate to poorer countries hit hardest by climate change when they fill out their tax returns.

    Sen. Mike Barrett said his bill is in part a reaction to President Donald Trump’s decision to withdraw the United States from the 2015 Paris accord meant to address climate change.
    The bill would add a line to state tax forms to let taxpayers make a donation over and above their regular payment.

    The Lexington Democrat said any money raised would go to 48 of the poorest countries in the world…
    https://www.seattletimes.com/nation-world/bill-would-let-taxpayers-aid-countries-hit-by-climate-change/

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    pat

    2 Jun: UK Telegraph: Could the world’s best performing commodity take the heat out of climate change?
    by Jillian Ambrose
    The value of energy commodities including oil, gas and coal may have more than doubled in recent years, but it is the offspring of the fossil fuel industry which is emerging as the next generation commodity to watch.

    In the last year alone, the value of Europe’s flagship carbon market has tripled. Fresh analysis shows that the price could be set to double again within the next three years and ***quadruple by the end of the next decade. The World Bank estimates that carbon markets, and simpler carbon tax regimes, have a value of well over $82bn (£62bn).

    “Governments at all levels are starting to see the effectiveness of carbon pricing in their efforts to cut harmful carbon pollution while also raising revenues for climate and ***other policies, including environmental action,” said John Roome, a senior director at the World Bank…

    Royal Dutch Shell and mining giant Rio Tinto have both joined the work carried out by the Carbon Pricing Leadership Coalition. Ben Van Beurden, Shell’s chief executive, has leant the market his personal support…
    BP’s Bob Dudley believes carbon markets could be the third pillar in meeting the Paris Agreement, alongside lowering the carbon intensity of energy and increasing efficiency…

    The price steadily fell from around €32 (£28) shortly after the market launched in 2006 to less than €3 by early 2013, amid widespread calls to scrap the scheme…
    Last week, the European carbon market was just 11 cents shy of the €16.34/t set on June 9 2011. It is a pivotal turning point which the world is watching carefully. Still, governments need to face realities if they are to close the gap between current price expectations and what’s needed to achieve the two degrees Paris goal…

    A fresh report from the body published earlier this year found that carbon prices would need to average €45-€55 per ton of carbon for a sustained period to drive coal and lignite power plants out of the market and keep emissions in line with the Paris Agreement.

    Carbon Tracker’s Mark Lewis says carbon pricing alone won’t be enough to achieve the Paris goal of keeping the global rise in temperatures to well below two degrees Celsius.
    “But it does have a vital role to play,” he says…
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/06/02/could-worlds-best-performing-commodity-take-heat-climate-change/

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      pat

      in her 2 June article, UK Tele’s Jillian Ambrose wrote:

      “Last week, the European carbon market was just 11 cents shy of the €16.34/t set on June 9 2011. It is a pivotal turning point…”

      however, what she didn’t write:

      1 Jun: CarbonPulse: EU Market: EUAs recover from 2-week low as dark spreads crushed
      EU carbon prices bounced back above €15 on Friday to claw back much of the previous day’s heavy losses, combining with weaker German power to knock generator profit margins to their lowest in at least a decade.

      1 Jun: CarbonPulse: EU Market: EUAs close under €15 following largest drop since early 2017
      EU carbon prices suffered their largest daily fall in over a year on Thursday, as end-of-month selling precipitated and wider energy markets tumbled following President Trump’s decision to impose steel and aluminium tariffs on the EU, Mexico, and Canada.

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      yarpos

      Would it be rude or non PC to invest in coal and the carbon markets at the same time? sort of hedging really.

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  • #
    pat

    ***$2 billion immediately jumps to $2.3 billion!

    3 Jun: Guardian: Up in smoke: what did taxpayers get for the ***$2bn emissions fund?
    Before the latest auction figures, Adam Morton investigates the plan Turnbull once called ‘a recipe for fiscal recklessness’
    by Adam Morton
    At some point in June, the Australian government will announce it has spent up to ***$2.3bn over three years on a scheme that the prime minister believes is a reckless waste of public money…
    According to the scheme’s architect, it is great value for money…

    ???About 80% of projects with contracts under the emissions reduction fund are in the rugby league states north of the Murray…

    The most recent greenhouse gas data shows pollution is up in every sector of the economy that gets money from the emissions reduction fund…
    The only sector in which there has been a fall in emissions is the one not covered by the emissions reduction fund – electricity, due to the closure of some coal-fired power…
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2018/jun/03/up-in-smoke-what-did-taxpayers-get-for-their-2bn-emissions-fund

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    pat

    2 Jun: UN creates a new global climate change coalition
    Earth has a “30-year window of opportunity” to tackle climate change, according to World Meteorological Organization (WMO) secretary-general Petteri Taalas…
    The three UN organizations already work together, but under the new coalition will strengthen action on guarding health from climate change- and environment-related risks. Taalas, WHO director-general Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, and UNEP executive director Erik Solheim came together to form the coalition and spoke to delegates at the World Health Assembly about opportunities and challenges to come…

    Solheim said, “If we speed up on renewable energy solutions, fewer people will die from air pollution. Let’s create a pollution-free environment.”
    One of the coalition’s first outcomes will be a Global Conference on Air Pollution and Health, which will take place at WHO Headquarters in Geneva, Switzerland from October 30 to November 1.
    http://en.brinkwire.com/366430/un-creates-a-new-global-climate-change-coalition/

    31 May: World Meteorological Org: Press release: WMO and WHO tackle health impacts of pollution, extreme weather, climate change
    GENEVA, 31 May 2018 – In the face of growing health impacts from extreme weather, climate change and air pollution, the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) and World Health Organization (WHO) have agreed to step up joint action to tackle environmental health risks that cause an estimated 12.6 million premature deaths every year.

    A new Collaboration Framework on Climate, Environment and Health was signed on 30 May by WMO Secretary-General Petteri Taalas and Dr. Tedros Adhanom Ghebreyesus, Director-General of WHO. It follows the launch of a global coalition between WMO, WHO and UN Environment during the World Health Assembly on 24 May…

    The new agreement is aligned to the international agenda on sustainable development, disaster risk reduction and climate change adaptation. It places special emphasis on reaching the most vulnerable populations in developing countries, small island developing states and urban areas.
    It is based on decades of collaboration, and puts this on a formal footing. WHO and WMO already have a Joint Office for Climate and Health…

    “Many vector-borne diseases like malaria and dengue fever are dependent on rainfall and temperature. Provision of climate services such as seasonal outlooks is vital to prevent and manage such climate-sensitive diseases. Heat-health warnings are increasingly used as a tool to reduce the health impact of heatwaves,” said Dr Taalas…

    The bilateral agreement is part of a wider international coalition which also embraces UN Environment and the Climate and Clean Air Coalition…
    One of the most immediate outcomes of the coalition will be a Global Conference on Air Pollution and Health, which will take place in Geneva 30 October to 1 November 2018…

    WMO’s role in the coalition ensures that the expertise, modelling capabilities and facilities of national meteorological services can be harnessed for global public health…
    WMO’s observing network, its Sand and Dust Storm Warning, Advisory and Assessment System (SDS-WAS) and its Global Atmosphere Watch stations, which monitor the atmosphere, will be underpinning to the global drive to improve air quality mapping and monitoring.

