JoNova

A science presenter, writer, speaker & former TV host; author of The Skeptic's Handbook (over 200,000 copies distributed & available in 15 languages).


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Weekend Unthreaded

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Weekend Unthreaded, 9.2 out of 10 based on 41 ratings

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266 comments to Weekend Unthreaded

  • #

    Is the Gore effect getting stronger?
    “GET OUT OF MELBOURNE WHILE YOU STILL CAN” Warning in the Daily Telegraph.
    Click here.
    Then it hits. “Coldest temperature in years’ as Australia shivers”
    Click here.

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    • #

      We’ve just had a couple of warm days down south and, guess what, we also have had steady rain. Warm weather and rain, it can’t be. Anyway, I’m just waiting for the warming worriers to begin their end of the world wailing once again.

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      • #
        toorightmate

        Yep.
        The presence of climate change is Oh so obvious.
        Melbourne has never before had a windy day in winter, nor a cold day in winter, nor a warm day in winter, nor rain in winter. Global warming is upon us, to be sure, to be sure, to be sure.

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        • #
          OriginalSteve

          Speaking of other “weird” things…..oh noes…..

          http://climatechangedispatch.com/nasa-confirms-falling-sea-levels-for-two-years-amidst-media-blackout/

          “Most media outlets cannot be bothered to report something that dramatically deflates their narrative. So it goes without saying that when NASA confirmed that ocean levels have actually been falling for the past few years, the media would be more than silent.

          As the global warming narrative quickly unravels, and leftists scramble to throw accusations at those who dare question the false data, the media brushes facts under the rug. Amidst revelations of scientific *****, data alteration and faked “hockey stick” data models, the fake news media remains suspiciously silent over the fact that NASA now confirms ocean levels have been falling for nearly two years.

          On a NASA page intended to spread climate alarmism (https://climate.nasa.gov/vital-signs/sea-level/), NASA’s own data reveal that worldwide ocean levels have been falling for nearly two years, dropping from a variation of roughly 87.5mm to below 85mm.”

          10

        • #

          I always like to make clear that I’m a believer in climate change, even recent climate change…and even a human component in climate change!

          But I also believe climate has to change and not just in cycles (or it wouldn’t be climate), the present change is broadly what-you-get in an interglacial and any human component is no big deal compared to what Gaia throws at you just because she can.

          The least spectacular climate change is sea level rise. Why has it been such a dribble since the 1700s? Is this the best we can do now? Certainly not your glory days of ten to eight thousand years ago, Gaia old girl. And now someone says the dribble has stopped! (Not that I’d care, but really, Gaia…)

          Apparently the present winter heatwave is, for a determined few, the latest evidence of CAGW. When I check (naughty me, I check) if find that a record for hottest July day has indeed been set in Sydney. The temp recorded on the 24th of July in 1990 has been beaten by .1 on the 31st. Commonsense prompts me to call it even between the two contenders because the 31st, with its nose into August, has a slight advantage…but a record’s a record.

          Here’s the thing: if it means something that a record for July daily max has been set in 2017, why does it mean nothing that a record for June was set in 1931? Even with UHI they can’t beat June 11 1931?

          But moving away from Sydney temp with its pesky UHI: One thing that’s hard to fudge is rainfall, and Sydney has accurate records stretching back to 1859, with daily readings available. Rainfall totals are still just statistics, of course, and don’t tell a full story, eg like how the rain fell and for how long, but they’re pretty handy.

          So how has Sydney fared with precip over the years? Well, when I check (naughty me) I find that the eight driest years (5th percentile) all fall between 1859 and 1980. The driest year was 1888, followed by 1862, then 1968, 1941, 1957, 1880. 1980 and 1936.

          But 1888 was sandwiched between good years for rain. What about clusters of dry years? The worst pair was 1935-1936, followed by 1979-1980 (hence Heathcote fires), followed by 1906-1907. The worst string of three dry years was 1905-1906-1907.

          So if sea levels do dribble down a bit in future, don’t crack the champagne. Nothing was any better when sea levels were lower or when Arctic ice was more abundant at September minimum. You won’t have the problems you’ve got now…but you may wish you did.

          40

          • #

            It’s worth adding that 1888 was so dire in Sydney because nearly one third of its rain for that year arrived only in December. For a city used to such high average rainfall, this was, as the saying goes, “worse than they thought”. Of course, they got over it. Just like the early settlers got over the awesome drought and heat of the early 1790s.

            Now we have to get over it.

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    • #
      Roy Hogue

      …and announced as if staying in the shade and drinking enough water couldn’t get you through even the hottest temperature of 132° F (55.5° C) ever recorded on the floor of death valley. I doubt that Melbourne ever gets that hot.

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        • #
          Roy Hogue

          Yea. I did read it. Temperatures all at least a little above freezing were all I saw unless I missed one and not exactly scary to someone who spent one whole winter and part of another one in Massachusetts.

          And then there’s Gore, still trying to scare everyone about roasting to death without benefit of a spit or a fire over which to be slowly rotated so they brown equally on all sides. A+ for persistence but F- for truthfulness.

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          • #
            Annie

            Roy, Melburnians talk of freezing when the temperature is into the low double figures! It is a bit different in country Victoria; we actually do get some freezing temperatures, several degrees below at times. We have had a weekend recently where we had thick ice in a bucket of water. One morning everything was covered with thick frost…very pretty. It does happen here but I do smile at the city hype. ;)

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            • #
              David Maddison

              Annie, you might have to make the C to F conversion.

              “Low double figures” is a huge amount colder in F than it is in C. 0C is 32F but 0F is about -18C.

              -40 is the same temperature in both F and C.

              50

            • #
              Roy Hogue

              Annie,

              I’m really a Southern California boy. So much so in fact, that I get cold in the low 60s F (15.5 C). We get overnight frost here sometimes in the winter but mostly reasonable days if you bundle up for the “cold” weather, meaning a light jacket unless I’m going to be out in cold weather for an extended period of time.

              Yesterday we threw a big birthday party for my wife and though it got up to the high 80s on our patio we had our usual ocean breeze which made it quite pleasant and some of the guests spent most of the afternoon throwing the bull out there.

              Inside was another matter. Having a well insulated house is a double edged sword and with so many people inside with bodies at 98.6 F there’s a lot of extra heat and it doesn’t cool off very fast even after dark because of the insulation. So the air conditioning was working overtime to keep the place bearable.

              It definitely helps to have a thermostat that constantly monitors how fast the house warms and cools so it can anticipate when to start cooling and when to stop again. So we don’t have the 3 degree or more temperature swings of less sophisticated thermostats… …worth every penny I paid for it.

              01

              • #
                Roy Hogue

                About C and F temperature scales. If you have temperature to the nearest degree or even to the nearest 1/10th degree, C gives you much poorer resolution than F because there are 1.8 F degrees per C degree.

                That’s almost 2 whole F degrees per C degree. And believe me, you can feel a 2 degree F temperature difference. That’s the only thing about metric measurements that bothers me. I can’t get thermostats or any kind of thermometer that if I set it to read in C instead of F, I can get the better resolution of F. Everything is either analog where you need to interpolate between marked points on the scale or it gives you the nearest full degree or worse, truncates to the full degree if electronic.

                Nobody knows or is interested in the finer points of making measurements in consumer products.

                10

    • #
      Dennis

      Heatwave forecast yesterday, now today BoM reports – Issued at 9:55 am Sunday, 30 July 2017.
      WINDY CONDITIONS AHEAD OF A COLD FRONT.
      SYNOPTIC SITUATION:
      A strong cold front will move across southeastern New South Wales during Sunday afternoon and evening. Vigorous west to northwesterly winds are expected ahead of the front.

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    • #
      Chris in Hervey Bay.

      Cold every where.. I’m currently on the East Coast of North America. 10:06 Sunday morning. 35 miles north of Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, temperature at the moment is only 17C.

      Been here for 3 months now and have not seen any summer, except for a few 90F days in Ohio and Minnesota, traveled through the mid-west to Florida, rained every day, couple of hot days in Florida, and that was it, summer is over.

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  • #
    Alfred Alexander

    Thank you for Weekend Unthreaded
    Alfred

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  • #

    The debate regarding renewables versus other power sources reminds me of the time Thomas Edison and Nikola Tesla. I will say that I have extensively read the biographies of both these men.

    Edison indeed invented a reliable light bulb. However, he always used and favoured DC. When wealthy NYC residents wanted electric lighting intheir homes provided by Edison a steam driven generator was usually installed near the house. The same setup was used for individual business places.

    As more clients wanted electric lighting a bigger steam engine would be built and power sent along streets to whoever paid for it. Edison insisted the DC lines be placed underneath the sidewalks no matter how inconvenient it may have been. The only drawback was the fact such DC power could only reach a few blocks before another steam generator was required to power another few blocks.

    Meanwhile, Tesla was an enthusiast of AC power and perfected what we would call the transformer. This boosted the power along a grid so it could be used for greater distances. It was dangerous and in NYC AC power was sent along lines strung along telegraph/telephone poles. Once, the sight of a linesman being fried to death for 20 minutes horrified crowds and seemed to support Edison’s view of DC power being safer.

    Nevertheless, AC power prevailed and the turning point came when Tesla supervised the massive hydro-electric station at Niagara Falls. On completion, AC power was sent long distances to places like Buffalo City and other New England centres. These became huge manufacturing centres using the reliable, cheap, reliable power. Edison’s DC power using always nearby, isolated steam generators became obsolete.

    After all this time it seems ironic, to me, that we have returned to Edison’s idea. That is, wind and solar farms need to very numerous, close together, isolated sources of small amounts of DC power that eventually has to be converted to AC in any case. Naturally, they don’t emit CO2 like Edison’s generators but the overall scheme is the same. Worse, the idea of big, stationary AC power stations appears to be made to seem old technology. Well, in Australia at least.

    Edison would be pleased; Tesla aghast. I think that not too long in the future Tesla’s idea of power distribution will prevail despite naming a car in his name.

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    • #
      Rod Stuart

      Indeed, there is a lot more to the story of DC and AC power generation, but as you point out, Edwina, a significant part of the comparison was distributed generation as compared to the long distance power transmission that eventually came to be economical.
      The production of electricity is generally considered to have four components businesses. They are generation, transmission, distribution, and retail. The generation component typically represents about 15% or 20% of the cost to the end user. High voltage transmission costs, not including losses, represent another 15% or 20%, and distribution and retail share the remaining cost.
      Since replication of the HV transmission system is inherently redundant, that job is generally performed by government in order to prevent monopolies. (The old dichotomy of creating a monopoly to prevent monopolies). Generators are generally allowed to be retailers, in order to avoid an imbalance in capacity to produce and demand.
      When distributed generation is considered, it is possible only when individual users are networked, (requiring a distribution system) and the amount consumed and generated by each user measured and billed. Billing systems alone represent a huge cost to an electricity retailer.
      So blind Freddy could see that inviting the end user to perform small scale generation, even if there were inherent efficiencies, is bound to produce higher costs for consumers as a whole. In fact the giant fans are essentially small scale production requiring excessive transmission networks and PV panels make the distribution system necessary.
      Thus is the cost of electricity to the consumer tripled or quadrupled by the Unreliables.

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        Graeme No.3

        Rod Stuart:
        In fact renewables increase just abot everything.
        Firstly by replacing some of the conventional generation by something that costs 3 times as much. The claims that renewables are cheap are based on their selling price AFTER subsidies. Also, by reducing their share of the market it makes conventional generation more expensive. Then, as you note, the increased cost of distribution as the Woop Woop wind farm gets connected.
        Then the distribution costs, what with preventing flow back into the main grid, the new meters for solar users etc.

        And now the debate isn’t about whether we continue along the road to blackouts, or whether renewables actually reduce emissions, but on how they can be stabilised by storage at vast expense to the consumer. My comment below is awaiting moderation, but I point out the logical way out is to abandon the RET which means the renewables cash flow will collapse.

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        • #
          Rod Stuart

          You won’t get any argument from me.

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        • #
          Ted O'Brien.

          Graeme. After subsidies AND TAXES AND OTHER IMPOSITIONS ON COAL. Including proposed and suggested impositions. e.g. notional “environmental costs”.

          Furthermore I doubt that the claims of cheap renewables are not billing renewables for existing distribution facilities.

          20

    • #
      RickWill

      Intermittents only make economic sense if NOT connected to a large network. Networks have evolved from the economy of scale that comes with coal generation located near the mine. nuclear well away from densely populated centres and hydro of massive scale with site specific requirements.

      There is little economy of scale with intermittents and the actual energy source is widespread. Any benefit of diversity in location of generation and demand from different consumers is offset by the transmission costs when intermittents are part of a grid.

      Allowing intermittents to supply into the existing networks is an economic disaster in the making.

      20

      • #
        Will Janoschka

        Intermittents only make economic sense if NOT connected to a large network.

        Correct! I’m working on power for a Port-a-potty. One 50W solar panel and 16 18650 Li-ion batteries. 4 in parallel and four of those in series Just enough to operate a nighttime motion detector to turn on a 2W outside LED. Inside Led + small fan when occupied!
        Have 2 Problems, Outside LED goes on when ever the deer and the antelope play. Can’t find a solar panel with output taps every seven generators so that the batteries could be self balancing. John paper dispenser gives out only one square for free. Coin storage is inside the holding tank! :-)

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        • #
          tom0mason

          Will it work with Paypal?

          20

          • #
            Will Janoschka

            “Will it work with Paypal?”

            Now thats an idea! What is the minimum free transfer from a PayPal account? Some folk use lotsa john paper! :-)

            10

            • #
              Graeme No.3

              Will Janoschka:

              Print the paper with a picture of Al Gore on the back to encourage usage.

              10

              • #
                Will Janoschka

                Folk like I would just sit there examining that image on the first free square, wondering if such has any meaning at all. While all of the folk outside pee in their pants. :-)

                11

        • #
          Will Janoschka

          Yous guys are good! For problem #2, anyone have some idea of how to take a 50W solar panel apart without destroying it, for access to the cell interconnect-s? :-)

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    • #
      RickWill

      Intermittents only make economic sense if NOT connected to a large network. Networks have evolved from the economy of scale that comes with coal generation located near the mine. nuclear well away from densely populated centres and hydro of massive scale with site specific requirements.

      There is little economy of scale with intermittents and the actual energy source is widespread. Any benefit of diversity in location of generation and demand from different consumers is offset by the transmission costs when intermittents are part of a grid.

      Allowing intermittents to supply into the existing networks is an economic disaster in the making.

