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US debate: It’s no accident climate change is ignored — it’s a poison pill a pollie would prefer to hide

Climate change is not ignored in the election, it’s hidden, because most voters don’t care, and don’t want to pay.

US election 2016, logo.Perplexed! Vox and others just can’t figure out why climate change is being ignored in this election.

“That’s 4 straight debates without a single question on climate change.”

Oh no?!  Humanity is about to destroy civilization and Brad Plumer wants to know why ” the most powerful nation on Earth can’t set aside five minutes to discuss.”

Plumer obviously hasn’t read the polls, but the Clinton team will have. It’s no accident that Hillary Clinton dropped any mention of climate change after she had neutralized Bernie Sanders. His fans are the only ones who care. Tom Steyer tried in the 2012 election and wasted 74 million dollars achieving almost nothing on the back of the “climate” scare.

Poll after poll shows that the public are happy to say they “believe in climate change”, and don’t mind if “the government” wants to give their grandchildren nice weather.  But don’t ask them personally to pay: when their money is on the table, the awful truth is they don’t believe the experts, and they don’t want to spend their own money. The poll results are devastating:

More than half of western voters are skeptics

In the UK, 62% don’t believe in a man-made climate threat. Likewise,  most Canadians are skeptics, and when CBC accidentally admitted that unthinkable truth, then they had to “edit” the story to reframe it. (We can’t have the public knowing that most people are skeptics. Think of the momentum!). In Australia, 54% of voters are skeptics of man-made global warming, and 80% don’t donate to environmental causes or vote for it.

So bring it on, say we skeptics, get that climate talk out into the election campaign, put it front and centre and watch the voters run away from  anyone who wants to force them to pay to slow the storms.

Carbon schemes have to be hidden to get past the voters

Rarely have voters had a real choice on the climate policies — but they did in Australia in 2013, and they voted for the skeptic in a landslide. Since then, the smarter climate lobbyists know that they can only get “carbon trading” legislation if  the public don’t know its coming. The dead dog that is climate action must be hidden under some other meaningless title like the “Safeguard” mechanism. That’s how it happened in Australia. Australians voted for “no carbon tax” two times in a row, then the party threw out the PM, and the carbon tax was quietly snuck in as a subclause, a spare mechanism, that could be sold as “nothing much” if anyone discovered it, but had the potential to be amped up as needed after the legislation was passed by a House and Senate that probably didn’t even know what they were signing.

 

 

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US debate: It's no accident climate change is ignored -- it's a poison pill a pollie would prefer to hide, 9.2 out of 10 based on 58 ratings

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79 comments to US debate: It’s no accident climate change is ignored — it’s a poison pill a pollie would prefer to hide

  • #

    Turnbull making us use CFLs was a sort of carbon tax…though the revenues were collected by General Electric.

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      David Maddison

      And as I have posted before, given the extra complexity and cost of CFL’s I would be surprised if there was any net saving of CO2 over their life, in fact they may be a bigger producer of CO2 compared with the former incan technology if CO2 of manufacture is taken into account.

      A bit like windmills, really.

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    • #
      Mark M

      And the CFLs failed to stop one storm caused by Global Warming.

      172

  • #
    Mari C

    There are several traditional soap-box issues being ignored as well, and a few have started to notice it. One in particular is a cause/anti-cause rumble that produces lunatics and spittle at the very mention, so I won’t.

    CAGW, Climate Change, what-ever they choose to call it now, is Not To Be Discussed, lest someone get a notion that the politician mentioning it might have been taken at face value. Except for Trump, who says it isn’t happening and he’ll dismantle all the treaties on day one (along with a bunch of other stuff to do on day one, I hope he has prepared all the paperwork in advance) and Bernie, who built his campaign around CAGW and other UN warm and cuddlies, and who lost.

    Hillary won’t say a thing. From the small bits that leak out, she isn’t concerned either way, and may personally be inclined to lean towards doubter. Once Bernie was out of the picture, she didn’t need to pretend to care about the climate and could concentrate on smearing Trump as she tried to convince the public she was a warm and caring human who wants only good things for her children fellow citizens.

    Neither -party- wants warming, CO2, or anything associated with it discussed right now. It would open up that can worms that, in the US, is Taxes. Even fees would be a difficult thing to sell right now. The fact that the nation is still on its knees from the crash of the housing market bubble is also not being mentioned. Just the wee gains in “recovery” that get paraded around. And having just successfully convinced the local board to cut almost 21 thousand US dollars off the tax value of my house and side-lot, and 27 thousand off the value of my fiancé’s property, both of which had values reduced from 5 years ago already, I -know- that recovery isn’t here.

    Trump will talk about all of it. That is why his party his trying to distance itself from him. He opens his mouth and out come the echoes of what most middle-class people have been saying, thinking and grumbling for years. The party leaders, both sides, were so certain they could sway the voters with the same old gnawed-on crumbs that they missed the boat – they never saw him coming, they never imagined he’d get through the first few states. They blew it.

    I don’t like Trump. He is a bully, a boor, an egocentric creep. And he is, god save us, exactly what we need right now – if only to force the politicians out of their insulated bubbles and out into the real world for a bit, where they might get a clue as to just how out of touch they are, what the reality of average Jim and Jan America’s lives are. Both parties need a serious kick in the pants, and Trump is itching to get his foot close enough to plant it firmly on those backsides. He’s close, but if he isn’t elected the parties will convince themselves it was all a bad dream, and what comes next campaign could be too terrible to contemplate.