    The SDS-WAS can play an important role in knowing when and where dust storms may occur, to allow health partners to plan more effectively and benefit from WMO global atmospheric monitoring and forecasting capacity on acute episodes of hazardous air quality – such as dust storms.

    The World Meteorological Organization is the United Nations System’s authoritative voice on Weather, Climate and Water.
    https://public.wmo.int/en/media/press-release/wmo-and-who-tackle-health-impacts-of-pollution-extreme-weather-climate-change

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      RicDre

      “Earth has a “30-year window of opportunity” to tackle climate change”

      I thought Climate Change tipping point was supposed to occur in the next 10 years…did they move the Climate Change Goal Posts out an additional 20 years while I wasn’t looking?

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        RickWill

        I thought civilisation had already passed the tipping point – so why bother; let the good times roll.

        Here in south east Melbourne,Australia it appears we have missed out on Global Warming. Sadly June maximums have been falling since the late 1980s, Even worse June lowest temperature have also fallen since the late 1980s. Global Warming is the promise that never materialises!

        Is there any place out there that has actually experienced Global Warming? Not the sort that occurs in the heart of big cities but in the suburban and rural areas.

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    pat

    PICS: 2 Jun: NemoNews: Wind Turbine Blades Damage In Train Accident
    by Mike Scott
    At least two wind turbine blades were damaged during an accident on the Des Moines River bridge, between Keokuk, Iowa, and Alexandria, Missouri, on Saturday morning, June 2.
    Information is sketchy at this time, but it appears that two wind turbine blades being transported on a BNSF train made contact with the bridge, folded backwards and shattered.
    BNSF crews are on scene at this time, and the bridge is closed…

    We’ve reached out to both BNSF and Siemens, who we presume manufactured the blades at their plant in nearby Ft. Madison, for more information and comments…
    VIDEO: 4mins15secs
    https://nemonews.net/2018/06/02/wind-turbine-blades-damage-in-train-accident/

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      Graeme No.3

      pat:

      The blades aren’t damaged just redesigned to meet the claim by one ‘renewables’ enthusiast in the comments at The Australian that new wind turbines will operate at 63% efficiency.
      There is a possibility that he meant a Capacity Factor of 63% but confused the two. In any case No Way José!
      There is a small turbine that gives something like that CF and that was on the North Cape in Norway. 3 turbines in Shetland get 47-48% CF, but the factor drops the closer you get to the Equator (something to do with average wind speeds dropping). If it was true we would see all the installed turbines in Australia (average CF ~27%) being upgraded urgently to more than double the output.

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    pat

    only found the SMH article below because I found mention of Fairfax in this Christian radio piece:

    2 Jun: VisionChristianRadio: Questions Raised Over Solar Systems
    Thousands of Australians, who made the switch to solar energy to bring down energy costs, could have deficient solar systems because of unreliable operators.
    The Clean Energy Regulator inspected more than four-thousand small scale solar systems last year.
    Their unpublished data – obtained by Fairfax – shows almost 20 percent of the mostly rooftop systems were sub-standard – with some generating less electricity than promised.
    Common problems included poor wire protection and incorrect installation…
    https://vision.org.au/radio/news/questions-raised-over-solar-systems/

    1 Jun: SMH: One in five rooftop solar units deficient, official figures show
    By Nicole Hasham
    One in five rooftop solar systems are deficient and thousands of Australians are being denied lower power bills because their household solar delivers less electricity than promised, new data shows…
    The Clean Energy Council, which accredits 5000 solar installers in Australia, cancelled 13 accreditations this financial year and temporarily suspended 153 installers.
    NSW Fair Trading has received 3327 complaints about the photovoltaic industry over the past five years, while Consumer Affairs Victoria received 6436 in the four years to June last year…

    The Australian Energy Market Operator says rooftop solar and battery storage has the potential to improve the reliability of supply and reduce demand at peak times, and industry research found it can lower wholesale electricity prices.
    However unpublished data by the Clean Energy Regulator, obtained by Fairfax Media, suggests the technology may not always deliver as promised.
    Of 4140 small-scale solar systems, mostly rooftop units, inspected last year, 822 were “substandard”, meaning they did not meet Australian requirements and may prematurely fail. This equates to almost 20 per cent, compared to 22 per cent the previous year.

    Common problems included installers not using heavy-duty plastic coating to protect wiring, and components being incorrectly mounted or installed. Not all such issues would affect electricity yield.
    About 2 per cent of systems were deemed unsafe, often because water had entered electrical components.

    University of NSW research published in late 2016 showed the performance of rooftop solar systems in Australia varies widely.
    In Sydney, the worst-performing 25 per cent of systems had electricity yields at least 16 per cent lower than the best-performing 25 per cent of systems. In Melbourne and Brisbane the difference was 13 per cent.
    Senior lecturer at the university’s School of Photovoltaic and Renewable Energy Engineering, Anna Bruce, said most rooftop systems performed as expected.

    However some were “not performing well at all” and in many cases, the owners were oblivious.
    “Those households are not getting their money back to cover the cost of that investment,” Dr Bruce said.
    “They could be saving a lot more money off their electricity bills and we could be reducing more emissions if those systems were performing properly.
    “We need to be watching and making sure [the systems] are properly maintained,” she said, adding “there will be failures” as systems installed over the past decade began to age.

    Pieter Lindhout, from Annandale in Sydney’s inner west, installed solar panels on his family home about six years ago. After purchasing a monitoring device to track energy production and consumption, it showed “no electricity being produced”.
    “That was a shock,” he said, estimating the system had been dormant for up to four months.
    Mr Lindhout replaced a broken inverter, which converts the solar system current into one that can be used by home appliances.

    But another issue soon emerged – cables into the solar panels were touching the roof, and the panels short circuited when it rained.
    Without monitoring “I would not have been aware that my system was working at 60 per cent,” Mr Lindhout said…

    Solar Analytics chief executive Stefan Jarnason, whose organisation is the nation’s largest independent energy monitoring provider, said while installers were generally “very good these days, there’s always some shonky ones around, as there are in any industry.”
    The company’s analysis of data from over 6000 photovoltaic sites that are not actively monitored found 11 per cent were likely to be generating less than half their expected output.

    Sustainability consultant Michael Mobbs, of the inner Sydney suburb of Chippendale, has suffered a string of design and installation problems with his $26,000 rooftop solar and storage system installed in 2015. Monitoring revealed the system was providing just 46 per cent the promised electricity.
    https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/one-in-five-rooftop-solar-units-deficient-official-figures-show-20180601-p4zixo.html

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    • #
      pat

      should have noted there’s still plenty of solar PR in the SMH piece, as expected.

      20

    • #
      yarpos

      “The Australian Energy Market Operator says rooftop solar and battery storage has the potential to improve the reliability of supply” breathtaking

      50

      • #
        Annie

        Refurbishing and reopening Hazelwood would make more sense, as would cutting out subsidies to unrenewables. Does AEMO really believe its own statement?

