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Trump may pull US out of Paris agreement within two weeks

All over the US media today –  discussion over whether Trump will pull the US out of the Paris agreement. We all know the Paris agreement will not alter world temperature*, slow storms or stop floods but is potentially a trap for domestic legal action, it hurts the poor via high electricity bills, and reduces living standards (for those outside the $1.5 Trillion Green Industrial Complex). The free citizens around the world may score a big win soon. We hope.

*To put the impotence of Paris in perspective: if we use IPCC estimates, and all industrialized nations make a 100% reduction in CO2 emissions by 2100, we can only cool global temperatures by 0.35C — a third of one degree at most. That’s no oil, no gas, or coal, in a world powered by handmade nuclear reactors using mud bricks transported by horse and cart. ;-) And that assumes that the models are right despite them failing on regional, local, short term[1] [2], polar[3], major feedbacks [4] [5], humidity[6], rainfall[7], drought[8] and on clouds[9].

White House may pull out of Paris agreement due to legal implications

Timothy Cama, The Hill

Trump could announce as soon as next week his plans to pull out. The Huffington Post and New York Times reported on the developments earlier Tuesday.

Central to the administration’s debate is whether the U.S. could reduce its greenhouse gas-cutting commitment for the 2015 pact without running afoul of it.

The agreement states that a country “may at any time adjust its existing nationally determined contribution with a view to enhancing its level of ambition,” which sources say concerns the White House counsel’s office.

If Trump wanted to ratchet down former President Barack Obama’s promise of a 26 percent to 28 percent emissions cut by 2025, the agreement may prevent it.

The administration is also worried that staying in the accord would give environmentalists a legal argument to prevent Trump from repealing climate regulations like the Clean Power Plan.

Climate Deal Could Turn on a Single Phrase: 

John Swartz, NY Times

The provision at issue, Article 4.11, states that a nation “may at any time adjust its existing nationally determined contribution with a view to enhancing its level of ambition.”

Christopher C. Horner, a senior legal fellow at the Energy and Environment Legal Institute, said liberal state attorneys general and climate activists would inevitably sue over efforts to weaken the targets. “This will be most aggressive in the Ninth Circuit, which hopefully triggers some memories in the minds of administration lawyers,” he said, referring to the fight over the administration’s immigration plan, which has been stayed by the California-based federal appeals court.

“Despite the mad rush to insist that plain language means either the opposite of what it says, or else nothing at all, under any canon of construction, Article 4 does not permit revisions downward,” Mr. Horner said. “The language is deliberate and reads only one way: the way it was written and, as the context affirms, was plainly intended.”

The momentum has turned against the Paris agreement for Trump Whitehouse

Juliet Eilperin, Washington Post

Pruitt, who is spearheading the effort to rewrite several Obama-era rules aimed at curbing greenhouse gas emissions, has argued that exiting the agreement will make it easier to fend off the numerous legal lawsuits he will face in the months ahead.

At a rally with supporters Saturday, Trump said he would make a “big decision” on Paris within the next two weeks and vowed to end “a broken system of global plunder at American expense.”

Be very afraid — the big downside — “Pariah Status”:

“The Trump team seems oblivious to the fact that climate protection is now viewed by leading allies and nations around the world as a key measure of moral and diplomatic standing,” [Paul] Bledsoe said in an email. “The U.S. would be risking pariah status on the international stage by withdrawing from Paris, and even a fig leaf approach of technically staying in the agreement while ignoring most of its provisions would be better than pulling out altogether.”

Watch out. People might say things that are not nice about the USA.

The largest military power in the world and the second largest economy is hardly at risk of being “not included” or exiled from all the other decisions around the world that matter. As the largest contributor to the UN, if they did get excluded, the US would be freer. And if foreign aid was channeled direct instead of through a global bureaucracy, the poor may win too.

REFERENCES

[1] Anagnostopoulos, G. G., D. Koutsoyiannis, A. Christofides, A. Efstratiadis, and N. Mamassis, (2010). A comparison of local and aggregated climate model outputs with observed data’, Hydrological Sciences Journal, 55: 7, 1094 — 1110 [PDF]

[2] Koutsoyiannis, D., Efstratiadis, A., Mamassis, N. & Christofides, A.(2008) On the credibility of  climate predictions. Hydrol. Sci. J. 53(4), 671–684. changes [PDF]

[3] Previdi, M. and Polvani, L. M. (2014), Climate system response to stratospheric ozone depletion and recovery. Q.J.R. Meteorol. Soc.. doi: 10.1002/qj.233

[4] Christy J.R., Herman, B., Pielke, Sr., R, 3, Klotzbach, P., McNide, R.T., Hnilo J.J., Spencer R.W., Chase, T. and Douglass, D: (2010) What Do Observational Datasets Say about Modeled Tropospheric Temperature Trends since 1979? Remote Sensing 2010, 2, 2148-2169; doi:10.3390/rs2092148 [PDF]

[5] Fu, Q, Manabe, S., and Johanson, C. (2011) On the warming in the tropical upper troposphere: Models vs observations, Geophysical Research Letters, Vol. 38, L15704, doi:10.1029/2011GL048101, 2011 [PDF] [Discussion]

[6] Paltridge, G., Arking, A., Pook, M., 2009. Trends in middle- and upper-level tropospheric humidity from NCEP reanalysis data. Theoretical and Applied Climatology, Volume 98, Numbers 3-4, pp. 351-35). [PDF]

[7] See 10 Anagnostopolous 2010

[8] Sheffield, Wood & Roderick (2012) Little change in global drought over the past 60 years, Letter Nature, vol 491, 437

[9] Miller, M., Ghate, V., Zahn, R., (2012) The Radiation Budget of the West African Sahel 1 and its Controls: A Perspective from 2 Observations and Global Climate Models. in press Journal of Climate [abstract] [PDF]

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262 comments to Trump may pull US out of Paris agreement within two weeks

  • #
    TdeF

    “The largest military power in the world and the second largest economy” China?
    GDP
    US 19,417
    China 11,795
    Japan 4,841
    Germany 3,423
    UK 2,496
    India 2,454
    France 2,420
    Brazil 2,140
    Italy 1,807
    Canada 1,600
    Russia 1,560
    Korea 1,498
    Austral 1,359

    222

  • #
    TdeF

    Besides, after thirty years, 250,000 windmills, Green energy, wood pellets, biofuels, energy savings, electric cars when all the talk about the environment,crises, storms, tipping points is boiled down, there is only one issue. CO2.

    Where is there any evidence at all of a change to CO2? Could it be that CO2 is not determined by human emissions but by ocean temperature? Is there in fact any evidence that CO2 is harmful in any way or that islands or cities are drowning or any other of the predictions of doom? No.

    894

  • #
    James Murphy

    Science is conspicuous by its absence yet again. As usual the fanatics have nothing but a weak comment about “moral and diplomatic standing”.

    It’s depressing to see how many people fail to think about the language used by the climate change fanatics, especially when they can spend hours debating the semantics of a tweet by Trump.

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    • #
      Gerry, England

      It is not about science but about presentation. The warmists are very slick media con men that dazzle the audience with Climate Science Fiction. To win the war we need to get some media training for our side so that the poor interview that Scott Pruitt gave becomes a thing of the past. Myron Ebell did very well batting away questions at his recent GWPF presentation.

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      • #
        Environment Skeptic

        “Other Crop Losses Globally Due to Cold & Mini Ice Age Climate Intensification (360)”
        https://www.sott.net/article/349918-Other-crop-losses-across-the-world-due-to-cold-Mini-Ice-Age-climate-intensification

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        • #
          PeterPetrum

          But, but, but – that’s climate change, isn’t it. No mater what, it must be our fault.

          50

          • #
            Environment Skeptic

            “Thousands of cattle killed by spring snow storm in Colorado”
            “Farmers and ranchers in Baca and Prowers counties have lost cattle and countless crops due to the spring snow. The Colorado Farm bureau estimates the cattle deaths are into the thousands.

            “Everybody is still out just trying to take care of what is alive,” said farmer Gary Melcher. “They haven’t had a chance to really analyze what the true loss is yet.”

            Even though the storm has passed ranchers are still trying to find animals that are still alive. Many of them were lost after fences collapsed under the weight of snow. Some of them are stuck, barely able to move through all that snow. ”

            https://www.sott.net/article/349987-Thousands-of-cattle-killed-by-spring-snow-storm-in-Colorado

            50

            • #
              Environment Skeptic

              Other Crop Losses Globally Due to Cold & Mini Ice Age Climate Intensification (360)”
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=boF5u2SkBt8

              40

              • #
                el gordo

                Good catch ES, the AO index continues negative which is a sure sign of a cool wet summer in Europe.

                http://www.cpc.ncep.noaa.gov/products/precip/CWlink/daily_ao_index/ao_index.html

                50

              • #
                Environment Skeptic

                From: http://m.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=11848011
                “It’s the question on every New Zealander’s lips today.

                How will Aucklanders survive a polar blast that will see temperatures in the country’s biggest city tonight dip into single figures?

                It’s enough to launch a thousand social media hash tags, with #prayforus being the one touted most loudly around NZME HQ’s newsroom.

                Yes, yes, Christchurch might be headed for zero overnight and Hamilton 1C. You have our sympathy.

                But surely the real story is that Aucklanders are expecting a minimum of 6C? Hey, that’s literally not freezing!

                Remember, you read it here first: stock up this arvo on everything you need to make soy flat lattes and smashed avos n toast, because it’ll be chilly outside in Auckland tomorrow.”

                90

              • #
                Environment Skeptic

                “Darwin weather: Territorians experience coldest April temperature since 1968″
                The maximum temperature recorded to 9am this morning was 21.9C at 8:58am, making it the lowest maximum daily temperature for the Wet Season recorded in Darwin and the third lowest on record for any month.

                The average daytime temperature in Darwin for April is 32.7C.
                http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-04-12/darwin-weather-april-coldest-day-since-1968/8436068

                40

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              • #
                el gordo

                ‘Coldest temperature on record: -25.6C – Ranfurly, Otago, July 17, 1903.’

                Its probably just a coincidence, but it was during a Gleissberg Minimum.

                40

              • #
                sophocles

                Environment Skeptic asked:

                How will Aucklanders survive a polar blast that will see temperatures in the country’s biggest city tonight dip into single figures?

                Ah, Journos are just a big bunch of cry-baby WIMPs.

                Aucklanders will survive just as well as we survived the one back in 1976. That was when it was truly cooling and had been since 1950, with the Press all whimpering in chorus about a new incoming fresh glaciation, except they called it “an Ice Age.” Well, the Ice Age is now imminent … let’s hear them weep and cry.

                It 1976, it snowed in Auckland. And Wellington. I flew there from Auckland that afternoon. The next day, the sun came out.
                It was cool, about as fresh as a normal frost. But it was sunny.

                It will be just the same this time although it may not be quite so cold. We’ll just roll another log onto the fire, turn up the thermostat, fill the coal bucket or adjust whatever we have, just as we did then.

                It will be easier to survive this time. Auckland is supplied with Real Electricity not propellor powered unicorn farts, fairy dust, and other stuff. And far more Auckland homes are now double-glazed and fully insulated than before. Back then, it was: “Eh? Insulation? Wozzat?

                It’s going to be a fun winter.

                To think the whole sad saga of CAGW started with a bunch of bureaucrats in the UN deciding the climate was influenced unduly by the combustion of fossil fuels.
                That’s it. No science, no research, just a committee “feeling.”

                The IPCC was formed to prove the assumption.
                After 26 years, it’s failed. But the propaganda has a firmly implanted fish-hook, darn it.

                60

              • #
                sophocles

                Single digit temperatures are quite common in Auckland. They’re nothing unusual during winter. Sub-zero temperatures are not quite as common but are common enough to be a so what? phenomenon. We’re going into winter now. That’s next month. May gives us a feel for what’s coming so we can get prepared for it.

                I’ve just loaded my car with a bunch of ‘retired’ old worn towels to dry off and clean the front and rear screens and the wing mirrors. The hose has been checked and adjusted so that frost (light ice) can be washed off the car when needed. I do this every winter.

                At least I don’t have to change from summer tyres to winter tyres.

                40

    • #
      clive

      There is an old saying.”Sticks and stones may break my bones,but names will never hurt me”

      10

  • #
    PeterS

    I like the way many have signed the agreement with what amounts to escape clauses. For example India has declared:
    “The Government of India declares its understanding that, as per its national laws; keeping in view its development agenda, particularly the eradication of poverty and provision of basic needs for all its citizens, coupled with its commitment to following the low carbon path to progress, and on the assumption of unencumbered availability of cleaner sources of energy and technologies and financial resources from around the world; and based on a fair and ambitious assessment of global commitment to combating climate change, it is ratifying the Paris Agreement.”

    In other words, India will continue to rely heavily on coal to expand their electricity generation system while using more and more renewables. At the end pf the day they are expanding both. In fact they are increasing their reliance on coal in absolute terms at a remarkable rate. They have under various stages of construction a total of 50,025 MW of new coal based power projects coming on line 2017 – 22. That’s the equivalent of over 30 Hazelwoods! http://www.cea.nic.in/reports/committee/nep/nep_dec.pdf

    Trump is doing the right thing if he gets out of the useless Paris agreement. We should too but of course both major parties refuse even to contemplate doing so. Worse still they both have decided to treat the idea of building new coal fired power stations as about the worst thing we could do to the planet, despite the fact many hundreds are being built elsewhere. Stupid is as stupid does (or does not in this case).

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    • #
      Peter C

      I wish we would also pull out!

      But as you say both of the major parties and nearly all of the minor parities (Greens, Xenophon) are in favour. Cory Bernadi and Family First have not declared themselves as far as I know. Same with Hanson (although Malcolm Roberts would surely tell her that we must get out). Katters would probably agree to leave.

      160

      • #
        PeterS

        It would be nice to see Trump pull out of the Paris agreement and others start to follow by the time we get to the next federal election here. It will be very revealing as to which party if any will make a pullout here one of their promises. It should destroy both major parties if another one makes that promise, but then again I often give Australia voters too much credit. At least we ought to have a hung parliament with say One Nation holding the balance and demanding as one of the conditions to form government we pull out of the Paris agreement. Time will tell of course.

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        • #
          • #
            PeterS

            Hit a paywall yet again so can’t read it. In any case yes ACP is on my “to consider for voting” list. The LNP and ALP as they stand are definitely off the list. Why anyone would voting for either is beyond comprehension unless of course one is brain dead.

            81

            • #
              • #
                el gordo

                Thanx clipe.

                20

              • #
                Albert

                Having third world countries who bludge of us blaming us for their weather is an insult to intelligence. It has to stop

                100

              • #
                PeterS

                Yes but what is worse is voters blindly voting the same parties over and over and expecting a different result. By definition that’s insanity. We get the government we deserve.

                60

              • #
                CharlesM

                @PeterS We have no real choice in a two-party system. Voting for the Progressive Left Democratic Party is dangerous (insane is too strong). The only realistic option is to support Trump’s initiatives, and then try to vote in more Tea Party-style Republicans into the House and the Senate. But the Left will continue to dominate the MSM, the Courts and education. These swamps cannot be drained by fiat, only by patience.

                51

              • #
                PeterS

                CharlesM I hope you are right but I’m afraid history says otherwise.

                20

            • #
              el gordo

              ‘Australia will need to review its participation in the Paris agreement on climate change if Donald Trump follows through with his threat to withdraw from the treaty, according to the chair of the Turnbull government’s backbench committee on environment and energy.

              ‘Craig Kelly told Guardian Australia on Wednesday he’d predicted immediately after Trump’s election that the Paris climate deal was “cactus” and he stood by that assessment.’

              Guardian

              91

            • #
              Angry

              The National party has also betrayed Australia and are off my voting list also.

              40

          • #
            Ted O'Brien.

            “The loopy left are intent on shutting down the most reliable and cost effective method of generating power that gives our nation a competitive advantage — coal fired power stations,” (Senator Bernardi in that article in The Oz Dec 7 2016.)

            For those of that “loopy left”, the Cold War of 1945-1990 is very much still on. Their objective is to disable industry in democratic nations to make them unable to defend themselves against any kind of aggression.

            60

        • #
          sophocles

          Two or three rough winters in a row might help. If it’s cold then it isn’t warming and that might just penetrate a few skulls.

          40

    • #

      From the buzz leaking out to reporters, it appears the administration is paying attention to an important point in the post above, namely that the Paris accord facilitates a domestic litigation trap. Already there have been lawsuits filed against several jurisdictions who enacted emission reductions in the spirit of signalling virtue. So in Massachusetts, and also in the UK, once there is a legal requirement stating emission levels, the uncertainties of climate science are beside the point: the lobster is in the trap.
      WH counsel advises that the US could face domestic litigation if it stays in Paris Accord, but revises its commitments downward. That is giving momentum to those wanting to end US participation.

      120

      • #
        Oliver K. Manuel

        I agree that the US government needs to

        1. Withdraw from the Paris agreement as soon as possible, and

        2. Tell the US NAS to stop using budget review of federal research programs to direct US research funds to support the UN’s Agenda 21.

        130

      • #
        Oliver K. Manuel

        This truth is now self-evident: National governments and national academies of sciences work together to hide the power that determines human destiny, just as the Catholic Church did when Copernicus first reported Earth moves in orbit around the Sun in 1543.

        http://www.omatumr.com/Photographs/Suns_core.htm

        40

  • #
    pat

    fingers crossed.
    Trump needs a BIG win at the moment because the leftover 2017 Obama budget gave little to those who wanted to see his campaign promises included.
    nothing could be BIGGER – for all but the miniscule number of CAGW zealots in the world – than pulling out of “Paris”.

    imagine how all those CAGW fanatics in the MSM will be LOST if “Paris” falls apart. they should be the first to go at Fairfax…and they should be cleaned out of the ABC:

    3 May: ABC: Fairfax Media staff to strike after 125 more jobs axed under major restructure plan
    By business reporter Stephen Letts
    Staff at the Sydney Morning Herald and The Age in Melbourne have voted to walk off the job for a week following Fairfax Media’s announcement that it will cut 125 editorial jobs — roughly a quarter of its newsroom — as part of $30-million restructure…
    Staff have been given a deadline of next Tuesday, May 9, to nominate for a voluntary redundancy…

    Fairfax will also cap rates offered to freelance contributors and slash payments to casuals, aimed at cutting $3 million from the budget…
    Fairfax announced a massive full-year loss in 2016, after writing down the value of its mastheads and plant by $1 billion.
    The loss also included more than $60 million for a round of at least 120 redundancies made during the year…

    Fairfax received more bad news this morning with the New Zealand competition regulators knocking back the planned merger with New Zealand’s biggest media player NZME, publisher of the New Zealand Herald…
    Key points:
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-03/fairfax-media-cut-further-125-editorial-staff-in-restructure/8492738

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  • #
    Dave in the States

    Today I passed within ear shot of a TV while going about my daily activities. I heard a few political pundits pining for a significant increase in the federal transportation fuel taxes. I heard one guy say: “Now is the time to sneak it in there while the prices are still low.” A lady answered that it would bring in much needed revenue. They don’t really care about the climate, poor people, morality or the science. They just want all that money! And the power that comes with it. And the religion of the AGW/global governance agenda.

    These forces are what Trump is up against.

    282

    • #
      John F. Hultquist

      Dave in the States,
      The Great State of Washington did pass a gasoline tax (in 2 stages). Citizens were aware the cost of materials, equipment, and wages had gone up while the State’s ability to fix highways had gone down. Do note this was a state tax and not a new source of federal money. The Feds have a problem of leakage, or have had. I’d not want a higher federal tax until wording was included that directed the money to highway projects.

      The green blob wanted the Washington proposal to fail because it did not direct enough of the new money to their favorite projects, such as bike lanes, transit projects, and so on.

      81

    • #
      PeterS

      These forces are what Trump is up against.