      30

  • #
    Graeme No.3

    Whether you like Trump or not as a person it must be admitted that he has shaken the Green Blob into hysteria. The increasingly shrill cries of doom, the desperate attempts to try and drown out opposition, and the release of unrealistic plans for 2030 or 2050 are all aimed at holding the existing position.
    What the local AGW believers have overlooked is the effect of the electricity crisis on the average consumer. The failure of the SA supply and the increasing cost of electricity are focussing their attention on Climate Science and its multiple but expensive failures. This is shown up in the dropping level of support for The Greens in the polls which will only get worse as electricity bills rise. Both our major parties haven’t reacted to the crisis but want to continue making things worse, and seem to think the recent jump in electricity bills is a one off event, so any action that has been announced won’t have effect until years in the future. Their ideas are 3 fold.
    The Snowy scheme 2 which will be 5 years off at the most realistic estimate and won’t add anything to supply but will enable more renewable capacity with less likelihood of major blackouts.
    The RET target debate which boils down to whether you should half or wholely collapse supply. Driven as usual by the gullible acceptance of the shrill cries from the Green loonies that the world will end soon unless there is a wind turbine on every hill. They have been saying that for 30 years and the evidence of AGW has been diminishing annually. The problem for the politicians in Canberra is that more renewables mean rising electricity bills, so public acceptance of increasing renewables will rapidly dissappear.
    The last resort is to increase the amount of generation by natural gas. This has the “half” truth that it would reduce emissions; half because only CCGTs operate with lower emissions. The combination of wind turbines and OCGTs will result in less reduction in CO2 emissions but higher costs, more than using CCGTs alone. As the Irish have found out, using CCGTs with wind has resulted in poor efficiency (higher costs and CO2 emissions) and having to import electricity rather than exporting it. Attempting to add supply from sources that cost 3 times that of coal fired guarantees that electricity costs must rise.
    So rising electricity bills are being set in place without regard to changing public attitudes. There are only 2 outlets left for the rising public annoyance, the alternative parties or the turbines. Both One Nation and The Conservatives are opposed to the RET so will benefit when votes are counted. The other outlook is for some to take out their frustrations and start attacking the vulnerable turbines. It doesn’t take much to damage a turbine, a few bullets in one of the blades could result in a lengthy and expensive replacement which would dampen the enthusiasm of potential investors. I am not advocating such action but as anyone who has driven in the country knows bullets fly and such an obvious target for resentment is a likely target.

    The conclusion is obvious: the rising electricity bills will result in even more loss of support for the 2 major parties, and they will need to change plicies or be annihilated. Within 12 months they will panic and change policies. Don’t invest in companies involved in renewables.

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  • #

    People around the world, except the coldest cities: REDUCE YOUR HEAT READILY, EASILY. All asphalt roads and playgrounds and parkinglots can very simply have a grey-colored powder so that the black absorption rate is reduced dramatically. This could have been done in 1930! mixed in to turn the surface (or entire asphalt) grey.

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    • #

      Black road surfaces get hot, yes, but lose heat rapidly after sunset. That is why cattle like to lie on them as soon as it gets dark, as the benefit doesn’t last long. Problem up here in the tropics is, uncoated concrete is grey, and can retain heat for seven months in adverse orientation. Some progress being made with reflective paints, especially those with cenospheres (hollow ceramic microspheres). By-product of burning coal for power generation :-)

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      • #
        Graeme No.3

        Martin Clark:
        Hollow cenospheres in paint have been in use since the mid 1990′s. I worked at a Paint Company in western Sydney where 2 side by side tanks getting (mostly) full sun were painted with standard white paint and the same with cenospheres. They were large tanks, the capacity slips my mind but in excess of 25 tonnes of water based paint. The cenospheres reduced the temperature of the contents by 1-1.5℃. On a house roof I am told the effect is higher.
        There are coloured IR radiating pigments but they are quite expensive, which restricts their usage to military purposes.

        50

        • #
          Greg Cavanagh

          I did some experiments on my old house roof. The house was about 60 years old when I bought it, it had an asbestos super-six roof.

          For two weeks I recorded temperatures in the roof and in each room of the house and under the house for reference points.

          I then cut large vents in each end of the roof to let the air flow through. It made zero difference to the peak temperature in the roof, but when the day cooled off, the roof cavity cooled off a lot quicker.

          I wasn’t happy with that result, so I put pink bats in the roof. I used the R5.1

          That made up to 3 degrees difference in the rooms on the hottest day. It also raised the temperature in the roof by 6 degrees. I recorded a high of 51 degrees C in the roof; the outside temperature was about 36C if I remember correctly.

          I also own a black car. I personally don’t believe colour makes any difference to the inside of the vehicle. The surface might be hotter but I’ve never measured it to be sure. It is assumed to be hotter.

          The reflectors in the paint should make the most difference. I don’t believe colour makes any difference.

          11

    • #
      Yonniestone

      Don’t forget lighter coloured concrete has a high albedo type effect that reflects outgoing radiation onto surfaces that wouldn’t get that much sunlight positioned near darker surfaces, a small experiment was done here in 2012 by UC among others.

      50

    • #

      9-17-2012 According to Chao, asphalt pavement reflects only five to 20 percent of the sun’s energy, depending on its age (asphalt lightens as it ages). In comparison, “cool pavement” could reflect from 30 to 50 percent. http://www.triplepundit.com/2012/09/heat-island-effect/
      ……………

      10

  • #
    Roy Hogue

    We interrupt this thread to announce that

    THERE IS GOOD NEWS TODAY! :-)

    The truth about climate change is evident here where I live. After a few days of 90° F plus (up to 100 once; 32° C and up) we have settled back down to our usual onshore breeze with temperatures in the 80s or less. So the weather and the climate are both alive and well. And I think both of those things take great delight in confounding those of use who think we should be able to predict or control them. And most of all, they delight even more in confounding those who think either of them is a constant that never varies.

    So if you’re looking for something constant, try pi, e or if you’re more adventurous, Planck’s constant. There are more than enough of them to keep you busy. So see if you can use calculus to derive e or pi.

    Better yet, spend some time trying to derive Planck’s constant and see if you can make it come out correctly (6.62607004 × 10-34 m2 kg / s).

    That should keep you out of the way of the rest of us for a long time, which will be a welcome relief. And by the way, don’t forget to calculate pi and e to their exact values.

    Yes I mean you, Mr. Gore and Mr. Liao. And the exercise wouldn’t hurt many others either. So broaden your horizon a bit and learn something at the same time.

    And now the bad news can resume if you so wish.

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    • #
      Will Janoschka

      “So if you’re looking for something constant, try pi, e or if you’re more adventurous, Planck’s constant. There are more than enough of them to keep you busy. So see if you can use calculus to derive e or pi.”

      They are not constant, but instead certain (precise)! They must be asymptotic and incommensurable with their generator. A characteristic of any power series (logarithms). They do not even obey Heisenberg’s uncertainty principle.
      For understanding of planet Earth’s averages; that Clowns mistakenly call climate; the term Phi is used (golden section ratio) or the asymptote of the integer Fibonacci series which is (1/x + 1 = x) for all positive integer x starting at zero or one!! The Fibonacci is what all nature does between integer radius and integer circumference (close enough for government work). All massive Solar system objects assume such as the ratio between orbital radius and orbital time interval for one orbit (proper time)! The integer expansion in both cases is used in nature to prevent destructive Solar system “resonance”.
      Earth is such a wonderful place to live and learn!
      Unfortunately most ‘educated’ now are ‘over educated’ and ‘under skilled’, still children claiming “I wants what I want when I wants it”!
      All the best!-will-

      72

      • #
        RobK

        Wil,
        But, but..what about dark matter? :-)

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        • #
          Will Janoschka

          “But, but..what about dark matter?” :-)

          Perhaps dead stars that can’t be seen astronomically. Perhaps fantasy like CAGW; delusion to make somebody’s math turn out! :-) right back!

          30

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        Roy Hogue

        I guess i’ve been “one-upped”. ;-) But do remember that there’s nothing to be gained by making things too tough on the ignorant. If you confuse them they just double down on climate change and we suffer more of their nonsensical laws and regulations. :-)

        30

        • #
          Will Janoschka

          Roy,
          I was just trying to show the complexity of the weather. Way,way beyond the ken (cognizance) of even one climate skyintist, let alone 97 of them. The other three maybe.
          All the best!-will-

          20

          • #
            Roy Hogue

            The weather is really quite simple. You need only remember that it makes its own rules and we don’t control what they are or even get any input to the making of them. Then you know all there is to know about the weather. ;-)

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    • #
      Will Janoschka

      Many many cheap Chinese products can be bought on Ebay such as:
      “260W Mini Polisher Polishing Machine Dental Lab Lathe Table Tool Jewelry 3000rpm”!
      Internal workings are fine, outside detail is crap! Easy to fix with US old style craftsmanship! Can easily double the selling price!

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  • #
    Manfred

    NASA Confirms Falling Sea Levels For Two Years Amidst Media Blackout, here
    and reported here and here.

    Write and inform local Councils.

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      Manfred

      Meanwhile, Ocean Cooling Resumes yet the NOAA are still hot & hard at it, NOAA: Third Fakest June On Record

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      • #
        Manfred

        Sigh…
        Your comment is awaiting moderation.
        July 30, 2017 at 8:49 am · Reply

        10

        • #
          Dave in the States

          At least yours has an explanation. Mine just plain disappeared. Oh well….

          20

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          Mine at 6:59 am also. It seems Mod has woken up in a picky mood.

          30

          • #
            Robert Rosicka

            Pretty sure it’s key words that get your post into moderation , also if you haven’t posted for a while you also get put in the sin bin .
            Not sure they have someone 24/7 going nuh that’s no good .

            40

            • #
              Graeme No.3

              Well, let’s see. This must be the offending bit so it won’t be visible (as appended to this)..

              10

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                Graeme No.3

                There are only 2 outlets left for the rising public annoyance, the alternative parties or the turbines. Both One Nation and The Conservatives are opposed to the RET so will benefit when votes are counted. The other outlook is for some to take out their frustrations and start attacking the vulnerable turbines. It doesn’t take much to damage a turbine, a few bullets in one of the blades could result in a lengthy and expensive replacement which would dampen the enthusiasm of potential investors.

                30

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                Graeme No.3

                Well, obviously not that bit. I should note that I wasn’t advocating such action, just predicting that it might happen.

                10

              • #
                Graeme No.3

                This must be the bit – the spelling error offended some one or thing.

                The conclusion is obvious: the rising electricity bills will result in even more loss of support for the 2 major parties, and they will need to change plicies or be annihilated. Within 12 months they will panic and change policies. Don’t invest in companies involved in renewables.

                10

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                Will Janoschka

                What is the cost of bullets used to damage a spinning wind power blade v.s. a quarter stick of dynamite? Also not suggesting just wondering.

                20

              • #
                Graeme No.3

                Will Janoschka:

                Neither is recommended. Bullets or other sharp impact causes a stress fracture in fibreglass which propagates rapidly with varying stresses e.g. the blades rotating. The spread of the crack can reach supersonic speeds. Apart from attracting unwanted attention with shooting you run the risk of the broken aerofoil hitting you ( the current record for throw by a broken blade is 1300 metres).
                Dynamite also attracts attention, starting with your attempts to acquire it. And how to you attach it? Are you proposing a squadron of kamikaze birds? Besides turbines are fairly fragile things, fires, blade breaks, support columns failing etc. let them take nature’s course.

                10

              • #
                Graeme No.3

                Will Janoschka:

                Here is how to destroy a wind turbine.

                https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hBeiOqOeRbY

                10

              • #
                Will Janoschka

                “let them take nature’s course.”

                :-)

                00

    • #
      Manfred

      Sigh…
      Your comment is awaiting moderation.
      July 30, 2017 at 8:17 am · Reply

      10

    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      Manfred @#7.

      NOAA’s chart for Sydney terminates at 2010. Why?

      https://tidesandcurrents.noaa.gov/sltrends/sltrends_global_station.htm?stnid=680-140

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  • #
    Another Ian

    “The old joke goes … in a nightmare world, the English build the cars, the Swiss are the lovers, the Italians run the government and the Germans run the police. I’m beginning to understand why.”

    Reminds me of a similar joke:

    For Sunday contemplation

    “In 1867, Canadians thought we’d have the best of all worlds: British law, American know-how and French culture. Instead, we somehow ended up with French law, British know-how and American culture.”

    http://www.smalldeadanimals.com/2017/07/religion-of-pea-7.html#comment-1116621

    Australia?

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    TdeF

    It is a great puzzle to me that every year there is an announcement that CO2 has reached record heights. Now that we have the most extensive and accurate measure of temperature in history, the temperature of the planet has not changed for 20 years. Warming records are now set by as little as 0.001C.

    Still Al Gore and his acolytes, in the face of the most obvious contradiction, still argues that man is heating the planet dangerously and quickly by CO2. It is obviously wrong but Obama and Macron and Merkel friends still believe him. Why? As for Flannery, Nye, Mann, Hansen and the other profiteers of doom, no explanation is needed. It is their career.

    No one has even tried to explain how CO2 exclusively heats the water around the Great Barrier reef, causing exclusive and allegedly unnatural bleaching.

    The sky is falling. Where, how and when is not said. Only why is certain. Evil Coal. Even when the sulfurous brimstone has been removed. The fear is medieval. The technique of mass hysteria ancient. Monckton’s Profiteers of Doom.

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  • #

    The more I look at these numbers for the Base Load power for this week, the more I learn, and it’s funny like that. You think that over the years you have a good handle on things, and yet each time you look, you see something new.

    The Base Load was as (usual) 18,000MW plus every morning, rising to around 28,000MW at the 6PM peak. Coal fired power supplied what it always has been supplying, around 80% of that 4AM consumption, the daily minimum of 18,000MW. Wind had good days, and bad days, but coal fired power was stable.

    I mentioned that there are 16 Plants and 48 separate Units overall.

    This week, eight of those Units were down, most probably for maintenance. Now, you may think that 8 Units doesn’t amount to all that much power, but most of them were the big Units, like one at Bayswater, and one at Eraring. In all, those 8 Units down took 4400MW out of the system, and that’s an awful lot of power, and still coal fired power supplied almost the same as it always had, just that the other Units ramped up a little to cover it, and at Peak times, more gas fired units came on line for longer, hence the price spikes up to around $250+ for every State on a couple of days at Peak time of 6PM.

    It’s also amazing to watch the sharing of power from State to State, and just how much ancient old Hazelwood really is missed from the whole system.

    This week’s analysis is at this link.

    Tony.

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      Mark M

      In 1953, Victoria’s politicians were intelligent & opened coal fired power stations to end blackouts:

      http://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/23316983

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      • #
        Graeme No.3

        And Tom Playford in South Australia also.

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        Dennis

        And even encouraged aluminium smelter construction to provide extra stability to the electricity grid I understand, and to create jobs and tax revenue.

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        • #
          David Maddison

          Yes, aluminium smelters were where the cheap surplus power got dumped at night since it is not feasible to lower the power output on base load coal power stations.

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          • #

            David mentions this,

            …..since it is not feasible to lower the power output on base load coal power stations.

            I thought that also, but from watching power output from coal fired power over recent weeks, I have noticed that the power output from those coal fired plants closely follows the actual Load Curve for total power generation, (and consumption) with output from some of the plants derated at 4AM, and then ramped up during the day so that they supply close to and at their maximum at that 6PM peak.

            It’s most noticeable for NSW, Queensland and Australia as a whole, because Victoria, now without Hazelwood just has those 10 remaining Units at Loy Yang (A and B) and Yallourn W generating all they can all the time, and they have two units down out of those ten.

            I can show you if you want to do a little work.

            Take this link, (power generation for last Friday) and click the MW button on the chart there at top right. The solid black line you see is for all fossil fuel plants in Australia, and that’s a normal Winter Load Curve. Now, scroll down to the bottom of the plants list, and untick all the State boxes and the total and subtotal, so nothing shows on the graph.