        20

      • #
        Annie

        I haven’t been down to the middle of our village to see what time the sun is sinking behind the hill to its west at present. I suspect it is fairly early. What with foggy mornings I’m wondering just how useful the proposed micro-grid would be?!

        40

  • #
    pat

    FakeNews again:

    3 Jun: Yahoo: Reuters: America’s poor becoming more destitute under Trump: U.N. expert
    Reporting by Stephanie Nebehay; editing by David Stamp, Andrew Bolton and Daniel Wallis
    Poverty in the United States is extensive and deepening under the Trump administration whose policies seem aimed at removing the safety net from millions of poor people, while rewarding the rich, a U.N. human rights investigator has found.
    Philip Alston, U.N. special rapporteur on extreme poverty, called on U.S. authorities to provide solid social protection and address underlying problems, rather than “punishing and imprisoning the poor”…

    (FINALLY, PARAGRAPH NINE, OOPS IT WAS OBAMA-TIME???)
    ***However, the data from the U.S. Census Bureau he (Alston) cited covers only the period through 2016, and he gave no comparative figures for before and after Trump came into office in January 2017…
    Alston, a veteran U.N. rights expert and New York University law professor, will present his report to the United Nations Human Rights Council later this month.
    It is based on a mission by the Australian in December to several U.S. states, including rural Alabama, a slum in downtown Los Angeles, California, and the U.S. territory of Puerto Rico…
    https://www.yahoo.com/news/americas-poor-becoming-more-destitute-under-trump-u-110313048.html

    naturally, it is being picked up worldwide:

    US poor more destitute under Trump: expert
    NEWS.com.au-9 hours ago

    Trump’s ‘cruel’ measures pushing US inequality to dangerous level …
    The Guardian-1 Jun. 2018

    Wikipedia: Philip Alston
    His brother is the former Australian federal (Liberal) Cabinet minister and High Commissioner to the United Kingdom, Richard Alston…
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philip_Alston

    20

    • #
      pat

      given Alexander Downer’s role in Spygate, amusing to see Richard Alston providing cover for him:

      31 Dec 2017: Sydney Morning Herald: Alexander Downer named as crucial link in US investigation into Russian interference
      By Michael Koziol
      The Australian government went to ground on Sunday after the revelations were published, saying through the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade that no comment would be made because the matters were subject to ongoing US investigations. Labor also declined to comment…

      Mr Downer did not respond to calls on Sunday, but one of his predecessors as high commissioner, former senator Richard Alston, said there was nothing unusual about Mr Downer’s meeting with Mr Papadopoulos.
      “We all mix with interesting people at times,” he said. “You do follow leads, and I don’t find anything particularly odd about that. You don’t necessarily know that someone’s a low-level lackey until you’ve met them, or even afterwards.”…
      Mr Alston said intelligence officials would have been responsible for decisions about informing the Americans, not Mr Downer.
      “You tell those people and then you leave it up to them. You don’t ask whether they’ve passed it on – they probably wouldn’t tell you anyway,” he said. “They guard their independence quite jealously. They certainly don’t share strategies and things like that with diplomats, even the high commissioner. They do their own thing.”…

      ???On Twitter, many Americans told Mr Downer he was a “hero” and had helped to save democracy in the US…
      https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/alexander-downer-named-as-crucial-link-in-us-investigation-into-russian-interference-20171231-h0bpn9.html

      another amusing read:

      Jan 2015: news.com.au: Billionaire Sir Michael Hintze and Liberal Party president Richard Alston throw lavish party at taxpayer owned property in London
      ONE of Australia’s richest men was allowed to hold an extraordinary function at the official Australian high commissioner’s residence in London.
      By Charles Miranda and Simon Benson
      ONE of Australia’s richest men was allowed to hold an extraordinary function for his equity fund colleagues and supporters at the grand Stoke Lodge, the official Australian high commissioner’s residence in London.

      Questions have been raised how it was the Department of Foreign Affairs and Trade allowed billionaire hedge fund manager and British Tory Party patron Sir Michael Hintze and Liberal Party of Australia president Richard Alston to throw the lavish soiree at the property in July last year…

      It is understood Alston, who knew his way around the mansion well from his time as high commissioner from 2005 to 2008, asked the then newly appointed high commissioner and former Liberal Foreign Affairs Minister Alexander Downer, to use the home for the party for the advisory board of the international equity fund, of which Mr Alston is a member…READ ON
      https://www.news.com.au/national/billionaire-sir-michael-hintze-and-liberal-party-president-richard-alston-throw-lavish-party-at-taxpayer-owned-property-in-london/news-story/2092ad5502301675d95461b7b3a1a419

      20

    • #
      OroginalSteve

      Under Trump, the reality is that the US economy is really picking up. This translates to more jobs for people across the economic and social spectrum….

      30

      • #
        RicDre

        “Under Trump, the reality is that the US economy is really picking up.”

        Yes and therein lies the problem; with the economy picking up and more people working, less people will rely on the Government Dole to survive. That’s a serious problem which the politicians must correct immediately!

        20

  • #
    Robber

    AEMO has now published reports on the reasons for its inventions in the SA market up to Dec 2017. So it still has quite a backlog to go.
    Summary of reasons for interventions in 2H 2017:
    Dec 23 – AGL synchronise Torrens A1,2 4; Origin sync Osborne; AGL sync Torrens B.
    Dec 1 – Origin sync Osborne; AGL sync Torrens B4.
    Nov 4 – Origin sync Osborne.
    Oct 27 – Energie sync Pelican 12; Origin sync Osborne; AGL sync Torrens B2.
    Oct 9 – AGL sync various Torrens.
    Oct 7 – AGL sync Torrens B2.
    Sep 22 – AGL sync Torrens B2 & 4; Origin sync Osborne.
    Sep 17 – Origin sync QPS.
    Sep 2 – Energie sync Pelican 12.
    There were no interventions in May-Aug, and just 2 Jan-Apr, and only 2 in 2016.
    In all cases AEMO forced additional gas generation in SA: “To ensure adequate system strength for secure operation of the South Australian power system, certain combinations of synchronous generating units must be in service at all times.”
    That resulted in lower generation in other States, and compensation was paid through price adjustments (ie we all paid through higher wholesale prices).
    Presumably those interventions occurred with strong wind/solar generation that made the system unstable without additional gas generation and exports to Vic.

    60

    • #
      RickWill

      Without the link to Victoria more wind would need to be taken off line. The SA-Vic link enables SA wind to export their intermittency and have forced up prices in Victoria due to closure of Hazelwood. It is a slow motion train wreck for the Australian economy.

      30

  • #
    Peter C

    NIGEL FARAGE AUSTRALIAN TOUR

    It might be of interest to some readers.
    https://www.nigellive.com.au/?gclid=EAIaIQobChMI7bbe5P-22wIVlYRwCh30EgoqEAAYASAAEgK6EvD_BwE

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    • #
      PeterS

      If only we had someone like him here in Australia. The funny thing is his demeanour is very much what down to earth Australians use to be like calling a spade a spade and standing up against BS of any kind.