      Indeed. That’s why I doubt very much he will succeed in the end, unfortunately. Socialism under various guises is rampant in the Western world like a deadly cancer that’s gone too far for the doctors to try and save the patient.

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      • #
        OriginalSteve

        My uncle escaped from communism in Hungary. Young adults pre voting age need to be schooled by parents on the dangers of green communism, and communism/socialism in general.

        Kids also need to be told its ok to question authority – if those in authority have a legitimate reason for what they do, fine, if its punative or unbalanced then expect a fight by the citizens. They say you cant fight city hall, i disagree, you can run a campaign of constant irritation to the point where you force their hand. Kids also need to understand Civics, namely the need to be involved in civic matters, to hold local councils or govt acocuntable for what they do, and to let them know they will be bounced if they throw their weight around.

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        • #
          Dave in the States

          Kids also need to be told its ok to question authority –

          Schools, especially government schools, are a culture of conformity. It starts in kindergarten and carries through all the way to the PHD level. Not only are the students expected to conform to prescribed modes of thinking and behavior, but so are the teachers and the professors,…….. and scientists.

          60

          • #
            Angry

            Children need to be taught HOW to think instead of WHAT to think…

            50

            • #
              PeterS

              In other words critical thinking is much harder to teach than propaganda. Besides the socialists are in control of the education system and they don’t want the children to think at all – just obey orders.

              60

              • #
                Ted O'Brien.

                Here’s a run of people all wrong at once. Don’t you have any kids and grandkids?

                An awful lot of kids have been taught to despise authority. Some of this comes from the education system, but some also comes from the cartoons that kids watch while parents are getting breakfast or whatever. e.g. a recurring story where the heroine is a teenage girl, the villain is her father the businessman, and she saves the world by thwarting his business plans.

                I confess that I didn’t do enough to stop it from happening. And I am paying the consequences in seeing people less happy than I would like them to be.

                And I shudder to think what computer games might be leading them to. A dreadful waste of time for a start.

                20

        • #

          «As someone who lived under communism for most of my life I feel obliged to say that the biggest threat to freedom, democracy, the market economy and prosperity at the beginning of the 21st century is not communism or its various softer variants. Communism was replaced by the threat of ambitious environmentalism.»
          - Vaclav Klaus

          92

  • #
    Dennis

    But wont children be frightened by the truth when they are told that their teachers cannot be trusted?

    230

    • #
      Albert

      The poor kids may now believe Santa is just a fiction. I feel sorry for the ones that knew AGW was a myth but still had to preach it

      50

    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      Don’t cuss the teachers. Cuss the teachers’ teachers, the academies and the whole system. Don’t hold back.

      Nearly 30 years ago our daughter was told in Year 8 Geography class that in Australia the farmers had destroyed all the cultivation land. She objected.

      Her teacher wasn’t a fool, he wasn’t a crank. He was teaching what he had been taught to teach. By pointing out a few home truths she was able to carry the day, that this statement was not true. But in at least 95% of the classrooms in Australia that would have gone unchallenged.

      This slander had a purpose. Farming was, and maybe still is but won’t be for much longer, the last sector of the Australian economy still dominated by small business capitalism. The purpose of this institutional slander is to convince a majority of the population that farmers are not to be trusted with land ownership or business ownership. To gain support for the abolition of property rights. Even the current housing affordability crisis for non home owners is developing support for abolition, as increasing numbers of people see themselves as being shut out.

      I would say that Trump is our last hope to head this campaign off. But he can’t do it on his own. However if he does pull out of the Paris accord, that should greatly improve our chances of getting the RET shut down for a start.

      71

  • #
    Geoffrey Williams

    If Trump pulls out of ‘Paris’ it will be a huge ‘line in the sand’ for America and the climate debate around the world. Others will follow for sure. He has the public support and the mandate to carry this out. His political future may rest on it. If he does go ahead his opponents will be marching in the snow again! Should be interesting.
    GeoffW

    330

    • #
      el gordo

      Turnbull (pseudo Marxist) says he won’t follow Trump and pull out of the Paris Agreement.

      40

      • #
        Raven

        Trump should have made Malcolm pull out of the Paris agreement as a condition of taking those Syrian refugees.

        That’d give him something to think about. ;)

        30

  • #
    Lance Wallace

    Best option for Trump would be to submit the Agreement to the Senate for ratification. That was how the Kyoto Protocol was treated. The Senate passed the Byrd-Hagel resolution 95-0. That said that any treaty requiring no reductions by developing nations but having a possible deleterious effect on the US economy could be ratified. Guess what? The Paris Agreement meets both those conditions. Just as Kyoto died the day this resolution was adopted, the Paris Agreement would die if submitted to the Senate for ratification. Not all the future Presidents would be able to put it back together again. If he just leaves, it might come up for consideration again in 4 or 8 years. However, I can see the argument for just leaving–he needs a big victory and that would be one he could win instantly.

    230

    • #

      Lance brings up something here that a lot of people forgot in their rush to blame Republicans for all the climate change problems.

      President George W Bush got the blame for not ratifying the Kyoto Protocol with that vital second signature, and that second signature would effectively bind the U.S. to compliance. The media vilified him relentlessly for not signing.

      The original Kyoto Protocol was presented to the U.S. during the Clinton presidency. Billyjeff looked to his Veep, former Senator Al Gore, and asked him to take it up to The Senate, where all his friends were, and they would go along with Big Al, and sign up like all good buddies do.

      Then, along comes Byrd Hagel, and that was passed 95-0. people say that the Clinton Senate was troubled with a Republican Majority, hence it was always going to be problematic to get it up. However, at 95-0, not even ONE Democrat would agree, and Kyoto was sunk without trace, under the Clinton Administration, nothing at all to do with Dubya.

      Seemingly forgotten with the media Democrat sycophants.

      The original Kyoto Protocol saw 192 Countries bound to it. Of those, only 23 Countries were actually required to do anything, reduce their CO2 emissions to a level 5% lower than they were in 1992, except for the U.S. and their target was set at 7%. Those 23 Countries had to pay their own way to reduce emissions, promise not to construct ANY new coal fired power plants, pay for their own renewables, and, on top of that pay 2.3% of their GDP into a fund to help those remaining 169 Countries lower their emissions and everything else associated with that, and for the installation of renewable power in those Countries.

      As to the remaining 169 Countries, China and India included, the ONLY thing they had to do was to report their emissions. They could do whatever they wanted.

      That’s why Byrd-Hagel got passed, because those 169 Countries had to do nothing at all, except rake in the money, with the U.S. far and away the hugest contributor. That’s why it failed in the U.S.

      Kevin Rudd, in a flourish of popping camera bulbs signed Australia up to Kyoto at the Bali Climate Conference in 2007.

      Tony.

      391

      • #
        Environment Skeptic

        All they need to do is follow China and convert the military apparatus over to more energy efficient unmanned drone technology and everyone’s greenhouse targets would be met.
        http://www.marketwatch.com/story/chinese-military-drones-rival-the-best-of-the-us-2016-12-01

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          Environment Skeptic

          Maybe drones could target greenhouses and problem solved??

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            Will Janoschka

            That is good. Why not stop building Greenhouses. That seems the only claimed source of increasing temperature. :-)

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            Angry

            Mindless drones are the only ones that believe this global warming BS !

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        clive

        “Little Johnny Howard”kicked this”Climate Change”off,with taking away our guns because of the Port Arthur massacre.He needed to take away our guns before he introduced his new legislation,in case”WE the People”objected.He also introduced new land clearing laws,all at the behest of the UN.Then he snuck in an ETS before he got the boot,which helped Julia Gillard to bring in a “Carbon Tax”which Abbott got rid of,but Turdbull snuck it back in,at the last sitting in December.Pity he didn’t bother asking,or telling us about it.

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    • #
      AndyG55

      “Best option for Trump would be to submit the Agreement to the Senate for ratification.”

      Problem is that there could possibly be enough RINO’s and left-wing Republican AGW SUCKophants that it might pass. !!

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  • #
    John F. Hultquist

    Note that the Trump gang jumped on the travel ban without sufficient consideration of the regulations, laws, and courts.
    The Nation was set up with check & balances and the ill-thought-out travel ban was like a small car hitting a concrete wall.
    If similarly little thought is given to pulling the US out of the Paris agreement, the action will be similarly stalled.
    Let’s hope the delay is to make sure the outcome is better.
    Perhaps, Trump will declare it a “treaty”, send it to the US Senate, and have it voted down. That would make a clear statement, and likely it would not come back.

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      TdeF

      The First Amendment Freedom of religion was the problem allowing judges to interfere with a travel ban which seems to target countries simply because of religion. Constitutional law cannot interfere with the Paris ‘agreement’ which is probably improper as a treaty not ratified by Congress and therefore not binding anyway. Removing any connection with Paris would remove the idea that the US was party to the whole climate scam.

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      Peter C

      Perhaps, Trump will declare it a “treaty”, send it to the US Senate, and have it voted down

      Well I hope he counts the Senate votes before he does that.

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  • #
    pat

    Countries which exert control over most of their industries don’t want Western industries- or NGOs which CAGW zealots believe are tainted by money from “big polluters” – to be represented at “climate talks”!

    30 Apr: Financial Times: Pilita Clark: Nations push to curb business influence at UN climate talks
    Countries including China and India call for tighter rules to avoid conflicts of interest
    Climate talks restart in Germany this month for the first time since the inauguration of US president Donald Trump…
    A group known as the Like Minded Developing Countries has expressed concern about the “undue influence” of large companies at such talks. In a submission ***(LINK) to the meeting this month, the group, which includes India and China, says more rules are needed on potential conflicts of interest for businesses whose concerns clash with the Paris accord’s aim to curb climate-warming fossil fuel emissions.
    ..

    It adds that such conflicts have been taken more seriously in other UN negotiations, such as those on a global tobacco control treaty that has guidelines on protecting public health policies from the “vested interests of the tobacco industry”.Mr Schuldt conceded that cigarette companies differed from oil or coal producers, which are a backbone of economic activity, and his negotiating group did not believe those sectors’ representatives should be banned from climate talks…

    The Paris accord, which came after more than 20 years of UN talks, requires countries to come up with plans to slow the pace of climate change. A slew of rules governing its operation are still to be negotiated at conferences such as the one this month in Bonn, which is set to start on May 8

    Industry bodies that aggressively back fossil fuels are expected to face close scrutiny at a special meeting in Bonn on the participation of non-government groups.

    Many business associations at the meetings are funded by big polluters, according to a new report by the US-based Corporate Accountability International group, which has long campaigned against industry influence at climate talks.
    ..

    One of the groups the analysis mentions, BusinessEurope, has also made a submission (LINK) to the Bonn climate meeting. However, it argues that the Paris agreement requires more business participation in climate policymaking, not less

    https://www.ft.com/content/28ad2bd8-2c34-11e7-9ec8-168383da43b7

    ***from the linked 4-page submission, it would seem there’s no objection to welcoming NGOs who go along with the agenda:

    ‘In the case of the UNFCCC, there is a growing recognition of the importance of the participation of Non-Party Stakeholders, as stated in decision 1/CP.21, where those Stakeholders were invited by the Parties of the Convention “to scale up their efforts and support action to reduce emissions and/or to build resilience and decrease vulnerability to the adverse effects of climate change, and to demonstrate such efforts via the Non-State Actors Zone for Climate Action platform”.’

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    pat

    reminder of some of the options:

    13 Feb: Daily Caller: Michael Bastasch: Here’s How Trump Can Withdraw From The Paris Climate Agreement
    A new congressional report lays out the various ways President Trump could withdraw the U.S. from a United Nations agreement to cut greenhouse gas emissions…
    3. Burn The Whole House Down
    If Trump doesn’t want to wait until 2019 to formally withdraw from the Paris agreement, he can try and pull out of the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) — Paris’s parent treaty.
    “If the Executive sought to pursue such a course of action and effectuate such a withdrawal, it would need to provide written notice to the U.N. pursuant to the terms of the UNFCCC,” CRS reported. “Withdrawal from both the UNFCCC and the Paris Agreement would become effective
    http://dailycaller.com/2017/02/13/heres-how-trump-can-withdraw-from-the-paris-climate-agreement/

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    Leonard Lane

    The past week has been a great disappointing to conservative Pres Trump supporters:
    1) No funds for the wall
    2) H1B visas increased
    3) Planned Parenthood (abortions) funded
    4) Budget increased
    5) National Public Radio and TV funded
    6) National endowment for the Arts (the folks who put a cross in a jar of urine and called it art)
    7) No cuts in EPA budget (promised at least a 25% cut)
    8) No election reforms
    9) Hundreds of lower court federal judges vacancies unfilled (this is important because these are the federal courts who blocked his immigration restrictions, these judges will move up to the appeals courts, etc.)
    10) Few if any of the US Attorney positions filled(these are the federal prosecutors who could bring law and order back to America after 8 years of Obama)
    11) No cut off of funds to sanctuary cities where federal immigration law is thwarted and convicted criminals are turned
    back to pray on US citizens

    With these results in the first budget of the Trump Administration, I don’t expect many real cuts in the huge climate change budgets, in the contributions to the UN, etc. in Pres. Trump’s next budget. Many working class and conservative Americans

    This is sad, because many felt it was our best chance to bring America back from the brink of socialism.

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    • #
      CharlesM

      Rome wasn’t built in a day.

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        PeterS

        Neither was it destroyed in a day. However, the socialists are trying their best to speed things up.

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          OriginalSteve

          All Collaborators will get their day in court….fear not…

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          • #

            There is a time plan, I am sure, and it may be the 2018 target for at least 8 more Senators. That depends on how long the ‘resistance’ continues for. Timing is everything in Capitol Politics.

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          CharlesM

          The Left in America is destructive, no doubt about that. Reversing bad policies will necessarily come in small steps. That is the way the Constitution was designed. For example, an Obama-appointed Judge in California prevented the Federal Government from de-funding San Francisco whilst it remains a “sanctuary city”. Every move that Trump makes will be blocked in the Courts and on the streets (like in Portland, OR a few days ago), but he will ultimately prevail. Be thankful for Trump’s appointment of Neil Gorsuch once these issues reach the SCOTUS.

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            PeterS

            You are assuming America has all the time in the world to fix things by small steps. I’m afraid they don’t. History has proven civilisation after civlisation goes through various phases before it destroys itself from within. One would hope this time it’s different but that’s what they always say each time in the past.

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      sophocles

      It’s too late:
      America disappeared over the edge of the Socialism cliff after the 2008 crash …

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    • #
    • #
      John F. Hultquist

      The alternative — this week — was to have a partial government shutdown. There are 193 weeks remaining of this Administration.
      A shutdown makes for terrible headlines and is a stupendously stupid thing to do. A few years ago, for one of these, National Park and Forest Service Rangers had to chase visitors off the lands, then put up and monitor barricades, and so on. They had to work, made no friends, and had to deal with irate visitors.
      Guess who got blamed for this?

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  • #

    Being a climate pariah is be a badge of honour.

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    Leonard Lane

    Should have read:
    Many working class and conservative Americans have been left our of the budgeting process as we have been under Clinton, Bush, and Obama. Seems the swamp is filling faster than it is being drained.

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    • #
      Will Janoschka

      Just who is actually blocking the drain?

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      • #
        Ted O'Brien.

        Who is blocking? Here in Australia it was Al Gore and Clive Palmer and a peculiar opportunity for this to arise.

        I would like to know how Al persuaded Clive.

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    pat

    2 May: Breitbart: James Delingpole: Delingpole: ‘Climate Change’ Is No More Credible than Magic Says Top Physicist
    Richard Lindzen, Alfred P Sloan Professor of Atmospheric Sciences, Emeritus at Massachussetts Institute of Technology, has long expressed doubts about the “science” behind anthropogenic global warming theory. (h/t Paul Homewood)
    Now, in probably his most comprehensive and devastating assault yet on the Climate Industrial Complex, Lindzen shreds every one of the fake-science arguments used by the environmentalists to justify their hugely expensive “global warming” scare story…READ ALL
    http://www.breitbart.com/big-government/2017/05/02/delingpole-climate-change-is-no-more-credible-than-magic-says-top-physicist/

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      Oliver K. Manuel

      Thanks, Pat, for this reminder that MIT Emeritus Professor Richard Lindzen is still speaking out against pseudo-science. The research careers of young faculty members would be endangered if they spoke out.

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    OriginalSteve

    I know who the pariahs are, its the Left.

    An example of typical Leftist nonsense :

    * Create a lunatic position ( i.e. CAGW Big Lie >= scientific proof )
    * Call anyone who has the brains and backbone to think independently ( i.e. CAGW scientific proof )

    1 + 1 = 3 ( or in Leftist loony land of Common Core : 5+5 = about 9 )

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    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Dang…..should have used NEQ ( Not Equal To instead of greater than less than symbol……the joys of working in TSQL )

      Should read :

      * Call anyone who has the brains and backbone to think independently ( i.e. CAGW NEQ scientific proof )

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    TdeF

    You have to love the irony of Australia being the world’s biggest exporter of coal (comparable to Indonesia now), earning its hard currency with coal and banning coal and gas in Australia. Coal pays the wages of all the public servants and lawyers who are trying to stop coal from being exported. I suppose we could sit around for 50,000 years and live on yams and kangaroo. It’s been done before.

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    • #
      PeterS

      Well if Venezuela can run out of fuel thanks to socialism despite sitting on one of the biggest oil reserves in the world then we could also run out of coal and gas and hence electricity despite being the biggest coal exporter and sitting on huge gas reserves. Socialism is such a powerful nation destroyer.

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        TdeF

        I thought Venezuela had a real problem with its high sulphur fuel and the cost of sulphur removal? There is more to this than just failed socialism.

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      sophocles

      … and may become a huge exporter of food too, although they won’t be banning that for local consumption. Locals may suffer though as global prices are already spiking with American grain production down by 35%, and winter vegetables and grains hit right across Europe.

      Australia seems to be looking at record harvests so far, and may well export at the expense of its home markets.

      Be prepared for food prices to soar … I half expect to see rioting across the Middle East again … :-( If it happens, it may flash into and across Europe.

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        Bobl

        I once wrote to my member mentioning that if the climate got cooler we could see multi-year crop failures across Europe, N America and N Asia, it might be up to Australia and Africa to feed the world. I asked if the government was prepared for that! At least China is looking at their food supply diversity.

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        • #
          Graeme No.3

          Bible:
          They have been looking at food supply diversity for years. Why do you think they are so keen on Australian farms? And they have poured money etc. into Africa and elsewhere.
          The Chinese have never believed the nonsense of global warming, they have looked at their history and know what happens when the climate turns cooler. So they have played lip service while building their manufacturing economy, and those PV panels and wind turbines installed? Fine if they give a sort of supply where there is none, and it is a great way of g those manufacturers, but look at the Green’s complaints about wastage of renewables- as soon as the reliable supply is in place they are pushed to the back of the queue.

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            Graeme No.3

            Sorry Bobl, my spellchecker doesn’t like your name.

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              Bobl

              That’s OK Graeme, the auto-correct thingies almost always trip me up too, it’s one reason I call the on screen keyboard on my tablet the “virtually unusable virtual keyboard”

              Anyway you make the exact point I was trying to bring up, China’s interest in our farms is at least in part to hedge cooling and diversify the food supply away from the northern hemisphere. The west seems top arrogant about CAGW to see what would happen if am ice age started – mini or otherwise. They are also making big moves in png arguably a better food source than oz in a child period.

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  • #
    Patrick healy

    Before we all get too carried away, it should be noted that in the recent U.S. budget, the dysfunctional EPA was given a rise of 15 {I think} American million dollars. This is to augment the hundreds of millions they spend on global warming agitptop

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  • #
    John Watt

    Trump may pull “us” out of Paris agreement within two weeks. We wish! Malcolm Trumbull certainly won’t.