    There are those who believe in CAGW. Some are really intelligent and assume that other “experts” are correct, why would they lie? continue to promote a false and misleading theory? it must be happening, it must be CO2. Some just follow the trail of crumbs. Most don’t care – they have payments to make. Mortgages, rents, utilities, cars, schools, medical bills, and the credit cards they have used to cover those and other expenses. If it will cost them more, they don’t want it. It isn’t there. They haven’t the money or the time to invest in something that is coming due next year, much less in the next 50. Especially when they just finished paying last winter’s heating bill and are wondering how finance this year’s.

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    • #
      Rod Stuart

      Most don’t care – they have payments to make

      Therein lies the sticky wicket in the process we call “democracy”.
      Philosophers and economists in the eighteenth nineteenth centuries identified that the Athenian ideology only works as long as the populace is willing to put in the effort to discuss, debate, decide, and act. One of your founding fathers remarked (sic) “you now have a Republic……if you can keep it”.
      About 4 years ago retired Supreme Court Justice David Souter discussed this very phenomenon.

      50

    • #
      Reed Coray

      Mari,

      When I read your comment, I thought I had written it while sleep walking. I couldn’t agree more with everything you said–especially about how both Parties, but especially the Republican Party, blew it.

      41

    • #
      jorgekafkazar

      From the small bits that leak out, [Hillary] isn’t concerned either way, and may personally be inclined to lean towards doubter.

      According to leaked documents, Hillary told GE that the economy can be healed by passing out more food stamps. If she’s stupid enough to say that, she’s probably stupid enough to believe it, along with all the Warmist Lysenkoism.

      40

  • #
    Manfred

    No ‘climate hiding’ going on here. It’s right out in the open. Watch the institutionalized globalist parasite screech and howl in dismay, seeing their power and control threatened from common core to climate ‘science’ defunding, together with the whole stinking Conversational edifice that is tertiary ‘eco-research’ sucking on the teat of infinite self-interested political largesse.

    Donald Trump Promises Change in Gettysburg Speech: ‘Has to Come from Outside Our Very Broken System’

    The Republican nominee laid out his plan for his first 100 days in office if he is to become President of the United States, listing six measures he plans to execute in order to clean up special interests and collusion in Washington, D.C.

    The six measures include:

    A constitutional amendment to impose term limits on Congress
    A hiring freeze on federal employees in various areas of government
    A requirement that for every new federal regulation, two existing regulations must be eliminated
    A five-year ban on executive government workers becoming lobbyists after leaving public service
    A ban on White House officials lobbying on behalf of a foreign government
    A complete ban on foreign lobbyists raising money for American elections

    Trump went on to discuss a variety of ways that he plans to change government spending, including canceling billions of dollars being sent to the United Nation’s climate change programs
    as well as canceling federal funding for sanctuary cities.

    He promised an economic plan to benefit the American worker and tax reductions for the middle class.

    The Republican nominee also touted his plan to restore government ethics, end Common Core education and illegal immigration, and repeal and replace Obamacare with health savings accounts.

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    • #
      Yonniestone

      There’s also a lot of Australian globalist parasites posing as politicians in the major two parties that are waiting to see how this plays out, if Clinton wins it’ll be full steam ahead with the usual non issues we see taking up space across every MSM outlet while the troughers pig out and get fatter at the public’s expense.

      Or if Trump wins it’ll be some serious back peddling with many “having the nations best interests at the time” lines touted in efforts to convey newly found sincerity and attempts to appear human, this and a few heads taken by those who have endured the good fight all along.

      Peoples memories are short but the internet’s is long.

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      • #
        clive

        The alarmists keep telling us their concern about global warming is all about man’s stewardship of the environment. But we know that’s not true. A United Nations official has now confirmed this.

        At a news conference in October 2015 in Brussels, Christiana Figueres, executive secretary of U.N.’s Framework Convention on Climate Change, admitted that the goal of environmental activists is not to save the world from ecological calamity but to destroy capitalism.

        “This is the first time in the history of mankind that we are setting ourselves the task of intentionally, within a defined period of time, to change the economic development model that has been reigning for at least 150 years, since the Industrial Revolution,” she said.

        Referring to a new international treaty environmentalists hope will be adopted at the Paris climate change conference later this year, she added: “This is probably the most difficult task we have ever given ourselves, which is to intentionally transform the economic development model for the first time in human history.”

        The only economic model in the last 150 years that has ever worked at all is capitalism. The evidence is prima facie: From a feudal order that lasted a thousand years, produced zero growth and kept workdays long and lifespans short, the countries that have embraced free-market capitalism have enjoyed a system in which output has increased 70-fold, work days have been halved and lifespans doubled.

        Figueres is perhaps the perfect person for the job of transforming “the economic development model” because she’s really never seen it work. “If you look at Ms. Figueres’ Wikipedia page,” notes Cato economist Dan Mitchell: Making the world look at their right hand while they choke developed economies with their left.

        60

        • #
          David Maddison

          The admission that CAGW is about the destruction of capitalism predates that Clive.

          From an IPCC official there is this alarmingly frank and disturbing 2010 statement by Ottmar Edenhofer: “But one must say clearly that we redistribute de facto the world’s wealth by climate policy….One has to free oneself from the illusion that international climate policy is environmental policy. This has almost nothing to do with environmental policy anymore, with problems such as deforestation or the ozone hole.”

          See original German at http://www.nzz.ch/klimapolitik-verteilt-das-weltvermoegen-neu-1.8373227 and translation at http://www.eike-klima- energie.eu/uploads/media/IPCC_Edenhofer__Climate_Policy_Is_Redistributing_The_World__s_W ealth_.pdf

          In his Wikipedia entry at https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ottmar_Edenhofer he admits he was influenced by Karl Marx, among others.