      51

    • #
      Ross

      I think you will find Canadians Lauren Southern and Steve Molyneaux are coming soon after as well. They are coming to NZ so I assume they will be Australia as well.

      30

    • #
      Ian

      Only in making sure they are nowhere near this man. He is well disliked in the UK as you can see by looking at the YouGov site https://yougov.co.uk/opi/browse/Nigel_Farage

      02

  • #
    Peter C

    I’ve never seen a party so hell bent on losing the next election.

    The Liberal Party is caught in an ideological struggle for the soul of the party. The Liberal Conservatives would rather loose the next election than give Malcolm Turnbull a victory and see their party lost forever. The so called small “l” Liberals have the numbers at present but their message is so similar to Labor that there is no choice for voters.

    I myself have lost faith in the Liberal Party and have joined the ACP.

    Senator Paterson, however is continuing the struggle from within the Party.

    I went to a session of the Freidman Conference on Liberty and Freedom last weekend in Sydney. It was called “Future of the Liberal Party”, presented by Senator James Paterson, ex Senator Nick Minchin and Harry Stuchbury (Young Liberals) and Rod Schneider.

    It was clear that some young Liberals care a lot about the Core Principals of the Liberal Party. They are dismayed by the current course of events. I got the impression that the Liberal Party will not be destroyed, even if they loose the next election. But if they do loose there will be a big turn around in direction.

    40

    • #
      Peter C

      My bad! Should have been 16.1.1 in reply to Peter S.

      20

    • #

      On the horns of a dilemma, Peter, kinda’ like
      see-saw climate.

      What we true-blue liberal/conservative (not-fuddy-duddy)supporters
      -of-constitutional-rule-of-equality-before-the-law,WANT, is guvuh-mint
      for the people by the people, NOT, you know, philosofer kings making
      decisions like Big Brother, that are not,properly theirs to make …
      Soros, Turnbull, Big Al…Oh Socrates!

      40

    • #
      PeterS

      Good comments. Actually the LNP, not just the Liberal Party has lost its soul completely. It’s really time to dissolve it and start a new party with a better name since liberal in much of the world actually means the left side of politics. So until that happens they have lost my support. Meanwhile the ACP is the only real party of any conviction and common sense. However reality bites. The next election will be revealing. It appears ALP+Greens will win perhaps by a landslide. If that happens, especially if it’s a landslide the LNP has to rediscover itself quick smart or preferably just die given there is so much dead wood. Either way, we should see the last of Turnbull and his colleagues. If we don’t then surely the LNP has to die away for all our sakes. Surely Australians are not that stupid as to put up with the hypocrisy of Turnbull and his colleagues.

      20

  • #
    OroginalSteve

    My very clever and very switched-on Father sadly passed away today after his 3rd stroke.

    He worked for BIS Shrapnel as an economic consultant many years ago, and in recent times we spent much time discussing politics and the current mess that is our kamikaze energy policy.

    He was a pragmatist, but crucially didnt underderstand the engineering aspects of the power grid. However once i explained the engineering, you could see him become increasingly more concerned.

    I think out of all this you can see the disconnect between the economics worlds and engineering reality creates a high risk for Australia.

    Vale, Dad.

    140

    • #

      Commiserations,Steve, such clever-switched-on *individuals,*
      (my dad like-wise.) They’re ir-replacable.In the Naychur- Darwinian
      accounts of evolution’s grand sweep, individual moments, Socrates,
      Galileo/ Newton, Shakespeare, Beethoven, and countless others, they
      are the eye/mind on the universe and matter, what else?

      60

    • #
      pat

      condolences to you, Steve.

      40

    • #
      Kinky Keith

      Sounds like you were connected.
      You can’t ask for much more than that.
      All the best.

      20

    • #
      Annie

      That’s a sad day for you, my condolences Steve.

      40

    • #
      Yonniestone

      Very sad for you Steve, cherish your time with him.

      20

    • #
      PeterS

      You are very lucky to have had such a great dad. My condolences for your loss. If he lived long enough to have heard Trump’s news about the urgency to bolster their coal and nuclear plants I’m sure your dad would have felt even more concerned about the obvious and deliberate gradual destruction of our base load power systems.

      30

    • #
      sophocles

      Sad news, Steve. Cherish your memories of him.

      00

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    Thank you

    30

  • #
    StephenP

    UK nameplate capacity of windmills 18GW, current UK power generation from windmills 0.42GW.

    60

  • #
    StephenP

    UK nameplate capacity of windmills 18GW, current UK power generation from windmills 0.42GW.

    10

  • #
    Another Ian

    “Delingpole: One Year on from Quitting Paris Accord, Trump ‘Has Broken the Spell of Climate Change Mania’ ”

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2018/06/03/delingpole-one-year-on-from-quitting-paris-accord-trump-has-broken-the-spell-of-climate-change-mania/

    30

    • #
      PeterS

      I’m not so sure it’s yet time to celebrate over there but it’s tracking very well so far thanks to Trump. Now what to do about our country. The choice is obvious and simple, vote for ACP and put a stranglehold on the renewables nonsense. Any other decision is simply in agreement of the CAGW scam, pure and simple. The ACP policies are clear and no other party even comes close. If on the other hand Turnbull is rolled and the new leader adopts the same policies as those of the ACP then I will back LNP for sure. However, I see very little action on that front and to be honest I can’t see it happening at all as long as Turnbull stubbornly stays on as the leader. He’s the type of person who rather than give up his position would hand over the government to the ALP+Greens, who in my opinions always envied them for supporting the CAGW scam so openly and honestly, unlike Trunbull’s hypercritical stance.

      40

      • #
        wal1957

        I will not be voting for Libs even if they change their leader.
        How could you possibly trust the remaining ‘honourable’ members?
        Cutting the head off still leaves all the vermin behind.

        We do need a change and it isn’t going to happen if we continue to vote either/or of the big 2.
        I would rather put my faith in a party such as ACP. Support will grow with each subsequent election until it becomes a truly viable alternative to the greens in Labor/Libs. I am in it for the long run, something that the major parties have no concept of. Always short term self interest. Stuff ‘em!

        40

        • #
          Ian

          I do hope your still only 20 else your dream of seeing ther ACP as a viable party will almost certainly elude you At the last set of elections the ACP plus its Family First members polled less well than did Family First before the merger

          13

          • #
            Ian

            Spotted your instead of you’re just after I pressed Post Comment. Apologies for a very carless and stupid error

            02

          • #
            PeterS

            Ian I don’t dream – I am a realist. The truth is this nation is stuffed. Some of us with eyes to see know that and so will vote for a party that has much better policies, namely the ACP, even though the likelihood is they will not go far enough to hold the balance of power in either house of parliament. That’s the best we can do in a democracy. If as expected ALP+Greens wins in a landslide (mostly thanks to Turnbull) then the crash and burn hopefully will be over very quickly; quickly enough for Trump to step in and take over before the Chinese do after he is no longer the POTUS. I rather in the long term we go down under a Western democracy than under a communist dictatorship.