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    pat

    of course, some renewables are mentioned too but, thankfully, countries are ignoring the “War on Coal”:

    3 May: ThomsonReutersFoundation: Pakistan ramps up coal power with Chinese-backed plants
    by Saleem Shaikh and Sughra Tunio
    Pakistan must tap these unutilised vast underground reserves of 175 billion tonnes of coal, adequate to meet the country’s energy needs for several decades,” minister says.
    Officials at the Water and Power Ministry have said Chinese companies and their partners are expected to spend around $15 billion over the next 15 years to build close to a dozen coal power plants of varying sizes around the country…
    Pakistan has long needed more power than it can produce, with the energy deficit currently around 4,000 MW. According to the International Energy Agency (IEA), average energy demand in the country is around 19,000 MW, against generation of around 15,000 MW.

    Demand soars beyond 20,000 MW during peak summer months of May to July, when air conditioning systems place an extra burden on the national power grid, often causing power cuts.
    The IEA forecasts that total electricity demand will rise to more than 49,000 MW by 2025 as the country’s population increases.
    Only 67 percent of Pakistan’s approximately 190 million people have access to electricity, according to the World Bank…

    “Pakistan must tap these unutilised vast underground reserves of 175 billion tonnes of coal, adequate to meet the country’s energy needs for several decades, for powering the country’s economic wheel, creating new jobs, and fighting spiking unemployment and poverty,” Iqbal said…
    However, (CO2) emissions are increasing at a rate of 3.9 percent (16 MTCO2 eq.) annually…
    http://www.eco-business.com/news/pakistan-ramps-up-coal-power-with-chinese-backed-plants/

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    David Maddison

    America under Trump is returning to common sense but Australia is embedding itself ever more deeply in CAGW nonsense and we are the only country shutting down thermal generators with no posibility of building more.

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    • #
      PeterS

      Yes it appears we are the only nation on earth of any significance that’s not building new coal fired power stations. Even Japan, which is only now starting to recover from its deep recession that started some 25 years ago is building a large number of them. One wonders if Australian politicians and their supporters on both sides actually give a dam about Australia’s economic future. I certainly believe they don’t.

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    • #
      King Geo

      Oz is like the UK – all major parties running with the “CAGW Nonsense”. Trump pulling the USA out of the Paris Agreement will help turn this around but what is really needed is the “GA/LIA” to kick in sooner than later. It will take a natural event like this to put a dagger in the “CAGW Myth”.

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      Angry

      Exactly!
      Just look at the morons in Victoria in closing down the Hazelwood coal power station that supplied 20% of the states electricity !!

      communist traitors @#$^%^*&**^&%$ !

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    pat

    for those upset by the US Budget, do at least watch all of the following to put things in perspective. no point going only by the reports in FakeNewsMSM:

    5/2/17: (FULL) White House Press Briefing
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_kwsSq_gs4

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    john karajas

    Australia was constantly being threatened with being labelled as an international pariah for its policies towards unwanted boats carrying illegal immigrants. Wonder of wonders: Australia’s policies and operating procedures are now being upheld as templates for other Western-style nations to emulate.

    America inflicted the CAGW scare upon the rest of the world. America may now save us from all the unadulterated bull**** that has been inflicted upon us.

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    • #
      Andrew McRae

      “The U.S. would be risking pariah status on the international stage”… by electing Donald Trump, but they (almost) did that anyway. Trump’s domestic enemies believe he has already made the USA a pariah.
      Go for it, Don, you’ve got nothing to lose.

      Look for the next book by Trump: The Art of the Deal-breaker!

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  • #
    Ruairi

    The Paris climate-change bluff,
    Shows the Emperor still in the buff,
    Till a boy in the crowd,
    Shouts out bravely and loud,
    “Enough is enough is enough”.

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  • #
    King Geo

    Off topic – the Fairfax Group plan to offload a lot of staff (25% job cuts) – is this because this “Greenie-type MSM” outlet has lost a lot of market share because many folk reject their “extreme leftie biase”? Most folk are sick of this “leftie extremism whether it be alarmist AGW/Climate Change tales or promoting Islamism in our western society. I like many who are drawn to this blog prefer consulting SkyNews & definitely not Auntie (as bad or worse than the Fairfax Group).

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    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Hang on – you mean the share of the fake news market is under threat by having less of it available from a MSM greenie-beholden “news” outlet?

      Have I missed something here?

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    • #
      Angry

      Bye bye leftist FAIR FAUX !

      Time to bring out the bubbly !!

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    • #
      Ted O'Brien.

      Fairfax had the biggest advertising base. While I would like to think it was bad journalism on the AGW front, I think they probably had the most to lose with the advance of internet information transfer / advertising.

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    King Geo

    Off topic – the Fairfax Group plan to offload a lot of staff (25% job cuts) – is this because this “Greenie-type MSM” outlet has lost a lot of “market share” because many folk reject their “extreme leftie bias”? Most folk are sick of this “leftie extremism” especially their obsession with “Alarmist AGW/Climate Change” propaganda. I like many, who are drawn to Jo Nova’s Blog, prefer consulting the the likes of the SkyNews MSM outlet & definitely not the Fairfax Group or Auntie (arguably worse than the Fairfax Group because they are tax payer funded).

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    • #
      James

      Please call the ABC something other than Auntie. How about the A B Figgin C! Unless of course your auntie was some kind of witch!

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      • #
        King Geo

        Point taken - I will in future refer to them as the A B Figgin C!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

        A lot of my friends, who used to listen to the A B Figgin C radio station 720 talk-back here in Perth, have now switched to Perth’s local talk-back radio station 6PR 882 who I have always listened to. Mind you 6PR 882 are owned by Fairfax Media these days but there is no obvious “leftie bias” like the A B Figgin C.

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        Angry

        ABC…………

        Aljazeera Broadcasting Corporation

        australian bullshit commission

        australian brainwashing commission

        Allah Before Christians

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    Oliver K. Manuel

    Thank you, JoNova, for the encouraging news. I was pleased to see that the GDP gap remains between the US and CHINA despite years of globalist efforts to erase it.

    I strongly endore Trump’s decision to pull out of an international Paris agreement because it was based on pseudo-science.

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  • #

    Trump is dealing with insanity in his opponents, and he is not acting like it. He doesn’t get it after all (I am sorry to have to say, since everyone’s hopes are on him). With the new spending bill, he is officially wasting his time until the next go-around in September, and he should know that is bad business. Maybe he thinks he is buying that time, but he is not showing what he is buying time for. He should be disowning everything Obama did by Presidential fiat, immediately, and none of this foofaraw about getting Congress to do it for him–just undo all Obama did, and let Congress worry about where to go from there; they can’t complain, because they already did that when Obama went around them (not to mention, around the will of the people). He should have disabused himself by now, of the notion that he can negotiate with the Democrats, who are acting like religious extremists on a holy war.

    He should work by executive order at the drop of a hat, to roll back all Obama did, and let them try–and fail–to impeach him.

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      CharlesM

      Brief research shows that Trump signed more Executive Actions than Obama in the first 100 days. But the US has checks and balances. A number of EA’s by Trump have been overturned by the Courts.

      The Democrats under Obama were sheep. Under Trump, the Republicans are split on a number of issues, and there will have to be compromises.

      Remember, purists kill what they believe in – . Surely it is time to support Trump’s efforts.

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    Art

    Trump won’t pull out of the Paris agreement. Hidden in his recently released budget plan is a fully funded EPA. Remember it wasn’t that long ago that he committed to a 30% budget cut for the EPA. Trump is all bark and no bite.

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    • #
      Geoffrey Williams

      Hope you’re wrong Art. . .
      GeoffW

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      el gordo

      Trump will pull out of the Paris Agreement, telling Ivanka that she has been brainwashed.

      A fully funded EPA, link?

      Trump is not a dictator, the president has to get things through tiers of government. Obamacare took awhile to get through.

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    • #
      clive

      I repeat,The Fake Stream Media: “It’s Our Job to Control What People Think.”Don’t believe”ANYTHING”the MSM tell you.

      10

  • #
    pat

    2 May: The Hill: Timothy Cama: Trump picks renewable energy policy skeptic to lead DOE office
    President Trump has named Dan Simmons, an opponent of policies meant to promote renewable energy, to lead the renewable energy office at the Department of Energy.
    Simmons formerly worked at the Institute for Energy Research, a self-styled, free-market energy think tank that is funded largely by fossil fuel interests.
    An Energy official announced Simmons’s appointment to lead the Office of Energy Efficiency and Renewable Energy (EERE) in a recent email to employees, which noted that Simmons started at the department during the Trump administration’s transition period…
    Trump has proposed to cut EERE’s funding by 53 percent…
    http://thehill.com/policy/energy-environment/331615-trump-picks-renewable-energy-policy-skeptic-to-lead-doe-office

    behind paywall:

    1 May: Financial Times: Eclipse to Test U.S. Electric Grid Reshaped By Solar
    The first total solar eclipse to darken U.S. skies in a generation has forced utilities to draw up contingency plans for an electric grid increasingly powered by the sun.
    A giant shadow moving west to east on August 21 will temporarily remove “a large amount of photovoltaic resources” from the country, a regulatory body concluded last week. California’s grid operator on Monday estimated the eclipse would boost its net demand by 6,000 megawatts, enough power for the city of Los Angeles, as solar output nosedives.
    Eclipses are among the latest factors utility managers must consider as renewable energy becomes a bigger part of the generation mix…

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    • #
      Ian Hill

      Eclipse? As Thomas the Tank Engine would say – “stuff ‘n nonsense”! Don’t they get clouds or night time in California?

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    pat

    behind paywall:

    3 May: UK Times: Louis Emanuel: Big bills as ‘green homes’ fail to live up to promises
    Owners of new-build properties are being sold a false promise of low energy costs because developers are underestimating emissions by 50 per cent, a study found.
    Academics at the University of Bath likened the way planners offer over-optimistic efficiency projections to the VW emissions scandal. They said homeowners and businesses were being hit with unexpectedly high bills because the “green” credentials of new buildings were continually overstated.
    David Coley, the university’s professor of low carbon design, said that the system for predicting emissions and efficiency was deeply flawed.
    “The problem is nobody checks that the building is performing as promised. There is very little regulation. They can’t be sued. It’s like a surgeon not being bothered about whether their patient lived or died,” he told The Daily Telegraph…
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/news/big-bills-as-green-homes-fail-to-live-up-to-promises-h82jsds06

    2 May: UK Telegraph: Sara Knapton: Energy scandal: misleading efficiency claims leading to huge bills for homeowners
    David Coley, Professor of Low Carbon Design at the University of Bath, said the real problem stemmed from the practice of building modelling, which is not ‘fit for purpose.’
    “It’s a serious scandal,” he said. “It affects all new buildings as well as the refurbishment of older ones.
    “When one school in Plymouth was rebuilt, the energy bills for a month ended up costing the same as for an entire year in the old 1950s building…
    “The impact of the inaccuracies of building modelling professionals has severe financial and environmental implications for both the government’s global warming targets as well as building owners who are purchasing homes and other buildings that are sold to be energy efficient but in reality are not.”…

    In the first research of its kind, a team from Bath’s Department of Architecture & Civil Engineering and Department of ***Psychology interviewed 108 building modelling professionals about 21 common design energy-related aspects of a building, from the insulation in the walls to the temperature the heating was set to.
    The questioning was based on a real building in which detailed energy, occupancy and temperature data had been recorded, and provided a comparison with the answers of those surveyed.

    Co-investigator and Senior Lecturer in the Department of Psychology, Dr Ian Walker added: “Given our findings about how the level of relevant education and experience don’t separate the good modellers from the bad, we are calling on the government for educational and policy change to work with industry and universities to increase efforts in improving building physics education.
    “Currently, an in-depth qualification for building modelling does not exist, meaning there is little formal training process for those entering the profession.”…READ ALL
    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/2017/05/02/energy-scandal-misleading-efficiency-claims-leading-huge-bills/

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    pat

    3 May: ScottishHousingNews: Updated scheme offers green homes loans to homeowners
    Homeowners can now apply for an interest free loan of up to £32,500 to improve the energy efficiency and use of renewable technologies in their properties…
    http://www.scottishhousingnews.com/15221/updated-scheme-offers-green-homes-loans-to-homeowners/

    2 May: Guardian: Julia Kollewe: Britain’s energy supply is in jeopardy after Brexit, warn MPs
    The influential Commons business, energy and industrial strategy committee said that any gap between the UK leaving a European atomic power treaty and entering into secure alternative deals would “severely inhibit nuclear trade and research and threaten power supplies”…

    MPs are also worried that Brexit could distract the government from achieving emissions reduction targets, enshrined in domestic law.
    The committee’s report recommends maintaining access to the internal energy market and retaining membership of the emissions trading system until 2020 at least…

    “While there are undoubtedly weaknesses in the operation of some EU policies on energy and climate change, notably the EU emissions trading system, the secretary of state, Greg Clark, acknowledged that cooperation with EU partners was generally mutually beneficial. The UK has consistently been a driver of high standards and ambitious climate change targets.”
    https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/may/02/britains-energy-supply-is-in-jeopardy-after-brexit-warn-mps

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    pat

    not in Australia…not anywhere?

    26 Apr: Bloomberg: Tom Randall: The Electric-Car Boom Is So Real Even Oil Companies Say It’s Coming
    Total SA, one of the world’s biggest oil producers, is now saying EVs ***may constitute almost a third of new-car sales by the end of the next decade…
    (Total) Couse’s projection for electric cars is the highest yet by a major oil company and exceeds BNEF’s own forecast, said Colin McKerracher, head of advanced transport analysis at Bloomberg New Energy Finance.
    “That’s big,” McKerracher said. “That’s by far the most aggressive we’ve seen by any of the majors.”…
    The most expensive part of an electric car is the battery, which can make up half the total cost, according to BNEF…

    Electric cars currently make up about 1 percent of global vehicle sales, but traditional carmakers are preparing for transformation…

    “By 2020 there will be over 120 different models of EV across the spectrum,” said Michael Liebreich, founder of Bloomberg New Energy Finance. “These are great cars. They will make the internal combustion equivalent look old fashioned.”
    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-04-25/electric-car-boom-seen-triggering-peak-oil-demand-in-2030s

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      OriginalSteve

      Reckon electric cars should have emergency sails on them, so when the wind stops blowing over night while cars are charging, they can still get around….

      Palm to forehead…..

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      • #
        Willard

        OriginalSteve
        May 1, 2017 at 7:03 pm · Reply
        I do hope one day you can contribute for a change…

        Try to follow your own advice Steve.

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        • #
          OriginalSteve

          This coming from a bot who singlehandedly contributes nothing of value to the forum?

          Pot meet kettle….

          If you dont get the sail and electric car thing, youre wasting your time here.

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          • #
            Willard

            If the wind stops blowing overnight to generate electricity how will a sail help Steve?
            Didn’t think that one too well did you sunshine?

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            • #
              Graeme No.3

              The sails will be made from a durable flexible PVsolar material which will be invented real soon now.
              On a more serious note electric cars are about where they were in 1975 except the batteries are a bit better. Petroleum delivers so much energy per kilo that cars can afford the extra weight from the engine, gear box and transmission and STILL out-perform electric cars.
              Yes, improved batteries will make IC obsolete, the electric car enthusiasts said so in 1975.

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                Willard

                On a more serious note electric cars are about where they were in 1975 except the batteries are a bit better.

                Your sort of correct with the above comment Graeme although batteries are a lot better rather than a bit better.
                the rest of your post is outdated and incorrect, best you catch up with 2017 Graeme.

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      tom0mason

      Are they to make these vehicles without resorting to fossil fuel technology to power the manufacturing process? I think not.

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        Willard

        Your point being TomO?

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        • #
          Ted O'Brien.

          The point I would like an answer for, is what is the overall efficiency of the electric car system? Promoters seem to ignore the cost of the charging and the source of that energy.

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          • #
            Willard

            Far more efficient than using large amounts of energy to refine fuel, transport it to a bowser, then burn it in a combustion engine at 25-40% efficiency.

            15

            • #
              clive

              And just how are they going to “Generate”enough power to manufacture these “Electric Cars?”let alone recharge them.Why that may have to be done by,wait for it”FOSSIL FUELS”

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          Lionell Griffith

          As we progress toward the madness of 100% renewable alternative energy sources, we will learn a very hard lesson. The three laws of thermodynamics are sill in operation, cannot be broken, and any attempt to do so has automatic and immediate negative consequences.

          In simple language they are:

          The first law: you can’t get more out than you put into the system. There is no such thing as a free lunch. Oh, you can pretend there is but only by sacrificing someone else to achieve your ends. The net result is everyone loses. Even those who think they got away with it – in the long run.

          The second law: you can’t even get as much out as you have put into the system. It always costs to do something. Losses are inevitable. The hope is that the less you get out will be worth more than what you put in. The results of the industrial revolution was built upon that hope. It worked quite well until the government started consuming more and more of the productive output.

          The third law: when you start, you don’t have as much as you think you have. Some of it can’t be used to do anything. This makes it even harder to deal with the second law to increase the value of what little you have. This is in addition to what the government takes off the table.

          Unlike man’s law that can be broken, these kinds of law cannot be avoided, evaded, or wished away. They are built into the fiber of the universe and in operation 24/7.

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            OriginalSteve

            I keep hearing tid bits from intersting people about hydrogen tech which is quietly moving forward…things like use of liquid as a carrier etc.

            The point being the tech is happening, and what it will do is create a headache for oil comapnies, but better news is that it will also take the control away from the eco-pinkos, as the CAGW crisis is effectively “gone” – and how do you tax hydrogen? Near impossible.

            All the eco-Comrades will wail and gnash their teeth, but will be sidelined and made impotent, and wont be able to stop this wave of hydrogen tech. Many people are happy to dump this tech free of charge on the market….

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            • #
              Rick Will

              Where does the hydrogen come from?

              Hydrogen is all about renewable energy. It was a cornerstone of Obama R&D promotion.

              Toyota are backing hydrogen vehicles as a key to the renewable future of motor transport. Still electric cars but with a fuel cell running on hydrogen rather than hydrocarbons. The hydrogen is produced by electrolysis of water. It requires much electricity and relatively expensive storage.

              Electrolysis of water affords more economic electric energy storage than batteries but more complex than a battery.

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                OriginalSteve

                I think a fuel cell has had its day, the real prize is low energy dissociation of H20, there is hydrogen tech out that shows promise.

                The main hints I have heard is low energy cracking of water through combination of technologies techs, like new nano tech and cobalt-based catalysts etc.

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              • #
                Rick Will

                Fuel cells are just starting out at consumer level – far from having their day. Car makers are backing fuel cells for transport in the future:
                https://www.theverge.com/2015/7/2/8885845/bmw-toyota-hydrogen-fuel-cell-cars
                All the major manufacturers are working on fuel cell technology and investing heavily.

                Walmart have made significant steps in using fuel cells to power their stores:
                http://www.bloomenergy.com/customer-fuel-cell/walmart-renewable-energy/

                If intermittent power generators are ever to get beyond 20% of electric supply there will be a huge excess capacity most of the time. That provides a free resource of electric power to supply electric energy to some form of storage. Already electrolysis of water is far cheaper storage than battery storage:
                http://www.itm-power.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/01/platts-itm-article-Januart-2016.pdf
                Current price around EUR1/MW. In a 20 year life you can store 175GWh from a 1MW unit. Current lithium battery prices are around EUR1.5/MWh at 50% DoD to get 5000 cycles so a paltry 5GWh over its life. So hydrogen is by far the lowest cost storage; of the order 50 times cheaper; roughly 40X if you convert from gas back to electricity through a fuel cell but could be used for gas turbine as well.

                To get 100% renewable electricity grid it needs to have an installed capacity around 7 times the peak demand. That means there are periods of huge excess capacity. Germany is already suffering from oversupply issues and paying neighbouring countries to take their excess production. South Australia has Victoria as its sink in periods of high wind. These precincts have less than 30% renewable so imagine how bad it gets when the renewables are able to produce 100% of demand. There will be so much excess capacity most of the time that it will be incredibly wasteful of the capital expenditure. Hydrogen electricity to gas plants offer a feasible and economic option to put the excess capacity to good use. Transport is the obvious user of all that gas.