          50

    • #
      Oliver K. Manuel

      Thanks, Manfred, for reminding us of one bright spot in the Presidential election campaign, Mr. Donald Trump’s Getteysburg speech.

      40

  • #
    doubtingdave

    Sorry Jo , this argument that we are involved in ; has never really been about global warming , its always about control , its always been about a Globalist new world order; and climate change is just one small part of how to make a population obedient to that system , add to that a compliant main stream media and a astroturfing education system , what chance do our kids have , and that’s where the real battle lies

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  • #
    Lord Jim

    Globalists and foreign money are destroying western democracies.

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    • #

      This is a cop out. Easy to deflect guilt from ourselves again. Let,s go into conspiracies and be content with what we are apparently not guilty of. We have been voting these globalist and corrupt politicians ever since I remember. We have been lazy in our self assessment preferring to pass the guilt to anyone but ourselves.

      Where are we failing?
      1. Education of the new generation
      2. Avoidance and cowardness of our generation
      3. No political single voice and disjointed platform with no similar to the left determination
      4. Ostrich attitude of our business to ever increasing taxes, red tape, burocracy
      5. Greed of an average person by actively participating in a “give me something for nothing attitude”
      6. Moral decay of family values that are taken over by state control.
      7. Blind Acceptance of multiculuralism that leads to ghettos, racial and cultural divisions, national collapse
      8. Failure of media for being not balanced, lazy with cut and paste journos
      9. Rise of political correctness phenomenon.
      10. Abandonment of free speech
      12. Believe that democracy can be preserved no matter what
      13. Rise of the state and decline of self reliant individualism
      14. Unwillingness to adjust to new market conditions blaming it on globalisation and foreign money

      I am sure there is more

      40

      • #
        Manfred

        Sadly Darius, there may very well be more. Too many people have bought into the socialist nightmare of co-dependence – the addiction to “free” money on the one hand and the reward of maintaining elected office on the other, with only the most belief ridden clinging to the notion that a “fair” redistribution of the fruit of earnest labour and intelligence will equalize the 2 and 3 sigma outliers either side of the mean and somehow thereafter, everyone will live happily ever after. Short of lobotomising the upper 2 and 3 sigma groups, and genetically engineering the lower 2 and 3 signma groups, redistribution ain’t ever going to achieve anything except disempower, impoverish and entrap those dependent on it. Society in general and education in particular needs to get far smarter in identifying, developing and harnessing each individual’s strengths and aptitudes. The present comatose UN sponsored common-core education system is thus far incapable of this. Those that “succeed” have largely escaped merely because they are smart enough. I only hope that we can collectively and intelligently avoid a wider conflagration, but I nevertheless feel there is an ‘adjustment’ in the wings.

        40

  • #
    Another Ian

    Jo

    FYI

    “Obama always said climate change was America’s greatest national security threat”

    “Who could mistake Russia’s aggressive posturing?

    First puffs of provocative smoke from the Russians.
    Belching smoke through the Channel, Russian aircraft carrier so unreliable it sails with its own breakdown tug”

    http://www.michaelsmithnews.com/2016/10/obama-always-said-climate-change-was-americas-greatest-national-security-threat.html

    81

  • #
  • #
    Gordon

    All this is nothing!. In Canada……wait for it.
    Our beloved Princess of Ottawa is going to introduce legislation to make homes…….hang on!!!!!
    So energy efficient they will not require FOSSIL FUELS!!!!!!!!
    REALLY!

    90

    • #
      Lord Jim

      That is the least of your problems.
      The globalists want to make Canada/USA/Mexico into the next EU with open borders.

      80

      • #
        David Maddison

        Well, I guess if 25 Mexicans live in a single room in a house in the US or Canada the room won’t need heating with fossil fuels or anything else.

        40

        • #
          Manfred

          Perhaps not Dave, but it’ll certainly require effective aircon, which will require a reliable source of energy, ipse facto, cheap fossil fuels for the foreseeable future. The waste heat from 25 bodies approximates a 2.5kW fire – and that’s if they’re at rest and not protesting, the latter appearing an unlikely scenario.

          40

  • #
    Another Ian

    For the record

    “Guest opinion: Dr. Tim Ball

    “Oh what a tangled web we weave, when first we practise to deceive!”

    Sir Walter Scott (1771-1832)

    Support for the global warming/climate change agenda is becoming increasingly desperate, hysterical, and illogical. The causes are many, but chief among them are a plethora of contradictory evidence and growing public skepticism or at least disinterest. There are bizarre parallels to the Frankenstein and Dracula stories. The monster of anthropogenic global warming (AGW) collapses as it turns on the scientists who created it. Dracula needed the energy of blood but knew the dangers of exposure to sunlight. The IPCC failure to consider the Sun is a similar exposure and is causing their demise.”

    https://wattsupwiththat.com/2016/10/22/salvaging-the-unsalvageable-hfcs-and-the-un-climate-change-fiasco/

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  • #
    Owen Morgan

    I remember Mark Steyn, a friend of this website, discussing the late Robert Byrd, a US Senator for West Virginia from 1959 to 2010. In those years, Byrd managed to get virtually every new building in the state named after him. Hillary Clinton was close to him. As far as she is actually capable of liking anyone, Hillary Clinton “liked” Robert Byrd. Robert Byrd was a member of the Ku Klux Klan.

    Guess which of those facts Hillary Clinton least likes to be recalled.