            Then along the top of the list of plants, click the 4 boxes headed BW, the 4 boxes headed ER, the 4 boxes headed LD, the 2 boxes headed MP, and the 2 boxes headed VP, and then tick just the subtotal box, and you’ll see that the solid black line closely resembles a normal Winter months Load Curve. That’s just the coal fired plants in NSW.

            Tony.

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            • #
              David Maddison

              Perhaps Tony, it is doable but not economic because of the extra wear and tear created on equipment that is designed for a constant power output. E.g. metal fatigue caused by constantly varying thermal loads in equipment that wasn’t designed for this.

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          • #
            toorightmate

            The ONLY reason there are any aluminium smelters in Australia is that wise governments provided cheap power to enable downstream processing of bauxite/alumina.
            “Wise” and “government” no longer fit in the same sentence in Australia.

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    • #

      Okay, you need to do this now, and that’s 11.40AM Sunday.

      Go to this link and look at the sharing of power between the States, and note especially Qld, by looking inside that box.
      Demand (actual consumption) is 5100MW and below that it shows actual generation and that total is 6184MW.

      Under that box are the two Interconnectors, and currently they are both red showing the totals 67 and 1017, the maximum for both Interconnectors, and that is the power that Queensland is sending into (Northern) NSW.

      There are three coal fired Units off line in Queensland currently.

      The total power being supplied from coal fired power is 5964MW and the other 220MW is from three itty bitty natural gas fired plants.

      So, currently in Queensland coal fired power is supplying 96.5% of the power requirements for Qld, and part of NSW.

      Oh, there are no renewables supplying in Qld, because, umm, we don’t have any.

      And Qld wants to go 50% renewables by 2030, 13 years from now, and starting from a base of zero.

      As the good Knight Sir Rodney said, when listening to his King (in The Wizard Of Id) ….. “lips, don’t purse!”

      Tony.

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      • #

        “total power being supplied from coal fired power is 5964MW
        and the other 220MW is from three itty bitty natural gas fired plants.

        So, currently in Queensland coal fired power is supplying
        96.5% of the power requirements for Qld, and part of NSW.

        And Qld wants to go 50% renewables by 2030, 13 years from now,
        and starting from a base of zero.”

        If this isn’t the Madness of the Elites. I don’t know what is!

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    doubtingdave

    i am realy losing faith on this site and others that I visit , such as Infowars or Stephan Molineux or Brietbart or Drudge or gateway pundit and the rest , how many of you judge lives problems from your own ideology , rather from logic and or critical thinking , its easy to support lord monckton on global warming , but how many of you support his faith , how many of you can see that Lord MONCKTON can only see the beginnings of the NWO AND GLOBALISM STARTING WITH COMMUNISM RATHER THAN LOOKING BACK TO THE CREATION OF A FEUDAL SYSTEM , THAT STARTED FROM FORTH CENTURY EUROPE UNDER THE REIGHN OF CONSTANTINE , but ofcourse it would not be in the interest of those that defend there faith to acknowledge that

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    • #
      Mark M

      FWIW, I say keep doubting, dave.
      Lotsa issues in one lil comment but, no doubt Constantine & the council of Nicea and the Nicene creed are historical moments still in play today.

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      • #
        doubtingdave

        OFCOURCE THEY ARE MARK , WHAT IS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE COUNCILLS OF NICEEA AND THE COUNCILS AT PARIS , YOU CAN INVITE PEOPLE FROM ALL OVER THE WORLD WITH DIFFERFENT BELeIVES , BUT THEY ALL BELEIVE IN STEWARDSHIP OF THE Earth don’t they

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        • #
          James Bradley

          Except that their vision of the stewardship of earth was Europe, Britain and the Middle East…

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      toorightmate

      doubtingdave,
      Your views are way over my head. To a simple person like me, your views appear to be out rightly stupid.

      50

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      Roger

      Current political moves seem to be aimed at turning the general population into ‘free serfs’ with an illusion that they are living under democracy whilst the reality is that they are no longer able to influence policy through democracy because it has been removed and the people you elect can no longer make the decisions.

      That is how the EU has been structured and functions and why we voted for Brexit so as to be able to restore sovereignty and democracy. I have long believed the EU is the test-bed for the unelected, unaccountable global government that the UN is determined to create.

      The UN tried to create a global bogie-man using pollution, chemicals and pesticides – but that didn’t frighten people enough and hence didn’t work.

      Next attempt was to use AGW and manipulate the data where necessary to maintain the fear … that was on the verge of working until Trump cried ‘the Emperor is naked’ … But the green Blob and compliant politicians who use it as a control and tax mechanism have yet to be stopped in their tracks.

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      Will Janoschka

      “how many of you judge lives problems from your own ideology , rather from logic and or critical thinking…?”

      None! But try Conservative Tree House. Sundance thinks a lot! Posters not so much.

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      Peter C

      i am realy losing faith on this site

      Well Doubting Dave, FAITH seems to be an issue for you. I do not know why you are bothered about it. Some how you seem to equate Faith/belief with analytical science. That may be wrong and you can explain, if you want to.

      For myself evangelical atheists such as Richard Dawkins are just as unwelcome are evangelicals of other religions. If you identify with Richard Dawkins you can explain that also.

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  • #
    • #
      doubtingdave

      is there any difference between the Edicts of Constantine and the executive orders of Barack Obama !

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      • #
        doubtingdave

        Obama past edicts that destroyed borders , and allowed businesses to take advantage of slave labour from nations like Mexico , why is that any different from what Constantine did , do you want a new feudal system , like the one that Constantine helped create in Europe that lasted a thousand years

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          el gordo

          Down the thread a bit Clipe has put up something happening in the UK which is similar to the insanity found in Australia.

          ‘A friend, who is in farming at the moment, has recently received a cheque for £3,000 from the Rural Payments Agency for not rearing pigs and I would like to join the ‘not rearing pigs’ business.’

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            Will Janoschka

            ” I would like to join the ‘not rearing pigs’ business.

            Are you admitting that you yourself have reared a pig? :-)

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    Yonniestone

    You seem to be a bit disenchanted with life Dave take it easy, remember the greatest difference between a left wing vs conservative political mindset is the ability of the latter to be critical of elected leaders with the intent to improve not destroy what they helped create, I’m a life long non believer in any higher power but can see that Christianity has the ability to evolve in a positive way relative to human progress unlike others which offer no room for independent thought.

    Better the devil you know (for better use of a phrase) when in the minority but safe for being so.

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      doubtingdave

      yonnie , I have been trying to understand this shit all my life . what gave the game away to me is understanding a old literature trick called typology , and I would be happy to explain , truth is you cannot understand ancient literature from the modern mind , you have to put yourself into the minds of the people contemporary TO THE TIMES WHEN HISTORY WAS WRITTEN , AND TYPOLOGY IS THE ANSWER TO THAT

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      • #
        Will Janoschka

        Huh? Typology is the study of types. Typology may refer to: Typology (anthropology), division of culture by races; Typology (archaeology), classification of artifacts …

        You are indeed correct about wearing the shoes(moccasins) of the elders. Compare modern electronics with what J.C Maxwell had to work with! Yet modern is often wrong; yet Maxwell is still correct. What a mind! :-)

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    Ruairi

    The Greens will ban all coal use if they can,
    Which won’t have any impact in Japan.

    Even global warmists would deny,
    The climate nonsense spouted by Bill Nye.

    The warmists operate through nods and winks,
    To bluff their way on full up carbon sinks.

    Big science news when bleaching is discovered,
    But not a mention when the reefs recovered.

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    David Maddison

    Yesterday I went on a vintage train hauled by steam locomotives. They easily pulled the cars at 100kph and can go much faster. The acceleration is just as good as modern trains. These particular locos were among the last built before diesel took over.

    As industry is systematically destroyed in Australia by “green energy” it’s nice to harken back to the technology that created the Industrial Revolution (which I suppose they don’t teach in schools any more or teach it in a negative manner if they do).

    If you want to go on one of these trains in The People’s Republik of Victoriastan, check out the Steamrail Victoria website.

    https://youtu.be/YQh7d7z_AoI

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      David Maddison

      The video link I posted above is of the steam train arriving at Southern Cross Station in Melbourne.

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      Dennis

      David are you aware of the Pritchard steam car, two converted Ford Falcon sedans produced in Melbourne in the 1970s? Very quick start up time to produce steam and said to be extremely economical with the fossil fuel used to heat the water.

      There is one 1920s US Dobel steam car located in Sydney that used to owned by Howard Hughes, apparently he owned two of them. It also has a short start up or get up steam time. It looks a bit like a Rolls Royce of that period and had “ultra-modern” for the period sliding glass windows either side, but they had to be moved front or rear depending on which doors needed to be opened. Unfortunately after it was restored (not from unroadworthy condition) including steam components it later caught fire and was burnt out. I lost track of it after that.

      However, in Maryborough Queensland there is a private company Olds Engineering where the Dobel steam components were reconditioned. Olds Family being related to Oldsmobile cars USA and REO Trucks (R.E.Olds) and the Olds Family Maryborough were inventors and built steam powered railway engines, launches and even some cars. I knew one of the directors who was involved in steam cars as a hobby before he became an employee, conventional powered vehicles converted to steam. He said that one 20-litre can of Kero would power power the car all the way to Melbourne.

      The owner of the Dobel also has/had a couple of Stanley Steamer cars and an ex-New York taxi cab electric car from the very early 1900s with lead acid batteries. If you remember Grandma Duck in Walt Disney comics he car, a horseless carriage design, was much the same.

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      • #
        Dennis

        I forgot to include that the two Pritchard-Ford cars were apparently purchased by Ford Motor Co USA including the patents on the steam power system.

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      • #
        David Maddison

        Thanks Dennis.

        Here is a video about a Dobel Steam Car.

        https://youtu.be/rUg_ukBwsyo

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        • #
          Dennis

          The one in Sydney (was years ago) came from the auction of the Robert Holmes A Court collection in Western Australia and is a sedan, yellow body with black mudguards and running boards.

          When reconditioned performance was impressive, same top speed going forward or in reverse … great for Chicago gangsters I thought!

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        David Maddison

        Here is a video of the Pritchard Steam Car.

        https://youtu.be/LJq2Hc_mXFI

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      • #
        Another Ian

        Dennis

        Not steam but don’t forget this bloke

        “A Son of the Red Centre – Westprint

        A Son of the Red Centre by Kurt G.Johannsen is available on Westprint’s online store of aboriginal books, … “Mulga Express” Mark IV. First published in 1992, …
        [Search domain westprint.com.au] westprint.com.au/a-son-of-the-red-centre.html”

        using producer gas

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    • #
      AndyG55

      The Newcastle Flyer (steam train) used to do Sydney-Newcastle in 2hr 20 minutes.

      The current “express” electric, takes 2 hours 30 minutes

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      • #
        Will Janoschka

        Eternal combustion or nuclear always have superior efficiency, if you can afford the additional mass. Not for aircraft. That is why water was invented by Aerojet General and General Dynamics. Dig to deep on a planet with an Oxygen atmosphere and compressed Hydrogen interior; one flick of the Bic, yous all gots Oceans in 40 days!
        It took Lockheed and JPL (high-bidder) to fix that mess! JPL is still tweaking to make it better!
        All the best!-will-

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    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      A few years back on a Saturday, I was driving along Horatio St in Mudgee when an oncoming vintage car sent up a cloud of smoke or steam, I was not sure which. The car pulled over to the kerb as I went by. I looked in the mirror and people were getting out.

      I got thinking, it’s Saturday and they might need a mechanic. My brother in law has a motor repair business, and might be able to open up shop if they needed it. SO I turned around. As I did the car sent up a great cloud of steam. I said to myself: She’s b***ered now!, but the people got back in and drove off!

      Later I was talking to the brother in law. That same day he had done a weld on a Stanley Steamer. There was a rally of steam cars in town. He said that as it drove off there wasn’t a sound.

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    pat

    seems not all millennials have been indoctrinated into CAGW!
    28 Jul: CNBC: David Gernon: ‘The RV space is on fire’: Millennials expected to push sales to record highs
    •RV shipments are expected to surge to their highest level ever, according to a forecast from the Recreation Vehicle Industry Association.
    •It would be the industry’s eighth consecutive year of gains.
    •Thor Industries and Winnebago Industries posted huge growth in their most recent earnings report.
    •”They’ve done massively well because they’ve made massively creative acquisitions,” said Gerrick Johnson, an analyst at BMO Capital Markets.
    Those shipments are accelerating, and should grow even more next year, the group said. Sales in the first quarter rose 11.7 percent from 2016…
    Thor saw sales skyrocket 56.9 percent to $2.02 billion fromlast year. Winnebago’s surged 75.1 percent last quarter to $476.4 million…

    Millennials are a major target market for RV companies. According to the 2017 North American Camping Survey from KOA, a private campground company, millennials make up 38 percent of campers, but 31 percent of the general population.
    Also, since many RV customers make multiple purchases over time, catching them when they’re young is key..
    https://www.cnbc.com/2017/07/28/the-rv-space-is-on-fire-millennials-expected-to-push-sales-to-record-highs.html

    30 Jul: Tim Blair Blog: FROM THE DEEPEST DARKEST CONGO …
    … comes a battery that’s wrongo.
    “Behind every clean electric car there is cobalt,” reports the FT’s David Pilling. “And behind cobalt is the Democratic Republic of Congo.” And when the Congo is involved, so is terrible corruption and brutality:
    An important question now presents itself for South Australian wind worshipper Jay Weatherill. Will the substantial cobalt component of his planet-saving big lithium ion battery be ethically-sourced? Or will it be drenched in the blood of exploited Congolese?
    (Via Andrew R.)…
    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/blogs/tim-blair/from-the-deepest-darkest-congo/news-story/cf571d3a7b94bd31d7e497b85e630478

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    • #
      David Maddison

      Thanks for the cobalt link, pat. I posted this on Facebook as a result:

      Will South Australia’s ridiculous Big Battery contain ethically sourced cobalt, or will it be from that socialist paradise of the People’s Republic of the Congo? Demand from Greentards that they only use ethically sourced cobalt in their Big Batteries!

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    pat

    28 Jul: Breitbart: James Delingpole: Revealed – How Renewables and the Global Warming Industry Are Literally Hitler
    Have you ever wondered what kind of sadistic, totalitarian mentality you might need to want to carpet the countryside with bat-chomping, bird-slicing eco crucifixes in order to save the planet from an imaginary problem?
    This book, unearthed by David Archibald at American Thinker (LINK), offers a clue:
    It’s by a Nazi inventor and industrialist called Dr. Franz Lawaszeck, whose proposed solution to Germany’s energy problems in the 1930s was the wholesale adoption of wind turbines…

    But Nazi Germany’s contributions to the modern climate change industry did not stop with gigantic wind turbines. No. One of the earliest proponents of man-made global warming theory was none other than the Luftwaffe High Command’s chief meteorologist Hermann Flohn.
    Archibald reports…

    Plus, there’s a much more comprehensive book on this fascinating subject due to be published quite soon, which is guaranteed to make the greenies’ heads explode and on which, of course, I shall be fully briefing you…
    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/07/28/delingpole-revealed-how-renewables-and-the-global-warming-industry-are-literally-hitler/

    20 Jul: AmericanThinker: David Archibald: The Nazi Origins of Renewable Energy (and Global Warming)
    http://www.americanthinker.com/articles/2017/07/the_nazi_origins_of_renewable_energy_and_global_warming.html

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    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      Yes. A joke whichever way you look at it. But.