                In the case of Australia there is already natural gas infrastructure across the country so adding hydrogen into the system in high sunlight locations like Dampier, Darwin and Dubbo, for example, makes sense.

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    pat

    2 May: Leeds Uni: Antarctic Peninsula ice more stable than previously thought
    The new Leeds-led research calls into question a recent study from the University of Bristol that reported a 45 cubic kilometres per year increase in ice loss from the sector. The Leeds research found the increase to be three times smaller.
    Lead author Dr Anna Hogg, from Leeds’ School of Earth and Environment, said: “Dramatic changes have been reported in this part of Antarctica, so we took a closer look at how its glaciers have evolved, using 25 years of satellite measurements dating back to the early 1990s.”…
    The paper Increased ice flow in Western Palmer Land linked to ocean melting is published in Geophysical Research Letters 2 May 2017…
    http://www.leeds.ac.uk/news/article/4042/antarctic_peninsula_ice_more_stable_than_previously_thought

    LOL:

    24 Apr: SSRN (Social Science Research Network): Bill McKibben’s Effect on the US Climate Change Debate: Shifting the Institutional Environment Through Radical Flank Effects
    Ross School of Business Paper No. 1364
    Authors:
    Todd Schifeling
    University of Michigan at Ann Arbor – Erb Institute
    Andrew John Hoffman
    University of Michigan, Stephen M. Ross School of Business
    Abstract
    This paper investigates the presence and influence of radical flanks on field-level debates. We study the ability of radical flank actors to shift the focus of these debates by increasing the legitimacy of pre-existing but peripheral issues. We apply this conceptual model to the empirical context of the climate change debate in the United States and the efforts of Bill McKibben and 350.org to pressure major Universities and Colleges to divest their financial investments in fossil fuel assets. As these new actors and issue entered the debate, we find that, while divestment itself gained limited traction, liberal policy ideas, which had previously been marginalized in the U.S. debate, gained increased attention and legitimacy…
    https://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=2957590

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      Ted O'Brien.

      “Three times smaller”.

      Should we read that as one third, or does it have some other meaning?

      “influence of radical flanks on field-level debates….”

      Somebody is getting paid too much!

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    pat

    solution? let’s call the whole thing off!

    2 May: ClimateNewsNetwork: Tim Radford: Next decade critical for climate targets
    SMOKING CHIMNEYS’ PHOTO CAPTION: To keep global warming below an average global rise of 2°C, fossil fuel consumption would have to be reduced to less than a quarter of the world’s energy by 2100.
    Researchers in Austria report in Nature Communications (LINK) that they took a long hard look at what must happen to keep global warming to “well below” an average global rise of 2°C and if possible 1.5°C above pre-industrial levels.
    They deployed a mathematical simulation – in effect a computer model – to measure the carbon emitted in fossil fuel consumption, and the carbon taken up by natural mechanisms such as forests and oceans, and the impact of the ways humans use the land around them…

    “This study shows that the combined energy and land-use system should deliver zero-net anthropogenic emissions well before 2040 in order to assure the attainability of a 1.5°C target by 2100,” says Michael Obersteiner, one of the authors, and ecosystem services and management programme director of the International Institute for Applied Systems Analysis, based in Laxenburg, Austria.

    That means that by 2100, fossil fuel consumption would have to be reduced to less than a quarter of the world’s energy supply. Right now, it makes up 95%. At the same time, humans must stop clearing forests and restore them…
    But to make this happen would require a global economy in which wind, solar and bio-energy output increase by 5% a year, and carbon emissions peak by 2022…
    http://climatenewsnetwork.net/next-decade-critical-climate-targets/

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    • #
      Graeme No.3

      pat:
      Note the basic assumption that there is a relationship between CO2 and temperature (without the slightest evidence) and it is rather ironic that they call for forests to be protected and enhanced when the Greens have been the biggest threat to forests for 2 centuries. Millions of tonnes of wood chips ( sorry, that should read wood pellets) being burnt for subsidies and thousands of sq. kms. of sq. kms. of tropical forests burnt to make way for palm oil plantations to supply biofuel.

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    pat

    behind paywall:

    2 May: UK Times: Inquiry into ‘Apple of the solar world’
    The demise of a company that told crowdfunding investors it was building the “Apple of the solar world” is being investigated by the Insolvency Service.
    Solar Cloth Company collapsed in May last year, less than 18 months after it had secured almost £1 million from “crowd” backers, most of whom were ordinary private investors.
    Investigators are contacting shareholders about the circumstances surrounding Solar Cloth Company’s public fundraising and rapid decline.
    The business raised £967,130 from 400 investors in 2015 via Crowdcube, the crowdfunding platform. Later it transpired that Solar Cloth Company had misled them about the state of its finances and had failed to mention the chequered trading history of its founder…
    https://www.thetimes.co.uk/edition/business/inquiry-into-apple-of-the-solar-world-mfsb7lg39

    with pics:

    2 May: TheMemo: What happened to the ‘Apple of the solar world’?
    By Oliver Smith
    The Solar Cloth Company’s pitch was based around a lightweight ‘soft’ solar panel that could be rolled out on rooftops and carpark roofs which couldn’t hold the weight of traditional solar.
    It promised to start a solar revolution.
    With palpable excitement investors backed the business to the tune of £950,000, lured by boasts of a sales pipeline with £4.5m worth of deals with local councils, retailers and transport hubs…
    To make things even worse, especially for out-of-pocket investors, Solar Cloth’s remaining assets were reportedly bought by one of the company’s former directors at a fire sale price just weeks later.

    Last July, with the company having collapsed, The Times revealed that Solar Cloth’s founder Perry Carroll had previously been bankrupt twice with a string of failed businesses in his wake…
    Crowdcube said following the incident it has improved its due diligence of company directors, and today the Insolvency Service is said to be further investigating the incident…
    https://www.thememo.com/2017/05/02/solar-cloth-company-what-happened-to-the-apple-of-the-solar-world/

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      James

      I think you would be very silly to invest in anything that is crowd funded. All crowdfunding seem to me to be is a way around normal rules regarding company share floats and investing.

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    James

    “Watch out. People might say things that are not nice about the USA.”

    I just got home from Australia, and had the misfortune to have to listen to the ABC. They never have anything nice to say about the USA.

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    • #
      OriginalSteve

      Well yes, the MSM in Oz is very left wing, and collectively cries itself to sleep every night when someone mentions Trump….

      Serves them right, I say….

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  • #

    TRUMP and PRUITT get the SCIENCE RIGHT – NATURAL CYCLES DRIVE CLIMATE CHANGE.
    The Australia the UK and the U.S should pull out of the Paris Agreement and the UK should repeal the nonsensical Climate Act 0f 2008.
    Climate is controlled by natural cycles. Earth is just past the 2004+/- peak of a millennial cycle and the current cooling trend will likely continue until the next Little Ice Age minimum at about 2650.See the Energy and Environment paper at http://journals.sagepub.com/doi/full/10.1177/0958305X16686488
    and an earlier accessible blog version at http://climatesense-norpag.blogspot.com/2017/02/the-coming-cooling-usefully-accurate_17.html
    Here is the abstract for convenience :
    “ABSTRACT
    This paper argues that the methods used by the establishment climate science community are not fit for purpose and that a new forecasting paradigm should be adopted. Earth’s climate is the result of resonances and beats between various quasi-cyclic processes of varying wavelengths. It is not possible to forecast the future unless we have a good understanding of where the earth is in time in relation to the current phases of those different interacting natural quasi periodicities. Evidence is presented specifying the timing and amplitude of the natural 60+/- year and, more importantly, 1,000 year periodicities (observed emergent behaviors) that are so obvious in the temperature record. Data related to the solar climate driver is discussed and the solar cycle 22 low in the neutron count (high solar activity) in 1991 is identified as a solar activity millennial peak and correlated with the millennial peak -inversion point – in the RSS temperature trend in about 2004. The cyclic trends are projected forward and predict a probable general temperature decline in the coming decades and centuries. Estimates of the timing and amplitude of the coming cooling are made. If the real climate outcomes follow a trend which approaches the near term forecasts of this working hypothesis, the divergence between the IPCC forecasts and those projected by this paper will be so large by 2021 as to make the current, supposedly actionable, level of confidence in the IPCC forecasts untenable.”
    The paper was published in E&E on line at DOI: 10.1177/0958305X16686488

    A blog version is accessible at http://climatesense-norpag.blogspot.com/2017/02/the-coming-cooling-usefully-accurate_17.html

    Here is an exchange I had with Freeman Dyson two years ago.
    E-mail 4/7/15
    Dr Norman Page
    Houston
    Professor Dyson
    Saw your Vancouver Sun interview.
    I agree that CO2 is beneficial. This will be even more so in future because it is more likely than not that the earth has already entered a long term cooling trend following the recent temperature peak in the quasi-millennial solar driven periodicity .
    The climate models on which the entire Catastrophic Global Warming delusion rests are built without regard to the natural 60 and more importantly 1000 year periodicities so obvious in the temperature record. The modelers approach is simply a scientific disaster and lacks even average commonsense .It is exactly like taking the temperature trend from say Feb – July and projecting it ahead linearly for 20 years or so. They back tune their models for less than 100 years when the relevant time scale is millennial. This is scientific malfeasance on a grand scale. The temperature projections of the IPCC – UK Met office models and all the impact studies which derive from them have no solid foundation in empirical science being derived from inherently useless and specifically structurally flawed models. They provide no basis for the discussion of future climate trends and represent an enormous waste of time and money. As a foundation for Governmental climate and energy policy their forecasts are already seen to be grossly in error and are therefore worse than useless. A new forecasting paradigm needs to be adopted. For forecasts of the timing and extent of the coming cooling based on the natural solar activity cycles – most importantly the millennial cycle – and using the neutron count and 10Be record as the most useful proxy for solar activity check my blog-post at http://climatesense-norpag.blogspot.com/2014/07/climate-forecasting-methods-and-cooling.html
    The most important factor in climate forecasting is where earth is in regard to the quasi- millennial natural solar activity cycle which has a period in the 960 – 1020 year range. For evidence of this cycle see Figs 5-9. From Fig 9 it is obvious that the earth is just approaching ,just at or just past a peak in the millennial cycle. I suggest that more likely than not the general trends from 1000- 2000 seen in Fig 9 will likely generally repeat from 2000-3000 with the depths of the next LIA at about 2650. The best proxy for solar activity is the neutron monitor count and 10 Be data. My view ,based on the Oulu neutron count – Fig 14 is that the solar activity millennial maximum peaked in Cycle 22 in about 1991. There is a varying lag between the change in the in solar activity and the change in the different temperature metrics. There is a 12 year delay between the activity peak and the probable millennial cyclic temperature peak seen in the RSS data in 2003. http://www.woodfortrees.org/plot/rss/from:1980.1/plot/rss/from:1980.1/to:2003.6/trend/plot/rss/from:2003.6/trend
    There has been a cooling temperature trend since then (Usually interpreted as a “pause”) There is likely to be a steepening of the cooling trend in 2017- 2018 corresponding to the very important Ap index break below all recent base values in 2005-6. Fig 13.
    The Polar excursions of the last few winters in North America are harbingers of even more extreme winters to come more frequently in the near future.
    I would be very happy to discuss this with you by E-mail or phone .It is important that you use your position and visibility to influence United States government policy and also change the perceptions of the MSM and U.S public in this matter. If my forecast cooling actually occurs the policy of CO2 emission reduction will add to the increasing stress on global food production caused by a cooling and generally more arid climate.
    Best Regards
    Norman Page

    E-Mail 4/9/15
    Dear Norman Page,
    Thank you for your message and for the blog. That all makes sense.
    I wish I knew how to get important people to listen to you. But there is
    not much that I can do. I have zero credibility as an expert on climate.
    I am just a theoretical physicist, 91 years old and obviously out of touch
    with the real world. I do what I can, writing reviews and giving talks,
    but important people are not listening to me. They will listen when the
    glaciers start growing in Kentucky, but I will not be around then. With
    all good wishes, yours ever, Freeman Dyson.

    The quality of the UK,USA and Australian science on climate since 2000 has been appallingly low. It is time to close down the entire UNFCCC Agenda 21 circus.

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    Donald!

    If Big Green and the great Herd of Independent Minds and the mainstream media and your Manhattan liberal family think you are doing things wrong…then you are doing things right.

    Cave into these influences and you will be just another stooge for perpetual war and debt. (You must have noticed that wind turbines and solar panels chew up a lot of borrowed/invented money and a lot of oil and gas. That’s because they suck as mainstream power, duh.

    Why dismantle Syria to make a Sunni energy corridor for eg Qatar’s gas while your coal sits in the ground, your own oil and gas reserves are vast, and your immediate neighbour to the north has 16% of the world’s uranium production at a good price point? Or is this still a Russia thing?)

    Fight Green Blob. End the war on coal. Then end a few other wars.

    Peace, Donald.

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    Roy Hogue

    I cry out against the fact that Trump needs a reason to pull out of Paris. It’s a bum deal. Period! What more does he need than that? Please Donald, get real, there is no reason on Earth for this Paris deal to even exist.

    As for becoming a Pariah… …after a few seconds of consideration I’ll take that any day. And screw the politics. Here’s our chance and we should take it. There may never be another president willing to say to the global warming pushers, take your foul scheme and go where you belong. You’ll get the same welcome there that other scoundrels have received for as long as there have been scoundrels.

    We need you not!

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      TdeF

      Pariah? Since when has the US not been a pariah? Our Malcolm Turnbull and Foreign Minister Bishop openly despise Trump and shirtfronted him over their refugee problem but have nothing to say on Putin. Opposition leader Bill Shorten described the US president as ‘Barking Mad’. France and Germany openly detest the US and so many British have despised the US since the war of independence in 1776. China tolerates the Paper Tiger as their biggest trading partner but goads and supports North Korea. As for the Middle East, where is the US liked? Pakistan? India?

      The US has nothing to lose in international standing by looking after their own interests. The US provocation of the Arab Spring under Democrat Obama has set fire to a dozen countries and Egypt and Turkey have now reverted to military dictatorships while anarchy reigns from Tunisia to Afghanistan, North Korea threatens imminent nuclear war with tacit Chinese support and we are told the biggest issue in the world today is CO2? No.

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        David Maddison

        President Trump will be meeting Turnbull on May 4 US time but will only be meeting him on a decommissioned WW2 aircraft carrier turned into a museum and moored off Manhattan.

        A perfectly designed insult to Turnbull.

        If I was Trump, I wouldn’t invite Turnbull to my home either.

        http://www.skynews.com.au/news/top-stories/2017/04/26/turnbull-to-meet-with-trump-in-new-york.amp.html

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          TdeF

          I cannot agree. Trump’s house is in New York.

          Aircraft carriers like the Interpid won WW2 in the Pacific. The battle of the Coral sea and then of Midway ended Japanese control of the Pacific. War was fought over the horizon and the British lost both the Prince of Wales and Repulse to Japanese land based bombers, ending the era of the battleship. Australia had nothing.

          Conversely, the First fleet had not even landed at Botany Bay in 1788 when America signed its declaration of independence. We have no connection with the White House itself, a site chosen by George Washington in 1791. The celebration of American victory in the Pacific with Australia as the base of operations is quite appropriate on the Intrepid.

          General Douglas McArthur was based a few hundred yards from where I write this, in Melbourne. Australia and the US had retreated to the Brisbane Line, prepared to concede a successful Japanese invasion until the Battle of the Coral sea to stop the massive invasion of Port Moresby and the first major battle in history fought by aircraft carriers where neither side could see the other. Meeting on the Intrepid is most appropriate and not an insult at all, more an evocation of our joint history as allies.

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            David Maddison

            I understand that TdeF but normally one would think that there would be a commemoration on the USS Intrepid followed by meetings at the official residence/office, the White House.

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              TdeF

              He may get an invitation to Trump’s own home. The White House is a goldfish bowl in Washington, 200 miles away.
              Donald might also want to introduce the family. My point is that this is not an insult but an appropriate if unusual gesture.

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              TdeF

              1.25 Million people a year visit the White House. How many get to see Trump’s place on top of New York? We will see what transpires but Trump knows how to impress.

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                TdeF

                As Tony Abbot noted, today marks the 75th anniversary of the Battle of the Coral Sea. As with the Battle of Britain and to paraphrase Winston Churchill, It was not the end. It was not even the beginning of the end. But it was, perhaps, the end of the beginning. The unstoppable Japanese aircraft carriers had been stopped.

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              TdeF

              More information on the dinner. Trump will stay at his club. His wife and son live in New York`. It costs half a million dollars for him to go home on the night because of security and shutting down Manhattan.

              The dinner is on board the giant carrier Intrepid. A dinner for 650+ guests including Fox, Rhinehart and many others. This is beyond the White House capability and the battle of the Coral Sea 75th anniversary is seen as the starting point of the US/Australian alliance, so it is all well planned and huge. The White House is just a house. This is a major event.

              So as a consummate salesman, Trump is doing a number on Australia. Even Turnbull might be impressed. Julie Bishop too who said they would endure the Trump presidency. I think Donald knows he is talking to a man with a one seat majority who removed a popular Prime Minister mid term. Still, that’s politics and business. Security is an issue too and an aircraft carrier is the right place considering that only 20% of New Yorkers like Trump and 5% of the Press.

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              • #
                Roy Hogue

                Trump is doing a number on Australia.

                Indeed he is. And like I said on the weekend thread, I hope Malcolm enjoys it.

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          • #
            Roy Hogue

            Australia had nothing.

            Australia had one thing and it was vital; men willing to go to battle along with the U.S. and Britain. Your help was important and you shouldn’t say,” Australia had nothing,” not if my opinion means anything.

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  • #

    The US Senate, not the Prez, ratifies treaties. The Petition Project of real scientists blocked the Kyoto sellout. This Econazi Occupied France agreement the Green Dems are pushing was an attempt to circumvent the Senate. Temperature data for satellites and there-since-1920 thermometer stations show temperature is decreasing–as anyone can show by plotting the curves and finding the trendline. The majority HERE are not hoodwinked by Gaian Greenery or German Ecological National Socialism. Let Europe and Australia wither while the US and China watch and bet on the outcome.

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      Roy Hogue

      As I said, it’s a bum deal. In fact, as we all know, it’s a solution without a problem. Getting into such a thing is always a mistake.

      The Senate has not yet ratified it so it’s fair game for the president to kill our agreement to it. And in fact it attempts to get around the Senate as you said and therefore to get around the constitution. Those I believe are several more reasons to toss it.

      There are no reasons to keep it.

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      Forrest Gardener

      Hank, I wonder whether there is something on the flip side of the fact that the senate ratifies treaties. Something like that the previous president having made an agreement requiring the current president to put it to the senate for ratification. I don’t know but that just might be the trapdoor Trump might fall through if he just declares the US out of Obama’s commitment.

      Or perhaps there is another reason Trump didn’t just declare the agreement off. Time will tell.

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    Curious George

    U.S. already is a pariah state in North Korea. Undoubtedly many progressive world leaders will now join Kin Jong Un.

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      Roy Hogue

      If anyone is foolish enough to join up with Kim Jong Un then they deserve what they get.

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        OriginalSteve

        I always invite carping leftists to emigrate to NK – shuts them up really fast…they would miss thier coal heated homes, nice cars and electronic gadgets provided by capitalism…they are rank hypocrits too….

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          Roy Hogue

          Steve,

          From what I can see it doesn’t appear to be widely known how badly trashed most of North Korea is. The few cities, mainly Pyongyang where visitors are allowed are spic and span squeaky clean and could be any city anywhere. But outside of those protected places North Korea is falling apart at the seams. Year after year after year of neglect have taken their toll.