    80

  • #
    doubtingdave

    https://youtu.be/-bYAQ-ZZtEU what originally set me off as a sceptic was reading Michael Chrichton and his article state of fear but sherill atkinsons speech means just as much

    30

    • #
      doubtingdave

      ATKINSONS talk . and CRICHTOS WORDS , ARE DEFINING MOMENTS IN MY LIFE , AND I JUDGE MUCH ABOUT WHAT THEY say from what I hear
      —-
      Dave, no yelling OK? skip the CAPS. – Jo

      30

    • #
      Owen Morgan

      It’s Sharyl Attkisson and, please forgive me, because I am not just being pedantic. There was a request under FOIA for instances where her name occurred in administration documents. In the characteristic DC way, the grudging document dump probably coincided with a Sunday, the Fourth of July and eleven sightings of the Loch Ness Monster.

      There was – surprise, surprise! – no mention of “Sharyl Attkisson” at all, but somebody with a magnificently devious mind realised that Ms. Attkisson has two names which are very unusual and yet similar to much more common names. When the document dump was searched for the wrong spellings of her name… whaddyaknow… There she was: just one hit, but a hit that proved the administration was lying, because the e-mail referring to “Atkinson” was demonstrably part of a chain. In other words, that certainly wasn’t the first time her name had come up in discussion.

      The “most transparent administration in history” had desperately tried to expunge the name of Sharyl Attkisson from its records, but had been outwitted by a citizen.

      50

  • #
    Ross

    Jo is definitely right on this. In one of the Wikileak emails it has Podesta saying exactly this –don’t mention climate change as it is not a winner ,or words to that effect. ( Sorry I don’t have a link)

    41

  • #
    • #
      Yonniestone

      You can use the ‘In private browsing’ or ‘Incognito’ window to search the headline then it works, but I couldn’t get a link to here either.

      30

    • #
      scaper...

      The leader of a foreign-funded, highly orchestrated group of Australian activists working to stop the $16 billion Adani coalmine in Queensland has confirmed links with the Hillary Clinton 2016 Presidential campaign and warned a Clinton administration will “embarrass” the Turnbull Government over coal.

      John Hepburn, the executive director of The Sunrise Project, confirmed today the revelations of the foreign-funded campaign against the Adani project by influencing indigenous land owners and environmental legal challenges exposed in briefings to Hillary Clinton’s campaign director.

      Mr Hepburn said the revelations via WikiLeaks in The Australian about the previously secret US funding and links with John Podesta, the Clination campaign chairman and former counsellor to Barack Obama, was a warning for the Turnbull government.

      “That a major US philanthropist has been emailing the senior adviser to the likely next US President, about the expansion of coal mining in Australia, highlights a major diplomatic risk for the Turnbull government,” Mr Hepburn said in a statement responding to the revelations.

      Mr Hepburn said the risk was “that a Clinton administration will hold a mirror to Australia’s climate inaction and pursuit of new coal reserves”.

      “It is no surprise that the ongoing expansion of coal mining in Australia is on the radar of Clinton’s most senior adviser. While the world is ratifying the Paris Climate agreement in record time, Australia is becoming a global embarrassment for being the first developed country to go backwards on climate policy and fast-tracking the approval of new coal mines,” Mr Hepburn said.

      80

    • #
      Graeme No.3

      Some bits that might be relevant.
      The Sunrise Project, the lead environmental group in the campaign to stop coalmining in Australia, is funded from the multimillion-dollar US Sandler Foundation and boasts in its secret briefings passed on to Mr Podesta that it is trying to hide its funding sources from the Australian parliament.

      it is also disclosed that an associated group, Human Rights Watch, offered to help the environmental lobby keep its tax-­exempt charity status

      In a celebratory email to the Sandler Foundation in August last year after a decision against the Adani mine, Sunrise Project director John Hepburn, a former Greenpeace activist and one of the authors of the strategy to block coalmining in Australia, thanks the foundation for support. He added he was going to buy a “few bottles of bubbly” for a celebration with “our colleagues at GetUp!!!!, Greenpeace, 350.org, Australian Youth Climate Coalition, Mackay Conservation Group, Market Forces and the brilliant and tireless Sunrise team”.

      50

    • #

      Posting links to ‘The Australian’ articles online only works if the clicker is a subscriber, but there is a fairly simple way round the problem.
      I will not post the solution here, but can be contacted via my website.
      There is an alternative that still works, detailed at
      https://goo.gl/zgamm

      30

  • #
    ianl8888

    … the legislation was passed by a House and Senate that probably didn’t even know what they were signing

    Oh, they knew.

    It was just preferred that that the mass of populace didn’t. That’s still true in NSW with the LINO Baird.

    But now we have the Fed ALP, SA, Tasmania, Victoria and Q’ld all loudly proclaiming their non-carbon virtue, which they will visit upon us imminently. Nothing hidden there – except HOW this virtue is to be achieved without killing people.

    90

  • #
    Mark M

    Kerry: ‘It Pisses Me Off’ That Climate Change Got Left Out of Presidential Debates

    https://pjmedia.com/news-and-politics/2016/10/21/kerry-it-pisses-me-off-that-climate-change-got-left-out-of-presidential-debates/

    “On a panel with Leonardo DiCaprio after a Thursday screening at UN headquarters in New York of the actor’s documentary “Before the Flood,” Kerry said that “maybe November 8th will produce a capacity for the entire Republican caucus” to see the global-warming film.

    “It should be required for every single one of them,” he added, to applause from the audience.”
    . . .
    If Hillary wins, this film will be used as re-education for non-believers.

    50

  • #
    TdeF

    Who needs a carbon tax when you have the RET scheme? This is a direct and cunning tax on electricity, most of which is coal generated but not directly on the sensitive voting consumers but on the electricity retailers, an insidious and massive hidden in the bill.