      I haven’t paid attention for many years, but the US for a time at least paid farmers not to grow wheat, paid on an acreage basis. This proved hugely beneficial in terms of productivity, security of production and landcare. Farmers worked their reduced acreages more efficiently to maintain the same level of production more reliably, at the same time improving the maintenance of their land.

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      • #
        James

        It was called the set aside program. Now as a result of Ethanol subsidies pushing up the price of corn, corn is being grown in more and more marginal areas. The corn price has since come back down, but corn is being grown on land that would be better suited for hay production.

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    pat

    behind paywall:

    29 Jul: UK Telegraph: Christopher Booker: It’s absolute fantasy to think we can move to all electric cars without fossil fuels
    To the few of us who have long been trying to follow the Government’s woefully unreported plans for Britain’s energy future, the news of the switch in 2040 to electric cars was hardly a surprise. But the full implications of this drive to phase out virtually all use of fossil fuels in the coming decades have not yet begun to sink in. And there are many more shocks to come. Brushed aside in the daylong blizzard of propaganda to which we were treated in favour of all-electric cars, there are of course many practical reasons these have not caught on.
    Despite hundreds of millions of pounds in taxpayer bribes to persuade motorists to buy them, they make up only 0.3 per cent of the 31.7 million cars on our roads. It didn’t take long for the crucial question to be asked: where is all the extra 30 gigawatts (GW) of electricity needed to charge these cars to come from…

    29 Jul: Forbes: Tim Worstall: Electric Cars Will Make Britain Poorer – Where’s The Tax Money Going To Come From?
    We have a useful reminder that electric cars aren’t going to be quite the economic saviour some seem to think. For the current system of fossil fuel use adds near £30 billion a year to the government’s tax collections. Electric cars are only even potentially cheaper than fossil fuel powered if the power is untaxed, or at least untaxed at these levels. All of which means that if the fleet is to be largely electric then the government is going to be ***looking around for some other form of tax revenue to cover that gap…

    In total, duties on petrol and diesel add up to almost £28bn a year for the exchequer. Worse for the chancellor of the day, petrol and diesel sales make a contribution to VAT. VAT is charged at 20% of the wholesale price plus the duty, which equates to 16.7% of the final price. That’s a form of double taxation and explains why more than 65% of the cost at the pumps goes to the exchequer…
    https://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/2017/07/29/electric-cars-will-make-britain-poorer-wheres-the-tax-money-going-to-come-from/#6914eede6304

    ***27 Jul: UK Telegraph: Pay-per-mile scheme could replace fuel duty and vehicle excise in new electric revolution
    By Steven Swinford
    Ministers are considering radical plans to scrap fuel duty and vehicle taxes and replace them with a pay-per-mile charging scheme.
    The rise of electric cars has led to warnings that the £28billion raised annually from fuel duty is at risk…
    Officials are understood to be seriously considering proposals by this year’s winner of the £250,000 Wolfson Economics Prize.

    Gergely Raccuja, a 27-year-old graduate from UCL, proposed abolishing fuel duty and vehicle excise duty in favour of a simple distance based charge…
    Heavier and more polluting vehicles would pay more, and the charge would be collected by insurers…
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/07/27/pay-per-mile-scheme-could-replace-fuel-duty-vehicle-excise-new/

    more to come.

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      Roger

      The EU set up its satellite based GPS system thinking it could generate revenue from it by people paying to find their position. That revenue would go to ESA, the European Space Agency. What they overlooked was that the existing US GPS system is free and so there was no revenue available .

      Since then they have been considering many different ways of using it to generate revenue, one of which is by introducing satellite based pay-per-mile. I suspect, and haven’t looked at any recent reports, that the EU is now in the final stages of doing so – likely using air pollution reduction as the argument. If I am correct then it makes sense that the British Government as part of ESA (and that is likely to continue after Brexit) are preparing the public for what they already know is coming.

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        greggg

        Maybe they could use it for pay-per-mile car registration and insurance. It’d be fairer to people who don’t clock up many kilometres and spend more on rego than fuel.

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    pat

    Gergely’s (WITH RAC?) prize-winning plan is being spun as “ground-breaking”???

    13 Jul: PolicyExchange: Gergely Raccuja wins 2017 Wolfson Economics Prize
    The Treasury wins too, according to Raccuja. With both the number of vehicles on the road and total vehicle mileage projected to grow, government revenue will rise over time. This will stop and reverse the growing loss to the Treasury from falling fuel duty, estimated at an extra £2.3m a day…

    For his final submission Gergely received input from the RAC Foundation, one of Britain’s largest motoring organisations…
    However, it was 27-year-old Raccuja that most impressed the team of judges, including former Chancellor Lord Darling, Chairman of Legal & General Sir John Kingman, economist Bridget Rosewell, former Deputy Mayor of London for Transport Isabel Dedring and The Times associate editor Lord Finkelstein – to scoop the £250,000 prize at an event in central London on Thursday evening…
    Wolfson Prize Winner Gergely Raccuja said:

    “I’m over the moon, the past 2 months have been an incredible journey. I want to thank the judges for their support for Miles Better and the RAC Foundation and Amey for helping me improve the proposal.”…

    The founder of the Prize, Lord (Simon) Wolfson of Aspley Guise, said:
    “Gergely’s entry met that challenge, and is ***ground-breaking, yet simple – with the backing of a major motoring organisation…
    https://policyexchange.org.uk/wolfson-winner/

    ground-breaking? hardly:

    Wikipedia: Vehicle miles traveled tax
    A vehicle miles traveled tax, also frequently referred to as a VMT tax, VMT fee, mileage-based fee, or road user charge, is a policy of charging motorists based on how many miles they have traveled.
    It has been proposed in various states in the United States and elsewhere as an infrastructure funding mechanism to replace, or supplement the fuel tax, which has been generating billions less in revenue each year due to increasingly fuel efficient vehicles.

    In the United States, a VMT fee currently exists as part of a limited program for 5,000 volunteers in Oregon and for trucks in Illinois. Internationally, Germany, Austria, Slovakia, the Czech Republic, Poland, Hungary and Switzerland have implemented various forms of VMT fees, limited to trucks. New Zealand also has such a system applying to all heavy vehicles and diesel-powered cars. France, Belgium and Russia all have truck-based systems under development…

    Since 2000, fuel tax revenues have declined significantly as a result of less driving and increasing fuel efficiency. As fuel tax revenues dwindle, policymakers have had to divert billions from the general fund and other non-transportation funds to pay for infrastructure…

    Some motorists are concerned that VMT charging could be an invasion of their privacy, as location information is utilized. They view the program as “Big Brother” or a “Nanny” state. As any data collection system poses a risk to private information of users, VMT pilot programs across the country have explored various options to protect the privacy of participants…
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vehicle_miles_traveled_tax

    Guardian goes along with “ground-breaking”:

    14 Jul: Guardian: Gwyn Topham: Pay-per-mile road tax plan wins £250,000 Wolfson economics prize
    Prizewinner Gergely Raccuja, 27, aims to scrap vehicle tax and fuel duty to help fund all road repairs with more eco-friendly scheme collected by insurers
    The founder of the prize, Next fashion chain boss Lord Simon Wolfson, said it was a ***“groundbreaking, yet simple” solution…
    Raccuja said: “The key to our entry was to keep things simple, yet come up with an answer that was sophisticated enough to deal with an upheaval in cars and road transport which hasn’t been seen since the introduction of the motor car well over a century ago. I hope I can persuade our politicians too that everything to do with our roads could be better.”
    Steve Gooding, the director of the RAC Foundation, which provided input to Raccuja’s final submission, said the clock was ticking for policymakers as existing models of tax and spending on roads faced becoming redundant…

    Bloomberg’s headline takes the prize:

    14 Jul: Bloomberg: Jill Ward: Wolfson Prize Winner Has ***Earth-Friendly Solution for U.K. Roads
    “Policy makers can learn much from this year’s prize, and I hope they will take forward solutions to solve one of the greatest infrastructure challenges of modern times,” said Simon Wolfson, the founder of the prize and chief executive officer of Next Plc…
    According to Raccuja, the proposal would help the Treasury, which is seeing income from fuel duty curtailed as Britons drive less and cars become more efficient. Among the judges were former Chancellor of the Exchequer Alistair Darling and Legal and General Chairman John Kingman…

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    pat

    28 Jul: ClimateChangeNews: India’s electric vehicle revolution faces major hurdles
    High costs and a lack of public charging stations pose a challenge to bold EV target, say experts, not helped by inconsistent government policy
    By Darryl D’Monte
    Lithium batteries, which account for 60% of the cost of a two-wheeler, need replacing every few years and are imported from China, Alok Ray of SMEV tells Climate Home…
    “The government isn’t clear about its policy to support electric vehicles,” says Ray. “The ministry of new and renewable energy withdrew a R5,500 subsidy [$86] for a two-wheeler in 2012. While there was a market for 100,000 two-wheelers at this reduced price, the next year we only sold 16,000.”

    This ministry provided the subsidy through a $15 million Alternate Fuels for Surface Transportation Programme, of which the EV industry was a beneficiary. After its withdrawal, the market crashed and around 1,000 dealers and eight manufacturers shut down their EV businesses…

    In its 2015-16 budget, the government introduced a new subsidy under FAME – Faster Adoption and Manufacture of Electric (and Hybrid) Vehicles in India, under which manufacturers are reimbursed 15% of the cost of the vehicle.
    Small petrol or diesel-fuelled models remain cheaper than the Reva, however. Mahindra Electric produces only 200 electric cars a month.
    From 1 July, a 12% goods and services tax will apply to EVs, further hampering the industry’s growth…

    It stands in contrast with China, where government subsidies nearly halve the cost of EVs, while there are disincentives for conventional vehicles. It is different, too, to the consumer-driven US market, where Tesla’s cheapest model retails at $35,000 – far beyond the budget of Indian buyers.

    And a shortage of charging stations, even in cities, limits the range that EVs can ply. While the exact number is hard to pin down, PlugIn India lists just 222 community charging stations across the entire country. Electricity distribution is largely under public control and Indian laws make it difficult for the private sector to get involved…READ ALL
    http://www.climatechangenews.com/2017/07/28/indias-electric-vehicle-revolution-faces-major-hurdles/

    25 Jul: IndianExpress: Driverless cars will lead to job loss, won’t allow, says Nitin Gadkari
    Gadkari, a proponent of electric vehicles, said he has also told global automakers that India will not reduce import duty on e-vehicles or its parts.
    by Avishek G Dastidar
    DRIVERLESS CARS, labelled as the future of automobiles with Google, Apple and Tesla racing to crack a potentially multi-billion-dollar market, will not be allowed in India because they will lead to more unemployment, according to Union Road Transport and Highways Minister Nitin Gadkari.
    “We will not allow driverless cars in India. We don’t need it. Unemployment is a huge problem in our country. Each car gives job to a driver,” said Gadkari on Monday, while responding to queries from reporters…
    “I am certain on this issue,” he said…

    Gadkari, a proponent of electric vehicles, said he has also told global automakers that India will not reduce import duty on e-vehicles or its parts. “I have told chiefs of the auto companies recently that world-class electric vehicles can very well be manufactured in India. They are welcome to make them here under Make in India, we will not reduce the import duties,” he said…
    http://indianexpress.com/article/india/driverless-cars-will-lead-to-job-loss-wont-allow-nitin-gadkari-4765745/

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    Dennis

    It’s cold for a record hot day.

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    Greg Cavanagh

    Point of curiosity that I’ve uncovered.

    But first some background; I’m writing a novel based in the year 1300 Florence. (Yea, it’s a popular time for authors).

    My epiphany: When you read Italian history in broad scales, it is a time of massive turmoil between Kings of Germany, France and England. Aided and abetted by the Popes and the Roman Emperors at various times for various reasons.

    I’m currently researching Charles of Anjou. His life is a microcosm of the broader picture.

    I believe the “Game of Thrones” is based on this period of time also.

    Basically human ambition, interaction, advantage and overthrow is very much like like a fractal. It’s self-similar at varying scales. From an individual to an entire Kingdom, there are similar drives, ambitions and betrayals. Outcomes are similar too, from destroying one’s own family unit to destroying one’s own reign and country.

    So, if history displays fractal properties, how can anyone (like Nostradamus for example) predict the future 10 years out, let alone 100 years out. It can’t happen.

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      Rereke Whakaaro

      Basically human ambition, interaction, advantage and overthrow is very much like like a fractal.

      Can we then assume that this is a fractious fractal?

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    Yonniestone

    Are the ‘White Walkers’ singled out for having too much privilege?

    If not I call fake history.

    /sarc.

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    pat

    27 Jul: Reuters: Asleep at the wheel? Germany frets about economic car crash
    by Emma Thomasson and Edward Taylor
    (Additional reporting by Andreas Cremer and Ilona Wissenbach; editing by Giles Elgood)
    Daimler Chief Executive Dieter Zetsche beamed as he posed for cameras in a Mercedes-Benz electric car after meeting politicians to discuss the future of the auto industry in Stuttgart, birthplace of the combustion engine.
    What the pictures do not reveal is that the Mercedes EQ car was a prototype that had to be dragged into the city square by four employees before the shoot.

    Daimler’s EQ brand will only hit the road at the end of the decade. It’s a sign of how Germany has been slow to embrace electric vehicles and associated technology as it clings to the combustion engine that has driven its post-war prosperity…
    Merkel is aware of the risks to Germany’s auto industry, noting that only one maker of horse-drawn carriages – U.S. firm Studebaker – survived the invention of the modern car by German engineer Karl Benz 131 years ago…

    Germany has fallen behind in developing the cells that are at the heart of electric vehicles, with most imported from Asia, and has also been slow to build charging stations, abandoning a target to have 1 million electric cars on the roads by 2020.
    The country needs to spend between 50 to 80 billion euros on electric cars infrastructure, Rolf Bulander, a board member at auto supplier Bosch, told Reuters…

    In March, Daimler said it was speeding up its electric car program, aiming to bring more than 10 new models to market by 2022 through 10 billion euros of investment…
    Frank Deiss, head of the factory, says workers should not fear job cuts as Daimler is expecting ***so much growth that more combustion engines will be needed by 2025 than now even if electric cars account for 20 percent of Mercedes sales by then…
    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-germany-election-economy-idUSKBN1AC1YC

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    David Maddison

    Of the numerous wars against civilisation being waged by the Left, one of them is against bunker fuel as used by commercial ships.

    They are against the high sulphur content of some of these fuels.

    But what is the problem? Sulphur dioxides cause acid rain over land which could be an issue around a coal power station without scrubbing but what is the problem when they are discharged over the ocean? In terms of the volume of the atmosphere the discharge is negligible.

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      David Maddison

      No one has answered. Am I correct to think that there is no problem with SO2 released at sea?

      Perhaps the Red Thumb Troll can answer?

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        ROM

        David .
        Look up “ship tracks”. say on Wiki although there are a lot of other sources.

        The MODIS satelite has recorded “ship track” cloud formations over the global oceans for many years past.

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      gnome

      It’s the vibe of the thing. Don’t look for logic when the censorious green giant rises up.