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      PeterS

      Interesting point of view. If Trump is half as clever as I believe he is he will try to expose the progressive left as anti-American and on the side of the likes of Kin Jong Un.

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    • #
      TdeF

      You can see why Nikki Savva in today’s Australian strong advises Abbott to take the job of Attorney General. Tony is the thoughtful statesman Turnbull is not and never will be.

      The battle of the Coral sea, 75 years today was the first time the Japanese armada had been stopped. It was in the Pacific what the Battle of Britain was to Britain and the battle of Stalingrad was in Russia, the turning of the tide. 656 Americans died and they lost a fleet carrier, but just off our coats they stopped the invasion of Port Moresby and then Australia. America needs allies again, as do we.

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    pat

    3 May: Radio NZ: ‘Don’t let the whole side down’: Bainimarama
    Fiji’s prime minister Frank Bainimarama has asked his Australian counterpart to press Donald Trump over climate change
    Mr Bainimarama, who is in Australia, said he has asked Mr Turnbull to reinforce his earlier message to Mr Trump for the US to stay in the Paris Agreement and to continue to take a leadership role.
    In his speech in Melbourne at the opening of the 4th Australasian Emissions Reduction Summit Mr Bainimarama said his message was simple.
    He called on the president not to let the side down by leaving the Paris Agreement when there was a clear game plan and so many scores on board…

    He said Fiji’s priority, as president of the COP23 climate change talks in Bonn in November, was to build a grand coalition of governments, civil society and the private sector to defend the agreement and come up with an action plan.
    Mr Bainimarama said the response to Fiji’s appeal for funds for its presidency had been disappointing and he said he had appealed for more assistance…
    Mr Bainimarama also appealed to developed nations to follow through commitments over climate finance…
    http://www.radionz.co.nz/news/pacific/329944/'don't-let-the-whole-side-down'-bainimarama

    talk about a TALKFEST:

    4th Australasian Emissions Reduction Summit: Speakers
    *MORE SPEAKERS TO BE ANNOUNCED SHORTLY*
    https://summit2017.carbonmarketinstitute.org/speakers/

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    Bulldust

    O/Topic but maybe of interest. I believe we are seeing the decline of the MSM entering the death throes period now:

    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-04/fairfax-media-staff-on-strike-say-time-to-invest-in-journalism/8494502

    Had they not been peddling garbage for so long they might not be in this dire situation. Good riddance. When they attacked Youtube creators it was clear they were lashing out. Youtube creators make far more impressions these days than the MSM. If you are over 50 you might still be reading papers, but don’t think that is where the younger generations will get their opinions. Commercial TV is also toast, but will take a bit longer to die.

    Also, had an enormous chuckle at how Trump upstaged the pompous MSM and their expensive dinner with a rally in Pennslyvania. The MSM just doesn’t get it and they are now Darwining themselves out of existence.

    On the flipside several Youtube creators arte making the move to set up new media outlets. I see Phil DeFranco is the latest to head down that route. More power to them … now we will get a diversity of opinion that has been lacking for a long time.

    Youtube may try to stifle those voices, but if they do they do so at their own peril. There are plenty of platforms out there all too happy to eat their lunch (VidMe for example).

    As an aside, even being over 50 myself (although a bit of a technophile), I now find my time equally distributed between Youtube and TV, but by TV I mean Netflix, Kodi, and other streaming platforms. The only reason I even skim the MSM online is because I do so for my job. That and to poke fun of course.

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  • #
    pat

    more sporting analogies.
    nothing like setting the rules after u sign on to playing the game!

    3 May: CarbonPulse: ECOSYSTEM MARKETPLACE – Setting the rules of the game at the Bonn climate change talks
    By Paula Caballero, Global Director, Climate Program at WRI
    What’s true for sports is true for tackling climate change: to make things happen, you have to agree on the rules of the game.
    Climate negotiators gathering in Bonn from May 8-18 will be working to do just that by writing a “rulebook” so that the vision of the Paris Agreement on climate change can be translated into action. The COLLECTIVE WILL to implement the global climate pact is clear: it entered into force years before anyone expected. The logical next step is to agree to the rules and processes that will underpin it…

    Agreeing on the rules of the game by the end of 2018 is essential for the long-term increase in ambition – what we at WRI think of as the “Arc of Ambition” – that countries need so they can make smart, evidenced-based policy decisions that foster sustainable growth and combat poverty today and in the future…
    Parties need to know that climate action efforts will be measured, communicated and counted in ways that create a level playing field and build trust to reinforce the sense of COMMON PURPOSE…

    Under the Paris Agreement, countries must progressively increase their commitments to climate action at a pace and scale that avoids irreversible tipping points. Incremental changes won’t do it. We need deep, systemic transformation…
    For example, the discussions in Bonn will need to determine how the global stocktake will be conducted, who will be involved, how to collect relevant information, how to make COLLECTIVE PROGRESS, how to link to other processes under the Paris Agreement and how the stocktake can inform future national climate commitments.
    Onward

    Geopolitically, the playing field today is even more complex. Sweeping political changes in the United States and elsewhere could make these negotiations more challenging. There is a risk that the COLLECTIVE POLITICAL WILL to deliver a robust transparency and accountability framework may be weakened…
    http://carbon-pulse.com/33946/

    about the author above:

    World Bank: Paula Caballero
    Paula Caballero was Senior Director of the World Bank Environment and Natural Resources Global Practice between July 2014 and August 2016. Prior to joining the Bank, she was the Director for Economic, Social and Environmental Affairs in the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Colombia…
    She was a leading voice and negotiator in international fora, including the United Nations Framework Convention on Climate Change, and the Post 2015 framework…
    Earlier in her career, she served with the Energy and Environment Unit for Latin America & Caribbean at UNDP…
    http://blogs.worldbank.org/team/paula-caballero

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    • #
      Rick Will

      Reading that waffle is akin to sticking my finger down my throat – it is beyond pukeworthy. Arc of Ambition = puke; COLLECTIVE WILL = puke; irreversible tipping points – chunder; robust transparency and accountability – dry reaching!!

      50

  • #
    Faye Busch

    And if foreign aid was channeled direct instead of through a global bureaucracy, the poor may win too.

    America could have a dedicated “army” to help distressed populations in horrendous situations with food/water, medical supplies, etc, etc. Without the UN’s suck of the sav, all money would go directly to the problem.

    Trump’s idea to keep refugees in their own countries in safe places is practical and better for the world.

    The sooner the UN is out of our lives, the better. You know the UN runs our lives through our local Councils, don’t you?

    Trump is our only hope.

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      OriginalSteve

      Have a look at a lot of the Bills that go to Oz parliament – they usually have references to UN treaties in them. In effect, our laws are crafted around the Communist UN.

      The ugly reality – the UN has power and standing becasue our govt ( and other national govts ) directly endorse and support it and kiss its rear end.

      No govt support – no UN. Simple.

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  • #
    pat

    ***yet another sporting analogy!

    4 May: WaPo Editorial: Leaving the Paris agreement would be a gratuitous thumb in everyone’s eye
    Staying in the agreement is costless, while leaving would rightly provoke sharp and sustained international outrage…
    The Paris agreement does not formally obligate the United States to make any particular level of emissions cuts…
    If the Trump administration wants to move that balance toward fossil fuel interests, it does not have to leave the Paris agreement to do so…
    Given all that, leaving Paris would be nothing more than a gratuitous thumb in the eye of practically every important nation on the planet, a bizarre and irrational ***unforced error…
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/the-harm-of-leaving-the-paris-accord/2017/03/04/ca831394-0053-11e7-99b4-9e613afeb09f_story.html?tid=a_inl&utm_term=.eb65697c9e64

    yesterday’s editorial, more of the same. “Paris” is meaningless, so you should stay in:

    3 May: WaPo Editorial: Trump wants to leave the Paris agreement. That would be a huge mistake.
    Paris exiters argue that the United States cannot remain in and revise downward the international commitment…
    This is nonsense. World negotiators considered making the agreement’s climate commitment language stronger, preventing countries from backtracking on their pledges. They purposely declined to do so…

    Nothing in the Paris agreement could stop him from keeping the United States in the system and Mr. Obama’s pledge on the books, and then simply declining to meet the pledge. It is fanciful to imagine that U.S. courts would interpret Paris, an agreement with almost no legal requirements, otherwise. Even this path would be better than pulling out entirely. Staying in keeps the Trump administration at the international table as potentially significant decisions are made on technology and decarbonization…
    https://www.washingtonpost.com/opinions/trump-wants-to-leave-the-paris-agreement-that-would-be-a-huge-mistake/2017/05/03/10633a2e-3033-11e7-8674-437ddb6e813e_story.html?utm_term=.1541a853ec6a

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    • #
      Forrest Gardener

      If El Wapo advocates something the prima facie that is a good reason to do the opposite.

      50

  • #
    pat

    Nato’s supreme allied commander for transformation?

    4 May: UK Independent: Nato warns climate change is ‘global security threat’ as Donald Trump mulls over Paris Agreement
    ‘It’s not too late, but it is time’ warns the organisation’s supreme allied command
    by Rachel Roberts and agencies; The Associated Press contributed to this report
    “There is a huge necessity that the UN continues to involve all nations and co-ordinate the action of all nations to fight climate change”, said General Denis Mercier, Nato’s supreme allied commander for ***transformation.

    ”If one nation, especially the biggest nation … if they do not recognise a problem, then we will have trouble dealing with the causes of climate change.”
    Though he did not single out any country by name BLAH BLAH…
    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/nato-warns-climate-change-global-warming-security-risk-donald-trump-considers-paris-agreement-a7716711.html

    3 May: Daily Caller: Michael Bastasch: Policy Experts Call On Trump To Abandon ‘Unconstitutional’ Paris Climate Treaty
    Competitive Enterprise Institute (CEI) senior fellows Chris Horner and Marlo Lewis published a paper Wednesday arguing President Barack Obama joined the Paris agreement in 2016 by ignoring the U.S. Constitution to make his climate policies immune to legal challenges.
    “President Obama didn’t honor his constitutional responsibility to get advice and consent of the Senate,” Lewis told The Daily Caller News Foundation…

    “This treaty is designed to expand every government’s control over private energy-related capital,” Lewis said, adding Obama wanted to use Paris to make his “domestic energy policies immune to legal challenges.”
    “There is no way on Earth an executive can reorganize the economy for the next 35 years,” Lewis said…
    “If Trump wants to preserve his legacy, America can’t stay in an agreement that’s designed to bankrupt the fossil fuel industry,” Lewis said.
    http://dailycaller.com/2017/05/03/policy-experts-call-on-trump-to-abandon-unconstitutional-paris-climate-treaty/

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    pat

    no end in sight to this power grab:

    29 Apr: ClimateCentral: U.N. Risk Chief: Put a Price on Disasters
    By Anastasia Moloney, Thomson Reuters Foundation
    Calculating the costs of natural disasters is a valuable way for governments to recognize and limit the potential for damage, especially as extreme weather linked to climate change occurs more often, the United Nations’ disaster prevention chief says.

    Recent deadly landslides caused by floods in Peru and Colombia show the urgent need for governments to prepare better and invest more, said Robert Glasser, head of the U.N. Office for Disaster Risk Reduction (UNISDR)…

    “It’s about tying climate risk together with disaster risk more broadly and quantifying the costs historically and projecting future costs,” he said…
    “With climate change, we are seeing a marked increase in extreme weather,” Glasser said.

    Global economic losses from disasters have reached an average of $250 billion to $300 billion annually, according to a 2015 report by UNISDR.
    A yearly global investment of $6 billion would pay off in benefits of $360 billion in less damage and fewer economic losses in 15 years, the report said.
    Yet spending on preparedness and resilience remains low. The U.N. has called on governments to spend at least 1 percent of development aid by 2020 on disaster preparation, but they currently spend just half that amount.

    Experts plan to address ways of lessening the impact of disasters and boosting funding next month in Mexico at a major meeting to review progress on the Sendai framework for disaster risk reduction that was adopted in Japan in 2015…
    http://www.climatecentral.org/news/un-risk-chief-put-a-price-on-disasters-21401

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    Angry

    I have been praying that Donald Trump has the courage to do this !

    Then the US can start to become a beacon to the world again !!

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  • #
    pat

    4 May: China.org: He Shan: Solar-industry leader calls for action on Paris deal
    JinkoSolar, a global leader in the photovoltaic (PV) industry, attended B20 (Business 20) Summit in Berlin on May 2-3 and called for action on the implementation of the Paris Agreement.
    At the summit, whose theme is “Resilience, Responsibility, Responsiveness – Towards a Future-oriented, Sustainable World Economy,” how to promote sustainable development of economy and implement the Paris Agreement are key issues on the agenda…
    Qian believed if enterprises can seize the opportunity brought by energy transformation, a new growth engine will emerge for enterprises…

    Carbon trade and carbon pricing are at the exploration stage and need unified standards. China will launch a national carbon emission trade system in 2017, putting itself on a path towards green, low-carbon and climate change-adaptive economy. This year’s B20 Summit has proposed building a platform dedicated to the strategic dialogue for carbon pricing, meaning that solid progress will be made on carbon trade in 2017…READ ON
    http://www.china.org.cn/business/2017-05/04/content_40742908.htm

    3 May: The Hill: Undoing the damage caused by the flawed ‘social cost of carbon’ metric
    By Rep. Evan Jenkins (R-W.Va.)
    (Jenkins represents West Virginia’s 3rd District and is a member of the Appropriations Subcommittee on the Interior, Environment, and Related Agencies)
    It is important that Congress continues to pursue further reform to limit and reduce the regulatory bureaucracy. One particularly contentious issue is misuse of the previous administration’s environmental models and metrics in rulemaking. The Environmental Protection Agency (EPA) and other federal agencies have increasingly used an ambiguous metric, the “social cost of carbon,” to justify their environmental rulemaking…

    Unsurprisingly, the previous administration ignored longstanding precedent in its cost-benefit analyses. For one, it calculated the global benefits while only estimating the domestic costs, leading to a significantly higher estimate per ton of carbon. It also disregarded Office of Management and Budget (OMB) guidance regarding the application of appropriate discount rates to its estimates, which skews the dollar amount dramatically higher…

    Since its first use of the social cost of carbon, the Obama administration regularly recalculated the models, often increasing the supposed cost of small increases of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere — and thus the purported monetary benefits derived from reducing those emissions.
    There are other problems inherent to the social cost of carbon, including the use of climate modeling that likely overstates the sensitivity of the Earth’s climate to increased carbon dioxide emissions…

    Trump took an important step by disbanding the Interagency Working Group that concocted the metrics, and he halted the use of social cost of greenhouse gases in the rulemaking process. It is imperative that Congress also act to provide legislative certainty on these measures…READ ON
    http://thehill.com/blogs/congress-blog/energy-environment/331820-undoing-the-damage-caused-by-the-flawed-social-cost-of

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    pat

    a little more on the B20 Summit:

    4 May: Yahoo: PR Newswire: JinkoSolar Exclusively Invited to Deliver a Speech at B20 Summit in Berlin
    Ms. Dany Qian (JinkoSolar) also attended the panel “Towards a Future-Oriented Sustainable Economy: Energy, Climate Change and Resource Efficiency” with IEA, BASF, Enel and Continental. The B20 is convinced that a future-oriented, sustainable, and competitive world economy can only be guaranteed if businesses keep finding innovative solutions to curtail climate change, foster the energy transition, and decrease resource intensity. The G20 can achieve this by implementing the Paris Agreement, accelerating the market readiness and deployment of low-carbon technologies, and by establishing a Resource Efficiency Platform.

    B20 Germany 2017 – May 2-3 Berlin
    Press Release: B20 Chair Juergen Heraeus: The G20 needs to have more courage in actively shaping globalization…ETC ETC
    https://www.b20germany.org/

    4 May: CCTV: Xinhua: Merkel: G20 to further promote globalization, inclusive growth
    Berlin: German Chancellor Angela Merkel Wednesday told B20 Summit 2017 in Berlin that globalization and inclusive growth are important for the global economy…
    Merkel assured Germany, as the host of Group of 20 (G20) Summit 2017, would commit to further promoting globalization and a strong, sustainable and inclusive economic growth…

    3 May: InternationalPressSyndicate: ITPO Enhances UN Presence in Bonn
    BONN (IDN) – The United Nations Industrial Development Organization (UNIDO), based in Vienna, has officially opened an Investment and Technology Promotion Office (ITPO) in Bonn, which hosts nearly 20 UN secretariats, including the UN Framework Convention on Climate Change (UNFCCC) and the UN Convention to Combat Desertification (UNCCD).
    The office was opened on May 3, nearly six months after the German Federal Minister for Economic Cooperation and Development (BMZ), Gerd Müller, and the UNIDO Director General,LI Yong concluded an agreement in November 2016 on the margins of UNIDO’s 50th Anniversary celebrations at the Vienna International Centre…

    The roles of investment and sustainable technology are highlighted in the 2030 Agenda for Sustainable Development, and especially in Sustainable Development Goal 9 that seeks to “build resilient infrastructure, promote sustainable industrialization and foster innovation”.

    UNIDO expects the ITPO Germany to complement the efforts of the Government of Germany to promote investment and sustainable technology in developing countries and, specifically, will be well-positioned to support the BMZ’s Charter for the Future approved in July 2014. Furthermore, it will help contribute to the implementation of the Third Industrial Development Decade for Africa, declared by a UN General Assembly Resolution in 2016.

    Germany has been a strong supporter of UNIDO since its inception in 1966, and was a founding member when UNIDO became a specialized agency in 1985.
    “Throughout this longstanding relationship, the Government of Germany has provided substantial support to UNIDO programmes and projects, mainly through voluntary contributions from the Federal Ministry for Economic Cooperation and Development,” according to UNIDO.
    http://www.indepthnews.net/index.php/global-governance/un-insider/1119-itpo-enhances-un-presence-in-bonn

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  • #
    PeterS

    EMERGENCY: ANOTHER VICTORIAN POWER PLANT TO CLOSE

    Australia is being destroyed from within thanks to the socialists.

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      Dave

      This is not true, surely?

      Victoria can’t afford to do this at the moment!

      They will be in BLACKOUT continually!

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      • #
        PeterS

        Actually I would be happy for all the employees there to be sacked and I will work there for half their pay. Serious!

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        • #
          Dave

          Exactly
          As Tony said years ago
          “Just shut them down”
          Wait and see what happens!

          This will be a good lesson me thinks!

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    • #
      Rick Will

      AGL can just install more solar panels and wind turbines; quickly – and problem solved if you believe their advertising:
      https://www.youtube.com/user/aglenergy

      No wonder the unions want to make hay while the coal gets burnt rather than sun shining.

      It is wondrous how easily duped people have been. Those that do not make their own electricity (courtesy of the poor) are feeling the rising cost of electricity while being told that renewables are lower cost than coal – how stupid is that. The lack of understanding around intermittents meeting demand as it occurs is mind boggling. I doubt that there are more than a handful of people across the globe who actually appreciate the gap. I doubt Finkel will get it. The CSIRO are emboldened by the Finkel enquiry and touting the virtues of their stupendously silly energy roadmap.
      http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-04-28/carbon-price-vital-for-emissions-free-future,-roadmap-shows/8478364

      This roadmap needs to be torn to shreds for the nonsense it embodies.

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      • #

        AGL can just install more solar panels and wind turbines; quickly – and problem solved if you believe their advertising: (and then their youtoob blurb)

        H0lee $hit, these idi0t$ actually believe this.

        We’re r00ted!

        Tony.

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        • #
          Rick Will

          AGL are heavily invested in renewables. Those investments are making a return. They are riding the wave of delusion that renewables are lower cost than coal right now. I am not sure if AGL staff are deluded but it does not matter if they are making money by whatever legal means.