    The tax is not collected by the Government, another ruse. The rivers of cash go to the windmill industry. It is doubly hidden by forcing them to buy ‘certificates’ for cash from the windmill industry. They are also forced to take the electricity whether they want it or not and when they do not want it.

    This terrible tax scales with the RET percentage, so at 50% half the income from electricity flow into ‘certificates’ which are ‘traded’, currently $85 a MWhr and on average private homes use 6 MWhr a year.

    So coal power stations can only sell half their output and have to close and the money flows into a river to people who buy windmills and transmissions lines overseas and you need lots of transmission lines at $3-5Million a km. Too bad some of them are so badly maintained or built that they fall over in a modest wind.

    Who needs a carbon tax? We have one! According to all the Labor state governments and Bill shorten, it will be at 50% in just 14 years. Why? To save Australia from Carbon Dioxide pollution?

    Of course it is not a tax on people who do not buy electricity, so light those wood fires. It is not about carbon dioxide. It is about control of electricity by political parties of the left, just as the NBN was about control of all communication. Does anyone seriously believe Stephen Conroy wanted to improve communications?

    In Victoria the starving Unions are in power again and desperate to take over every organization. Currently they are taking over all fire fighting through control of the 60,000 CFA volunteers. Think of it, 60,000 new people in the union at $600 each, $36 Million to the Fire Fighter’s Union for the right to volunteer to risk your life to defend your property.

    While the Abbott government was fighting to stop Union control of building, the Unions are fighting to take over every aspect of modern life and every source of funding and membership. Comrades.

    140

    • #
      TdeF

      Remember too that when you buy energy intensive goods, you are paying this tax again. Heating, airconditioning, lighting, all manufacturing, communications, recharging your electric car. This tax is insidious and massive, soon to be a 50% tax on all carbon based electricity at retail level, far more than the producers get, which is why Hazelwood will be closed, plunging three states in the Dark ages.

      90

      • #
        TdeF

        Some more on who is paying for all these useless, unreliable and unsustainable windfarms and distribution systems which fall over in a puff of wind. You are.

        The Government makes out it is all wonderful

        Their report shows indirectly how much we are being soaked for this political science.

        So 15.9 Million Megawatt was generated by unreliable, short term ‘renewable’ power stations, which will have to be renewed every 20 years. The total 15.9Million Megawatt hours. These have to be purchased by your electricity retailer and the current price is $85 per megawtt hour, a pretend market as it is compulsory. In fact there are not enough suppliers.

        By my calculations 15,900,000 x $85 or $1,350,000,000 dollars last year by law had to be paid to windmills for energy, whether you used it or not.

        The entire Snowy Mountain scheme was completed in 1974 at a total cost of $820million. Increasing this x10 for 2016 we are talking about a scheme to shut our coal generators which is bigger than the Snowy Mountain scheme. At the end of which we will replaced our reliable long term solution with an unreliable, intermittent and massively expensive set of windfarms which do absolutely nothing for our environment, nothing to reduce CO2 and make us the laughing stock of the world.

        Never has so much self harm been done to so many people by so few activists and extremists. As said, it is everything they wanted in a carbon tax, even to the faux trading of certificates.

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          TdeF

          Unlike the Snowy Mountain scheme and all the other power schemes which are 50, 60, 70 years old, these ‘renewable’ powersources have to be renewed. This is not a grand scheme to setup the country for permanent power for ever. Quite the reverse. We will never stop building them as they fall over, stop working, stop turning, blow up. Unlike the Snowy Mountain or Hazelwood or Port Augusta, this is not investing for our future, it is demolishing what our parents built and replacing it with unsustainable rubbish, short termism to somehow prevent the world’s temperature from changing even 0.01C. There is no science in this science. It is the destruction of our quality of life and everything left to us for a fantasy picture in which more than half the people have no interest or believe is a straight scam. Stop the RET now. Put Abbott back. Stop these mad wind farms.

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  • #
    pat

    full of links to more negative Trump-related stories:

    22 Oct: BBC: US election: Trump outlines plan for first 100 days
    Donald Trump, lagging behind Hillary Clinton in polls, has outlined what he would do in his first 100 days were he to become US president.
    With 17 days until the election, much of the recent focus has been on controversies linked to his campaign…
    Among the key details he announced were:
    ◾the cancellation of all payments to UN climate change programmes and the redeployment of those funds to fix US infrastructure…ETC
    Analysis – Anthony Zurcher, BBC News
    With just over two weeks left before election day, however, it is probably much too late for Mr Trump to make “faith and optimism” the focus of a campaign that has often been typified by darkness and anger…
    He said the media was fabricating stories to make him “look as bad and dangerous as possible”…
    Who is ahead in the ***polls?
    Clinton 47% Trump 43%
    http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37741792

    ***The BBC poll of polls looks at the five most recent national polls and takes the median value, ie, the value between the two figures that are higher and two figures that are lower…LINK “SEE INDIVIDUAL POLLS”
    What are the polls like in battleground states?
    We’ve identified 13 states that can be considered battlegrounds in this election.
    (from Real Clear Politics data skewed by MSM faux polls)
    CLINTON AHEAD IN 10 OUT OF 13
    http://www.bbc.com/news/election-us-2016-37450661