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    pat

    as usual, the following victories are not picked up by the MSM:

    read all:

    29 Jul: Irish Independent: Esther Hayden: Locals overjoyed that wind turbine planning is quashed
    The residents of Clonroche are overjoyed that a proposed wind farm won’t be built in their area following legal wrangling…
    ‘This is a huge victory for the community of Clonroche and really highlights what the power of the people can achieve. A huge thank you to our legal team and to all the people who supported us financially and encouragingly throughout this long and stressful planning procedure.
    ‘While we are delighted with the result, we are mindful of other small communities like ourselves who find themselves battling the financial and lobbying power of the wind energy industry. There is an urgent need to have the existing guidelines revised in order to protect communities.’
    http://www.independent.ie/regionals/newrossstandard/news/locals-overjoyed-that-wind-turbine-planning-is-quashed-35963099.html

    28 Jul: Courier Times Indiana: Maddie Wallace: Wind projects suffer major setbacks
    (Editor’s note: This story appeared in the July 23 edition of The Courier-Times but due to a technical problem did not appear on our website.)
    The Henry County Planning Commission on Thursday denied a one year extension for the CAU (Commission Approved Use) for both NextEra Energy Inc. and its West Fork Wind Project and Apex Clean Energy and its Flat Rock Wind Project…

    The denial means that NextEra and Apex will have to start from scratch with the Planning Commission in the approval process, should they wish to pursue a CAU again…
    These decisions resulted in a standing ovation from many of the meeting’s attendees, who showed up with signs and dressed in white in protest of the wind farm projects…
    http://www.thecouriertimes.com/news/article_5365f5c6-73bf-11e7-82b7-cf4f6d1266cb.html

    28 Jul: BusinessCornwall: Wind farm appeal rejected
    Good Energy has lost its appeal to secure planning permission for a £30 million wind farm in north Cornwall.
    Plans were refused by Cornwall Council for an 11-wind turbine scheme on farmland at Week St Mary near Bude in 2014, and following an inquiry, the Secretary of State for the Department for Communities and Local Government, Sajid Javid, has upheld the original decision…

    However, in his report, Javid said the project would be an “incongruous presence of significant scale” and that the “alien presence would harm the Area of Natural Beauty itself and the Heritage Coast”.
    The decision was welcomed by local campaign group Communities Against Rural Exploitation.
    Chairman, Richard Sowerby, said: “We are of course delighted that Good Energy’s Appeal of Cornwall Council’s planning refusal has been dismissed and planning permission has been refused.

    “We always contended that a wind farm of such a huge scale was inappropriate in this landscape and it was detrimental to highly valued heritage assets.
    “We are relieved for the many local residents whose lives would have been blighted by their proximity to this monstrous wind farm. We are also very grateful to the many people who gave the time, money and support that enabled us to get to this point.”
    https://www.businesscornwall.co.uk/latest-news/2017/07/wind-farm-appeal-rejected/

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    pat

    28 Jul: Bloomberg: Anindya Upadhyay: Wind Projects in Peril as Indian States Rethink Purchases
    Two Indian states at the forefront of adding renewables to their power mix are backtracking on agreements for at least one gigawatt of wind projects and are seeking lower prices, potentially dealing a blow to Prime Minister Narendra Modi’s green energy goals.
    The southern states of Andhra Pradesh and Karnataka, which account for a quarter of the country’s installed wind capacity, are renegotiating or scrapping purchase agreements with developers and want power at prices lower than what had been stipulated in contracts already signed, developers said.

    “We have lost 75 megawatts of our project pipeline as Karnataka has canceled 400 megawatts of PPAs and there seems to be no other option than taking legal recourse for this,” London-listed Mytrah Energy Ltd. Chief Executive Officer Vikram Kailas said in a phone interview…

    While Mytrah’s projects are yet to be built, Bangalore-based Atria Power has lost investments of 1.9 billion rupees ($30 million) to build a 24-megawatt project in Karnataka, a company official said. International Finance Corp.-backed Hero Future Energies Ltd. faces renegotiation of the tariff for its 70 megawatts of commissioned projects out of a planned 120 megawatts in Andhra Pradesh.

    “Andhra Pradesh should honor what they have signed,” Hero Future Energies Chief Executive Officer Sunil Jain said. “If all these PPAs are renegotiated, you could have bad debts of millions of dollars and what’s worse is that you’ll drive investors away.”…

    The forced revision of PPAs sets a bad precedent and will shake investor confidence, especially when India is a long way from achieving its clean-energy targets, according to Bloomberg New Energy Finance…

    According to ratings agency India Ratings and Research, there could be a substantial dip in wind capacity additions in the current financial year ending March 31. Installations could fall to 1 gigawatt to 1.5 gigawatts from an all time high of 5.4 gigawatts last financial year, the rating agency said in a recent note…
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-27/wind-projects-in-peril-as-indian-states-rethink-purchase-pacts

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    pat

    29 Jul: Irish Independent: from WicklowPeople: Deborah Coleman: Residents’ warnings on turbines
    A number of residents affected by the controversial Raheenleagh Wind Farm near Ballycoog and Croghan shared their experiences with those living along the route of the proposed Ballymanus Wind Farm during last Thursday night’s meeting.
    Paddy Condren from Ballycoog said that he wouldn’t like to be any closer than he is to the turbines and said that he is aware of many families who say that it is like living with a constant airplane sound overhead.
    ‘The noise never goes away,’ he said…

    Mr Condren also raised concerns about road closures in connection with the already approved Ballcumber Wind Farm, for which grid line works are currently under way.
    ‘The Ballycumber cable is going through Ballycoog at the minute and, on the Clone to Annacurra road, I was caught in traffic for half an hour. The amount of traffic on those roads at present is highly dangerous,’ he said…

    Eugene Clune who lives in Ballinvalley shared his family’s trauma and said that if he had the chance now he would approach things very differently.
    ‘My house is situated 800 metres from an industrial turbine and my four-year-old has slept, maybe two nights since last winter.
    ‘She would ask us why her granddad is outside on the digger in the middle of the night – because that is what it sounds like,’ he said.

    Mr Clune urged the people of Aughrim and other areas in the planning application to fight against having turbines erected in their communities.
    ‘You are very lucky that you are not living with turbines, but the threat of turbines. It is up to you to stop these and if I had my time again I would treat it very differently,’ he said…
    http://www.independent.ie/regionals/wicklowpeople/news/residents-warnings-on-turbines-35967743.html

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    pat

    READ ALL:

    28 Jul: TrueNorthReports Vermont: Pownal residents say green ‘model communities’ program not local, rolled out illegally
    By Michael Bielawski and Bruce Parker
    POWNAL, Vt. — It came dressed up as a local initiative to spur Vermont’s first “climate change economy,” but some residents say the Climate Economy Model Communities Program originates from Montpelier and is being implemented illegally.
    The Vermont Council on Rural Development wants to turn Vermont towns into model communities for climate change. In April, the statewide group selected the small southwestern town of Pownal to be the first success in what it calls the Climate Economy Model Communities Program…

    In Pownal, the climate change program is cleverly named “Empower Pownal,” giving the appearance of a local initiative. As the program spreads to other communities, it presumably will be repackaged and branded as a grassroots effort of other towns…READ ALL
    http://truenorthreports.com/pownal-model-communities-program-not-local

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    Mark M

    2000: Overfishing and global warming land cod on endangered list. 
    “Scientists fear that North Sea cod may go the way of those in the Grand Banks of Canada, where overfished stocks disappeared in 1992 and have not revived.” 
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2000/jul/20/fish.food
    Reality.
    2017: Enjoy cod’s revival, but the extent of our ruination of the sea remains unknown. 
    https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2017/jul/22/enjoy-cods-revival-extent-of-our-ruination-of-seas-unknown?CMP=share_btn_tw
    > And the cod of the Grand Banks of Canada?
    2017: The cod are coming back to Newfoundland — and they’re eating the shrimp that had taken over. 
    http://nationalpost.com/news/canada/the-cod-are-coming-back-to-newfoundland-and-theyre-eating-the-shrimp-that-had-taken-over/wcm/a77366dc-248f-4026-81d6-11acd7c484ab

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      Roger

      The true reason for the decline in Cod in the North sea has been the disastrous Common Fisheries Policy [CFP] imposed by the EU. It has forced trawlermen to dump hundreds of thousands of tonnes of dead fish back into the North sea each year as they are outside the boats’ species-by-weight quotas. Penalties for breaching quota have been massive fines and sometimes loss of the fishing boat.

      Policies such as these are what happens when the unelected and unaccountable (often led by the nose by know-nothing eco-activists) are able to rule our lives. Brexit can’t come soon enough and with it the return of Britain’s waters and full control over them once more.

      BTW for those who don’t know, when the CFP was introduced the EU used it to put 100,000 British fishermen out of business by ‘exporting’ those jobs to the French and Spanish through the use of quota. To add insult to injury the Spanish and French fishermen were given grants (from Our EU financial ‘contributions’) to buy the new boats they needed to come and fish in British waters !

      The EU did exactly the same with Dairy Quota and put a huge number of British dairy farmers out of business – Britain had been a net exporter of dairy products but the EU gave us a much smaller quota than needed to even meet our own home consumption and gave a huge quota to French farmers so that in future we would be buyng a significan percentage of our dairy products from France.

      Time after time, in area after area, anyone who looks carefully can see how the soviet-style quota systems the EU loves have been used to forcibly transfer jobs and industry form the UK to elsewhere in Europe.

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    Mark M

    July 27, 1988: “Experts guess we have a window of about 20 years to undo the atmospheric damage

    https://twitter.com/WeDontHaveTime0/status/890964710702579713

    20

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    pat

    TonyfromOz – over to you -

    ***“Solar panels across Queensland have become our biggest energy producer, exceeding even power stations,” (Townsville MP Scott Stewart) said.

    29 Jul: Townsville Bulletin: Rachel Riley: North Queensland power costs brings solar energy boom
    Solahart Townsville has been inundated with calls from householders looking to install both solar hot water and power systems after a recent surge in quarterly electricity bills.
    Solahart Townsville manager Emma Walden said her business was doing at least one household installation a day, with Annandale, Kelso, Cranbrook and Kirwan proving to be some of the suburb hotspots.
    She said while many of the systems were first-time installations, there had also been a spike in people with older systems looking to upgrade due to advancements in technology…

    Idalia parents Paula and Daniel Halliday this week had a Solahart system worth more than $10,000 installed after their last quarterly bill peaked at $900.
    “Our power bills weren’t really that bad, about $400-$500, but a hike seemed to hit a few months ago and basically we went from summer bill to a winter bill that was even higher and it just didn’t make sense,” she said…

    Townsville MP Scott Stewart said the State Government was still adamant it would not support a new coal-fired base load power station in the North as a means of driving down power costs. Instead, he said, he was supportive of residents and the Government continuing to transition toward renewables.

    ***“Solar panels across Queensland have become our biggest energy producer, exceeding even power stations,” he said.

    “We won’t go down the road of old technology and are looking the future and the future is renewables.”
    “We are really supportive of the push by Townsville City Council to get the battery production happening here to create job and a stable alternative energy source.”…
    http://www.townsvillebulletin.com.au/news/north-queensland-power-costs-brings-solar-energy-boom/news-story/194798914091a7d49b533268a4e9e798

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    • #

      Oh dear!

      Don’t you just love clueless Government ministers.

      This is the Media release from Mark Bailey, Qld Gov Minister for, well, everything, a bit like Russ Hinze used to be for Sir Joh.

      Note how he only uses the Nameplate.

      So, in reality, that 1706MW of Solar power actually equates to 290MW average per day across a year, so just a tad more than ONE UNIT (of eight units) at that same Gladstone power Plant, and, as half that power is consumed by the homes themselves, that takes it down to half of that, so 145MW fed back to the grid per day, and that’s nowhere near even one unit.

      That 1706MW on a bright clear sunny Summer day day would generate around 1370MW for just one hour either side of Midday, and if you seriously think they are going to shut down any unit at any coal fired power plant for two hours, you’ve got rocks in your head.

      And, as I have seen from watching this data now, rooftop solar power makes absolutely no difference whatsoever to the total power generation from any of those Qld coal fired power plants.

      This is just the normal spouting of cr@p from someone who hasn’t the nous to ask for actual data, or go and check for himself. Lead me to the cameras.

      But hey, don’t worry, Craig says we will soon be getting our power from the cloud.

      As a sidelight, I saw an article during the week from one of those experts on everything, you know, a movie star, this one called Paltrow or something.

      She was extolling the virtue of a Jade Egg. Anyway, the article quoted an OBGYN who said not to use the d@mned thing, and the actress said what would she (the doctor) know anyway. The article also said that said item draws energy from the light of the moon.

      Say, sunbeams during the day, and Jade Eggs at night. Power problem solved.

      Please don’t ask me. Just google Jade Egg Paltrow. You’ll be rolling around the floor in no time.

      Tony.

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        Rod Stuart

        Most of time that egg is somewhere that the moon don’t shine.

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        • #
          Rereke Whakaaro

          It’s not referred to as a “dill-dough” for nothing. A dill buys one, and Gwyneth gets the dough.

          30

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        Robert Rosicka

        Tony I know someone that insists he gets full power from his rooftop solar on any cloudless night regardless of moon phase but especially during a full moon .
        This guy is otherwise intelligent so it beats me I’ve given up trying to explain it .

        50

        • #
          Rereke Whakaaro

          My bet is: “substances”.

          30

          • #
            alwaysBskeptical

            Re substances:
            Yes, “moonshine” !!!!

            It is a full moon next week, Tuesday 8th August. I will look at our inverter when the moon is high in the sky and report back.

            10

        • #
          Graeme No.3

          AGW “science” claims the Earth’s surface absorbs radiation from the Sun and radiates IR, which warms the air, which in turn back radiates and warms the surface. Since 70% of the Earth’s surface is water that requires liquid water to radiate IR.
          So he could be a believer in Climate “Science” or possibly he has a very high feed in tariff and a diesel generator.

          10

      • #
        Annie

        Well I did look Tony! Oh dearie me! Are they thoroughly taking the mick I wonder? Calling the company ‘Goop’ for a start…what’s with that? Is it just me but do others here feel that things generally are becoming sicker and sicker and our society is being degraded in every possible way?

        00

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    tony b

    I’ve supported the sceptic view in all my discussions with people up to today. Todays heat in Penrith which is warmer than anything recorded anywhere in Sydney in July has changed everything. Its July for petes sake and it’s hit 28. Jo Nova is going to address todays heat. No but but

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    • #

      No. That’s it. I’m convinced. Despite 28 million weather balloons, 30 years of satellites, 3000 Argo buoys and a half a million years of ice cores that don’t show any reliable effect from rising CO2, it was 28 degrees in Penrith. What can I say?

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      el gordo

      Tony b I purposely left the Central Tablelands yesterday and went down to Sydney to soak up the ambience, it was hot.

      The thing is we cannot confuse weather with climate change, but everyone I spoke to was convinced an early spring is further proof of a tipping point, what do you think?

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      bullocky

      ‘I’ve supported the sceptic view in all my discussions with people up to today’
      -
      Evidence?

      20

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      Greg Cavanagh

      I’m on the Sunshine Coast, so that’s my reference point.