          There is so much inertia in the charge for renewables and the widespread delusion that it is lower cost than coal generation that it is not being questioned. If you asked a 1000 people in the street what is cheapest I bet you would find the majority say renewables despite paying more as renewables have increased. Even the PM is saying that gas companies are price gouging in Australia. Electricity prices will continue to skyrocket and at some point they will even out at the cost it takes to produce on-demand supply from intermittent generation – about AUD450/MWh. At that wholesale price the NEM will be cactus because it will be cheaper for everyone to make their own or go back to kerosine lamps and wood fires. There is no benefit of scale with solar in the vast majority of Australia and very small benefit of scale with wind. So little point in having a national grid once renewables have taken over generation.

          The propaganda on the message that renewables are cheap is widespread and is winning the public perception (deluded as it is:
          https://cleantechnica.com/2017/01/22/renewables-now-cheapest-renewable-energy-costs-low-too-high/
          Few consumers have any idea how the RET works in Australia and fewer than a handful of people globally actually appreciate the cost of renewables meeting supply on demand.

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        • #

          Umm, watch the video that Rick Will linked to above, (shown at this link) and it only runs for 45 seconds, and then note Comment 65 below from pat, how the Unions are holding AGL to ransom, and how AGL responded, by saying that they will lock out the workers, and stage a sequential shut down of Loy Yang for safety reasons, and that’s safety of the power plant processes themselves.

          At the video, note at the 7 second mark, where the talking head mentions that stating 2022, they will be closing down that coal fired power plant.

          However, then he says this:

          We can’t just switch off today, or things won’t switch on tomorrow

          So, they umm, ….. KNOW that there will be blackouts and are still going ahead with it.

          This is a bluff.

          First South Oz goes down, then Tassie, then Southern NSW, and then Victoria. It won’t be rolling blackouts in some residential areas. This will be Southern Australia ….. BLACK.

          As if that will ever be allowed to happen.

          I’ll bet the phones in all those above areas were running hot last night.

          They know.

          This will be painted as a big money grubbing company wanting to get its own way, because the leftie media won’t blame the pure as the driven snow Unions.

          But, but, but, you can bet the pollies involved, Andrews and whatever his name is in SthOz won’t even mention the possibility of that there will be total blackouts if a coal fired power plant shuts down.

          Don’t kid me. They know all right.

          Tony.

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          • #
            Ted O'Brien

            Do they know something that we don’t?

            e.g. What is the bluff all about? Could it be that AGL knows that the RET can only end badly? That their short term profits derived from higher prices will all become losses as demand collapses? They should!

            Do they want the RET removed before the economy hits a wall?

            What are they trying to leverage?

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    • #
      Dennis

      And Shorten led union controlled Labor have already announced their fifty per cent renewables policy to be implemented if they are returned to government.

      40

  • #
    pat

    3 May: UtilityDive: The carbon consensus: Generators, analysts back CO2 price at FERC technical conference
    Putting a price on carbon was just about the only common ground power sector stakeholders could find in two days of discussion on wholesale market reforms
    By Gavin Bade
    Alone in the swamp
    While power sector stakeholders appeared in relative consensus on carbon pricing at FERC, they are outliers in Washington. In addition to suspending the social cost of carbon group, President Trump has moved to roll back a number of Obama-era environmental regulations, a point spotlighted by Sue Tierney of the Analysis Group.
    “I bet this is the only federal building in Washington, D.C. where there is a discussion of carbon pricing and deep decarbonization,” she said to laughs from the crowd. “So very good, FERC. We like it.”

    But whether those discussions will continue is up in the air. After Commissioner Honorable steps down in June, FERC will be left with just one commissioner, and it needs at least three for quorum.
    While the president is said to have settled on three nominees — lawyer Kevin McIntyre, Senate aide Neil Chatterjee and Pennsylvania PUC Chairman Robert Powelson — not one of the figures were present at the conference, nor have they indicated how they would handle state carbon goals…
    http://www.utilitydive.com/news/the-carbon-consensus-generators-analysts-back-co2-price-at-ferc-technical/441862/

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  • #
    pat

    3 May: Reuters: Emily Flitter: Wood pellet fuel deemed ‘carbon neutral’ in U.S. spending bill
    “Recent advances in science and accounting for pollution from different types of woody biomass have clarified that burning trees to produce electricity actually increases carbon emissions compared with fossil fuels for many decades and contributes to other air pollution problems,” a group of 60 U.S. scientists wrote in a 2014 letter to the UK’s secretary of state for energy and climate change.

    The European Union already treats biomass as carbon-friendly and subsidizes its production…

    “We are thrilled to see such strong bipartisan support for biomass, which Congress is officially recognizing as the carbon neutral, renewable energy source that it is,” said Dave Tenny, president and chief executive of the National Alliance of Forest Owners, in a statement emailed to Reuters on Wednesday…

    Environmental groups criticized the decision…
    http://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-budget-climatechange-idUSKBN17Z2LB

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    Eddie

    It’s a pity all that effort that went into Paris wasn’t employed for something more useful, like redistributing the world’s wealth for instance – but it wasn’t, so get over it. No use keeping an agreement just for what it might have been.

    The law of unintended consequences is a far better application of the precautionary principle than for climate hysteria.

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    pat

    3 May: Vox: David Roberts: California is about to revolutionize climate policy … again
    The state’s cap-and-trade program would be replaced by a new, sleeker one.
    The changes that SB 775 proposes for the state’s carbon trading program are dramatic — and, to my eyes, amazingly thoughtful. I know some environmental groups have reservations (on which more later), but in my opinion, if it passes in anything close to its current form, it will represent the most important advance in carbon-pricing policy in the US in a decade. Maybe ever. Yeah, really…

    The legislature cannot simply reauthorize and extend the existing program. If it does, all the piles of cheap allowances laying around (the current system allows unlimited “banking,” i.e., hoarding of allowances from year to year) will suddenly be worth much, much more, as the market prices compliance costs through 2030 into the value of today’s allowances…

    The elegant new cap-and-trade system proposed in the California senate
    The system proposed in the new bill reflects the fact that policymakers expect cap-and-trade to take over as the primary instrument of carbon reductions in the state…
    It has the following features, almost every one of which will cause a tingle in the toes of carbon wonks:
    1) It is entirely new…ETC

    2) It includes a price collar…
    It provides some price certainty while also offering enough flexibility to allow prices to vary with emissions.
    This does open at least the theoretical possibility that the ceiling won’t be high enough to ensure the necessary emission reductions. (Though, as we will see, the ceiling gets pretty high pretty quick.) But it is also a savvy way to reach out to more conservative legislators without compromising too much…

    ***3) Prices start low and rise, predictably, ***in perpetuity.
    In 2020, the price floor begins at $20, just a little higher than the price floor of the system it replaces. The price ceiling begins at $30. Both rise in predictable increments, though at different rates.
    The price ceiling rises at $10 per year, plus inflation…
    This keeps prices within a tightly bounded range at first, as people and businesses adjust to the system, while gradually increasing price flexibility over time. It also starts with reasonably low prices, while increasing them fast enough that the ceiling hits $100 before 2030…

    Finally, note that the program, as proposed, operates in perpetuity. (The price ceiling will be well over $200 by 2040, over $300 by 2050.) There is no statutory finish line at which point it needs to be reauthorized…

    5) In includes zero (0) offsets…ETC

    I gotta say, if this thing passes, it will be close to a miracle…

    The significance of SB 775 is not just that it would rationalize and accelerate carbon reductions in California, but that it would show other jurisdictions what ambitious, state-of-the-art carbon-pricing policy looks like. It might even — ironically given the state’s heavily blue politics — chart a course toward bipartisan carbon policy. It is, after all, California, where all things are possible.
    https://www.vox.com/energy-and-environment/2017/5/3/15512258/california-revolutionize-cap-and-trade

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    pat

    shut down the ABC.
    apparently there’s hardly a soul in Whyalla who isn’t happy about Adani’s throwing a lifeline to the Arrium steel works, but ABC finds one and begins by stating he’s a former “BHP steelworks employee” even tho the guy’s Wikipedia page (yes he has one) makes no mention of this:

    4 May: ABC: Daniel Keane: Adani’s $74 million announcement puts Whyalla at centre of jobs, environment dilemma
    Whyalla diver, business owner, environmentalist and former BHP steelworks employee Tony Bramley sounds anguished when he ponders the dilemma that has now embroiled his regional city.
    On one side of that conundrum is the environment; on the other, jobs.

    “It’s a special dilemma for me because I have had a lot of environmental interests, and still do, but I also realise people have an absolute need for work,” Mr Bramley said.
    “Do we build steel to export coal? We’re on a train, can we get off it? I don’t know what the answer is.”…
    “It’s a sign of how badly the town is doing at the moment that I would say there would be almost 100 per cent support in this community for the coal mine to go ahead because that would guarantee at least another year or two on the town’s future.”

    That view is shared by former state Labor MP and current Whyalla Mayor Lyn Breuer, who proclaimed Adani’s announcement as “only good news” for the steelworks.
    “You won’t get too much dissent in Whyalla,” she said…

    For about 15 years, Mr Bramley worked in administration at the steelworks, and he understands its central place in local life. But he is also a passionate environmental campaigner, having fought to save the giant cuttlefish in Upper Spencer Gulf.
    He currently runs an eco-tourism business…
    “I’ve been all around the world diving — South Africa, America, Hawaii, South Pacific, New Zealand,” he said.
    He has also spent time exploring the Great Barrier Reef…
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2017-05-04/whyalla-at-heart-of-environment-employment-dilemma/8497912

    so many people in this country, yet ABC gives voice to Bramley time and time again!!! I knew this would be the case the minute I read the Whyalla piece. close down the ABC:

    they even use the same photo of Bramley in 2012 as in the Whyalla piece today:

    2012: ABC: Commercial diver Tony Bramley fears for the breeding area
    http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-06-08/tony-bramley.jpg/4059876

    Apr 2015: ABC: Washed up cuttlefish bones a ‘positive’ sign for ongoing population recovery in South Australia
    Tony Bramley from Whyalla Diving Services said plenty of cuttlefish bones were washing up and that was a good sign…

    Sept 2014: ABC The World Today: Scientists baffled by return of giant cuttlefish
    TONY BRAMLEY: You can move to within a metre of them without any interruption in their behaviour…

    May 2014: ABC: Welcome back giant cuttlefish
    Dive tour operator Tony Bramley says that even after decades of working with the animals, they’re still largely unknown…

    2011: ABC The World Today: Olympic Dam expansion causes concerns
    TONY BRAMLEY: There will be a lot more opposition from those dedicated groups that have been formed to oppose this development. They have only just begun to fight and they’ll use every means that they can to stop the process – absolutely…

    2008: ABC: Effectiveness of shark shields questioned at inquest
    Whyalla-based commercial diver Tony Bramley runs a diving operation from the South Australian regional centre on the Spencer Gulf.
    He says the shields have potentially saved his life on more than one occasion…

    2007: ABC The World Today: Cuttlefish endangered by mine plans
    ELEANOR HALL: BHP Billiton’s Olympic Dam uranium mine is set to become the largest open cut mine in the Southern Hemisphere and the key driver of South Australia’s mining boom…
    Local diver Tony Bramley has been observing the phenomenon for more than 20 years…

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      Raven

      Tony Bramley – The ABC’s go-to man in South Australia.
      Interviewed at least ten times all the way back to 2007 on anything from the steel industry, right through to dam building, employment, shark shields and cuttlefish.

      Is there anything on which Tony Bramley isn’t the authority?

      Usually I’d say sell the ABC but who’d buy it with this example of plain lazy journalism.
      Just close it down.

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    Rex Tillerson presentation to State Department audience,
    a measured walk through the global hotspots. or maybe with
    RT at the tiller, a negotiating of the reefs and shoals of
    this post-cold-war very complex period. Go Trump.
    https://theconservativetreehouse.com/2017/05/03/secretary-rex-tillerson-presentation-to-state-dept-audience-a-walk-around-the-glob

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    cedarhill

    Pariah Status — how funny. Recall 1956? The Ugly American. So I guess it’s now The Pariah Ugly Fat American? Even Americans don’t like Americans.

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      AndyG55

      oh dear, US status will drop with Iran, Syria, Iraq, North Korea, EU and any number of other dictator-run third-world countries….

      oh dear.. what a pity. ;-)

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    el gordo

    ‘Fiji prime minister Frank Bainimarama, who will host this year’s climate change talks in Bonn, has asked Australia prime minister Malcolm Turnbull to urge US president Donald Trump to stay within the Paris climate treaty.

    ‘In his first address as president of COP23, Bainimarama told the Carbon Markets Institute conference in Melbourne on Tuesday that he had written a letter to Trump, who has dismissed climate science as a Chinese hoax, urging the US to stay within the Paris agreement.

    ‘Bainimarama met with Turnbull at the PM’s home in Sydney on Sunday and said he had asked Turnbull to convey the message to Trump when he meets with him next week.

    “My message to Donald Trump, and the message that I hope Malcolm Turnbull will also convey is ‘Mr President, do not abandon the Paris agreement, please stay the course’.”

    RE New Economy

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      el gordo

      Its entirely appropriate that a political dictator should be the president of COP23.

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    pat

    4 May: Herald Sun: Anthony Galloway: AGL to shut down Loy Yang power plant over industrial action threat
    THE Andrews Government has moved to stop Victoria’s biggest power station from shutting down, which would have left the state without half of its energy supply.
    The state’s Industrial Relations Minister Natalie Hutchins will make an application to the Fair Work Commission to end industrial action at the Loy Yang A power station in the Latrobe Valley.
    The move comes after energy giant AGL announced it would lock out its entire workforce and shut down the power plant, and its associated mine, on May 15.
    With the mine … also supplying power to the Loy Yang B station, the move would wipe out 50 per cent of the state’s energy supply…

    The company announced the drastic move to shut down the plant after receiving notice from the ETU of “consecutive stoppages” from May 15.
    AGL Loy Yang general manager Steve Rieniets told the Herald Sun the union action was an unacceptable threat to the plant’s operation and it needed to completely shut it down before the strikes began…
    “We need to lock out the entire site simultaneously with the industrial action, this will allow us to shut down the station in a systematic way to protect equipment from being damaged.”
    Workers have twice rejected a pay offer including a 20 per cent rise over four years…

    Opposition energy spokesman David Southwick said the dispute showed that Hazelwood power station – which closed its doors in March – should have remained open.
    “The closure of Hazelwood after only a few months’ notice has left Victoria exposed and given the unions more bargaining power and able to hold the state to ransom,” Mr Southwick said.
    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/business/agl-to-shut-down-loy-yang-power-plant-over-industrial-action-threat/news-story/0ecf02c1817f9b1aac696d069a2ea262

    earlier Bolt had the same Herald Sun link, but with the following excerpts. it seems the above piece is an updated version:

    4 May: Bolt blog: Emergency: Another Victorian Power Plant to Close
    ENERGY producer and retailer AGL Energy says it will shut down operations at its Loy Yang power plant in Victoria from May 15 after two workers’ unions threatened to disrupt work there as part of industrial action.
    “As a consequence of the proposed action, AGL Loy Yang will not be able to continue operations.
    “This will require both the Loy Yang A power station and the mine be shut down,” AGL Loy Yang General Manager Steve Rieniets said…
    http://www.heraldsun.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/emergency-another-victorian-power-plant-to-close/news-story/05b4dc6f93e2d035828d9bb334565d4d

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      So, Union holds AGL to ransom. AGL holds the State to ransom.

      What’s not to like!

      May 15, Victoria shuts down.

      May 16, People find out how important coal fired power really is.

      May 17, plans submitted for a number of HELE coal fired plants to replacing aging plants.

      Pity that between now and May 14, Dan Andrews supports his Union buddies and pressures AGL.

      Go on AGL, don’t threaten, just DO IT.

      Tony.

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      Talk about Scylla and Charybdis.

      If Dan Andrews supports his Union buddies and pressures AGL not to shut down, does that get seen as a green leaning State premier actually supporting coal fired power, you know, actually admitting that his State CANNOT get by without coal fired power.

      Oh dear!

      What happens next?

      Tony.

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    Oliver K. Manuel

    Here in Missouri (the show-me state), the rivers are flooded, at least two major interstate highways are closed because of flood waters, and it’s raining more today.

    Climatologists are as respected as fortune tellers and witch doctors, and at least one of the residents knows what world leaders and their well-paid consensus scientists seek to ignore:

    http://www.omatumr.com/Photographs/Suns_core.htm

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    Tom O

    I absolutely LOVE this phrase -

    The provision at issue, Article 4.11, states that a nation “may at any time adjust its existing nationally determined contribution with a view to enhancing its level of ambition.”

    Seems to me the whole damn deal is voided on that statement. Name one nation that polled its people to determine what the nation’s contribution should be. This was a deal by so called “leaders,” not nations, and no, they are not the same. It is time for ALL nations to come to the realization that “national commitments” require the input of the people, and for all people to realize that their governments are not free to sell them into slavery.

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      Fred Streeter

      a nation “may at any time adjust its existing nationally determined [i.e., by its government] contribution with a view to enhancing [i.e., upwards] its level of ambition
      [i.e., to reduce GHG emissions].”

      Were a new government elected on a ‘reduce our level of ambition’ ticket, that clause would not permit it.

      (IMHO :) )

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    Eddie

    Does the Gruinad think talk of “Catastrophic” damage (their double-quotes) to the English vine crop is being perhaps a tad alarmist ?
    English vineyards report “Catastrophic” damage after severe April frost.

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      TdeF

      Odd. Climate catastrophe and no mention of Climate Change. Surely Global Warming is responsible for the frosts? More windmills needed.

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    CO2 has no significant effect on climate and here is why:
    At a scale of the size of atoms, the atmosphere consists of gas molecules with empty space between them. Activity of the gas molecules determines what can be measured as temperature and pressure. Imagery of the activity of the molecules making up the atmosphere is helpful. Wikipedia, in the article on kinetic theory of gases, has a pretty good 2-D animation of the 3-D activity. It shows simulated molecules bouncing elastically off each other and the walls of the container. At any point in time, the speed (and energy) of the molecules ranges from zero to high values with the highest probability being towards lower energy.

    Emission of electromagnetic radiation from a solid or liquid surface complies with the Planck spectrum and Stephan-Boltzmann (T4) law. This also includes most particles of smoke and aerosols because they typically contain millions of molecules. Emission of radiation from gas molecules is entirely different. It is quantized and depends on the energy levels of individual molecules which are determined probabilistically according to the Maxwell-Boltzmann distribution which favors lower energy photons. The average energy level of molecules in the Maxwell-Boltzmann distribution depends on the temperature.

    Graphs of the probability distribution curve shape are shown in the Wikipedia article on Maxwell-Boltzmann. Molecules jostled to high enough energy for long enough time can emit a photon. This is called, for lack of a better term, reverse-thermalization. The Maxwell-Boltzmann distribution is more highly populated at lower energy levels resulting in biasing the Planck spectrum radiation emitted by the surface to lower energies favored according to Maxwell-Boltzmann. This also results in the higher energy (shorter wavelength) photons absorbed by the CO2 being substantially redirected to the lower energy (longer wavelength) photons emitted by water vapor molecules. The process is progressively more pronounced as temperature declines with increasing altitude.

    Water vapor is the only significant greenhouse gas. What is happening, and humanity is probably contributing, is increasing water vapor. Average atmospheric water vapor is increasing more than twice as fast as it should be based on temperature increase alone (feedback). The ghg effect of that is countering the cooling that would otherwise be occurring. We will soon know if it is enough to prevent decent into another Little Ice Age . . . or worse. The physics is further described at http://globalclimatedrivers2.blogspot.com which also explains why CO2 has no significant effect on climate and identifies what does.

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    Rod Stuart

    This is a little production made specifically for school aged children. It explains the errors that can be made in the “False Choice Cafe”.

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    David Maddison

    O/T

    REMINDER – SUBMISSIONS DUE IN TODAY – LAST CHANCE!

    IF YOU DON’T TELL THEM THE TRUTH THEY’LL NEVER KNOW!