            10

        • #
          PeterS

          I feel the same way. I would only vote for the LNP if all of the lefties are ejected from the party. Realistically though I can’t see that happening so I have just about resigned to the fact I will be voting for ACP and ON above the rest.

          10

  • #
    Another Ian

    “Wired: If They Want to Fight ‘Fake News,’ Why Are Google, Facebook Relying on Wikipedia?”

    http://www.breitbart.com/california/2018/06/01/wired-if-they-want-to-fight-fake-news-why-are-google-facebook-relying-on-wikipedia/

    20

    • #
      PeterS

      The leftist MSM and social media outlets rely on anything and everything as long as it’s not real science and the truth.

      10

    • #
      sophocles

      Because Wikipedia can be edited by anybody with the urge to edit it.

      10

  • #
    Another Ian

    “Science or Science Fiction? 97% climate consensus crumbles in survey”

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2018/06/science-or-science-fiction-97-climate-consensus-crumbles-in-new-survey/

    20

  • #
    Mark M

    How much must a carbon credit cost before carbon credits prevent their first extreme climate event?

    New Zealand’s productivity commission charts course to low-emission future

    “So far the scheme has failed to reduce domestic emissions because the price of carbon was too low.”

    https://theconversation.com/new-zealands-productivity-commission-charts-course-to-low-emission-future-96281

    ‘Unusually’ cold start to winter after warmest ever May

    https://www.stuff.co.nz/manawatu-standard/news/80673957/unusually-cold-start-to-winter-after-warmest-ever-may

    New Zealand hit by record cold temperatures overnight

    “Mr Glassey said the bone-chilling -20 degrees recorded at Pukaki was close to the country’s coldest ever recorded of -25.6 in Ranfurly in 1903.

    “So that’s very cold.”

    https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11469596

    20

  • #
    Another Ian

    If you have time “for a gander”

    “Take a gander at this: https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1002981958509584385.html. If true, someone’s been doing a lot of footwork and has been using their head for something other than a hat rack.”

    https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2018/06/02/russia-clinton-dirt-mueller/#comment-95850

    10

  • #
    pat

    don’t know why this isn’t a separate highlight on 2GB’s website. never mind. listen to all:

    AUDIO: 15mins06secs: 4 Jun: Alan Jones Show 2GB: Melissa Ware – impact of wind farms
    https://omny.fm/shows/the-alan-jones-breakfast-show/melissa-ware-impact-of-wind-farms

    re comment #24 – 1 Jun: SMH: One in five rooftop solar units deficient, official figures show By Nicole Hasham.
    how come there is still no other MSM on this huge story which affects hundreds of thousands of householders with rooftop solar?

    yet Giles, who no doubt knows about the solar rooftop problems, has this on the same date:

    1 Jun: RenewEconomy: The rapidly changing dynamics of Australia’s grid
    By Giles Parkinson
    As for rooftop solar, Saddler notes that the share of residential solar in the grid is still relatively small but it is the most steadily growing generation source in the NEM. (See red line in chart below).
    That line is expected to grow steadily. By 2040, or perhaps 2050, the share of distributed generation, which includes rooftop solar, battery storage and demand management, is expected to reach nearly half of all Australia’s grid demand…

    (Hugh Saddler, lead author of the latest National Emissions Audit from The Australia Institute):
    “From now on we can expect new capacity to be a mix of both technologies. Indeed, the Clean Energy Regulator states that it expects solar to account for half of all (new renewable) capacity by 2020.”…

    But Australia – thanks to the closure of coal-fired generators and their replacement with wind and solar – has cut emissions by 18 per cent from the electricity grid in a decade…
    https://reneweconomy.com.au/the-rapidly-changing-dynamics-of-australias-grid-23288/

    00

  • #
    pat

    can’t recall seeing this posted. can someone excerpt some of it?

    behind paywall:

    Union calls for James Cook University to rehire sacked Peter Ridd
    The Australian-1 Jun. 2018
    The peak higher education union has called on James Cook University to immediately reinstate Peter Ridd, the physics professor and…

    20

    • #
      Another Ian

      Pat

      Got a mention on Allan Jones 2 pm session on rural radio network (I don’t have a link for that) , so might be on his 2GB am one

      00

      • #
        Another Ian

        One suggestion was that JCU be banned from any of the latest $500 mil till they re-hire him.

        Jennifer Marohasy mentions it in her latest email also

        00

  • #
    Mark M

    Plastic Bag Ban begins July 2018.

    WA will ban lightweight plastic bags on 1 July
    http://qldbagban.com.au/wa-will-ban-lightweight-plastic-bags-on-1-july/

    Apparently whales will be able to tell the difference between plastic bags with handles – less than 36 microns, including degradable, biodegradable and compostable plastic bags, and “barrier bags for unpackaged perishable food such as fruit, vegetables, meat and fish.”
    https://www.qld.gov.au/environment/assets/documents/pollution/management/waste/plastic-bag-ban-factsheet.pdf

    > Perhaps this whale missed school that day …

    Whale dies in Thailand after swallowing 80 plastic bags
    http://www.france24.com/en/20180602-whale-dies-thailand-after-swallowing-80-plastic-bags

    But, my ‘thing’ is being charged for bags that have been ‘banned’.

    The local cake-pie shop has a notice it will charge 10c a bag.
    I can buy online, MED HD 240 + 120 Side Gusset x 500 – 20 Microns 2,000 Bags per Box @ $58 + GST per box
    https://www.plasticbags.com.au/collections/stock-bags/products/singlet-bags-white

    “Singlet bags are used by supermarkets and many other retail outlets.
    They are strong and economical and many customers re-use them as bin liners.”

    . . .
    . Where is the government regulations on what can be charged for a banned bag, or is it a free-for-all?

    . Shop owners who value customers could add only a charge of .005 to each bag, or you could charge 10c, or, the ‘green’ retailer could refuse to stock them as they are banned.

    . Is there a strict ATO compliance and stock inventory sales sheet so there is no skimming of cash by dubious retailers?

    . Each bag has a mark-up profit beyond dreams.

    Retailers need to confront the Retailers Association asap and help train their frontline staff deal with people refusing to pay and abuse.

    But, it gets worse.

    Who will regulate this?

    Penalties may apply to any retailer who does not comply with the legislation.

    And this. Should a government suggest “media criticism” as a legitimate response?