      Every year I take notice of when winter starts. It typically hits in the second week in June. The weather is perfect and warm, then suddenly its 6C of a morning and chilly all day.

      Last year (2016) Winter hit in the first week of June and winter was exceptionally cold and long.

      This year (2017) Winter hit in the second week of July, and lasted about a week. It’s been a very mild winter so far. I’m still expecting the Westerly Winds to drop the temperature, and stay that way for a month or three.

      This is called weather, not climate. And we do have a big variation in weather from year to year.

      30

    • #
      Hasbeen

      Give us back our weather Tony, it’s bloody freezing here in southern Queensland.

      Well apart from those 2 hours a day when solar panels work.

      20

    • #
      el gordo

      Tony the other day it snowed in St Petersburg, unusual weather for this time of year, but a cool July in Denmark is climate.

      ‘A summer day is defined as any day in which temperatures top 25C (77F) at least somewhere in Denmark.

      ‘According to the Danish Meteorology Institute (DMI), July is likely to end without reaching 77F anywhere in the country. If that prediction holds up, it will mark the first time that Danes will have suffered through a summer-less July in nearly four decades.

      “There are only three years in our records in which July contains a big fat zero when it comes to summer days and temps above 25C. That’s 1962, 1974 and 1979,” climatologist John Cappelen said on the DMI website.’

      10

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      el gordo

      Tony in the interest of balance, this is also climate.

      ‘While Monday’s top temperature for Sydney will still count towards the July figures – unlike rainfall where the monthly reading cuts off earlier – it’s unlikely to shift the needle much from the average of 19.2 degrees set so far this month.

      ‘That tally is shy only of the 19.45 degrees average maximum set in 2013, making it likely Sydney will post its second-warmest July by maximums in records that go back to 1858, Mr Hough said.’

      SMH

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    • #
      el gordo

      Admittedly, on face value, it has the appearance of a tipping point.

      http://www.weatherzone.com.au/news/record-july-heat-across-multiple-states-and-territories/526654

      00

  • #
    David Maddison

    Essay on words with silent “l’s”.

    http://www.deimel.org/language/l.htm

    21

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    David Maddison

    Discussions of why Americans pronounce the 60/40 lead tin alloy as “sodder” but in British English it is “solder”.

    No definitive conclusion reached but very interesting discussion.

    https://english.stackexchange.com/questions/19990/what-is-the-correct-pronunciation-of-the-word-solder

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      Len

      Any thing to do with sodomites? :-)

      10

    • #
      Another Ian

      I used to ask Americans why they still had an “l” in their spelling then

      30

    • #
      gnome

      There are two separate languages involved.

      Ask them why they could care less when they couldn’t, why they side their domiciles with aluminum and pull their cars up to the curb.

      20

      • #
        ROM

        As has been said about the Brits and the Yanks over the years; They are two nations separated by a common language!

        Also said about American troops in Britain in WW2. Over paid, over sexed and over here!

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  • #
    Rollo

    The Turnbull government is planning to help fund the construction of new clean-coal-fired power stations­ in an extraordinary meas­ure to intervene in the looming energ­y security and pricing crisis.

    The Australian Feb 2017

    How’s this coming along? Any start dates for specific projects?

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      Yeah! Never, when Labor gets elected.

      It’ll be a case of the lights going out, and Bill saying ….. “WTF just happened then?”

      I’ve still got people saying that the overnight power consumption is just off peak hot water, solved by solar hot water heating.

      That overnight off peak hot water heating amounts to less than 10% of that 18,000MW Base Load, and that’s only for one hour, and then the occasional cycle every so often.

      Until people actually realise that while they are sound asleep, Australia is consuming between 60 and 65% of its total power consumption, then this current blindness towards consequences will continue.

      I can see the response right now when one of those political leaders is finally told about it. First response will be ….. “Yeah! that’s bovine waste.” Second response will be ….. “Holy $hit!” Third response will be a phone call to the politician’s super fund, asking ….. “how much will I get if I go now?”

      Tony.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    In case you are wondering what PM Turnbull’s thought bubble about “Snowy 2.0″ was about here is the page for the feasability study.

    http://www.snowyhydro.com.au/our-scheme/snowy20/

    One paragraph says:

    “If built, Snowy 2.0 would increase the generation capacity of the iconic Snowy Scheme by up to 50 per cent, making up to 2000 megawatts available to the National Electricity Market.”

    Of course, this is totally misleading because not one new what of power is produced, it is a storage scheme only.

    Also, I am predicting it will be found feasible because that’s the answer the PM wants and because….the people doing the feasibility study will be the ones who get to build it….

    Also, the round trip energy efficiency is 70-80% so you’ll only get back that much of the useless wind energy put iin to pump the water. Come to think of it, wind is too unreliable even for pumped hydro.

    I predict that coal power will be used to pump the water!

    71

  • #
    David Maddison

    Australian farmer paid to not let animals graze on grass because grass supposedly locks up carbon.

    https://www.spectator.com.au/2017/07/government-stupidity/

    62

    • #
      Robert Rosicka

      If this is true I want in .

      40

      • #
        David Maddison

        Absolutely.

        He gets paid $350k per year on a $2 million investment.

        That’s a 17.5% return. Much better than a working farm and he doesn’t have to produce anything.

        You could borrow the $2 million at maybe 4%.

        51

        • #
          Robert Rosicka

          Best part is almost zero input costs just rates and tax that’s about it , I’m going to see if any of these property’s are left sounds like a good investment given that lil bill will no doubt get the nod next election, for that matter it won’t matter lab or lib same same .

          50

        • #
          Greg Cavanagh

          I seem to recall from many years ago; some aboriginal communities being paid big dollars not to do their usual burning of the scrub for the same reason; The Australian CO2 budget.

          10

    • #

      Waste, weeds, exotics and ferals…The environmentalist’s dream is the conservationist’s nightmare.

      My god Big Green sucks.

      50

      • #
        James

        I wonder what his liability insurance company thinks? Does the government indemnify, so that when lightening strikes after 10 years, and starts out a huge fire, which would be hard to control, then spreads to neighboring property, will the taxpayer be on the hook for damages?

        50

    • #
      Craigthomas

      David Archibald is wrong (as usual).
      The “idiocy of Direct Action” is not “belief in global warming ” at all.
      The idiocy of Direct Action is Tony Abbott ‘a *dis*belief, and his rejection of the sound economic alternative.

      215

      • #
        AndyG55

        Sound economic alternative would have been to IGNORE the whole AGW fiasco/scam completely.

        111

      • #
        el gordo

        Craig I think Direct Action is a pork barrel for the Nats, its a disgrace.

        40

      • #
        Rereke Whakaaro

        And at least David Archibald has the fortitude to state an opinion. Which is something I have never witnessed from you.

        We do not know where you stand, on anything, which makes if hard to know whether we should give you any credence at all.

        Whether or not his opinion aligns with yours or not, is immaterial. While we live in a democracy, he is entitled to have his.

        You are also entitled to have yours. Would you like to share it with the rest of us?

        21

  • #
    Rollo

    The publisher’s letter in this months Silicon Chip magazine is worth reading. Leo Simpson, once again, comes out very strongly about Australia’s bleak energy outlook. Silicon Chip has always encouraged debate publishing articles and letters from all points of view, unlike most other magazines in the science/technology arena.

    40

  • #
    David Maddison

    Here’s a bit of a look inside the Hazelwood power station just before it was shutbdown.

    https://youtu.be/UHSPYFxqruI

    42

    • #
      Greg Cavanagh

      Criminal.

      I just don’t understand how our politicians can be so blind.
      It boggles the mind.
      Now I’m sounding like Ruairi.
      I’ll go out in a cloud of glory!

      60

      • #
        Craigthomas

        So you think our politicians should subsidise uneconomical coal plants?
        With our tax dollars?

        316

        • #
          David Maddison

          How was it not economical Craig Thomas, if it were allowed to operate in a free market and not deliberately made uneconomic by your socialist/Green brethren?

          How can your beloved windmills and solar possibly compete without subsidies?

          You say “renewables” are cheaper than fossil or nuclear. Why can’t they compete in a free market then?

          I am an economic and science rationalist. I don’t care how the power is produced as long as it is in a free market. Let the marketplace decide the production method, not government policy.

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          • #
            Rereke Whakaaro

            You will get no reply from Craig. I don’t think he is very good at sums. And he certainly doesn’t “do” economics.

            I would love to get a group of knowledgeable people together, in cyberspace, to rationally analyse, and compare, the total supply-chain, and maintenance costs for each of the alternative sources of power.

            21

          • #
            Craigthomas

            They were operating in a free market.
            At a time of record high power prices, *and* with the usual government subsidies that coal attracts, Hazelwool still wasn’t a going concern unless the government gave them a $400million subsidy.

            13

        • #
          toorightmate

          None of our coal fired power stations have been uneconomical.
          It is the ridiculous penalties applies by left wing idiots such as yourself which have led to the current disaster.
          The once lucky county is now damned thanks to you and your ilk.

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          • #
            Craigthomas

            Er, except for Hazelwood, which was uneconomical and so was shut down by its private owners after they begged for a $400million subsidy and didn’t get it.

            13

        • #
          AndyG55

          At least coal PROVIDES on demand.

          Something unreliabales can NEVER do.

          And allowed to run 24/7 is by far the cheapest form of electricity.

          Coal also provides a massive income into Australia.

          Win and Solar are just a subsidy sewer.

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        • #

          Counting the hidden costs of energy. See Fig 1.
          Total system costs.

          Ignoring these costs distorts the picture – not a level
          playing field for cheap ol’ King Coal.

          http://www.energyinachangingclimate.info/Counting%20the%20hidden%20costs%20of%20energy.pdf

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        • #
          Greg Cavanagh

          Coal fired power plants don’t need to be subsidised.

          It’s the solar and wind that do get subsidised, and that is wasting our tax dollars on a boondoogle.

          Let the market decide. May the best provider win. No subsidies for any of them.

          50

          • #
            Craigthomas

            The market did decide. Hazel wood was privately owned. They wanted $400million from the taxpayer to stay open. So they closed.

            24

        • #
          el gordo

          ‘So you think our politicians should subsidise uneconomical coal plants?
          ‘With our tax dollars?’

          No need, China and Japan would be happy to build state of the art coal fired power stations, which could easily be paid off over the life of the unit.

          10

    • #
      Robert Rosicka

      You can’t mention Hazelwood without attracting red thumbs David , which shows the mentality and maturity of their mob .

      Coal , coal , coal , coal , coal and Hazelwood, that should get me a few red thumbs .

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      • #
        Rereke Whakaaro

        You got one from me, just so you wouldn’t be disappointed if nobody else read your comment.

        30

    • #

      As if anybody could consider coal economical!

      All those Japanese, Chinese, South Koreans, Indians, Taiwanese etc who spend tens of billion annually on Australian coal sometimes use it for art installations, occasionally a bit of it goes for smoking Lapsang Souchong tea when the pine logs are too wet. But mostly they just like looking at our coal because it’s so shiny.

      As if Asian factories would actually burn Australian coal! If that were true then it stands to reason that Australians would be better off burning coal, since we have centuries supply of the premium black stretching along the Sydney–Gunnedah–Bowen Basin.

      You think rational Australians would be campaigning against their coal as uneconomical if Asian industry was actually importing and burning Australian coal in massive quantities year after year? Well? You think Asians are really building new efficient plants for our coal at a great rate? Those are extra-big cinema complexes for Kung Fu movies, silly!

      100

      • #
        Rereke Whakaaro

        Australian coal [is] sometimes used for art installations,

        I have actually seen a Buddha carved from a piece of coal. I presume it was Australian. It was certainly very solid and shiny.

        30

        • #

          Well there you go. Yet there are still people who think Asians use our coal for industry and power. As Craig has pointed out…it’s just not economical!

          20

  • #
    Mark

    For every one hundred thousand electric cars you must install the equivalent of both Loy Yang A and B 3000MW to charge 70kw into car batteries for three hours.

    Palachook in Queensland says she will put in recharging facilities from Cairns to the Gold Coast. The fastest chargers need 30 minutes to complete a charge…?…that is a capacity of 48 cars per day for each charger…do you need to make a reservation to charge your car…at three in the morning?

    These lefties, they do not think anything through, do they?

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    • #
      gnome

      Interesting too, if two wheelers can recharge at the public charging points. I suspect two wheelers will be far more popular (and useful) than four wheelers, and in the short to medium term they will swamp the market (as they apparently do in China).

      Get in line, Tesla owner, my electro-vespa was here before you.

      20

    • #

      Say, how may electric cars charging at night
      does it take to crash the grid?

      20

      • #

        Charge of the Light Brigade.

        Half a league, half a league,
        Half a league onward,
        Plunged in the battery smoke
        Drove the six hundred…
        Theirs not to reason why,
        Theirs but to do or die,
        Charging an army though
        Someone had blundered …

        h/t Tennyson.

        20

  • #
    Mark

    Al gores the truth:

    Al Gore : I saw a fish swimming in the street (1 min, 20 seconds, Fox): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1pr5FgekNfA

    Absolutely magnificent.
    Soon he’ll be telling us he invented the ocean.

    40

  • #
    OriginalSteve

    I was wondering today of the marvel of desperate politicians….Tony Blair put tanks on the streets and around Heathrow on unproven security issues, now in Oz we see the same, is the climate mirage about to collapse, so they needed a diversion?

    Never underestimate a desperate politician….

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  • #
    RAH

    A few weeks ago I took the first 2 week vacation I have taken in over a decade. We drove 1,600 miles west and spent our time exploring the Teton mountain range (the youngest range in the Rockies) and Yellowstone National Park. Before we went I spent some time learning a little bit about the geography. My reading and then seeing those massive calderas at Yellowstone and the more local effects from their eruptions, including an exposed cliff of tuff 200 ft thick (The tuff is about 200 meters at it’s thickest points) , brought home just how real catastrophic climate change can happen in a very short time. A large eruption at Yellowstone would have global effects that would dwarf the effects from Krakatoa eruption of 1883. No number of wind farms, solar panels, and electric cars are going to save people when it goes again. It is a wonderful and interesting place full of interesting features and wildlife. But the end message I left with reinforced what I learned long ago. No living thing on this planet has control over it’s ultimate fate and our effects on our environment and planet are miniscule compared to what nature can do in an instant.

    50

  • #
    James Murphy

    As I have said before, in some ways it’s a mystery to me why the MSM hasn’t started asking why there are 2 trends which are, in some regards, totally at odds with each other.

    One is that gas bills continue to increase at a great rate.
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-06-09/energy-prices-set-to-jump-next-month/8605662

    The other is that many gas producers are really feeling financial pressure from rock-bottom gas prices.
    http://www.rigzone.com/news/oil_gas/a/151161/A_Worldwide_Gas_Glut_Claims_27_Billion_Victim_in_Canada/?all=HG2

    The MSM is not known to be logical, or objective, but even a broken clock is correct twice a day…

    40

  • #
    James Murphy

    I guess we will never see Michelle Obama, or other signalers of virtue holding up a sign with #BringBackOurGeologists in an equally pointless attempt to save yet more victims of a savage, repressive, and regressive organisation (for once, not referring to the Greens), because the odds are that they were probably men, and they are involved in the evil oil industry.

    http://www.rigzone.com/news/oil_gas/a/151173/Boko_Haram_Attack_on_Oil_Team_Said_to_Have_Killed_48

    50

  • #
    mobilly2

    Just a question , if the Norwegian floaty windy mills go ahead with a Archimedes water
    displacement of 11,500 tonnes per floaty windy mill off the Scotland coast , how many do they have to produce to get their scary sea level rise and no significant power output to anyones benefit ?