    Don’t forget submission are due soon to this inquiry.

    http://www.environment.gov.au/climate-change/review-climate-change-policies/discussion-paper-2017

    How you can get involved

    The Discussion Paper is open for public consultation until 5 May 2017.

    Read the Discussion Paper

    The 2017 review of climate change policies Discussion Paper is available to download.

    Review of climate change policies Discussion Paper (PDF – 540.35 KB) | (DOCX – 4.97 MB) ​
    Complete a cover sheet for submissions

    Submission cover sheet (PDF – 54.58 KB) ​| (DOCX – 51.83 KB)
    Send your submission

    Please complete the cover sheet above and send your submission to climatechangereview@environment.gov.au

    Electronic submissions (in Microsoft Word .doc or .docx) are preferred.

    Alternatively, submissions may be posted to the address below to arrive by the due date:

    Climate Change Policies Review – Discussion Paper submissions
    2017 Review Branch
    Department of the Environment and Energy
    GPO Box 787
    Canberra ACT 2601

    Submissions close at 5:00pm AEST on 5 May 2017.

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      David Maddison

      Here is my submission, it is based on my submission to the Finkel inquiry. Please let me know any errors or suggestions before I submit.

      SUBMISSION BY DR DAVID MADDISON
      5th May, 2017

      EXECUTIVE SUMMARY
      The hypothesis of whether anthropogenic climate change (“global warming”) is assumed to be proven by government and is driving policies which have lead to Australia having a power crisis resulting in some of the world’s most expensive electricity (and unreliable in the case of SA). A solution is proposed which allows Australia to have inexpensive and weather-independent electrical power generation.

      Government “believes” in “global warming” because of a flawed understanding of the scientific method, believing scientific fact to be driven by a supposed 97 percent consensus of scientists which is not true in any case.

      Fortunately, it is found that anthropogenic influences on climate are insignificant and power generation methodologies compatible with this finding will be suggested.

      These methodologies are based on well established technologies, can be implemented immediately and at relatively low cost, and solve the main problems of energy diffuseness and variability with wind and solar and because these technologies can be operated full time at maximum power if necessary, no expensive battery or pumped hydroelectric storage is required.

      INTRODUCTION
      This review demands that a rigorous application of the scientific method be applied as the economic future of Australia is at stake.

      Before discussing solutions to Australia’s energy crisis which is caused by “climate change policies”, the nature of which is expensive and unreliable electricity it is first necessary to question the fundamental premise upon which there has been such a massive and ongoing investment in expensive intermittent, low density energy sources.

      THE CLIMATE
      The ostensible reason for this investment away from traditional sources of coal and gas fired generation is the hypothesis that emissions of carbon dioxide cause catastrophic anthropogenic global warming (CAGW).

      There is no evidence whatsoever that this hypothesis is true or even plausible, in fact, it is widely discredited now by scientists outside of the “climate change industry” and the claim has only ever been demonstrable with inappropriately altered historical temperature records.

      It surely has not escaped the attention of well-informed people, the extensive alteration of historic temperature records that has occurred with Australia’s and other climate agencies to the effect of cooling the past and warming the present? (e.g. http://joannenova.com.au/2014/08/the-heat-is-on-bureau-of-meteorology-altering-climate-figures-the-australian/, https://realclimatescience.com/history-of-nasanoaa-temperature-corruption/, http://joannenova.com.au/2017/02/noaa-whistleblower-tells-how-they-used-bad-data-to-rub-out-pause-for-paris/ to name a few of thousands of references to this.)

      In the light of extensive documentation of the alteration of historical climate records why is not the question of whether there is real anthropogenic global warming considered? The scientific method DEMANDS that if the data is bad then then the results are INVALID.

      There are further issues to consider such as:

      - CO2 is not a particularly powerful “greenhouse” gas and is present in the atmosphere in only trace quantities. It is estimated that of all the approximate 400ppm of CO2 in the atmosphere, only 4.3% or 17.2ppm is of anthropogenic origin. (http://notrickszone.com/2017/02/25/blockbuster-paper-finds-just-15-of-co2-growth-since-industrialization-is-due-to-human-emissions) It is simply not plausible that the small amount of anthropogenic CO2 in the atmosphere is responsible for the temperature changes claimed. In the past CO2 levels have been much higher than this with commensurate flourishing of plant life and hence all life (since CO2 is vital for plant life, a fact that many don’t seem to know).

      - The geological record also shows that natural CO2 concentrations lag temperature changes by hundreds of years and do not lead them. This is an undeniable scientific fact. Natural temperature changes are responsible for later changes in CO2.

      - The IPCC computer models have no forecasting or hindcasting ability whatsoever, they cannot even make predictions into the past when the answer is known. Therefore they are scientifically invalid. It is questionable whether a chaotic process such as climate can be modelled in any case. There used to be a saying “Garbage In Garbage Out” GIGO. These models represent a tremendous waste of supercomputing resources which should be used on legitimate scientific research. Australia’s energy policy should not be based on faulty and invalid computer models.

      - There has been no global warming whatsoever for nearly 20 years and only 0.57C over the last 154 years. We are still coming out of a cool period of 10,000 years ago. In any case, climate is not static as many people seem to think and constantly changes with natural cycles such as Milankovitch Cycles and variations in solar output, both phenomena of which are responsible for a vast majority of natural climate variations.

      - Global warming is not a bad thing, even if it were happening now. Some of mankind’s greatest achievements happened during naturally warm periods such as the Minoan, Roman and Medieval warm periods. Agricultural output is plentiful in warm periods. This is one reason farmers use greenhouses, often with artificially enhanced CO2 to which promote plant growth. During naturally cool periods such as the Maunder Minimum, many people died due to diminished agricultural output and the effects of the cold.

      - CO2 is at a very low level in geological terms. The minimum level for plants to thrive is around 200ppm compared to about 400ppm we have now. The very slight amount of CO2 put into the atmosphere by mankind provides an additional buffer to protect plant life from CO2 starvation and hence all life. The more CO2 there is in the atmosphere, the better off plant life and all life is. We need more CO2 to enhance crop yields to increase agricultural output for the world’s growing population.

      The present dogma that there is CAGW lacks scientific integrity and is ultimately one of the biggest failures to correctly apply the scientific method in all of history.

      To quote from a reader at comment http://joannenova.com.au/2017/01/unthreaded-week-and-what-a-great-week-it-has-been/ the current “researchers” have the following characteristics:

      They don’t adhere to the philosophy of science.
      They don’t adhere to the scientific method.
      They aren’t remotely sceptical, and indeed shun same.
      They’ve never conducted a relevant experiment in their lives.
      They have no testable hypothesis.
      They’ve never validated their modelling and don’t appear to even consider it necessary.
      The hypothesis they’ve been working on for thirty years has no quantification.
      Richard Feynman would place it squarely within the vague theory category.

      So, no, they aren’t scientists.
      They may be government ‘researchers’, but that’s about it.

      THE “97% CONSENSUS” CLAIM
      The claim of a 97% consensus among scientists that CAGW is real demonstrates a lack of understanding of scientific processes as science is based on fact, not consensus. The 97% figure has been thoroughly debunked in any case. See, for example http://joannenova.com.au/2013/05/cooks-fallacy-97-consensus-study-is-a-marketing-ploy-some-journalists-will-fall-for/

      IF GLOBAL COOLING – HOW WILL “RENEWABLES” COPE?
      While few well-informed scientists believe in CAGW (if they are not dependent on research funding for same), there is certainly some evidence that the earth is heading for a period of significant global cooling, which unlike harmless global warming even if it were happening to any significant degree, is serious because it will result in reduced agricultural output. Some opinions suggest global cooling seems likely to happen because the main thing that predicts global mean temperature is solar output, along with where we happen to be within the Milankovitch Cycle. It is well known that solar output is currently diminishing in accord with established natural cycles.

      Scientists such as Piers Corbyn, John Casey and David Dilley have written and spoken extensively about the forthcoming cooling period that, according to them, we have arguably already entered if unaltered temperature data is examined.

      Global cooling, should it occur, will require that we have access to cheap, reliable, high energy density power which windmills, solar and other “green” power generation schemes (even with energy storage) are simply not capable of delivering, not even in principle.

      AUSTRALIA’S CO2 OUTPUT – THE BIG PICTURE
      Australia produces about as much CO2 from power production as is produced by the respiration of 1.3 billion Chinese people. People themselves are not carbon neutral. Whatever the truth of “climate change”, is the tremendous economic damage done to Australia by “green” energy worth it in the context of a miniscule production of CO2? Is not economic prosperity and viable industry more important when there isn’t really a problem?

      ELECTRICITY PRICES
      The cost of electricity for industry in the USA is about one tenth what Australian industry pays. It is no wonder Australian factories are closing down everywhere. Also, Australian domestic consumers pay around twice as much as US consumers. This is a completely unacceptable situation given the riches of Australian energy resources such as coal, natural gas and deposits of uranium and thorium.

      LEGISLATIVE RESTRICTION CAUSING ENERGY SHORTAGES
      Australia can no longer build new hydroelectric plant, explore for gas in many places, use hydraulic fracturing despite it being a proven and productive technology to obtain gas, and we are not allowed to use nuclear power. This are not the hallmarks of rational policy or a “clever country”, nor indeed wise and informed leadership.

      FUTURE POWER GENERATION
      It is simply not morally or technically correct that a rich country like Australia has to pay Third World prices for electricity or have Third World levels of supply reliability.

      The technologies for cheap, reliable power generation already exist and are well proven. I make the following recommendations.

      RECOMMENDATIONS
      - Australia should retain existing levels of hydroelectric power production. Implement more hydroelectric power production in the limited number of remaining suitable sites if economically acceptable and within reasonable environmental constraints.

      - Retain existing fossil fuel powered generators replacing them only as per normal economic necessity due to depreciation etc.. Upgrade to new technologies where technically and economically feasible.

      - When coal fuelled power stations need to be replaced they can use the next generation supercritical or ultrasupercritical technologies. These are much more economical to run as they use less coal per unit of power produced and less CO2, assuming that was a problem.

      - Install nuclear power generators if economically justified according to whomever wants to build one. These produce no CO2 emissions, assuming that was a problem.

      - Thorium reactor technology should be researched. This produces no CO2.

      - Immediately stop all subsidies for solar and wind generation. As we are constantly told that such power generation methodologies are so cheap that they will run fossil generation out of the market without market interference by government, then there is obviously no need for subsidies or legislative market distortions.

      - Power output ratings for windmills and solar plant need to be honestly presented. To say that a windmill has a power rating of, say 1MW is dishonest when it has a typical capacity factor of 30% so its average deliverable output is effectively 300kW.

      - Remove legislative restrictions against the exploration for new gas resources, hydraulic fracturing, the development of new hydroelectric resources and the use of nuclear power.

      - Investigate reported alteration of Australia’s historic temperature records.

      ATTACHMENTS
      In support of some of the technologies I propose I refer readers to my articles on “Supercritical and Ultrasupercritical Steam Power Stations” in the December 2015 issue of Silicon Chip and “Small Nuclear Reactors – safe power, very low pollution, very low risk” in the June 2016 issue of Silicon Chip. These are provided as attachments.

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    Roy Hogue

    Well, never mind global warming or Paris. We lose even if we all die — apparently anyway. One more thing o be afraid of…

    I always knew there was a good reason to stay away from those cemeteries with all their decaying bodies.

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      Roy Hogue

      And yet even after humans have been around for 10s of thousands of years, or so they tell us, the Earth is still alive and well.

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      PeterS

      Well we could put the bodies on a rocket and send them to the sun, but not before we do the same to all the Greenies as they are doing far more harm to the earth and its inhabitants in so many ways.

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        Roy Hogue

        If history teaches anything it’s that you can’t please everyone no matter what you do. So I wouldn’t waste valuable resources sending bodies or Greenies anywhere. We’ll always have complainers around and at least a large number of them will not have a factual leg to stand on. But it won’t matter to those who look for a cause to follow.

        The solution is for conservatism to become strong enough to rule politics instead of needing to beg at the door all the time. But we never do a very god job of selling the value of more conservative thinking. The allure of free stuff is too great to overcome with just the election of probably the worlds most hated president ever.

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    Stan

    There appears to be no downside for Trump and only benefit, if they pull out of Paris agreement. He would actually welcome the savings to taxpayers if the US was kicked out of the UN. But of course that will never happen, because the UN people are too wedded to all the cash (it’s nothing to do with principles or fixing problems for them).

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      PeterS

      The only downside is for the squealing left who will have temper tantrums much like the North Korean dictator.

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    pat

    4 May: CarbonBrief: Simon Evans: US tells China it has ‘no plan yet’ to meet its 2020 climate target
    The details emerged in a series of terse, repetitive answers to an international climate action peer-review process, known as the Multilateral Assessment. The US submission, which was published this week, says “jobs, economic growth and energy independence” are its priority…
    Carbon Brief has a summary of the written answers submitted by the US, Russia and Japan…

    In its official response, the US administration says it has no plan to meet its 2020 climate target using carbon offsets. It adds:
    “The Administration is reviewing existing policies and regulations in the context of a focus on strengthening US economic growth and promoting jobs for American workers, and will not support policies or regulations that have adverse effects on energy independence and US competitiveness.”

    This pro-forma response is repeated six times. Elsewhere, the US says it “do[es] not have updated information” about the impact of recent policy announcements on emissions. It adds that a question about its 2025 target is “outside the scope” of the assessment process…
    https://www.carbonbrief.org/us-tells-china-it-has-no-plan-yet-to-meet-its-2020-climate-target

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    pat

    couple of laughs:

    4 May: Guardian: Graham Readfearn: Global warming scientists learn lessons from the pause that never was
    New study finds there never was an unexpected lull in climate change but says the science community needs to communicate better
    When deniers and contrarians talked about this “slowdown” the implication was that somehow, the laws of physics had suddenly changed and loading the atmosphere with CO2 might not be a problem any more.
    As I argued three years ago, this global warming pause was never really a thing…

    Now a new study in the leading journal Nature (LINK) has tried to reconcile the differences between the various pause studies and make suggestions about what went wrong…

    Prof Stefan Rahmstorf, of the Potsdam Institute for Climate Impact Research, said: “I think the main lesson to be learnt from this discussion, by scientists, the media and the public alike, is to be highly sceptical of narratives pushed by so-called climate sceptics.” …

    So what to make of it all?
    The short version is that global warming didn’t stop, scientists knew global temperatures would wobble around and climate scientists aren’t always the best communicators.
    But also, to paraphrase Stefan Rahmstorf, climate sceptics are not really sceptics at all.
    https://www.theguardian.com/environment/planet-oz/2017/may/04/global-warming-scientists-learn-lessons-from-the-pause-that-never-was

    3 May: Guardian: Hannah Devlin: Global warming ‘hiatus’ doesn’t change long term climate predictions – study
    Detailed analysis rejects view that apparent slowing of global rise in temperature from 1998-2012 is evidence against man-made climate change
    An apparent hiatus in global warming that spawned a decade-long controversy has had no impact on long-term climate projections, a detailed analysis has concluded…
    The paper, published in Nature, said that this short-term slowdown could be mostly accounted for by known climate phenomena…
    “The heat is still there, it’s just stuck underneath,” said Medhaug…
    https://www.theguardian.com/science/2017/may/03/global-warming-hiatus-doesnt-change-long-term-climate-predictions-study

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    pat

    never mind:

    4 May: WeatherNetwork: Most significant cold snap in decades for southern Ontario
    “The cold snap, which is expected to last five days, will be one of the most significant bouts of cold weather Toronto has seen in May,” The Weather Network meteorologist Tyler Hamilton says.
    “The record for the most single-digit days in a row in May is five, and that was back in May of 1974,” Hamilton adds. “Currently, we’re forecast to get five days of single digits, making it one of the most prolonged cold periods in history.”…
    https://www.theweathernetwork.com/news/articles/most-significant-cold-snap-in-decades-for-southern-ontario/81937

    4 May: CBS Denver: Staggering Losses Being Recorded For Farmers, Ranchers After Blizzard
    The snowstorm killed thousands of cattle…
    Seven foot high snow drifts buried cows and toppled acres of wheat crops in Prowers County and Baca County near the Kansas and Oklahoma borders, costing farmers millions of dollars…
    After the storm dumped 30 inches of snow in some areas, the damage is compared to the blizzard of 2007, which was one of the worst snowstorms in state history…
    http://denver.cbslocal.com/2017/05/04/dead-livestock-blizzard/

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    pat

    4 May: GWPF: Dr. David Whitehouse: New Study Confirms: The Warming ‘Pause’ Is Real And Revealing
    The authors of this recent paper delicately tread a line between the two opposing camps saying, on the one hand, that both sides have a point and their particular methods of analysis are understandable. But on the other hand they make it clear that there is a real event that needs studying…READ ON
    http://www.thegwpf.com/new-study-confirms-the-warming-pause-is-real-and-revealing/

    2 May: GWPF: Andrew Montford Appointed GWPF Deputy Director
    Andrew will play a key role in the GWPF, working closely with the Chairman and Director…

    4 May: Paul Homewood: 2020–The Climate Turning Point
    Christiana Figueres has not been twiddling her fingers since stepping down from the UNFCCC. Instead, she is at the forefront of the campaign group, Mission 2020.
    They have recently issued this press release…READ ON
    https://notalotofpeopleknowthat.wordpress.com/2017/05/04/2020-the-climate-turning-point/

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    pat

    excerpts from cached version:

    4 May: E&E News: Emily Holden: Key GOP lawmaker: ‘I’m a little concerned’
    The Republican lawmaker who has been urging the White House to consider staying in the Paris climate agreement for strategic reasons says the Trump administration seems headed toward exiting the deal.
    Rep. Kevin Cramer (R-N.D.), a former adviser to President Trump, said he’s not sure how the discussion turned around so quickly…
    Asked whether he was hopeful that the talks could reverse course again, he said he didn’t know.

    “Lawyers can have various opinions legally, but the lawyer that’s responsible for advising the client generally takes the safest route,” Cramer said. “The president has to be comfortable, and for him to be comfortable, his lawyer has to be comfortable.”
    He said Don McGahn, the chief White House attorney, thinks the United States could face lawsuits if it tries to change its commitments.
    “Personally, I’m a little concerned, only because if there’s a legal way to get out of it altogether, I don’t see why there wouldn’t be a an equally legal way to stay in but change our obligations, our commitment,” he said…

    Sources have told E&E News that the White House could announce exiting the deal as soon as next week…
    The differing legal interpretations at the center of the fight revolve around Article 4.11 of the 200-nation climate accord, which reads: “A party at any time adjust its existing nationally determined contribution with a view to enhancing its level of ambition.”
    Some within the administration argue that means the United States can only strengthen, not weaken, its commitment (Climatewire, May 3).

    The contingent of Republicans in Congress who think the United States should consider staying in the agreement is small, although Sen. Susan Collins (R-Maine) is also supportive of remaining.
    ***Collins and Sen. Ben Cardin (D-Md.) sent a letter urging Secretary of State Rex Tillerson to stay in the Paris accord and continue to engage on “this important global issue.”
    They said stalling climate change could save millions of lives and trillions of dollars in economic activity in U.S. coastal communities and also boost national security.
    U.S. research institutions can be leaders in climate innovation, they said.
    https://www.eenews.net/climatewire/2017/05/04/stories/1060054044

    ***3 May the Collins/Cardin letter to State Dept/Tillerson re staying in “Paris”:
    https://www.foreign.senate.gov/imo/media/doc/5-3-17%20BLC%20joint%20letter%20with%20Collins%20to%20Tillerson%20on%20climate%20change.pdf

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    pat

    what special interests are behind these efforts?