    “In addition, retailers who ignore the bag ban may suffer consumer boycotts or media criticism.”
    http://qldbagban.com.au/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/QLD-BAG-BAN-factsheet-KEY-FACTS.pdf

    Some facts:

    Thailand is one of the world’s largest consumers of plastic bags, which kill hundreds of marine creatures living near the country’s popular beaches each year.
    At least 300 marine animals including pilot whales, sea turtles and dolphins perish each year in Thai waters after ingesting plastic, Thon told AFP.
    “It’s a huge problem,” he said. “We use a lot of plastic.”
    http://www.france24.com/en/20180602-whale-dies-thailand-after-swallowing-80-plastic-bags

    Plastic bags best for the environment:
    You must reuse a regular cotton bag 7,100 times to make it better for the environment
    Organic cotton bag needs 20,000 reuses
    Paper needs 43 reuses (pg 10-11)
    Danish EPA: http://mst.dk/service/publikationer/publikationsarkiv/2018/mar/plastposer-lca/
    via: https://twitter.com/BjornLomborg/status/974328993947283457

    Plastic Bag Ban Responsible For Spike In E. Coli Infections, Study Says

    Laws against plastic bags often encourage the use of reusable totes to transport groceries. But as people tend to neglect washing those bags, increased food contamination becomes likely.

    https://www.huffingtonpost.com.au/entry/plastic-bag-ban_n_2641430

    > “Most advances of human society over the past century have been facilitated by the use of plastics.” <

    Plastics and Environmental Health: The Road Ahead

    Plastics continue to benefit society in innumerable ways, even though recent public focus on plastics has centered mostly on human health and environmental concerns, including endocrine-disrupting properties and long-term pollution.

    The benefits of plastics are particularly apparent in medicine and public health.

    Plastics are versatile, cost-effective, require less energy to produce than alternative materials – such as metal or glass – and can be manufactured to have many different properties.
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3791860/

    11

    • #
      Another Ian

      Mark

      Jennifer Marohasy had a series of blog posts in the early 2000′s (IIRC) around the highly successful stuff up that was the ban on plastic in Ireland.

      It was bad enough to convince even the greens on the enquiry into introducing an equivalent ban in Scotland that it was not a good idea

      11

  • #
    pat

    truly unbelievable. tonight, ABC Four Corners has the FIRST OF THREE programs on TRUMP/RUSSIA. note in the opening line: “The US President and his connections to Russia”!

    ABC TV Australia: Trump/Russia
    Posted Tue 29 May 2018, 5:59pm Updated Tue 29 May 2018, 6:23pm
    It’s the story of the century: The US President and his connections to Russia.

    In a Four Corners special series, award winning investigative reporter Sarah Ferguson follows the spies and the money trail from Washington, to London, to Moscow.

    In this three-part series, Four Corners delivers a riveting account of the allegations and evidence from the characters central to the drama that has gripped the world.

    On Monday night, the story begins:

    Follow the Money: Four Corners follows the money trail from New York to Moscow, tracking the ties between Trump, his business empire and Russia.

    Secrets, spies and useful idiots: in part two, Four Corners speaks to key protagonists at the centre of the unfolding drama over members of the Trump team accused of being compromised by Russia.

    Moscow Rules: in part three, Four Corners investigates the central allegations that members of the Trump team, including possibly the President himself, actively colluded with Russia to subvert American democracy.

    Months in the making, filmed across the United States, the United Kingdom and Russia, Sarah Ferguson charts the extraordinary allegations, interrogating the evidence and interviewing central characters in this unfolding story that could be lifted from the pages of a blockbuster spy novel.

    A three-part investigative special series reported and presented by Sarah Ferguson, begins Monday 4th June at 8.30pm. It is replayed on Tuesday 5th June at 1.00pm and Wednesday 6th at 11.20pm. It can also be seen on ABC NEWS channel on Saturday at 8.10pm AEST, ABC iview and at abc.net.au/4corners.
    http://www.abc.net.au/4corners/trumprussia/9813228

    two of the characters ABC chooses to feature:

    4 Jun: Felix Sater: The business partner Donald Trump wants nothing to do with
    Four Corners By Sarah Ferguson, Jeanavive McGregor and Lucy Carter
    Updated 45 minutes ago
    Trump biographer Tim O’Brien questions the deal struck by Sater…
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-04/felix-sater-long-time-business-partner-to-donald-trump/9815904

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      pat

      the first of the 2 characters:

      13 March: Buzzfeed: How A Player In The Trump-Russia Scandal Led A Double Life As An American Spy
      Felix Sater has been cast as a Russian mafioso, a career criminal, and a key business associate of President Donald Trump — but he spent more than two decades as an intelligence asset who helped the US government track terrorists and mobsters. “Greed is my go-to weapon.”
      by Anthony Cormier & Jason Leopold
      Basically, he’s portrayed as something just short of a Russian spy.

      Effectively, he has been a spy — but for the United States. For the first time, BuzzFeed News has verified the surprising sweep of Sater’s undercover work and many of his specific exploits. He worked as an asset for the CIA and the Defense Intelligence Agency (or DIA) and tracked Osama bin Laden. Then he worked for more than a decade for the FBI, providing intel on everything from the mob to North Korea’s drive for nuclear weapons. He still operates as a source for the bureau, according to two current FBI agents…

      Did he actually know Putin?
      “No, of course not.”
      Did he think the Trump Moscow deal could get Trump elected?
      Even Trump “is f**king surprised he became the president.”…
      https://www.buzzfeed.com/anthonycormier/felix-sater-trump-russia-undercover-us-spy

      Wikipedia: Felix Sater
      As a result of his assistance, Sater’s court records were sealed for 10 years by Loretta Lynch, then the United States Attorney for the Eastern District of New York. Lynch’s decision to seal his records was discussed at her 2015 Congressional confirmation hearings to become attorney general; she stated that Sater provided “information crucial to national security and the conviction of over 20 individuals, including those responsible for committing massive financial fraud and members of La Cosa Nostra.”

      provided u read the following long enough, u got to the following excerpts:

      28 Aug 2017: NYT: Trump Associate Boasted That Moscow Business Deal ‘Will Get Donald Elected’
      By Matt Apuzzo and Maggie Haberman
      There is no evidence in the emails that Mr. Sater delivered on his promises, and one email suggests that Mr. Sater overstated his Russian ties. In January 2016, Mr. Cohen wrote to Mr. Putin’s spokesman, Dmitri S. Peskov, asking for help restarting the Trump Tower project, which had stalled. But Mr. Sater did not appear to have Mr. Peskov’s direct email, and instead wrote to a general inbox for press inquiries.
      The project never got government permits or financing, and died weeks later.
      “To be clear, the Trump Organization has never had any real estate holdings or interests in Russia,” the Trump Organization said Monday in a statement…

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      Annie

      Are the ABC laying themselves open to legal action over this in the future?

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    pat

    comment re: “13 March: Buzzfeed: How A Player In The Trump-Russia Scandal Led A Double Life As An American Spy” has gone into moderation.

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      pat

      second of the 2 characters, Timothy L. O’Brien:

      theirABC even posts a youtube!