    Five most recent listed by BBC:
    21 Oct: IBD/TIPP Clinton 42 Trump 42
    21 Oct: LA Times/USC Clinton 44 Trump 44
    18 Oct: Quinnipiac: Clinton 50 Trump 44
    18 Oct: Economist/YouGov: Clinton 47 Trump 43
    17 Oct: Reuters/Ipsos: Clinton 43 Trump 39

    reality:
    latest IBD/TIPP Poll – Trump Expands Lead Over Clinton To 2 Points (Trump had 1-point lead 21 Oct)
    Investor’s Business Daily-12 hours ago

    LA Times/USC: 19 Oct was when Clinton and Trump tied at 44%; Trump is 1 point up at 21 Oct.

    as for BBC’s earlier polls! go check the internals to see what a joke they are:
    17 Oct: Fox: Clinton 7 ahead
    17 Oct: Bloomberg: Clinton 9 ahead
    16 Oct: CBS: Clinton 11 ahead
    13 Oct: NBC/WSJ: Clinton 10 ahead

    21 Oct: WND: Bob Unruh: Voters diverge from media, keep Trump ahead
    (Bob Unruh joined WND in 2006 after nearly three decades with the Associated Press)
    Friday (21 Oct) polling shows GOP candidate holding ‘substantial’ lead among ***independents
    Real Clear Poltiics reported the IBD-TIPP tracking poll had Trump leading 41 percent to 40 percent, Rasmussen reports had Trump up 43-41 and the L.A. Times/USC Tracking had Trump ahead 45-44.
    Only if one would assume that third party candidates Gary Johnson and Jill Stein would be removed from the ballot is Clinton ahead of Trump, then by a 43-41 margin, the surveys show…
    “What explains Trump’s continued lead? One key fact that has shown up in the three days of IBD-TIPP polling is that Trump holds a substantial 42 percent to 31 percent advantage over Clinton among independent voters.”…
    They generally are socially liberal but fiscally conservative – and they “now make up about 34 percent of the electorate.”
    Rasmussen, which had Trump ahead 43-40 on Thursday and 43-41 on Friday, said, “A new high of 88 percent of voters now say they are certain how they will vote in this election. Among these voters, it’s Trump 48 percent, Clinton 47 percent…
    COMMENTS:
    Bart White: “Trump holds a substantial 42 percent to 31 percent advantage over Clinton among independent voters.” If this is correct, and I believe it is, then Trump must be ahead by six percent overall…
    MGD: Or more.
    http://www.wnd.com/2016/10/voters-diverge-from-media-keep-trump-ahead/

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    David Maddison

    I’m glad people are using the term windmill rather than “wind turbine”.

    Anything to do with proper turbines has an association with proper engineering whereas “windmill” seems much more Mickey Mouse, as indeed it is.

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    • #
      ralfellis

      The proper term is WINDELEC !! A mill is for grinding something, so unless the electrons are being ground up in some manner, these are windelecs, not windmills.

      R

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      • #
        Dave in the States

        Ok if you say so. But RE is grinding somethings. To use a biblical term, it is “grinding the faces of the poor.” Increased energy costs hurt the poor the most.

        Energy taxes of all types are essentially regressive taxes. That’s why politicians like them after the elections are over. Regressive forms of taxation have a much wider tax base.

        RE is also grinding down the environment and eco systems much more than modern fossil fuel extraction does.

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  • #
    Ruairi

    The warmists create a false scare,
    By pretending how much that they care,
    But the people’s reaction,
    From the Polls, is inaction,
    For a crisis that just isn’t there.

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  • #
    Peter C

    No one wants to talk about Climate Change. There seem to be very few votes in promoting it.

    Yet there is very little political discussion about the cost and waste of resources and loss of opportunity to spend the money on good things either.

    That is what I do not understand.

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    • #
      el gordo

      ‘That is what I do not understand.’

      Overcoming mass delusion will require a revolution in ideas to change the status quo. A paradigm shift in science would be a real eye opener, people are very interested in new scientific discoveries.

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      • #
        clive

        Well until we get rid of these”Lying,do nothing,career politicians”we are stuck with them.We need some new blood and I hope that One Nation and or a new “Conservative Party”rises out of the ashes,because the idiots we have in parliament don’t care what “We the People”want.

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  • #
    pat

    Fox hosts go at it over the Dem operatives in the O’Keefe videos…the Judge is surely right.

    21 Oct: GatewayPundit: Aleister: Judge Jeanine Schools Geraldo Rivera Over Leftist Agitators: “I Could Indict Them In Three Seconds!” (VIDEO)
    Rivera expressed doubt that authorities could bring any charges based solely on the footage.
    “I could indict them in three seconds!” Pirro, a former district attorney, fired back.
    “Don’t tell me there isn’t evidence there to file a charge and get a conviction.”
    Rivera said he still questions that the “braggadocio” seen on the tape could be made into a specific criminal charge by a prosecutor…
    Judge Jeanine is tougher than anyone currently working in federal law enforcement.
    http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2016/10/judge-jeanine-schools-geraldo-rivera-leftist-agitators-indict-three-seconds-video/

    shades of Gough’s “It’s time”!