    4 May: InsideClimateNews: Sabrina Shankman: Bipartisan Climate Change Bill Aims to Change the Conversation in Washington
    A small but increasingly vocal group of Republicans is embracing the ***reality of global warming and pressing the issue in Congress.
    This is the second time the bill, called the Climate Solutions Commission Act, has been introduced, after failing to pass in 2016.
    It would establish a bipartisan National Climate Solutions Commission, which would conduct a comprehensive review of what can be done in both the private and public sectors to reduce greenhouse gas emissions while growing the economy and protecting jobs. If passed, it also would direct the Government Accountability Office to report on the financial tools, policies and institutions that can help reduce emissions while protecting economic growth…

    Rep. John Delaney (D-MD), one of the new bill’s sponsors, said he can’t predict whether it will pass this year, but he notes that there are nearly twice as many cosponsors this time—six representatives from each side of the aisle…
    Recent studies (LINK) have shown that while historically the economy rose along with emissions, that is no longer the case. In 21 countries—including the United States—the 21st century has seen declines in emissions as economies have grown. And a shift toward renewable energy is bringing hundreds of thousands of jobs…

    Rep. John J. Faso (R-NY), a co-sponsor of the bill, said in a press release: “Creating a bipartisan commission will help bring the public and private sectors together to provide smart solutions to the problems we face in the world today from the negative impacts of climate change.”
    The bill has been endorsed by the Environmental Defense Fund, The Nature Conservancy, The Partnership for Responsible Growth, the National Wildlife Federation and the Friends Committee on National Legislation…
    https://insideclimatenews.org/news/04052017/bipartisan-climate-change-bill-cut-emissions-save-jobs-economy

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    Dennis

    Two billion dollar investment pledged for the US from an Australian business man in front of POTUS Donald Trump … poor fella our country;

    http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/blogs/andrew-bolt/not-australia/news-story/d8795e33ddf3c3850517c697a3242a22

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    Robber

    Alert from AEMO re forecast electricity shortfall:
    Under the NER Cl 4.8.4(d), AEMO considers that Customer load would be interrupted in order to maintain or restore the security of the power system in SA Region, for the following period, from 1730 hrs to 1800 hrs 11/05/2017.
    The maximum load forecast to be interrupted is 142 MW at 1730 hrs 11/05/2017
    AEMO will determine the latest time at which it would need to intervene through a AEMO intervention event.

    Forecast Lack Of Reserve Level 3 (LOR3) in the Vic Region – STPASA
    Under the NER Cl 4.8.4(d), AEMO considers that Customer load would be interrupted in order to maintain or restore the security of the power system in Vic Region, for the following period,
    AEMO declares a Forecast LOR3 condition for the Vic Region. From 1730 hrs to 1800 hrs 11/05/2017
    The maximum load forecast to be interrupted is 142 MW at 1730 hrs 11/05/2017
    AEMO is seeking a market response.

    Looks like the lights are flickering. However they often then remove these alerts, presumably because there is a market response as another generator fires up, or some major consumers do some load shedding. AEMO capacity forecasts show Vic capacity declining from 6300 MW to 4550 MW on May 11 with a forecast reserve of only 82 MW.

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    pat

    4 May: CBS Denver: Ski Resort To Stay Open Year Round
    SQUAW VALLEY, Calif. (CBS4) – Want to ski through the summer?
    Then head to northern California, not far from Lake Tahoe, and Squaw Valley Alpine Meadows.
    The resort plans to stay open for an “Endless Summer.”…
    Dates and times through the summer were posted on their website through the Independence Day weekend, and they’re looking at staying open into August as well…
    In April, they passed the 700 inch snow mark (nearly 60 feet!) for only the second time in their recorded history…

    Colorado is no stranger to long ski seasons, with Arapahoe Basin oftentimes remaining open for the mid-summer holiday. They plan to remain open this season “into June…at least.”…

    4 May: RocklinToday: Press release: 714 Inches of Snow Means Fourth of July Skiing at Tahoe
    Olympic Valley, Calif.- Winter and summer will blend together in 2017 at Squaw Valley as the resort emerges from a historic winter and sets the stage to operate July 1-4 and Saturdays thereafter as long as conditions allow.
    714 inches of snow fell at Squaw Valley Alpine Meadows this winter, equaling nearly 60 feet…
    Squaw Valley currently has a base depth of 20 feet and is primed to offer skiing and riding in the Shirley zone for winter enthusiasts looking to boot-up long into the summer…
    January 2017 at Squaw Valley Alpine Meadows broke the resort’s record for most snow in one month, with 282 inches, followed by the snowiest February ever with another 196 inches. With the Tahoe Basin snowpack currently at more than 300% of average, the Squaw Valley operations team plans to work in conjunction with Mother Nature, as they have all season long, to provide a skiable surface in July and beyond, narrowing the gap between the 2016-17 season and the 2017-18 season…
    http://www.rocklintoday.com/news/templates/community_news.asp?articleid=16462&zoneid=4

    5 May: ABC Nebraska: Hundreds still waiting for power after snow storm, could take a week to restore
    by Ifesinachi Egbosimba
    “We got more [snow] in that one day than we got all winter,” said Ron Olsen, who lives in Wilsonville…
    Ice, snow and strong winds brought down about 200 power poles in the Twin Valleys Public Power District on Sunday.
    “Many miles of lines and poles broken and on the ground,” said Al Rogers, Director of Operations for Twin Valleys Public Power District.
    According to Twin Valleys, at one point on Sunday all of its 6,500 meters lost power and with so many outages they had to call in back up…
    http://nebraska.tv/news/local/some-may-be-without-power-for-a-week-thanks-to-sundays-winter-storm

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    el gordo

    Our worst fears, we are flying virtually blind.

    ‘According to overseers of the long-term instrumental temperature data, the Southern Hemisphere record is “mostly made up”. This is due to an extremely limited number of available measurements both historically and even presently from the south pole to the equatorial regions.’

    - See more at: http://notrickszone.com/#sthash.HJPubdah.dpuf

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    David Maddison

    https://spectator.com.au/2017/05/laughing-gas/

    The latest lunatic government intervention into Australian energy markets conjures up the old lady who swallowed a fly. In 2001, pandering to the misguided populist belief that renewable energy is cheap, the federal Coalition government set a small renewable energy target – just 4 percent of electricity generation – rather like swallowing a fly. Unfortunately, like the old lady who then swallows a spider to catch the fly, our governments – of all complexions – can’t stop intervening.

    Now we have come to the sorry pass where a Coalition government, to loud cheers from the press gallery, will stop Australian companies from honouring commercial contracts to export gas to Asia. So much for all those North Asia free trade agreements that were meant to cement our trading relationships.

    Less than two years ago, the federal minister for Industry and Science, Ian McFarlane, was thrilled to open an LNG plant in Queensland, lauding it for being the first in the world to export coal seam gas. Well, good luck paying back the $80 billion it cost to build Queensland’s LNG export industry. Now, Santos is being vilified for buying gas in the domestic market to export from its Queensland plant, yet since 2011 Santos has been trying to develop huge reserves of CSG near Narrabri, which could meet half NSW’s demand. It can’t because the NSW government has been pandering to Greenies and farmers. Santos is also being demonised for selling gas more cheaply abroad than at home but it is only doing so because the contracts were signed when gas prices were even cheaper than today.

    Global oil prices plummeted from US$155 to US$ 29 a barrel between June 2008 and January 2016, taking gas prices down with them. Australian gas projects that were viable when prices were sky high have been abandoned, reducing the supply of gas, because Australia is the most expensive country in the world in which to build an LNG plant. Who’s fault is that?

    Punishing Santos by preventing it from honouring contracts will only discourage investors from developing the additional gas supplies Australia needs. The day after the federal government announced its policy, almost $1 million was wiped off the value of affected gas companies. Santos’ share price which was $22 not long after it’s Gladstone LNG plant was announced is now under $3.50.

    So why are Australian gas prices so high? Don’t blame Santos; it’s trying to increase supply. Blame the governments of Victoria, NSW and the Northern Territory for blocking the development of conventional and unconventional gas. And blame the Renewables Energy Target which is shutting down coal-fired power stations decades earlier than necessary and replacing them with expensive, unreliable wind farms.

    Had the federal Labor government listened to the Productivity Commission in 2009 or had the federal Coalition government been able to persuade Labor, the crossbenchers and some of its own Green-tinged parliamentarians to listen to Dick Warburton in 2014 and end cross subsidies for renewable energy, we would not be in this predicament.

    When the 1600-megawatt Hazelwood power plant was privatised in 1996, it was meant to run for another 40 years. In 2005, the Victorian Bracks Labor government provided the plant with enough coal to last until at least 2030.

    But in 2009, the Rudd Labor government souped up the RET from 9,500 to 45,000 gigawatt-hours. The Productivity Commission warned this could drive coal-fired power stations out of business leaving huge supply gaps and price spikes.

    ‘Bollocks,’ wrote a columnist in the Age. ‘If the generators failed to maintain the stations during the transitional period to cleaner electricity supply, the State government has emergency powers that allow it to take over and run the asset.’

    But by 2011, the federal Gillard Labor government was threatening to close Hazelwood. Luckily, in a lucid moment, it baulked at throwing workers out of their jobs. But it was only a stay of execution. The Victorian government added a further $20 million to Hazelwood’s costs last year by trebling the royalties on brown coal. The Victorian treasurer blithely claimed this would not be a problem. A year later, the RET and the increased royalties made Hazelwood unviable. The owner, Engie, asked for $400 million to keep Hazlewood going but the federal and state government turned a deaf ear and the plant which produced power for only $30/MWh per hour was gone, the ninth and the largest coal-fired power plant to close since 2010, generating more energy than all the wind farms in the National Energy Market together.

    The closure of Hazelwood threatened the viability of the Portland aluminium smelter, so the Victorian government, having failed to subsidise the power plant which would have helped keep Victorian, SA and NSW electricity cheaper and more stable, instead subsidised a single business. Yet even in the face of this disaster, the green cheer squad were sanguine; the closure of Hazelwood ‘would have limited impact on energy prices’ they said. In fact, it will lift household power bills by 20 per cent, with futures contracts up 200 per cent from a year ago. All this in a state with 27 trillion cubic feet of gas reserves, which has banned fracking, has a moratorium on conventional gas exploration until 2020, and whose offshore gas production will fall 40 per cent by 2025.

    The SA government also rejected a bid from Alinta for $25 million to keep its cheap coal-fired power station open for five years. Instead, the SA government will spend $550 million building a gas-fired plant, a battery to store wind and solar energy and renting diesel generators. The federal government mocked SA for driving power plants out of business and then spending a fortune shoring up energy but the federal government’s RET did just as much damage to coal-fired plants and now it is spending $2 billion to upgrade the Snowy in a belated attempt to fill the energy gap the RET created.

    Never mind coal seam gas, you’d need laughing gas to be amused by this green buffoonery that taxpayers and consumers are forced to finance. Our politicians should recall the demise of the old lady who tried to solve each problem by doing something even more stupid. The song concludes, ‘there was an old lady who swallowed a horse – she’s dead of course.’

    How long before our businesses succumb to the same fate?

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      Robber

      Very clearly explained, David. Why oh why won’t our pollies listen? Instead we now have two more inquiries, one by Dr Alan Finkel, our Chief Scientist into the National Electricity Market, and another by the Dept of Environment & Energy to review current climate change policies. Both are to report later in the year, but I’m not holding my breath that there will be any plain speaking from either of them, as they will almost certainly toe the politically acceptable (but erroneous) path. Meanwhile our industries will become less and less competitive.
      All our politicians are fiddling while Australia burns. “Rome’s emperor, the decadent and unpopular Nero, “fiddled while Rome burned.” The expression has a double meaning: Not only did Nero play music while his people suffered, but he was an ineffectual leader in a time of crisis”. Sound appropriate?

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    Another Ian

    Jo

    Very O/T but FYI

    Looks like maybe trouble in WordPress land

    https://chiefio.wordpress.com/2017/05/02/tips-may-2017/#comment-82904

    And link there

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    pat

    4 May: LA Times: Joseph Serna: Central California towns in trouble if Sierra snowpack melts too fast
    The rain has largely stopped after one of the wettest winters in California.
    But as spring temperatures begin to climb and snow in the Sierra Nevada melts, the threat of flooding has communities across the Central Valley on edge…
    The storms that set a rainfall record in Northern California have left a vast layer of mountain snowpack, which now sits at almost 200% of average for the first week of May. In some areas, the snow is 80 feet deep, according to state and NASA reports.
    Downstream, the rapid snowmelt is keeping public agencies juggling water levels across the state’s network of reservoirs…
    A heat wave could cause chaos…

    Taking matters into his own hands
    Many of the state’s dams and weirs are at least 60 years old, and in the Central Valley, many were built more than a century ago, the report stated. It noted that flood-management responsibilities in California are spread among more than 1,300 local agencies managing an infrastructure of more than 20,000 miles of levees and channels and more than 1,500 dams and reservoirs.
    In February, Fuller decided he no longer could wait for the politicians. He called a local contractor who has lived in the community for decades to supply the labor, hammered out a contract in a week with the Corcoran prison to excavate one of its wheat fields and launched a $14-million effort to raise 14 miles of levee wall by 4 feet…
    “We had to take the bull by the horns and get to work,” Fuller said. “I don’t have time to wait for the bureaucrats to square this mess out.”…READ ALL
    http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-central-valley-flood-control-20170504-story.html

    5 May: YaleClimateConnections: Bruce Lieberman: Record snow, record snowmelt?
    California braces for flooding as warmer weather bears down: New study suggests continued warming could sap the state’s snowpack by 2100
    On May 1, Sierra snowpack was 196 percent of the historical average for that date, with a snow water equivalent of 42.5 inches, the California Department of Water Resources reported. It’s only a matter of time before creeks and rivers swell. With persistently hot temperatures like those in March, April and the beginning of May, watersheds below the Eastern Sierra could quickly become overwhelmed – and infrastructure associated with the Los Angeles Aqueduct threatened…

    The state is coming out of one of the biggest winters in decades. But if it gets too hot, too fast, and for too long, water managers will have no choice but to release melt water from reservoirs and send it toward the coast and back into the ocean.
    That seems like a big problem for California. But a new study suggests an even bigger one in coming decades: the Sierra snowpack itself is dwindling, much faster than previously realized…READ ALL
    https://www.yaleclimateconnections.org/2017/05/record-snow-record-snowmelt/

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    pat

    while Yale spins a CAGW yarn over the California snow, this is the kind of variable power they want to sell us:

    4 May: Reuters: German spot power price rises on sharp renewables decline
    The German spot electricity price for day-ahead delivery rose on Thursday on the back of a sharp fall in electricity production from renewable wind and solar sources…
    The German baseload power contract for Friday delivery gained 4.75 euros or 14.84 percent to 36.75 euros ($40.00) per megawatt-hour (MWh)…
    Electricity production from German wind turbines will fall by 9 gigawatts (GW) on Friday to 7.2 GW, Thomson Reuters data shows, while solar power production will reduce by about 1 GW to 3.2 GW…
    http://af.reuters.com/article/energyOilNews/idAFL8N1I61MU

    thankfully, there are alternatives!

    4 May: Platts: German…power prices mixed on renewables, load
    German day-ahead prices increased Thursday as wind output was forecast to fall Friday…
    Combined hard coal and lignite availability for Friday was set at 28.5 GW, with nuclear pegged at 7.8 GW…

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    el gordo

    “There is a huge necessity that the U.N. continues to involve all nations and coordinate the action of all nations,” to fight climate change, General Denis Mercier, NATO’s supreme allied commander for transformation, told Reuters on the sidelines of a conference in Norfolk, Virginia.

    “If one nation, especially the biggest nation … if they do not recognize a problem, then we will have trouble dealing with the causes,” of climate change, said Mercier.

    Reuter

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    Mervyn

    Donald Trump will become the biggest bloody fool if he fails to take America out of the Paris Agreement because to remain in the Agreement contradicts:

    1. his policies that are reversing Obama’s ‘climate plan’ underpinned by the Agreement;

    2. his energy policy to unleash $50 trillion of fossil fuel energy; and

    3. his election campaign rhetoric and promises, and commitments to voters.

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    pat

    still beloved by ABC, Fairfax, Crikey, etc!

    25 Apr: Quartz: Helen Razer: Why I’m a communist—and why you should be, too
    (Helen Razer is an Australian writer who contributes to a range of publications)
    And, heck, communism contains some ideas that are still very appealing, especially in times such as now when an economic downturn has been felt by so many…
    Communism is a system of social organization that has never been truly tried and, these days, never truly explained…

    Capitalism had many false starts, and now, in the view of a commie such as myself, it is enduring a very real end. Voters are rejecting its prescriptions in different ways, expressing their frustration by electing authoritarians who promise a fictional version of the past or, as in Spain, Greece, and Scotland, socialists and communists who hint at an unseen future…

    We don’t know what that communist future will look like. We know that our age of automation has created the possibility of free time. We know that we have collectively created the means to sustain all on this planet. But, we also know that we have built this abundance at the cost of environmental devastation. Both climate change and the irrevocable fact of nuclear weapons reduce the original communist hope for collective management of everything; these totalizing threats demands a certain level of totalitarian management. It is my view that an honest communist can now no longer say that the state can be done away with entirely—these true threats require a handful of true bureaucrats to manage them…
    https://qz.com/965740/why-im-a-communist-and-why-you-should-be-too/

    taxpayer-funded Auntie has no trouble finding time for Helen!

    Best of RN Drive: Surviving a relationship breakup
    ABC Online-24 Apr. 2017
    After her partner of 15 years broke up with her, Helen Razer embarked on a quest to go on 100 dates in one year.

    I went on 100 dates and lived to tell the tale: Helen Razer
    ABC Online-17 Feb. 2017

    What becomes of the broken hearted? Helen Razer’s 100 date odyssey 48mins15sec audio
    ABC Conversations with Richard Fidler -9 Feb. 2017

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    Oliver K. Manuel

    Yes, communism has many appealing ideas and one very unappealing fact: Totalitarian control of real individuals for the benefit of the whole society, as imagined by one dictator.

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    Amber

    Simple .. Mr Trump made an election promise to get the USA out of the Paris “Agreement ” . Keep the promise or lose some base . It’s not complicated .
    Mr. Trump’s top budget representative recently said the USA won’t be wasting money on green subsidies . Smart guy .
    Coal is coming back and the USA is self sufficient in Oil Gas and Coal so the notion they are going to return to cave dweller status or North Korea at night is no longer on . The Obama “legacy ” of screwing USA workers and the economy are in remission thanks to Mr. Trump .
    Let’s hope he doesn’t get all weak kneed because he will need at least 2 terms to drain the swamp and get the USA humming again .
    A lot of other countries will breath a sigh of relief when the USA finally puts the worlds largest fraud out to pasture.

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    Amber

    People forget the USA Senate voted 95-0 on the Byrd-Hagel
    Resolution that stipulated the USA should not be a signatory to any protocol that mandated (Not Pledged )the reduction of greenhouse gas emissions UNLESS it also mandated reductions from developing countries during the same period . This resolution was the USA response to Kyoto which was supposed to be an enforceable agreement that never occurred . The Kyoto Protocol was DOA from that day forward and Paris-Lite is the same .
    The Democrats and the Republicans saw Kyoto the same way 95-0 . The USA is going to create it’s own energy advantage and the unapproved Paris- Lite pledges are not even a speed bump .
    With control in the Senate the current administration
    could state that the Byrd- Hagel resolution has not been rescinded , it stands , and that no greenhouse gas or other emission
    treaty , protocol , accord , pledge, or secret handshake is binding unless passed into law by Congress and the President of the USA .

    Obama activists knew the Paris Agreement was an attempt to skirt congress and thought they would get away with it . Wrong .

    Mr. Trump is facing the most hostile media in history and it will do know good to isolate his base by braking his promise to cancel USA involvement in the Paris agreement . Just the opposite .
    Further, the effort to encourage coal and not wipe it out as Hillary so proudly boasted and the opening up of more energy supplies will make the USA economy competitive and self sufficient . Emission reductions will
    occur without EPA bullies and the climate fraud industry sucking the life out American ingenuity .
    Keep the promise please Mr. Trump .

    00