    Bring it on any politician if you want to argue the seas are rising yet you campaign for more displacement ( I guess they wont get that )

    We made great progress with steam and the canals through Europe and the USA only to be denied that from our own Government in Australia 200 years hence forth , and they call themselves progressives , no they are regressive .

    Australia could be so much more !

    30

    • #
      Robert Rosicka

      Now that’s a great question , if it takes off these floaty wind things and they build 100s if not thousands will the displacement affect sea levels , or currents or whales migrating or seabirds .
      Doubt it , one big storm should be enough to destroy them .
      11,500 tonnes plus the force of the blades spinning I hope those tether lines are strong enough and anchored properly .

      30

    • #
      Annie

      We’ve heard of Boaty McBoatface, which suggestion was denied, and recently Trainy McTrainface. Now we can enjoy Floaty McFloatface.
      Sorry, couldn’t help myself…life is just so s1lly these days.

      50

      • #
        Rereke Whakaaro

        It only appears to be silly, to the sane. To the rest of us, it is life as normal.

        10

    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Australia started life as a prison, why not ship out recalcitrant pollies and greenies to act as extra ballast on these windmills they love so much?

      41

    • #
      Richard111

      You need to displace 400,000 CUBIC KILOMETRES of water to raise global sea levels by just 1 metre.

      20

  • #
    tom0mason

    As a piece of entertainment how about a look at the weather.
    For the latest look at what 12 weather models are saying about the likely Autumn weather for the UK, have a look at gavsweathervids.com latest video at https://www.youtube.com/embed/BKSkmhEJnc8?ecver=1. These models are from weather outlets across the world from Australia, Brazil to Russia, Germany to Korea and Japan, and many others!
    The vast majority of these models incorporate climate model information, thus they are indicating warmer than usual temperatures (but that is what they usually say — and often correct themselves in the shorter term as they’ll have it wrong) but overall there is no reliable pattern to pick from all these models’ predictions.
    By the way ALL of them will update before any of the events they predict to happen, and so NONE of them should be taken as any more accurate than a guess.

    IMO, as a piece of entertainment these weather models are as interesting as and TV soap opera.
    So what is your guess for the Autumn weather. (I’m going for average temperatures but more rain.)

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  • #
    pat

    speaking of coal, 4BC radio in Brisbane had a top news item during the week about “climate activists” shutting down one or two Commonwealth Bank offices. never found anything online to confirm, apart from this photo & caption, which is mostly absent at the other links I found for it online:

    27 Jul: Brisbane Bank Refuses to Open Due to Climate Activists’ Protest
    PHOTO CAPTION: A group of climate activists opposed to a mining project by the Adani Group gathered outside a Brisbane bank, which decided to close ahead of the protest on Thursday, July 27
    http://www.stltoday.com/news/world/brisbane-bank-refuses-to-open-due-to-climate-activists-protest/html_8a952424-feb4-5558-9c98-c5e8d8c3348b.html

    the following Courier Mail article, (Google summary included “Brisbane Bank Refuses to Open Due to Climate Activists’ Protest”, but I didn’t find it on the page), has this excerpt in one of the comments:

    FROM COMMENTS:
    Steve: So protesters stop access for ordinary folk going about their business by forcing the CBA near the Mall from being able to do business. Other people against Adani have repeatedly said the business case for Adani is poor because no banks will finance it. Of course they won’t finance it as they are being bullied by small minority groups who should quite frankly be rounded up and charged by the police for stopping people from performing their daily tasks…

    NOT SURE HOW THE CONFERENCE WENT, BUT READ ALL OF THIS:

    28 Jul: Courier Mail: Sarah Vogler: Labor chiefs stop embarrassing anti-Adani mine motions hitting conference floor
    A RAFT of anti-Adani motions will not be debated on the floor of Labor’s pre-election Townsville conference tomorrow, with the party carefully negotiating a compromise on the politically-sensitive issue.
    A leaked 663-page document has revealed Queensland Labor’s policy committee was flooded with proposed motions ahead of the conference, including many that could have proved politically sensitive for the party as it heads into the looming election.
    Multiple motions against the Adani coal mine were among those put forward and rejected ahead of the conference, including one calling for all new mines to be banned and for coal from Adani’s proposed mine to be prevented from leaving Australian shores…

    “The Adani Carmichael mine project will bring much-needed jobs to regional Queensland, as the Queensland Government invests in new industries, biofuels, renewable energy generation and defence manufacturing,” the approved motion reads…READ ALL
    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/queensland/labor-chiefs-stop-embarrassing-antiadani-mine-motions-hitting-conference-floor/news-story/3ef3729b07056bf3dfd817aeccedd47a

    20

    • #
      pat

      these protests have been ongoing, & involve a minimum number of self-righteous “green” zealots. shouldn’t they be arrested, if they do not have permits or if they occupy premises?

      28 Jul: 350.org: #StopAdani Perth escalates against Commonwealth Bank
      Friday, 28th July, 2017: #StopAdani activists today have held simultaneous protests at two branches of the Commonwealth Bank in Perth’s central business district, in a protest against the bank’s involvement in the Adani Coal Mine.
      Activists held a rally outside the main branch in the Murray Street mall, and occupied the Hay Street branch a block away. The rally featured a human coal train chugging through the gathering pulling carriages emblazoned with “STOP funding dirty coal #STOP ADANI”. The bank reacted by locking its doors…
      Last time a similar protest was held, 30 police and 2 SWAT vans were in attendance. There was one arrest and the branch was closed for over an hour.
      Images at (LINK)
      https://350.org.au/press-release/stopadani-perth-escalates-against-commonwealth-bank/

      read all the following:

      24 Jul: AFR: Matthew Stevens: It doesn’t matter that our banks don’t like coal
      PHOTO CAPTION: Commonwealth Bank appears to have become the activists main target.
      Confirmation that Australia’s big four banks have continued to finance coal but with increasing post-Paris climate commitment discrimination fails to address the more profound shift in the way Australian carbon miners will fund their future.
      On Monday, the anti-carbon lobby, Market Forces, released a study announcing that Australia’s major banks had lent $17 billion to the fossil fuel sector in the years since the Paris Climate Agreement was signed in 2015, but that local lending to the coal industry is in deep and structural decline.

      Now, one of the ambitions of the green elite that prepared a landmark document five years ago called Stopping the Australian Coal Export Boom was to make coal unfundable for local banks…

      That part of the plan has worked so well that, having been subjected to years of peaceful weekly protest by a small but resolute number of anti-coalers, Westpac was moved in April to announce a new approach to coal funding that saw it rule out support for expansions into new coal basins and set a cap on the quality of coal it was prepared to lend against…

      Westpac’s policy was described very adequately by Minerals Council boss Brendon Pearson was “a textbook case of virtue signalling”…

      “While the immediate practical effect is likely to be negligible, the bank’s decision will be used by single issue activists to stigmatise the Australian coal industry and resources sector which collectively provided 14 per cent of Australia’s GDP growth over the last decade. The bank should reflect on that over coming weeks and months.”

      In concert with the release of the Market Forces study, a bunch of anti-Adani protesters gathered outside of the Commonwealth Bank’s Sydney headquarters. CBA management should expect this to become a semi-permanent phenomenon given the way Westpac crumbled to similar sustained protest.

      I am certain CBA management is made of rather sterner stuff and that there will be no blinking on coal, at least while Ian Narev runs the place…
      http://www.afr.com/business/it-doesnt-matter-that-our-banks-dont-like-coal-20170724-gxhoov

      30

      • #
        Annie

        What happened to activists being arrested and charged with causing an obstruction? Why are the police so lily-livered about sorting such people out?

        30

      • #
        OriginalSteve

        Precisely the reason high pressure water canon were invented….probably the first time in a while a few of them might have had a wash, so 2 birds, one stone…..

        20

    • #
      pat

      PIC: 28 Jul: GreenLeft: Zebedee Parkes: Anti-coal activists target Commonwealth Bank
      Some 50 activists played protest games, sang and danced in the Commonwealth Bank’s foyer in Sydney on July 24. Stop Adani Sydney spokesperson Rada Germanos told Green Left Weekly: “We’re playing games in the Commonwealth Bank’s Sussex Street foyer calling on it to stop playing games with our collective future and pull out of funding the Adani Carmichael coal mine [in Queensland].”
      https://www.greenleft.org.au/content/anti-coal-activists-target-commonwealth-bank

      PLENTY OF TWEETS/PICS RE THE ONGOING ANTI-ADANI BANK PROTESTS:

      https://twitter.com/hashtag/commbank?lang=en

      20

  • #
    Another Ian

    Jo

    FYI

    “Are Ice Age Glacials Caused By Orbital Inclination?”

    https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2017/07/30/ice_age_orbital_inclination/#comments

    40

  • #
    • #
      Greg Cavanagh

      I wonder how they missed M.M. In the climategate emails he often boasted at bringing in $30 million for CRU, and I understand that that is also the reason the investigations couldn’t find anything against him, because his unit brought in too much money to find against him.

      60

    • #
      Rereke Whakaaro

      Propaganda only works if you a) tell a lie that is so big, that nobody is capable of challenging it in its full entirety; b) Keep repeating the lie at different times, via different media, using different talking heads; c) Stigmatise anybody who gets up and presents a plausible and rational alternative to the lie; d) Present awards and accolades to those who have the most success in propagating the lie; and e) Remove or redirect funding away from research or analysis of alternative lines of research the could potentially debunk the lie.

      Let me know, if I have missed anything.

      10

    • #
      Lucky

      Try:

      http://notrickszone.com/2017/07/30/for-fame-and-fund-japanese-scientist-accuses-four-climate-researchers-ipcc-of-fake-science/#sthash.7DsC2Qb3.dpbs

      ” The anthropogenic global warming (AGW) theory of the IPCC is a fake science developed by the following scientists for fame & fund, causing huge economic losses to the world. President Trump made a scientifically right decision to withdraw the U.S. from the Paris Agreement and will liberating mankind from the AGW scam.

      Dr. Syukuro Manabe (Born in 1931, Princeton Univ.), pioneer of AGW theory
      Dr. Robert Cess (Born in 1932, Stony Brook Univ.), mechanics researcher
      Dr. James Hansen (Born in 1941, NASA &Columbia Univ.), Venus researcher
      Dr. Michel Schlesinger (Born in 1943, Univ. of Illinois), rocket engineer “

      10

  • #
    pat

    30 Jul: Sunda Mail Editorial: Labor’s zealotry on renewable energy is sending the country broke
    TODAY’S confronting revelation that more than 464 Queenslanders a week are having their electricity disconnected because of soaring power prices is a wake-up call to the Labor Party…
    Labor’s zealotry on renewable energy targets is sending the country broke. Mr Shorten is also hell-bent on creating class warfare with his Robin Hood-style tactics of taxing the rich to curry favour with the poor.

    It comes as we also reveal that the Adani coal mine project will proceed with $400 million to be pumped into the project over the next few months, creating hundreds of jobs. This at a time when unemployment is at double-digit levels in north Queensland.
    With a Queensland state election looming – the likely date being late October or early November – cost-of-living pressures are emerging as a major poll issue. In fact, power prices could emerge as the biggest single issue…

    Latest official figures from the Australian Energy Regulator show a 55 per cent leap in the number of households that had their power cut off in the three months to March. With more than 18,000 disconnections in the first nine months, the 2016-17 total is set to easily top last year’s 21,667. And in a further indication of consumers’ struggle, the number of Queensland customers entering formal payment plans with their providers has soared by a third to 42,361…
    Mark Henley, CEO of Queensland Council of Social Service, says energy is “the one that is really hurting people’’. Of course, it’s the regions that once again are hit hardest. The air-conditioning costs in north Queensland are onerous because of the heat.

    The Palaszczuk Government needs to reassess its approach to the power supply industry in this state. It is benefiting hugely from surging power prices through its majority stake in the state’s power generators. It’s time consumers were put first. Queensland needs a commission of inquiry into electricity prices and reforms aimed at making life easier for taxpayers.
    It’s now reaching crisis level.
    http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/opinion/editorial-labors-zealotry-on-renewable-energy-is-sending-the-country-broke/news-story/b46c5c083b010ad557b43959e7e31b75

    40

  • #
    pat

    ???

    30 Jul: AFR: Mark Ludlow: Warren Buffet’s BHE Renewables sets the standard for utility solar
    (bottom of article: The reporter travelled to California with the assistance of The Climate Council)

    Given the fast pace of the rollout of solar power across the globe, the $3 billion Topaz Solar Farm, about 270 kilometres north-east of Los Angeles, was the largest utility-scale solar project in the world when it was completed in 2014.
    Now it has to settle for being the second-largest solar farm in California, which has embraced renewable energy as part of its push to have 50 per cent clean energy by 2030…

    The state’s largest solar project is the 579 megawatt Solar Star project, near Rosamond and also owned by BHE Renewables, which was completed in 2017. The Desert Sunlight project in the Mojave Desert in the state’s south-east, is the same size as Topaz, while there are also four other 200 megawatt to 250 megawatt projects in California.

    The Topaz solar farm, which was built between 2012 and 2014, was developed by company First Solar before being bought by Birkshire(sic) Hathaway Renewables, a subsidiary of the multinational company run by billionaire investor Warren Buffett, which has more than 1400 megawatts of solar projects across the United States…

    The Topaz solar plant consists of 22 sections or “blocks” of thin-film cadmium telluride PV panels across 4700 acres. It produces enough electricity to power 18,000 Californian homes and displaces about 377,000 tonnes of carbon, equivalent to taking 73,000 cars off the road…

    Unlike most solar and wind projects in regional Australia, which needs to spend hundreds of millions of dollars to connect to the grid, the Topaz site, a former ranch, was chosen because it was right next to a transmission line that connects to Bakersfield, the sub-station hub for the electricity grid between the north and south of California. It is also linked to the coast via the nearest big town of San Luis Obispo and then connects down to the metropolis of Los Angeles…

    Under an advantageous power purchase agreement with the state’s largest energy utility Pacific Gas & Electric, Topaz Solar Farm has locked in a deal that delivers about US60¢ a kilowatt hour for the power it puts into the grid.

    With the advent of more solar projects, the price offered for solar power has come down to about US30¢ a kilowatt hour, or about half of what Topaz receives. (The flip side is that the cost of building new solar farms has fallen dramatically in recent years due to new and cheaper technology.)…

    While the Topaz farm employed about 1000 jobs during construction, it only needs 15 staff now to monitor and replace broken panels. The low level of ongoing jobs on solar projects is one criticism raised by fossil fuel proponents, but the low maintenance and operational costs are an upside compared with traditional fuel sources…

    Mr Hood, who has helped BHE Renewable deliver projects across the US including 1 megawatt community solar units, said he was not fussed about losing the mantle of California as the world’s largest solar project.
    “We would love to expand because the solar resources here are perfect,” he said. “But the way it works it was so hard to permit this with the county, it would be a nightmare to go back and try and build more.”…
    http://www.afr.com/business/warren-buffets-bhe-renewables-sets-the-standard-for-utility-solar-20170729-gxld60

    20

  • #
    Will Janoschka

    Pleeze give more red stars. I am still trying to outdo Kristian, who pays for red stars! :-)

    32

  • #
    RB.