    12 Oct: Breitbart: Liam Deacon: Wikileaks: ‘Anti-SJW’ Heat Street Founder Louise Mensch Pitched Ad Script to Hillary Clinton Campaign
    Former British Conservative Party Member of Parliament and “right wing” blogger Louise Mensch privately tried to assist the Hillary Clinton campaign, emails published by Wikileaks reveal.
    Mrs. Mensch runs the Rupert Murdoch-backed blog Heat Street, which claims to stand against identity politics and what it labels “social justice warriors” under the slogan “no safe spaces.”
    However, its editor in chief, Mrs. Mensch, was caught writing a campaign advertisement script for the Democratic candidate – a woman who has traded off identity politics and social justice warrior politics. The ad appears to be based on the idea that Mrs. Clinton should be in office simply because she is female and is supported by “multiracial” women.
    “… much rather have your girl Hillary,” Mrs. Mensch wrote in an email to Michael Kives of Creative Arts Agency (CAA), a former Clinton campaign advocate.
    She said Hillary’s “intelligence [is] beyond doubt” but argued she “is not capitalizing on the yearning that we have to see a woman as President,” before scripting the campaign ad named “OUR TIME.”…
    Her e-mail was forwarded by Mr. Kives to the Hillary Clinton campaign, as well campaign chairman John Podesta…
    Mrs. Mensch’s e-mail initiates a conversation with Mr. Kives by drawing on her friendship with someone called “Arnold,” believed to be former California governor and movie star Arnold Schwarzenegger.
    In the email, Mrs. Mensch also claims to be “a committed Republican” but has been campaigning against Republican nominee Donald Trump for some time, frequently employing the hashtag #NeverTrump. She has publicly claimed to back independent Republican Evan McMullin, although in July she tweeted “It’s Our Time Now” with a picture of Hillary Clinton with the words “Yes She Can” over it.
    Since the Wikileaks revelation today, she has begun frequently tweeting the hashtags #RepublicansForHillary and #ImWithHer…
    Murdoch’s News Corp has not yet responded to a request for comment.
    http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/10/12/revealed-conservative-blogger-louis-mensch-working-hillary-campaign/

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    pat

    VIDEO: 22 Oct: Fox News: Professor with Remarkable Track Record Predicts a Trump Election Win
    Saturday on Fox & Friends, Tucker Carlson sat down with a college professor with a remarkable record of predicting election outcomes.
    Professor Helmut Norpoth, from Stony Brook University in New York State, has correctly predicted the outcomes of the last five presidential elections.
    This year, he steadfastly believes Donald Trump will win the election.
    Norpoth said he uses two “models” to make his prediction:
    One is the “primary” model, where he compares a candidate’s strength in their respective primaries.
    “The candidate who does better in his party’s primary beats the other guy who does less well,” Norpoth said…
    The second model he created is called the “swing of the pendulum” model…
    http://insider.foxnews.com/2016/10/22/trump-will-win-election-professor-long-track-record-predicts

    note: Brent J. Budowsky is an American political opinion writer, Hillary supporter and blogger for publications including The Hill, the LA Progressive, and The Huffington Post. Trump ISIS video simply refers to Clinton’s ridiculous claim ISIS are using Trump vid to recruit members:

    Wikileaks: Re: HRC, Obama and ISIS
    From: Brent Budowsky
    To: John Podesta
    Date: 2015-12-21
    (SCROLL DOWN) On Monday, December 21, 2015, Brent Budowsky wrote…
    I suspect her negative trust ratings are locked in through election day. If there is a Trump ISIS video the campaign release it. If not, her untrustworthy numbers will remain further locked at high levels. These trust problems are self-induced and keep occurring. The best single move to elect her would be a massive voter registration and organization drive. Expand the electorate so more voters will vote so her low trust ratings generally will have less pro rated impact, and the number of higher trust voters will be newly registered. Most of the consultants will oppose this because they do not get paid for registering voters to elect candidates, they get paid for other things such as television ads whether those ads are effective or not.
    It is no coincidence that this year Trump runs no ads, while Jeb and Hillary run the most ads with little effect. Voter registration by contrast creates real voters and changes—and improves—the playing field itself. There is no ad on earth that will increase her trust ratings or the enthusiasm of her voters the way a mega-registration project will increase her support on election day…
    https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/25651

    Wikileaks: Warning to Hillary Clinton
    From: Brent Budowsky
    To: John Podesta
    21 March 2015
    It was not uplifting to learn in recent hours that problems with foreign donations to the Clinton Foundation continue, Hillary Clinton was still making paid speeches for hire this week, and Tony Rodham is hustling gold mining deals in Haiti.
    From the minute the email story broke I have been out there publicly and unequivocally supporting Hillary Clinton in multiple ways in multiple media unlike many Democrats and unlike most in the media. My mama taught me long ago that when I am seriously angry I should count to ten and choose my words carefully. In that spirit here is my toned down advice which I seriously doubt the Clintons are hearing from those close to them, and if they are hearing it, they are not understanding it.
    If there is one thing that could well bring down a Hillary Clinton candidacy it is this cycle of money issues about which I am now feeling red alerts, loud bells, warning signals, and red flags and I am now seriously pissed off that there is a real chance that her candidacy and the Democratic Party could be destroyed by these self-created dangers that continue to proliferate the closer she gets to presumably announcing her candidacy…etc
    https://wikileaks.org/podesta-emails/emailid/6900#efmAAAAD3

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    Roy Hogue

    I have a little analogy that maybe can explain all this in simple terms.

    Have you ever tried to drive in a screw that wont go easily? I had this experience yesterday as I was trying to put a mounting bracket for something on one of the uprights that support my patio roof. I had drilled the right size pilot hole but after a short distance the screws would get so tight that the phillips head screwdriver would slip unless I put an inordinate amount of pressure against it. It was hot and I was getting exhausted fast if I kept that up.

    So what do you do when a screw wont go in? You lubricate it, in this case putting some soap on the threads was enough. Just drag the threads across a bar of soap a few times and you have what you need. If it was something on your car that wouldn’t screw, penetrating oil might be the right lubricant. You can easily extend this to screwing almost anything (and get your minds out of the gutter, this is serious ;-) ).