      3 Jun: Youtube: Trump/Russia: Trump biographer Tim O’Brien says the President is a liar
      posted by ABC News Australia
      Tim O’Brien speaks to Four Corners’ Sarah Ferguson about the Trump family and their dealings in Russia.
      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Qa3oQnVp2c&feature=youtu.be

      Timothy O’Brien (ex-NYT, HuffPo etc) now churns out anti-Trump stuff for Bloomberg, including his latest:

      31 May: BloombergQuint: Trump a 10? No, Say Puerto Rico’s 4,600 Dead
      by Timothy L. O’Brien
      On Tuesday the New England Journal of Medicine (LINK) published a new estimate of the lives lost on Puerto Rico due to Hurricane Maria: about 4,600. That stands in stark contrast to the 16 deaths the president cited in October, and the official death toll of 64 that the Puerto Rican government has stood by for months…
      To put the tragedy in context, consider the death tolls from other recent hurricanes…
      Compared to all of these events, Hurricane Maria represents an epic loss of life. And the New England Journal noted that its estimate of about 4,600 dead on Puerto Rico “is likely to be an underestimate.” …
      Reporters on the ground in Puerto Rico last fall saw this coming…

      even Trump-hating WaPo questioned the number:

      1 Jun: WaPo: FactChecker: Did exactly 4,645 people die in Hurricane Maria? Nope.
      by Glenn Kessler
      Few academic studies have received as much media coverage as a new report, published by the New England Journal of Medicine, that the death toll in Puerto Rico in the aftermath of Hurricane Maria was much higher than official estimates of 64.
      Most of the articles on the study funded by Harvard T.H. Chan School of Public Health focused on one particular number: 4,645 “excess deaths” from Sept. 20 through Dec. 31, 2017. The report stirred outrage and anger…

      But there’s a problem: This is not a verified number, unlike body counts in wars. The Harvard study offers only an estimate – a midpoint along a broad range of possibilities. It is not based on death records, only estimates of deaths from people who were interviewed in a survey.

      In effect, the researchers took one number – 15 deaths identified from a survey of 3,299 households – and extrapolated that to come up with 4,645 deaths across the island. That number came with a very large caveat, clearly identified in the report, but few news media accounts bothered to explain the nuances…

      Here’s why you need to be very, very careful with this figure.
      The Facts
      Few disagree that the official death toll is far too low. The Puerto Rican government has already asked researchers at George Washington University’s Milken Institute School of Public Health to examine death certificate and mortality data to come up with a better number. That report is due to be completed in the coming months…

      The Harvard study took a different approach. The researchers surveyed a random sample of 3,299 households, representing 9,522 people, and obtained answers from about 93 percent. The survey participants identified 38 people who died after the hurricane through December. Of that number, three died directly from medical complications, illness or trauma because of the hurricane, and 12 died because of the interruption of medical services in the aftermath. The other 23 deaths were reported to be unrelated to the storm.

      From that base of survey data, the researchers extrapolated to the whole island and came up with a range of excess deaths. That range is 793 to 8,498, with a 95 percent confidence interval. This means, according to the researchers, that “if one had unlimited resources, and continued to take random samples, 95 percent of the resulting confidence intervals would include the actual death count.” The widely reported number of 4,645 is simply the midpoint and is no more or less valid than any other number in the range. (Note: the third sentence has been rewritten to directly quote from the document, as various experts have contacted The Fact Checker with differing definitions of a 95-percent confidence interval.)

      In response to questions, the researchers posted a document that includes this question: Does your study say that 4,645 died? The answer: “No. We provide a 95% confidence interval of 793 to 8,498, and 4,645 falls in the middle of this range.”

      The researchers said the confidence interval is so large because “deaths are relatively rare events,” and so many more households would need to be surveyed to narrow the range: “This was a quick study on a limited budget. With more time and resources, we would recommend a larger sample size in order to narrow the range of estimates.” They also noted they did not have access to the demographic registry data, like other researchers, because the government stopped sharing data…

      Steven Kopits of Princeton Policy Advisers, a critic of the Harvard study, notes that the available registry data, which still is incomplete, shows 654 excess deaths above the previous year through December. On the face of it, he said, the Harvard number makes little sense because that means 4,000 bodies would be missing – when only 45 were reported as missing as of December.
      “With the power outage following the hurricane, residents in ill health and near death died prematurely for lack of access to life-sustaining services like respirators, dialysis and air conditioning,” he said. “These deaths were principally attributable to an extended loss of power. On the other hand, most of these people were under the care of family or professional staff, and their deaths were recorded in near real time. Virtually all those who died in 2017 have been properly accounted for. There are materially no missing bodies.”…

      He suspects that because the “vast majority of those who died prematurely would have died in a few months even absent the hurricane,” the number of excess deaths should “decrease month by month and probably disappear entirely — from a statistical perspective — within a year.”

      Another critic is Donald Berry, professor of biostatistics at the University of Texas MD Anderson Cancer Center in Houston. “The results are statistically weak and nearly useless, at least insofar as number of deaths is concerned,” he said. “Another way of conveying the confidence interval 793 to 8498 is 4645+/-3852. The error is almost as big as the estimate.” He also faulted the researchers for using a different methodology — official deaths for all of Puerto Rico— as a comparison for 2016. “They should have used deaths in 2016 only the same 104 barrios they considered in 2017,” he said…

      [Update: Under pressure, the Puerto Rican health department suddenly released the long-hidden death figures, showing an increase of 561 deaths in September over the same month in 2016, an increase of 683 deaths in October, an increase of 187 in November and a decline of 34 in December. That adds up to a 1,397 increase in that four-month period.]

      All too often, the news media grabs onto a number in an academic report and puts it in headlines, ignoring the caveats deep in the report. Given that this report is based on a survey, with potentially huge margins of error, it should be treated cautiously. Five other studies, based on preliminary death certificate data, have all come up with much lower numbers – about 1,000.

      That’s still 15 times higher than the official count, which is bad enough. But it’s an egregious example of false precision to cite the “4,645” number without explaining how fuzzy the number really is.

      On the face of it, there should not be thousands of missing people in Puerto Rico. Given the large confidence interval for the Harvard study, it seems more likely that the true number is closer to the lower limit in the range, along the lines of previous studies – and not the number that has been so prominently in the news.
      https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fact-checker/wp/2018/06/02/did-4645-people-die-in-hurricane-maria-nope/?utm_term=.95428fbce755

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        pat

        Greenfield also questioned what O’Brien didn’t:

        1 Jun: FrontPageMag: Daniel Greenfield: Harvard Study Explodes Puerto Rico Death Rate to Bash Trump
        And ‘Deathers’ demand more dead Puerto Ricans
        Now Harvard has delivered. “Hurricane Maria killed more than 4,600 in Puerto Rico, not 64,” USA Today blares. “A New Study Says Nearly 6,000 Died In Puerto Rico,” BuzzFeed shouts. “Puerto Rico’s Hurricane Maria Death Toll Could Exceed 4,000,” the New York Times reports slightly more cautiously.
        4,000, 4,600 or 6,000. Which is it? …
        This is what comes of a media monopoly that thinks fact checks are only for Republicans…

        Did researchers from the hallowed halls of Harvard actually count graves and assemble a list of all the people who died in Hurricane Maria?
        Come on. That’s too much work. So the Harvard researchers took it easy (LINK)…READ ALL
        https://www.frontpagemag.com/fpm/270327/harvard-study-explodes-puerto-rico-death-rate-bash-daniel-greenfield

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    DonS

    Hi Jo

    I don’t know if anyone else has mentioned it but last week one of your former universities, Australian National University, announced that from 2020 it would be selecting students for admission not just based on academic merit but will require a compulsory, provable, community service component. For overseas viewers, admission to Australian universities has in the past been based almost entirely past academic score although individual circumstances can also be taken into account.