    Plants may be doing their part to fight climate change. According to a study published in the science journal Nature Communications, land-based vegetation has boosted its carbon dioxide absorption by 17 percent compared to 30 years ago.

    A quick calculation gives me about 25 Gt of carbon more per year being taken up by land plants than 30 years ago. Remember that Gaia can’t cope with the extra 9 Gt of emissions from humans, emissions have remained the same for a few years while the rate of CO2 increase has never been higher.

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    pat

    30 Jul: Courier Mail: John McCarthy: Adani chief about to splurge $400m as megamine gains pace
    Adani Australia chief executive Jeyakumar Janakaraj told The Sunday Mail the project would go ahead and would get financing of about $3.1 billion.
    Queenslanders will start to see a significant build-up of work over the next few months, and Mr Janakaraj challenged anyone who thought they could stop the company to look at what it had overcome to get to this point.
    The major mine construction contract has gone to Downer Group, and Austeel will build the rail line sleepers. AECOM will design the railway, and the steel will come from Whyalla.
    Next in line will be the site of the fly-in fly-out hub in either Townsville or Rockhampton and the development of the mine’s airport and camp…

    Adani will soon announce a construction deadline, and sitting in the company’s office is a clock ticking down the seconds until the first coal will be shipped on March 11, 2020…
    The Brisbane-based company has withstood a brutal campaign from activists over seven years but Mr Janakaraj said the company had overcome all of the hurdles thrown at it.
    “If someone thinks they can stop us, let them see our track record,’’ he said.
    “A few years back people were saying there was a structural shift (decline) in coal.
    “Where are those people today? Coal is over $US100 a tonne. I want to see those faces.
    “Everyone laughed at me. They said look at the price point, look at the costs and I have said this many times: we are not bothered by price.’’

    “Everyone said we would not get our approvals. We passed that stage. Then everyone said they would stop us in court, and we passed that.
    “Everyone said these guys won’t get government support, and we got that from both sides of government. Everyone said these guys won’t get board approval, we got that.
    “Everyone said coal is the past, coal is dead, but look now, coal is here for the foreseeable future.
    “Now everyone says these power plants are not economically viable. Why are they fighting us on economics?
    “Look at our track record.
    “I have never had a doubt about this project. This is my fifth greenfield project.’’

    Mr Janakaraj said he understood the activists opposing the project were doing their job but their business model was destroying jobs.
    “They want to stop the Galilee today and the Hunter (Valley) tomorrow, and they want to work on every other industry sector the day after tomorrow.

    “Someone else is making money by stopping jobs in our backyard. This is what the Australian people have to understand. It is not about Adani or the Great Barrier Reef.
    “In the name of coal, people are actually stopping Australia developing.
    “It is their business model versus the Australian economy and its business model and our business model. It is something that is extremely not correct.’’

    Mr Janakaraj said claims that the Federal Government was going to lend the project $1 billion through the Northern Australia Infrastructure Facility were misleading. “People are throwing around $1 billion. It’s really wrong,’’ he said.
    “Even I don’t know the number. It could be anything. OK, someone has put that number, but the $1 billion is not ours. We don’t know where it came from.’’
    He said any funds from the NAIF would be “gap funding’’ that would be used to supplement debt raised in other areas.
    He said the decision by Glencore to buy a $1.1 billion stake in Yancoal’s newly acquired NSW assets showed there was money for coal projects.
    “There is money there always,’’ he said…

    “This is the starting point for a huge opportunity for these two countries to take it beyond the Commonwealth and cricket and maybe curry,’’ he said.
    “Our picture of energy solution is much, much bigger than Carmichael. We want to be the starting point for Australia-India relations…
    http://www.couriermail.com.au/business/adani-chief-about-to-splurge-400m-as-megamine-gains-pace/news-story/33581d471eddb470a9ad025ae45ff422

    30 Jul: SMH: Sean Nichols: NSW Labor backs new renewable energy corporation with Snowy Hydro funds
    Opposition resources and energy spokesman Adam Searle says he “can’t see a circumstance” where a NSW Labor government would subsidise new coal or other fossil fuel projects such as the proposed $1 billion federal loan for the controversial Adani mine in Queensland…

    The (NSW Renewable Energy Futures) corporation, to be funded by the sale of NSW’s share of the Snowy Hydro to the federal government and green bonds would “build, invest, own, and operate large-scale renewable energy and storage technologies, whilst modernising the grid”.
    The motion says the corporation “will maximise the speed and efficiency of the energy transition, ***reduce prices for consumers, maximise job opportunities in the future economy for regional NSW, and deliver dividends for the people of NSW in a shared and decentralised energy future”.

    It also commits Labor to maintaining its support for Federal Labor’s objective of 50 per cent energy generation and consumption from renewables by 2030…
    The measures would be included in a new Climate Change Act.
    The motions passed following negotiations with the Construction, Forestry, Mining and Energy Union and the Australian Workers Union…
    http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/labor-backs-new-renewable-energy-corporation-with-snowy-hydro-funds-20170730-gxlsq5.html

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    Isn’t just a little odd that you set yourself a task that at the outset may seem a little complex, but doable, and then you find so much more than you bargained for at the outset.

    I wondered about this Base Load thing, and how to get the message across, and settled on the idea of what I thought might be a shortish weekly post detailing the data, just a collection of facts, with some sort of history, so, instead of showing one point in time for one time, I could show data for weeks, growing into an even longer time frame.

    At the start, it took time, but now I can do that daily data collection is around half an hour.

    The odd thing I mentioned above is how many new things I have learned. Sometimes, you get locked into thinking you have a good handle on things, and that is what assisted me in what I was doing, knowing what that data indicated, rather than just looking at it and saying Yeah! ….. but!

    One little newly learned fact leads to questions, and then another fact opens up, and you realise that while the basics were there all along, the detail was really interesting.

    Let me show you the cheapest wholesale power in Australia, and then tell you why, and where I say wholesale, that’s the generated electrical power that the retailers then purchase and then onsell to consumers.

    Go to this link, and this is the rolling AEMO page for Price and Demand (demand being actual consumption.)

    The default is NSW, and the data I want to show you is for Queensland, so at the top left, click on the Qld tab.

    When the page opens, hover your mouse over the low point there, and that is ‘around’ 4AM.

    The lighter coloured line is consumed power and the dark solid line is the cost per MWH.

    Note the cost here and that’s around $60/MWH. When you look at the cost you pay per unit on your power bill of cents/KWH, up and beyond 30 cents/KWH, then that wholesale cost of $60/MWH is the same as 6 cents/KWH, so a markup of five times above wholesale.

    Okay, that Qld total is the cheapest in Australia.

    When you check every other State, you’ll see the same thing. The cost is cheapest at that 4AM point in time.

    At that 4AM point in time, Australia wide, when consumption is at its absolute daily lowest point, still 18000MW plus, 80% plus of all that power is being supplied from coal fired sources, so it stands to reason that coal fired power is the cheapest power in the Country.

    Back to Queensland. At that 4AM time, Queensland consistently, every day so far (except for one day) of the near five weeks I have been watching and recording the data on a daily basis, Queensland coal fired power plants have been generating more than that Qld daily low point, and that is because Queensland is supplying power via the Interconnectors, two of them into Northern NSW.

    At that 4AM time, every day, only three small natural gas fired plants are in operation, and they feed power to outback and Northern areas not close enough to get access to that coal fired power. Those gas plants are generating 300MW, and that comes in at 4.5% only of the QLD consumption.

    So, 96% of the power in Qld and Northern NSW is supplied from coal fired power. Back to the cost for Qld, the cheapest in Australia.

    Qld also has the only modern SuperCritical plants in Australia, four of them, Kogan Creek, Milmerran, Callide C and Tarong North, and those plants are just one level of technology lower than the HELE USC plants.

    So, even with those new tech coal fired plants, Qld still has the cheapest wholesale power in the Country.

    Don’t let anyone tell you that modern coal fired power is more expensive than renewables or any other form of power generation.

    Qld has no renewables, just the youngest coal fired fleet in the Country, and also the cheapest wholesale power as well.

    It’s funny that, isn’t it.

    Real data always says something other than what those costing ….. models indicate.

    Who would have thought?

    Tony.

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    pat

    28 Jul: Reuters: U.S. coal exports soar, in boost to Trump energy agenda, data shows
    by Timothy Gardner and Nina Chestney
    U.S. coal exports have jumped more than 60 percent this year due to soaring demand from Europe and Asia, according to a Reuters review of government data, allowing President Donald Trump’s administration to claim that efforts to revive the battered industry are working…

    The previously unpublished figures provided to Reuters by the U.S. Energy Information Administration showed exports of the fuel from January through May totaled 36.79 million tons, up 60.3 percent from 22.94 million tons in the same period in 2016…

    They included a surge to several European countries during the 2017 period, including a 175 percent increase in shipments to the United Kingdom, and a doubling to France – which had suffered a series of nuclear power plant outages that required it and regional neighbors to rely more heavily on coal.
    “If Europe wants to lecture Trump on climate then EU member states need transition plans to phase out polluting coal,” said Laurence Watson, a data scientist working on coal at independent think tank Carbon Tracker Initiative in London.

    Nicole Bockstaller, a spokeswoman at the EU Commission’s Energy and Climate Action department, said that the EU’s coal imports have generally been on a downward trend since 2006, albeit with seasonable variations like high demand during cold snaps in the winter…

    Overall exports to European nations totaled 16 million tons in the first five months of this year, up from 10.5 million in the same period last year, according to the figures. Exports to Asia meanwhile, totaled 12.3 million tons, compared to 6.2 million tons in the year-earlier period…

    “Simply to know that coal no longer has to fight the government – that has to have some effect on investment decisions and in the outlook by companies, producers and utilities that use coal,” said Luke Popovich, a spokesman for the National Mining Association.

    Shaylyn Hynes, a spokeswoman at the U.S. Energy Department, said: “These numbers clearly show that the Trump Administration’s policies are helping to revive an industry that was the target of costly and job killing overregulation from Washington for far too long.” …
    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-coal-exports-idUSKBN1AD0DU

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    pat

    ***note the Aussie angle:

    30 Jul: Stuff.co.nz: Susan Edmunds: Solar battery packs may have to be stored outside under proposed new rules
    Consultation is open on the standard, which would ban lithium ion batteries inside a dwelling, under the eaves of a house or within a metre of it. Installed beyond that distance, the batteries would have to be in a fireproof enclosure…
    But Allan Miller, former director of the Electric Power Engineering Centre, at the University of Canterbury, said the batteries could be a potential fire hazard…
    However, there are believed to be no known house fires caused by home-installed lithium ion batteries.

    Putting them outside in a purpose-built enclosure would add at least $1000 to the cost of installation, he said.
    “The irony is that you can drive into the garage with your electric vehicle and most have a battery that’s three times the size of the Tesla Powerwall. And you can drive into a garage with a 60L tank of petrol.”
    The standard would not apply retrospectively, so any installations before it came into force would be allowed to remain.

    Solar installer Phil Rumble said the idea was “madness”. “Why don’t they move gas cookers outside?”
    He is installing Tesla batteries in Auckland and said about 65 per cent were inside the house. The rest were either bolted on to the outside of houses or put on a concrete plinth next to the house…
    “If you stick to good quality you won’t have any issues. If you allow crap into the country then you’ll have issues. They shouldn’t be installed if they’re not good enough to not catch fire.”
    Tesla said it had no comment on the standard…

    ***A Ministry of Business, Innovation and Employment spokeswoman said ***Standards Australia was responsible for managing the development of the standard.

    “Standards New Zealand does not comment on the content of draft standards, given that our role is to manage the process of development, and we therefore do not have the technical expertise to be able to comment on content issues. Please note that given that the standard is at draft stage, the content could change before being finalised.”
    She said the draft was open for comment until April 15.
    https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/money/95201430/Solar-battery-packs-may-have-to-be-stored-outside-under-proposed-new-rules

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    pat

    30 Jul: Chicago Tribune: At EPA museum, climate-change displays are out and coal may be on the way in
    by Juliet Eilperin and Brady Dennis, Washington Post
    A miniature museum that began as a pet project of former EPA administrator Gina McCarthy has come under scrutiny. It features the agency’s work over four and a half decades, with exhibits topics such as regulating carbon dioxide emissions and the Paris climate accord. The Obama administration championed such efforts, but President Donald Trump’s policies are at odds with them.
    Now the museum, which opened just days before President Barack Obama left office, is being reworked to reflect the priorities of the Trump administration, an effort that probably will mean erasing part of the agency’s history…

    Unlike other stark changes that have taken place at the EPA since Trump took office, the museum overhaul has not been primarily driven by political appointees. Rather, some of the same career staff members who worked on the exhibits under the Obama administration informed Trump appointees about the museum and the fact that parts of it were not in line with their vision.
    “I wanted to make sure that they knew it existed,” said Nancy Grantham, a career public affairs employee at EPA, who has toured the exhibit with at least one Trump official. “That’s just how I operate. I don’t like to be surprised, and I assume others don’t like to be, either.”…

    There is no question that parts of the museum reflect an Obama administration-centric narrative. It includes a panel dedicated to the 2009 “endangerment finding,” in which then-EPA Administrator Lisa Jackson concluded that the agency was legally obligated to control greenhouse gas emissions linked to climate change because they threatened public health. A separate panel features a Dr. Seuss cartoon-themed poster with the message, “Join the Lorax And Help Protect the Earth From Global Warming.”

    The Paris agreement, in which nearly 200 nations pledged to curb their carbon output in December 2015, also has a display panel, which notes that the “EPA is leading global efforts to address climate change.” In June, Trump announced plans to withdraw from the international agreement.
    The Clean Power Plan, Obama’s signature effort to regulate carbon emissions and combat climate change, also is prominently displayed…

    On a tour of the exhibit Thursday, a career official said that these climate displays are slated to be removed, adding that the agency may add a display of coal to the museum.
    Grantham acknowledged that the climate panels probably will be altered, and possibly shelved, although she stressed that no final decisions had been made. “It should be no surprise that there may be changes,” she said…

    In the meantime, to make sure the current administration is represented, EPA officials have installed a large poster board in the museum, highlighting the agency’s new “back to basics” agenda. It features a picture of Pruitt shaking hands with coal miners at a Pennsylvania mine and promises “sensible regulations for economic growth.”

    It’s unclear how much taxpayer money, if any, it will take to overhaul the EPA museum to reflect the views of the Trump administration…
    In the meantime, to make sure the current administration is represented, EPA officials have installed a large poster board in the museum, highlighting the agency’s new “back to basics” agenda. It features a picture of Pruitt shaking hands with coal miners at a Pennsylvania mine and promises “sensible regulations for economic growth.”
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/nationworld/ct-epa-museum-climate-change-20170730-story.html

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    Another Ian

    More on sea levels and satellites

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2017/07/30/putting-the-brakes-on-acceleration-2/#comment-2566600

    Plus Willis E on the supposed acceleration in the main thread

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