    Now what do you do when you intend to screw the people? People don’t ordinarily go for things that work against their good interest. So you need some lubricant just like any other screw that won’t go in. But in this case the lubricant you need is words, words that divert attention, words that say a different story than the one you should be telling, words that reassure where no reassurance is possible because of what you intend to do, promises you don’t intend to keep, almost anything but the truth will do. And if the words are slippery enough so much the better because they’re sure to work fast.

    We’ve seen it over and over again. We’re being lubricated so we can be screwed… …again.

    It’s a simple, easy and effective solution. Pour on the lubrication. And they’ve been doing it for so long that we don’t even recognize it for what it is anymore.

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    • #
      Another Ian

      Comment applicable to screwdriver only – I think

      Put a bit of that probably rare product known as valve grinding paste on the end of the screw driver and it is less likely to slip

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      Yonniestone

      It’s a great analogy Roy, but my mind won’t get out of the gutter on this one. :)

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    • #
      Annie

      Soft-soaping the people Roy.

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    • #
      Rod Stuart

      Another option is to use that great Canadian invention; the Robertson socket head drive.
      Then put the Robertson chuck in a half inch drill and it doesn’t matter whether it’s lubed or not.
      In your analogy, this is what Obama has been doing to all Americans the world.

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      • #
        Roy Hogue

        Rod,

        Whatever else Obama has been doing, he’s sure poured on the lubricant. His mouth is always going on with words intended to distract us from the fact that we’re being screwed.

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    • #
      AndyG55

      “So what do you do when a screw wont go in?”

      I usually grab a hammer :-)

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  • #

    Thx pat, and worth repeating from that wikileaks email
    re those foreign donations and Clinton duo highly paid
    speaking engagements …

    ‘If there is one thing that could well bring down a
    Hillary Clinton candidacy it is this cycle of money
    issues about which I am now feeling red alerts, loud
    bells, warning signals, and red flags and I am now
    seriously pissed off that there is a real chance that
    her candidacy and the Democratic Party could be
    destroyed by these self-created dangers that continue
    to proliferate the closer she gets to presumably

    announcing her candidacy…etc’

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    pat

    Trump has had 3 events today I think – Gettysburg, Pennsylvania, Virginia Beach, VA & Cleveland, Ohio.

    must watch:

    Twitter: David Martosko (Daily Mail)
    VIDEO: 18secs: YUGE Trump & Pence crowd in my hometown of Cleveland tonight. When I was a kid, fewer People than this would go to Cavaliers games.
    https://twitter.com/dmartosko/status/789968997705928704

    22 Oct: Breitbart: Donald Trump Takes Stage to ‘Mostly Women’ at Massive Cleveland MEGA-Rally
    http://www.breitbart.com/2016-presidential-race/2016/10/22/donald-trump-takes-stage-to-mostly-women-at-massive-cleveland-mega-rally/

    can’t find any proper shots of Clinton’s event. Heavy is pro-Clinton, but can’t put a single shot of the crowd in their gallery. they have some numbers, which I can’t verify:

    22 Oct: Heavy.com: Hillary Clinton’s Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania Rally: The Photos You Need to See
    A Clinton supporter wears a campaign hat as Democratic presidential nominee Hillary Clinton speaks during a campaign rally at Taylor Allderdice High School on October 22, 2016 in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania. More than 1,000 people attended, and an additional 1,200 were in an overflow room
    http://heavy.com/news/2016/10/hillary-clinton-pittsburgh-pennsylvania-pa-rally-photos-pictures-allderdice-high-school-tim-kaine-crowd-pics-how-many/3/

    some were commenting online that students got credits for attending, but I wouldn’t know.

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  • #
    David Maddison

    QUESTION: Is an electric grid with lots of windmills more or less susceptible to an electromagnetic pulse than a properly designed grid?

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    • #
      bobl

      More, consider the number of machines, an EMP event say a carrington solar flare happened and most objects with coils of wire (eg generators) were fried, what would be back up sooner, 1000 windmill alternators 100 meters in the air bathed in magnetism or 4 x 250 MW alternators on the ground inside an earthed steel framed building a virtual faraday cage?

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  • #
    John F. Hultquist

    Only 3% of US people think climate is most important issue

    Viewed the other way-round: 3% of US voters is a lot of people that need counseling.

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  • #
    Oliver K. Manuel

    Climate change is ignored because consensus scientists know this might explode in their face at any minute if the 1935-36 error in Weizsacker-Bethe’s definition of nuclear energy is exposed in a public debate.

    See these official galley proofs of a paper in press: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/10640850/WHAT_CONTROLS_HUMAN_DESTINY.pdf


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  • #
    Richard Ilfeld

    One route to fear, if not sanity.
    Ask a committed leftist/government employee how their pension fund is supported.
    Send them a list of the equity investment of said fund.
    Use yellow highlighter to highlight the companies said leftist wishes to destroy.
    Append article showing dismal returns of “environmentally friendly” funds.
    Assert one will both vote and campaign against taxpayer bailouts of under-funded public pensions, especially
    where same have been exempt from ERISA and Social Security.

    If the leftist recognizes no other reality, the cold slap of bankruptcy and the chain the sheriff puts on the front door
    will come as a shock, but come it will.

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  • #
    Uncle Gus

    I’ve never really understood the love affair between politicians and CAGW.

    Admittedly, it’s a Cause, and a Bandwagon, and has the advantage of being completely non-human so it can’t suddenly do something embarrassing like terrorist attacks or really awful ethnic music…

    But it is and always was election cyanide. Voter repellent. The majority of people (a) don’t understand it, (b) don’t care. And never did.

    This is of course totally irrelevant to the question of whether it’s true or not, but we’re talking about politicians here…

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