    So what you may say, as I did initially, but on reflection it seems that they could be setting up a system that can be used to discriminate against what they would regard as undesirables/deplorables gaining access to a university education. Shy, introverted, outsiders, sceptical, free thinkers need not apply. ANU wants joiners, followers, conformers to the current fashions. Solid, measurable and testable criteria are no longer enough.

    And by what do they measure “community service”? In the choice between someone who volunteered to handout how to vote cards for the Liberal party or someone who chained themselves to a tree to stop a coal mine who would an admissions staffer under the direction of an academic choose as worthy of entry?

    I know I would never have gotten into university under this proposed system as I am not a joiner of clubs etc. and have a deep suspicion of like minded groups of people. As a student of science I always thought it better to be unattached to any one group or group think, look at what peer pressure has done to climate science. Time will tell but it seems that ANU is looking to create an even more politically mono-cultural student body of leftist do gooders then they have now.

    Interestingly the new system will not apply to full fee paying international milch cows (students). ANU not quite ready to scare off that golden goose.

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      Annie

      Sorry DonS, accidental touch on red thumb….definitely not intended for you! ANU seem to be looking for one, however :(

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    pat

    ABC’s Big Ideas? CAGW again?
    seems Hunt from Cambridge was on the program on a different CAGW angle just last week, but why not provide him with more hours (with repeats) of taxpayer-funded air-time:

    4 Jun: ABC: Geoengineering: The quick, and potentially catastrophic, fix for climate change
    RN By Michael Dulaney for Big Ideas
    To proponents, like Cambridge University’s Hugh Hunt, geoengineering could mitigate the worst aspects of climate change, and provide time to look for more permanent solutions.
    “It’s a little bit like someone with lung cancer – we’re not going to give you a transplant if you’re going to carry on smoking,” he said.
    “Geoengineering will buy us some time, until we get this sorted out.”…

    Dare not speak its name…
    Dr Hunt is concerned about the lack of research into geoengineering solutions, which he says could leave the international community seriously unprepared if any country decided to act unilaterally.
    “If they could be made to work, they could be quite cheap – the development time can be short, and the cost low,” he said.
    “It’s like the Voldemort of climate change – it shall not be mentioned.”…

    Adaptation on the Great Barrier Reef
    Great Barrier Reef Marine Park Authority (GBRMPA) chief scientist David Wachenfeld said the authority has already undertaken local action to improve the resilience of the reef to climate change, which he said was “far and away the greatest threat” to its survival…
    Dr Hunt and Dr Wachenfeld spoke at the Climate Adaptation 2018 conference in Melbourne, recorded and broadcast by RN’s Big Ideas.
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2018-06-04/geoengineering-the-risky-fix-climate-change/9822022

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      OriginalSteve

      What this article talks of in a coded way, is the planned take down of our industrial civilisation to protect their mythical “Gaia” nonsense…..

      The ABC in effect is really a religious broadcaster now…

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    Ian1946

    An interesting article on global warming it’s origins and current drivers.

    FYI:
    https://www.john-daly.com/history.htm

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    pat

    a better alternative to ABC’s Four Corners this evening:

    3 Jun: Youtube: 39mins54secs: Life Liberty & Levin – Sunday June 03 2018
    On this week’s Life, Liberty & Levin, Mark and special guests Andy McCarthy and David Limbaugh break down the Mueller investigation, James Comey’s inconsistencies, spies in the campaign and the left’s war on Trump and their desire to impeach him.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8_mbJUxdwf8

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    OriginalSteve

    It occurs to me that many trolls like Craig Thomas / Ian are designed to chew up our time so we dont do other actually useful things like actual science….

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    Yonniestone

    Just saw this on Catallaxy Files, Tony Abbott to Give Carter Commemorative Lecture.

    The Lecture will be held at CQ Functions in the Melbourne CBD from 5:30 pm Tuesday, 3 July 2018.

    To book click this link http://www.australianenvironment.org/events/2018/7/3/abbott-lecture

    I’m going to try to get there, looks great.

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    Lewis P Buckingham

    SBS news on TV just told us that the current bad dry spell in NSW is caused by Climate Change.
    Since the definition of Climate Change is caused by our CO2, according to the IPCC, SBS has decided we caused it.
    So now we can work out what caused all the other droughts in Australia, we did.

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      sophocles

      Then you’ll appreciate this paper by Smirnov (Collision and radiative processes in emission of atmospheric carbon dioxide 2nd May 2018) wherein he states:

      The contribution to the global temperature change due to anthropogenic injection of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere, i.e. resulted from combustion of fossil fuels, is approximately 0.02 K now.

      So SBS news on TV is flat out wrong, is misleading their public with Fake Facts and here’s your proof (to beat them up with). You could make the demand, that in the light of the evidence you provide, it is now up to them to categorically prove their claim or retract and apologize to their readers.

      A little more is at NoTricksZone . My first link (top) is to the paper’s Abstract only; the rest of the paper is behind a paywall. Expletive Deleted!

      Go on: have some fun. :-)

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    Another Ian

    “(Category: Baiting the left)”

    Link and comments at

    http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/index.php/2018/06/03/newrules-3/

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    pat

    but the FakeNewsMSM have been raving about how well it’s going!

    4 Jun: CarbonPulse: ETS delay puts China’s fledgling carbon industry in chokehold, survey shows
    The delay of China’s national emissions trading scheme is threatening to choke the nation’s fledgling carbon market industry as a majority of companies have put a freeze on new hires and some staffers have been forced to take a pay cut to keep their jobs, according to a new survey.

    4 Jun: CarbonPulse: Australia cancels contracts for 1.7m carbon credits
    Australia’s Clean Energy Regulator has cancelled two contracts for delivery of a total 1.67 million carbon credits to its Emissions Reduction Fund.

    behind paywall:

    4 Jun: UK Telegraph: Ex-City banker readies £150m float of uranium venture Yellow Cake
    By Jon Yeomans
    A former investment banker is leading the flotation of a new company that plans to buy up and store huge quantities of uranium in anticipation of a jump in its value.

    Peter Bacchus, previously of Jefferies and Morgan Stanley, is masterminding the initial public offering of Yellow Cake, which is seeking to raise between $160m (£120m) and $200m that it will use to buy 8.1m pounds of the radioactive metal, used in nuclear reactors.
    It is understood that Yellow Cake – so named for the yellowy tint of powdered uranium – has struck a supply deal with Kazatomprom, the world’s largest producer of uranium, to buy around $170m worth of the metal at a 7pc discount to the current spot price of around $22…
    https://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2018/06/04/ex-city-banker-readies-150m-float-uranium-venture-yellow-cake/

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      yarpos

      Carbon “industry” ??? I remember when industry had to do with doing useful things and producing some goods and services.

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